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Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:05 PM

Feds Investigating Felonious Gun Nut

Source: Addicting Info

How does a person convicted of manslaughter obtain 18 assault weapons and other firearms, along with 40,000 rounds of ammunition? Well, according to NBC News, a White Supremacist from Ohio who also happens to be a convicted felon did just that.

The arsenal was discovered during a completely separate arrest of 47-year old Richard Schmidt, who owns a sporting goods store called Spindletop Sports Zone where he was selling counterfeit jerseys and other sports goods from China. Initially, it was simply a check up on a thriving counterfeit goods market, but then search warrants were unveiled and Schmidt was indicted on charges of illegal possession of firearms.

Even more disturbing is what the search warrants unveiled, which was four trailers out back with automatic and semi-automatic weapons, bullet-proof body armor, high capacity magazines, and ammunition. Further, evidence of ties to the Neo-Nazi movement was discovered, as well as a “Jewish 500″ list, which is supposedly a roster of Jewish-owned businesses. Further, there was paraphernalia from “Waffen SS,” Adolph Hitler’s Nazi military force through World War II.

I could go on, but I think you get the picture. This, ladies and gentlemen, is why we need gun control. This guy is a nut not only for guns, but for Nazi ideology to boot. According to the report, he was possibly planning attacks against Jewish people and civil rights groups in the area. If he hadn’t been arrested for selling counterfeit sports goods, who knows how far this would have gone?

Read more: http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/01/19/feds-investigating-felonious-gun-nut/

121 replies, 10199 views

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Arrow 121 replies Author Time Post
Reply Feds Investigating Felonious Gun Nut (Original post)
Galraedia Jan 2013 OP
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #1
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #9
pnwmom Jan 2013 #10
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #11
pnwmom Jan 2013 #13
Aristus Jan 2013 #67
RC Jan 2013 #47
hack89 Jan 2013 #86
RC Jan 2013 #88
hack89 Jan 2013 #89
RC Jan 2013 #90
hack89 Jan 2013 #93
RantinRavin Jan 2013 #12
pnwmom Jan 2013 #14
RantinRavin Jan 2013 #15
pnwmom Jan 2013 #44
primavera Jan 2013 #54
krhines Jan 2013 #117
mr.ed Jan 2013 #74
paleotn Jan 2013 #80
A Simple Game Jan 2013 #83
Mojorabbit Jan 2013 #94
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #18
awoke_in_2003 Jan 2013 #42
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #103
bettyellen Jan 2013 #55
Kolesar Jan 2013 #82
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #104
Kolesar Jan 2013 #105
awoke_in_2003 Jan 2013 #108
mbperrin Jan 2013 #19
AllyCat Jan 2013 #63
jeff47 Jan 2013 #106
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #16
mbperrin Jan 2013 #20
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #22
mbperrin Jan 2013 #24
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #27
AlbertCat Jan 2013 #32
Comrade_McKenzie Jan 2013 #25
donnasgirl Jan 2013 #28
Proletariatprincess Jan 2013 #61
JI7 Jan 2013 #69
Proletariatprincess Jan 2013 #62
oldbanjo Jan 2013 #78
xtraxritical Jan 2013 #41
Tom Ripley Jan 2013 #66
another_liberal Jan 2013 #72
xtraxritical Jan 2013 #85
oldbanjo Jan 2013 #77
truebluegreen Jan 2013 #79
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #29
madokie Jan 2013 #73
oldbanjo Jan 2013 #75
Prog_gun_owner Jan 2013 #64
Demo_Chris Jan 2013 #81
shenmue Jan 2013 #2
another_liberal Jan 2013 #7
BumRushDaShow Jan 2013 #3
Duckhunter935 Jan 2013 #4
SunSeeker Jan 2013 #17
Duckhunter935 Jan 2013 #30
SunSeeker Jan 2013 #34
Duckhunter935 Jan 2013 #102
freshwest Jan 2013 #5
Jenoch Jan 2013 #36
freshwest Jan 2013 #39
Jenoch Jan 2013 #45
freshwest Jan 2013 #48
another_liberal Jan 2013 #6
Jenoch Jan 2013 #37
another_liberal Jan 2013 #43
Jenoch Jan 2013 #49
another_liberal Jan 2013 #50
NickB79 Jan 2013 #59
naaman fletcher Jan 2013 #96
Duckhunter935 Jan 2013 #60
Prog_gun_owner Jan 2013 #68
Jenoch Jan 2013 #109
atreides1 Jan 2013 #8
24601 Jan 2013 #21
another_liberal Jan 2013 #26
Duckhunter935 Jan 2013 #31
another_liberal Jan 2013 #40
penndragon69 Jan 2013 #23
ManiacJoe Jan 2013 #33
Jenoch Jan 2013 #35
another_liberal Jan 2013 #46
Jenoch Jan 2013 #51
another_liberal Jan 2013 #52
Jenoch Jan 2013 #53
another_liberal Jan 2013 #71
NickB79 Jan 2013 #57
another_liberal Jan 2013 #70
Jenoch Jan 2013 #110
another_liberal Jan 2013 #112
Jenoch Jan 2013 #113
another_liberal Jan 2013 #114
Jenoch Jan 2013 #115
another_liberal Jan 2013 #116
Jenoch Jan 2013 #118
another_liberal Jan 2013 #119
Jenoch Jan 2013 #120
another_liberal Jan 2013 #121
hack89 Jan 2013 #87
another_liberal Jan 2013 #91
hack89 Jan 2013 #92
another_liberal Jan 2013 #97
naaman fletcher Jan 2013 #95
another_liberal Jan 2013 #98
naaman fletcher Jan 2013 #99
another_liberal Jan 2013 #100
naaman fletcher Jan 2013 #101
jeff47 Jan 2013 #107
Jenoch Jan 2013 #111
samsingh Jan 2013 #38
bluerum Jan 2013 #56
NickB79 Jan 2013 #58
ManiacJoe Jan 2013 #65
bluerum Jan 2013 #84
brewens Jan 2013 #76

Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:18 PM

1. I suspect most gun nutters are perfectly ok with this guy having that arsenal.

They are racists/white supremacists just like him.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #1)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:55 PM

9. not so

I am not racist,i own guns,i vote Democrat,and no i am not OK with this idiot having any weapons.If and when people wake up and understand there is a black market for guys like him will anything get accomplished.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #9)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:07 PM

10. Better regulation would help to keep guns out of the black market. n/t

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #10)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:13 PM

11. OK

Tell me how you can keep it from becoming black market

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #11)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:15 PM

13. By regulating the transfer, at every point on the distribution chain,

from the factories on out.

It wouldn't be a perfect system but it would be better than it is now.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #13)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 02:43 AM

67. To say nothing of the fact that a gun black market would have significant logistical difficulties.

Black marketing firearms has been compared to the drug trade; this is a little unrealistic, though. It's not as if one can swallow 50 Bushmaster rifles and then simply stroll through customs. Nor can one simply flush 25 Bushmasters down the toilet when the cops show up at the door.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #11)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:56 PM

47. A good start would be regulating the manufacture of any and all guns.

 

How can anyone deny that manufacturing way more guns than the legal market can handle, contributes to the black market.

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Response to RC (Reply #47)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:51 PM

86. So the government decides how many guns will be made every year? nt

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Response to hack89 (Reply #86)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:07 PM

88. And what kind?

 

Why do you have a problem with that in a country that supplies most of the rest of the world with war toys of all shapes and sizes?
We need to stop the killing somewhere. Granted our arms exports are keeping our GNP afloat, but more guns is obviously not the answer, if we want a peaceful world.

Don't you find it a bit ironic to be accidentally shot at a gun show? Maybe guns should be considered dangerous and should not be allowed to be brought in by patrons at gun shows. The people shot won't be buying many guns at that show. So that's a good thing anyway.

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Response to RC (Reply #88)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:14 PM

89. And when a republican is President he gets to decide how many and what kind?

I thought we were looking for long term solutions.

I don't see the point. There will still be plenty of guns being made to meet demand. Violent felons will have plenty of guns and mass killers will still buy them legally.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #89)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:45 PM

90. So we should not do anything?

 

Those children at Sandy Hook will have died in vain then.

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Response to RC (Reply #90)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:29 PM

93. That is a childish argument

of course we do something. There are many things we can do.

But can't they be well thought out, rational and realistic?

