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[IHateTheGOP]

This message was self-deleted by its author (IHateTheGOP) on Mon May 9, 2016, 04:13 PM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

[baldguy]

1. K&R

[MineralMan]

2. Yes, indeed.

We have our votes. Let's use them to everyone's best advantage.

[Baobab]

29. But she just told the GOP she shared their values.

MineralMan - you're being GAMED.

[w4rma]

3. Progressives don't tell neoconservative donors that they are better for neocons than Trump.

Neoconservatives and progressives are completely and diametrically opposed to one another in every single way.

[w4rma]

4. Trump as Unifier: Are Hillary Clinton and Neoconservatives Ready to Join Forces?

Last edited Sun May 8, 2016, 11:16 AM - Edit history (1)

'Neocon elites are probably the likeliest faction to defect to Clinton, and what they'd want is blood-curdling aggressiveness overseas and Benjamin Netanyahu in charge of Middle East policy.'
…
On Wednesday, the Clinton campaign at least hinted at this approach by posting a list of people it described as "prominent activists, journalists and elected officials" in the Republican Party who have decided to reject Trump, quoting some who explicitly said they would vote for Clinton if she ends up as the Democratic nominee. A verbatim sampling from the list (which was further updated by the campaign on Thursday) follows:

• Lifelong Republican, foreign policy expert Max Boot: “ would be vastly preferable to Trump.’”

• Billionaire Bush-backer Mike Fernandez: “If I have a choice — and you can put it in bold — if I have a choice between Trump and Hillary Clinton, I’m choosing Hillary.”

• Elliott Abrams, former foreign policy advisor for Presidents Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush: “won’t be voting for Trump”

According to journalist and political commentator Sam Sacks, who spoke with D.C.-based Sputnik Radio about the same dynamic on Thursday, observers can expect to "see a lot of the neoconservatives, people who were, ironically, very close in the George W. Bush administration... coming home and supporting Clinton, who has a foreign policy record that hews pretty neoconservative."
…
Clinton probably won't be able to get meaningful numbers of Republican defectors. She is absolutely loathed among the Republican base and has been for years and years. Reuters says 84 percent of Republicans have an unfavorable view of Clinton, CNN has them at 85 percent. While she might get a few prominent neocons like Max Boot or Robert Kagan, they won't bring anyone over with them. And those few aside, the vast majority of the party will accommodate themselves to Trump eventually. It's happening already.
http://www.commondreams.org/news/2016/05/05/trump-unifier-are-hillary-clinton-and-neoconservatives-ready-join-forces

Sanders was referring to a Thursday Politico report that claimed Clinton’s supporters have targeted Bush family donors for funding, trying to convince them she represents their values better than presumptive GOP nominee Donald Trump.

“By the way, as I understand it, [Clinton] is now reaching out to Jeb Bush’s fundraisers in order to raise money from them, and that really casts a doubt on the parts of millions of Americans,” said Sanders, who currently trails Clinton in the race for the Democratic presidential nomination.

“Are you really going to stand up for the middle and working class when you’re collecting millions from Jeb Bush supporters?”
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/279049-sanders-hits-clinton-for-soliciting-republican-donors

[99Forever]

5. Hillary Clinton is a neoliberal pretending to be a progressive.

No amount of lies, spin, pandering, demeaning, authoritarian lecturing, fear-mongering, tone deaf dismissing, or blind personality worshipping, will ever change that.

One thing Hillary Clinton MOST certainly is NOT, is a progressive. Not by a LONG FUCKING SHOT.

[LWolf]

6. Hillary is a neo-liberal.

That means she has a lot to say that sounds progressive when it comes to social issues, and, yes, she is better on social issues than Republicans. At the same time, she's part of our disastrous economic problem, which is, despite what some would like us to think, interconnected with those social issues.

Of course, the neo-liberals co-opted both the term "liberal" and "progressive" when they came to power, so, if you mean "progressive" like the PPI, then you are correct. If you mean "progressive" as in working to make life progressively better for the 99%, you aren't.

