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rg123

(36 posts)
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 09:00 PM Jul 2013

Rep. Rush Holt (D-NJ) Will introduce legislation to repeal Patriot Act

Once again, our nation is grappling with a false choice being presented to us by the media and intelligence officials: In order to be safe, we must be willing — in President Barack Obama’s words — to accept “modest encroachments” on our civil liberties.

These claims are being advanced in the wake of the most sensational revelations about intrusive, and potentially illegal, government surveillance activities at home since the Watergate era.

I have noted numerous times throughout my career in public office my reverence for our Constitution and my admiration for the wisdom displayed by those who drafted it and argued for its passage. As we renew the debate over the almost incredible power and implications of the surveillance activities that are now in the news, we all would do well to remember what Alexander Hamilton noted in Federalist No. 8:

“Safety from external danger is the most powerful director of national conduct. Even the ardent love of liberty will, after a time, give way to its dictates. The violent destruction of life and property incident to war, the continual effort and alarm attendant on a state of continual danger, will compel nations the most attached to liberty to resort for repose and security to institutions which have a tendency to destroy their civil and political rights. To be more safe, they at length become willing to run the risk of being less free.”

With those words, Hamilton not only describes his own time, but post-9/11 America as well.



con't

http://www.app.com/article/20130710/NJOPINION03/307100009/HOLT-Liberty-yields-false-security?gcheck=1

55 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Rep. Rush Holt (D-NJ) Will introduce legislation to repeal Patriot Act (Original Post) rg123 Jul 2013 OP
Go Rush! My deep appreciation. cali Jul 2013 #1
That is a sentence I thought I would never read on DU... awoke_in_2003 Jul 2013 #51
Thank you Rush Holt, a serious person. (nt) enough Jul 2013 #2
the democans and republicrats will resist mightly but good for him nt msongs Jul 2013 #3
Yes - The Surveillance State Is Out Of Control - Thank You For Sharing The Good News cantbeserious Jul 2013 #4
Rush Holt also wants to make verified paper-trail voting standard. Octafish Jul 2013 #5
Either he or Frank Pallone should be NJ's next US senator brentspeak Jul 2013 #6
You nailed it. merrily Jul 2013 #20
BARRONS: "As Booker Runs for Senate, Newark Faces Development Uncertainty." proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #25
More people need to see this. Apophis Jul 2013 #7
K&R. silvershadow Jul 2013 #8
Kick & rec! octoberlib Jul 2013 #9
awesome !! nt steve2470 Jul 2013 #10
In my social activist class NJCher Jul 2013 #11
K & R Scurrilous Jul 2013 #12
K&R ReRe Jul 2013 #13
There is no chance, absent a major change in the situation. BlueCheese Jul 2013 #48
About fucking time. Volaris Jul 2013 #14
Exactly what needs to happen nf abelenkpe Jul 2013 #15
What does he need us to do to make this happen? sabrina 1 Jul 2013 #16
Well, first we have to elect a president who wouldn't veto it. FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #35
Elizabeth Warren maybe? sabrina 1 Jul 2013 #53
I think she'd be excellent. FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #54
Was I the only one who thought Obama would do this? n-t Logical Jul 2013 #17
No, a lot of us got that wrong. FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #36
Rep. Holt always expresses to his constituents the greatest respect for President Obama. proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #40
I've heard more than one liberal who's met Rush Limbaugh and said FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #45
I've read letters written by Rep Holt to Pres Obama critical of certain specific policy decisions. proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #47
I certainly wasn't criticizing Holt FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #50
Please see post #40 for further clarification. nt proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #52
Holt: “I’m going to beat Cory Booker and win this campaign the same way I beat Watson in Jeopardy!" proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #18
Oh, he's THAT guy, wow, thanks for telling me I saw that Jeopardy. xtraxritical Jul 2013 #23
Thank you, Rush Holt! Waiting For Everyman Jul 2013 #19
Just when you are about to completely give up on the party mick063 Jul 2013 #21
More info. proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #22
That's fantastic. liberal_at_heart Jul 2013 #24
Please support Rush Holt for US Senate. The NJ primary is on August 13. Contributions welcome. proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #27
K&R MotherPetrie Jul 2013 #26
This!! needs to be supported. AzDar Jul 2013 #28
@RushHolt to follow on Twitter proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #29
Rep. Rush Holt: When Big Brother Meets Big Data proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #30
I'm all for getting rid of the Patriot Act Californeeway Jul 2013 #31
"Do people have a realistic appraisal of how big of a political fight it will be?" FiveGoodMen Jul 2013 #37
And go back to the days when police who wanted to bust wheelchair ridden marijuana patients Warren DeMontague Jul 2013 #32
Imagine US Senator Rush Holt (D, NJ). nt proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #33
Ok. :) silvershadow Jul 2013 #39
I am up for that! nt Pholus Jul 2013 #43
EMAIL: New video up with your help 12:12 PM (2 hours ago) proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #34
Good luck on that one for the so called Patriot Act does not have a snowball's chance indepat Jul 2013 #38
Improve it then, that's why negotiation and compromise matter. nt proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #46
I would support such legislation. n/t Blackford Jul 2013 #41
Now, ain't ThAT a Democrat. A flood begins with but a single drop. BornLooser Jul 2013 #42
BOUT FUCKIN TIME! Rex Jul 2013 #44
Whatever one may think of Edward Snowden or Glenn Greenwald... BlueCheese Jul 2013 #49
k&r for exposure. n/t Laelth Jul 2013 #55
 