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #10)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:14 PM

12. Yeah

Because we all know that reguation has been so good at keeping drugs off the back market!

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Response to RantinRavin (Reply #12)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:15 PM

14. It's easier to produce drugs at home and sell them than it is to produce guns. n/t

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #14)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:18 PM

15. Who needs to produce

When there are millions of unregistered guns in the county.

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Response to RantinRavin (Reply #15)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:52 PM

44. The guns won't do much without ammo, which will run out sooner

if it isn't produced.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #44)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:28 AM

54. I have to say, I still smile when I think of Chris Rock's solution...

... let everyone have all the guns they want, but charge $5,000 for every bullet. You'd really have to think twice then about whether you wanted to blow somebody away!

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Response to primavera (Reply #54)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:39 AM

117. He must have done something

They put $50,000 worth of bullits in his ass.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #44)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 09:31 AM

74. Reloading

Evidently you've never heard of reloading.

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Response to mr.ed (Reply #74)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 10:33 AM

80. Wonder how long it would take

...that racist, gun nutter in the above story to reload 40,000 rounds at home? Even if he could get that much brass and lead. Non-factory reloading is ridiculously slow, tedious and has far wider quality variations compared to the automated, mass production of ammo. Think underloads and overloads, among other screw ups. There's a reason why shooting non-factory reloads will in most cases void a firearm's warranty.

Hmmmm, now that I've thought about it, home reloading might not be such a bad thing after all. If nutters had to reload all their own ammo, the process itself might act as a kind of self regulating mechanism....if you catch my drift.

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Response to mr.ed (Reply #74)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 11:33 AM

83. $50,000 for a pound of powder. Simple. n/t

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #44)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:32 PM

94. It is easy to make ammo. One would have to regulate those items too. nt

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #14)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:24 PM

18. I am

A veteran of the vietnam war,and when i was 17 i thought i was fighting for everybodies rights not just a choice few.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #18)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:44 PM

42. So, your name is donnagirl...

and you fought in Vietnam Nam? Maybe our definition of fight is different.

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #42)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 08:01 PM

103. If tour that nosey

Yes it's a pet name my wife gave me 40 years ago

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #18)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:28 AM

55. a girl who fought for us in Vietnam at age 17? Jeeze, get a better story, LOL.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #18)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 10:43 AM

82. I was in Sang Bang Dang Gong...

I was with the Green Berets,
Special Unit Battalions...
Commando Airborne Tactics...
Specialist Tactics Unit Battalion.

Yeah, it was real hush hush.

http://www.script-o-rama.com/movie_scripts/t/trading-places-script-transcript-murphy.html

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Response to Kolesar (Reply #82)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 08:04 PM

104. Your ignorance

About veterans shows that some democrats hate military people, and will be the down fall of most idiots that fall into your catagory.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #104)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 08:08 PM

105. I don't know where that came from Mr. Catagory eom

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #104)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 08:37 PM

108. No one here hates vets...

just poseurs.

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Response to RantinRavin (Reply #12)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:27 PM

19. OTOH, it has done a great job at keeping autos and trucks identified.

Title transfers, insurance and inspection requirements, all help to keep the chain going.

Or I could go to a local gun show and pay $100 to a complete stranger and get a small caliber handgun without so much as a bill of sale or even knowing who he is or him knowing who I am.

Which method would lead to more black market items? Hmm. It's a stumper.

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Response to mbperrin (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:49 AM

63. Well said.

You don't transfer a car title and someone commits a crime with your car or breaks a law in that car, you are going to get some serious questioning and probably some trouble.

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Response to RantinRavin (Reply #12)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 08:28 PM

106. Actually, they have

Consider the relative ease with which you can buy tobacco products compared to illegal drugs. Sure, there's plenty of illegal drug dealers, but their goods are much harder to buy than similar legal products.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #10)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:20 PM

16. We have laws

Against drunk driving,does it stop it no, does it stop the senseless kiling of our people due to drunks,no.
We have laws against drugs,does it stop the drugs (no) are families destroyed by peoples drug use yes.
Are there laws against prostitution yes,does it stop it,no.
I do not want to argue pnwmom,but i wish people would stop and think about how many laws there are and these things still go on and on.Sorry to say this but we also have to stop letting killers out of jail,rapists,child molesters,and that list just keeps going.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #16)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:29 PM

20. So any law that's not 100% effective should be dumped?

Strange how Chicago has cut shooting deaths in half with stricter rules there. 100% effective? Better than nothing? Absolutely.

