Reclining seats on planes might go away in the future!

[True Dough]

I'd rejoice! Can't stand when the person in front of me puts their seat back as far as it can go and I have barely any space left. So annoying.

The controversial debate of reclining your seat on the plane may soon come to an end thanks to airline companies wanting to cut back on costs.

With airlines like Southwest debuting a more streamlined seat design for 2025, it’s only a matter of time before reclining seats disappear completely, aviation and travel expert William McGee told Condé Nast Traveler during an interview published on Monday, April 15.

“This trend has been occurring for several years now, and I think it will continue. Lighter seats are what the airlines want, because with the cost of jet fuel they are always looking to reduce weight onboard,” McGee, a senior fellow for aviation and travel at the American Economic Liberties Project, said.

He adds that lighter, non-reclining seats require fewer mechanical parts, and thus airline companies also save money when it comes to maintenance.

[link:https://ca.news.yahoo.com/style/airlines-may-rid-reclining-economy-224132124.html|

[JohnSJ]

1. Good. Some people are so inconsiderate, and overdo the reclining

making it very uncomfortable to the person behind them

[Initech]

36. Some asshole almost broke my laptop on a flight one time because he reclined too far.

[JohnSJ]

42. I hope you let him know. It is just garbage how inconsiderate some people are

[Initech]

54. Yeah I definitely pulled a Larry David on that one.

[jimfields33]

56. I'm glad too. Absolutely annoying.

I think some do it on purpose.

[Goodheart]

87. It's impossible to "overdo the reclining"

They never go back that far.

So, I took a long flight from New York to Edinburgh without a reclining seat and it was torture. All seats should recline.

[RainCaster]

2. I'm tired of the seats that are too damn narrow

I don't like the idea that I have to pay triple pricing just to get a seat that fits my shoulders without overlapping the shoulders of the person next to me.

[marmar]

3. It's rare that I recline my seat, but I just accept that it's going to happen. No big deal.

[pnwmom]

34. It's a big deal if your legs are long enough that your knees are crammed into the seat. nt

[yorkster]

4. So have you never wanted to recline your seat?

If you ask the person behind you, respect meal times and don't fully recline, seems
this might be less problematic.

Most likely the airlines just don't want to deal with it.

[True Dough]

6. Nope. I'm not a seat recliner.

I respect the space of the person behind me. I think it was a mistake to ever allow seats on flights to recline, especially in economy.

[ProudMNDemocrat]

5. I seldom put my seat back.

I too like more leg room. I can nap sitting upright as well.

[Model35mech]

7. If you don't like the seat STAND for the duration of the flight

I can hear the air-transport industry, pushing to pack people in like sardines in a can.

[badhair77]

8. I welcome this.

I have never had anyone ask, they just shoved back the seat. I’m not huge but I’m not thin either; it makes for a long trip. We’d all like more space and to get comfortable but not at the expense of others.

[Wonder Why]

9. So you blame others because the airlines decided to cut the space between rows? And if the airlines decide to

narrow the seats more, will you blame your seatmate(s) from further impinging on you?

At what point in the narrowing and shortening progress will you decide that it's not the people who are at fault?

[True Dough]

11. The difference between the two is the degree of control by the passenger

None of us has the ability to stop airlines from narrowing seats, but we each choose to recline or not recline the seats to infringe of the space of the person behind you.

[Wonder Why]

15. Except that the narrowing of seats and shortening of rows has made airline travel more uncomfortable

especially to those not young. As one ages, it gets more difficult to sit for hours on end straight up. And remember, it's not flight time. It's time from when you sit down until you stand to deplane which could be far more than flight time. And because of the hub and spoke system, it could be multiple flights. And in many cases, it is impossible or impractical to stand up and walk up and down the aisle for a few minutes.

It takes a lot more money to go first class and even that, on some flights, is problematic because of the tightening. I remember days when you had more room in coach than I had on my last first class flight a few years ago. Compared to years ago, our flying is minimal - about once every five years vs twice a week. And it's not because we don't want to travel. We take long-distance train, as poor as it is in scheduling and on-time performance.

Even when driving, it is generally recommended that one take a break every couple of hours - and not just for the drivers' benefit.

