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Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:07 PM

Many people in this country hunt to live

I personally loathe hunting and all other blood sports concerning animals. There is also a difference between eating what you kill, but you can afford to buy whatever you want to eat, and eating what you kill because you and your family need to live.

It is apparent many DUers don't understand this. In parts of NC and TN (which are the areas I personally know about), poor and lower class people have always hunted and fished to supplement their tables, but things have gotten even more desperate due to manufacturing being outsourced. Many of these people get basically all of their protein from the land. They reload their own ammo, some have deals to get casings from friends or ranges.

I grew up with families who did this. As an adult, I have taught people who gave to live like this. They range across all fifty states.

All this talk of taxing weapons and ammo, or taxing owners needs to include this. We already have starving children, elderly, and family because of lack of food. This would make it worse.

Guns are also the most efficient and humane (to the animals) way for them to hunt.

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Reply Many people in this country hunt to live (Original post)
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 OP
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Response to obamanut2012 (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:10 PM

1. city folk don't understand about living off the land.

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Response to Tuesday Afternoon (Reply #1)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:12 PM

2. I really think most people don't realize how it is for so many

In certain areas, and how poor and desperate people are. Appalachia, Indian reservations, etc.

I've taught people whose family literally ate roadkill, they were so poor.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:18 PM

13. That is why gun control is not strictly along party lines

Urban vs rural etc come to mind

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #13)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:23 PM

24. I think that is true to a large extent

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #13)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:29 PM

87. Whether someone owns a gun is a more powerful predictor of a personís political party--NATE SILVER

 

Whether someone owns a gun is a more powerful predictor of a personís political party than her gender, whether she identifies as gay or lesbian, whether she is Hispanic, whether she lives in the South or a number of other demographic characteristics.

It will come as no surprise to those with a passing interest in American politics that Republicans are more likely to own guns than Democrats. But the differences have become much more stark in recent years, with gun ownership having become one of the clearest examples of the partisan polarization in the country over the last two decades.

In 1973, about 55 percent of Republicans reported having a gun in their household against 45 percent of Democrats, according to the General Social Survey, a biennial poll of American adults.

Gun ownership has declined over the past 40 years ó but almost all of the decrease has come from Democrats. By 2010, according to the General Social Survey, the gun ownership rate among adults that identified as Democrats had fallen to 22 percent. It remained at about 50 percent among Republican adults.

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/12/18/in-gun-ownership-statistics-partisan-divide-is-sharp/

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #87)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:11 PM

147. So what...look at the rural/urban split in party registration

and Nate Silver is just another media figure

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #147)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:58 PM

173. "Nate Silver is just another media figure"

 

Yep, I think you're biased against reality. What kind of Professor are you?

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #173)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:32 PM

210. Comp Sci

I have a strong dislike for media figures and "journalists", who are actually just more media figures.

His source is cherry picked...typical media move.

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #210)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:26 PM

230. This best pollster in history! want to contest that?

 

What makes you such an expert on anything? Just curious

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #230)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 08:07 PM

247. He is not a pollster in the least

He is an aggregator of polls and a model user/builder. A good article about it is here: http://www.forbes.com/sites/johnmcquaid/2012/11/07/three-lessons-from-the-nate-silver-controversy/ As the article states, he has been a game changer, though he is not alone. It is not at all clear that he has the same expertise in other areas and that his models are more broadly applicable.

I comment on that which I have real world experience and expertise. That includes a lot of technology, solar power, computer modeling, military stuff, motorcycles, and firearms (which I also teach).

What is so mighty about Mopar these days?

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #87)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:32 PM

155. The Gallup survey indicates a less than black & white picture...

According to the survey, household ownership of guns is at its highest level since 1993, that those gun-owners identifying themselves as Democrats rose from 30% to 40% in just two years, and women are the fastest rising demographic among gun-owners.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/150353/self-reported-gun-ownership-highest-1993.aspx

And there is a very significant level of gun-ownership here on DU, as you may have ascertained.

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Response to Eleanors38 (Reply #155)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:38 PM

158. So you're picking Republican biased Gallup over Nate Silver after the last election? Hilarious

 

Or is there a lot of Astroturf on DU?

