Roll call votes-comparison of Democratic vs. GOP conventions-my view as a Clinton delegate

[Gothmog]

The theme of the Democratic Convention will be Unity. Part of the deal for Sanders endorsement of Clinton is allowing Sanders to have some roll call votes on the super delegates, open primaries and the requirement of a formal roll call vote for the nomination itself (currently the plans are for this vote will be on Tuesday in the afternoon and not on Wednesday during prime time). There appears to no plan for Sanders to release his delegates to vote for Clinton during the roll call like what Clinton did in 2008. I would prefer that Sanders follow Clinton's 2008 example but that appears to not be part of the deal for Sanders endorsement and I want the party to be unified coming out of the convention.

The DNC could block these roll call votes if they wanted to ignore the rules and the democratic process but instead of using Roberts Rules of Order to thwart the goal of unity, there will be three to five roll call votes as the Convention and Clinton delegates are being "whipped" to show up and vote for these roll calls. The first vote will be as early as two thirty on Monday afternoon and the Clinton campaign will be busy "whipping" the delegates to be there for these votes.

The GOP blocked the roll call votes last night and will be paying a price for ignoring the rules. Democrats and DNC will be taking a different approach with the goal being a unified party. As a Clinton delegate, I am looking forward to these roll call votes and I love the fact that the Clinton campaign is trusting in the process and democracy.

We will see which method works but I think that putting your trust in democracy and the process may be the better way to go.

[BlueMTexpat]

1. Thanks for the background info, Gothmog.

I personally am quite unhappy that Sanders did not release his delegates as Hillary did in 2008. Actions speak louder than tepid words, IMO.

But I applaud the unity theme and hope that things will work out as hoped.

[Gothmog]

22. I am seeing more and more reports that there will be protests by Bernie or Bust types

The Sanders delegation contains a percentage of bernie or bust types who are planning to fight the process. We will see what happens but I am confident that the Clinton campaign is ready for these actions and I like the current plan

Again the Clinton people are in control and they know what they are doing as compared to the trump issues.

[BlueMTexpat]

25. At least Cornel West shouldn't be

there since he has endorsed Jill Stein.

[Gothmog]

27. Prof. West is not technically a delegate and so has no vote

If he shows up, he may be allowed onto the floor. I have a friend who lost out as a delegate to the national convention as so was named as a member of one of the committees show that she could go to the convention. I think that she will have a floor pass but she will not have a vote

[MADem]

32. Since he has formally endorsed the Green candidate I don't think he belongs, at all. nt

[Hortensis]

2. So agree. Tendencies to conservative authoritarianism and

to liberal respect for democracy are part of who we are.

[Cha]

3. Thank you, Goth!

[Her Sister]

4. You'll be there!! Just awesome! Feeling History!

[Gothmog]

21. I will be part of history and will also get to deal with some votes

My kids think that I am weird from wanting to see more roll call votes than normal.

[cosmicone]

5. Kicked and highly recommended n/t

[DemonGoddess]

6. K&R!

Looking forward to what you tell us about the convention next week!

[Surya Gayatri]

7. Massive K & R. Thanks for posting. Good for Team Hillary et al.

[wildeyed]

8. Thanks for that great information.

Easy to lose track of our own convention when there is so much opportunity to point and laugh at the RNC.

[KMOD]

9. K&R

[Spazito]

10. I think this is a very wise decision...

It allows for those who want to register their support for Sanders to do so without affecting the official nomination of Hillary Clinton, it gives them an outlet which is the opposite of what the repubs did which increased the anger of a number of their base.

Unity is the key and this decision helps to bring this about, imo.

Thanks for the info on this.

[UtahLib]

11. K&R. Thanks for the insight into convention operations.

[Lisa D]

12. K&R!

[NCTraveler]

13. Question.

Why do you think Clinton won't win on the first ballot? Why will three to five roll call votes be needed. She has more than enough to take it first time around.

[Gothmog]

14. Clinton will easily win on the first ballot

She should have a 1,000 more delegates and will win easily. Many of Sanders super delegates have move towards her now. In 2008 there was no full roll call vote because Hillary Clinton released her delegates and Obama was a accepted by acclamation which is the better way to proceed. Sanders appears to want a full roll call vote that he is going to lose which is not what was done in 2008

[NCTraveler]

15. Still leaves the question.

Why do you think there will be three to five roll call votes? I think I am reading it correctly. Thanks for your patience.

[Gothmog]

17. In addition to the vote on the nomination, there are expected to be votes on super delegates

The mechanism to disagree with the reports of the platform, rules or credentials committee is a minority report. It was reported that there will be no minority reports on the platform even though the Sanders people lost on Israel and a resolution calling for no votes during the lame duck session on TPP. The permanent rules committee meets on Saturday and there are expected to be minority reports on super delegates, open primaries and some other matters. Right now, the Clinton campaign is expecting two minority reports but there could be more minority reports and more roll call votes required.