cali

(114,904 posts)
1. Go Rush! My deep appreciation.
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 09:04 PM
Jul 2013

Excellent statement and great quote. I've always liked Holt. Now he has my admiration.

brentspeak

(18,290 posts)
6. Either he or Frank Pallone should be NJ's next US senator
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 09:50 PM
Jul 2013

Unfortunately, the New Democrat power elite have anointed their Wall St. lackey, Corey Booker.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
20. You nailed it.
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 11:38 PM
Jul 2013

The notion that voters can primary all DINOs right out of Congress is naive at best.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
25. BARRONS: "As Booker Runs for Senate, Newark Faces Development Uncertainty."
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 12:34 AM
Jul 2013
http://online.barrons.com/article/SB10001424127887324328204578574191247442404.html?mod=BOL_article_full_more

As Booker Runs for Senate, Newark Faces Development Uncertainty
Fears for New Jersey City's Business Climate If Mayor Exits

By HEATHER HADDON
MONDAY, JULY 8, 2013


What happens to Newark's business climate if Mayor Cory Booker is elected to the Senate in October?

Newark Mayor Cory Booker has championed the new buildings and businesses that have sprung up during his seven-year tenure, promoting New Jersey's largest city as a modern-day boom town.

<>

Economic development has been prominent on Mr. Booker's agenda since he took office. His efforts were hampered by the recession, but things have picked up since. About $1 billion in projects broke ground in Newark between 2011 and 2012. Another $2 billion in investment is now moving forward, according to city projects lists viewed by The Wall Street Journal.

<>

NJCher

(35,662 posts)
11. In my social activist class
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 10:56 PM
Jul 2013

That I teach at a university here in NJ, we studied legislation that originated with our representatives. Rush Holt was by far and away the originator of the most popular (with the people) bills.



Cher

ReRe

(10,597 posts)
13. K&R
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 11:07 PM
Jul 2013

Hoo-ray! Anyone who wants to abolish the Patriot Act is OK by me! Especially when he wants a paper trail for our votes too. Go Rush Holt! Of course, Boehner will never let it come to the floor, but in 2014 when we take the House back, once and for all, it could be the first bill that is passed! Thanks, rg123 for this OP!

BlueCheese

(2,522 posts)
48. There is no chance, absent a major change in the situation.
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 06:40 PM
Jul 2013

Feinstein and Reid are on record as supporting the surveillance programs. Even if the planets align and it somehow gets through, Obama will veto it.

