Florist who refused to serve gay couple rejects settlement

[Judi Lynn]

Source: Associated Press

Florist who refused to serve gay couple rejects settlement
By NICHOLAS K. GERANIOS, Associated Press | February 20, 2015 | Updated: February 20, 2015 3:09pm

SPOKANE, Wash. (AP) — A florist who refused to provide flowers for a gay wedding has rejected an offer from the Washington state attorney general to settle a discrimination case by paying a $2,000 fine and agreeing to sell bouquets for same-sex ceremonies in the future.

"Our state would be a better place if we respected each other's differences, and our leaders protected the freedom to have those differences," Barronelle Stutzman wrote in a letter Friday to Attorney General Bob Ferguson.

She wrote that gay couples are allowed to act on their views, but "because I follow the Bible's teaching that marriage is the union of one man and one woman, I am no longer free to act on my beliefs."

Stutzman, 70, owner of Arlene's Flowers in Richland, Washington, had earlier said she plans to appeal a judge's ruling that she broke a state antidiscrimination law.


Read more: http://www.chron.com/news/us/article/Florist-declines-settlement-offer-6092174.php

---

[center]

[/center]

[randys1]

1. I hope her business is bankrupted.

[City Lights]

39. So do I. nt

[C Moon]

2. Her definition of "differences" is hate.

[Skittles]

3. disgusting

this gal thinks she is true Christian - that is very sad indeed

[Mr.Bill]

4. Some people in this country

will never grasp the concept that the bible does not trump law.

[FiveGoodMen]

6. In fact, they want to see that it does!

These are the threats to any decent way of life.

If there's a war worth fighting, they are the enemy.

(Note to all: Yes, I said enemy, I meant enemy, don't even waste your breath)

[cstanleytech]

5. Odd, I dont recall the bible saying anywhere that you should not or cannot sale

flowers, cake or anything to anyone for that matter because they are gay.

[Major Nikon]

11. It's just another excuse people give to hate and promoted all the way to the "progressive" pope

You can safely assume you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do.
-- Anne Lamott

[BrotherIvan]

30. I do

That part of the Bible that most fundamentalists hate, the New Testabment, talks about everyone getting in an uproar when Jesus went and ate with lepers, harlots and outcasts. Yeah and sinners, Publicans, and Gentiles too.

15 And it came to pass, that, as Jesus sat at meat in his house, many publicans and sinners sat also together with Jesus and his disciples: for there were many, and they followed him. 16 And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners? 17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Compare: Matthew 9 -13; Luke 5:27-32

And you know who didn't like it? The Zealots and the Pharisees. A lot of similarities here.

[closeupready]

7. Look, honey. Your business is a public accommodation; the law prohibits discrimination.

Further, your homophobic superstition is subsidized by taxpaying gay people.

[silvershadow]

8. Because the Bible prohibits doing business with homosexuals? I think he is confused. nt

[CanonRay]

9. Her mind is warped by all that crap she hears every Sunday

She's confusing being forced to marry a woman with selling flowers to the public. If someone were forcing her to marry a woman, I'd be on her side. Don't think that's going to happen. Her argument logically leads to those who don't want to serve other races, or any other difference you can find in the bible, which is basically anything.

[JDDavis]

10. She is probably not alone.

So many religious people think their religion gives thema reasonable excuse to be a bigot.

Guess she doesn't like the idea that two gay folks could love each other and be so happy together they want to share their lifetimes together. Using her bible to excuse her fears and ignorance, well, it's not the first time in history stuff like this has happened and continues to happen.

I suppose she sells flowers for funerals of gay folks, cause that's okay, they're dead now, so no problem making a profit on those flowers.

[msanthrope]

12. Didn't her god tell her to give Caesar what is Caesar's? nt

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

13. I should appeal my speeding ticket ...

... nowhere in my bible does it mention that speeding is a crime.

Oh, wait, our body of law is not the same as her bible. or the koran. or Game of Thrones.

[pepperbear]

14. "I believe in the love of Jesus Christ so I won't make a flower bouquet."

That's the long and short of it right there.

[azurnoir]

15. If you wish to proceed then make your public business private members only sort of thing

of course there would be ah complications with sales, your public shop would have to shutter but hey tour religious beliefs will be protected, other wise pay up

[uppityperson]

16. you can act on your views so long as it doesn't hurt others or is illegal. Since WA

has marriage equality, it is illegal to discriminate. I don't see how those married gay couples harm anyone so no, the comparison is not valid.

Eta, she needs a big fine to serve as a warning that no, there is no right to act on your beliefs.

[uppityperson]

17. link to Seattle Times article...

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/florist-declines-settlement-offer/

[phylny]

18. Does she similarly refuse to serve

customers who are divorced or are divorced and remarry?

Either way, she doesn't have a leg to stand on, but I'm wondering how hypocritical she is.

[They_Live]

29. or people who eat shrimp?

