School guidance counselor/teacher fired for job as lingerie model 17 years earlier

[HiPointDem]

The NY Post covers the story of Tiffany Webb, a former guidance counselor at Murry Begtraum who was fired for a past job she had as a bikini and lingerie model.

Webb, now 37, had posed for the photos when she was 18-20 and disclosed the job when she was first hired by the DOE. The photos have shown up on the Internet over the past few years, leading to her being "rubber roomed" twice for a year each while the DOE investigated the case. There was also a third investigation conducted without a rubber room imprisonment.

Webb received satisfactory ratings every year and was respected by colleagues and students, juggling a case load of 540 students according to the Post. Nonetheless, she was fired for "conduct unbecoming a DOE employee" on December 23 of last year after a student allegedly showed photos of the lingerie-clad to the principal of the school at the time.

http://perdidostreetschool.blogspot.com/2012/10/sue-baby-sue.html#comment-form


wait, wait, it's impossible to fire teachers and unionized employees!

[treestar]

1. God that's awful

What is even wrong with lingerie modeling?

[HiPointDem]

3. you know, bad influence on our impressionable youth. everyone is concerned about it.

surely you can see the difference:

[treestar]

5. Especially silly if her modeling was JC Penney catalogue type stuff

If it was sexy lingerie that's one thing, but nothing like what people see as you say in those photos above anyway.

I don't see how it means she can't teach now. That's just horrid. People should not be paying for everything they do 18-20 for life.

[HiPointDem]

6. not jc penney, but nothing worse than what you see in music videos, apparently.

http://www.google.com/search?q=tiffany+webb&hl=en&prmd=imvnsuo&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=6OZxUL6PE4WpiQKDnIGYDA&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1024&bih=605

[treestar]

7. Not that bad

And if that's her today as a teacher in row 2, she hardly looks like the same person.

[HiPointDem]

9. no, that's a law student. but tiffany's modeling was about 20 years ago & more importantly,

fully disclosed when nyc hired her.

to turn around and fire her for moral turpitude after 12 years' employment is out of bounds and clearly related to nyc's education deform agenda.

she'll win in court, i'm sure. another waste of money for nyc, and another bit of evidence that shows nyc doesn't care about the money, just about harrassing educators.

[treestar]

14. Their definition of "moral turpitude" including such a thing

is pretty harsh. Geez! And we can't lose good teachers over this kind of thing! Especially from so long ago.

[99th_Monkey]

36. Well, there's lingerie modeling, and then there's "lingerie modeling"

I'm not sure which applies to the news story, but neither in my view should
justify her dismissal.

PORTLAND, Ore. - The sign outside Ben Cunningham’s Southwest Portland business reads: "Pussycats." But according to his business paperwork, this establishment is a religious organization.

According to public documents filed with the Oregon Secretary of State, Cunningham registered the business as a tax-exempt religious organization called "XXX Church."

Pussycats is one of Portland's full-nude "lingerie modeling" shops, which critics say are unregulated outfits that sometimes sell sex.

A former employee says the only worshiping that goes on at Pussycats is by done by clients who pay money for sex.

"I worked there and made thousands of dollars," Nikki said.

"Nikki" agreed to talk to KATU News as long as it did not use her real name or her performer name.

"If you want to get (oral sex) you are going to get (oral sex). If you want to have sex - you're going to have sex," she said.
http://www.katu.com/news/local/Undressed--unregulated-Inside-the-lingerie-modeling-industry-140681223.html

[postulater]

2. The "rubber room"? The school has a special room for rubbers?

That should be investigated.

[HiPointDem]

4. lol. i agree, it's suspicious.

[Igel]

31. I've only heard this with reference to NYC.

IIRC it's a room where teachers go and sit. They're on contract so their time isn't their own, on the other hand the school has nothing that they want to the teachers to do.

So you go to school, sign in, report to a room with other rubber-roomed teachers, and you sit. Then, at the end of the day, you go home.

Since I first heard of the practice I've wondered what happens if you call in sick. Do you have to arrange for a sub to take your place? Do they have planning pull-outs?

[HiPointDem]

32. lol. "i need a sub for my rubber room duty, strep throat today" fwiw, nyc isn't the only place

with 'rubber rooms,' e.g. chicago has the same thing with a different name. i suspect all urban districts do.

[DiverDave]

47. It's a power trip for management.

Yes (they tell you) you have a union contract, but we still own your ass.
I delivered some equipment to the Chrysler plant in Newark De. (since shut down). and saw a huge room filled with people reading the paper and playing cribbage and chess, hundreds just hanging around.
I asked what the f, and was told that since they were retooling the line
the overlords decided the workers should just SIT for 8 hours a day.
Not maybe go out and help around the community, not DOING something that would
have uplifted everyone, nope.
The message was 'you aint gonna get a free vacation from US.'
Absolutely disgusting and despicable.
Oh, I never found out what the management did during that time.
Golf in Myrtle Beach,I suspect.

[Ishoutandscream2]

8. I've been a school counselor/teacher for 27 years now

And I hope to God my administration doesn't dig up some stuff on me from some 30 years ago.

