This one about Beck and Kanye and Beyonce makes me wanna leave DU today

[randys1]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026201563#post98

[samsingh]

1. it's all entertainment - each of those people are doing much better than us

[randys1]

2. If you mean financially so why should we give a shit about their feelings or what

people say, I do agree with that.

But the comments in that thread are based in something else.

something very deep and ugly

[arcane1]

3. Musical opinions are the last thing that deserves to be taken seriously.

I think all three of them suck

[randys1]

9. Not about musical opinions, these bigots go way beyond that

[CurtEastPoint]

4. Can you explain why?

[randys1]

7. Because attitudes are being expressed that show a tremendous ignorance of a given

community and possibly overt bigotry toward that community.

When an AfAm tells someone that the AfAm community highly values the work of Kanye and Beyonce for whatever reason, and then that person's statement is shit on, that bothers me greatly

[bravenak]

5. That was a nasty shitty post.

Taken shits more important than her lifes work? A white mans shit is more important than the lifes work of a black woman?

[randys1]

10. Evidently on DU that comment is not only accepted but endorsed by the majority.

And it proves nothing the MANY bigots on that thread are saying has ANYTHING to do with music

[bravenak]

11. Even in the African American group.

Sad.

[randys1]

12. Where - what did I miss - by an AfAm?

[bravenak]

13. This thread.

Me and you are the only ones who have a problem with that post.

[randys1]

14. I am doing too many things, you mean here on this thread everybody else agrees that

Kanye and Beyonce combined have less talent than the shit of Beck?



Really?

And not just that, as to talent, but that their value in the AfAm community is nothing, meaningless?

Anybody want to say that here in AfAm??

[bravenak]

15. I'm just not seeing anybody think anything is wrong with it.

Maybe it's perfectly normal.

[randys1]

16. dont worry, I am about to get another hidden post and be banned

If I am banned just make sure to NEVER oppose OUTRIGHT RACISM on du or you will be also

[bravenak]

17. Don't bother getting a hide over that.

[randys1]

20. I wonder if hating Kanye has anything to do with Kanye telling the truth about W or

for that matter white presidents and Katrina.

Not Clinton, but other than Clinton this country does have a track record of presidents not much caring about Black people

Well wait, LBJ cared, didnt he. He was a racist but he cared.

JFK I dont think he cared, he cared politically.

Bobby Kennedy cared.

[bravenak]

22. Feeling like things they love are losing popularity to a new group.

Race music used to be under the counter. Now it is THE music.

[randys1]

24. Oh hell yes. And music industry people and artists from all areas are on board big time

You will NEVER hear a true musician saying any of those things about Kanye or Beyonce

oh hell, enough of this

[marym625]

63. Bobby cared

What a different world it would be.

[giftedgirl77]

33. I just saw it, almost lost my mind....

Gave my 2cents, just a bit nicer. That whole thread was evil.

[bravenak]

38. But look at how much fun they're having.

I've seen black people compared to ball sweat and shit. Nice.

[giftedgirl77]

40. Yep & once again our music is disparaged

as well as one of the strongest most successful black women ever.

[JustAnotherGen]

47. I had two wedding songs

The first was a Michael Buble before dinner . . .

The second was 1 + 1 and it was my husband - a 45 year old Harley, tattooed, metal artist, heavy metal, shit kicker wearing guy . . .Who insisted on it.

And he is appalled at that thread.

That song is up there with Sensa Una Donna and At Last and La Vie En Rose. Anyone who has ever listened to that song knows she can sing and touch your heart.

[marym625]

34. I have a problem with it

For a few reasons. Biggest being it's almost all trash talk. Wtf does any of it doing on DU?

[bravenak]

37. They have gotten so bold.

This is apparently perfectly acceptable. Only certain people have to mind what they say as to not hurt others. People like me have a different standard to be held to. Ahh, GD. They got sucked right in by the op.