Unfortunately, the best chance to undo this madness is when the Patriot Act comes up for renewal.

Volaris

(10,270 posts)
14. About fucking time.
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 11:26 PM
Jul 2013

This will die the fastest Legislative death in the history of American Politics, as it strips FAR too much money and Power from FAR too many people and corporations who have gotten FAR too fat of the "War on Terra". Just sayin'..

But again, it's about fucking time. This has my full and vocal support. I'll e-mail McCaskill's office and see what kind of response I get=).

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
53. Elizabeth Warren maybe?
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 10:41 PM
Jul 2013

Kucinich would definitely not veto it but he hasn't sucked up enough to Corporate America and the MIC to have a chance.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
40. Rep. Holt always expresses to his constituents the greatest respect for President Obama.
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 06:13 PM
Jul 2013

eg. Check out his Twitter feed to read his response to the recent GT speech on climate change and energy policy.

Google: obama rush holt

...and yet, see OP among numerous examples.

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
45. I've heard more than one liberal who's met Rush Limbaugh and said
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 06:19 PM
Jul 2013

they got along with him fine.

But I don't like the things he does.

And I don't like the things Obama does.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
47. I've read letters written by Rep Holt to Pres Obama critical of certain specific policy decisions.
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 06:40 PM
Jul 2013

That's the job of elected officials representing their constituents decision by decision, issue by issue. The analogy is absurdly broad.

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
50. I certainly wasn't criticizing Holt
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 06:43 PM
Jul 2013

And the analogy was just to point out that when a good guy likes a bad guy...

...the bad guy's still bad.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
18. Holt: “I’m going to beat Cory Booker and win this campaign the same way I beat Watson in Jeopardy!"
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 11:32 PM
Jul 2013

Go RUSH HOLT! National support by progressives encouraged: http://www.rushholt.com


Booker endorsements surge, despite failed power grab partly motivated by efforts at water utility privatization.

http://www.nj.com/essex/index.ssf/2013/07/apellate_court_affirms_booker_had_no_authority_to_vote_on_council_seat.html
http://www.nj.com/essex/index.ssf/2013/07/appellate_court_ruling_curbs_mayoral_power_in_newark_and_hoboken.html

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2012/02/booker_reinstates_water_agency.html
http://njcop.wordpress.com/rally-for-newarks-water/


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/19/new-jersey-senate_n_3468270.html

In New Jersey Senate Election, Democrats Start Picking Sides
The Huffington Post | By John Celock
Posted: 06/19/2013 6:50 pm EDT | Updated: 06/19/2013 11:02 pm EDT


Newark Mayor Cory Booker picked up key backing in his bid for New Jersey's open U.S. Senate seat Wednesday, while one of his Democratic rivals is setting himself up as the anti-Booker.

Booker was endorsed Wednesday by 64 Democratic elected officials in South Jersey, including several of the most powerful Democrats in state government.

<>

Holt used a two-minute video to highlight his work in Congress and discuss his differences from Booker.

"I'll be the first to admit, I'm no Cory Booker," Holt said. "I don't have a million Twitter followers. I've never run into a burning building. I'm not friends with Mark Zuckerburg, though I did 'like' him on Facebook. I'm a teacher, a scientist and my most famous moment was beating the computer on Jeopardy."

Pallone announced backing from 21 Democratic leaders in Middlesex County, including two state senators and Assemblyman John Wisniewski (D-Sayreville), who was state Democratic Party chairman until last week. The endorsement list did not include Democratic gubernatorial nominee Barbara Buono, a Middlesex County state senator, who has not endorsed in the Senate race to date.

<>

http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2013/07/rush_holt_seeks_to_follow_his_fathers_footsteps_to_the_us_senate.html

Rush Holt runs for U.S. Senate, more than 70 years after his father served there

By Matt Friedman/The Star-Ledger
on July 07, 2013 at 6:00 AM, updated July 07, 2013 at 10:11 AM


TRENTON — Rep. Rush Holt Jr. had just finished giving a speech to environmentalists in Washington about 10 years ago when a stranger approached him.

