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antigone382

(3,682 posts)
Tue Feb 26, 2013, 05:05 PM Feb 2013

Women should NOT be economically penalized for bearing children and caring for their families. [View all]

Last edited Tue Feb 26, 2013, 08:15 PM - Edit history (1)

I have to say I really don't understand why the substantial pay disparity between men and women is routinely justified as nondiscriminatory because "women take time off to have children," or the related "women choose careers that have fewer hours so that they can take care of children."

A thread currently trending in GD is a case in point of this phenomenon:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022430939

It references a CBS News report on the increasing percentage of men going into nursing, and the fact that these men are being paid more. While the article does emphasize that a large part of this is due to the more lucrative career paths that male nurses are choosing, it also mentions that even within the same occupations, male nurses are making more money than female nurses do. Even so, the disparity between women and men within nursing is less than the national average, where to date the average woman earns about $.77 on the average man's $1.00.

Now, I can't speak to the specifics of this profession because the article doesn't specifically reference it, but I have studied occupational wage differences within the last six months, and I can hypothesize with some confidence that a major reason for these wage differences is that women have gaps in their employment as a result of having children and caring for family members. I would wager that nurse anesthetists--the position which male nurses are going into at the highest rate--spend more time not only receiving an education, but also working on the clock; while LPN's, which are much more likely to be women, probably do not have the same educational requirements or time requirements. I would welcome clarification from someone more knowledgeable in the medical field. My guess is that the career choices of women in nursing, like women in most fields, are guided by the need to have time and flexible options to allow for family care-taking.

This by no means rules out plain old misogyny as a factor in wage differentials--controlling for every other conceivable factor (such as specific career paths, experience level, number of children, etc.), there are still differences between men's and women's average wages that seemingly cannot be accounted for by anything except sexism. Nevertheless, at this point in our history, the life-experiences of men and women are very different, due largely to the fact that women bear children and men don't, and our career choices reflect that.

However, I don't know about other women, but I never went to the uterus store to decide the particular role that I would play in the reproduction of the human race. Nor do I accept the contempt levied at women who carry out their reproductive role on the basis of the need for "population control." Even a stable or decreasing population is going to require that babies be born on a pretty frequent basis, and women are going to be the ones bearing those babies. As a matter of biology, women who have children bear the majority of the physical burden for creating and rearing new humans; it is unfair that we should also be saddled with the economic burden of this service to society.

Of course, a large part of the problem is that reproduction and care-taking are not adequately recognized or rewarded in our society as "services," though society would literally cease to exist without them. Perhaps another part of the problem is the notion that improvements in the structure of our work-lives that would facilitate these services should only benefit women (though to be honest, I don't know any advocates of greater gender equality who think this way). If we are to establish workplaces which allow individuals to prioritize their families, and social structures which offer some form of compensation for this activity, men should be able to reap its benefits as well. Perhaps the problem is not that women are denied entry onto a ladder-like career path that demands total dedication to one's work to succeed; perhaps the problem is that such a harmful and dehumanizing career path exists at all.

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shameless kick. n/t antigone382 Feb 2013 #1
Hi, I'm an RN (female) and I'd like to address a couple of points in your post Heddi Feb 2013 #2
Yes, the article mentions that there are important educational distinctions between the two. antigone382 Feb 2013 #3
if the per hour rates are the same roxy1234 Feb 2013 #4
The point is that women face disproportionate barriers. antigone382 Feb 2013 #6
Well the women I work with who are CNA's Heddi Feb 2013 #5
Those are very interesting insights into the world of nursing. antigone382 Feb 2013 #7
A long term fix to our economy... valiberal26 Feb 2013 #8
As an environmentalist, I don't necessarily agree with that. antigone382 Feb 2013 #9
And then when those children grow up, they would also need to have 6 or 7 kids too? How many people uppityperson Feb 2013 #10
Like I said, in an ideal world... valiberal26 Feb 2013 #11
Overpoulation issues aside, I have no desire to subsidize large families. Peter cotton Feb 2013 #12
It is unfortunate to me that the discussion of compensating women for reproduction... antigone382 Feb 2013 #13
That was my point actually. valiberal26 Feb 2013 #17
I don't know that we need to encourage it to the point of six children per family. antigone382 Feb 2013 #18
We already subsidize breeding through the tax code customerserviceguy Feb 2013 #27
ZPG=zero population growth? antigone382 Feb 2013 #31
You are correct customerserviceguy Feb 2013 #33
I believe this conversation is about Texasgal Feb 2013 #16
Post #8 advocated having the government encourage women to have half a dozen children or more. Peter cotton Feb 2013 #23
No not clear Texasgal Feb 2013 #26
Interesting question, but not one I addressed. Peter cotton Feb 2013 #28
The problem I may have is that Texasgal Feb 2013 #29
Why should one stay on topic for the entirety of a thread? Peter cotton Feb 2013 #30
Or we could look at immigration laws gollygee Feb 2013 #14
What! The last thing we need is more overbreeding. smirkymonkey Feb 2013 #15
Long term fix... valiberal26 Feb 2013 #19
Two words: "Carrying capacity". Spider Jerusalem Feb 2013 #21
Only if your model has unlimited resources and opportunity TheKentuckian Feb 2013 #24
I've read your OP and your responses. I believe I understand your points. maggiesfarmer Feb 2013 #20
Interesting points, thanks! I think that general time off for family issues should be compensated. antigone382 Feb 2013 #22
thanks for picking up the humble brag about my daughter, maggiesfarmer Feb 2013 #25
It sounds like you have a good reason to be proud. antigone382 Feb 2013 #32
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