An incident at my gym today...

[CaliforniaPeggy]

I was wearing my Obama 08 t-shirt with my sweat pants during my workout this morning. It's a nice one, navy blue with stitched letters and the Obama symbol.

Next to me, on the recumbent bike was an old man. When I was getting ready to finish my ride, he turned to me and this conversation began:

"Pardon me, but I don't think that t-shirt is an appropriate one to wear to the gym."

"Oh really? Well, I'm sorry, but I think it is."

"Well, I have freedom of speech too." WTF?

"Of course you do. I would never deny you that right." And then I walked away.


Weird.

[FSogol]

1. I would have told the staff he was exposing himself to females in the gym.

[freshwest]

6. Technically, that would be true. He was exposing his dumbassery!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

7. Um.......NO. I know you're kidding, but still.........

[FSogol]

19. Heh, heh. Just using your freedom of speech, right?

(Yeah, I was just kidding.)

[valerief]

98. Bwahahaha! Good one! nt

[AsahinaKimi]

2. He probably hasn't found a decent

Romney Tee shirt... um, not that there will ever be one.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

4. I thought that too!

[AsahinaKimi]

11. YAY!

Great minds think alike!

[Xyzse]

20. You have something there.

They did say that the R in the logo makes it look like a male's posterior.
Not really the best thing to see at a gym.

[liberal N proud]

3. What does your wearing a t shirt have to do with their freedom of speech

They could wear a Palin shirt too if they wanted.

Oh the stupidity.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

5. I mean, really!

[Chorophyll]

97. Right? People should have to prove the understand what free speech is before

they throw that phrase around.

(Which would, ironically, be a violation of free speech. Sigh.)

[Amaril]

112. It's that whole......

....disagreeing with them = persecuting / bullying them.

It's the same logic that turns "Happy Holidays" into a war on Christmas.

[Brother Buzz]

8. I suspect he's mad because he doesn't have the courage or conviction to wear a Romney shirt

[CaliforniaPeggy]

21. Could be......I really don't know.

[Politicalboi]

9. Maybe because it was an

08 shirt. Now, GET OFF MY LAWN!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

12. Somehow, I suspect it was the Obama part rather than the 08!

[Politicalboi]

17. That's what I would have told him

Sorry, but I didn't get a new one this year.

But yes I am kidding about the 08.

[yardwork]

83. Get off my lawn!!! is exactly what I thought when I saw this.

[freshwest]

10. Good for you! I wish I could see some men wearing this on a T-shirt...

It would make me feel a lot safer!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

14. Thanks! I do not shy away from controversy........

[Liberalynn]

13. PUKES think they are the only ones entitled to free speech

[CaliforniaPeggy]

16. That could very well be...

I think I showed him otherwise...

[Liberalynn]

75. Yes you did!

[Dawson Leery]

110. The Dixie Chicks vs Hank jr. and the response the Country crowd.

[Cali_Democrat]

15. That is weird

Very weird.

Just make sure people like that don't follow you. Take glances over your shoulder every now and then. Creepy assholes are everywhere.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

18. I would be very surprised if he'd pulled a stunt like that.

I'm bigger than he is, anyway.

He was old.

[Rambis]

22. The crazy fuckers are emboldened

They scream about freedom when they wouldn't know freedom if it walked up and bit them in the ass!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

24. True that!

[marions ghost]

23. This perfectly encapsulates the Rethug sense of entitlement

"your shirt offends MOI"...in fact, whatever you're doing offends Moi--(but I can do what I like).

Deliberate intimidation. They have no shame.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

28. I have enough emotional strength that these types don't bother me.

I tend to get up on my high horse when confronted!

[marions ghost]

51. I guess if you're strong enough to wear the shirt

you're strong enough to deal with the turkeys it could attract. It does worry me that this kind of thing causes people NOT to wear the shirt (or the sticker or button, whatever) when they know it will attract this kind of attention. This is a Rethuglican issue--I can't imagine anyone on the Liberal side giving somebody some stuff about a damn shirt. That is how tiny-brained they are. This is typical of their nasty behavior.

I'm gonna dig out my 2008 shirt today--you reminded me....Got my 2012 button and stickers (& yard sign even), but forgot about that shirt.

[AlbertCat]

86. It does worry me that this kind of thing causes people NOT to wear the shirt

Well, I had to take my Darwin fish off my car after they slashed my tires.... it's just too expensive!

[marions ghost]

101. Yeah back in the 90's

we had a brick thrown through the rear glass of our car right before the election--our car with the Clinton/Gore and other left-leaning stickers...

My sister actually got nearly run off the road (going over a long bridge) recently late at night--she has several stickers like "Scientists for Obama"--not too inflammatory you would think. It was very clear that it was an act of domestic terrorism. Didn't get any info for cops to work with. Her 22-year old daughter was in the car--she was so scared she won't talk about it to this day.