76 things banned in Leviticus


1. Burning any yeast or honey in offerings to God (2:11)
2. Failing to include salt in offerings to God (2:13)
3. Eating fat (3:17)
4. Eating blood (3:17)
5. Failing to testify against any wrongdoing you’ve witnessed (5:1)
6. Failing to testify against any wrongdoing you’ve been told about (5:1)
7. Touching an unclean animal (5:2)
8. Carelessly making an oath (5:4)
9. Deceiving a neighbor about something trusted to them (6:2)
10. Finding lost property and lying about it (6:3)
11. Bringing unauthorized fire before God (10:1)
12. Letting your hair become unkempt (10:6)
13. Tearing your clothes (10:6)
14. Drinking alcohol in holy places (10)
15. Eating an animal which doesn’t both chew cud and has a divided hoof (cf: camel, rabbit, pig) (11:4-7)
16. Touching the carcass of any of the above (11:8)
17. Eating – or touching the carcass of – any seafood without fins or scales (11:10-12)
18. Eating – or touching the carcass of - eagle, the vulture, the black vulture, the red kite, any kind of black kite, any kind of raven, the horned owl, the screech owl, the gull, any kind of hawk, the little owl, the cormorant, the great owl, the white owl, the desert owl, the osprey, the stork, any kind of heron, the hoopoe and the bat. (11:13-19)
19. Eating – or touching the carcass of – flying insects with four legs, unless those legs are jointed (11:20-22)
20. Eating any animal which walks on all four and has paws (good news for cats) (11:27)
21. Eating – or touching the carcass of – the weasel, the rat, any kind of great lizard, the gecko, the monitor lizard, the wall lizard, the skink and the chameleon (11:29)
22. Eating – or touching the carcass of – any creature which crawls on many legs, or its belly (11:41-42)
23. Going to church within 33 days after giving birth to a boy (12:4)
24. Going to church within 66 days after giving birth to a girl (12:5)
25. Having sex with your mother (18)
26. Having sex with your father’s wife (18:8)
27. Having sex with your sister (18)
28. Having sex with your granddaughter (18:10)
29. Having sex with your half-sister (18:11)
30. Having sex with your biological aunt (18:12-13)
31. Having sex with your uncle’s wife (18:14)
32. Having sex with your daughter-in-law (18:15)
33. Having sex with your sister-in-law (18:16)
34. Having sex with a woman and also having sex with her daughter or granddaughter (18:17)
35. Marrying your wife’s sister while your wife still lives (18:18)
36. Having sex with a woman during her period (18:19)
37. Having sex with your neighbor’s wife (18:20)
38. Giving your children to be sacrificed to Molek (18:21)
39. Having sex with a man “as one does with a woman” (18:22)
40. Having sex with an animal (18:23)
41. Making idols or “metal gods” (19:4)
42. Reaping to the very edges of a field (19)
43. Picking up grapes that have fallen in your vineyard (19:10)
44. Stealing (19:11)
45. Lying (19:11)
46. Swearing falsely on God’s name (19:12)
47. Defrauding your neighbor (19:13)
48. Holding back the wages of an employee overnight (19:13)
49. Cursing the deaf or abusing the blind (19:14)
50. Perverting justice, showing partiality to either the poor or the rich (19:15)
51. Spreading slander (19:16)
52. Doing anything to endanger a neighbor’s life (19:16)
53. Seeking revenge or bearing a grudge (19:18)
54. Mixing fabrics in clothing (19:19)
55. Cross-breeding animals (19:19)
56. Planting different seeds in the same field (19:19)
57. Sleeping with another man’s slave (19:20)
58. Eating fruit from a tree within four years of planting it (19:23)
59. Practicing divination or seeking omens (tut, tut astrology) (19:26)
60. Trimming your beard (19:27)
61. Cutting your hair at the sides (19:27)
62. Getting tattoos (19:28)
63. Making your daughter prostitute herself (19:29)
64. Turning to mediums or spiritualists (19:31)
65. Not standing in the presence of the elderly (19:32)
66. Mistreating foreigners – “the foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born” (19:33-34)
67. Using dishonest weights and scales (19:35-36)
68. Cursing your father or mother (punishable by death) (20)
69. Marrying a prostitute, divorcee or widow if you are a priest (21,13)
70. Entering a place where there’s a dead body as a priest (21:11)
71. Slaughtering a cow/sheep and its young on the same day (22:28)
72. Working on the Sabbath (23:3)
73. Blasphemy (punishable by stoning to death) (24:14)
74. Inflicting an injury; killing someone else’s animal; killing a person must be punished in kind (24:17-22)
75. Selling land permanently (25:23)
76. Selling an Israelite as a slave (foreigners are fine) (25:42)

[BrotherIvan]

31. President Bartlet

[rickford66]

32. Shouldn't they have to prove consistancy?

If they can pick and choose which religious rules they obey, then they really aren't following their stated religion. Why wasn't this proposed during the Hobby Lobby case?

[bvf]

40. That's cafeteria christianity for you.

You get to choose which rules to obey. I suspect most so-called christians practice it.

[rickford66]

41. Personal practice I can accept. Using it a a legal tool is fraud.

[Jake Stern]

19. Maybe Stutzman feels she can take it all the way to a largely sympathetic SCOTUS

Sadly, she just might be correct. I could see Kennedy and the others Cons voting in favor of her "religious freedom".

[Thor_MN]

20. It would be nice to see the companies she buys supplies from cut her off.

Let her practice her hate with no flowers at all.

[bvf]

42. If I were one of her vendors,

I'd be looking at other business opportunities.

She'll still get her stuff, but let's see how much money she's willing to spend before her beliefs become an annoyance or worse.

[tanyev]

21. And I'm sure it's only a coincidence that her lawyer is a graduate of Regent University

and does a lot of work with the Alliance Defending Freedom, who has prominently featured this story on their web page.

Kristen K. Waggoner

Since joining ELM 16 years ago, Kristen has participated in many constitutional cases, including Andersen v. King County (same-sex marriage), Stormans v. Selecky (pharmacist conscience rights), and State v. Hamlin (clergy-penitent privilege). She has served as outside general counsel to private schools and universities, churches, and other non-profit organizations. She has also defended individuals in a variety of areas, including breach of contract, negligence, wrongful termination, statutory claims, and family disputes.

Kristen earned her J.D. from Regent University School of Law, graduating magna cum laude in 1997.

http://www.elmlaw.com/index.php?page=attorneys&id=16

http://www.alliancedefendingfreedom.org/

[LiberalElite]

38. I wonder if

she's being represented pro bono and the lawyer told her to reject the settlement so they could keep this in the news and make a bigger case out of it.

[tanyev]

44. Oh, I'm sure of it.

I bet that the letter mentioned in the OP was written by the lawyer or someone from the Alliance Defending Freedom. I'm sure that those internet friendly graphics of Ms. Stutzman were photographed, produced and distributed by the ADF. I bet Ms. Stutzman has been well-coached by them on her soundbite quotes. I would even be willing to bet that they found her, rather than her just happening to find them in the phonebook.

[herding cats]

22. Funny thing is, her rights stop where the couples rights began.

She violated the state law by ignoring their rights, which has nothing to do with her religious beliefs and everything to do with not discriminating against another person. It's as simple as that, no matter what other people are telling her.

[valerief]

23. Why isn't everyone doing it? Because everyone isn't an asshole like you, Stutzman. nt

[groundloop]

24. Hmm.... this is very odd because the Jesus I studied didn't care about people's sexuality

He was more concerned about the plight of poor people, about inequality, and about those who are well off helping out those less fortunate than themselves. I can't seem to recall one single word that Jesus said about homosexuality (and I bet Ms Stutzman can't either).

[wolfie001]

25. This is appalling! Disgusting!

Who the hell cares what god/gods she claims to pray to. These are the people at war with America.
She's nasty = Republican

[rurallib]

26. she should have checked the anti-discrimination laws before she started her business

Suppose instead of gay folks, she religiously objected to inter-racial marriages. I doubt anyone would stand behind her for that. I do not see any difference.

Or what if her religion objected to catholic-protestant weddings or people with an age difference over say ten years?

Either serve the public or don't stay in business.
And maybe Jesus isn't your friend if he set you up to fail like this? Or maybe when he said "render unto Caeser" he meant obey the civil laws?

[Faux pas]

27. Preaching is soooo much easier

than practicing. Instead of having sh*t like this spread all over the country, can't we just confine them in one spot? Let them wander the desert for let's say, 40 yrs? That could be them walking the walk.

[Lint Head]

28. Well...Go the fuck under.

[Cha]

33. Bible Schmible.. Did Christ Discriminate?

[Behind the Aegis]

34. ....

[DeSwiss]

35. Okay, now I see it.

- Pretty slick. The business that was going under anyway has now accelerated it's death spiral since her bigotry has been made plain for all to see. So this way she gets to blame gay people AND Jesus for it, and become a martyr. How clever.

Remember now whatever happens, it's not her fault.

K&R

[center]
Pissed Jesus says: ''They're not my followers. No!
Seriously? It's like they never even picked up the book.''[/center]

[hedgehog]

36. At least one right wing Catholic site is presenting this as a

story of a woman being forced out of business by the Gay Agenda®. He goes on to warn fellow Catholics (he's not so sure about other Christians) that the End Times® are upon us, and that we should all start storing food and arming ourselves in order to serve the Prince of Peace.

[DeSwiss]

45. The florists first!

- The Catholics next!!!

[peace13]

46. Ha ha ha! Bingo!

And they care more about the flower lady than the poor little raped boys. I don't get where the Catholic Church thinks it has a right to open it's mouth to protest anything. I laugh here but cry inside because the children will continue to be abused in the name of the church!

[StoneCarver]

37. I know there's a lot to be angry and upset about but...

I can't help but feel sorry for her. There's no excuse for her crazy thinking. But I just shake my head and hope she sees the error of her ways. I know I've evolved a lot over the last 10 years on the subject. I would hope people would forgive me for things I said or did 10-15 years ago.
Stonecarver

[Trillo]

43. So she's saying,

... Bible's teaching that marriage is the union of one man and one woman, I am no longer free to act on my beliefs."

She can't marry a guy?