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Thu Mar 22, 2012, 08:13 PM

'This so-called post-racialism is a figment of our imagination.'

'“This so-called post-racialism is a figment of our imagination. Race, unfortunately, is still the barometer by which everyone is measured.

Bernadette Pruitt, an associate professor of history at Sam Houston State University in Huntsville, Tex., who has written about Southern racial history and can’t stop thinking of Trayvon Martin and his family. http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trayvon-martins-killing-galvanizes-florida-community-civil-rights-groups/2012/03/21/gIQAbQslSS_story.html


If I could make that bolded part 100X bigger, I would. Because THIS is the reality of the situation and has been ever since this country came into existence.

But the allure of "post racialism" was not a figment of OUR imagination. I have yet to meet a single black person that thought for even one second that Obama's presidency automatically ushered in an era of "post racialism." 400 years of history, brutality and oppression are not easily overcome.

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Reply 'This so-called post-racialism is a figment of our imagination.' (Original post)
Number23 Mar 2012 OP
Kalidurga Mar 2012 #1
nofurylike Mar 2012 #2
Number23 Mar 2012 #5
nofurylike Mar 2012 #11
JustAnotherGen Mar 2012 #3
noiretextatique Mar 2012 #4
Number23 Mar 2012 #7
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2012 #9
Number23 Mar 2012 #10
noiretextatique Mar 2012 #16
noiretextatique Mar 2012 #12
Number23 Mar 2012 #13
noiretextatique Mar 2012 #15
Number23 Mar 2012 #18
noiretextatique Mar 2012 #19
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2012 #22
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2012 #8
noiretextatique Mar 2012 #14
Blue_Tires Mar 2012 #21
Blue_Tires Mar 2012 #20
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2012 #6
noiretextatique Mar 2012 #17
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2012 #23
Mr Dixon Apr 2012 #24
Number23 Apr 2012 #25

Response to Number23 (Original post)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 08:51 PM

1. In a truly post racial country

we would barely be aware of Obama's heritage. I don't think that day will ever come when people are seen for who they are and what their character is before a whole lot of assumptions are made over the color of their skin. I mean when most people are that way instead of a small percentage of the population.

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Response to Number23 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 12:58 AM

2. Hear, hear!!

the word delusion, or maybe lie, would be more correct than imagination.

the only people i ever hear claiming this is "post racialism" are the same ones who are always in denial about racism; and always deny their own racism.

thank you for posting that, and your great comment, Number23!

But the allure of "post racialism" was not a figment of OUR imagination. I have yet to meet a single black person that thought for even one second that Obama's presidency automatically ushered in an era of "post racialism." 400 years of history, brutality and oppression are not easily overcome.


YES YES YES.

"400 years of history, brutality and oppression are not easily overcome"

and won't even start to be if people still refuse to look at the facts of that. i had an argument with someone at Whole Foods because they featured lady auschwi ... uh ... antebellum's cd at the checkout.

"yeah, right, antebellum: a reeeeeeal proud period of u.s. ATROCITY.... !"

next time i was there, the cd was no longer featured there.

thing is, so many will not look at it, at all, much less with true recognition of the history we must face if this world is ever to overcome it. and those who will not look at it, are not honoring those who suffered in those CENTURIES of crimes against humanity ... and those who are STILL SUFFERING TODAY'S!!!


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Response to nofurylike (Reply #2)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 06:58 PM

5. You ALWAYS blow me away!!!

the only people i ever hear claiming this is "post racialism" are the same ones who are always in denial about racism; and always deny their own racism.

Yes! YES!! A million times YES.

thing is, so many will not look at it, at all, much less with true recognition of the history we must face if this world is ever to overcome it. and those who will not look at it, are not honoring those who suffered in those CENTURIES of crimes against humanity ... and those who are STILL SUFFERING TODAY'S!!!


ABSOLUTELY. I am under no illusion of living in a "color blind" society. I don't think such a thing will ever exist as long as human beings exist on this planet anyway.

I am immensely proud of being black. So when someone (and let's be real - it is ALWAYS a "well meaning" white person that says this) says "they don't see color," I not only view this as 100% unbelievable but I also view this as someone willfully choosing to not recognize a very important way in which I see myself. I WANT you to see that I am black. What I don't want is a whole bunch on nonsense "she must be x/y/z BECAUSE she is black" on top of it.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #5)

Sat Mar 24, 2012, 04:06 PM

11. YES!! "willfully choosing to not recognize a very important way in which I see myself."

I am immensely proud of being black. So when someone (and let's be real - it is ALWAYS a "well meaning" white person that says this) says "they don't see color," I not only view this as 100% unbelievable but I also view this as someone willfully choosing to not recognize a very important way in which I see myself. I WANT you to see that I am black. What I don't want is a whole bunch on nonsense "she must be x/y/z BECAUSE she is black" on top of it.