It's even worse now. Yeah, gotta be careful. They're dangerous.

[nadine_mn]

59. do you have your bayonet ready on your high horse?

ha! I am sorry you had that awkward exchange - I work out at the Y and one of the TVs is always on Fox and its hard to resist the urge to hurl.

You were much more pleasant than I might have been - I get a little crabby after a workout - hell just climbing up the damn stairs is a workout - I look forward to using the bike because I get to sit down and rest...hee hee.

[roody]

99. DUZY here!!!

[CreekDog]

115. that's cool

as long as it doesn't dance!

[lpbk2713]

25. It is to your credit that you are so much a lady.

I would have dealt with confrontational stupidity in an entirely different manner.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

30. Aw, thank you......

I will stand up for what I believe, but I do not believe causing a public fuss works out for the best in the long run.

YMMV!

[marions ghost]

32. they wouldn't do this kind of thing to a guy

--maybe something else (like throw a brick through your window) --but this kind of thing is reserved in our culture exclusively for women, perpetrated by tragically insecure men.

She wasn't being a "lady," she just wasn't tangling with a jerk.

[NYC_SKP]

26. I wish we lived in the same city, Peg!

I'd spot you while you press 250#, you know you can do it!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

33. My dear NYC_SKP!

*thud*

NO way could I do that!

You'd make a great gym buddy, that's for sure!

[NYC_SKP]

46. How about one-fitty?

Or, how about fitty?

[Gidney N Cloyd]

89. C'mon, CalPeg, get with the program!

[pinboy3niner]

100. +1

LOVE the Ryan workout meme!

[librechik]

27. I would have said Why aren't you wearing your Coolidge T-shirt?

lol

[CaliforniaPeggy]

34. Oh, FUCKING PERFECT!

[1StrongBlackMan]

29. I suspect this guy ...

has come to believe that his freedom of speech includes denying you your's. Wonder where he got that idea?

[CaliforniaPeggy]

38. I suspect you're right...

He's an older Caucasian male, and is most likely used to getting his own way.

It's cultural.

[Populist_Prole]

63. Those types sure do seem to be the worst offenders in that regard

If they want to spend what should be their golden years screaming at the changing culture, that's their problem.

[porphyrian]

31. They have to silence others to win, and they are still losing. n/t

[CaliforniaPeggy]

39. Exactly right. n/t

[ejbr]

35. Missed opportunity

as you were in a gym, you could have hit a dumb bell with a dumb bell.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

42. Um, no.........I don't do that!

[Hutzpa]

36. He wanted to chat you up, but didn't know how

[CaliforniaPeggy]

43. Uh.........I DON'T think so, LOL!

[Baitball Blogger]

37. Was it the "Y"?

They are pretty conservative there.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

44. Not the Y........it's a private, local gym. But my area is full of these conservatives...n/t

[geardaddy]

65. The "Y" here (YWCA)

is nice and liberal. They never have Fox on. Their slogan is "eliminating racism, empowering women."

[Baitball Blogger]

68. YMCA?

They use to have FoxNews 24/7 during the early W years. But now they have three main screens. Fox does get more visility, but MSNBC can be found in the rear.

[geardaddy]

69. I haven't been the the YM in years.

There's a YW right near my house. It's so much better.

[BlueJazz]

40. He was really saying "Your shirt bothers me" which means...

"I spend my whole life trying to be pissed off and unhappy with the state of the Universe"

I think it's a lost cause, pal...

[CaliforniaPeggy]

47. It was clear he was upset by my shirt. Too bad!

[rightsideout]

41. So his idea of "Freedom of Speech" is denying yours?

Where do they come up with this molasses for brains thinking?

[CaliforniaPeggy]

48. I guess they think they're entitled!

[Raster]

50. These are republicans. Of course his idea of freedom of speech is denying yours.

[TeamPooka]

61. exactly!

[pinboy3niner]

45. You should have told him...

"I'm sorry. My 'Fuck Romney' shirt is at the cleaners."

[CaliforniaPeggy]

49. Now, that's terrible, my dear pinboy!

Terribly funny!

[TeamPooka]

62. rotflmao

[rivegauche]

82. YEAH!! Love it!

[The Doctor.]

52. As has been said, they feel that speech they disagree with infringes on their 'freedom'.

But it's not about freedom of speech for them, it's about being incompetent at or incapable of using reason. They are generally very poor at using tools like reason and logic, so they have no depth of conviction in their political views. They don't realize that there is a way to ascertain the validity of a given opinion or position, so they must pour a great deal of blind faith into their position. In doing so, they inextricably tie those positions to their egos. Their political affiliations become a major part of their identity.

