Change one known fact about Trayvon Martin -

[hedgehog]

Make him a white kid living with his dad and dad's fiancee while on school suspension.

Consider how Zimmerman's story plays out now.

[FormalObserver]

1. I don't understand........

What point are you making? We can't make him anything he isn't, and if we were to do that wouldn't we make him alive?

[bigwillq]

3. I would make him alive as well.

Or Chinese.

[Bucky]

19. Why do you hate Chinese?

I'm sorry, I seem to have lost my focus there....

[bigwillq]

21. I don't.

But the OP thinks the trial would go differently if trayvon were white. What if he were chinese? Arab? Mexican?
Something to think about.

[Lex]

5. I see abstract thinking is not your thing.

I understand. Sometimes some people don't develop an understanding of abstract, hypothetical thinking very well in their cognitive development.

[FormalObserver]

8. No I get it, thank you.

But if Trayvon were white, would Zim have shot him? It's a silly hypothetical. I know, what if Trayvon weren't suspended from school? Would he still be alive? What if, what if, what if..... What if George Zimmerman were black? Would this story hit the news?

[EOTE]

9. If George Zimmerman were black, I don't know if this story would have made news.

It probably would have. One thing is damned near certain, though. He'd be on death row right now and he WOULDN'T have legions of followers excusing what he did like he does now. It's not silly to think these things out, it's very important. It's silly to dismiss them.

[Lex]

10. Agreed. It's important to ask these questions of ourselves, it's how we learn

and how we assess our actions as a community and as a society. Some people have a hard time with this type of critical, abstract thinking.

[FormalObserver]

16. I see that "abstract" thinking is your "thing"

I doubt you have any others.

[Lex]

20. Welcome to DU. Enjoy your stay.

You really are making quite an impression I assure you.

[exboyfil]

11. See Dooley case (black man shooting white man during altercation)

Actually gun nuts came down on Dooley's side. Guns trump race.

[EOTE]

12. Guns may trump race as far as gun nuts are concerned.

But there's no doubt that the media treats cases very differently depending on the race of those involved.

[Scuba]

14. Ya think?

[DevonRex]

13. Zimmerman would not have profiled a white kid

walking in that neighborhood as "suspicious."

[Scootaloo]

27. It's less likely Zimmerman would have thought him "suspicious"

And if he had shot the child anyway, the Media would be talking about a crazy hispanic man gunning down an unarmed student. DU wouldn't have throngs of people lining up to carry water for Zimmerman. Zimmerman's lawyers wouldn't be attemping a character assassination "defense" - or if they did, it wouldn't circle around the child being "a thug."

Change the skin tone, and you change the entire thrust of the event, and realize just how big a factor race still is, not just with htis particular trial, but in the way our society operates.

[Drale]

2. He would have been tried, convicted and executed already. /nt

[MattBaggins]

23. No because he wouldn't have stalked a white kid

He probably would have hunted down another black kid though and we would be back at square one.

[exboyfil]

4. The Dooley Manslaughter

conviction is instructive. I think this case should have the same result (unless it can be conclusively proven that Martin begged for help and not Zimmerman - then it is murder). A hot head with a gun escalated a situation for no good reason.

You are right about the race. If my 17 year old daughter was confronted by a nut while walking home at night, I would instruct her to do everything in her power to avoid the situation and defend herself if necessary. Her being white, female, and unarmed; Zimmerman would go to jail for life if he ended up shooting her.

[hedgehog]

6. I was unfamiliar with that case, but it's a good comparison:

http://www.tampabay.com/news/courts/criminal/jury-finds-trevor-dooley-guilty-in-manslaughter-case/1262347

It offers a second thought experiment: what if Trayvon had been white, and Zimmerman black?

[NCTraveler]

7. No one would have been shot.

Zimmerman would have waved at him as he walked through the neighborhood.

[librechik]

15. interestin --along the same lines, in another thread: what if Trayvon was a female?

the pursuit would have seemed so much more threatening and the fight back so much more reasonable. But a young black male is fair game, I guess.

[hedgehog]

17. I didn't see the thread, but it certainly illustrates the point!

[uponit7771]

22. +1

[JI7]

18. i am so disgusted by Zimmerman and his fucked up family

let me tell you, if you see some creepy thug following you and then the fucker gets out and starts to run after you what the fuck are you supposed to do ?

really, if it was anyone but a black male would there be any discussion here ?

just the fact that people are taking that thug's side shows me it's racism.

[MattBaggins]

25. We have a few right here on DU

who feel that Trayvon had no reasonable fear of someone who was chasing him yet Zimmerman had reasonable fear from someone who was trying to get away from him.

The people who seem to support Zimmerman are all huggers from the Gungeon.. Coincidence?

[JI7]

26. many of them are the same ones and i never see most of them

in any other discussion. i think most are actually republicans. or maybe ron paul types. but i really don't think they hold liberal positions on any issue.

[egduj]

24. Or what if the races were reversed...

What if George Zimmerman was black and Trayvon Martin was Hispanic? How do you think it would be playing out then?