Hello, DU! Here’s your Friday Afternoon Challenge: Double Take!

[CTyankee]

Here are three pairs of “double takes” grouped together for you to identify!

and please do not cheat and “guess”.....play fair, folks...
1a.
[IMG][/IMG]
1b.
[IMG][/IMG]

2a.
[IMG][/IMG]
2b.
[IMG][/IMG]

3a.
[IMG][/IMG]
3b.
[IMG][/IMG]

[Lochloosa]

1. First two Chagall?

[kentuck]

4. Looks like Cezanne?

or one of them thar impressionists.

[joeybee12]

9. I think so too...maybe the second is Renoir?

[CTyankee]

13. no cezanne here...

[CTyankee]

7. not Chagall...

[NMDemDist2]

2. what am i supposed to look for?? what's a 'double take'? n/t

[WheelWalker]

3. You and me, both... nt

[CTyankee]

6. Please see my explanation at #5. my apologies for not being clearer...

and less lame!

[Tansy_Gold]

20. Two interpretations of the same thing, or

one copies another.

I'm stumped, however.

1 & 2 are Impressionist, I think???? but I can't find anything like them on a google search.

Something about #5 suggests Chicago to me, but other than that, I haven't a clue.

[CTyankee]

22. yes to both interpretations and copies...

[CTyankee]

5. sorry. I meant when you see one of the two it looks a lot like the other!

So one artist did one and another artist did the other. They look very similar. Can you identify each one?

That was my aim here. I'm sorry if I confused you folks...

these are all very famous works of art/architecture.

[elleng]

8. Thanks, yank!

Lets take a boat trip (oops, you've already done that!) and lets keep going!

[CTyankee]

12. love to! But home for the duration of hubby's post op recuperation...

[elleng]

17. OK, OK, whatever you say!!!

[CTyankee]

18. I'll email you! stay tuned!

[elleng]

24. TUNED!

[librechik]

10. Ones: Renoir and Cezanne?

[CTyankee]

11. keep going. you're not there...yet...

[librechik]

14. ones: Renoir and Monet

[CTyankee]

16. in that order?

[librechik]

19. yes

of course (i hope)

[CTyankee]

21. and you know why? (simple actually)...

[librechik]

25. what's the trick?

I just know Renoir's style and then I recognized the Monetgarden water

[CTyankee]

28. Look at the water...I think (not sure) that that is the difference...

[catnhatnh]

15. 1a and 1b look like something from one of the "net" twins...

either "Mo" or "Ma".....

[CTyankee]

23. who are they?

[Tansy_Gold]

26. 3a -- A church in the US, possibly Anglican/Episcopalian based on the flags????

I still have no idea where it is, but I managed to figure out part of the lettering:


. . . truly to believe and to preach thy (word). Grant we beseech thee unto thy church . . . and both to preach. . . .


and now it's time to feed the dogs.

[CTyankee]

30. You are getting there, but the words are not the key to what is the "double" of the

double take. As a matter of fact, I can't even locate those words...

[Tansy_Gold]

31. I thought the words might have some specific denominational or historical meaning

They're on the very top edge of the "ground floor" of the building. I had to zoom in to make out even that much.

[CTyankee]

32. what language were they in? English?

[Tansy_Gold]

34. yep, clear as day when you zoom in!

By the flag I suspected it was an Anglican church, so of course the words would be in English. I just had to crop and resize until I coul make them out.

[Tansy_Gold]

33. AHA!

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/08/realestate/08scap.html

3a is St Barthomew's, New York, built in 1918
and I'm assuming 3b is the church from St-Gilles on which Stanford White based his design. I haven't located that pic yet.



once again -- churches and art I know NOTHING about, but the words WERE a clue -- because the phrase is associated with St. Bartholomew. From there, I let google do the rest.



ETA

Had to rely on my French to overcome the goog's autocorrect.

Benedictine Abbey Saint-Gilles-du-Gard

http://www.medart.pitt.edu/menufrance/sgilles/sgilmain.html


Second edit to add the info on St. Bart --

http://justus.anglican.org/resources/bio/234.html

Almighty and everlasting God, who didst give to thine apostle Bartholomew grace truly to believe and to preach thy Word: Grant that thy Church may love what he believed and preach what he taught; through Jesus Christ our Lord, who liveth and reigneth with thee and the Holy Ghost, one God for ever and ever.