It would be like telling kids they have to make a 100 to pass a course, or else they're failures. 99 - hit the road, you little bum.

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Response to mbperrin (Reply #20)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:34 PM

22. It's not

What i am saying,as a veteran mbperrin i personally will never forget how many of our people have died fighting for our rights )all of them) for our people to live free in the United States,just as i have the right to own a gun other people have the right not to own one.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #22)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:50 PM

24. No problem with owning a gun. I just think it ought to be watched at least as closely

as someone who buys a 50cc Honda motor scooter.

See about buying something as simple as an antibiotic without the right paperwork. And no one was ever injured by an antibiotic that I heard of.

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Response to mbperrin (Reply #24)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:56 PM

27. mbperrin

Agreed,we have so many laws on the books now that could be effective there is no need for anymore,in my humble opinion and if what i hear is correct(i am still looking) for the facts that the last couple of shooters were on Prozac and if that is true this should be watched a hell of a lot closer. Michael Moore is who i heard on a utube video about the use of these drugs.

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Response to mbperrin (Reply #24)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:19 PM

32. And no one was ever injured by an antibiotic that I heard of.

Well, some have died because they are allergic to penicillin.

But I get your point.

In no other laws do we expect 100% efficiency. And a gun is a weapon....made for killing. When a gun kills, it has been used correctly. When a car/bat/kitchen knife/antibiotic kills, it's a mistake or accident or misuse. That guy who killed all those elementary school kids used his gun correctly and it worked efficiently. This simple fact seems to fly out the window way too much.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #22)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:51 PM

25. Vietnam had nothing to do with preserving America's freedoms. That is rhetoric. nt

 

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Response to Comrade_McKenzie (Reply #25)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:01 PM

28. When we were kids

And signed up to fight my friend we did not ask why,we thought we were fighting the right fight so if you have no love for vietnam vets that is your right.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #28)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:27 AM

61. When you were a child, you thought as a child.

Now that you are grown up, you should know better than to make such a childish argument.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #28)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 05:58 AM

69. Why wouldn't you use your rights to ask Why you are going to war ?



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Response to Comrade_McKenzie (Reply #25)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:31 AM

62. Bravo Comrade!

America goes to war to advance it's business interests and exploit others peoples lands and resources. Freedom is a meaningless word. Rhetoric indeed.

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Response to Comrade_McKenzie (Reply #25)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 09:59 AM

78. All that matters is that she was fighting for this Country,

It was a War for the economy of the World.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #22)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:40 PM

41. What did the Vietnam war have to do with "my rights"?

 

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Response to xtraxritical (Reply #41)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 02:39 AM

66. Ho Chí Minh was gonna take away your guns, cancel "Gilligan's Island", and make you wear...

black pajamas...that's what!

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Response to Tom Ripley (Reply #66)


Response to Tom Ripley (Reply #66)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:32 PM

85. Thanks Tom, I needed that !

 

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #16)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 09:55 AM

77. Your right, where I live the same people are arrested for stealing

over on over, while they are waiting for a Court date they are arrested again sometimes three or four times, they never serve time. They hire a lawyer she pays off the police and the Judges and they are released. A 42 year old person that I know has four cases waiting for Court dates right now, he told me that his lawyer told him if he never killed anyone he would never go to jail. Am I to fill safe with a Police Dept that is being paid off. Without guns the police will be owned by the bad guys and we will be like Mexico.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #16)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 10:17 AM

79. So we should just get rid of laws that people break, and not pass any more?

FREEDUMBz!

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #9)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:06 PM

29. You, by definition, are NOT a gun nutter, my dear.

You are neither racist nor a Republican.