Seriously, this is some real kind of bullshit.

[Posteritatis]

29. It was right before she was to get tenure, so I assume someone was trying to find things. (nt)

[LadyHawkAZ]

10. Woman models lingerie as teen = fired from teaching job 17 years later

Last edited Mon Oct 8, 2012, 02:31 AM - Edit history (1)

Man poses nude in his 20s = gets elected to Senate.

Women's bodies BAD, DIRTY, SHOULDN'T BE AROUND KIDS. Naked men GOOD, MAKE LAWS.

Nope, no double standard there.

[Xedniw]

11. Nice!

You hit the nail on the head.

[LadyHawkAZ]

12. I hit the PALM on the head, too n/t

[Posteritatis]

13. I've merely been hitting the head on the desk. (nt)

[proud2BlibKansan]

15. Absolutely ridiculous.

[HopeHoops]

16. Yeah, and my daughters get shit in the mail with young women their age in such "outfits".

Good fucking grief. I'll assume she wasn't working for the district when she posed. Hell, I smoked pot. Obama smoked pot. That doesn't disqualify either of us to be president, but I've got a lot of stuff in MY department that does. I just don't get this puritan bullshit in a society where you can look up nasty porn by entering something like "hairy preggo fucks a horse" in Google and get a million or so hits.

I haven't seen the pictures of Webb, but 18-20 is a prime time for posing nude. What's the problem there? Every fucking museum in the country has paintings from prudish periods in European history with chunky nude women. Curiously, there aren't any slender ones I can think of. Being chunky was associated with prosperity (as in SHE HAS FOOD TO EAT).

Okay, okay. I'm trying to avoid getting angry here. Fuck it. I'm angry.

[HiPointDem]

17. she didn't pose nude, though. swimsuits and lingerie. and she told the district that 12 years ago

when she was hired.

it really is a railroad. the bloomie squad is trying to shit-can tenured teachers *by any means possible*.

there are many cases like this. not necessarily lingerie models, but railroad phoney-baloney reasons for firings and layoffs.

[HopeHoops]

19. I don't care if she did a full Hustler spread (literally) - it still has nothing to do with today.

[HiPointDem]

21. agreed. fact remains, she didn't do anything that can't be seen daily in major media.

[HopeHoops]

23. Hell, most of the porn on the net is old stuff anyway (well, at least the good stuff).

It is easy money for that age range. Bad decision, perhaps, but it shouldn't apply to current affairs. The Aaaahnold posed damn near nude (with a prominent unit in a thong) and he still got elected to a governorship. Why do we apply different standards to women? It's so fucked up I can't even find words for it (and if you read my posts, you KNOW I'm good at finding words). Hell, the Gubenator actually WAS nude in the Terminator movies. Why is our society so pent up about the fact that PEOPLE HAVE BODIES?

But the main point is that they fired her for something she did, I presume (details weren't provided) before she even got the job. On the practical side, at 18-20 you wouldn't have a B.A. in education so she couldn't have been a teacher at the time. What she does on their clock is one thing. What she did before it is irrelevant. I hope she sues the shit out of them, not to get her job back, but to prove a point and get some money to move on to a more rational district.

[MadHound]

18. Part of the double standard that most teachers live with,

Your life is supposed to be an open book, and you are supposed to be squeaky clean. But hey, if you dare to have your picture taken holding an alcoholic beverage, or do lingerie modeling before you were even a teacher, off with your head.

But *gasp* teachers shouldn't have tenure, nope, nope. It keeps them from getting fired.

[etherealtruth]

20. Complete and utter stupidity

First and foremost, should any adult really be judged by what they did as an 18 year old ? I am not talking about heinous crimes ... just the normal immature bs (I am not even sure this even rises to that).

If this woman was a Victoria's Secret model right now ... would that make her unfit? I don't think so.

Stupid, stupid, stupid folk in positions of power.

[LiberalFighter]

22. Can it be conduct unbecoming if it didn't occur during her period as a teacher?

I think the student that provided the photos should be thrown out of school. Student likely doing it to get back at the teacher for something s/he did wrong.

[SaveAmerica]

24. My thought as well, not unbecoming a teacher if she wasn't a teacher then

I hope she gets good returns on her lawsuit.

[etherealtruth]

25. I don't think there should be any repercussions for the student ....

What did the student do that was wrong?

I don't think the teacher did anything wrong (posted upthread to that effect) ... but the student did absolutely nothing wrong.

From where I sit the only one's that did anything wrong were the administrators that decided to let a competent and experienced person go .

[Posteritatis]

28. In practice "conduct unbecoming" translates as "we don't like you for whatever reason." (nt)

[Nye Bevan]

26. What am I missing? Modeling underwear is completely legal.

Why should she be fired for that?

[Kalidurga]

27. She forgot to put her burka under the underwear.

This is even worse than the bank employee that got fired 30 years after she committed a petty crime that had nothing to do with her current employment.

[Scootaloo]

30. She's a woman, and a teacher

She's supposed to dress in a sack, never drink, never be seen with men, have her hair tightly bound, and never, ever, EVER let her ankles be seen. Like the good ol' days of the 1840's.