[marym625]

48. I'm seriously surprised that the op wasn't locked

But nothing should surprise me anymore. Rules are arbitrary. Words mean more than they actually do. And sometimes just the opposite. Some people are allowed to say this. Others can't say that. And baiting is just commonplace.

Sad.

Sigh.

[bravenak]

52. I wish it had been, but you know...

People need their pleasures.

[JustAnotherGen]

54. Degradation

The Gio - he sees things. He no likey the imagery.

[bravenak]

55. Yep. That's exactly what it was.

Like watching cannibals after an apartment fire.

[marym625]

58. How about some erotica?

Wonder how long until that was hidden and locked.

[bravenak]

60. I could use some erotica in place of that.

Don't tempt me!! That thread prolly will stand. Just like asian privilege thread.

[marym625]

61. Let's post some erotica and see what happens

Nothing like a good sex story. Maybe a little bondage. Nothing too severe. Latex and stiletto heals.

Lol. I crack me up.

[bravenak]

62. Lol!!

I'm busy asking people to explain themselves, but, i'm sur they have me on ignore. Smart.

[marym625]

64. Oh you're on that thread?

I just don't want to deal with it. Convince a man against his will, he'll have the same opinion still.

Nah, they wouldn't ignore you. Then they might miss something and then how can they complain?

[bravenak]

66. You saying I'm their excitement?

How sad! My boring ass.

[marym625]

67. gotta run

But had to say, you crazy lady? You are all kinds of fun!

[bravenak]

69. See ya around! Take care.nt

[JustAnotherGen]

53. See my post #51

On this thread. We are on the sme wave length here.

[yeoman6987]

6. Are you condoning his behavior?

[randys1]

8. What? I am furious at the OP of the thread i linked, not sure if I linked to the OP or not but

no I find the tremendous DISrespect being shown to the AfAm community in that thread to be EXTREMELY TROUBLING.



Oh, I see you mean am I condoning Kanye's behavour, got it.

I dont think what he did matters anymore, whether I condone it or not, we are BEYOND that, we are now saying the following per that thread

a shit from the body of Beck has more value than both Kanye and Beyonce combined AND whatever value those two have for the AfAm community is meaningless to me (me being the person who wrote the OP and the several others who agree)

[yeoman6987]

18. I read some of the thread earlier but didn't finish

For the same reason you did. I still think Kanye is rude to certain musical winners.

[randys1]

19. I do too, but those type of comments dont really have anything to do with that.

I think what he did was out of place, and that there is a time and place for whatever it is he felt he needed to say and do.



But we all know when someone becomes ENRAGED by what he did, it aint about music

[yeoman6987]

28. I totally agree with you!

A heart for you my friend!

[randys1]

30. thanks...!

[JustAnotherGen]

21. I seriously didn't know who 'Beck' is . . .

Until my husband pointed out he sang the 'Loser' song. . .


Which kind of sucks compared to Clapton's Promises End.

We have a 'thing' where it seems like when we are in the car the Loser song comes on and I tell my husband the guys voice makes my ears bleed and so he switches the station and almost every single time Promises End comes on.

Beautiful song - love Clapton's voice and guitar playing.

[randys1]

23. I am a musician, I love music more than life, almost.

For instance my favorite rocknroll is Pink Floyd and Queen and Zeppelin and Beatles and Robin Trower and Frank Zappa and I could go on for hours, but I appreciate Brittney Spears and Madonna, even though I dont listen to their music.

I appreciate the music "The Wiggles" do because it is wonderful fun music that makes little kids happy.

I appreciate Opera but cant listen to it.

I used to only appreciate rap and hip hop music, the loud bass especially bothered me due to years of headphones damaging my ears. i now both appreciate and love it and listen to it, I learned from it.

Lots of stupid people have stupid opinions about music, sometimes racism is involved and sometimes not.

Today we saw racism, IMO


Oh , I should add I also LOVE

Stevie Wonder
Sam Cooke
James Brown
Aretha Franklin
The Temptations
Smokey Robinson
Marvin Gaye, oh do I love Marvin Gaye

[JustAnotherGen]

27. Zepp? Do you like Robert Plant?

Band Of Joy - looking at your list . . . I think you will love that album!