So what we wind up with are people who see speech running contrary to their positions as a threat to their very identities. Their egos cannot bear the notion that there are hostile ideas out there that they have no defense against. Interestingly, this is the main reason they become addicted to Fox 'News' and Rush: Those sources give them the false sense that their positions, and therefore identities are unassailable by hostile ideas. Sadly, at some level they know damn well that there is little real substance to their beliefs... which is why they respond with such hostility to any messages that 'threaten' them.

[Chiyo-chichi]

53. You know... there are lots of websites that sell "Rmoney" shirts.

I'd be tempted to get one and the next time I saw him, say "Sir... I got you a Mitt Romney shirt so that you can exercise your free speech, too." I'd do it just to see if he noticed.

[sevenseas]

78. Wouldn't work in Georgia because people here are so ignorant.

Great idea, except not for Georgia. They would think RMoney is Romney spelled correctly, and would give a thumbs-up as they pass by.

[rurallib]

54. Peggy - you were supposed to bow to his superior male intellect

and immediately admit your mistake. Thence hie yourself to the dressing room for something much more to his liking.

No wonder Republican men are so cranky. They never ever get the respect they deserve from you uppity women!

[LondonReign2]

55. he seems to think freedom of speech means..

..freedom not to see or hear speech he disagrees with.

Republiks iz dumb.

[warrior1]

56. What a jerk.

You should have given him your patented CaliforniaPeggy "My Dear, Fuck you!" But we all know that you don't swear.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

67. I certainly don't swear.....

Except to folks who know me!

[NCTraveler]

57. For starters, you rock.

Second, he clearly does not understand the meaning of "freedom of speech" in the good old US of A.

[flamingdem]

58. I was on a treadmill listening to a nasty discussion between 2 guys

who were both convincing each other that Obama is bad for business etc.

I wanted to jump in but kept my mouth shut! arrrrg.

[Liberal_in_LA]

60. WTF is right.

[silvershadow]

64. Freedom of speech to them usually means freedom to suppress our speech. What a tool. n/t

[tblue37]

66. This is like the RW fundie belief that anyone who is not Christian is

suppressing the fundies' freedom of religion if the non-Christian asks the fundies to stop attacking them for not having the same beliefs.

Or like the fundie belief that anti-bullying laws suppress their freedom of religion.

These people seem to think that if anyone expresses any idea or belief, however innocuous, that in any way diverges from the fundies' belief, then that person is attacking and suppressing the fundies' freedom of speech or freedom of religion.

Of course, the fundies feel perfectly comfortable attacking the beliefs or the freedom of speech of anyone who differs in any way from what tthe fundies believe!

[Voice for Peace]

70. his defense is probably that it raises his blood pressure

and that's why he mentions rights -- he wants a neutral zone,
and I don't blame him, but people need to learn that if
something is offensive to them, they can just look at
something else, or walk away.. no need to suffer.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

71. Don't you get it? He's convinced he's being repressed...

[reflection]

72. Tell him if you cared what he thought

you'd listen to AM talk radio and watch Fox news so you could just cut out the middle man.

[DrewFlorida]

73. Excellent response!

[femrap]

74. You are so

patient with the dude....thinking he can tell you what to wear.

I always have to give a smart ass comment. Someday, someone will probably shoot me in the back. Just so I don't see it coming.

[Rider3]

76. Brilliantly handled!

[southernyankeebelle]

77. So the old man thought he didn't have the right to free speech? Crazy Man.

I was in line on the first day of voting and some guy behind us said something about freedom. I turned and asked him what freedom was taken from him? He cleared his throat and said it was his wife that was saying it. I told him he needs to tell his wife to turn Fox News off. He laughed.

[Javaman]

79. Like I always say...

people are stupid.

[midnight]

80. My speech trumps your speech so you have to be silent.... It's an ALEC virus coming to your

community...

[rivegauche]

81. You silly woman.

Did you forget that freedom of speech only applies to THEM? Entitled old white republicans, of course. And what were you doing wasting time at the gym when you should have been home making dinner for your family??

[GoCubsGo]

84. It's the old "I know you are but what am I?" reflex.

Any time one of them or their mouthpieces says something nasty, and the left complains about it, they try to turn it back on us, claiming we're denying them free speech. See: The Chick-fil-A controversy. The CEO expresses homophobia. The Left gets upset and calls for a boycott of his crap food, and in calling for a boycott, somehow the Left is denying his free speech, even though he has always been free to spew his hate. This guy is probably just automatically acting on his latent reptilian brain reflexes in this regard.

[titanicdave]

85. the guy

undoubtedly has "Romnesia" but "Obamacare" can cure it

[Arugula Latte]

87. It's like the religious nuts who think that NOT restricting the rights of gays

infringes on their religious freedom.

