And still the right wingers in Congress refuse to act

[zebonaut]

Caution: Extremely Disturbing and Graphic

But there will be serious hearings on Hillary's email server......

The gun industry apologist with blood on his hands

[Plucketeer]

1. NRA promotional clip

"See! A GOOD GUY with a gun could have averted this tragic incident. Visit your local gun shop today!"

[Fred Sanders]

11. "Media must now also arm themselves...because the solution to all those guns is....more GUNS!"

[Archae]

2. SOB absolutely HAD to be "famous..."

Even filming himself shooting the unarmed and unaware victims.

Then he shoots himself.

[Journeyman]

3. No one in government did anything -- anything -- after Sandy Hook . . .

No one.

Time to break free of our illusions and recognize realities.

No one did anything. And nothing will be done.

[hibbing]

4. agree

I have no illusions that something will be done, it is sad.

Peace

[Old Crow]

5. There is no other nation on Earth permitting this kind of insanity.

I don't even know what to say.

[WhoIsNumberNone]

6. The most chilling part is nobody noticed him waving the gun around before he started shooting.

[Old Crow]

7. I suspect the reason why...

... is that everyone you see before the shooting is caught up in tunnel vision. The reporter and interviewee are on camera and looking at each other. Looking to the side could ruin the shot, so you're not going to do it, even if you see someone moving around in your peripheral vision; the videographer, for his part, has his attention focused on the viewfinder. During that live shoot, all of them essentially had blinders on.

On edit: You're probably already aware of everything I wrote above; my apologies for explaining what probably didn't need explaining. And yes, it is chilling to see a gun so plainly displayed while the soon-to-be-victims are completely unaware of what's about to happen.

[Fred Sanders]

10. Blinders to what? Living a life not trembling in fear and watching out at all times for gunman? Your post makes

no sense.

[Old Crow]

13. Not sure what you're misunderstanding.

What I'm saying is that the reason the reporter, interviewee, and videographer did not notice the handgun that was being pointed right at the reporter for several long seconds prior to the shooting is because they were all preoccupied with doing the interview.

Make sense now?

[Fred Sanders]

14. Maybe the sun was in their eyes....what point are you trying to make? I see nothing.

[WhoIsNumberNone]

17. Try reading it again

If you've ever done this kind of work, you would know that you are completely focused on what you're doing when you're getting a shot- you're not alert for nutjobs with guns- hence the blinders.

It's also clear that the gunman is outside the cameraman's field of vision. The reporter and the interviewee are both focused on each other. Plus, news people are so used to assholes waving their dicks off camera that they just tune it out. Nobody is faulting them for not noticing the whack job with the gun sneaking up on them.

[Fred Sanders]

19. And if they had noticed, what difference would it have made...against a GUN?

The entire observation is , I repeat, pointless.

[WhoIsNumberNone]

23. I didn't suggest that it would have made a difference

Although, since you asked, perhaps at least one of them could have gotten away had they been aware of him before the shooting started. But once again that was never the point.

[Fred Sanders]

31. To fully confess, I have not seen a second of the video...murder voyerism is not my thing.

[Dr Rise]

26. I'm glad you explained it.

That's it exactly! Don't know if I would have thought of it sooner or later.

[WhoIsNumberNone]

32. There's new information out about this

The shooter was a disgruntled employee of the station- Another reporter from the looks of things. If anyone would know that they would have been too engaged to notice him sneaking up at that moment, it would have been him.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/virginia-shooting-suspect-vester-lee-flanagan-kills-himself-after-videos-posted-online-10473264.html

[Old Crow]

34. Interesting. I had no idea the shooter had been a reporter.

Incidentally, going back to the earlier discussion: One reason I thought it was worth discussing why the reporter, interviewee, and videographer didn't see the gun is because of comments I was seeing on YouTube. More than one person over there were claiming that the video was "obviously fake" anti-gun propaganda because, they argued, no one could have missed the gun when it was pointing right at the reporter.

I don't know if people are still claiming that; frankly, I'm not even sure I want to look. Crazy, I know. Incredibly, there are still people online claiming the massacre at Sandy Hook was staged.

[Fred Sanders]

12. No idea what you mean by "chilling"....who is always on the lookout for danger???? A gun is so

easily hideable because it is so small...death in a small package.

[Old Crow]

15. Fred, I'd suggest you re-watch the first five seconds of the video.

That might help you understand some of the comments better.

[Fred Sanders]

16. Nope. Still have no idea why you consider that relevant to anything??? The GUN is what is relevant.

[WhoIsNumberNone]

18. Yes, the gun is indeed what is relevant.

And I never faulted anyone for not noticing him there. I merely commented that it's chilling to watch that asshole quietly taunting them before he kills them. They have no idea they're going to be dead in a few seconds. You don't find that chilling?

[Fred Sanders]

21. I find that anyone and everyone having such easy access to guns to be the only chilling part....terror and the gun are as one.