In theory Clinton delegates are suppose to be getting texts and calls from the whips but I and a couple member of the Texas Clinton delegates have not yet heard.

This is my first convention but I have been reading up on the rules and talking to past delegates.

[NCTraveler]

18. Thank you.

Seems your op focused on the nomination. That deal appears to be sealed tight. I'm still expecting one vote.

[Gothmog]

19. I am expecting at least three roll call votes

A good friend who was a 2012 delegate is teasing me that I have to spend more time on the convention floor that she did

[Gothmog]

20. Sanders Delegation Plotting in Public and Secretly to Shake Up Democratic Convention

I saw this on the JPR site. This article describes what Clinton delegates may face http://www.alternet.org/election-2016/sanders-delegation-plotting-public-and-secretly-shake-democratic-convention

The poll and its followup actions are one thread in an evolving tapestry of potential protests in Philadelphia. There have been other public efforts, such as e-mails to Bernie delegates since he endorsed Clinton last week that argued he did it just to get into the convention hall where he can still win. One such e-mail sent to New England delegates had this question-and-answer section:

Q: So Wait, Bernie DIDN’T quit today?
A: No. he has to say she won the primary, he endorses her and will help the party defeat Trump, yada yada but he DID NOT concede. There is a very big and important difference. Had he conceded, all of his delegates would go to Hillary and he would no longer be an option for the nominee.
Q: So Bernie can actually still win?
A: YES. And if he wasn’t still TRYING to win, he would have conceded. The ONLY option he had to get to the convention with his delegates behind him and have a chance to still win was to do what he did today. He is not a traitor. He didn’t sell us out. He did the only possible thing he could have done to keep fighting for the nomination.

Seeing this e-mail, one state Democratic Party official commented, “This is the craziness that is fueling some of our nationwide delegates. I’ve been told that everyone that is in a responsible position is dealing with these posts.”

Clinton delegates were warned to expect more than one minority report and some roll call votes at the convention. There will be a number of Bernie or Bust types in the Sanders delegation and so I can expect an "interesting" convention.

The Clinton campaign has a "whipping infrastructure" in place or which will in place to deal with these efforts. I am really not that concerned but I doubt that the Sanders campaign will have control over all of its delegates from what I have seen

[NCTraveler]

24. I don't get why you connect Sanders not conceeding to multiple votes.

And at another point say they will be voting on other things.

Of course Clinton is ready for anything. She is running a massive machine. If the vote is for the nomination it is one and done. If procedural votes are taken they will be separate from the actual nomination vote.

Outside of a small group I don't see much of a dust up happening. We are Democrats. There will be a little excitement.

Are you talking about individual states.

That article seems very disjointed to say the least.

[Gothmog]

26. The goal is to keep this low key and not to make this a major issue

I am told that in some conventions there are few if any roll call votes because everything was done by acclamation. That is what happen in 2008 but that does not appear to be what is happening this time.

I am a political geek and so I am personally looking forward to these votes. The procedural votes for the 2008 and 2012 conventions were proforma and no drama. With a 1000 delegate lead for the Clinton delegation , I doubt that there will much drama in Philadelphia

[NCTraveler]

28. I doubt it as well. Nt

[NCTraveler]

29. Forgot to say I am jealous.

Have an amazing time.

[glennward]

33. I really feel sad about this. I admit I don't understand much about convention roll calls etc. but

I hate to see the Democrats even going through the motions of not accepting Hillary on the first vote. With the way the GOP's convention is going we have such a great opportunity to put our differences with them on display for the country to see. I will confess I am fearful that there will be disruption just to spoil it for Hillary. The general election is going to be really tough enough and Democrats have a way of wounding themselves. Still, I am hoping for the best.

[democrattotheend]

35. What makes you think Hillary won't be nominated on the first ballot?

She got a majority of delegates so I don't see why she won't be.

I am excited about having a proper roll call. I was excited about what I thought would be a proper roll call in 2008 as well, although it didn't turn out that way.

Historically, conventions were the forum where major decisions for the party were made, including whom to nominate. While I don't advocate going back to the days of smoke-filled rooms where nominees were chosen undemocratically, I don't see why anyone should be upset about following the party rules and doing a proper roll call that highlights the democratic process by which we chose a nominee, as well as on the process for future nominations. Conventions have become a choreographed infomercial that the networks barely cover anymore because nothing interesting happens at them. I for one am happy to see democracy on display. And I felt that way in 2008 as well despite being an Obama supporter. I was somewhat disappointed when Hillary released her delegates and then shut down the roll call.

[MADem]

16. And when he loses the roll call vote count, he'll just look churlish.

He'll look more churlish if he does it more than once.