Jay Z rapped it - now do it - dust that dieter off your shoulders.

[randys1]

29. Love him, saw him and the band at Oakland Coliseum the weekend they got in a

fight with Graham's people.

I remember playing their debut album (Led Zeppelin) in my cousins house when I was whatever age I was, very young, I turned to my cousins and said "boys, everything changes from here on"

We were Beatle fanatics, still are, but we instantly heard the change that day.

Have not listened to Band of Joy lately but I will check it out.

[JustAnotherGen]

35. Definitely check it out

I grew up listening to really good music - so Zeppelin was in the background a lot. Along with CCR, Muddy Waters, The Supremes, Sam Cooke, the Stones . . . My first album as an 8 year old in 1981 was Springsteen's Live From Asbury Park. My parents got a kick out of me asking for that when my friends were all over Rick Springfield!

[marym625]

72. traffic

The Band, Bob Dylan, Jefferson Airplane (love Grace Slick,Cream, Fleetwood Mac

I have to turn the music on.

[Number23]

41. "The Wiggles"!! What's your opinion on the massive Wiggles controversty?

This yellow Wiggle quit:



They then hired this yellow Wiggle:



and then fired him and replaced him BACK with the old yellow Wiggle:



SCANDAL!

[JustAnotherGen]

46. Don't do this

I'm still wondering what happened to Aunt Viv and why Uncle Banks replaced her with a Stepford wife with the same name.

[Number23]

50. Uncle Phiiiilll!!!!!!

Girl, that Wiggles drama was like story of the YEAR here in Oz a few years ago. You couldn't have escaped it if you'd wanted to. For me, I was sworn to never let my children attend another Wiggles concert as a result. I am TOTALLY Team Sam (the second yellow Wiggle)!

[Jamastiene]

65. I feel the same way about music.

Just because I might not enjoy a particular musician's music does not mean that music has any less value, much less the musician themselves. It just means it's not my thing. That music and the musicians who make that music still has value to others.

I don't listen to Beyonce much, only a little, and I don't listen to Kanye. I do think he seems to open his mouth about awards at the wrong times sometimes. I'd rather not think of Beck's shit at all. I like some of his music, but that doesn't mean Kanye or Beyonce are less than him in any way. They just play a different style of music than I am accustomed to.

I get why you are upset now that I have read your reasons in this thread. I didn't even see that other thread until you brought it up. Yes, that post was way wrong and should have been hidden. It was awful.

I wish everyone had been forced to sit through at least one year of a Music Appreciation class. I chose it as one of my electives in high school and I'm glad I did. The thing is, I had already learned the overall lesson of the class before going into it. A lot of people never do get the concept of music appreciation. What you love may not be another person's favorite music and what they love might not be your favorite music. Both are valid music, just different strokes for different folks.

Bringing race into it and belittling musicians the way some in that thread did was a new low for DU.

[Dr Hobbitstein]

25. Loser was Beck's early commercial hit.

His album that just won, "Morning Phase", is NOTHING like the song Loser.

With that said, I found Clapton's playing and tone (not to mention his songwriting ability) to diminish rapidly once he started playing the Strat. But he made JJ Cake a lot of money, so...

[JustAnotherGen]

36. He's boot knockin' music

If Number23 reads this post she's going to I just upped her "word" last night!

[Number23]

39. What's really funny about Beck is that alot of his musical stylings are CLEARLY bitten from black

folks. You know, the people his dumps are more musically important than.

This is from several years ago and is imo a great song from him. Anybody that can hear this track and not hear half a dozen blatant hip hop riffs doesn't need to even be talking about music at all. And I say this as someone who likes a few of Beck's songs. What he does is pretty cute but there is a reason that so many people say "Who?" when you say his name and NO ONE says that when you talk about Beyonce or Kanye.