[badhair77]

79. I was responding indirectly to Post #4.

My response was based on personal experience. But I’m one of the nicest and most accommodating people you’ll ever meet so I would not complain to you if you reclined your seat, took the armrest, or even half sat on me if the airline narrowed the seat. I do like the suggestion that the airline offer some seats that don’t recline.

I’m a senior citizen and I also have a bad back, a botched knee surgery and I walk with a cane so I understand others desire to recline.

[Ms. Toad]

22. My seat is my seat - and the space into which the airlines permit it to reclines is mine.

You have a similar space into which you can recline. There is no need for me to ask permission to use my space, or to explain to you that my reclining seat is to accommodate a medical need..

In my case, I have a long-standing back injury. Sitting completely upright in an airline seat for more time that it takes to get airborn causes me agony for anywhere from a week to several months. I always request a reclining seat as an accommodation for that injury. Would you expect a person in a wheelchair to ask your permission to use that wheelchair?

[RandomNumbers]

24. Agree. I will pay extra and/or jump through hoops to get an aisle seat.

That gives me the best chance of being able to stand up and stretch my legs a bit.

I don't always succeed; and then if I have to use that space behind me - what you said.

[True Dough]

33. Then what the airlines ought to do

is have designated rows for recliners. Everyone else can be spared the inconvenience.

[Ms. Toad]

40. I have no problems with that,

as long as I don't have to pay extra to choose a seat that accommodates my medical needs.

Or, they could just stop shrinking the distance between seats.

[LisaM]

63. I can't use the tray table if I am reclined (or if you do).

I like to read or do crossword puzzles on flights, I also like to enjoy a gin and tonic while we're in the air. When the person in front of me fully reclines, I don't have use of my tray table. It's not just about the space. It's about having a spot where I can write or have a beverage and once you recline, I lose the ability to use my own tray table. (I go comfort or first as much as possible, but I can't always afford that).

[badhair77]

82. I was responding indirectly to Post #4 and her reference to people informing the person

in the next row. As I mentioned to someone else, my response was from personal experience. I’ve been squished in many a seat. No, asking permission is not required, it’s just a courtesy. I totally understand your accommodating a medical need, so you must do what you have to do and I’m sorry you have to suffer. I like the idea of my requesting a seat in an area that doesn’t recline. I have spinal stenosis, a herniated disk, a knee issue from bad surgery, a history of DVTs and I use a cane. Not having a reclined seat in front of me works better for me. And no, I would not expect a person in a wheelchair to ask for my permission to use the wheelchair. Hope your next flight is a pleasant one.

[Ms. Toad]

83. You would certainly qualify for an accommodation.

As a general rule, seats in front of exit rows and in exit rows do not recline, and the back seats in any section in a plane don't recline because of the wall. Accommodations are pretty easy to request. Once I've bought my ticket, I look for the accommodation request page and request a seat that reclines along with a note it is an accommodation for a back injury. With United (which I use most frequently because I have a credit card that gives me both carry on bags and a checked bag for "free" ) they usually fire off a first email that says I have to pay to choose a seat, followed by an email that tells me what seat they've assigned to me - and it has always been a reclining one.

It's been a long battle with my back - an injury sustained when the principal of the school decided to continue an assembly past the end of the school day and students started shoving each other down on top of each other and me. Most faculty hadn't bothered to attend, since administration never checked to see if we were attending, so my reward for following the rules was a back injury that I've lived with ever since then. I've mostly worked out a truce with it - as long as I avoid any stackable chairs or other upright chairs. That makes me an odd sight at many meetings, which I spend sitting on the floor in the back of the room. Physical therapy is always a nightmare, since everyone assumes that the PTs who came before them were just incompetent - and they, alone, can fix me. Even though I was seeking theraphy for entirely unrelated matters (which they completely igore). But it's been years since I had a serious flare - pretty much as long as I hold up my end of the deal my back sticks to low level (manageable) background pain. (I've also got DVT, but not the kind that is triggered by plane rides . . . the solution to mine was removing my top rib. )

[Liberal In Texas]

10. They were OK before the airlines started to cram as many seats as they could together.

But now, I could understand locking them into one place. Getting in and out of outboard seats in cabin class is nearly impossible even without them reclined.

