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liberal_at_heart

(12,081 posts)

59. I don't measure things in my every day life and I am so glad to know that you must know so

Reply to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #51)

Thu Apr 4, 2013, 10:24 PM

Apr 2013

much about me without actually knowing me.

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Math problems are a problem for job-seekers, employers say [View all] FarCenter Apr 2013 OP

I have a suggestion. SpearthrowerOwl Apr 2013 #1

Maybe if schools went back to teaching the material instead of teaching how to take a test. hobbit709 Apr 2013 #3

I agree SpearthrowerOwl Apr 2013 #5

+100 lunasun Apr 2013 #88

Wouldn't that be nice? Scootaloo Apr 2013 #132

Thread could have ended right here. RedCappedBandit Apr 2013 #157

The purely academic approach to instruction is a problem Puzzledtraveller Apr 2013 #193

Or perhaps take the focus off of sports, and put it back on education AndyA Apr 2013 #226

***DINGDINGDINGDINGDINGDING!!!*** WINNER! WINNER! lastlib Apr 2013 #230

+1 Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #236

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2013 #229

They are not looking to hire scientists, just basic manufacturing machine operators FarCenter Apr 2013 #4

my post was maybe confusing SpearthrowerOwl Apr 2013 #6

The company appears to be paying enough to attract ..... oldhippie Apr 2013 #18

This is as good an argument as any for us to go Metric. TheMightyFavog Apr 2013 #23

Yes. It is simply not reasonable to expect people to be able to multiply and divide by 12. Nye Bevan Apr 2013 #24

Fractional inches don't involve twelve, they involve powers of 2 Fumesucker Apr 2013 #30

I think you're right. Sixteenths of an inch is far, far beyond my powers of comprehension (nt) Nye Bevan Apr 2013 #31

USA lost $1 billion Mars probe because a critical measurement wasn't converted between metric and Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #44

It depends. My machinist 6" rule has 16ths and 32nds on one side and 10ths and 50ths on the other. FarCenter Apr 2013 #70

Never mind a dial caliper. ;) n/t X_Digger Apr 2013 #76

I've got one of those also, and two dial calipers Fumesucker Apr 2013 #92

1.6 minutes per question, including reading the directions and problems. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #82

People who can't read a tape measure in 96 seconds are not fit to be trained as machinists and Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #110

You are so right .... oldhippie Apr 2013 #196

Thank you. You put your finger on the simple basic logic at point and expose the pay straw man. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #197

And a super majority of successful professionals who took the HS graduation exam failed it miserably Fumesucker Apr 2013 #199

People wanting to succeed in the 21st century need more skills than lawyers educated in the 20th. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #204

(posted reply to wrong post) Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #205

That was one person of fifty Fumesucker Apr 2013 #211

Well, it was the person highlighted in the article who seems to want to dilute the test. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #213

What this company and our educators do not understand JDPriestly Apr 2013 #166

Modern grade school math education is getting back to that. It is more project based. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #212

Nor is it reasonable to gravitate towards the most effective and efficient form of measurement. LanternWaste Apr 2013 #209

they're clearly not paying enough to attract people who can pass their test. but HS math performance HiPointDem Apr 2013 #74

"formula"? There is no formula necessary. Basic simple understanding of the concepts is all. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #111

there *is* a formula, mass divided by volume. they wanted a specific number for a specific HiPointDem Apr 2013 #123

But you forgot the formula, when understanding the concepts is more powerful. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #124

i can't remember the formula because i'm about 40 years out of high school & have never had HiPointDem Apr 2013 #125

It's the culture from the bottom up. Cultures that respect learning (Euro, Jpn) have better schools. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #126

oh bullshit. japanese schools are not *better* than american schools (i know from lengthy personal HiPointDem Apr 2013 #139

Japanese schools outcompete American schools by all the usual measures. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #143

'the usual measures,' eh? please describe those 'usual measures'. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #144

One of any number (TIMSS): Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #148

oh, TIMMS is 'the usual methods', eh? First administered in 1995, less than 20 years ago. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #156