Sense. It makes none.

[SunSeeker]

88. Amazing how some people don't get any smarter with age.

He thinks freedom of speech means freedom from speech. This old dude doesn't even know what freedom of speech means. But he sure knows hate. Sad that he is spending the short time he has left on earth hating on people.

[David Zephyr]

90. They are crazy. Right wing radio and fox ignited their paranoia.

Love your t-shirt! Go Obama!

[busterbrown]

91. Bet he would have loved that fucking Batman white face t shirt.....Shithead!

[SleeplessinSoCal]

92. I think Republicans are being encouraged to challenge Obama supporters everywhere.

Fortunately, freedom of speech goes both ways. You expressed yours and he his. Of course your t shirt is appropriate. He could have said something about being from 08, but didn't. He could have asked where is your 2012 t shirt? He could have been very nasty.

I think you handled it perfectly. I'd have probably said something like "enjoy your medicare. I won't have any when I get to your age if Romney/Ryan are elected".

[Warren DeMontague]

93. "Tough shit, gramps"

You're more polite than I am, I think.

[gollygee]

94. It isn't called "Freedom to decide what shirts others wear"

It's called "Freedom of speech."

There is no part of the freedom of speech that allows you to restrict the speech of others.

[Marr]

95. I'd have said, "love it or leave it, commie".

And when he's fumbling over that one, start chanting, "USA! USA! USA!".

[NICO9000]

96. My wife wears her Hope shirt from '08 a lot these days

We're in L.A. so she hasn't had anyone try to give her any shit. They'd be in for a shock too since the missus is just loaded for bear with these idiots. She says she's seen a whopping one RMoney bumper sticker here which is one more than I've seen so far.

[DeschutesRiver]

102. This is also how Palin incorrectly defined freedom of speech - was there was a government act

that was somehow interfering with this old guy's desire to express himself?

No. His freaking 1st amendment right to freedom of speech is the right to express ideas and beliefs, etc, free of GOVERNMENT RESTRICTION.

So yes, he has "freedom of speech" and no, your wearing an Obama t-shirt can not possibly interfere with his freedom of speech since there is no government action involved. I'd be wearing my Obama shirt to the gym every day, and the next time he opened his mouth, I'd have a handout ready for him that explains free speech - I'd pull it together at about an 8th grade reading/comprehension level. I'd tell him I'd be glad to school him on anything else he missed out on learning during his education process over the years (because he is really old enough to freaking know this stuff - if he is going to quote the constitution, get it right).

There is simply a wave of people who seem to believe that the 1st amendment is their right to shut down ordinary people from expressing their views, if they find them unpleasant or contrary to their beliefs. And it has nothing to do with that at all.

[jackbenimble]

103. I was thinking something totally different

Like he was a republican, and also a dirty old man who didn't want to see Obama while staring at your chest. LOL, I was imagining you saying something like the Obama shirt was your way of making sure creepy old republicans weren't staring...

[CaliforniaPeggy]

104. Well, he was sitting next to me, to my right...

Staring at my chest from that angle would be an exercise in frustration, esp. since I'm anything but large, lol!

I can be pretty outspoken when I want to be, but somehow I can't see myself saying what you imagined I had said!

[-LOKI -BAD FOR YA]

105. after nov 6 you can proudly wear your obama t-shirt ,no one will be wearing romney t-shirts n\t

[KurtNYC]

106. Let's get him an appropriate t-shirt for a Romney supporter at the gym....

"America's Biggest Loser"

http://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=biggest+loser+tshirt&tag=googhydr-20&index=aps&hvadid=12949825555&hvpos=1t1&hvexid=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=351338270825180028&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=b&ref=pd_sl_8hhip280ih_b

[CaliforniaPeggy]

107. I LOVE it!

However, I hope I never see him again......

We're not exactly close, if you know what I mean......

[booley]

108. Freedom isn't a Pie

I think that's the source of the problem

Too many on the right think their rights mean they can deny others of rights.

So this guy having freedom of speech means he thinks he can keep you from having freedom as well.

They see freedom like a pie, the more one person has the less someone else gets

[CaliforniaPeggy]

109. Thank you for the great analogy!

They see freedom like a pie, the more one person has the less someone else gets

This is exactly how they see it, and they could not be more wrong!

[Dawson Leery]

111. The YMCA in Milford has a group of old white men (from Orange)

who spend their time talking in the weight room. They are just like this jackal. They see the "others" as taking their freedom away.

[Hekate]

113. "Get your own T-shirt, buddy" is a sufficient answer

Tsk. Silly old man.

Hekate

[CreekDog]

114. have you considered joining a gym in Culver City?

[CaliforniaPeggy]

116. Nope, I haven't.

This is close to my house, and very reasonably priced.