[cally]

12. My back hurts terribly unless I recline

The shape of the seats do not fit my body. I recline and put pillows around to change the shape. Horrible news for me. For those complaining about reclining seats, remember this was not a controversy until airlines started shrinking distance between rows. Also, everyone of us has different medical issues, heights, and skeletal shapes. It changes over time for some of us. I already do my best to minimize flights while trying to still see family

[lostnfound]

17. Me too. Nt

[Ms. Toad]

18. Ditto.

I just made a simlar post about my own long-standing back issues. If reclining seats are removed, it may mean the end of flying for me.

If you but seats which don't include an ability to choose your own seat in advance, you can request - as an accommodation - that you be assigned to a reclining seat. (I know you can pay a relativley nominal fee to choose your own seat, but as a general rule, people who need a reclining seat for medical reasons should not be required to pay extra to avoid being assigned a seat that will not leave them in agony at the end of the flight.)

[Sky Jewels]

26. Same.

I don’t have back problems unless I’m on a flight with upright seats.

[mahina]

52. Same

[Oopsie Daisy]

76. Same here. I must fly in an upgraded class that I can barely afford.

[Ace Rothstein]

13. I think this is fine for short haul flights.

I couldn't imagine not being able to recline on an 8+ hour flight.

[honest.abe]

47. Exactly what I was about to write.

I have been on 14+ hour flights to Asia from DC. Few people could handle that without seat recline.

[Hekate]

72. Unfortunately, if this is allowed on short haul flights it will inevitably spread as an "option" & then be standard

Whatever happened to the Passengers’ Bill of Rights?

[Auggie]

14. Yay!

At 6'2", I loathe reclining airplane seats ... and NEVER partake myself.

[Ms. Toad]

16. That will likely mean the end of flying or me.

I have had a back injury since the mid 80s. I am always at a pain level of 1-2. If forced to sit in an upright chair for more than about 15 minutes it takes anywhere from a week to several months to return to my base level of pain. The time on the tarmack is about my limit for sitting in an unreclined airplane seat. The last time I flew and was assigned to a non-reclining seat, my flight was less than an hour and I was in agony for more than a week. This was early in the pay extra to choose your seat era. Since then I have always requested, as an accommodation, a reclining seat.
'
'So if there aren't reclining seats, I'm in a really hard place for flying. They are not just a teeny-tiny luxury for me, they are a necessity if I want to live as pain free as I am able to. (Even a 1-2 level of constant pain is exhausting - having it bumped up to more than makes life really miserable.)

[cally]

21. I have similar levels of pain

That I try to manage. Sorry you suffer!

[Layzeebeaver]

67. I concur.

At some point they are going to drug us and put the passengers in the hold and the baggage will sit in the non-reclining seat with no legroom.

[Paladin]

19. In all my years of flying, dozens and dozens of flights...

...exactly one passenger sitting in front of me has given me advance notice of their intention to recline their seat, asking as a matter of courtesy if it was alright with me. All the rest have just slammed their seats into my knees without warning or comment.

I can do without reclining seats very well.

[Phentex]

20. I have never cared about anyone reclining but I'm short

with plenty of legroom and I feel bad for tall people.

[question everything]

23. All they have to do is limit the extent to which they recline. And more space which will never happen

[2naSalit]

27. They already did that...

More than once.

[2naSalit]

25. They BARELY recline as it is already!

It was hard to notice any difference when I did recline my seat during a recent trip that took five flights roundtrip. Seriously, I barely had room for my feet. I somehow ended up with a seat with lots of leg room on the flight out of Newark where I trashed my back and other things trying to relax during my unexpected 27 hour layover with no place to stretch out for that entire time. The seat barely reclined on any of the flights. I avoided airlines like Allegiant because of the long time in air without the option of reclining at all.

I say, Boo, Hiss. I don't fly much as it is, this will make flying an option further down on the list for me. I'll take a train instead.

[Sky Jewels]

28. Keep the recline, increase the space between seats.

They won’t do it, of course.

[edisdead]

29. it teclines like an inch Woopideedoo!!!

The people that make a big deal out of this always floor me.