"He came up to me and said: ‘You’re Rush Holt? I’ve been wanting to meet you,’ " Holt said. "He said: ‘My middle name is Rush. I’m named for your father.’ "

Holt (D-12th Dist.) did not know his father, Rush Holt Sr., for long. The elder Holt — an eccentric lifelong politician whose career peaked with a single term as a U.S. senator from West Virginia — died of cancer when his son was 6.

But throughout his life, Holt, 64, has learned about his namesake through people his father influenced decades ago — as well as their kids. The man who told Holt he was named after his father said it was because his own dad was a coal miner and "to his dying day said a coal miner never had a better friend than Rush Holt."

Now, Holt hopes to join the Senate himself, almost 73 years after his father left the office. He’s running as an underdog in the four-way Aug. 13 Democratic primary to succeed the late Sen. Frank Lautenberg (D-N.J.). The field includes Newark Mayor Cory Booker, the camera-friendly front-runner.

"Ultimately, people want a workhorse, not a show horse," Holt said of the race. "I’m not going to elaborate on that statement. Take it for what it’s worth."

<>


http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2013/07/oliver_begins_seeking_donations_for_us_senate_candidacy.html

Oliver begins seeking donations for U.S. Senate candidacy

By Matt Friedman/The Star-Ledger
on July 10, 2013 at 6:07 PM, updated July 10, 2013 at 6:09 PM


...A poll released yesterday showed Oliver getting 3 percent support among Democrats, compared to 52 percent for Newark Mayor Cory Booker, 10 percent for U.S. Rep. Frank Pallone (D-6th Dist.) and 8 percent for U.S. Rep. Rush Holt (D-12th Dist.).

<>

Waiting For Everyman

(9,385 posts)
19. Thank you, Rush Holt!
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 11:33 PM
Jul 2013

I hope the support you find surprises us all and is overwhelming. And I'm so pleased that a Dem is doing this.

 

mick063

(2,424 posts)
21. Just when you are about to completely give up on the party
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 11:47 PM
Jul 2013

A man like this pops up.

You can thank Holt for keeping my attention.

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
22. More info.
Wed Jul 10, 2013, 11:52 PM
Jul 2013
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/06/20/us-usa-congress-newjersey-idUSBRE95J13T20130620

New Jersey court clears the way for U.S. Senate special election

NEW YORK | Thu Jun 20, 2013 3:53pm EDT


(Reuters) - New Jersey's special election to fill the U.S. Senate seat left vacant by the death of Frank Lautenberg will go ahead this year as scheduled, after the state Supreme Court declined on Thursday to hear a legal challenge.

Governor Chris Christie, a Republican, ordered a special primary election on August 13 and a special general election to be held October 16 - three weeks before the regularly scheduled November election, when Christie himself is up for re-election.

Democrats accused Christie of making a political calculation, ensuring he would not appear on the same ballot as a race that might energize Democratic voters by authorizing a special election that will leave taxpayers with a $24 million tab.

In a one-page decision, Supreme Court Chief Justice Stuart Rabner denied the application by Somerset Democratic Chairwoman Peg Schaffer, who argued that Christie lacked the authority to set the October election.

<>

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
27. Please support Rush Holt for US Senate. The NJ primary is on August 13. Contributions welcome.
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 12:42 AM
Jul 2013

Last edited Thu Jul 11, 2013, 02:04 PM - Edit history (1)

See: http://www.rushholt.com


CAMPAIGN LAUNCH VIDEO





Terrific video!

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
29. @RushHolt to follow on Twitter
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 01:28 AM
Jul 2013

Last edited Thu Jul 11, 2013, 02:09 PM - Edit history (2)

See https://twitter.com/RushHolt and also https://www.facebook.com/RushHolt . Booker has several million followers, Holt 5k. PUMP IT UP!

http://www.politickernj.com/67068/holt-theres-nobody-i-know-who-can-run-campaign-i-can-maybe-close-pascrells?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Wake%20Up%20Call%20NJ&utm_campaign=Wake%20Up%20Call

Holt: 'There's nobody I know who can run a campaign like I can. Maybe close is Pascrell's'
By Max Pizarro | July 5th, 2013 - 11:52am


PLAINSBORO – You’d think it might get tiresome sometimes being Rush Holt trying to navigate in what is often perceived to be a dumbed-down profession, populated by those seeking to have beers with the world’s bar stool-bound sports fans sooner than discuss issues – let alone the fine points of quantum physics.