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #9)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 09:12 AM

73. By all accounts I'd say you aren't a gun nut

difference between a gun nut and a person who simply owns guns, big difference
At any rate Welcome to DU

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Response to donnasgirl (Reply #9)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 09:39 AM

75. Your right, taking the guns from the good guys will

only help the bad guys and we will be like Mexico the bad guys will own the police.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #1)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:53 AM

64. I don't concider myself a "gun nut"

 

But felons owning guns is illegal. how would stricter gun laws change any thing? did he get them at a gun show? probably. We need to find out how a felon got these guns, and plug that hole. we don't need new laws, we need the ones we have to work.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #1)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 10:40 AM

81. That is ludicrous and offensive as hell

 

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:26 PM

2. Sends chills down your spine

You have to wonder how many people are like that.

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Response to shenmue (Reply #2)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:44 PM

7. We have no way . . .

We have no way of knowing how many there really are just like this guy, monsters waiting to happen. Most guns are unregistered in this country.

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:29 PM

3. He was probably a straw purchaser re-selling them too.

From the article, something that needs to be highlighted -

Unfortunately, every nut in the country is stockpiling weapons in anticipation of some or all of their paranoid conspiracy theories coming true. We are the ones who need to be on the lookout, because when the apocalypse doesn’t come on its own, they will create one.


What these loons, their RW-elected officials, and their media continually try to do is to provoke and incite with their rhetoric, with the goal of having their sick fantasies become a reality (with their means justified by their soothsayer fictional ends).

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:30 PM

4. find out where he got them

He was prohibited and broke several existing laws. Put him away forever. If he had automatic weaponry, that is serious felony material there. Do you think new laws would have stopped this? He was already breaking existing laws. Lets start enforcing them as a start.

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Response to Duckhunter935 (Reply #4)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:23 PM

17. How do we enforce them when the NRA made sure there was no ATF head, no info sharing, no research?

These are all subjects of the President's executive orders. You know, that stuff he did that was just like Hitler?



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Response to SunSeeker (Reply #17)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:07 PM

30. I have no issues with the executive orders

from what I have been able to read about them. Most make common sense and he could of done this a long time ago. Deputy Director Thomas E. Brandon must not be able to do anything as acting director. I was without a boss for two years and I had to do his job and mine for that time.

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Response to Duckhunter935 (Reply #30)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:21 PM

34. Then why do you suggest that new laws would not have stopped this?

Maybe if we had better information sharing, maybe if gun dealers had to keep better records, maybe if we had universal background checks, this nutbag would not have gotten his Nazi arsenal.

I realize you've been lurking here a long time, but do you post to ANYTHING besides gun posts?

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Response to SunSeeker (Reply #34)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 07:29 PM

102. maybe if we enforced esisting laws

that would help before we make new laws that will not be enforced. I agree on background checks, better information sharing, and as I have said, I have no problems with the executive orders. They seem to make sense. This idiot should be in prison for a very long time.


Yes, I do

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:40 PM

5. Why did the State of Ohio grant a felon a license to open a store that likely sold guns?



Even if he didn't buy the guns as part of the store inventory, where did he get the money? Was he making so much money off the counterfeit sporting goods, that he could afford to buy 4 trailer truck loads of guns and ammunition?

Or was the store just a front for money laundering, and where did the money come from? That has to be a fortune in weaponry he had there.

Something very odd about this story.


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Response to freshwest (Reply #5)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:31 PM

36. There are LOTS of sporting goods stores that do not sell firearms.

In fact, I am sure there are more sporting goods stores, especially independent ones, that do not sell firearms than those that do.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #36)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:36 PM

39. That's not the point. Note I said 'likely' not 'certainly' or 'all sporting goods stores.'

4 trailer truckloads full of guns and ammo is a lot of money to extract from any business. This story is not complete, yet. Where did the money come from and does he have associates?



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Response to freshwest (Reply #39)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:54 PM

45. I'm sure an investigation will

turn up any assiciates. I hope it also finds the people who sold him the guns and I hope they are prosecuted.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #45)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:57 PM

48. Yes, 4 trailer truckloads of guns is enough for many people to hold at once. He intended mayhem.

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:40 PM

6. I guess he had credit . . .

I guess he had credit at the gun show, being one of their best customers and all.

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #6)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:32 PM

37. What gunshow?

Where did that detail come from?

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #37)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:47 PM

43. Gun shows are the easiest . . .

Gun shows are the easiest way for a felon to buy a gun; in fact, they are the easiest way for anyone to buy a gun. No background check, no waiting period, nothing. You pay your money and take your purchase back home to your storage trailer. And, yes, they have lots of gun shows in Ohio.

