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Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:39 PM

SO HELP ME GOD = AZ Legislators Want to Require High School Graduates to Recite a Loyalty Oath

Certain AZ Legislators Want High Schoolers to Recite a Loyalty Oath Before Graduating
Posted by David Mendez on Wed, Jan 23, 2013
http://www.tucsonweekly.com/TheRange/archives/2013/01/23/certain-az-legislators-want-high-schoolers-to-recite-a-loyalty-oath-before-graduating

... HB 2467, a proposed measure sponsored by seven legislators (six representatives and a senator) ....

... the bill's text:

BEGINNING IN THE 2013‑2014 SCHOOL YEAR, IN ADDITION TO FULFILLING THE COURSE OF STUDY AND ASSESSMENT REQUIREMENTS PRESCRIBED IN THIS CHAPTER, BEFORE A PUPIL IS ALLOWED TO GRADUATE FROM A PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL IN THIS STATE, THE PRINCIPAL OR HEAD TEACHER OF THE SCHOOL SHALL VERIFY IN WRITING THAT THE PUPIL HAS RECITED THE FOLLOWING OATH:

I, _________, DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR THAT I WILL SUPPORT AND DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES AGAINST ALL ENEMIES, FOREIGN AND DOMESTIC, THAT I WILL BEAR TRUE FAITH AND ALLEGIANCE TO THE SAME; THAT I TAKE THIS OBLIGATION FREELY, WITHOUT ANY MENTAL RESERVATION OR PURPOSE OF EVASION; AND THAT I WILL WELL AND FAITHFULLY DISCHARGE THESE DUTIES; SO HELP ME GOD.


... you're swearing that you're taking an oath freely when you're being coerced into taking the damn thing, again, in order to graduate. I'm pretty sure that makes the rest of the oath invalid, doesn't it? .....

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Reply SO HELP ME GOD = AZ Legislators Want to Require High School Graduates to Recite a Loyalty Oath (Original post)
Coyotl Jan 2013 OP
hrmjustin Jan 2013 #1
maui902 Jan 2013 #91
0rganism Jan 2013 #2
ChisolmTrailDem Jan 2013 #4
Coyotl Jan 2013 #21
ck4829 Jan 2013 #5
progressoid Jan 2013 #18
gollygee Jan 2013 #63
lunasun Jan 2013 #85
fishwax Jan 2013 #88
2naSalit Jan 2013 #3
Sadiedog Jan 2013 #75
2naSalit Jan 2013 #78
Sadiedog Jan 2013 #89
ck4829 Jan 2013 #6
nobodyspecial Jan 2013 #7
hifiguy Jan 2013 #42
riqster Jan 2013 #82
sadbear Jan 2013 #8
santamargarita Jan 2013 #9
onenote Jan 2013 #10
Buzz Clik Jan 2013 #11
immoderate Jan 2013 #77
longship Jan 2013 #12
NightWatcher Jan 2013 #13
Fumesucker Jan 2013 #48
barbtries Jan 2013 #14
2naSalit Jan 2013 #80
Jennicut Jan 2013 #15
enlightenment Jan 2013 #27
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #35
enlightenment Jan 2013 #45
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #69
enlightenment Jan 2013 #74
Demo_Chris Jan 2013 #16
Initech Jan 2013 #17
Coyotl Jan 2013 #22
rurallib Jan 2013 #19
Hekate Jan 2013 #24
white_wolf Jan 2013 #20
Coyotl Jan 2013 #23
Mr.Bill Jan 2013 #31
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #36
white_wolf Jan 2013 #37
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #71
Rex Jan 2013 #25
kimbutgar Jan 2013 #29
Mosby Jan 2013 #34
kimbutgar Jan 2013 #43
Mosby Jan 2013 #51
Coyotl Jan 2013 #59
dbackjon Jan 2013 #73
kimbutgar Jan 2013 #83
MADem Jan 2013 #87
dbackjon Jan 2013 #90
patrice Jan 2013 #26
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #55
Ash_F Jan 2013 #28
Aristus Jan 2013 #30
JDPriestly Jan 2013 #32
KamaAina Jan 2013 #40
JDPriestly Jan 2013 #44
gtar100 Jan 2013 #33
hifiguy Jan 2013 #38
Fumesucker Jan 2013 #50
JoePhilly Jan 2013 #39
Blue Idaho Jan 2013 #41
tanyev Jan 2013 #46
Swede Atlanta Jan 2013 #47
legaleagle_45 Jan 2013 #49
Coyotl Jan 2013 #60
arely staircase Jan 2013 #52
Sekhmets Daughter Jan 2013 #53
Politicalboi Jan 2013 #54
HockeyMom Jan 2013 #56
winter is coming Jan 2013 #57
DirkGently Jan 2013 #58
Viking12 Jan 2013 #61
FiveGoodMen Jan 2013 #62
Arcanetrance Jan 2013 #64
Angry Dragon Jan 2013 #65
Downtown Hound Jan 2013 #66
Fresh_Start Jan 2013 #67
avebury Jan 2013 #68
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #70
dbackjon Jan 2013 #72
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #76
Bennyboy Jan 2013 #79
benld74 Jan 2013 #81
KoKo Jan 2013 #84
RKP5637 Jan 2013 #86
iemitsu Jan 2013 #92

Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:41 PM

1. What the hell is up with these people?

This should be stopped by the courts.

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Response to hrmjustin (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:51 PM

91. Unlikely to be passed

So hopefully won't need courts to intervene, costing AZ taxpayers even more in legal costs. Republican state lawmaker also introduced bill to reimburse costs of recall election to Russell Pearce, the person behind the controversial anti-Senate Bill 1070, even though all of the funds Pearce used in opposing (and losing) the recall were donated. In other words, at least one Republican state legislator wants Arizona taxpayers to reimburse funds to a recalled Republican legislator even though it wasn't his money he spent. But do not despair. Slowly but surely, Arizona is turning younger and more diverse, and the state will eventually go blue despite the best efforts of old Republican white men to prevent that inevitability.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:44 PM

2. "I TAKE THIS OBLIGATION FREELY"

How is it possible to put a statement like this into a mandatory oath?

Apparently, "freely" means something very different to some people.

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Response to 0rganism (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:46 PM

4. Beat me to it. That exactly what I was thinking before I

even scrolled down to see your comment.

The right wing pigs are so fucking stupid it burns.

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:31 PM

21. Sometimes stupid is a horrible Catch-22

You do all these stupid things because stupid does as stupid is so you don't know they are stupid

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Response to 0rganism (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:49 PM

5. You are free to use whatever pitch or tone you want I guess?

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Response to 0rganism (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:17 PM

18. No kidding.









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Response to 0rganism (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:02 PM

63. ROFL that was my first thought too

Are these kids graduating high school or entering the Marine Corps?

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Response to gollygee (Reply #63)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 09:11 PM

85. Notice what part they left out of this military oath

>obey all orders from the president of the United States.
What a joke AZ has truly become and isnt their education rating low/? seems like the $$ and time spent to push this could be better spent
http://cronkitenewsonline.com/2012/01/arizona-schools-finish-near-bottom-in-national-ranking/

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Response to 0rganism (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 09:48 PM

88. indeed n/t

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:45 PM

3. What a crock

and this is a portion of the oath of office that federal employees take upon placement on at their post. These kids aren't getting a job, this is a ruse to try and enforce their draconian laws after graduation and should be against any number of laws as it has no other intent than create a hostile environment within which entrapment can take place. Nice try shitbaggers, but no cigar.

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:15 PM

75. What Federal employees?

I ask because I technically am a federal employee but have never had to say such an oath. Do you mean Legislators? Just curious.

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Response to Sadiedog (Reply #75)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:34 PM

78. Actually lots of federal employees.

All the NPS employees I know along with all who work for USFS, USDA, I had to take it a bunch of times working as a low level peaen fo the USCB (census)... and a bunch of others including elected office holders and some others I can't think of at the moment.

I'm surprised you didn't, what kind of work do you do?

Here are the oaths I have personally dealt with (some are added on to in order to address specifics of certain positions):

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1218&pid=62702

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #78)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:14 PM

89. thanks for your reply.

I really did not know this, interesting. I work in education, Head Start.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:50 PM

6. As a leader, you don't have faith in your people when you don't expect

that they already have faith in their hearts.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:50 PM

7. Loyalty oaths

Like Hitler youth?

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Response to nobodyspecial (Reply #7)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:26 PM

42. Spike Jones nailed assholes like these pathetic klowns

seventy years ago:

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #42)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:44 PM

82. I never saw this before!

I had only heard the record (my folks had it).