Yet even though Holt is a former Princeton University professor who revels in policy and rejoices in science, he has another side seldom appreciated by those outside the Central Jersey suburban spill-zone known as the 12th Congressional District.

Now running as a candidate for U.S. Senate in a field dominated by the uber-twittering Newark Mayor Cory Booker and complicated by the presence of Holt’s doppelganger, fellow progressive U.S. Rep. Frank Pallone (D-6), Holt is positioning himself not only as the progressive fighter, but as the battle-tested progressive fighter.

“My strategy in this race is to do everything we would ordinarily do in a campaign – only faster, better – concurrently - rather than sequentially,” he told PolitickerNJ.com this morning over coffee, a day after he hit seven counties on a campaign swing and two days after he went up on the web with another nimble web ad.

There’s a little more than a month left in this special election.

<>

proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
30. Rep. Rush Holt: When Big Brother Meets Big Data
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 02:01 AM
Jul 2013
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rep-rush-holt/government-surveillance-supercomputers_b_3510905.html

Rep. Rush Holt
U.S. Congressman from New Jersey's 12th distri
ct

When Big Brother Meets Big Data
Posted: 06/27/2013 12:17 pm


In 2011, shortly after IBM's supercomputer Watson defeated two human champions on the game show Jeopardy!, I had the chance to face off against the machine in a simulated match on Capitol Hill. I got lucky -- I won my round -- but I remember being awed at Watson's ability to draw upon massive troves of data to answer complex, unpredictable questions.

In the context of Jeopardy!, Watson was amusing and impressive. In the context of the machine's current efforts to treat lung cancer, Watson is inspiring. But there may be a dark side to Watson's abilities. The New York Times reported last week that, according to a government consultant, "Both the N.S.A. and the Central Intelligence Agency have been testing Watson in the last two years."

To me, this revelation adds a new layer of concern to disclosures that the NSA has, apparently, been recording the metadata on every phone call in the country.

Why is Watson's involvement so troubling? If the NSA truly possesses a record of every phone call made in the United States, that database would be so large as to be practically unusable by ordinary humans -- ensuring that law-abiding citizens could expect a degree of "privacy through obscurity." Watson-style technology has no difficulty sorting through billions of records, but in the end it's what the computer is told to look for that opens to door to error or even mischief.

<>

I raise this concern not as someone who fears technology. To the contrary, I am a research scientist, a patent-holder, and a great believer in the power of technology to create jobs and improve our lives. But our legal system is falling hopelessly behind the capabilities of our technology, and we must reform our laws to meet modern-day challenges.

Interestingly, a group of intrepid, patriotic public servants with real computer expertise and an understanding of the law showed us over a decade ago how all of this could be done without violating the privacy of American citizens.

In the early part of the last decade, a group of researchers at NSA developed a program called THINTHREAD that had the ability to sort through the mass of data NSA receives and pick out items requiring further attention -- all without compromising the Fourth Amendment rights of Americans. Unfortunately, their effort came to naught because of internal politics at NSA and competition from a Beltway-bandit boondoggle called TRAILBLAZER. The whole episode became public and ultimately led to a Defense Department Inspector General report, the declassified portions of which paint a damning picture of mismanagement at NSA and retaliation against Thomas Drake and others who reported these problems to the IG.

For the last several years, I have offered amendments to either the annual defense policy or intelligence authorization bills to protect whistleblowers like Drake, and every time the current House majority has refused to even allow those amendments to be considered on the House floor. Real oversight of the intelligence community is impossible so long as the Thomas Drakes of our national security establishment are treated like criminals instead of the public servants they are. Getting those kinds of protections into law remains one of my top legislative priorities.