Regardless of what I think of Hillary Rodham Clinton, though, I'm on board for burying the right wing...including the neo-liberals and their right-wing economic policies.

[Lizzie Poppet]

7. Burying the right wing includes burying Princess Weathervane.

She's center-right where it matters most to me...

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

8. Hillary is a progressive in the same way that bank robbers are financiers.

[dana_b]

30. well said!

Progressives don't go to Bush supporters asking for money. Progressives want nothing to do with Bush supporters!

[catnhatnh]

9. You can't bury the right wing

by electing it.

[Baobab]

32. very good..

well put!

[Turin_C3PO]

10. Of course she is.

I'd call her a center-left Democrat. She voted the same as Bernie 93% of the time. I'm not a huge fan of her hawkish foreign policy but it's better than Donald "Kill their families" Trump.

[djean111]

11. Um, no, she is not.

She is for war and fracking and the TPP and means-testing Social Security and job and safety-regulation killing trade deals. Se is against Single payer.

For Hillary to be a "progressive Democrat", one would have to completely change the meaning of those words.

Which, of course, is what the DNC is trying to do. I'll pass, no thanks.

[timmymoff]

12. It is Orwellian when people call her a progressive.

[TimPlo]

26. Yea I agree

And Hillary is now expanding on this by courting man of Jeb Bush's ex-donors.

[timmymoff]

28. You will doom the country by supporting a neo liberal

[timmymoff]

39. Trump will be running on her left

Think about that shit for a minute.

[Nonhlanhla]

40. That is such bullshit

Trump is a fascist. Fascism only appears to be on the left on some issues. It's kind like how the Nazis called them themselves National Socialists. And yet, socialism is on the left and national socialism is on the far right of the political spectrum. You cannot divorce the aspects of fascist thought that bears a superficial resemblance to leftist positions, from the overall package. There is NOTHING in Trump that is to the left of Hillary, no matter what superficial similarities there might be between his positions and those of progressives.

[timmymoff]

41. I apologize

I read about trump now adopting Bernie's platform.. Hillary already did, so who knows, but all is well Hillary is now courting Jeb Bush Mega donors, so thank goodness she is showing her progressive side. I have never seen greater disconnect from reality in my life.

[Nonhlanhla]

42. So what if Mr. Misogyny and Racist is now adopting some of Bernie's positions?

Are you saying that Bernie's positions include the vile kind of racism and misogyny we see in Trump? Because whatever other policy positions Trump adopts, cannot be divorced from those things. Much like nothing Hitler did could be divorced from his anti-Semitism. It's a package deal with fascists: they represent the id of civilization (read Freud's Civilization and Its Discontents for a bit of insight on this). In other words, Trump can repeat some of Bernie's ideas until he's blue in the face, but that does not make him leftist in the least, since he's a fascist through and through.

I don't deny that Hillary is on the more moderate side of the progressive spectrum. Her courting Republicans does not bother me much, however: she knows damn well that she will lose some racist populist Democrats (we do still have a few left although most left for the GOP years ago) to Trump, and that she will lose some of the more rabid Bernie supporters, so she needs to make up for those votes elsewhere. She also knows that many of the more rational Republicans are terrified of Trump, and courting those votes and contributions makes perfect sense. Winning elections are all about creating a winning coalition of diverse interest groups. The coalition that I see her building consists of: social progressives who want to see progressive SC judges and protection of women, PoC, and LGBTQ etc.; economic progressives who want to see at least some of Wall Street's excesses cured (and yes, she does have a platform for that); women who would like to see a female president; People of Color who know that the Democratic Party is by far the better choice (especially compared to the Trumpist version of the GOP); LGBTQ who know that the GOP is the enemy; disaffected Republicans who are terrified of Trump and are willing to support Hillary despite some policy differences because they know the alternative is too awful for words. This would be a diverse coalition, and not all the interest groups will agree on everything, and some will even distrust one another. That is how it always is. The key to winning an election is to build a stronger coalition than your opponent. I see Trump appealing to a narrow subset of the traditional GOP voting blocks, plus some disaffected angry (and often racist or sexist) Democrats or independents.