We are packed in like fucking sardines to min-max the dollars the airlines make off of us and people freak out about the seat reclining.

[jimfields33]

59. People want cheap flights. That's why they are

no thrills. The people asked for this and then complain when they get their cheap flights.

[spooky3]

78. I agree. I know it's an unpopular opinion but I believe

That as long as one can pay more for business class seats or extra legroom economy seats, that’s better than being miserable. Cut back somewhere else to afford less uncomfortable travel.

[Demsrule86]

30. I have had bad experiences on planes the last several times I flew. I am taking my time this summer

and driving with my husband to South Carolina for our family reunion. I spent three days in a hotel after all the planes were canceled in South Carolina a couple of years ago. The next year, we sat on the tarmac for hours...the heat was excruciating.

Last time, we barely made our connection because our plane was late, and the airline lost my husband's expensive walker. We never got it back. I used to enjoy flying. Now it is just horrible.

[hlthe2b]

31. There is no comfort whatsoever in flying today. It is an ordeal from the moment you pack your bags

that only accelerates as you enter the airport and all that happens before you depart that plane at your destination. Ending reclining seats might help in some situations, but when they seat you in the most minimal of spaces-- putting all at risk of developing DVT (Deep Vein Thrombosis) and next to so many people who have lost any respect for others, well, I think it is only going to get worse.

Most of us won't live to see the long-delayed advances in high-speed trains this nation has long desperately needed, but I hope some will. Sigh...

[DFW]

45. The hi-speed trains of Europe have, alas, discovered US Airline seating

Try a second class seat from Düsseldorf to Paris on the Eurostar train (4 hours). Someone high up in Eurostar must have flown coach on American Airlines one time and thought, „that was awful, a miserable experience. What a wonderful idea!“ The idea of providing less for more has now caught on in Europe as well.

[hlthe2b]

48. Only underscoring that Greed is...

Universal.

[DFW]

51. Not just greed, but apathy.

The bureaucrats making these decisions never have to suffer the consequences of their decisions. They ride in noiseproof limousines, private jets, or, worst case scenarios, in the first class cars, although in the case of the Eurostar, it isn‘t much better (the German ICE and the Spanish ACELA, by contrast, are).

[MineralMan]

32. Out of respect for whomever is sitting behind me,

I never recline my seat. Normally, though, I pay extra for an exit row window seat, so I have plenty of legroom.

[Ms. Toad]

41. It is not disrespectful to use the space your seat entitles you to.

If a seat is designed to recline, the person using the seat is entitled to use the space into which it reclines. So reclining does not mean one is disrespectful, as implied by your comment that respect is what keeps you from reclining.

[MineralMan]

43. What I said is that I don't recline my seat,

out of respect for the person behind me. That is a very different thing. I could recline, but I do not. My decision. Others might make other decisions, which is why I choose to pay extra for an exit row seat. That's also my decision.

I take the seat I get, but I decide what to do in it. For example, I do not use the arm rest if there is a passenger next to my arm. I generally choose a window seat, so I have one free armrest, which I use. I leave the other one for the use of the center seat passenger. My choice. My decision.

I make the choice not to cause discomfort to others. That's my choice. Others make their choices.

[oasis]

44. I'm with you on this.

I always do the same whenever I fly.

[MineralMan]

46. So I believe. I don't consider myself any more, or less, important than any other passenger.

That's how I was brought up. And, since I choose to sit next to the window in an exit row, I take a few minutes on each flight to review the instructions regarding the opening of the exit door in an emergency. Every plane model is slightly different in that operation. I get a bit more legroom, so I take the time to learn what my responsibility is. Again, respect for others.

The other DUer said that I "implied" something by saying what I choose to do. That is incorrect. I simply choose to act in ways that do not inconvenience others on that flight. Seems a simple enough choice to me.

[petronius]

65. Exit rows for me too. And middle seat gets the armrests - I think that rule is in the Constitution, or the Bible,

or somewhere...

[doc03]

35. Just as well do away with them there is

only 1/8" of legroom at best

[lark]

37. Fuck no, I won't go!

I have scoliosis and can't tolerate a straight chair back, it hurts! I am in agony on the planes now until I can recline and couldn't tolerate much of this. Those fuckers make plenty of money now and provide less and less of a service over time. I hate these greedy capitalists who care nothing for their customers - they are way, way too common.

