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iscooterliberally

(2,860 posts)
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 11:55 AM Aug 2014

Feds allow sonic cannons on Florida's East Coast to search for oil

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by DonViejo (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Tampa Bay Times

ST. AUGUSTINE BEACH — Opening the Eastern Seaboard to offshore oil exploration for the first time in decades, the Obama administration on Friday approved the use of sonic cannons to discover deposits under the ocean floor by shooting sound waves 100 times louder than a jet engine through waters shared by endangered whales and turtles.

The U.S. Bureau of Ocean Energy Management's approval of this technology's use off the U.S. East Coast is the first step toward identifying new oil and gas deposits in federal waters from Florida to Delaware. Energy companies need this detailed information as they prepare to apply for drilling leases in 2018 if the government reopens the area, as expected.

"The bureau has identified a path forward that addresses the need to update the nearly four-decade-old data in the region while protecting marine life and cultural sites," acting BOEM Director Walter Cruickshank said in a statement. "The bureau's decision reflects a carefully analyzed and balanced approach that will allow us to increase our understanding of potential offshore resources while protecting the human, marine, and coastal environments."

Read more: http://www.tampabay.com/news/environment/feds-allow-sonic-cannons-on-floridas-east-coast-to-search-for-oil/2189029



How could this be a good idea? In what world? Gee we already ruined the Gulf of Mexico. Let's kill the eastern seaboard too.
36 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Feds allow sonic cannons on Florida's East Coast to search for oil (Original Post) iscooterliberally Aug 2014 OP
proving once again our fed agencies are owned by the 1% and Big Oil in this case wordpix Aug 2014 #1
Obama is doing what he agreed to do in order to get the financial support to become and stay Dustlawyer Aug 2014 #16
I'm surprised that we don't understand that your post is the answer to every question of motivation BrotherIvan Aug 2014 #18
He's pissing off the whole state of FL. lark Aug 2014 #21
Marine life at risk, and possible earthquakes as well. RoccoR5955 Aug 2014 #2
people like the Kochs think they're immune even tho one of the bros has cancer wordpix Aug 2014 #6
Disgusting for this to be done by a Democrat Autumn Aug 2014 #3
totally agree, O needs to reverse himself and clean out this agency wordpix Aug 2014 #7
BP was controlling the Coast Guard during the huge spill in the Gulf iscooterliberally Aug 2014 #9
You mean "Democrat." blkmusclmachine Aug 2014 #27
Despicable. nt Mnemosyne Aug 2014 #4
The word: absured... Plucketeer Aug 2014 #5
Hooray for the All-of-the-Above Energy Strategy! progressoid Aug 2014 #8
Shameful! logosoco Aug 2014 #10
The Oil Cos own the place. And the Prez. blkmusclmachine Aug 2014 #28
Gonna piss off the sand worms. AtheistCrusader Aug 2014 #11
my multi-petition signing was spit in a bucket Duppers Aug 2014 #12
Just in time for Fall whale migration on Florida's Atlantic Coast... JCMach1 Aug 2014 #13
Mother Nature will have the last word cp Aug 2014 #14
So we use sonic cannons to look for oil in the ocean,... KansDem Aug 2014 #15
We also use sonic and military cannons to disperse protesters. iscooterliberally Aug 2014 #19
So, we use sonic and military cannons to find oil... KansDem Aug 2014 #25
Sonic Cannons would make a good name for a rock band. tclambert Aug 2014 #17
Hotblack Desiato would have to be the frontman if he could get time off from Disaster Area. n/t xocet Aug 2014 #33
step by step we are destroying ourselves oldandhappy Aug 2014 #20
I think that's the PLAN blkmusclmachine Aug 2014 #29
Not we, the 1% Dont call me Shirley Aug 2014 #34
yes!! oldandhappy Aug 2014 #35
Torturing defenseless sea life Dems to Win Aug 2014 #22
Sea life is not in the 1%, just like we aren't. harun Aug 2014 #23
Fuck you, whales. MrScorpio Aug 2014 #24
Obama: "Drill, baby, drill!" blkmusclmachine Aug 2014 #26
But offshore wind turbines are evil. nt valerief Aug 2014 #30
BOOOM! Helen Borg Aug 2014 #31
BOEM is under the Department of the Interior.... xocet Aug 2014 #32
Locked... DonViejo Aug 2014 #36

wordpix

(18,652 posts)
1. proving once again our fed agencies are owned by the 1% and Big Oil in this case
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 11:59 AM
Aug 2014