Also, I have in my library a copy of Whitney Stoddard's "Art & Architecture in Medieval France" (1972) and Saint-Gilles-du-Gard is one of the examples featured.

[CTyankee]

36. Tansy, I don't know how to zoom in on lettering like that. Can you clue me in?

But this is exactly right.

I learned of this in David McCullough's fine book, "A Greater Journey", which was about Americans who came to Paris in the 19th century. Sanford White was one of them and he was so impressed when he went to Nimes, France with that church, he incorporated its design in the first St. Barts in NYC. When that church was taken down and a new church envisioned, the church managers specified that the portals of White were to be retained and included in the church at the new site.

It is the Church of Saint-Gilles, by the way, in Nimes. It happened to be right at the start of the Compestela de Santiago in Spain, the Way of St. James, a major pilgrimage site in Christendom. This church dates from the 12th century.

What a fabulous story!

[Tansy_Gold]

43. zooming and Santiago de Compostela

I right clicked and copied the pic from the thread into PhotoShop elements. Then cropped to get just the section where the lettering is. Then resized the image to make it bigger.

It probably would have been easier just to right click, then save the pic to a file and look at it in Windows Explorer (NOT Internet Explorer) and zoom in, but I did it the hard way.


I started my college career in 1966 as a Spanish major, after four years of HS Spanish in which we got a LOT of cultural background. So I had a smattering of the history. Then shortly after my return from six weeks in southern Spain in 1969, I discovered James Michener's "Iberia," which devotes a lengthy section to Santiago de Compostela. I've worn out three paperback copies of Iberia, still have a fourth on hand in fairly decent condition, refer to it frequently. It was easier to reach than "Art & Architecture of Medieval France."

And yes, I do have a lot of . . . . diverse items in my library!

[Aerows]

27. Wow, I have no idea

But this weeks challenge is awesome. I especially like the first two as a "double take". Just wonderful. Thank you so much for posting this. I'm not the most artistically inclined of people but I truly enjoy these. You really help me expand my horizons, CT

[CTyankee]

29. you are a sweetheart, aerows!

thanks for the kind words.

Actually, the second and third are kinda awesome, but to me, mostly the 3rd!

[Generic Other]

35. Is one of these Trinity Church in Boston?

Just a total wild guess.

[CTyankee]

38. No, it has been guessed as St. Bartholomew's in New York City.

Kind of a fabulous story here...

[Generic Other]

41. Both are Romanesque, right?

So the other must be St. Gilles du Gard, Provence. I recognize the doors.

[CTyankee]

45. Oh, yes! St. Gilles du Gard in Nimes! Good for you!

Are you an architect? Aren't those doors spectacular! No wonder Sanford White was so crazy about them! But do tell me your engagement with them. I'd love to know the story!

[Tansy_Gold]

51. Wait a minute! I didn't "guess"!

I researched. I analysed and examined and figured it out, but I never just guessed.

(slightly miffed, but only kidding, of course)

[CTyankee]

56. Of course, you are right! My apologies. I love that you did the research.

I'm actually more interested in promoting people's interest in art than I am in stumping them. I love to hear how they researched the answers and am always amazed and in awe of their research techniques. I find myself saying "I never thought of that" when I learn what they did.
If anything, I'm the one who just "guesses" at answers to stuff (like Jeopardy questions) and come to find out how wrong my guesses have been!

You did a masterful research job. I doff my cap to you, Tansy!

[trof]

37. This is GD subject matter? Belongs in The Lounge.

[CTyankee]

39. well, that has been up to the people who make these decisions and they have approved this in GD.

nt

[trof]

40. Yeah, true. I think they're on a coffee break.

[Generic Other]

42. We have been doing these in GD forever!

Quit being a spoil sport. Identify the pictures or accept defeat!

[trof]

57. Locking. "spoil sport" posts belong in the Sports group.

[CTyankee]

44. OK, so we have 2a and 2b not guessed! What?

Hint: they are in two very different European countries.

[Tansy_Gold]

46. I already donated my afternoon to the cause of 3a and 3b.

Looks like you stumped us, CT!

