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kpete

(71,991 posts)
Fri Aug 23, 2013, 08:24 PM Aug 2013

GUARDIAN Editorial: "It Is NOT The Role Of Politicians To Determine The Limits Of Public Discussion" [View all]

Surveillance and the state: this way the debate goes on
Thanks to Edward Snowden, the world now has a debate about the dramatic change in the contract between state and citizen


The Guardian, Friday 23 August 2013 18.58 EDT

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Secrecy and openness

Thanks to Mr Snowden they have now got a debate ? one that is rippling around the world. President Barack Obama says he welcomes that debate. That much is encouraging, even if it seems unlikely to be true because it is not going to be a comfortable debate for any government ? nor for those in intelligence, nor for anyone running a major technology or telecommunications company. The world was simpler when the law could be used to prevent any meaningful and informed discussion of what was involved. The laws crafted before and during the first world war (the Espionage Act in the US, the Official Secrets Act in the UK) saw to that.

Secrecy and openness must collide. Governments and spies will place the greater emphasis on security: that is inevitable. Individuals who treasure free speech, an unfettered press, the capacity for dissent, or an individual's rights to privacy or protection against the state, will have equal, or greater, concerns.


...............

Civil liberties and security

These are words that should be heeded by the British government official who told us that the Guardian had "had our debate" and that there was no "need" to write any more. It is not the role of politicians or civil servants to determine the limits of public discussion. Nor should the debate be circumscribed by attempting to criminalise the act of journalism ? without which, in this instance, there could be no debate.

Citizens of free countries are entitled to protect their privacy against the state. The state has a duty to protect free speech as well as security. Fundamental rights, as we say, collide. Journalists have a duty to inform and facilitate a debate and to help test the consent of people about the nature of any trade-offs between civil liberties and security. A democratic government should seek to protect and nourish that debate, not threaten it or stamp it out.


BRAVO!!!!
read the rest:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/aug/23/surveillance-state-debate-goes-on
45 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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bravo indeed! mike_c Aug 2013 #1
and kpete Aug 2013 #4
Bam! There we have it, in one crisp concise headline. Well done Guardian!! 99th_Monkey Aug 2013 #2
FINALLY!!! kpete Aug 2013 #3
"It is not the role of politicians or civil servants to determine the limits of public discussion" kentuck Aug 2013 #5
small steps... agent46 Aug 2013 #30
From what I've seen British newspapers are far superior to ours in every area. ... spin Aug 2013 #6
Oh, they have some crap rags and channels there too. riqster Aug 2013 #36
I often find the Brits tend to use more photos and graphics in their articles. ... spin Aug 2013 #38
............. Hotler Aug 2013 #7
Guardian - truth. 840high Aug 2013 #8
K&R for the subject line alone! n/t Skip Intro Aug 2013 #9
The New York Times is their great champion? FarCenter Aug 2013 #10
This message was self-deleted by its author agent46 Aug 2013 #31
Likely, however, who would be a better collaborative safeguard? closeupready Aug 2013 #45
Woof!! The Guardian lays down the gauntlet! longship Aug 2013 #11
That sort of talk is dangerous. We need to watch what we say. Warren DeMontague Aug 2013 #12
Excellent. They went too far this time. That's always what Authoritarians do. They get so drunk sabrina 1 Aug 2013 #13
Finally, the light of reason: QuestForSense Aug 2013 #14
K&R MotherPetrie Aug 2013 #15
Excellent article. blackspade Aug 2013 #16
if only... kpete Aug 2013 #19
K&R Solly Mack Aug 2013 #17
"Why wasn’t I consulted is the fundamental question of the web,” Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #18
K&R Ocelot Aug 2013 #20
Kick Luminous Animal Aug 2013 #21
Snowden/Greenwald weakened their own argument badly. gulliver Aug 2013 #22
Never understood LiberalLovinLug Aug 2013 #24
Do I really need to explain it to you? gulliver Aug 2013 #35
yes LiberalLovinLug Aug 2013 #39
Wow. You claim you are actually, truly puzzled... gulliver Aug 2013 #40
Why not actually answer to some of my points LiberalLovinLug Aug 2013 #42
The more you people try and demonize Snowden and Greenwald, Maedhros Aug 2013 #34
The NSA/security appartus argument. Cerridwen Aug 2013 #43
Excellent editorial. deurbano Aug 2013 #23
kn r Douglas Carpenter Aug 2013 #25
I second your BRAVO!!! Uncle Joe Aug 2013 #26
HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!! WillyT Aug 2013 #27
K&R felix_numinous Aug 2013 #28
I wish we could get the Guardian in the US GeoWilliam750 Aug 2013 #29
Yeah and it's not the role of gopiscrap Aug 2013 #32
Epic agent46 Aug 2013 #33
K&R woo me with science Aug 2013 #37
Where was it ever said that it was? treestar Aug 2013 #41
The Guardian - serious journalism, as opposed to bimbo-fed infotainment stateside. closeupready Aug 2013 #44
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