[JustAnotherGen]

42. Awesome song!

But it sounds like a cross between LL and Arrested Development with a good guitar reef.

[Number23]

43. Oh yeah, this could definitely have been on an AD cd. If they'd had a non-singing white guy

Speaking of AD, I just heard "Everyday People" being used in a commercial to sell cars. Sigh...

[JustAnotherGen]

44. He sold out!

He sold out. That's just wrong.




I had to do it ^IT^!

[cemaphonic]

71. Beck himself would be the first to agree with that

He learned how to play the guitar from old Mississippi John Hurt recordings at a time when all his peers were learning to play like Eddie Van Halen. And Odelay (the album that "Where it's At" is from) is like a cross between 80s rap and Sonic Youth. His 1999 album Midnight Vultures is full of his weird non-sequiter lyrics set to the vocal and production stylings of classic R&B/soul/funk artists like Sam Cooke, Otis Redding and Prince. He's always acknowledged his debt to black culture and music.

As far as relative fame levels go, his commercial peak was nearly 20 years ago. In 2035, all the kids will be wondering just who the hell this Kanye person is too.

Just for fun, Beck playing on a Mississippi John Hurt tribute album:

[Dont call me Shirley]

26. Yup, full of dumbass posts, yikes!

[kwassa]

31. That thread is grotesque. There is much underlying bigotry in this thread.

That is all I am saying.

[1StrongBlackMan]

32. I read through the thread ...

and thought someone was channeling a Martin vs Malcolm discussion, by proxy.

[JustAnotherGen]

45. I liked your comments on it

Haters gonna hate - and Kanye is laughing all the way to the bank with all of these web references to him.

[Half-Century Man]

49. I skipped the referenced thread, it just looked like flame bait.

It was.
It is.......somewhat comforting, to know we can be so passionate about certain topics. At the same time, it is disheartening to discover those passions about something as incidental as preferred types of music, cause such discord and hateful speech.

[JustAnotherGen]

51. I thought the lewd references

Were disgusting. But that Would never get a hide.

But let me point out Iggy has butt implants and those same people would need the vapors and accuse me of being a racist because I pointed out she had plastic surgery.

[marym625]

57. LOL!

Sorry, it isn't really funny. But it's so ludicrous it is.

Oy!

I didn't read enough of the thread to see that. In fact, I didn't read much at all.

It's like Facebook invaded DU.

[lunasun]

56. I have had enough too. That tread and one I posted tonight causing a different outrage

[gwheezie]

59. That thread was blatantly racist

How did Beyoncé get in the middle of it. Why the attacks on Beyoncé?

[JustAnotherGen]

68. Same reason Huckabee picked on her

They want her and know she would never give them the time of day.

Not a single one of them picked at her appearance - that says a lot.

It's like my mom told me - when a boy pulls your hair he doesn't like you - he's just mean as a snake because he knows you would never like him.

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

73. THey dont just want her, they want to OWN her and decide who she sings and dances

for and who she doesnt.

And Mr Huckabee will do as he pleases with her when nobody is looking, if he is like is ancestors

[JustAnotherGen]

84. I can't disagree!

Sick sick sick twists.

[steve2470]

70. this was my take in that thread, and hopefully my "invitation" won't get abused

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026201563#post265

my take

1- Ok, I have to get this out of the way. I'm not of a mind to act as he does at award shows. That being said, Beck really is the one who "should" have the biggest beef with him.

2- Unless you focus exclusively on pure technical talent, all music conversation is subjective. Your music makes your brain hum in just the right way, I may not care for it, and vice versa. Remember what some "music critics" had to say about Elvis and other people in rock way back when ?

Why do people have to aggressively put down other's musical tastes ? I don't get it. I don't care for my son's music (Atlanta-style hip hop) but I won't put it down either. He doesn't put down my EDM. We get along just fine.

3- You're cordially invited to visit the African-American group, and, WITH AN OPEN MIND AND OPEN HEART, read what is being said. Read the group SOP and participate within those rules, if you wish.