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #158)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:35 PM

236. Did Nate Silver do the poll cited?

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #87)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 11:35 PM

303. This is proof that statistics never give a complete picture.

 

Minnesota is solidly blue. Minnesota also is solidly pro RKBA. the urban vs rural thing is real, but not all rural areas are republican areas.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 03:01 PM

119. On my...

...home reservation, wild game is an extremely important part of our diet. It's about the only really healthy food we have access to. It is also culturally essential to maintain that relationship with our land.

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Response to Puha Ekapi (Reply #119)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:39 PM

159. Like you can't grow a freaking garden or raise rabbits and chickens?

 

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #159)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:53 PM

170. How would raising rabbits be in some way superior to hunting? Just asking.

I'm a meat eater, get most of mine from a schoolteacher/farmer a mile from my house. I don't eat venison because I find it gamey. But why would raising animals to kill be better than hunting wild animals?

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Response to peacebird (Reply #170)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:59 PM

175. You wouldn't need guns

 

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #175)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:01 PM

178. You can trap wild rabbits, no gun needed.

I guess I see guns as tools. What I object to is mega magazines and semiautomatic weapons. Those are not needed to hunt anything except other people.

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Response to peacebird (Reply #178)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:03 PM

218. You city slickers....

...have no idea what it takes to live off the land, do you? Try actually living off rabbit meat. You'll starve because it lacks adequate fat. You need high quality protein with plenty of fat, and that means big game. Have any idea what it would take to trap a 1000# elk? A rifle is the most humane, efficient way to do that.

Grow a garden adequate to live on? It's a real challenge here. My home is at 5000 ft. elevation in the Uintah Mountains. The growing season is very short, and it gets too cold for even cold hardy crops such as cabbages and kale to survive the winter. Raising chickens and rabbits? Very expensive to heat them over the winter. Ours is a poor community, like virtually every other reservation community in the country.

You folks haven't been around much, have you?

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Response to Puha Ekapi (Reply #218)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:07 PM

219. You clearly meant to reply to the person I was replying to, not to me. I support hunting.

I said nothing about raising chickens and rabbits except to ask Mopar why killing raised animals was better than wild.

Mopar replied that killing a domestic animal did not require a gun. A silly distinction in my mind.

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Response to peacebird (Reply #219)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:13 PM

221. Yes, you are...

...correct. Still finding my way around this place, sorry for the confusion.

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Response to Puha Ekapi (Reply #221)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:14 PM

222. No worries! Welcome!

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Response to peacebird (Reply #222)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:22 PM

226. Thanks!

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Response to peacebird (Reply #178)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 10:42 AM

331. I think handguns

end up killing far more people overall than semiautomatic weapons, at least accidentally.

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Response to Puha Ekapi (Reply #119)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:54 PM

242. I was just reading on diets and how frybread came into tradition. And food deserts= no fresh produce

unless you grow it yourself.

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #242)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 09:27 PM

282. "frybread"

is poverty food. When forced on to reservations, we were usually denied our right to hunt and supplied with meager rations of low quality commodities...flour, lard, maybe a bit of coffee and sugar if we were lucky and the agent was feeling generous. We were also restricted in our access to our other traditional foods that were gathered seasonally in different locations. The entire concept of "food deserts" is pretty modern. There are all sorts of healthy things to eat in our traditional country, but often we can't access it because some white man claims that somehow he owns the land now. We damn sure don't have Whole Foods on the rez, and even if we did, nobody could afford to shop there.

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Response to Tuesday Afternoon (Reply #1)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:54 PM

109. Some rural hunters don't understand - or care - "city folks" aren't into walking around in public

with guns.

Nor are they into living in compounds (surrounded by assault weapon caches), confederate or "don't tread on me" flags, walking around with a 1911 sticking out of their waist band because it's the thing to do, etc.

Hunting for food -- while not my thing -- is fine, as long as humans aren't the target, and the "hunter" is not a paranoid, bigot.

I don't really buy the "hunter" junk as an excuse to allow these guys to buy semi-auto, rifles or handguns.





Hunters lined up at Atlanta gun show to buy assault weapons only one week after Sandy Hook.

If the NRA gets their way, guys like this can walk around anywhere with a friggin gun or two strapped on.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #109)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:59 PM

110. thank you for that astute and well composed post. and the lovely pictures. you are a credit and an

asset to DU. Bless you.

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Response to Tuesday Afternoon (Reply #110)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:42 PM

161. Until rural people start caring about the majority in of the rest of the country

 

Why should urban people car about them? Most of our food comes from corporate farms in or out of the United States

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #161)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:59 PM

174. Most of my food is homegrown or local.... Exception for citrus, which my brother sends me from his

Trees in florida.

But veggies, spuds, sweet taters, figs, blueberries, cherries, apples, peaches, eggs, walnuts.... All from our place. Meat from a mile down the road. Bread from a local organic bakery.

By the way, I do care about rural folks and their lifestyle, even tho I am city raised. When we moved out here we made a concious choice to respect the ways of the locals. We have learned a lot.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #109)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:51 PM

167. this should be fun

 

we all know your anti gun feelings Hoyt...but to dispell your notions..how about people like me who when i lived in virginia put 800 to 1,000 pounds of meat a year in our freezers hunting?
Do we count?

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Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #167)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:19 PM

199. If all you do is hunt animals, great. If you accumulate assault weapons or carry in public, that's


a totally different thing. Most right wing gun cultists use the hunting excuse, and other such BS to obscure their real reasons for being gun cultists. They couldn't care less what it does to society.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #109)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:06 PM

182. some city folk don't understand...or care..that we rural folk stock meat by hunting

 

get over it hoyt...try to ban guns in big cities...you wont win that....and you sure as hell won't take guns away from rural farmers and hunters.

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Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #182)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:20 PM

201. When you go to town, do you carry. What are you hunting or expect to run into, backwoodsbob?

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #201)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:26 PM

206. I have NEVER carried in town

 

kind of ruins your argument doesn't it

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Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #206)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:32 PM

209. Glad to hear it. Hope you convince your gun buddies to do same. Get well soon.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #201)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:30 PM

207. getting well

 

Last edited Mon Jan 7, 2013, 01:01 AM - Edit history (1)

Doc says I'm supposed to take it easy for a few days so I will leave you with this:

There are area's where we can work together if both sides could talk to each other instead of at each other

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Response to Tuesday Afternoon (Reply #1)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:24 PM

151. This city dweller knows the difference between a hunting rifle and an assault weapon

I am not convinced the NRA or its supporters know that difference, though.

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Response to LonePirate (Reply #151)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:34 PM

156. feel free to go educate them. you might want to use the correct term however:

assault rifle is the issue.

an assault *weapon* can be a knife, sword, or anything that is chosen in which to Assault a person.

comprehende?

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Response to LonePirate (Reply #151)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:44 PM

239. One of these is my primary hunting weapon:

 

http://www.remington.com/en/product-families/firearms/centerfire-families/autoloading-model-r-15.aspx

Perhaps you can tell us what
the difference between a hunting rifle and an assault weapon

is, and what the defining features of each are?

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Response to LonePirate (Reply #151)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 12:53 AM

317. what is the difference?

 

this should be good

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Response to Tuesday Afternoon (Reply #1)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 09:17 PM

271. Most gun control measures being discussed would do nothing to prevent the use of guns for "living

off the land."

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Response to Squinch (Reply #271)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 09:19 PM

273. *most* OK.... then there are only a *few* that are at issue here.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:12 PM

3. That is what government food assistance is for.

Nobody in this country should need to hunt to feed their families.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:13 PM

6. Why?

That's like saying no one should be forced to grow their own food.

I don't get it.

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Response to Buzz Clik (Reply #6)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:19 PM

15. If people choose to grow their own food that is fine.

That is similar to people hunting and eating what they kill even though they can afford to feed themselves without hunting.

My objection is to the actual need to hunt. There should be some basic essentials that a society provides for it's members and IMO not starving to death because you haven't killed something in the last few days it high on the list.


It is very easy to injure yourself out in the wild. When I was living in the mountains of Colorado a neighbor of mine was out hunting and hurt himself badly. He was able to get back to a road )this is before cell phones) and he ended up being OK. If he needed to go back out the next day to hunt for food then he and his family would have been seriously screwed.

Hunting as a necessity is objectionable to me.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #15)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:24 PM

26. But, it is a reality to many people in this country

Hunting and fishing feeds them. It shouldn't be like this is such a rich country, but it is.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #15)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:39 PM

160. Purchasing food, meat or vegetables, means someone has killed animals for that purchase...

by either:
(1) Killing directly (hunting);
(2) Killing by agent (meat under cellophane); and
(3) Killing by abstraction (agriculture, which destroys whole ecosystems and distorts others).

Note also that injuries/deaths related to hunting have been on the decline, now, for several years.