He might have purchased them on the black market, but then you are dealing with criminals and risking being caught in some kind of a sting operation. Gun shows are far more likely where he got them.

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #43)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:58 PM

49. Where at a gunshow do these transactions take place?

How many of the sellers at gunshows would make a sale without a background check?

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #49)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:02 AM

50. Gun shows are regulated . . .

Gun shows are regulated as private sales are; that is, they are not regulated. Gun show sellers are not supposed to sell to felons or to the insane, no, but they are not required to do any kind of a check.

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #50)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:18 AM

59. If an FFL is selling ANY gun, he must perform a background check

It doesn't matter if it's in his store, at a gun show, or in his garage. The law says he must call the NICS hotline and get the OK to sell that gun. And since the majority of gun show booths are set up by FFL dealers, they are required to perform background checks.

If you take a walk around a gunshow, you'll see sellers pulling out cellphones and Form 4473 paperwork left and right to call the ATF number. If you are buying from a licensed dealer, they are most definitely not treated as private sales, as you attest.

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Response to NickB79 (Reply #59)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:38 PM

96. He's happy in his ignorance. nt

 

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #50)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:21 AM

60. any vender at a gunshow

that has an FFL or a non FFL holder that is in the business of selling weapons must conduct background checks. Even at gunshows. Private party transactions in the same state between two individuals at or not at a gunshow do not. I think universal check would help in this or allow a private citizen to access the NIC database.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #49)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 03:46 AM

68. All of them.

 

If you walked up to them with cash and told them you were a felon, more then half of then would say "I didn't here that. Now what kind of weapon were you looking for?"

Gun Shows are a serious problem. they will probably be shut down if they don't figure out how to enact some sort of regulation.

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Response to Prog_gun_owner (Reply #68)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 11:36 PM

109. How many gun shows have you attended

and witnessed such activity and where? Every gunshow I've ever been to, all of the vendors have been dealers with FFLs.

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 09:54 PM

8. But?

Was he an NRA member?

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:31 PM

21. Who has disagreed with enforcing current law? Gun laws anyway as I get the feeling that many here

are just fine not enforcing federal immigration & drug laws.

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Response to 24601 (Reply #21)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:54 PM

26. The problem is guns, Troll . . .

Anyone who violates a federal law has to be ready to face the consequences of his action; however, the problem is guns, Troll, not pot or immigration. Pot never killed anyone and except for Native Americans, we are all immigrants in the United States.

By the way, just how big are the pro-pot and pro-immigration lobbying operations? How many tens of millions of dollars do they spend on pressuring and coercing members of Congress? Don't make me laugh.

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #26)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:12 PM

31. on this I also disagree with you

enforce the existing laws first, background checks for all firearms transactions. Most gun violence is with handguns and you would be much better off working just as hard on that. We need to find out what failed here and how he was able to get those weapons and throw some people in jail for a very long time. Call me a TROLL if you want as I have been around for quite a while and plan on staying.

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Response to Duckhunter935 (Reply #31)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:40 PM

40. Don't act like a Troll . . .

Don't act like a Troll, and I will never call you one.

There is hardly a mystery how he got the guns: He went to some gun shows and bought as many as he had the cash for. I could do the same. So could you. The only way to stop that is registration of gun ownership and background checks before any gun sale, whether private or commercial.

In this particular case, it will be important to find out where he got the cash to make all of those gun buys. I hope they do learn more, much more, about that and his connections to neo-Nazi groups.

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 10:47 PM

23. He's a model repubLIEcon.

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:20 PM

33. Trace the guns, arrest the sellers.

Not holding my breath though....

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:24 PM

35. I support making it mandatory for

background checks for all gun sales including transfers between citizens. However, does anyone really think that law would have ANY impact on this idiot in Ohio? He already broke dozens of gun laws.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #35)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:55 PM

46. Mandatory background checks . . .

Mandatory background checks would have made his gun purchases much more difficult and far more expensive. He would almost certainly never have been able to amass such a huge arsenal. When the dust settles, we will likely find he got his weapons at gun shows, without ever having to ever submit to any kind of background check.