YES!!! brilliant!!! i think that is THE point about "color blind"!!

we don't need to be "color blind," we need be color cherishing, color celebrating , color adoring!!!

we need EQUALITY!!

we need to end PREJUDICE!!

- to end white privilege



thank you so very much for your kind words, dear Number23


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Response to Number23 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 11:41 AM

3. I'm so in agreement

With the author of that article. And with Kalidurgan (sp?). . . I think it's foolish to think that having a President who happens to be black means that America's race issues are solved.

Faaaar from hit - I think his 'win' sparked a whole new wave of 'Them ones is takin' over'.

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Response to Number23 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 03:45 PM

4. my recent interview in "post-racial" america

black woman was in HR
unfortunately it went downhill from there i met the east indian male CFO, who literally seemed at a loss for words upon seeing me. sat down to talk with the chinese male accountant, and he kept asking me , in a condescending tone, if i knew quickbooks. he asked me so many times, that i responded in frustration: "quickbooks is the most simple software...ever. i've worked on just about every accounting software imaginable, so YES i know quickbooks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" then he wanted me to do a test in quickbooks, which i passed with flying colors. then he looks at my resume again...and looks at me, as if he could not reconcile my work experience with my black, female self.

then the CFO comes over and says they are still interviewing...blah. blah, blah. i left KNOWING i did not get the job...because i a black female, and i am smart. i do not fit their stereotype of a black female. i had more skills than the accountant and CFO combined, and they felt totally intimidated. i am sure they were looking for a female who would not make them feel insecure or challenge their sense of superiority. i am sure they hired a meek, asian female...certain of it, in fact.
i not only have to deal with racism, but racist sexism also.

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Response to noiretextatique (Reply #4)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 07:06 PM

7. Girl...

Last edited Fri Mar 23, 2012, 09:00 PM - Edit history (1)

I am so sorry you had to go through that. And people have the NERVE to wonder why so many black women seem to literally SEETHE with quiet rage lurking just beneath our surfaces.

then he wanted me to do a test in quickbooks, which i passed with flying colors. then he looks at my resume again...and looks at me, as if he could not reconcile my work experience with my black, female self.

Been there. Lord, I've been there so many times I could write a book. I swear, it wasn't until I ventured out from beyond the 50 states of our "great nation" that things got better for me in that regard. I have a girlfriend who is applying for a job in Dubai because she has had a literal GUTFULL of the crap that gets tossed around in the States. She has three kids too. I told her I understood and supported her 100%. Actually, it's more like 412%.

i not only have to deal with racism, but racist sexism also.

Yep. Sexist assholes still want a woman who "knows her place" and black women are perceived as being too uppity and feisty. This will not do for sexist assholes. Conversely, I know we've talked about this on AAIG so you know I've said this before but some of the most easily threatened, bigoted, racist people who have EVER made my life a living hell were white WOMEN. So much for sisterhood, eh? We get it coming AND damn going.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #7)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 07:30 PM

9. Once ...

i not only have to deal with racism, but racist sexism also.

Yep. I know we've talked about this on AAIG so you know I've said this before .


during an "after project completion decompression" session , I had a had a white guy tell me:

"I know you people face a lot of that discrimination bull$hit; but I have to say, Black men have it the worst."

I was just sober enough not to knock him out, but drunk enough to be curious about how he came to that conclusion, so I asked him "Why do you say that?"

He said, "A lot of white managers don't want to hire Black men because, after all, you guys ARE men. So if they over-step, they're afraid you'll kick their a$$."

I asked, "What about Black women? I know plenty of Black women that will check ANYONE'S bull$shit."

To that he responded, "Yeah, but in the end, a Black woman is a woman; so we still want to f@#% them!"

I was completely speechless ... Well I had plenty of speech left, but none that could be expressed and me keep my job ... So I just left it with, "You know we're gonna have to revisit this when neither of us have been drinking ... whether it's at the jobsite or not is completely up to you."

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #9)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 07:43 PM

10. Yuck

To that he responded, "Yeah, but in the end, a Black woman is a woman; so we still want to f@#% them!"


