LISTEN: Sotomayor asks if unhoused people should 'kill themselves' if they have no place to sleep

[ihaveaquestion]

[The Blue Flower]

1. They should simply cease to be

according to repub lawmakers. So the short answer is 'yes'.

[AmBlue]

2. Thank you Justice Sotomayor

For your compassion. For saying what must be said.

[republianmushroom]

3. I'm sorry that this has to be said.

But thank you , Justice Sotomayor, for saying it.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

4. WOW

That was amazing

[pfitz59]

5. 'Outlaw public sleeping and the homeless will magically go away!'

Sure they will. There are folks in our country who drool at the thought of killing homeless and illegal residents. You know, the 'good MAGAts'.

[OMGWTF]

15. Sure! Just like when Agolf Shitler wanted to outlaw Covid-19 testing to make the numbers better.

Typical Rethuglican pretzel logic.

[Ray Bruns]

6. Republicans would be ok with it.

[Celerity]

18. They will vibrate in dark ecstasy. The death cult demands death.

Dead Kennedys – Kill The Poor - 7'' (1980)

[et tu]

7. more housing is needed

half way housing and facilities should be available.
it's inhumane how we treat are fellow citizens who
have problems. shame on us~

[maxsolomon]

14. Easy to say, hard to accomplish.

The need keeps growing; the resources don't.

[et tu]

17. tax the predatory billionaire club- nt

[maxsolomon]

19. Easy to say, hard to accomplish.

Homelessness is an intractable issue with no easy solutions. It's a national crisis. Cities like Grants Pass simply don't know what to do to solve it, so they turn to short-sighted reactionary methods to push the problem elsewhere. Even big cities like Seattle & Portland are overwhelmed.

Here is the Housing Authority in Josephine Co., OR: https://www.jhcdc.net/ As far as I can tell, the entire county has one subsidized housing complex: Harbeck Village. 48 units, no pets. It does provide vouchers.

[et tu]

21. hoping for a big win in roevember

and let's see what 4 more biden years can do~

[byronius]

8. I was homeless as a young man.

I had a support structure, though, and a decent upbringing.

The shame these sharks wish to inflict says more about them than the homeless.

I lived in an old van in a friend’s back yard for a year, working until I could find my own place and go back to college. I graduated, got married, took over a small business in trouble and raised two kids — an attorney and a math teacher — but I know how hard it was, and how lucky I was to make it over that period.

I don’t respect Americans who advocate cruelty. And the GOP — is immoral and quite evil.

[h2ebits]

16. Thank you for sharing your history.

The City of Denver passed a camping ban a number of years back. It's an absolute disgrace that people are not allowed to sleep in public spaces.

It is beyond an absolute disgrace to this entire country to allow the inhumanity and cruelty of our treatment of others to continue.

I hope that the Supreme Court rules in favor of PEOPLE and overturns the state law that Oregon wants to enshrine.

[LeftInTX]

25. I thought this was about a city ordinance and not a state law. It's City of Grants Pass vs Johnson.

Texas passed a law a few years ago. Fortunately, it is not enforced.

According to the Dallas Morning News Oregon doesn't have a law, nor has one been introduced.

[h2ebits]

28. Thanks for sharing this info. . . .

I only know about the City of Denver ordinance passed a number of years ago. But, I thought that I heard Justice S. say "Oregon" and that is why I put it in my comment.

[Coventina]

9. This formerly homeless child thanks you!

I was homeless from the age of 8-14.

It was economics, not drugs or mental illness.
Seattle has always been expensive and it’s only gotten worse.

[malaise]

10. What a heartless monster

I hate all of them

Thank you judge

[bucolic_frolic]

11. Wow, to me seems a question aimed at her Republican colleagues

no reasonable person would answer yes to that question

[crickets]

12. Good for Justice Sotomayor. She didn't allow any dancing around the question. nt

[dlk]

13. Justice Sotomayor doesn't mince words

She gets straight to the heart of the matter.

[orangecrush]

20. This poem captures the experience

Rather well.

you haven't lived until you've been in a flophouse,
with nothing but one light bulb and 56 men
squeezed together on cots with everybody snoring at once
and some of those snores so deep and gross and unbelievable—
dark
snotty gross subhuman wheezings from hell itself.
your mind almost breaks under those death-like sounds
and the intermingling odors: hard unwashed socks pissed and shitted underwear

and over it all slowly circulating air
much like that emanating from uncovered garbage cans.
and those bodies in the dark
fat and thin and bent
some legless armless
some mindless

and worst of all:
the total absence of hope
it shrouds them
covers them totally.

it's not bearable.
you get up
go out
walk the streets
up and down sidewalks
past buildings
around the corner
and back up the same street
thinking:
those men were all children
once
what has happened to them?
and what has happened to me?

it's dark and cold
out here.

~ Charles Bukowski

Fuck those Marie Antoinette bastards.

[Hekate]

23. Brilliant -- & horrifying

[ret5hd]

26. Bukowski...one of my all time favorites.

[orangecrush]

27. Same

[ret5hd]

30. My introduction to Bukowski:

Early 1980’s: I passed out at a punk rock party in the basement of an old house. I woke up in my car, a swastica spray painted on my chest, my jeans in the back seat. About 100 degrees.
Completely disoriented.

The “host” needed me to move my car so he could leave, but not before showing me Polaroids of my condition the previous night. He was laughing. I was in pain.