It doesn't really matter if hunting is "objectionable" to you, or even if it is a "necessity." Clearly, it is a necessity for some -- esp. those who don't want to go on the dole. But for others (myself included), it can be economical and healthy.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #15)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:48 PM

240. Then 99.9% of human history is "objectionable" to you. Congrats. n/t

 

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #15)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:51 PM

241. Oh, two other things.....

 

1. Some people would rather be self0sufficient than rely on the government to "save" or "help" them. Some people hear object to that concept, oddly enough. 'Tis a puzzlement.

2. "It is very easy to injure yourself out in the wild." Wow, brilliant non sequiteur of the day. And this differentiates "the wild" from any other place... how, exactly?

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:15 PM

7. That is never going to happen

At least not any time soon. They have CUT SNAP, and what Native Americans get is usually garbage, fatty cheese and processed carbs.

I am talking about reality, not a future utopia.

Sit down and talk to some of these people.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #7)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:23 PM

25. I agree, it isn't happening now

but it is something that we should strive for.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:17 PM

10. That is urban dweller talking point

who probably never lived off of government food assistance

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #10)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:22 PM

22. No, I never have lived off government food assistance

but I believe people should not starve to death simply because they could't kill something in the last few days.

It isn't a talking point. It is a social value.

The need to hunt to eat is offensive. If people want to hunt that is different.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #22)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:31 PM

153. You must have been offended for a very long time

There are parts of the US where if there is no deer or elk in the freezer or smoke house, its going to be a long winter. Been that way for generations and still is.

Government assistance in many states is pitiful in content and amount.

A deer lasts more than a few days, rabbit not so much.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:17 PM

11. please tell me that is sarcasm.

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Response to Tuesday Afternoon (Reply #11)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:21 PM

19. No, people should not need to hunt to eat.

How can that possibly be sarcasm?

People should not starve to death because they haven't killed anything for a few days or because they injured themselves and are unable to hunt for a time.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:25 PM

27. thank you for proving my point, Detroit City.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:55 PM

51. it isn't a matter of hunt or starve for the most part

 

I lived for years in the mountains of Virginia and most people I knew(me included)had a large chest freezer on the porch or in the garage or wherever just for deer meat.

It isn't eat or starve,it's taking the money you would have spent on meat and instead buying clothes for the kids or school supplies or whatever else is needed.Putting 800 to 1,000 pounds of meat in a freezer relatively cheaply frees up a lot of money for other needs.

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Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #51)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:57 PM

53. That is a point I also should have made

To pay the heating bill, to pay for doctor bills, to buy clothes for your kids, you hunt instead of going to Food Lion or Wal-Mart.

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Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #51)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:43 PM

162. Yep. It's called economical, light-on-the-land living. Been doing it for years.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:09 PM

68. People should not need to deforest and soak the ground with fertilizers to eat

 

And people should not be dependent slaves to a system that is bent on destroying self-dependence/self-reliance via ecosystem destruction.

Agriculture is a scourge. All the "isms" that enforce agrarian slavery are a blight to humanity. The forager is the true free man. All your complex systems that ensure affluent malnutrition cannot exist without stripping people of their skills and dignity and exploiting their labor.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:22 PM

21. You know, showing your ignorance isn't the best thing to do.

What the hell good are blanket statements like that. Remember a saying "walk a mile in my shoes?"

Get off your smug perch and try living someone else s life before you say stupid shit like that.

I use to live in no man's land and those people can't get to any kind of government assistance. That's like those on the right who want to yank the safety net out from under the urban poor. These rural people use hunting as a safety net!

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:26 PM

28. The people in my area

who hunt to put protein on the table for their families would be aggressively offended by that idea.

The idea that they should give up providing for their families themselves, and let the government do it.

Food assistance for those who need it is fine, but taking away a family's ability to provide for themselves is not.

Wrong-headed statements like that are part of the reason this segment of the population is suspicious of and resistant to government programs to begin with.

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Response to LWolf (Reply #28)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 08:46 PM

259. if you use a .223 semi automatic rifle

or a bushmaster .223 calibur M4 carbine how is there much meat left to eat ? it is all shot up with holes! right?