Read. I did not write "usual methods". I wrote "usual measures". Fancy straw man you got there. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #160

same difference. not a straw man. surely a genius of logic such as yourself should know better. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #173

All you've got left are ad hominem attacks. Enough! Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #174

lol. 'fallacy'. 'straw man'. 'ad hominem'. you're the one tossing around the verbiage. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #175

more diversion from the facts i posted, which you ignore because they don't suit your narrative HiPointDem Apr 2013 #178

You make more stuff up. Nobody has quoted any Bill Gates press releases. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #162

only because you don't know anything about washington state politics and bill gates' media HiPointDem Apr 2013 #168

Thanks for the info. Americans have this mythology that somehow we used to be #1 in everything ... eppur_se_muova Apr 2013 #220

Density is dead simple. Understand density and you create the formula. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #127

he was a condescending jerk, and i remember him because he was so awful and *that* is when HiPointDem Apr 2013 #136

Know this: a condescending jerk is a bad teacher. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #141

it's you with the ideologically driven nonsense. you make vapid generalizations about us schools, HiPointDem Apr 2013 #145

I haven't stated any ideological positions in this thread. You have already gotten into your Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #147

your ideology is clear from your comments and your uncritical stance towards the article. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #154

You couldn't point to anything so all you've got is a smear. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #158

Re: Gates Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #159

"...& have never had to find mass in my life ..." oldhippie Apr 2013 #198

density, i meant. as in the op. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #224

What about your math teachers before high school? muriel_volestrangler Apr 2013 #241

People can't think because we are not teaching them how to think, but what to think. Sivafae Apr 2013 #131

+1 Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #135

bullshit. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #140

Your empty response to a poster's thoughtful writing shows the emptiness of your ideology. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #149

'we are still stuck on rote learning' is more parrot-speak from someone who hasn't been HiPointDem Apr 2013 #153

Don't think of it as a 'formula'; think of it as a definition muriel_volestrangler Apr 2013 #240

If I may try to redirect this pissing match zipplewrath Apr 2013 #202

Well stated. Thank you. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #207

why not, if all they're going to be doing is repetitive entry-level manufacturing tasks? HiPointDem Apr 2013 #80

Because thinking production workers do "repetitive entry-level manufacturing tasks" misses the boat. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #128

Because I've done entry level production work and know lots of people who have. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #134

Again: Fallacy of misdirection: The article is not about entry level production workers. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #150

oooh, "fallacy of misdirection"!!! repeating 'fallacy' over and over is what parrots do. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #152

From the article: Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #129

If it's so fucking complex, why do they insist on hiring people with *only* a HS diploma? Oh, HiPointDem Apr 2013 #133

You don't know what they pay, but you think you know. It's because you are ruled by an Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #137

i know that general plastics gets cheap labor subsidized by the government through a HiPointDem Apr 2013 #142

That information has nothing to do with the conclusion you jumped to, nor the facts of the article. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #146

you'd be wrong, because mr hahn of general plastics says: HiPointDem Apr 2013 #151

Wrong. You are misdirecting again and contradicting yourself. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #155

actually, what eric said is that 1) his cheap-labor program is keeping him afloat in the recession HiPointDem Apr 2013 #161

Nope. Eric did not say that. You miscomprehend: "poised to come out" does not mean Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #164

lol. if you say so. you are the genius who knows all about fallacies and density, after all. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #170

First name with "eric"? You kept on referring to him as "eric". Enough of this nonsense. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #172

You attack my point by agreeing with it! Bizarref! Enough! Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #165

your agenda is clear to anyone reading. as are your tactics. enough indeed. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #167

Actually, they can afford to hire someone who needs to relearn basic math. JDPriestly Apr 2013 #163

I've gotta admit, I don't remember calculus anymore, because I don't use it. winter is coming Apr 2013 #225

This does not sound like a job that some one with a science degree would want karynnj Apr 2013 #19