Holy cow, they're flipping the bird when they "salute"....

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:51 PM

8. Shhh!!!!

My fascist legislators in Texas LOVE shit like this.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:57 PM

9. Only the GOP mind could dream up Nazi like bullshit

like this.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:12 PM

10. The irony is that the clown proposing this is the one who has violated his oath

to support and defend the constitution, seeing how 70 years ago the Supreme Court held that it is unconstitutional to compel students to recite a loyalty oath (i.e., the pledge of allegiance).

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:13 PM

11. A reasonable parent will ensure that the person who conceived this will be fired.

That's it. No room for wiggle.

Anything else is bullshit.

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Response to Buzz Clik (Reply #11)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:27 PM

77. Depends on where in Arizona...

and if there is anything you could call reasonable parents.

--imm

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:14 PM

12. Oh my!

That's all I can say.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:19 PM

13. What purpose does this serve?

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Response to NightWatcher (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:24 PM

48. Political advantage for the person who introduced the bill n/t

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:49 PM

14. it sounds just like a military oath?

what next.

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Response to barbtries (Reply #14)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:39 PM

80. It's actually stolen from

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:50 PM

15. They want students to take the oath that Senators and the Vice President take?

Weird. They aren't being sworn into anything.

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Response to Jennicut (Reply #15)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:02 PM

27. Teachers (K-12 and post-secondary)

are required to take this oath (in Nevada it's even worse because the wording is slightly different). Most of the people I work with who were forced to sign it wrote - as did I - "signed under duress".

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Response to enlightenment (Reply #27)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:37 PM

35. WTH?! Not in Pennsylvania, we're not! Have your teachers heard of the CONSTITUTION?!

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #35)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:09 PM

45. Well, yes - we have.

I spend a lot of time teaching my students about it, as a matter of fact. Problem is, we're state employees and if we want to work, we have to comply (right to work state and all that rot).

It's mostly a wink and a nod - we don't stand there with our hands raised and state the oath, as this moron legislator is suggesting the kids should do. We just have to sign a piece of paper that goes into our personnel file. And no one said a word about the number of people who signed under protest. It's all political theatre - unless you refuse to sign.

This started about 2005 and reached critical mass in 2008. There was a huge fuss about it - an instructor at one of the community colleges refused to sign and was fired. He sued - and lost, on appeal. The PTB say it's not a big deal because few people complain about . . . and besides, who pays attention anyway. The answer is "nobody" until someone refuses to sign - on principle - and gets canned for it.

I couldn't afford to loss my job, such as it is - so I held my nose and signed under duress.

They were doing this in California, also - though they may have pulled back on it. In Nevada it is particularly egregious (and potentially unconstitutional on its face) because of this:

I, ................, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support, protect and defend the constitution and government of the United States, and the constitution and government of the State of Nevada . . .


The oath the President takes - and the oath that federal legislators take - says this (the relevant section):

. . . defend the Constitution of the United States . . .


The problem is that "and the government" - it is not right to demand that an individual protect the government, particularly when they are being asked to defend BOTH the federal and the state government. Governments change all the time - no one should be required to defend or protect them.

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Response to enlightenment (Reply #45)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:40 PM

69. I fully get the "can't afford to lose my job" part. Man, how did we get such WHACKED legislators?

legislators??

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #69)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:57 PM

74. Got me -

But they are seriously delusional. Most of the time. Stuff like this is easy for them - they can look like they're doing something, while doing nothing, with the added bonus of faux patriotism . . . like a cherry on top.

It's like all the resolutions that get voted on at both state and federal levels. They don't change anything, but they're fantastic time wasters and another line on their legislative scorecard. It's total BS.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:56 PM

16. Funny stuff there.

 

Whatever. It wont harm the kids but it will damn sure harm the GOP. Keep it up guys, keep it up.

I suggest we all write them, and rather than expressing outrage demand that they include something about Jesus.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:03 PM

17. Is there any doubt as to how Arizona won Bill Maher's Stupidest State contest?

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Response to Initech (Reply #17)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:34 PM

22. Now I get it. AZ is trying to win a contest.

This made no sense until I heard about this contest

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:23 PM

19. so what haooens if you're an atheis and

1) you refuse to do the god part? or

2) you do the god part and then follow with an "I don't believe in deities"

do they burn you or lock you in stocks or some other medieval punishment?