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Response to 4 t 4 (Reply #259)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 09:03 PM

264. Wrong

And this population tends to use really old riffles and shotguns anyway

Anyhow, I am not a gun fan, but no...one pull of the trigger is one bullet. These things are not fully automatic guns.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #264)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 09:36 PM

288. really ,you can actually just shoot

1 bullet at a time

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Response to 4 t 4 (Reply #288)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 09:46 PM

291. Yes, to get technical

The gasses are used to push the sent round out as they push the bolt. They load the next round in. It takes one pull of the trigger to fire one bullet. Granted, you can do it very fast (4-6 rounds a second) but it takes one pull to fire one round.

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Response to 4 t 4 (Reply #288)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 12:49 AM

316. one bullet at a time

 

squeeze the trigger...one bullet

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Response to 4 t 4 (Reply #259)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 08:08 AM

328. They don't.

The point is that they would rather hunt their protein with a legal tag than get government food assistance.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:34 PM

33. What happened to basic human dignity?

 

Many of those people who hunt for food don't qualify for food assistance for one reason or another.

Many are farmers who grow YOUR food but whose farms barely break even. They own land, yes, but they can't sell that land or they'd lose their livelihood.

Many of those farmers are tenant farmers who don't own their own land but don't qualify for food assistance.


These are people who manage to be self-sufficient. Why are you insisting on taking that away from them? Why are you insisting that they eat the chemically polluted crap that food assistance would allow them eat when they can get higher grade food by their own hand than you can get in your grocery store?

These are people who understand that they are part of the circle of life not outside or above it. When they take prey they try to follow the same rules as a hawk or bobcat. They take the slowest, the weakest, injured from the herd in order to keep the whole stronger. (Or perhaps you now want universal veterinary care for every wild animal out there). They do NOT go after the biggest rack. They take species which aren't supposed to be here in the first place. Species which have no natural predators and which would grow out of control but for their hunting.
Or perhaps we should just work to wipe out the species as a whole? Somehow I think that contradicts your thinking. Or maybe you want to round them all up and ship them back to their native lands where they are no longer adapted to?

You obviously know very little about actual hunting, i.e. taking prey for food. It's not the same as sport murder - killing animals for trophies.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:40 PM

36. In another thread someone said she was getting cut off food stamps because she couldn't get

 

Transportation to the job training center.

Food stamps aren't all that convenient either it seems, and the food it buys tends to be poor quality.

Hunting seems more nutritious actually and more natural. How do you get more organic than non farm raised meat?

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:06 PM

67. you can eat much better from the land

 

than you could with government food assistance.

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Response to datasuspect (Reply #67)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:15 PM

73. Yes, ecologically destructive Monsanto corn vs nature-raised meat

 

Its a no-brainier. The system would prefer the former so that its malnourished masses need to rely perpetually on expensive, enslaving medical technology to fix their diseases and cancer.

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Response to NoOneMan (Reply #73)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:17 PM

77. all manufactured food is poison

 

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 03:01 PM

121. Not really a few years ago I was so broke I only made enough to pay my bills I applied

For assistance and was awarded a whole $16 in food stamps mind you this me living in nyc

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 03:05 PM

123. "Government food assistance"

is a major factor in the poor health of Native communities across North America. Go ahead, live on commod cheese, canned meat and powdered milk and see how long you stay healthy. I personally prefer real food to anything purchased in stores.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:55 PM

171. dude I lived in Detroit for 21 years

 

some of my best hunting trips were with my Detroit buddies up on the Holten Lake area

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 08:19 PM

250. A month of food stamps don't pay enough to feed a family for a whole month

And meat is expensive. I know lots of people who hunt to feed their families. And who fish to feed their families as well.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:12 PM

4. Very few people want to get rid of firearms used for legitimate hunting

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Response to Buzz Clik (Reply #4)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:29 PM

30. Agreed.

The "you people just don't understand" arguments foster more feelings of division between two already-alienated points of view.

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Response to yewberry (Reply #30)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:32 PM

32. Tell it to other DUers

That is why I posted this, because many people do not get it, even in this thread. There is a current OP wanting to seize all guns, and many posts in that and other threads wanting ex defacto and regressive taxes against ALL gun owners.

People in this country live in dire straits, where they can literally starve to death. I have talked to these people, I have known them and talked to them, and helped them as much as I could.

"You people just don't understand" is legit. Many people don't.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #32)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:00 PM

55. No one wants to ban all weapons.

Stop telling that lie already.