He'd do well to just let it go--already, he's looking hypocritical, as he excoriated her for speeches (where she gave the proceeds to charity), but he's making money on a book he is busily writing to be released in November, and promising juicy tidbits about Clinton.

I hope he sees the wisdom in UNITY. If not, it's his problem.

[Gothmog]

23. The bernie or bust elements in the Sanders delegation will not care

From the article cited above http://www.alternet.org/election-2016/sanders-delegation-plotting-public-and-secretly-shake-democratic-convention

“There are adherents to that strain of thinking, but it’s not very big,” said Karen Bernal, a Sanders delegate from Sacramento elected as a co-representative of the California delegation, the nation's largest. In a half-hour interview, she described a half-dozen different camps under the Bernie umbrella: the Bernie or Bust crew, reflected in the Q&A e-mail; a similiar subset that thinks the party’s superdelegates, or hundreds of party insiders and elected officials, can still be swayed to pick Sanders; people, like those in the VP poll, who say they are willing to publicly protest on the floor; those who agree with those protesters but would not disrupt the proceedings; those who will follow whatever directions Sanders or the campaign says; and “eventual nominee” types, who tend to be elected or aspiring politicians, who will back Clinton.

“As you can imagine, we have everything from the most die-hard Bernie Busters,” Bernal said, speaking of the 200-member California delegation and its counterparts. “In terms of the people who occupy that universe, they are almost indistinguishable from protesters you will see outside the convention. Under no circumstance will they ever vote for Hillary. They’re very protest-minded… That goes all the way to the other end of the spectrum, which is the 'eventual nominee' types. These are all Bernie delegates.”

Again, the Clinton campaign is making plans to deal with the bernie or bust types including allowing roll call votes. It will be interesting to see if Sanders has any control over his supporters at the convention.

[joshcryer]

30. It's just a shame Sanders isn't releasing his delegates.

Maybe he will (Hillary didn't until the day before). But for Clinton to get less delegates than Obama in 2008 would really accentuate the sexism that our country has. Won by a landslide, gets less delegates than Obama, a man, in 2008, in an almost virtual tie, got.

I truly hope Sanders releases his delegates and doesn't allow this to happen. Hillary Clinton deserves all the delegates.

[democrattotheend]

36. She chose to release her delegates in 2008

Nobody forced her to do that. Personally I wish she hadn't. I was excited about having a proper roll call.

[brer cat]

31. Thank you for this thread.

It is exciting that you are going to the convention!

[yardwork]

34. Love your posts!

[murielm99]

37. Thanks for keeping us so well-informed.

We will indeed have a unified party. Our convention will be classy, not filled with scandals over angry delegates, plagiarism or illnesses. If there are a handful of Sanders supporters who choose to act like dicks, so be it. They will only make themselves look foolish. Sanders endorsed. End of story.

I can't wait to see how much better our convention will be than theirs. We are not having a circus or a hatefest. We will have a positive convention. They want to take America back? We want to take it forward.

[Gothmog]

38. I was just contacted by one of the whips

We will be getting more details tonight

[Gothmog]

39. After GOP convention turmoil, Clinton team works to fend off Dem squabbles

This report is consistent with what I have been hearing http://www.politico.com/story/2016/07/dnc-convention-2016-delegate-fight-225798

Thus far, the backroom efforts have yielded success. There were no minority reports coming out of the platform committee meeting earlier this month, Ober noted, dramatically reducing the chance of a fight when Democrats vote on the platform at the convention. The Clinton campaign is hoping for similar success at the convention’s rules committee, which meets Saturday. The hope is to work out any rules challenges before or during that meeting, leaving the party controversy free when the full convention votes next week.

Republicans on Monday demonstrated the risk of entering the convention with rules turmoil. When the full GOP convention tried to vote through their proposed rules via a voice vote, a group of delegates critical of Donald Trump moved to block it, asking instead for a lengthy roll call vote. When party leaders denied that call, the delegates were irate, sparking a nationally televised shouting match and lingering bad feelings that threaten to spill over during Trump’s official nomination Tuesday.

Even with strong Clinton campaign discipline and most of the platform draft divisions resolved, DNC committee members still expect some dissent at the Rules Committee. "I think the Rules [Committee] is where something's going to happen," DNC Credentials
Committee member Moses Mercado said of the upcoming meeting.

Sanders supporters are looking to follow through on the Vermont senator's call to try and change the superdelegate system in future elections, as well as to open up the Democratic primary process so that independents and Republicans can vote in caucuses and primaries. Both of those changes would likely have helped Sanders in his primary challenge to Clinton, during which many Sanders supporters insisted the deck was stacked against their candidate.
Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/07/dnc-convention-2016-delegate-fight-225798#ixzz4EzXRYRyg
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The theme will be unity and this will be a major difference compared to Trump's flop of a convention