Bernie Sanders will be 75 years old in January 2017

[Cali_Democrat]

The average life expectancy for a male in the United States is 76 years. For this reason, his health is a legitimate issue that should be discussed.

Hillary Clinton already released her medical records earlier this year and she's considered to be a very healthy individual. The average life expectancy for a female in the United States is 81 years. Hillary will be 69 years old in January 2017.

Bernie Sanders has yet to release his medical records and news came out today that he just had hernia surgery which nobody was aware of until last-minute.

Bernie will need to release his medical records so voters can have the full picture.

Some will consider this topic to be divisive, but it's a legitimate topic of discussion just as people had legitimate concerns about John McCain's health in 2008.

[kestrel91316]

1. Frankly, I don't care if he's 75 or 85 or 105.

I support him and if he gets the nomination I assume his running mate will be both younger and highly qualified.

[Kalidurga]

2. I don't care

I trust him to chose a VP that will be more than qualified to take over if worst comes to worse. That is what the VP is for.

[Crystalite]

54. I'm more than a little saddened that this (blankety blank) post has even one recommendation.

Saddened and surprised, even knowing that it's a bitter season.

Wow.

[Kalidurga]

66. Well some posters

have nothing better to do than go negative and some Hillary supporters have nothing better to do than rec crap and hope it sticks.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

69. Isn't Bernie 6 years older than HILLARY? Not much difference

[DJ13]

3. He's all of 4 years older than Hillary

So I guess you think she should be required to release her medical records as well?

[Cali_Democrat]

4. She already released her medical records. nt

Actually, he's 6 years older.

[DJ13]

9. All of them, or just a selective few?

With reports that her assistant, Huma Abedin, has expressed her view that Hillary has started becoming more forgetful over the last few years, I doubt Hillary released any records pertaining to that health issue.

[BlueCaliDem]

74. Right. Forgetful...

Wishful thinking, DJ13? Or have you forgotten that she kicked GOP butt for 11 hours and looked fresh as a daisy afterward while Trey Gowdy, 17 yrs her junior, looked cooked.

You anti-Hillary people really need to try harder.

[cannabis_flower]

87. And exactly who..

brought up the health issue. If Hillary's supporters can bring up Sander's age, then it is perfectly legitimate to question Clinton's health also. And the hernia operation <yawn> . That is no big deal.

[UglyGreed]

55. Her staff felt she

need guidance and she did have trouble recalling her trip to Bosnia. Blamed it on sleep deprivation BTW. There might be more to her health issues we may not know.....

[DCBob]

16. Life expectancy for a woman in the US is 81.

Hillary is a spring chicken!

[berni_mccoy]

5. Agism should be an offense worthy of banning here

[DCBob]

10. The age and health of a candidate are legitimate issues.

They need to be considered when selecting a nominee. We need the best candidate to make sure we win this thing.

[berni_mccoy]

28. Wrong on both counts. FDR had a paralytic illness

And several other presidents had notable health issues... all elected with them.

As far as age, there is no issue here.

Age is a protected class against discrimination. Period.

[DCBob]

34. You misunderstood my point.

Of course we have had good Presidents with health and age issues. My point is many voters consider old age and bad health a liability and might affect their vote. We cannot risk electing a candidate that has the appearance of being weak and feeble and elderly and might run out of gas in a lengthy grueling general election campaign.

[berni_mccoy]

36. You misunderstand mine

Many voters consider sex or race a legitimate issue for voting... That doesn't make it right. And it's not something that should be tolerated.

[DCBob]

37. I didnt say it was right.. but we can't control how some voters think and vote.

If we want to win the general election we need to consider all factors... even if we think they are inappropriate.

[berni_mccoy]

38. So it is ok then to say "Hillary is a woman, voters have doubts about her ability to be...

Commander in Chief"? Really? Because, everything I know to be wrong and right says that would be extremely offensive. Just as offensive as Hillary supporters raising Sanders age. If one is wrong, both are wrong, for the same damn reason. And you know. Stop being an apologist.

[DCBob]

40. Sure.. I suspect some voters might have that on their mind when considering Hillary.

However I think she has done a good job of convincing many she is one tough lady and ready to be Commander in Chief on day one.

But clearly that is an issue and should be discussed. I have no problem with that and I suspect Hillary wouldnt either.

[berni_mccoy]

41. LOL Everyone Should Look at the above Response ^^^^^

[DCBob]

42. LOL .. Look at this one.^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[JonLeibowitz]

49. Is that an invitation for an OP? One imagines it would quickly be alerted on.

[DCBob]

50. Why is that such a big deal???

I dont get it.

[JonLeibowitz]

56. Do you think "I'm not sure about voting HRC since I question women's judgement" is a despicable OP?

[DCBob]

68. That's not what I am talking about.

The discussion could be.. "I wonder how voters in the general will react to a woman running for president given the mentality that many think women might not have the cojones to pull the trigger when necessary as Commander in Chief."

That's a legitimate discussion. We as progressives don't believe it but many voters might. So the discussion would be how Hillary can deal with that.

This is a political discussion board to discuss relevant issues.. all relevant issues.

[MissDeeds]

29. +1000

I thought Democrats were against things like ageism, sexism, racism...

Really offensive OP. A new low.

[DrDan]

48. all of those and others exist right here

regionalism, for example

I have always hated the reference to McCain as "gramps" - I find it extremely offensive.

The bashing of the South here is equally offensive.

Yep - you can find all types of bigotry right here. Not sure why some forms are ban-worthy and others accepted. Makes not a lot of sense to me.

oh well . . .

[JTFrog]

73. But only when directed at Bernie right?

Because you yourself engaged in ageism when it came to McCain. Advice you gave someone's mom on why they shouldn't vote for McCain (and he was younger then than Bernie is now):

"He likely won't make it his full term and you'll be left with <Fill-in-the-blank-incompetent-bush-bot-#-2>"

You seemed to think that was a legitimate issue back then.

Me, I have no problem with either of our candidates ages.

[doc03]

6. Remember Reagan, according to reports the last 4 years he

was pretty much out of it and Nancy was running things.

[Cali_Democrat]

8. You are correct

I don't believe Reagan was healthy enough to be President.

[doc03]

20. I am really not that comfortable with Hillary being 69. Myself I am 67

and forget what I did yesterday sometimes. Look how Obama has aged over the last 6 years.

[Thinkingabout]

7. Hillary has released her medical information, she is in fine shape.

Maybe sanders will release his before long.

[DavidDvorkin]

11. The 76 years life expectancy is at birth

At Sanders's age, it's much greater.

A 75-year-old man in the US has a life expectancy of another 11 years.

https://www.ssa.gov/oact/STATS/table4c6.html

[totodeinhere]

92. Good point.

[Lans]

12. It just means

Bernie has 6 more years of experience not voting for decisions like the Iraq War

[BlueCaliDem]

75. But voted for the 1998 Iraq Liberation Act - the prelude to the AUMF Against Iraq.

[Agnosticsherbet]

13. Clinton showed hers on July 31, Sanders must show his.

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/hillary-clinton-health-excellent-doctor-letter-2016-campaign-120861

[dsc]

14. that is somewhat misleading

what is relevant is the life expectancy of a male age 75 and a female age 69. For males age 75 it is 10.9 years, while for females age 69 it is 17.1. Life expectancy is greatly lowered by people dying young and that happens more often in males. Once a person hasn't died young then the life expectancy (in total) is quite higher.

[DCBob]

18. Valid point.

Thanks for the clarification.

[morningfog]

46. The poor OP stirred shit poorly. Lol.

It hard being a hater.

[NurseJackie]

15. I think voter concerns will be based on how the candidate and campaign choose to respond.

I expect that Bernie (his campaign and physician/s) will release his "fit-as-a-fiddle" medical records in due time, and everyone can move on.

But, the other possibility is that Bernie's campaign could decide to be dismissive, and as aggressive and defensive as his hardcore supporters are. This could create the wrong impression among voters that he has something to hide.

Voters for whom this could be an issue will have to make up their own minds. The question that remains is whether or not Bernie's campaign will behave in such a way that eases their minds, or in a way that arouses their fears.

It's impossible for me to predict the future, but it will be interesting to watch how all of this unfolds.

(Wishing a speedy recovery for Senator Sanders.)

[enlightenment]

17. My father

had two hernia surgeries - one in his 60s and the other in his late 70s. The "when" was elective, as neither was a threat to his well-being; just aggravations that he found the time to deal with as it fit his schedule.

He also had six stents - a pacemaker - a temporary colostomy (later repaired) after a bowel resection - surgery to remove a cancerous mass in his abdomen and laser ablation of his liver - all after he turned 75.

His cancer was treated with Gleevic, a chemo drug that he took daily for eight years.

He died five months shy of his 90th birthday and it wasn't any of those things that killed him - but the grief of losing my mother, his wife of 64 years, seven months earlier. He was mentally fit until the week before he died.


My point - in case you missed it - is that age is not an absolute indicator of anything. Even health setbacks don't tell the full story, as my dad could have run intellectual rings around most people until just before his death.

[hill2016]

64. Gleevec

isn't a chemo drug. It's a kinase inhibitor.

[enlightenment]

67. Okay.

He took it for eight years as a primary treatment for his cancer - a GIST tumor that was removed but had spread. The Gleevec kept the tumor/s under control. Every year or so they would take him off the drug, then the tumors would begin to grow and he'd go back on it. He was part of a Mayo study/trial - the oldest member who had the tumor removed (since we were told they are very difficult to remove).

I'm sure you know more about it than I.

[sadoldgirl]

19. If this concerns you so much,

then vote for O'Malley!

[Vattel]

21. Good lord, what matters is life expectancy of a 75 year old.

Even that is crude because the general health of the 75 year old makes a big difference.

[Cali_Democrat]

24. Then Bernie should just release his medical records

Something Hillary has already done.

Transparency.

[Vattel]

71. Why not first admit that the stuff about the average life expectancy being 76 is irrelevant?

Then we can talk.

[BlueCaliDem]

80. It will be irrelevant once he releases his medical records.

See how that works?

Until such time, people have every right to question his health and decide whether he's the one they want to vote for, for president.

[Vattel]

82. Holy shit! What is somewhat relevant is the life expectancy of a 75 year old.

The life expectancy of a new born baby isn't relevant at all. You guys are killing me here.

[BlueCaliDem]

86. This subthread is about Bernie Sanders, although you're trying to divert the conversation,

not the general consensus on the life expectancy of any 75 y/old. Life expectancy, as you've already pointed out, is contingent upon overall health.

But since BERNIE SANDERS failed to release his health records to date - while our front-runner has already released them back in July, so I don't know what the hold-up is with Sanders - we don't know what his health situation is, do we?

The life expectancy of a new born baby isn't relevant at all.

I have no idea what this has to do with the discussion of this subthread.

[Vattel]

88. Let me explain.

The OP said "Bernie Sanders will be 75 years old in January 2017. The average life expectancy for a male in the United States is 76 years. For this reason, his health is a legitimate issue that should be discussed." My point was that the 76 year life expectancy of a male is actually the life expectancy of a newborn male. Sanders is not a newborn male. He is 74 years old, and the life expectancy of a 74 year old male is not 76 years. Therefore, the fact that the life expectancy of a male is 76 years is irrelevant to whether his health is a legitimate issue.

[Crystalite]

22. Bernie will always be the older one, Hillary will always be the corporatist one.

I will always prefer the progressive trustworthy champion of the REAL middle working class.

Not that $250,000 year top 5% working class Clinton wants to protect.

[NorthCarolina]

23. I'll trust his VP choice to carry-on.

eom

[dlwickham]

78. people trusted McCain as well

see how that worked out

[NCTraveler]

25. I think the discussion is fine.

I just know I can't keep up with either.

[Warren Stupidity]

26. anything but the actual issues.

When it isn't hilarious disinformation about Sander's proposals, proposals that are part and parcel of core Democratic Party traditions and principles, proposals that really only republicans should oppose, it is endless nonsense about his hair, his age, his alleged racism, sexism, homophobia and anything else the CERTs can make up to toss out here. All of which is terribly odd when one considers that the same Emergency Response Team holds that she is inevitable, her lead insurmountable, and that we should all just surrender to the borg. Since she is certainly the nominee, what the flying fuck is the point of all this crap? Huh?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

27. Just a small point...

When looking at actuarial tables you have to look at the life expectancy for a person who is 75 now:

Life Expectancy (Female): 12.8 years
Life Expectancy (Male): 10.9 years
# Alive Out of 100,000 born: 69,070
Leading Cause of Death: Cancer
See all Life Expectancy & Mortality Rates

http://life-span.healthgrove.com/l/76/75

[Cali_Democrat]

52. Good info. Thanks. nt

[JonLeibowitz]

53. It could also trend upwards; the probability distributions that the actuarial tables are derived

It could also trend upwards; the probability distributions that the actuarial tables are derived from are not static in time. The mathematical term for this is a nonstationary stochastic process, or on the distribution side a nonstationary distribution.

The reason for this are medical advances.

[Live and Learn]

30. Another disgusting thread. Are you trying to set a record? nt

[morningfog]

47. Haters gonna hate.

Shit stirrers gonna shit and stir.