<>

Rep. Rush Holt (D-NJ) represents New Jersey's 12th Congressional District. He is a former member of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence and the former chairman of the House Select Intelligence Oversight Panel.

Californeeway

(97 posts)
31. I'm all for getting rid of the Patriot Act
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 02:04 AM
Jul 2013

Do people have a realistic appraisal of how big of a political fight it will be?

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
37. "Do people have a realistic appraisal of how big of a political fight it will be?"
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 04:37 PM
Jul 2013

Do we have anything more important to do?

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
32. And go back to the days when police who wanted to bust wheelchair ridden marijuana patients
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 02:12 AM
Jul 2013

had to deal with unacceptably inconveniencing levels of red tape and pesky 4th Amendment annoyances always getting in the way of the immensely satisfying experience of hauling a chemo-sick granny off to a prison cell, by what little hair she had left?






Ohhhh, Let the terrorists win, whydoncha.



proverbialwisdom

(4,959 posts)
34. EMAIL: New video up with your help 12:12 PM (2 hours ago)
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 02:48 PM
Jul 2013

Friend,

I don’t have a million Twitter followers, and I don’t have the financial backing of Wall Street or Hollywood. I’m about substance, not celebrity. I rely on the contributions of many individual supporters like you to fund my campaigns.

Here’s how you can help, right now. Take a look at my latest video calling out Wall Street for its computerized speculation, how they are undermining our financial system and harming hard-working people trying to save for retirement.



TRANSCRIPT:

These days, most stock trades aren’t made by human beings. They’re made by supercomputers that flip stocks in fractions of a second, helping bankers get rich quick. And every dollar the computers win is a dollar you lose. Even worse, high-speed trading is destabilizing our financial system. It helped cause the “flash crash” that once destroyed a trillion dollars of wealth in minutes.

So let’s fix the problem. Let’s create a small speculation tax: a fraction of a penny on every share of stock bought or sold. Those of us who invest for the long term will never notice the cost. But from Wall Street speculators, we’ll raise hundreds of billions of dollars – money that we can invest in our roads, bridges, schools, energy research, our social safety net, and more. Most Democrats are afraid to support a transaction tax. But the computers on Wall Street are beating the rest of us up – so I say, let’s fight back.

-Rush Holt

It is one in a series we are rolling out driving home the message that bold ideas are needed…bold ideas are what matter. Help me get them up on the air today!

Please contribute $25 right now to put the campaign on the air!

For the past 15 years, I have been one of the strongest progressive voices in Congress:

I voted against the war in Iraq
I voted against unwarranted spying on Americans;
I have been leading the fight to repeal the Patriot Act;

I have been a strong voice for the environment with the best lifetime rating the League of Conservation Voters offers, because I have fought aggressively to protect the air we breathe, the water we drink, and the land we cherish.
Please contribute $25 right now to put the campaign on the air!

With only 33 days until the August 13th special Senate primary election, your support is needed now more than ever. Today, we are opening field offices across New Jersey, mailing voters across the state, and about to go up on the air with television ads. This campaign is moving at an incredible speed, and so must my fundraising.

Please contribute $25 right now to put the campaign on the air!

If you would rather mail a check you can send your contribution to PO Box 782, Pennington, NJ 08534.

It means a lot to have the strong support of so many individuals like you for my campaign for the U.S. Senate. With your help, we will win on August 13th. Thank you.

Sincerely,

Rush

indepat

(20,899 posts)
38. Good luck on that one for the so called Patriot Act does not have a snowball's chance
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 05:54 PM
Jul 2013

in hell of being repealed while the permanent war on terra is raging.

BlueCheese

(2,522 posts)
49. Whatever one may think of Edward Snowden or Glenn Greenwald...
Thu Jul 11, 2013, 06:42 PM
Jul 2013

... there's no way this happens without all the disclosures of the last month.

Something to think about for those who want to see Snowden disappeared into a Supermax for the next 60 years.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Rep. Rush Holt (D-NJ) Wil...