[CTyankee]

47. Naw, I never do that! But I DO thank you for your effort. Was it worth it?

[Tansy_Gold]

49. Oh, most definitely worth it!

I'm currently reading a "biography" of Chicago, research related to a novel I'm thinking about. Stanford White designed a number of Gilded Age mansions in Chicago, and McKim, Mead and White was one of the firms engaged to design the World's Columbian Exposition of 1893. So the research for today's Challenge gave me an extra bit of insight, even though ultimately nothing I picked up today may end up in the novel.

(then again, the novel may never get written if I don't quit foolin' around on DU!)

[CTyankee]

48. OK, hint on 2a and 2b: A Queen wanted one of these copied for her own country.

[Iterate]

50. This one has been driving me mad all evening.

It's familiar, but not quite at hand. I hope you don't mistake lack of guesses for lack of interest.

It may come down to a brute force guessing game.

Can we safely say that 2a is on British soil?

[pinboy3niner]

52. Oh, go ahead and take a guess--just like Tansy

Good to see you here, cuz!

[Iterate]

53. Well hey der.

Good to see you cuz!

Ya, that last one was interesting, starting out with wondering "Who would have a variant of St. Georges Cross for a flag?" I lost out at the end by taking a long and unnecessary retracing of St. Bartholomew's path through Armenian churches in eastern Turkey, some in India, and a few Eastern Orthodox ones for good measure, then went back to NY to check the architect of St. Bartholomew's, arriving in France a bit too late. Such is your fate when you know little of art history and just a smidgen of everything else. That was a good pair of shoes worn through.

I'll have to give up on the last one though. Staying up all night is for idiots.

Say, I saw those DUzys, congrats! I could also see that some of the others must have been written by you, so that tells me you've got a new side business going, writing DUzys. Is there any money in it?

Oh well, it's late. Prost! and be well.

[Iterate]

54. Ok, I see now where my assumtions were wrong, completely wrong.

After a little closer look at the images, I knew how far off I was with a poorly remembered story.

And a minute later I found it, but only by the worst kind of dumb luck, completely unintended. So I'll leave it at that for others to enjoy with their morning coffee.

Or I could say:
"I have discovered a truly marvelous demonstration of this proposition which this margin is too narrow to contain."

[CTyankee]

55. Good for you! I can't wait to read what you have to say!

The journey is the best part of learning stuff. I came across this particular "double take" by sheer accident and one thing led to another and another. Fascinating.

But I'll not tell the answer and wait for your retelling of your discovery!

[Iterate]

58. 2a and 2b are...

more easily solved than people think.

I thought someone else might recognize it in the morning and answer, but since no one has, here it is with its awkwardly arrived conclusion.

I had picked out a few elements from the motif in 2a and did what our little primate brains must do, which is to force a narrative, however wrong, onto a few observations when the background is strong and observations are thin. As an aside, I think that bit of metacognition alone qualifies your weekly thread for GD, because it's what people do here, argue a narrative that explains an observation.

In this case the "background" was a biennial immersion into British history. I had seen the image, and I read it this time as 18th or early 19th century and British. Needless to say, it was quite a challenge to give it more context than that. So I gave up. It was the right move.

Looking again, the level of refinement, a queen who copies, collects art, and isn't Prussian, a crucifix at the end of a marble hall, I mindlessly went to the Hermitage site.

2a is the The Raphael Loggias in the Hermitage. I'll let the site do the heavy lifting of describing it:

"This splendid gallery is a reproduction of Raphael's celebrated Loggias, erected in the Vatican Palace and painted by Raphael and his pupils. The Hermitage copy of the Vatican frescoes was produced in tempera by a group of artists under Cristopher Unterberger. The vaults of the gallery are decorated with paintings based upon Biblical stories. The walls are covered with human and animal forms interwoven with flowers and foliage. Such decorative ornamentation was found in the ruins of Nero's Golden House and was called grotesques. The Raphael Loggias in the Hermitage reveal the links of 18th-century Classicism with Renaissance and Classical art. "

Link with panoramic view:
http://www.hermitagemuseum.org/html_En/08/hm88_0_1_31.html

2b is the copied Loggia by Raphael in the Apostolic Palace in Rome. There's much more to his story, but time is short,

It only makes sense that the neoclassical would be part of a "double-take".