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #46)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:03 AM

51. Where are you getting your information?

The vast majority of sales at gunshows are donexby dealers with FFLs. They do backgroubd checks. This guy is not going to buy guns from a dealer that has to do a background check. If a law is passed saying all gun sales need a background check, do you really think this guy will buy from someone who insists on following the law and submitting his name and information for a background check.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #51)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:05 AM

52. Gun shows are wide open free-for-alls.

Where are you getting your information, the NRA?

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #52)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:09 AM

53. I have never been a member of the NRA.

How many gunshows have you ever been to? The guys selling guns at those shows pay for the tables and the vast majority are dealers with FFL licenses. The 'gunshow loophole' is bs.

I support changing the law so that gun sales between individuals require the buyer to pass a background check. I also know that such a law would have little impact on the felon in Ohio.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #53)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 09:01 AM

71. "Isn't it pretty . . .?"

You claim:

"The 'gunshow loophole' is bs."


To quote a great and wonderful man (who killed himself with a gun):

"Isn't it pretty to think so?"

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #52)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:11 AM

57. Not the few I've attended

The tables selling firearms were almost entirely manned by gun store owners, handing out their business cards with the address of their brick-and-mortar location. And it doesn't matter where the gun is sold; someone who possesses and FFL MUST carry out a background check. The couple of hunting rifles I've ever bought at gun shows had background checks done on them. From what I've been told, the organizers frequently deny people without FFL's from renting tables to sell their personal collections.

The only guys I see setting up tables to sell privately generally don't have guns, just a bunch of fucked-up Nazi memorabilia and cheap-ass ninja blade knock-offs.

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Response to NickB79 (Reply #57)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 08:54 AM

70. I'll trust every unbiased, actual news source . . .

So, I can either take your word for that, or I can believe every unbiased, actual news source which has looked into the subject of how gun shows are run. Let me see . . . hmmmm?

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #70)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 11:44 PM

110. How about posting a link

to a story from an 'unbiased news source' that confirms your opinion? (It would also need to include results from more than one gunshow to be relevant).

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #110)


Response to another_liberal (Reply #112)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:05 AM

113. No, I've never been in a comma.

If you don't wish to support your opinions with reliable sources, that's your business.
I have never seen a news story in which the topic was about a licensed gun dealer failing to do background checks on sales at gunshows.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #113)


Response to another_liberal (Reply #114)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:44 AM

115. I've heard people like you making such claims, sure.

I have read blogs that make such claims. I have never seen a legitimate news organization do a story about a licensed gun dealer not doing background checks on any gun sales, including sales that take place at gun shows.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #115)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 07:31 AM

116. Toward the end of our exchange . . .

Toward the end of our exchange last night I became tired and not a little rude. For that I apologize.

Here are links to some good sources you can to begin with. I will note that it took me all of five minutes to find them for you as I sipped my morning coffee:

<http://www.bradycenter.org/search/?q=gunshow+loophole>

<http://www.csgv.org/issues-and-campaigns/gun-show-loophole>

<http://gunvictimsaction.org/fact-sheet/fact-sheet-gun-show-loophole-arms-criminals/>

<http://abcnews.go.com/WN/gun-show-loophole-closed/story?id=10404727>

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #116)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 04:02 PM

118. Thank you for the links.

The first and third links are biased sources. The second link did not work. The problem with the ABC story is that it does not contain enough details to answer my questions. Were the 'dealers' private sellers or did they pay the organizers of the show to have a table and sell their wares.

I am not opposed to requiring all gun sales to require background checks of gun buyers. I am just tired of the 'gun show loophole' hyperbole.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #118)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 06:27 PM

119. I doubt if "biased" is the right word . . .

I doubt if "biased" is the right label for those organizations. That description suggests they are somehow unfair or inaccurate, they are neither of those those things. They both have as their stated mission the reduction of gun crimes and greater restrictions on the availability of our most dangerous types of guns; however, as long as they are honest about facts they uncover and do not distort that information to advance their causes, can they really be called "biased?"

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #119)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 07:00 PM

120. Ok. Substitute the word 'objective'.

I'm not saying the Brady information is automatically inaccurate, just as the ibformation from the NRA is not automatically inaccurate. But as news sources, I am a little suspect of both.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #120)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 07:06 PM

121. Yes, "objective" . . .

Yes, "objective" is about right. They do have their mission at heart.