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Response to rurallib (Reply #19)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:41 PM

24. The law has always allowed Quakers, Jehovah's Witnesses, and others whose religion forbids...

... them to make oaths to secular powers to "affirm" that they are telling the truth in any situation calling for an oath (i.e. court, military).

This obviously applies to atheists and agnostics as well, though it is easier to get past the censors if you can claim religious belief (rather like conscientious objectors in the Viet Nam era, but that is another story).

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:24 PM

20. Loyalty oath. What do you think the Pledge of Allegiance is?

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all." Sounds like an oath of fealty to me and I despise the fact that we have children recite it daily in classrooms.

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Response to white_wolf (Reply #20)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:37 PM

23. Good point. What about prayer? Loyalty to the metaphysical master of the universe.

Pray or burn in damnation for eternity, another example of a freely given oath

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Response to white_wolf (Reply #20)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:18 PM

31. Especially children so young

Last edited Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:17 PM - Edit history (1)

that they don't even understand the meaning of many of the words they are reciting.

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Response to white_wolf (Reply #20)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:41 PM

36. What the Pledge IS, is a NON-MANDATED (yes, check the Constitution) paragraph

many U.S. schools ASK that their students recite.

ANY school that is getting away with DEMANDING this is a school with VERY weak and, frankly, undemocratic teachers and parents.

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #36)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:12 PM

37. It's non-mandated but very strongly encouraged.

It should be recited at all in any form.

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Response to white_wolf (Reply #37)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:44 PM

71. Oh, trust me; I know. I held my nose in my homerooms many a year. All I asked of

my students, though, was that they stand. If they wanted to remain silent, I let them know it was their LEGAL RIGHT.

But then, I'm a Lefty in more ways than one.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:50 PM

25. WHY is the AZ government prepairing their students to become state soldiers?

Sec. 3331. Oath of office
An individual, except the President, elected or appointed to an
office of honor or profit in the civil service or uniformed services,
shall take the following oath: ``I, AB, do solemnly swear (or affirm)
that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States
against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith
and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without
any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and
faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to
enter. So help me God.''
This section does not affect other oaths
required by law.

Source: United States Code - 5USC3331

IS THERE something we need to know about AZ!?!?

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Response to Rex (Reply #25)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:13 PM

29. Because the economy is so shitty there with right to work that people can't afford to live a middle

class life anymore. Old people are taking the minimum wage jobs to supplement their income forcing out the younger workers. One of my nephews works 2 minimum wage jobs and can barely make ends meet and has no social life because all he does is works and sleeps. The other had to join the Army because there is nothing but dead end jobs. He couldn't afford college so he had to join the Army. They are just preparing the youth their for their inevitable path of joining the military. Arizona the state of no opportunity nor upward mobility. My husband's family all moved there from California because housing was cheaper but now they are getting to the point they can't afford to live there anymore because of the low wages due to right the work laws. I wonder what's going to happen to all those retirement communities when the seniors die and there is no seniors to move in because they have no retirement, nor can the families sell the homes of the deceased family members.

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Response to kimbutgar (Reply #29)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:35 PM

34. why do people keep moving to AZ then?

AZs unemployment rate is right in the middle of the pack at 7.9% for 2012.

AZs population growth comes in at number 8.

Phx has the 4th best housing market in the country, Tucson is listed at #14.

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Response to Mosby (Reply #34)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:53 PM

43. For the warm weather, seniors love it and for the cheap housing

But once you get there you realize jobs don't pay much. It happened to a friend of mine. He commutes back to California to work, because he couldn't find a job in his field there. The most he could make is $8 an hour in the sf bay area he makes $60 an hour for his services. He is waiting on the real estate market to turn around so he can sell his house and get him and his wife out of the state. Also it is very racist, he is Filipino and said he NEVER faced racism like he does in Arizona. I have to go there next week to visit my in-laws and I am dreading going to the state. I will be staying indoors as much as possible as I don't want to get in trouble there being I'm not a lily white person. I wonder if I should bring my passport? And lastly Arizona has the craziest politicians ugh!!!!!

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Response to kimbutgar (Reply #43)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:29 PM

51. the pay varies depending on where you live

Highest pay is in the Phx metro area, the pay in rural AZ is a lot lower. Pay in Tucson is about 75% of the pay in Phx.

The cops here in the (phx) Valley generally suck, they arrest everyone they can in order to maintain law enforcement and the "justice" system as growth industries. I don't doubt that there is a fair amount of discrimination but my experience is that the cops here just want arrests, they don't care as much about skin color.