I wasn't suggesting SpearthrowerOwl Apr 2013 #73

And despite the fact that well-qualified people are jobless, the US LibDemAlways Apr 2013 #32

manipulating employment information to drive down wages sigmasix Apr 2013 #180

"But I'm not a numbers person, I'm a people person!" Silent3 Apr 2013 #2

No one is "bad at math" zipplewrath Apr 2013 #8

"I can't read very well" kiva Apr 2013 #12

what would the numbers be if asked of american students JI7 Apr 2013 #13

Probably not too far off Posteritatis Apr 2013 #15

this reminds me of something that happened JI7 Apr 2013 #17

Despite some not thinking it's cool, kiva Apr 2013 #28

Zipplewrath, I don't mean to be argumentative, but I am truly LibDemAlways Apr 2013 #35

that makes two of us Libertas1776 Apr 2013 #138

I stuggled with long division zipplewrath Apr 2013 #189

... Libertas1776 Apr 2013 #191

Self diagnosis zipplewrath Apr 2013 #194

Ha. I'm sure it feels that way. zipplewrath Apr 2013 #187

+1. +2. +3. .... Right on. Great post with examples from experience. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #48

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2013 #231

Discalculia is rare. Innumeracy is pandemic. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #237

Yeah. Truth. Right on. Damn straight. The real deal. On point. Should be obvious to all. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #46

Math teachers are expensive. Our schools are cheap. nt bemildred Apr 2013 #7

maybe, but onethatcares Apr 2013 #10

I wonder if they provide quick conversion guides and formulas ecstatic Apr 2013 #9

I wonder if the applicants would do any better without the time limit. surrealAmerican Apr 2013 #11

Someone's skills would have to be pretty rusty to need several minutes to read a tape measure. (nt) Posteritatis Apr 2013 #14

people don't use a tape measure in their daily lives. liberal_at_heart Apr 2013 #36

Whether it's a ruler or a tape measure, same diff, used the same way Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #51

I don't measure things in my every day life and I am so glad to know that you must know so liberal_at_heart Apr 2013 #59

I don't know, but you just told me. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #61

okay I will tell you the extent of my measuring. liberal_at_heart Apr 2013 #69

Fine. We all start somewhere. Take charge of your life. Learn something new. You are not stupid. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #77

maybe the poster has other priorities. when s/he feels a strong need to convert recipes, s/he'll HiPointDem Apr 2013 #86

we are talking about people knowing there are 24 inches in two feet snooper2 Apr 2013 #78

I thought there were ten toes in two feet. nt. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #81

you don't know what the problem was. all you know is it involved reading a tape. you could HiPointDem Apr 2013 #87

I'd be hard pressed making difficult questions around a standard tape measure.. snooper2 Apr 2013 #94

what you did is pretty much irrelevant to anything. obviously, at some point you *learned* how HiPointDem Apr 2013 #98

I'm sorry... snooper2 Apr 2013 #105

yet here you are, able to do complex math! i was referring to installing crown moulding, not reading HiPointDem Apr 2013 #182

This may come as a surprise, but they do in fact. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2013 #121

Get real. An adult not knowing how to use a ruler is inexcusable, period. (nt) Posteritatis Apr 2013 #185

"several" = 1.6 minutes, and that includes reading the initial instructions and each problem, in HiPointDem Apr 2013 #85

Time limit is rather large actually Capt. Obvious Apr 2013 #192

Is it time that under most state programs now in HS, 'basic' math isn't taught... JCMach1 Apr 2013 #16

This is grade school stuff WinniSkipper Apr 2013 #26

How on EARTH Aerows Apr 2013 #20

I bet there are a bunch of DUers who suck at fractions Fumesucker Apr 2013 #21

But you don't even have to know math Aerows Apr 2013 #22

Yes, but are the lines fourths, eighths or sixteenths? Fumesucker Apr 2013 #25

You fucking COUNT ..... oldhippie Apr 2013 #34

You've probably done some sort of work that involved measuring a lot Fumesucker Apr 2013 #45

Count the number of lines between "1" and "2".. if there are 8, it's 8ths, etc X_Digger Apr 2013 #75

