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Judi Lynn

(160,527 posts)
Wed Jan 20, 2016, 05:06 AM Jan 2016

Amidst drop in oil prices, U.S. Navy deploys 'Great Green Fleet'

Source: Reuters

Amidst drop in oil prices, U.S. Navy deploys 'Great Green Fleet'
Reuters
By David Alexander
5 hours ago

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. Navy will formally deploy its so-called "Great Green Fleet" on Wednesday, sending warships to sea on biofuels even though oil prices have dropped 70 percent since congressional Republicans first criticized the high cost of alternative fuels.

Navy Secretary Ray Mabus told Reuters the deployment is the next step in a fleet-wide effort that has seen the Navy cut its oil consumption by 15 percent since he took charge in 2009 and the Marine Corps curb its use by 60 percent.

A focus on energy and energy-saving technology gives the U.S. Navy a military advantage, Mabus said. An amphibious assault ship like the USS Makin Island, which uses a dual electric-diesel propulsion system, can stay on station three times longer than a conventionally powered vessel, he said.

“It gives us an edge tactically, it gives us an edge strategically,” Mabus said. “It keeps … fuel from being used as a weapon against us.”










Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/amidst-drop-oil-prices-u-navy-deploys-great-035144034.html

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Amidst drop in oil prices, U.S. Navy deploys 'Great Green Fleet' (Original Post) Judi Lynn Jan 2016 OP
We are energy independent when we use bio-fuel. JDPriestly Jan 2016 #1
It was always a problem to rely on other peoples oil to fight our wars. bemildred Jan 2016 #2
You use less fuel training then in actual combat, and in 2006 we were fighting... happyslug Jan 2016 #3

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
1. We are energy independent when we use bio-fuel.
Wed Jan 20, 2016, 09:38 AM
Jan 2016

The drop in oil prices may be a response to the fact that we are becoming less dependent on mostly imported or expensively obtained oil.

This is a good move on the part of the Navy in my opinion.

"It gives us an edge tactically . . . (and) strategically. It keeps . . . fuel from being used as a weapon against us."

Quote from the OP at Yahoo.com.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
2. It was always a problem to rely on other peoples oil to fight our wars.
Wed Jan 20, 2016, 09:45 AM
Jan 2016

Tactics wins battles, logistics wins wars.

Fancy weapons win battles, cheap effective weapons win wars.

 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
3. You use less fuel training then in actual combat, and in 2006 we were fighting...
Wed Jan 20, 2016, 11:43 AM
Jan 2016

Last edited Wed Jan 20, 2016, 12:28 PM - Edit history (2)

Remember the old saying "Train hard to fight easy", that is a doctrine of all armies, but most training is done on bases where the fuel supply is nearby, it does NOT have to be hauled clear around the world. This means a massive increase in fuel usage when in actual combat as oppose to training.

After the invasion of Normandy, it was of paramount importance to move supplies north. An American infantry division required 150 tons of gasoline per day, and an armored division 350 tons per day.

http://www.transchool.lee.army.mil/museum/transportation%20museum/redballintro.htm


Since WWII fuel use has increased by a factor of 15:

Robert Bryce stated that "The Third Army (of General Patton) had about 400,000 men and used about 400,000 gallons of gasoline a day." This makes one gallon per day per soldier.

According to my calculations (based on officially deployed troops number and oil consumption statistics) this amount went up to 9 gallons per day per deployed soldier in Vietnam War, to nearly 10 gallons per day per deployed soldier in Operation Desert Shield/Storm (Gulf War), and to 15 gallons per day per deployed soldier in January 2007.

http://www.resilience.org/stories/2007-05-21/us-military-energy-consumption-facts-and-figures


Please note the above cite mentions that 60% of all fuel used by the Military is "Jet Fuel". In the US military that is the fuel not only used in Jets and Helicopters but any vehicle that uses "Diesel", which is almost anything used today by the US Military (Mogas, the name for Gasoline in the Military was phased out in the 1990s when the Army converted its WWII era gasoline field ovens from Gasoline to Diesel. The M151 Jeep was the last vehicle the Army used that used Gasoline and it was phased out in the early 1990s (Most regular forces had passed them on to reserve forces in the early 1980s, the reserves kept them till the 1990s).

Also note "Distillate and RFO", RFO = "Residual fuel oil", this is real crap, but used in large boilers. This "fuel" is the second largest source of energy, it is used to propel "conventional" i.e. non nuclear, ships of the Military AND can be used in a pinch to run Diesel engines and jet planes ("Distillate and RFO" is considered a BAD fuel for both applications, but while it is bad it is usable). "Distillate and RFO" is also used to heat barracks and other buildings where Natural Gas is NOT available.

Thus most of the savings in both the Marines and Navy's drop in fuel usage since 2006 is related to the fact the US Military has drawn down its forces from Iraq and Afghanistan. i.e. the US Military is spending more time training close to their supply lines, and less time operating far from those supply lines and using extra fuel to get fuel to the troops that need it.

Thus it is the end of the wars that has lead to the drop in fuel consumption NOT any reduction do to adopting "Green Energy".

Please note, the US Military still assumes it will have all of the fuel it will need in combat. No training is done in situation where fuel is short.

This assumption is so bad, that you rarely even see any discussion of what the Germans did during WWII when their fuel supply was cut off in December 1941 (When their failed to take Moscow and re secure their fuel supply that the German Army relied on from 1939 till 1941, i.e. Russia). To solve the problem of no fuel, Germany used bicycle Infantry as "Fillers" (i.e. a unit designed to be kept in reserved and be sent it to stop any break through, this was done by truck based US Infantry during WWI and Cavalry by the Russians in WWII). Each German Infantry Division after December 1941 had to use less then 10% of the fuel it used in pre war training. This was to save the fuel for Tanks and Planes. The Germans used mostly horse powered wagons after December 1941 to get supplies from rail heads to the troops. The German only used one Horse Mounted Cavalry unit during WWII, mostly because after 1941 they recruited and used Anti-Communist Russians in that role.

Thus bicycle troops were kept by various European nations after WWII, mostly the Swiss and the Finns:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_infantry

http://www.combatreform.org/atb.htm

In 2001 the Swiss eliminated its bicycle troops, but revived them in 2015:

http://www.thelocal.ch/20150401/swiss-army-revives-bike-infantry-to-boost-fitness

The Swiss came out with a new bike in 1993 for their troops, and recently had to buy more, as their revived their bicycle troops. You can buy one for $2450 Swiss Franks:

http://www.simpel.ch/velos/Militaervelo_Fahrrad12.html

The Finns train their troops on bicycle and skis, but do not have a regular bicycle battalion:

http://yle.fi/uutiset/puolustusvoimien_polkupyorilla_ei_enaa_ole_merkitysta_sodan_aikana/5238523

Just a comment that the US Military is NOT prepared to fight any war where fuel is in short supply, thus the US, in any war, will secure Saudi Arabia and the Persian Gulf before anything else and that includes Europe and Japan.
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