As if a sister would probably give this fool the time of day...

Yuck.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #9)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 09:18 AM

16. sad, but true

white men fear black men, for the most. and think they can get at black women...laughable, for the most, but i am sure there are women who would go there for some perceived reward. not this sister, mind you. but i do know sisters who are more than willing to f there way into a job or promotion to survive.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #7)

Sat Mar 24, 2012, 09:03 PM

12. oh sis, do not get me started about THAT

the infamous "fetching" comment was made by a white woman. i really cannot even go there right now because my legal issue is finally being investigated by the EEOC, and it is ALL about that. yeah...is it any wonder that we are pissed off? i tried to put on my best mask, but there is only so much i am willing to deal with, especially considering the shit i have already been through. well meaning white friends always try to say: "that guy/woman is just an asshole," but after you've experienced it for the umpteenth time, you realize it is not about individuals...it is about a system, and a mindset that perpetuates the system. i am always supposed to be grateful in this system/mindset, but never an equal or a colleague, and never too competent as to disturb the perceived superiority of others. and white women are the worst...you are right about that. white men are either openly hostile or supportive. asian men, in my experience at least, seem to feel threatened by black women, and feel the need to put me in my designated place. black men...well i've only worked for one black man, and he is gay, so he was (mostly) supportive. my last supervisor was a white female who i am still friends with today. she totally supported me, as a worker and a person, and she respected me as a person and a competent accountant. and she got fucked over by the white women in charge too...i think she was perceived as a "n" lover. we have to voice this stuff and refuse to "go along" with it. it is a poison that is impeding our growth as individuals, and as a nation.

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Response to noiretextatique (Reply #12)

Sat Mar 24, 2012, 09:51 PM

13. "finally being investigated by the EEOC" GO, girl!!

How is it going so far? What do you think will be the end result?

I wish I'd had the guts to go to the EEOC with some of my stuff in my prior life. I remember one case where my (blonde, white female) boss sent me e-mails telling me how fabulous I was while she was behind my back going to HR every chance she got complaining about me and trying to get me fired. Because of her craven ineptness and stupidity, HR eventually created some kind of measure that you could not fire an employee without having DOCUMENTED PROOF that you had spoken to them about any deficiencies they may have and trying to rectify them. How effed up that something this basic and grade-school worthy has to be made into company policy because of how immature/unprofessional/obviously unsuited to be managing anybody you are?

I wanted to go to the EEOC over this but my mother talked me out of it at the time. To this day, I wish I had and this was damn near 10 years ago. You get even more props from me for seeing this through with the EEOC. Do you think you'll be able to get some justice?

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Response to Number23 (Reply #13)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 08:57 AM

15. i understand why your mom told you not to do it

it took over a year for the EEOC to assign an investigator to the case...it's been over two years since i was fired. it has been a long process, and i am not sure the reward can make up for that. however, in this economy, i felt i had no choice because: i still haven't found a job. honestly, if i could have moved on, i probably would have, just to be done with it. but i really feel i did not have a choice, i need to be compensated, not only for what actually happened, but also what has not happened since their illegal action. if they had given me severance, i might have passed on the lawsuit. but they tossed me into the street without any regard for the GREAT work i did there. that's the fng rub. it pisses me off to no end that incompetents are still working there while i was fired for reasons other than competence.

i am not sure what is going to happen. the investigator needs to talk to witnesses in order to prove my claim, and i could only get two to cooperate. i think my retaliation claim is solid, but the discrimination case is shakier. i don't think i will get what i deserve, but i will recoup something. however, i am very happy i brought the feds into their little plantation. nothing like shining the light on roaches and watching them scurry

as for your situation...if it was meant to happen, it would have. and if it happens again, by all means do it.

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Response to noiretextatique (Reply #15)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 06:36 PM

18. I absolutely agree.

but i really feel i did not have a choice, i need to be compensated, not only for what actually happened, but also what has not happened since their illegal action.


That is the absolute, very LEAST of what you deserve. Wrongful termination, racial discrimination, harassment. I think all of these are very apt descriptions of what you've endured. Even if you had done shitty work and were a horrible person, people should not be allowed to deprive others of their livelihoods on a f*cking WHIM. Reputable work places have legitimate procedures for terminating someone for a reason and from what you've described, there wasn't a damn thing "legitimate" about what happened to you.

i don't think i will get what i deserve, but i will recoup something. however, i am very happy i brought the feds into their little plantation.