[jeff47]

62. Looks that way. (nt)

[JI7]

31. no. once people already reach certain age the number is higher

Sanders is likely to live long enough to serve both terms .

And from what we see he is in excellent health .both mentally and physically.

[workinclasszero]

32. Bernie's age is a legitimate concern

especially considering the average life span of men in this country.

Not to mention a man that would be under enormous stress 24/7/365

Look at President Obama, he's gone grey. The office aged him prematurely. What would it do to a 75 year old man who's having health problems already?

[NurseJackie]

33. It's definitely a high stress non-stop job ...

... and one which requires a great deal of stamina. Not to mention how constant travel and time zone changes can affect someone. The demands of the office are likely much higher than running for the office.

I'm sure he'll provide voters with the reassurances they need. If voters like and believe his response, this will become a non issue in a few days.

Wishing a speedy recovery to Senator Sanders.

[oldandhappy]

35. And I will be 77!! May I play in the Oval Office??!!

[WillyT]

39. Ah... So Ageism Is The Only -ism Allowed Now ???

Thanks for the heads-up.

[JTFrog]

43. Oh, so now you can recognize isms?

Good to know.

[MissDeeds]

44. 423 views and only three recs

Looks like you lose.

[morningfog]

45. Yes, yes. We get it. You hate and are afraid of the old man.

[Scootaloo]

51. You're gonna need this...

[MrMickeysMom]

58. !!!

[MrMickeysMom]

57. That's a pretty desparate observation...

In 6 to 7 years, we might then all give Bill his sympathy card... Oh, wait... he'll be at death's door, too.

[Perogie]

59. He's still a better choice than HRC

[lostnfound]

60. Legitimate discussion but statistics put life expectancy for a 73 year old at 86..

An average of 76 includes people who died at age 1 or 3 or 20 or 30 or 55 or 65..
What you need are actuarial tables. Looking up a 73 year old male, (born 9-8-41) the life expectancy is 86.

Hillar using same calculator has a life expectancy of 87.

.https://www.socialsecurity.gov/cgi-bin/longevity.cgi

[RoccoR5955]

61. This is agism, and offends me!

I suggest that the OP delete the post!

[jeff47]

63. She won't. Any attack against Sanders is good in her eyes.

But she'll happily tell you how much of a "hater" you are.

[NurseJackie]

65. Considering the news, it's a valid question

... that some feel deserves to be answered. Hiding behind privacy concerns and deflecting with accusations of ageism and having one's sensibilities offended only cause more suspicions and doubts. Bernie will likely do the right thing in spite of the hypersensitive and shortsighted concerns of his hardcore fans.

[DCBob]

70. It's a valid concern.

I am sure it is on many voter's minds. Hillary is also getting up there. It will be an issue if the GOP puts up a much younger candidate like Rubio. Hard to say if it will be a negative or a positive.. depends how our candidate frames it.

Regardless its a legitimate topic to discuss. This is a political discussion board..right??

[coyote]

72. That's funny... I thought Hillary has mental health issues.

[still_one]

76. The question is a candidates health a legitimate issue, and if so, should a candidate release his

health records, or should that be considered confidential and not relevant

[dlwickham]

77. good one!

[brooklynite]

79. I am not concerned about his health in the slightest...

Just his electability.

[Reter]

81. You can't use the average life stat and compare it to a President

The average life span for a President is 90 if we take the last several only.

[Art_from_Ark]

90. You're right

Harry Truman lived to be 88
Richard Nixon lived to be 83
Ronald Reagan lived to be 93
Gerald Ford also lived to be 93
Jimmy Carter is 91
George H.W.Bush is also 91

[MeNMyVolt]

83. I think age will work against both Sanders and Clinton in the GE.

But they both seem very healthy. Heck, much more than myself, and I'm 20 years their junior.

Get the med records out and call it a day, but be ready to fight against the much younger Rubio.

[ViseGrip]

84. Don't care how old he is. How old is Biden? Funny, no one asked.

[MoonRiver]

93. A lot of people, including Biden, brought it up.

But since he was never a candidate, it was irrelevant.

[R B Garr]

85. Cali-Dem, someone alerted on this: 0 to 7 leave

so someone is locked out from alerting for a while.

[moobu2]

89. A lot of his supporters would vote for him if he was on his death bed.

they see him as some kind of religious savior figure type person for some reason.

[jfern]

91. He's shown a lot more energy than Hillary this campaign

His 80 year old brother seems to be doing fine.
And the average life expectancy over all 75 year old men is 86, and is going to be higher if you exclude those in poor health.