HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » Firearms in homes save li...
Introducing Discussionist: A new forum by the creators of DU

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:20 PM

Firearms in homes save lives?

Wondering what the board's general feel on this is, after another thread.

(EDITING: I'm thinking of privately-owned firearms in someone's home, not Police, just to be clear.)
15 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
Never. Categorically, no
2 (13%)
Yes, but not as many as they kill
6 (40%)
Yes, but it's too complex to make simplistic comparisons
7 (47%)
Yes, and it's more people than they kill
0 (0%)
Yes, and it's not more people than they kill, but it's still "worth it"
0 (0%)
I'm stopping a home invasion with one right now
0 (0%)
You're a delicate flower or Gollum or whatever it is this week and need to go away
0 (0%)
Show usernames
Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

17 replies, 968 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 17 replies Author Time Post
Reply Firearms in homes save lives? (Original post)
Recursion Feb 2013 OP
The Magistrate Feb 2013 #1
Recursion Feb 2013 #2
The Magistrate Feb 2013 #4
Recursion Feb 2013 #6
The Magistrate Feb 2013 #8
Recursion Feb 2013 #9
The Magistrate Feb 2013 #10
ellisonz Feb 2013 #14
B Calm Feb 2013 #3
safeinOhio Feb 2013 #5
raidert05 Feb 2013 #7
krispos42 Feb 2013 #12
jpak Feb 2013 #11
jazzimov Feb 2013 #13
TheCowsCameHome Feb 2013 #15
Recursion Feb 2013 #17
etherealtruth Feb 2013 #16

Response to Recursion (Original post)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:25 PM

1. Taken As A Whole, Sir, Demonstrably Not

The increased risk of death by fire-arm associated with possession of a fire-arm makes it quite clear widespread ownership of guns costs more lives than they might have saved.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to The Magistrate (Reply #1)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:26 PM

2. I don't know that we have even an inkling of the contrafactual data

I'm inclined to agree that they kill more than "would have" died had there been no defensive use of firearms, but that's not really a question that can be answered well.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Recursion (Reply #2)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:31 PM

4. The Numbers Give A Sufficient Basis To State It Without Reasonable Doubt, Sir

In an environment where murders comprise less than half the deaths owing to firearms, you would have to demonstrate that something on the order of two murders were stopped by privately owned firearms for every murder consumated, and that is just not supportable.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to The Magistrate (Reply #4)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:33 PM

6. Only if you assume all suicides would not have found another means

That's still the plurality of firearms deaths, IIRC the majority of firearms deaths in the home.

Accidents, I grant, would be completely eradicated if there were no firearms in homes. (Accidents in the home, at least.)

Let me see if I can find those actual numbers...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Recursion (Reply #6)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:36 PM

8. In Most Instances They Probably Would Not, Sir

Few means are as certain, and none are so available as a gun ready to hand.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to The Magistrate (Reply #8)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:37 PM

9. Most successful by method is prescription drug OD, I think?

But not everybody has access to those, either.

But, like I said, my inclination is to agree with you, however there are so many "what ifs" that I took the "too complex" option.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Recursion (Reply #9)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:41 PM

10. Much To Open Too Intervention, Sir

You can take a fist-full of phenobarbitol on a pint of whiskey and still wake up in a hospital, not in heaven or hell. It is true people sometimes manage to botch shooting themselves in the head, of course, but it is much more immediately lethal.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to The Magistrate (Reply #1)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 07:46 PM

14. +1

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Recursion (Original post)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:29 PM

3. If guns make us safe, then

with all our guns, why isn't the United States the safest country in the world?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to B Calm (Reply #3)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:32 PM

5. Bingo

Hard to argue with that.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to B Calm (Reply #3)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:34 PM

7. maybe...

 

We gots more of them there crazies and drugs on the loose in 'merica

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to B Calm (Reply #3)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 07:05 PM

12. Or the most violent?

Hmmm...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Recursion (Original post)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 06:48 PM

11. Dumb poll

yup

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Recursion (Original post)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 07:08 PM

13. WTF kind of poll is this?

One option for NO that is absolutist, and several answers for YES with qualifications?

And opinions don't overcome facts. Look at the stats.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to jazzimov (Reply #13)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 07:49 PM

15. Looks like something from Fox or Newsmax.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to jazzimov (Reply #13)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 09:18 PM

17. In retrospect, that's a fair point

If you can come up with a "no, but..." I'll add it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Recursion (Original post)

Sat Feb 2, 2013, 07:52 PM

16. Not worth the risk for me and my family! n/t

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread