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Rassah

(167 posts)
46. Ah, yes, those anarchists :)
Tue Sep 2, 2014, 01:37 PM
Sep 2014

There are two types of anarchists:

Anarcho-communists, which is closer to the Occupy types, where nothing is owned, everything is shared, everyone takes care of everyone else, and things are bartered and traded instead of bought and sold for money.
Anarcho-capitalists, who are kind of like randians, but unlike Rand don't think there should be any legalized coercion or violence, and who want to build their world based on the non-aggression principle (no one has the right to initiate force, and everyone has the right to defend themselves), and on the idea of completely voluntary and uninhibited trade.

The general idea behind anarcho-capitalists is that we can manage small scale things just like we manage relationships with our neighbors (we are generally not assholes to each other), and we can manage large scale things the way large businesses handle relationships between and within each other, through contracts, arbitration, "assurance," and most importantly reputation (Assurance is like insurance, except instead of insurance protecting you for others, assurance protects others from you. You would need to have assurance coverage for others to deal with you, and the worse asshole you are, the more expensive your policy). Whether you support it or not, I have found their hypothetical thought experiments on how society could be structured, and what possible consequences could arise, rather fascinating.

The closest thing that was attempted, though not modern, was the Icelandic Commonwealth that lasted from 930 to 1262. There was no government, per se, but representatives you bought in their version of "congress." You paid a subscription to them, and they negotiated general things on your behalf. If they did a bad job, you fired them and hired someone else. This only applied to large, overall, general country-wide stuff, not specific interactions between your neighbors or traders, and thus the amount of work involved was very little, and fee to hire such a rep was very low.

Regarding the two ways, 1) could very well happen, and it does already, but it doesn't last long. Commercial power comes from selling products, and as companies get large, they get comfortable and settled in what they do, shunning innovation for it being "too risky." And new start-ups invariably come in and kick their ass (like digital photo killing Kodak, internet killing AT&T, and even cars killing horse and carriage). As for 2) there will already be centrally accepted ideas of universal rights (respect life and property), but the recourse will likely be whatever the company you hire to protect your rights decides is best for you and cheapest for them. That could be anywhere from going after the perp directly, to negotiating with the perp's own security or assurance company on both of your behalf, to just paying you for whatever damage the perp did, if it's cheaper. So, just having generally accepted rules and guidelines doesn't automatically make it a government. You would need a central body enforcing those rules regardless of what people want for it to be government.

In the Exxon example, you won't be going to Exxon's arbitrators, but to one both you and they agree on. Most likely you won't even be the one going, and instead your security agency will go on your behalf. That agency has many more resources, since it will be a large company with many subscribers, comparable to a home insurance company you have now. Another big difference is that without government, there would not be a government-created concept of "limited liability corporation." Exxon would not be a nebulous entity whose actors are exempt from any harm the corporation does, but will be a group of people who are directly liable for their actions. This applies to everyone, from the careless drill operator who spilled oil onto your back yard, to the company owner who decided to stick that oil well on your neighboring plot against everyone's wishes. In the worst case, there also aren't any police that are forcing you to pay their salaries so they can keep Exxon safe from you. Exxon will have to have their own security, and the more harm they do, the more expensive their security costs will be, due to pissed off people taking things into their own hands.

At least that's the general hypothesis of how things MIGHT work.

Ask yourself ThoughtCriminal Aug 2014 #1
Trusting people who believe that Rassah Aug 2014 #23
No way! You mean greed and grifters are taking over Galt's Gulch? JaneyVee Aug 2014 #2
I'm shocked, shocked I tell you!!!! Initech Sep 2014 #32
Poor Chile. As if the people who live there don't have enough problems. n/t Cleita Aug 2014 #3
+1 Blue_Tires Aug 2014 #14
Very interesting, he indicated they control enviromental issues of not allowing Thinkingabout Aug 2014 #4
Kind of destroys their concept of ... aggiesal Aug 2014 #17
Maybe they meant only if they control everything then it is okay. Thinkingabout Aug 2014 #19
Bob the Angry Flower: Atlas Shrugged 2 hunter Aug 2014 #5
I am shocked, shocked that there is grift going on in this establishment. N/T politicat Aug 2014 #6
"Grifters, or incompetents, or both" perfect definition of both Republican and Libertarians. FSogol Aug 2014 #7
+1 freshwest Aug 2014 #21
Capitalism is not a system of ethics. Rand's mistake was to think it was. Wella Aug 2014 #8
Don't worry, everyone! The Wonderful Wizard of Market will solve all problems alcibiades_mystery Aug 2014 #9
"Is now"? Brickbat Aug 2014 #10
Not surprised sakabatou Aug 2014 #11
You don't have enough posts to start new threads. Please reply to some threads first. mobeau69 Aug 2014 #12
Now, now! I'll post it for you. It's an important video. And Happy Birthday Reverend Barber! freshwest Aug 2014 #22
Good for them, God bless them all. father founding Aug 2014 #13
They are not part of that group. At all. Rassah Aug 2014 #24
They wouldn't be interested - it is environmentally protected land under Chilean law. MH1 Sep 2014 #30
They picked that place because that government has some of the lowest restrictions in the world. Rassah Sep 2014 #33
Could there be a Heaven's Gate climax in their future? NBachers Aug 2014 #15
Of COURSE they're grifters. That's what ALL Right Wingers are.... Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2014 #16
Don't mistake the people involved in this group with conservatives. Rassah Aug 2014 #25
Atlas Shrugged fans are Reaganites. Not fans of Gandhi. Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2014 #26
Most of the guys behind this one are anarchists, not randians. Rassah Sep 2014 #27
No, these guys claim to be self made individuals but all sound the same... Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2014 #29
Maybe most do, but I know these guys personally... Rassah Sep 2014 #34
Hate the country, love it's money. Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2014 #36
Not even that. Note these are all bitcoiners, so they don't love its money either. Rassah Sep 2014 #40
I've known people like that. They also dressed as Klingons at Trek conventions. Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2014 #44
Some of them even go to furry conventions! :D Rassah Sep 2014 #45
Another good article on this octoberlib Aug 2014 #18
oh, wait just a damn minute, you mean they can not force our Second Amendment on them? Thinkingabout Aug 2014 #20
Ahhhh, I love that story...thank you! Pholus Sep 2014 #28
Caveat emptor: Awesome for sellers. Not DirkGently Sep 2014 #31
Anarchy doesn't mean "no rules" Rassah Sep 2014 #35
Aaaand you'd still need a "rule" against "rulers." DirkGently Sep 2014 #37
Why do you need a rule against rulers if there are no rulers? Rassah Sep 2014 #39
So civilization could be run by commercial arbitration? DirkGently Sep 2014 #43
Ah, yes, those anarchists :) Rassah Sep 2014 #46
Sorry, I wanted to post this earlier, but... Rassah Sep 2014 #47
Ayn Rand and John Calvin are two of the most under-rated people Dawson Leery Sep 2014 #38
I'm actually genuinely curious... Rassah Sep 2014 #42
A man chooses, a slave obeys. Would you kindly be a sucker. chrisa Sep 2014 #41
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