I know that and you know that but most people really don't Fumesucker Apr 2013 #89

I think you're on to something. And people who grow up relying on GPA pnwmom Apr 2013 #106

the question wasn't 'how many inches in a foot'. and how skilled you are at 'reading a tape HiPointDem Apr 2013 #91

Inches to feet, not metric system? still_one Apr 2013 #27

I was under a curriculum that only taught metrics... we never learned JCMach1 Apr 2013 #42

the world does metrics except here still_one Apr 2013 #53

I've encountered 4 twenty yr olds (give or take a year) lately, 3 male and 1 female, who can barely Zorra Apr 2013 #29

This is beyond politics - this education now in the US public schools lunasun Apr 2013 #104

BWAHAHAHAHAHA Generic Other Apr 2013 #33

This sounds like a job that requires math skills. Incitatus Apr 2013 #37

actually, it sounds like a job that requires no math skills. it's an entry level production job. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #100

Reading the tape measure is a surrogate for exboyfil Apr 2013 #171

it may be. now tell me about the other 17 questions. in fact, show me the problems and i'll HiPointDem Apr 2013 #176

Don't you think that the individual who exboyfil Apr 2013 #183

i already said i have no problem with such tests; i have a problem with the spin, and i don't HiPointDem Apr 2013 #184

Am I missing something? missingthebigdog Apr 2013 #188

you're probably right, as the company has a 'partnership' with tacoma community college. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #190

Despite assertions, readers who read the article will see that it actually is not entry level jobs. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #169

You have to use it or you lose it. bluedigger Apr 2013 #38

I don't know if there's a standard unit for density (and I refuse to google it to look smart, hehe) X_Digger Apr 2013 #72

Trig was my downfall. bluedigger Apr 2013 #79

Funnily enough, I actually used it in construction.. X_Digger Apr 2013 #84

I didn't foresee my future in HS. bluedigger Apr 2013 #90

I'd imagine that's a HUGE part of the grunt work.. 'what' was 'where' being as important to the.. X_Digger Apr 2013 #97

Indeed. bluedigger Apr 2013 #101

Mathematics, even basic mathematics, needs to be better respected in a culture that Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #39

Well, I'm not sure I could remember how to calculate density laundry_queen Apr 2013 #40

"test is rigged"? Get off. No company looking for employees would have any incentive Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #43

Sure they would laundry_queen Apr 2013 #47

If what you say is true, you haven't shown any reason for them to "rig the test". Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #49

Simple laundry_queen Apr 2013 #55

You are the one asserting that the article lied and the test wasn't straight up dead simple. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #56

I was speculating and said as much. laundry_queen Apr 2013 #58

I posted to show that your speculation was silly and baseless, without merit. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #63

You asserted you knew what was on the test. No proof. laundry_queen Apr 2013 #93

Nope. You can't quote where I asserted that, other than implicitly taking the article on face value Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #102

I do not believe anything other than it is a possibility laundry_queen Apr 2013 #114

Your posts show you aren't addressing the question the OP poses: Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #115

Is that a new rule on DU? nt laundry_queen Apr 2013 #116

No, it's not a rule. Just a good idea. Give it a try. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #117

Nice to know the posting police are still active. nt laundry_queen Apr 2013 #118

Read. I said "good idea". No policing. You've got nothing on topic. So be it. Enough. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #120

his past posts indicate that. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #181

But that would be part of the test. David__77 Apr 2013 #65

the article is bill gates propaganda if you know what you're looking for. touting the common core HiPointDem Apr 2013 #103

Nonsense. There is nothing wrong with expecting students to meet basic standards Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #107

Nor does your invocation of "gatesian boilerplate" address the bogus claim "the test is rigged". nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #109

If you know what density is, then you know how to calculate it Silent3 Apr 2013 #96

Pretending to have a math block is as bogus as pretending to have a literacy block, but Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #41

Have you looked at fairly recent grammar school math textbooks? Fumesucker Apr 2013 #50

Could you be more specific, please? Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #52

It was a year ago or so, my memory of the details is not specific Fumesucker Apr 2013 #57

There's a strong emphasis now on place value. When my kid was first learning winter is coming Apr 2013 #64

That sounds like what was going on with the homework I was looking at Fumesucker Apr 2013 #68

When I saw the method, I realized it was less prone to error (even though winter is coming Apr 2013 #71

Yes. That's how it works and that's the advantage, not to mention also deeper understanding Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #95

That's a lot of writing to do if you are calculating with pencil and paper, fine for learning.. Fumesucker Apr 2013 #108

Exactly. Learn the concepts and fundamentals from all sides and then the shortcuts are a breeze Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #113

Right to left, versus left to right.. X_Digger Apr 2013 #83

See anything in this link that rings a bell as to something taught in a strange way? Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #66

Thank You !!!! Exactly lunasun Apr 2013 #112

you can thank the education deformers for those books. HiPointDem Apr 2013 #179

I always have found it strange... PopeOxycontinI Apr 2013 #54

Nope. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #60

That's got to be a spoof muriel_volestrangler Apr 2013 #243

Wish it were. It's for sale from Amazon.com Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #244

Longer ago people knew all about baseball, movies, popular music, but would do poorly academically FarCenter Apr 2013 #67

Right, also what a culture values & rewards. The beer drinkers applauded the baseball stats recital. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #119

STOP IT POPEOXYCONTINI Skittles Apr 2013 #177

This is how we get presidents who ask "Is our children learning?". Initech Apr 2013 #62

I'm quite good at that kind of math but I totally suck at interviewing, I wouldn't get the job Fumesucker Apr 2013 #99

The people who make it to the interview are those with the fanciest looking resume. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2013 #122

Not as simple as "fancy resumes". Times are changing Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #130

No. You're buying what they're selling. lumberjack_jeff Apr 2013 #200

Education issue and maybe some couldn't read the questions anyway. dipsydoodle Apr 2013 #186

This isn't breaking news....go to any company and pay attention to *basic* math and writing skills cbdo2007 Apr 2013 #195

Note the test doesn't concern itself with how to shift earned money into an offshore account, Trillo Apr 2013 #201

Huh? You'd expect to be paid for taking a short test given during a job interview? Silent3 Apr 2013 #210

Your outrage is strong! I simply don't believe in corporate welfare. Trillo Apr 2013 #217

Your sense of entitlement is stronger Silent3 Apr 2013 #218

Perhaps you need some reading lessons. Trillo Apr 2013 #219

That I threw in the word "public" is what you're going to have a tizzy over? Silent3 Apr 2013 #223

So when I test prospective employees on their relevant skills in graphics and typesetting... LanternWaste Apr 2013 #221

If you don't pay them for your testing of them, you are asking them to work for you for free. Trillo Apr 2013 #222

On what objective measure do you base that premise? LanternWaste Apr 2013 #232

That's a pretty wild concept ..... oldhippie Apr 2013 #233

Sounds like H.S. Shop grads needed. One_Life_To_Give Apr 2013 #203

The Elephant in the Math Room: Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #206

Math challenged voters are a huge problem: Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #208

I did poorly in math while in school, LanternWaste Apr 2013 #214

Excellent honest post. "Mathematics is not a spectator sport." Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #215

Children are naturally equipped for mathematics and science, but ... Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #216

And yet I've seen you on this thread blame those who don't "get it" when it comes to math Fumesucker Apr 2013 #227

Nope. It is clear in this thread that I blame the culture much more than individuals. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #234

Inner city students use stick men to add and subtract. Peregrine Took Apr 2013 #228

Yes, around 6th grade is about when the culture hammers the relationship girls have with math. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2013 #235

There are very few valid excuses why someone would fail a basic math test Taitertots Apr 2013 #238

Kids who can pass that test went to college... XRubicon Apr 2013 #239

If this country could do the math, we'd never elect Republicans. Demoiselle Apr 2013 #242

What percentage of those applicants were college graduates?` lumberjack_jeff Apr 2013 #245

Bad math skills are a huge problem where I work Nikia Apr 2013 #246