Really if you're going to compare phx or tucson or anywhere else in the US to the sf bay area you're going to be disappointed. How does your filipino relative think he would fair in the rural south for example?

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Response to kimbutgar (Reply #43)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:50 PM

59. AZ is anything but lily white albeit there is now a white majority.

Much of the state is Navajo Nation or other tribal lands, plus there was a large number of residents in that part of Mexico before the conquest. Those people are still there and still speak Spanish too. Almost everywhere you go, you can speak Spanish instead of English.

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Response to kimbutgar (Reply #43)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:54 PM

73. You have nothing to fear

My partner and his family are all Hispanic. They go about their daily business like everyone else.

Same with the black, hispanic and Asians I have on my softball team


I am not sure where your friend is experiencing racism. I have a number of Filipino and other Asian/Pacific Islander friends - born and raised here and moved here from Cali. No issues ever. The only complaints the ones from Cali have is the lack of dining options.

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Response to dbackjon (Reply #73)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:48 PM

83. He's has been seated in several chains in Glendale and the waitress took a long time to take their

Order, he requested a booth and they told them they were taken but there were several empty ones, him and his wife were seated elsewhere right after that a white couple game in and given the booth, it is a non reservation restaurant. He has had incidents in the grocery stores where people have been rude. And let me tell you this guy is a sweet nice and Christian man so I know it's not anything he said or has done. As a non lily white woman I can definitely say I got the squint from white people. That said, of course, I'm not going to broad brush Arizona as bad (only the politicians) there are a lot of good people including the ones who commented on my comment. I will come to Arizona next week and be happy to see my in laws and have a nice visit.

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Response to kimbutgar (Reply #83)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 09:40 PM

87. I feel ya--I went down there for a friend's wedding and I got that old squint eye too.

The friends, and their people, were great, so I know what you mean about good people living there, but I do think there are plenty of people in authority and out and about who can be unkind.

If you don't fit a type that meets their approval, you could have trouble, that's the feeling I take away.

That's just my sense. I breathed easier when I got back on the plane.

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Response to kimbutgar (Reply #83)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:25 PM

90. There is a general lack of good service in Arizona

Along with some pockets of racists - but most of us are good people. Not lily white at all.

If he has issues like that, make a stink. Generally, this is one or two ignorant servers, and management would be ashamed of them.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 03:56 PM

26. Good comment! "freely"??? I'm not sure most people would recognize their own slavery if it bit their

butt.

We need a long HONEST, on-going, big discussion of what the word "Freedom" means, for real, and as many people as possible should participate in that.

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Response to patrice (Reply #26)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:34 PM

55. "I freed a thousand slaves, I could have freed a thousand more if only they knew they were slaves."

 

That was Harriet Tubman.

This is Ron White, "You can't fix stupid".

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:11 PM

28. Teenagers love being coerced and dominated!

Thanks AZ pubs for helping the future of that state to be a blue one.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:18 PM

30. If the bill passes the legislature and is signed by Governor Hagfinger,

it will be killed by the Arizona Supreme Court, the Circuit Court of Appeals, or the US Supreme Court. And even if it doesn't, no student of conscience will willingly swear the oath.

More uber-patriotic grandstanding by the Arizona legislators...

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:22 PM

32. What about children who are here on resident visas without citizenship?

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #32)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:15 PM

40. Or (shhh!) here without either?

SB 1070 didn't drive them all away, y'know.

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Response to KamaAina (Reply #40)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:54 PM

44. No. Here students with resident visas but who are not citizens.

Why should they be required to take a loyalty oath?

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:23 PM

33. Gee, loyalty oaths have worked so well throughout history.

Sounds like they are getting desperate. Can't win hearts and minds with their oh-so-awesome ideology so they have to force it upon them. They never get that loyalty oaths would be completely unnecessary if they actually worked to make this country a great place to live instead of just talking about it.

I am so sick of having the idiots controlling the conversations and screwing up our government. There are so many more effective things they could be doing with their time.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:14 PM

38. Metallized hydrogen is jealous of the density

of the reichwing "mind."

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Response to hifiguy (Reply #38)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:28 PM

50. And intergalactic space the vacuity of their "intellect"..

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:14 PM

39. The GOP is Irony deficient.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:19 PM

41. Is it any surprise

Businesses refuse to move there, the economy is failing, the educational system is gutted, and people are fleeing the state in record numbers? Jan Brewer and her merry band of small minded busybodies have destroyed AZ.