I am very chilled, do not get me wrong, but not at that.

[Old Crow]

22. Fred?

Two of us made the observation that it's chilling to see the handgun openly displayed just a few feet away from the soon-to-be victims. For whatever reason, that observation seems to have offended you.

I think we all understand that handguns are easily concealed. And I think everyone in this thread agrees their easy accessibility in this country is madness.

I don't understand why you seem to be looking for an argument. I'm not interested in arguing. Have a nice day.

[ish of the hammer]

27. yes, the GUN is relevant.

The comment is about why the victims did not SEE the gun. Merely a comment. There are soooo many hair splitters on these threads.

[geretogo]

8. America really is an armed mad house and the inmates are in charge .

[Fred Sanders]

9. How many more wake up calls will it take to actually wake up...a media person tragically now being in

the crosshairs of two of 30000 gun deaths a year just might do it.

[deathrind]

20. How very sad and tragic...

The entire vid is shocking but the first few seconds are.... just wow. I understand how the camera man did not see the firearm but how the other two did not notice is unbelievable.


RIP to the the two who died and prayers for the 3rd person fighting for survival.

[Dr Rise]

24. My mouth is open ............

that's some cold shit.

[BainsBane]

25. Not just the right wingers

Look at the records of the candidates for the Democratic nomination. Two are strong on gun control: O'Malley and Clinton. The rest are not.

[Stevepol]

28. I think Bernie is quite strong on gun control.

The only times he's "sided with the NRA" if you want to call it that is to allow the sale and use of (some kinds of) guns for hunting or target shooting. He's against any kind of gun entirely for shooting people (AK 47s e.g.) and he voted against a law that would have made the gun manufacturer liable if a gun manufactured by his company is used in a crime. I think I would agree with both those positions. Does anybody really want to restrict farmers and rural folks from having guns for hunting and protection in rural areas? And would there need to be a law to make the owner of a lumber yard liable if somebody beats someone to death with a 2 x 4 bought at the lumber yard? Plus, he's for ending the gun show loophole and for complete background checks and I would imagine almost any other regulation or law to reduce gun crime in the large cities.

[BainsBane]

29. That is not a strong gun control position

and that people here have contorted their own views to accommodate him, rather than pressuring him to change, is particularly offensive. Your spin on that law is inaccurate and reflects how the gun lobby has falsely portrayed it. There would be no need for special immunity for what you describe. The law has been used to protect gun makers from any and all liability, and Bernie knows that.

If you believe the unfettered profits of corporations trump the rights of families to seek redress for gun makers knowingly putting guns in the hands of illegal gun traffickers, so be it, but don't tell me that is a strong gun control position. It is anti gun control, as is voting against the Brady bill. You overlooked that particular vote.

The OP references handguns. Your point about farmers' rifles is unrelated, unless of course the point is to make excuses for someone whose position on gun control reflects the concerns of Vermonters rather than Americans more broadly. The percentage of people living on farms and in rural areas is quite small.

Here we have a prime example of people who are not right-wingers standing in the way of gun control. We have killings like this because far too many people make excuses, repeat gun lobby arguments, and prioritize most everything over the lives of the people killed.

The many posts like yours I've seen, combined with the hostility to Black Lives Matter expressed by some of his supporters, is the main reason I oppose his candidacy. I have seen a disturbing turn to the right on those issues. Of course, you could simply disagree with him on that particular point, as supporters of other candidates do on a range of issues, yet for some reason people feel compelled to rearrange their views to conform to his. That is exactly what I meant when I said not just right wingers.

[Fred Sanders]

30. What Clinton said today is a strong position of gun control...which must be a front burner issue for

all the Democratic Party candidates....front and centre.

It is just sad that some even at DU are misrepresenting the special NRA pushed carve out for the precious gun of the gun factories.

#MeltTheGuns

That is a stronger position.

[Old Crow]

35. Do you know of a web page that provides detailed info on the candidate's positions on gun control?

Last edited Wed Aug 26, 2015, 07:59 PM - Edit history (1)

That would be helpful. I'm finding bits of info here and there, but nothing comprehensive. A comparative table would be awesome.

On edit: The best web page I've found so far is the one below.

http://www.ontheissues.org/Gun_Control.htm

[WhoIsNumberNone]

33. NEW INFORMATION ON THIS VIDEO

The shooter committed suicide after posting this video on Facebook and Twitter.

He's been identified as another employee of the station- and another reporter from the looks of things- Described by co-workers as a very sad man. With these revelations, there's no doubt in my mind that this was nothing random and that Alison Parker was the target of the shooting. I won't be surprised if they find a diary in which it will be revealed that he had more than a little crush on her, and wasn't dealing with her engagement very well.

He probably seemed OK at the time to the person who sold him the gun.

[zebonaut]

36. Why not an Immediate Emergency Freeze on all new gun sales

until there is a system of safety checks in place

Obama has nothing to lose....