[Igel]

35. No. You misconstrue.

She must never let anything she do be grounds for a parent to have a nasty meeting with a principal.

The principals say they have your back just like their bosses say they have the principals' backs. They know it's often a fiction, and you have to know who's making this claim before you can put any stock in it whatsoever.

Sorry. Bad week.

[Igel]

34. You're missing a squishy clause in many contracts.

A clause that says anything that reduces the dignity and efficacy of you as a teacher or of the school's mission is grounds for dismissal.

There's a time problem here, since the events happened long ago and were disclosed before being hired.

But if the students start sniggering at a teacher because they've seen more of her boobs and butt than permitted by the dress code, then it can be argued it reduces her ability to be a good teacher. Some of it depends on how the teacher handles it. But there are always students who want teachers fired. You give them a bad grade and it's personal because they can't imagine that rules are meant to be followed or tests intended to be passed, so they want personal revenge. They're teenagers, so you expect immaturity. Their brains won't finish the big parts of maturation for another 6-8 years: Think about it, if the kid's 16 it means there's more time between now and when s/he matures than there is between now and when s/he hit puberty.

I don't think it should be argued that she reduces the achievement of the ed mission o the school, however. Entire school districts can do things that make them a laughingstock, but seldom are the administrators responsible fired or the school board members forced to resign.

[Odin2005]

33. And yet a male model can be elected to Teddy's Senate seat.

My Jr. High English teacher was a contender for Miss Minnesota, people thought it was cool, not a scandal.

[badhair77]

37. I was thinking the same think about Scottie boy.

I guess the standards for the Senate are much lower than the standards for teaching. The pay and perks are lower also.

[diabeticman]

38. 1- what is a "rubber roomed" 2- What is the DOE 3- IF they knew about the modeling before she

was hired WHY the Hell is it an issue now?


Something is wrong with this story. It smells.

[HiPointDem]

39. the "rubber room" is where nyc puts teachers it has removed from the classroom but does not

have sufficient cause or evidence to fire outright. they pay them to sit in the room.

in the age of education reform, there are a lot of senior teachers there.

supposedly they scrapped the rooms in 2010 & assigned teachers administrative duties but word is there are still teachers sitting in rubber rooms doing nothing.

it smells because bloomberg has mayoral control of schools in nyc & his aim is to fire senior teachers. the directive has been handed down even to the level of individual schools and (some) principals are complicit.

the bloomberg admin bills the 'rubber rooms' as evidence that unions make it impossible to fire teachers. they want to make teachers fireable at the mayors' discretion.

the teachers in the rooms say they can't be fired because they were not removed from classrooms for any fireable cause -- which is why the admin has been unable to prove they committed any fireable offense.

been going on for some time.

here's a STEM teacher who was assigned to a rubber room after he questioned some financial practices at his school. he had excellent reviews. he is a teacher who came to teaching later in life and didn't think tenure was necessary. now tenure is the only thing keeping him from being shitcanned by the will of his principal.

&feature=player_embedded#!

[diabeticman]

40. Thanks for the information. This helps me understand much better and I think it is B.S. what they

are doing to this woman.

[HiPointDem]

42. more video

rubber room documentary

&feature=related


teacher portelos vlogging his time in a rubber room

&feature=relmfu

&feature=relmfu

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

41. If she was a middle-aged man modeling diapers in houses of prostitution

she'd now be in the U.S. Senate receiving standing ovations for her modeling performance.

[Rose Siding]

43. "Most overcrowded school in the city" where fights break out daily...

Seems they have bigger problems they could have worked to overcome-

John Elfrank-Dana, a history teacher at the school, told DNAInfo that fighting at the school wasn't that unusual: "There are fights just about every day. But this was one of the biggest ruckuses I've seen in a long time." Altogether, police issued summonses to six teens for disorderly conduct and one for assault.

Last fall, the United Federation of Teachers said that Murry Bergtraum High School was the most overcrowded school in the city, with 104 overcrowded classes. The school was most prominently in the news after the principal took away students bathroom privileges in December 2010 after a fight between two students. A riot much like this one ensued, with kids screaming and running through the hallways like a tween version of a jailhouse riot.

http://gothamist.com/2012/03/03/video_crazy_policestudents_fight_at.php

[HiPointDem]

44. NYC is purposefully overcrowding certain schools they want to close.

[intheflow]

45. Fired right before she was about to get tenured.

I think this sounds like clear sex-discrimination and violation of first amendment rights. She did nothing illegal and by any reasonable measure this happened far outside any statute of limitations. Not to mention, some student could have had it in for her and photoshopped her head onto another more revealing body. This is utter bullshit.

[HiPointDem]

49. exactly.

[Matariki]

46. I hate shitty journalists. What the hell is "rubber roomed" & "rubber room imprisonment"?

You can't just throw out provocative terms like that without any explanation. Bad journalist. To the rubber room with you...

[HiPointDem]

48. because the rubber rooms got a lot of play in the news in ny, writer probably assumed

readers knew what they were.