The people who are out of touch with reality are some of the Bernie supporters around here. Not only do many still suffer from the bizarre delusion that Bernie has a chance to grab the nomination, but many of you don't seem to realize that the real fight in this election is against the rising tide of fascism as represented by Donald Trump.

[timmymoff]

43. We warned you.. good luck.

Better get busy selling this new brand of democrat that courts republican mega donors, should be a ton of work. Better start now because I won't be helping herm financially, canvassing, phone banking, or even talking her up in general conversation.

[timmymoff]

46. I think that results from our bernie group crushing hillary in the county by 5000

votes. To me that would say to someone we want you on our team, but you can't have us. We are for the liberal. Sorry we just aren't into Hillary. certainly you understand. We have county stuff and local congressional races to work on, we will be too busy to help the rw of the democratic party.

[Nonhlanhla]

47. You WARNED us?

Your so-called "warning" consists of "vote for the guy we want or we burn down the house." Hillary's coalition is largely the old Democratic coalition, plus she's making use of Trump's disastrous candidacy to broaden that coalition this time around. Winning candidates ALWAYS build broad coalitions. She also built a broader coalition than Bernie did during the primaries. That is how you win. You do not win by being the candidate for one or two interest groups only.

By the way, why was it OK for Bernie to supposedly bring Republicans into the fold (as we were told here a million times), but not for Hillary? The hypocrisy of some Bernie supporters stinks to high heaven.

[Karma13612]

33. No, we are listening to facts and have studied Bernie's voting record.

And also, we have been equally diligent regarding HRC.

She is trouble for the 99%.

You might "hate the GOP", but you also don't know a great presidential candidate when he is running and starting a revolution that can't be stopped by a few negative words on DU.

[Dragonfli]

13. I don't know if I can comply it would require that I vote against Clinton and every neocon/neolieral

in both parties, and some of the right wingers are running against one another.

[Joob]

14. Despite what Hillary does and fights for

She's really progressive!!! She's like so progressive. The best progressive! Omg hillary hasn't done anything ever wrong. Hillary has values and she changes them! Now that's progressive! Hillary wants to stop corruption!...uh after the election maybe! Progressive!
Hillary can do no evil! Hillary has never done a bad thing! Hillary was always for gay marriage and actively fought for it since back in her goldwater days! Hillary is progressive. Hillaryious.

[Contrary1]

23. The "jig" won't be up until September...

when Trump starts throwing the election.

[hobbit709]

15. If she's a progressive democrat then Nixon was a screaming liberal.

It's not what I've heard, her record speaks for itself.

[Broward]

18. How can people be this divorced from reality?

[grossproffit]

31. You ask this on a forum that thinks Bernie will win the nomination?

[Karma13612]

20. my my, there are an awful lot of threads about Hillary

being a progressive today.

Keep saying it all you want, it still won't make it true.

Her actions and her words say just the opposite.

And that is why there is a difference of less than 300 actual confirmed delegates between them right now.

Including superdels is wrong and misleading until the convention.

Hillary does not have the nomination in the bag, and she is not a progressive.

And using the phrase "the right wing", is confusing.

Do you mean the right wing of the Democratic party or "the Right" which is the Republican Party.

[bigwillq]

22. Ms. Clinton calls herself a moderate.

She calls herself a lot of things; I'm not sure what to believe with her.
Down-ticket DEMs will get my support without question.

[bvf]

25. According to a lot of posts around here lately

it's a bit late for that.

Sorry.

[bjo59]

27. Hillary Clinton is not a progressive, she is a corporatist. I take it that "right wing" means

"Republican" to you and "Democrat" means "progressive." In my view you are behind the times, along with many other Americans who still think Republican/Democrat is a meaningful binary. I'm sure the global corporatist class finds that both amusing and convenient.

[Arugula Latte]

34. Yes! Also, we have always been at war with Oceania!

Doubleplusgood!

[AzDar]

35. Bullshit. She's ALREADY courting Republicans and NeoCons...Vote SANDERS to stop the RW