Let's respect diverse musical tastes. We all have different brains and different ears. I think we, as progressives, can do this.

[benz380]

74. Riddle me this:

If the artist in question was a different race, would that thread have that many responses?

[steve2470]

75. Are you saying that because Mr. West is black, it got a lot of responses ? nt

[benz380]

76. No I didn't say that. I asked a question. n/t

[JustAnotherGen]

77. Probably - but without

The violent imagery (check out the hide on the OP down in the tread) and degrading sexual based language to a woman he is not even married to . . .


Seems to be okay when it's a black woman. Sorry but we've seen that at DU before.

And let me stop you - I'm not providing you with links or evidence. Go to discussionist, do a search there and you'll find the threads linking back to here.

[benz380]

78. The posts about excrement and ball sweat were the worst. n/t

[JustAnotherGen]

79. Disgusting filthy pigs

I can't imagine how these people speak to their wives, girlfriends -hell their own mothers.

[steve2470]

80. people's "inner assholes" come out online

Too many people at DU are 100% tone-deaf on race and gender-related issues.

[randys1]

82. Most rightwing men hate all Women, they have quasi conditional love for mothers and wives

and sisters but will always lump them in with their hatred in back handed ways.

I dont know a single rightwing male who has the same attitude about Women that I do or my liberal friends do, not one.

[JustAnotherGen]

83. I see that point

Good one. Which begs the question - exactly what kind of company do we keep at DU?

[randys1]

85. Most good, but seems like almost a 3rd or more not so good.

In society we have a political party that has decided that to be viable it has to give in to far right racists, homophobes and misogynists.

I heard that the SC Judge in Alabama who is telling them not to do the Gay marriages, that the KKK has now endorsed him.

This is a good thing.

When we can finally ALL agree that the teaparty was created by the Koch bros for the sole purpose (on the outside anyway) to oppose the Black president, no matter what he does, when we can agree to that, since it is true, we can then admit that a very very large percentage of the American people are very bad people, very bad.

And then when we all make it clear not one more cop can shoot a Black man for being Black, when we all make it clear no man will ever make a single law about a Woman's body, etc., we will be on our way.

[BklnDem75]

88. Dylan's 30 minute rant had a tiny thread in that mess...

Even Ted Nugent never received the level of hatred I'm reading in those two threads.

[Trajan]

81. Just so you know ...

It's like this all over the place .... YouTube is a cesspool of 'artistic hatreds' ...

I never understood why someone has to 'hate' an art form, and, by extension, the artists who create that art.

You don't like Country Western ? (I don't), then don't listen to it ...

I am not a fan of pure Rap Music, but I do give props to Kanye for his innovations in the 'art' of creating such music.

He is very good at producing modern rap music with excellent and polished production values ...

Still .... The interruptions in these ceremonies are not called for ... Taylor Swift and Beck have nothing to do with selecting their own awards, other than creating the art ... It isn't warranted ...

Nevertheless .. Beyonce, Etta James, Kanye, Beck, Taylor Swift, Lady Gaga, Justin Bieber, et al, ALL create art that some people find enjoyable ... Far be it for me to condemn any one of them ....

I am not a fan of any of them (I'm a Trent Reznor kinda dude), but each of them bring joy to someone ... I'm good enough with that ...

Beck, btw, has been amazing from the moment his first song hit the airwaves ... a very creative fellow who deserves kudos for his work.

[randys1]

86. This one is entertaining

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6208740


I invite you folks to participate in my idea of "Separate But Equal Grammy"

[BklnDem75]

87. It's just our 'allies' letting off some steam...

I see they got around to calling them 'lowlifes'. There's hatred and then there's a special kind of hatred. We're seeing that right now.

[benz380]

89. I'm watching the Little League thread in GD, seeing if it will get as long as the Kanye threads. n/t

[randys1]

90. can you direct me to this thread you speak of please

[benz380]

91. deleted. See you found the thread. n/t