Thanks so much for these threads. You never know what people will learn from your posting.

[CTyankee]

59. wonderful explanation!

I really knew nothing about these loggias (or loggie since I'm guessing that's an Italian word). I found them by researching "art in palaces" for a future Challenge. When I Googled the Winter Palace I saw them listed and thought "that's strange. A Raphael work in St. Petersburg?" Then I read that it was a copy of the original in the Vatican. Again. I was mystified and thought "Damn! How is it I missed this when I was in the Vatican Museum?" Then I read that it was not open to the public and felt relieved that I hadn't blanked out on my art trip to Rome in 06!

A short time later I was reading "The Greater Journey" by McCullough and he tells the story of Sanford White being so inspired with the portal of Saint-Gilles church in Nimes that he copied it for his portal of St. Bart's in NYC. So I pulled together a new Challenge, remembering the story of how Renoir and Monet painted La Grenouillere side by side and recalling how at the time the two separate works resembled each other! So I added them. (I had considered adding Rubens and Titian's versions of "Rape of Europa" but didn't want to use up more than my share of bandwidth with 8 instead of 6 images -- I'm funny that way.)

It was a fun process. In truth, I did expect that the savvy art folks here at DU would "get" the paintings pretty fast and frankly it would be easy to find the portals once you knew that the Episcopal Church was in NYC. I thought the loggias would be harder because that term is not a very common one to describe a hallway. But I'm sure there are a few people here who have been in the Hermitage Museum (I wish I had!).

I very much value the conversations I have with DUers on these Challenges. I learn a lot! I do try to make these weekly Challenges interesting.

Another one next week, if you want to join in!

[Aerows]

60. Fantastic explanation

I learn so much from these challenges.

[CTyankee]

61. So do I, as you can tell from that story...

designing these challenges makes me challenge myself to learn more. It's the upside of my art "addiction"!!

[Aerows]

62. Well, sooner or later your are going to infect me

with an "art addiction" LOL. I really love the Friday challenges. I love it when you do architecture. You have an ability to showcase architecture that I can't help but appreciate.

It doesn't hurt that I'm ten times more likely to recognize architecture than I am painting. I was a frequent visitor of the New Orleans Museum of Art simply because it was by my college, and it had gorgeous landscaping.

EDIT: and the Salvador Dali Museum in St. Pete, FL. The Man Ray exhibit was fantastic.

[CTyankee]

63. thanks for your story. It's the "real" reason I run the Challenge.

I just love the online conversations I have with DUers about their own interaction with art.

You wouldn't believe how many art blogs there are out there in cyberspace. I run into them by accident and when I first started to encounter them I would bookmark them. It got to where I had to stop because I was losing track of which was which. People blog about their own experiences with art and speak from their hearts about them. I find them gentle places to be. I want my little Friday challenge to be a "gentle place" here on DU...

[Aerows]

64. Art is my gentle place

I have visited a few museums, and I love them for the way they make me feel so pleased that we as human beings can do such wonderful things.

I write, but I'm humbled by the sculpture, painting and architecture our fellow human beings have created, just for us to behold.

[CTyankee]

67. Any great art can humble you, IMO, whether it be the written word, the concerto, the ballet or

the play or film that stuns, humbles and renders you almost unable to speak...

[entanglement]

65. 1a) looks like a Renoir

Do I get partial credit?

[CTyankee]

66. It IS Renoir!

Of course you get partial credit!

[entanglement]

68. Yay

Renoir was on my mind because I'd recently seen this interesting link "who's who in Renoir's 'Boating Party'"

http://www.phillipscollection.org/collection/boating/whoswho.aspx

identifying the subjects in that famous work.

As an aside, thank you for your "Friday Afternoon Challenge" thread. I really enjoy it, despite being neither an artist nor an art critic.

[CTyankee]

69. I LOVE "boating party"!

This tells you that for Renoir it was more about the people than the atmospherics. That is why you see Monet's version concentrate much more on the water and less on the people. With Renoir you see more interest in the interaction of the people on the little islet.

Your gaze is perceptive indeed!

And I think you for your kind words about the Challenge. Please come back...