He told me to wait a second…went inside and returned. He tossed a book in my window. Said I might like it…come back anytime.

It was Post Office.

[orangecrush]

32. ...

[Hekate]

22. I'm glad she said it. Thank you, Justice Sotomayor.

[LeftInTX]

24. About the case here:

Supreme Court divided over homeless ban and rights of the unhoused

Supreme Court justices expressed concern on Monday about punishing homeless people for sleeping outside when they have nowhere else to go, while also struggling with how to ensure local and state leaders have flexibility to deal with the growing number of unhoused individuals nationwide.

The court’s review of a set of Oregon anti-camping laws could lead to the most significant ruling on the rights of the unhoused in decades, with potentially sweeping implications for state capitals and city streets.

Throughout a more than two-hour argument, the justices seemed to divide along ideological lines with conservatives who make up the court’s majority suggesting that elected officials and lawmakers — not judges — should be setting local rules for dealing with homeless people.

Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. asked the Biden administration’s lawyer: “Why would you think these nine people are the best people to judge and weigh those policy judgments?”

Justice Brett M. Kavanaugh also expressed concern about federal courts “micromanaging homeless policy.”


No paywall link:
https://wapo.st/4d8H5N5


This is a complicated case. I don't have a good feeling about it.
I wish they would have been able to solve this locally and state etc.
Now it has gone to POTUS.

[Prairie_Seagull]

29. Being a human being on the face of the planet,

should not be illegal.

[Torchlight]

31. Homelessness, being a manmade problem

has one (or more) manmade solution(s). I think it comes fundamentally comes down to "I have mine, you should have made better choices."

A sentiment grandad echoed when anyone lauded him for his success, "I didn't make better choices than you did, sir; I was given more choices than you were."

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

33. One time a Colorado congressman said that old people have an obligation to die.

It sounded like he was a fan of "Logan's Run." In the movie, at the age of 30 (21 in the book) people took part in a ceremony -- called "carousel -- which they believed would reincarnate them, or "renew" them in younger bodies.

The truth was it was all a farce put on by people who were much older. You were not renewed -- you were executed.

According to Rep. Alan Grayson, the GOP health plan is: (1) don't get sick (2) if you get sick, die quickly.

Maybe that's the Replicaski solution to homelessness.

[GenThePerservering]

34. One of the wealthiest countries on the planet

and it's disgusting that we have people living in the streets, a great deal of the time because housing is too damned expensive. Something like 40% of the homeless in the Seattle area are employed - working taxpayers. I was chatting with a homeless couple on the tram in Portland and they worked whenever they could find work - sober, clean, decent folk with everything in two large roll-around suitcases, sleeping in parks, picking up after themselves and just keeping up their pride - but first, last and deposit for even a one room apartment is beyond their means - they can just about feed themselves.

I've slept on a good few park benches, myself, but I was a wandering whack-job and fortunately, when I was younger housing was cheaper and I could get a roof over my head (a shabby small one) on just over minimum wage. It's almost impossible in most places now but hey, the billionaires racked up enormous gains during the pandemic and just keep getting richer.

[LeftInTX]

35. Even more info: Justice Jackson made an important point:

Last edited Tue Apr 23, 2024, 01:53 AM - Edit history (1)

Sounds like all the justices are going in different directions, all kinda all over the place.

Thomas and Sotomayor raised a potential standing problem. Robinson says it is unconstitutional to make it a crime to have a particular status, but it’s less clear whether Robinson prohibits civil lawsuits arising out of an individual’s status. As Thomas noted, it’s not clear whether any of the plaintiffs named in this suit have actually been hit with a criminal sanction (as opposed to a civil fine), so they may lack standing to assert their claims under Robinson.

Meanwhile, Jackson flagged a potential mootness problem. The state of Oregon, she noted, has passed a law that limits Grants Pass’s (or any other municipality in Oregon’s) authority to target homeless individuals with ordinances like the ones in this case. So there may no longer be a live conflict between the plaintiffs in Grants Pass and the city because state law now forbids the city from enforcing its ordinances against those plaintiffs.

Very long article about today's proceedings:
https://www.vox.com/scotus/24137225/supreme-court-homelessness-grants-pass-johnson

If they can just stop the case, then it will be good. The other case may come about if the town in Idaho wants to take it to SCOTUS. SCOTUS does not seem too happy about dealing with this case. Somehow I feel common sense was lost in the process. I knew I read that Oregon changed their laws, so that this law was null and void. I just found the article confirming it. Since the law is null and void, why is it before the Supreme Court?

[gulliver]

36. She called them "homeless" not "unhoused people"

Calling them "unhoused people" harms them. It's unintentional and it has become somewhat habitual to use that supposedly empathetic term, but it implies that the hearer does not understand that the homeless are people. That offends the hearer and makes them roll their eyes. Cooperation is lost. The homeless people suffer more because of that ironic unintentional spoiling of a spirit of cooperation.

It's a difficult problem. And one never hears the phrase "unhoused people" as part of the sentence, "I went to the city, found some unhoused people, and drove them to my house so they could live in my spare bedroom." I would bet most people's opinion of the homeless living outside in a tent would be affected by whether the tent was in a city twenty miles away or out in front of their own house where they and their kids sleep.

I think the answer to homelessness has a lot to do with finding the root causes of homelessness and doing something about those.