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #52)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:06 PM

87. The law is exactly the same inside a gun show as it is outside

a licensed firearms dealer has to do background checks no matter where he is selling.

What you are thinking about is private sales - an individual can sell a personal gun to another resident of his state without a background check. But that can be anywhere - a gun show, the parking lot, a yard sale, a classified ad.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #87)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 02:54 PM

91. Yeah, except the law isn't enforced . . .

Yeah, except the law isn't enforced inside a gun show. Don't just take my word for it, the lack of background checks at gun shows has been well-documented many times by many very reliable sources. And:

"You can look it up."

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #91)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:07 PM

92. So give the ATF the resources they need to enforce the law.

it is not rocket science.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #92)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:40 PM

97. You'll get . . .

You'll get no arguments from me about that. It's possibly the first thing that should be done. Now we just have to get the Republican House to approve funding.

(sigh)

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #91)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:37 PM

95. That is an incorrect statement

 

A dealer has to do a background check no matter where he sells a gun.

the issue is this:

Dealers have to do background checks

Individuals (like If I wanted to sell you a gun) dont.

That is the same, inside or outside of a gun show.

The issue is that gun shows, by their very nature, are places where people who want to buy and people who want to sell guns congregate.

So, if I were a felon wanting to buy a gun, I would hang around a gun show and invariably find individuals who want to sell guns.

I would NOT be buying from a dealer. The dealer would have to do a background check.

But, individuals who want to sell guns know that is a good place to find buyers. So what they do is an individuals who has, say, an ar-15 for sale, will walk around the gun show with it on his back and a price tag attached. The buyers and sellers find each other.

So, there is in fact no gun show loophole. What there is is a private sale loophole.

Hopefully that is going to be closed.

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #95)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:44 PM

98. That is the law . . .

That is the law, however, it is rarely enforced inside a gun show. Don't take my word for that, it has been well-documented by a number of quite reliable news sources and gun control advocacy groups.

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #98)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:50 PM

99. Well

 

We will just have to agree to disagree rather than each of us appeal to another authority.

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #99)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 06:56 PM

100. The point you made . . .

The point you made about private sales in the parking lot is a valid one. We only differ on our degree of faith in the enforcement of gun laws inside the average gun show.

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Response to another_liberal (Reply #100)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 07:03 PM

101. actually,

 

its not just in parking lots, you can do a private sale inside the show.

I have pretty high faith in it. I've never known any dealer who isn't totally scrupulous with his paperwork. But you may be right, and certainly I can't prove that.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #51)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 08:37 PM

107. Here, lemme help

The vast majority of sales at gunshows are donexby dealers with FFLs

That's a very funny way of spelling "all". Almost like it isn't.

And I wonder if there will happen to be a lot of second amendment fanatics at his local gun show willing to straw-purchase because the evil government is stomping all over this poor man's rights. Nah, that couldn't possibly happen!

If a law is passed saying all gun sales need a background check, do you really think this guy will buy from someone who insists on following the law

The difference is at the moment, we can only arrest this guy for having the guns.
With the background check requirement, we can arrest the guy who sold him the guns too.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #107)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 11:49 PM

111. You won't get an argument

out of me on your last statement. Others have explained why the so-called gunshow loophole is BS. Those posts are not too far above this one.

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sat Jan 19, 2013, 11:32 PM

38. disgusting

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:34 AM

56. Lets estimate $.50 a round. That's $20k in ammo alone.

Where do people get that kind of cash to dump on ammunition.

Wonder if he was running a black market gun scheme.

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Response to bluerum (Reply #56)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 01:13 AM

58. I'd guess drug running was in there somewhere

Lots of these white supremacist groups make a lot of money running drugs.

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Response to bluerum (Reply #56)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 02:14 AM

65. You don't have to buy it all at once.

A case here, a case there. It will add up. Since it does not have expiration dates, you don't need to use it up quickly.

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Response to ManiacJoe (Reply #65)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 12:31 PM

84. True. But I suspect he was into black market sales.

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Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 09:46 AM

76. That'll confuse a bagger that's only capable of thinking what it gits learnt to think by

the hate radio! They was all learnt Nazis wuz sohshulists! Who knew that was a right-wing thing?

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