[jimfields33]

61. They need to charge what they did in the 70's and

Bring back dinners and strict attire. Business casual should be the minimum. If they get back to the pleasant way of flying and increase the cost of the flights, it might finally get back to business. Having cheap fares are the reason they did away with the niceties. No more 50 dollar flights. A 2 hour flight should be 600 dollars at least.

[Celerity]

85. you forgot the sarcasm emoji

Bring back dinners and strict attire. Business casual should be the minimum.

A 2 hour flight should be 600 dollars at least.

[lark]

90. The most indecent attire I've ever seen in public was at Hartsfield Airport in the mid-eighties.

This young woman had short shorts that were actually cut up to reveal almost her entire ass. Her butt cheeks were literally hanging out in the open. I was shocked to see that in an airport and I had been to some wild parties, but again, this was PUBLIC!

[northoftheborder]

73. Sitting upright for more than 10 minutes is

Excruciatingly painful with my back condition. I have to recline the tiniest amount in order to not squeeze a tall person behind me. Flying used to be fun - now the whole process is an annoying tiresome painful experience.

[nevergiveup]

38. Eventually we will all be sitting on the floor

surrounded by Amazon packages.

[Hekate]

39. This just makes me so sad. I used to fly from West Coast to East Coast about once a year...

I think it’s been a decade since last I flew. My knee gave out, I had the long delayed surgery, then there was COVID, during which I rehabbed my knee. And then — Time slipped by.

Dear DUers: the fight over half-inches and inches has been created by corporate decisions, not individual passengers. We who are older aren’t maundering about how flying was better in our youth — it was objectively better up to my middle-age.

Seats were wider. Leg room was adequate for a 6-foot human. Seats had room to recline so you could ease your back, and so the passenger behind you could get in and out. These are objective facts.

The changes that make everyone so miserable are corporate decisions. They rake in the dough while we suffer — and while we fight each other. If this thread goes like some of the ones we’ve had in the past, the blame will be placed on fellow passengers, and not where it belongs: corporate greed.

[MineralMan]

49. I understand what you are saying.

However, the convenience of flying across the entire country in under 5 hours outweighs the inconvenience of traveling any other way. So, I deal with sitting on a plane, uncomfortable as that might be.

There are some choices one can make, of course. On most airlines, if you book early, you can book an exit row seat or one of the bulkhead seats and get some additional leg room. You usually have to pay a little more for that additional comfort. Or, if you can afford it, you can book one of the business or first class seats. I don't choose to do that, due to the cost.

Flying is not particularly pleasurable, so I get on the plane, sit my ass down, put my seat belt on, and do the best I can to sit there for a few hours. So far, I've managed to do that OK. If I become unable to, I'll stop flying.

[Hekate]

60. I'm going to have to investigate business class. I spent my life being frugal, and that's how I flew...

But I was younger and not arthritic, as well. Now all that stuff has caught up with me, no need to go into details except to say if I can’t periodically cross and uncross my legs it will get bad fast. I am able to block a lot of the world out with a book, starting with waiting at the airport — but there are limits.

Another consideration is that by living so frugally for so long, I find to my surprise that I actually can afford to upgrade now. And if I ever expect to see my sis again, I should.

[MineralMan]

64. There you go.

I'm not flying much any more. Since my parents are gone, I have no real reason to go to California any more. My sister is still there, but she has advanced Alzheimer's and doesn't know who I am any longer. So, I'm pretty much staying put.

[DFW]

68. Ever since my knees started deteriorating, I told my employers

Look, people, I can do the short haul flights OK, but long haul, I just can’t any more.

Fortunately, my productivity combined with my seniority were enough to persuade them to go along. If it’s just up to Norway, or down to Spain or Portugal, sure, whatever. That’s two to two and a half hours. But over to North America, East Asia or South America? If I’m expected to walk off the plane on my own, then I go business class or else get somebody else. They agreed I had put in my dues, and were cool with it.