No doubt that has to be seriously satisfying. But it infuriates me that you've already prepared yourself to not get what you deserve and it's probably because that's EXACTLY what's going to happen. If my good wishes and thoughts have anything to do with it, you'll get everything you're fighting for.

But your experience is exactly why my mother talked me out of it. She's a black woman and a lawyer, so she knew not only would I not get sh*t, but it would be the most grueling, painful experience of my life and those assholes would probably go back to my kindergarten transcripts to find some dirt on me. Even though she was convinced I'd been mistreated and that I had a case, she figured it was not going to be worth the time, effort and money. She was probably right. But like I said, to this day I honestly regret not having done something if for no other reason than to "shine the light on the roaches" as you said.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #18)

Mon Mar 26, 2012, 02:40 AM

19. if i had known it would take this long, i would have opted for the right to sue vs. the EEOC

investigation. if you are ever in a predicament again, i would suggest you go for the right to sue route. my supervisor did that, and her case was settled last year. i might get more compensation via the EEOC, but the time it took to get the investigation started was way too long. i am totally discouraged, and i know that's exactly what they hoped for...well, they got it. still, siccing the feds on them gives me some satisfaction knowing they are scrambling to hide facts and try to bullshit their way out of this gives me some comfort.
i can bank on one thing: their hubris. they truly believe they are above the law and can do whatever the choose. the investigator told me they were not providing the information she requested in a timely manner. if they keep that up, i may win by default. please keep your good wishes and thoughts coming for me...i need it. my former supervisor told me that the judge in her case was so turned off by their attitude that they actually helped her case. hopefully they will continue to be assholes in my case.

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Response to noiretextatique (Reply #15)

Mon Mar 26, 2012, 10:52 PM

22. The retaliation case ...

Is always easier to prove than the underlying case unless you have a written document, a tape recording, or 8x10 glossies.

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Response to noiretextatique (Reply #4)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 07:07 PM

8. Let me guess ...

Your first name is Rebecca, Becky, for short.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #8)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 08:44 AM

14. nope

Karen. and my last name is not Jackson, Washington, Jefferson, or Johnson. and apparently, i do not "sound black" on the phone whatever that means.

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Response to noiretextatique (Reply #14)

Mon Mar 26, 2012, 10:23 AM

21. I think I posted on the old DU

the story about how "Washington" is now the 'blackest' name in the USA (89 percent)...I especially liked the part about a white Washington recounting how a few times he got turned down for loans and how housing vacancies were mysteriously sold when he called...

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Response to noiretextatique (Reply #4)

Mon Mar 26, 2012, 10:18 AM

20. good points...

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Response to Number23 (Original post)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 07:04 PM

6. I whole-heartedly agree ...

But to this part:

400 years of history, brutality and oppression are not easily overcome.


I would only add:

And the daily indignities that we are subjected to do nothing to advance the "post-racial" cannard; rather, they serve as daily reminders.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #6)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 09:39 AM

17. elevators and grocery stores

seem to bring out the worst in people. i have been accosted in elevators my entire adult life. i worked at a company for several years, when some random person asked me why i was on the premises...he happened to be a white man. while in the elevator, he asked me why i was in the building, and asked if he could help me. i told him this: unless you can do my job, you cannot help me. in the grocery store, older white people will never concede to you. old habits die hard...or not at all, until people die.

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Response to noiretextatique (Reply #17)

Mon Mar 26, 2012, 11:00 PM

23. You got that right ...

I can't count the number of times I've been confronted on elevators by the "helpful" new white guy that assumed I didn't belong ... even though I was more senior, in the company and in position, than the "helpful one." It's always funny to watch these "helpful ones" kowtow to my subordinates; but challenge me; until, of course, my subordinate introduces me as their boss ... and his boss, too.

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Response to Number23 (Original post)

Wed Apr 4, 2012, 02:43 PM

24. SAD

What I have found that is truly amazing is that of the numerous countries I have lived, my very own country is the only one that looks down on me, SMH. Traditions die hard I guess.

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Response to Mr Dixon (Reply #24)

Thu Apr 5, 2012, 09:16 PM

25. Good point, Mr. Dixon

my very own country is the only one that looks down on me, SMH.


Lots of black folks don't even feel qualified to call ourselves "Americans" until we venture somewhere else and realize that's what the rest of the world sees us as.

In the States, you're a black guy or gal. In many other places, you are an American first.

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