Pathetic.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:17 PM

46. Ooh, magic words that will certainly guide all decisions they make for years to come.

That'll work.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:22 PM

47. Unconstitutional on its face.....

 

There is no "nexus" between this "oath" and the awarding of a high school diploma.

They must have scratched their nuts raw and their pussies bloody in order to have time to think up this kind of crap. There is absolutely no logical connection between a public education and an oath. Sorry Charlie....

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Response to Swede Atlanta (Reply #47)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:25 PM

49. Yep

Why do they even waste our time?

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Response to legaleagle_45 (Reply #49)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:53 PM

60. Because they are racists who hate Mexicans, Hispanics, and Native Americans

This is directed at minority populations and is an affront to them.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:30 PM

52. so the pledge of allegiance every moring, 5 days a week, 9 months a year isn't enough?

i thought that was something of great significance to these nativists.

classic goal post moving

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:31 PM

53. Heeheehehehee

Gee didn't we just here this when Justice Sotomayor swore in VP Biden...

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:34 PM

54. SO HELP ME GOD

Wouldn't surprise me if this is what it's all about. Bringing "god" back in the schools. It's the start of a slippery slope IMO.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:39 PM

56. Loyalty Oathes

When I moved to Florida and went to work in a public school, they asked me to sign a loyalty oath to the Constitution of the USA (ok) and the Constiution of Florida. I refused to do the latter. I was told that was fine and that many employees had done the same.

In my book the US Constitution trump's any state's.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:49 PM

57. "foreign and domestic"

Apparently, the politicians don't realize that they qualify as "domestic".

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:49 PM

58. Nothing fascist about required "loyalty oaths" for schoolchildren, nosiree.


Gack.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:57 PM

61. I had to take an oath in AZ to be paid as a Grad Assistant

It was to the State Constitution if I recall correctly

edit: I found the oath

State of Arizona, County of __________________ I, __________________ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution and laws of the State of Arizona, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same, and defend them against all enemies, foreign and domestic, and that I will faithfully and impartially discharge the duties of the office of__________________________________(name of office) according to the best of my ability, so help me God (or so I do affirm).

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:59 PM

62. Adolf would be proud

...and Fuck Godwin.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:11 PM

64. Very Nazi like on their part

In truth we have allowed these elements to continue for to long.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:16 PM

65. more idiots stick their heads into the sand of Arizona

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:20 PM

66. I see Republicans are once again tackling the real important issues facing the country.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:21 PM

67. Require every individual voting for this bill or administering the act

to take a test and pass the test on the Constitution.
If you can't pass the test (and since these are legislators and public officials a passing grade should be 90%), you can make the bill or administer the oath.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:36 PM

68. If you want to be a state employee in Oklahoma you

have to sign a loyalty oath. I kid you not. It is part of the new employee paperwork that I prepare for new hires.

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Response to avebury (Reply #68)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:42 PM

70. Somebody need to sue and take this to a higher/highest court.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 07:47 PM

72. My legislature is nuts

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:15 PM

76. Forcing them to say the Pledge of Allegiance every day for 12 years isn't enough now?

Jesus wept.

This, of course, will immediately and rightly be found unconstitutional, if for no other reason that it infringes on the rights of students who are not citizens. Like foreign exchange students sponsored by AFS and other organizations. Or the children of people with H1B visas, or......well, you get my point.

http://www.afs.org/

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:40 PM

81. Here is one they should recite immediately after the 1st

I, _________, DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR THAT I WILL GET THE F*CK OUTTA THIS STATE AS FAST AS I AM ABLE NEVER TO SET FOOT INSIDE THE ASYLUM FOR THE REST OF MY BORN DAYS!!!!

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:55 PM

84. We are getting close to this here in NC...I feel for you with what we are up against.

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 09:38 PM

86. This is fucken ridiculous, like most things from AZ anymore. n/t

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Response to Coyotl (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:31 PM

92. Don't those same kids already recite the Pledge of Alligience every morning

at school? And why, if its important, do only public school kids have to take the oath? Is it assumed that wealthier kids are already loyal?
But then again, isn't this the same oath that elected officials pledge and then immediately break? I guess they just want others to be inn the same boat they are in.

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