How is this good for marine life? Obama, you are pissing off your base

Dustlawyer

(10,495 posts)
16. Obama is doing what he agreed to do in order to get the financial support to become and stay
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:22 PM
Aug 2014

POTUS. This is what most Democrats and all Republicans do, they answer to their real base, and it is not us.
Until we get rid of Campaign Contributions and hold Federal, State, and Local, Publicly Funded Elections we will continue to get screwed and so will our environment. Bernie has made this a big part of his campaign and we need to show by numbers that it would be a great idea for the politicians to agree with him on this. The money men will fight like hell to keep control of the most powerful nation in the world even while making it weaker and weaker internally.

BrotherIvan

(9,126 posts)
18. I'm surprised that we don't understand that your post is the answer to every question of motivation
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:28 PM
Aug 2014

From every politician except for someone like Bernie Sanders. The "he has a good heart, but his hands are tied" argument is meaningless. His hands aren't tied, they're shackled by his sponsors. A politician only "evolves" on an issue when their employers give the green light.

lark

(23,097 posts)
21. He's pissing off the whole state of FL.
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:42 PM
Aug 2014

Eeen the drill baby drill folks, like my mom & my father when he was alive, don't want our lovely beaches ruined, they want drilling anywhere else.

Sure pisses off this Floridian!

 

RoccoR5955

(12,471 posts)
2. Marine life at risk, and possible earthquakes as well.
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:03 PM
Aug 2014

Sheesh, I wonder how they will manage when there is no more water to drink, nor air to breathe?

wordpix

(18,652 posts)
6. people like the Kochs think they're immune even tho one of the bros has cancer
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:08 PM
Aug 2014

Autumn

(45,066 posts)
3. Disgusting for this to be done by a Democrat
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:04 PM
Aug 2014

wordpix

(18,652 posts)
7. totally agree, O needs to reverse himself and clean out this agency
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:09 PM
Aug 2014

which apparently is still run by the oil corps even after the BP disaster

iscooterliberally

(2,860 posts)
9. BP was controlling the Coast Guard during the huge spill in the Gulf
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:17 PM
Aug 2014

The oil companies own our government. The coast guard was spraying that corexit crap in the gulf according to a report by Vice on HBO. Our politicians represent the big piles of money it takes to get elected rather than the people who vote for them.

 

blkmusclmachine

(16,149 posts)
27. You mean "Democrat."
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 02:28 PM
Aug 2014

Mnemosyne

(21,363 posts)
4. Despicable. nt
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:05 PM
Aug 2014
 

Plucketeer

(12,882 posts)
5. The word: absured...
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:06 PM
Aug 2014

just lost it's edge.

progressoid

(49,988 posts)
8. Hooray for the All-of-the-Above Energy Strategy!
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:10 PM
Aug 2014

logosoco

(3,208 posts)
10. Shameful!
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:34 PM
Aug 2014

Especially when we see what European countries are doing with solar power. We are moving backwards and our government is over run by the oil companies.

 

blkmusclmachine

(16,149 posts)
28. The Oil Cos own the place. And the Prez.
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 02:29 PM
Aug 2014

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
11. Gonna piss off the sand worms.
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:38 PM
Aug 2014


(Someone's gotta inject some gallows humor here)

Duppers

(28,120 posts)
12. my multi-petition signing was spit in a bucket
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 12:44 PM
Aug 2014

I grieve.

JCMach1

(27,556 posts)
13. Just in time for Fall whale migration on Florida's Atlantic Coast...
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:05 PM
Aug 2014

cp

(6,626 posts)
14. Mother Nature will have the last word
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:12 PM
Aug 2014

and human beings will not fare well.

KansDem

(28,498 posts)
15. So we use sonic cannons to look for oil in the ocean,...
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:17 PM
Aug 2014

...and military cannons to look for oil in the MidEast.

Do I have that right?

iscooterliberally

(2,860 posts)
19. We also use sonic and military cannons to disperse protesters.
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:29 PM
Aug 2014

KansDem

(28,498 posts)
25. So, we use sonic and military cannons to find oil...
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 02:08 PM
Aug 2014

...and sonic and military cannons to lose protesters.

Got it!

tclambert

(11,085 posts)
17. Sonic Cannons would make a good name for a rock band.
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:24 PM
Aug 2014

xocet

(3,871 posts)
33. Hotblack Desiato would have to be the frontman if he could get time off from Disaster Area. n/t
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 03:19 PM
Aug 2014

oldandhappy

(6,719 posts)
20. step by step we are destroying ourselves
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:30 PM
Aug 2014
 

blkmusclmachine

(16,149 posts)
29. I think that's the PLAN
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 02:30 PM
Aug 2014

Dont call me Shirley

(10,998 posts)
34. Not we, the 1%
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 03:37 PM
Aug 2014

oldandhappy

(6,719 posts)
35. yes!!
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 04:49 PM
Aug 2014
 

Dems to Win

(2,161 posts)
22. Torturing defenseless sea life
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:49 PM
Aug 2014

It's not enough that humans are destroying the oceans and rushing toward our own extinction, we have to torture defenseless sea creatures on our path to destruction.

Disgusting, infuriating decision by Obama.

harun

(11,348 posts)
23. Sea life is not in the 1%, just like we aren't.
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 01:55 PM
Aug 2014

MrScorpio

(73,631 posts)
24. Fuck you, whales.
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 02:03 PM
Aug 2014

Signed, Big Oil.

 

blkmusclmachine

(16,149 posts)
26. Obama: "Drill, baby, drill!"
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 02:27 PM
Aug 2014

valerief

(53,235 posts)
30. But offshore wind turbines are evil. nt
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 02:51 PM
Aug 2014

Helen Borg

(3,963 posts)
31. BOOOM!
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 02:54 PM
Aug 2014

xocet

(3,871 posts)
32. BOEM is under the Department of the Interior....
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 03:14 PM
Aug 2014

This process does not appear to be a good idea especially when the USA should be shifting towards forms of renewable energy.

The news article does not directly specify any of the research that has been done to try to justify the use of "sound cannons".

Here is some background information on what departments are involved and which people have leading roles in those departments. More importantly, though, are the links at the end that allow one to see some of the research has been done to attempt to characterize the effects of sound in a marine environment.

I have not had time to read over this material, but at first glance it does not seem to indicate that a crew of "Heck-of-a-Job-Brownies" are running the show:

Department of the Interior
1849 C Street, N.W.
Washington DC 20240

People and Bureaus:
Employee Directory - available by phone (202) 208-3100
National Park Service
U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service
Bureau of Indian Affairs
Bureau of Land Management
Office of Surface Mining
U.S. Geological Survey
Bureau of Reclamation
Bureau of Ocean Energy Management
Bureau of Safety and Environmental Enforcement


Bureau of Ocean Energy Management Personnel

Walter Cruickshank, Ph.D., Acting Director
Walter Cruickshank, Ph.D. As Acting Director of BOEM, Dr. Cruickshank manages the development of the Nation’s offshore resources in an environmentally and economically responsible way. These programs include leasing, plan administration, environmental studies, National Environmental Policy Act analysis, resource evaluation, economic analysis and the Renewable Energy Program. Prior to becoming the Deputy Director of BOEM upon its establishment in October 2011, Dr. Cruickshank served as Deputy Director of the Bureau of Ocean Energy Management, Regulation and Enforcement (BOEMRE) and the former MMS since 2002. Dr. Cruickshank has worked in the Department of the Interior for more than 25 years. He earned a Bachelor of Arts in Geological Sciences from Cornell University and a Doctorate in Mineral Economics from the Pennsylvania State University.

http://www.boem.gov/Acting-Director/

...

Chief Environmental Officer William Yancey Brown
William Yancey Brown served as the Science Advisor to the Secretary of the Interior, Bruce Babbitt, from 1997 to 2001 and worked for the Interior Department earlier in his career. He is a former President and CEO of the Woods Hole Research Center, a leading non-profit research organization that applies science to global environmental challenges. Brown is a former President and CEO of the Academy of Natural Sciences in Philadelphia, PA, the nation's oldest natural history museum, and former President and CEO of the Bishop Museum, the leading cultural and natural history museum of the Pacific. He has served as a volunteer director on many non-profit boards, including chairing the Ocean Conservancy Board. Dr. Brown earned the degrees of Juris Doctor from Harvard Law School in 1977, Doctor of Philosophy in zoology from the University of Hawaii in 1973, Master of Arts in teaching from Johns Hopkins University in 1970, and Bachelor of Arts in biology from the University of Virginia in 1969.

...