[DetroitLegalBeagle]

70. Business/first class is the only way i fly now

Both domestic and internationally. The added expense is well worth the added comfort. More space, more recline, or fully lay flat for international, and generally include free checked bags, free carry ons, free drinks, and free food. Also have a slightly less chance of dealing with some disruptive passenger next to me or some kid who doesn't know how to behave properly.

[Elessar Zappa]

50. Good.

People can be very rude.

[Mark.b2]

53. Good. I make 2-3 trips a month, and I never recline...

I've noticed most people don't either.

[honest.abe]

55. I like the idea of the fixed pre-reclined seat.

That seems to be the best compromise.

[MineralMan]

57. I agree, unless they change the seat pitch to allow more space.

And that doesn't seem at all likely.

[ProfessorGAC]

58. Reclining Seats Were From A Different Era

Flights were expensive, so a lower % of the population flew.
As a result, there was way more than today's 13" from the back of one seat to the front edge of the next row.
When there was 18-19" between seats, a recline of 4 or 5 inches wasn't intrusive to the person behind.
Now at 13", that 4 or 5 inches is a big deal.
The increasing of passenger rows to minimize capital investment created this.
I bet the first & business class seats will still recline.

[jimfields33]

62. As they should. Business class seat can be a few thousand bucks.

First class is very expensive. Why should a guy paying 50 bucks get anything nice?

[Hekate]

71. Airlines set the prices and the spaces. As a very frugal younger person, I still had space & comfort...

Sure, first class was a spiffy world unto itself, but I had enough room to stretch my legs, recline the seat, get up and go to the restroom without falling into someone’s lap, and settle back down all while the people in the row in front of me were reclined and dozing. I could do this when I had infants, and toddlers, and barely-teens in tow.

People flying on a tight budget shouldn’t be dismissed as though they were beggars on the street corner. “Why should they get anything nice? “ We’re talking about human beings who can literally get sick and injured from the passenger accommodations now.

[ProfessorGAC]

86. And?

I wasn't suggesting 1st & B class shouldn't recline.
I was suggesting that where there is sufficient space, the seats will recline.
Not sure what your point is.

[jimfields33]

88. I just think you get what you pay for.

People expect to pay close to nothing to fly. Why do they expect anything at all from the airlines?

[ProfessorGAC]

89. We're Agreeing

Not sure why you thought otherwise.
The more expensive tickets will still offer that feature. But, in those sections there is still adequate space to provide it.
That's not true in coach.
A large fraction of my work travel was international so the company popped for B-Class over the Atlantic, 1st over the Pacific. I've been in those sections enough to confidently say there's plenty of room for reclining Seats.
But, as planes were rearranged for higher capacity, it was coach that got squeezed.
If there were still room in coach, we wouldn't have had this thread.

[marybourg]

84. The demand for flying as cheaply as possible caused this.

[newdayneeded]

66. The new saddle seat wont have recline

anyway. Google "airplane saddle seats" and prepare to scream.

[True Dough]

69. If they follow through with that,

I'm not getting on board any flight with those types of "seats."

[Hermit-The-Prog]

74. Coming soon: Each passenger will be stuffed into a cube for easier packing and higher profit.

[Renew Deal]

75. lol

Less maintenance
Less cost

Great idea!

[Hermit-The-Prog]

77. Rack 'em and stack 'em takes on a different meaning.

Rip out the seats and you could pack people 3 high.

The distinction between cargo and passenger planes will be reduced to pressurization and heat.

Watch out if they start advertising for more forklift operators.

[helpisontheway]

80. Good! Some people are so rude we were in the seats behind the extra comfort

The people had plenty of room but reclined their seat as far as it could go. At meal time I could not pull my tray table out. The flight attendant tried to give me food and I told her I had no where to put it. She had to tell the people in front of me to put their seat up so I could eat. So many selfish people.

[GenThePerservering]

81. I would be happy if they had some kind of lock-out mechanism

timed for when we eat. I can't count the times when some rube has rammed his seat back and nearly knocked my dinner or whatever into my lap or dumped my glass of water. The rest of the time I don't care. The flights I take are generally 8 hours to 17-18 hours, and I'll sleep sitting or or reclined slightly, it doesn't matter - I can put the pillow behind my lower back. I just don't want a lap full of turkey tetrazini.