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Response to Tempest (Reply #55)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:03 PM

57. It's not a lie. There are a few radicals in our midst who would ban all firearms.

 

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #57)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:05 PM

60. Wow. You're still taking their post out of context. Even after attempts to correct you. n/t

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Response to Tempest (Reply #60)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:06 PM

62. Your silly rationalization doesn't change the reality that the individual would ban ALL firearms

 

Even ones used by law enforcement people.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #62)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:15 PM

72. At least you admit you took the poster's comment out of context by your silence.

Now you should apologize to them for continuing to do so.

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Response to Tempest (Reply #72)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:16 PM

76. I took nothing out of context. The poster I pointed out would ban all firearms with no exceptions.

 

Which makes him or her a bit LESS of a hypocrite than typical police-state authoritarian gun prohibitionists; the unrealistic nature of the idea notwithstanding.

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Response to Tempest (Reply #55)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:06 PM

64. Not true

 

Some do. Many antigunners simply want a variety of restrictions that fall in spectrum of gun control/denial goals. However there is a vocal minority that want to ban private ownership of all firearms. So YOU should stop telling that lie already.

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Response to guardian (Reply #64)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:13 PM

70. Until you provide evidence, I'm considering it a lie.

Where are the posts from "many DUers" who want to ban ALL GUNS AS THE POSTER CLAIMED?

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Response to Tempest (Reply #55)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:20 PM

80. I am not a liar

So knock it off.

There is not only a CURRENT OP stating that, but many posts. MANY.

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Response to Tempest (Reply #55)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:52 PM

168. Sorry, but the pages in DU (in & out of the Gungeon) over the last 2 wks indicate otherwise. nt

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Response to Tempest (Reply #55)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:47 PM

215. Some clearly have said as much

Naming names would be a callout...not falling for that gambit

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #32)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:16 PM

74. Mm-hm.

There are posts all over the board expressing points of view across the spectrum regarding gun ownership, so I hardly think that's reason for yet another OP excoriating "you people."

And gee, thanks for the info about hunger. I had no idea, because apparently 'city people' have no experience with the world beyond our soy lattes and Whole Food stores. And you've actually talked to these hungry people? Oh, my stars!

Please. Condescension and alienation is not a good ally-building strategy.

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Response to yewberry (Reply #74)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:23 PM

82. You love saying this OP is about "you people"

When, posts show that many people do not have a clue how many people HAVE to live.

I LOVE how you have twice claimed I am trying to divide people, when I am actually trying to unite people, and have everyone understand where everyone is coming from.

I'm not one trying to stop discussion and finding common ground. Interesting some are saying I am. Very interesting.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #82)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:30 PM

152. How about a post claiming that rural people don't have a clue about poverty or hunger

because they've never eaten out of a dumpster? Would that be different?

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Response to Buzz Clik (Reply #4)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:39 PM

103. Most have bows and arrows around here

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Response to Rosa Luxemburg (Reply #103)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 02:33 PM

113. And that is the cruelest form of hunting.

If the deer was hit in a non-vital area, it could run off and suffer.

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Response to RebelOne (Reply #113)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:26 PM

229. same with a poor shot from a gun

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Response to Rosa Luxemburg (Reply #229)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:59 PM

244. Arrow hunting is now illegal in NY State.

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #244)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 11:48 AM

337. .

http://www.dec.ny.gov/docs/wildlife_pdf/huntingseasons1213.pdf

Bow season for 2013. New York State has some of the most strict hunting laws around, but bow hunting will always be legal in the US.

As you will notice, bow season is always before gun season, once gun season opens you can continue to bow hunt during that season as well.

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Response to Lurker Deluxe (Reply #337)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 12:21 PM

341. Hmm, I just posted that since Dec of 2012, crossbows are now illegal in NY State.

I've never known anyone who used bows and arrows to hunt deer.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:12 PM

5. K/R. I'm afraid that many who support taxes, confiscatio etc., don't have a clue about rural folks.

 

I, too, am against blood sports and sport hunting unless you eat what you kill, and I still don't like it.

But what cows and pigs and chickens go through on the way to our dinner plates is beyond sickening but how many people care?

OTOH, most of us can agree that ARs and high capacity magazines have nothing to do with getting protein from the land.

That's an entirely different argument!

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #5)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 12:16 PM

9. Yup -- exactly

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #5)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:59 PM

243. This is my primary hunting weapon:

 

http://www.remington.com/product-families/firearms/centerfire-families/autoloading-model-r-15.aspx

And it is illegal to hunt most game with "high capacity magazines".

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