Division of Environmental Sciences Chief Dr. Rodney E. Cluck
Dr. Rodney Cluck holds a Ph.D. in environmental sociology from Mississippi State University and a Masters Degree in Rural Sociology from the University of Arkansas, Fayetteville. For 6 years, beginning in 1999, Dr. Cluck served as the senior Bureau social scientist where he developed and oversaw scientific studies and conducted National Environmental Policy Act analysis. In 2005, Dr. Cluck joined the Office of Alternative Energy Programs and became the project manager for the United States’ first offshore wind facility. Dr. Cluck is currently the Chief of the Division of Environmental Sciences where he leads the Environmental Studies Program, the scientific backbone that informs policy decisions regarding leasing and development of ocean energy.

...

http://www.boem.gov/Leadership/


Some research has been done regarding sound and cetaceans:



Background

In a January 19, 2010 letter to the President’s Council on Environmental Quality, NOAA Administrator Dr. Jane Lubchenco committed to improving the tools used by the agency to evaluate the impacts of human-induced noise on cetacean species. As a result, two data and product-driven working groups were convened in January 2011: the Underwater Sound-field Mapping Working Group and the Cetacean Density and Distribution Mapping Working Group. In May 2012, the working groups presented their products at a Symposium where potential management applications were discussed with a large multi-stakeholder audience.

Underwater Sound Field Mapping Working Group
The specific objective of the NOAA Underwater Sound Field Mapping Working Group (SoundMap) is to create mapping methods to depict the temporal, spatial, and spectral characteristics of underwater noise.

Cetacean Density and Distribution Mapping Working Group
The specific objective of the Cetacean Density and Distribution Mapping Group (CetMap) is to create regional cetacean density and distribution maps that are time- and species-specific, using survey data and models that estimate density using predictive environmental factors. Separately, to augment the more quantitative density mapping and provide additional context for impact analyses, the CetMap is also identifying known areas of specific importance for cetaceans, such as reproductive areas, feeding areas, migratory corridors, and areas in which small or resident populations are concentrated.

Integrative Symposium
On May 23rd and 24th at the Four Points Sheraton in Washington DC, the near-final draft CetMap and SoundMap products were presented to an audience of ~170 people that included participants from government agencies, regulated industries, independent scientists, environmental consultancies and conservation advocacy groups.

...

http://cetsound.noaa.gov/index.html


The symposium's final report is also posted:


MAPPING CETACEANS AND SOUND: MODERN TOOLS FOR OCEAN MANAGEMENT SYMPOSIUM FINAL REPORT

May 23rd and 24th, 2012
Four Points Sheraton,
1201 K Street NW
Washington, DC.


...

4

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
Sound is the most effective means for marine species to communicate and sense their environment underwater and is critical to multiple life functions for all marine vertebrates and even some invertebrates. With increased understanding of how anthropogenic noise can limit the ability of marine species to hear and communicate, the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA), charged with managing the impacts of noise on marine life, has recognized the need to undergo a fundamental shift towards a more integrated and comprehensive strategy for measuring, managing, and reducing chronic noise impacts.

In a January 19, 2010 letter to the President’s Council on Environmental Quality, NOAA Administrator Jane Lubchenco committed to improving the tools used by the agency to evaluate the impacts of human-induced noise on cetacean species. As a result, two data and product-driven working groups were convened in January 2011: the Underwater Sound-field MappingWorking Group (SoundMap) and the Cetacean Density and Distribution Mapping Working Group (CetMap). The overarching effort of both Working Groups is referred to as CetSound.

...

http://cetsound.noaa.gov/pdf/CetSound_Symposium_Report_Final.pdf


Many, many questions could be asked. What spectrum of frequencies are being used to conduct the studies? Can one use frequencies that are not audible to cetaceans, etc.? One wonders how sound intensity behaves versus depth, temperature, salinity, direction, etc. Do concentrations of high salinity form channels and could one create a soliton in such channels? Does total internal reflection exist if such channels exist? If such effects could exist in these circumstances, what sound levels would be carried? How could any of this affect marine creatures?

At this point, I neither know if these questions would be valid questions nor if they (if valid) have been addressed, but would be interested if anyone else knows of links to information that relates to them.

DonViejo

(60,536 posts)
36. Locked...
Thu Aug 28, 2014, 05:58 PM
Aug 2014

This article is over a month old. Published Friday, July 18, 2014 11:31am. The LBN Forum SOP requires articles be no older than 12 hours

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