Suze Orman- "There's nothing wrong if you're a renter for the rest of your life"

[Bozita]

On ABC Nightline.

The corporate media readies the masses for the new American reality.

If you'd like to skip all the small shit, pick up a copy of Naomi Klein's "The Shock Doctrine."

If you want it in small doses, tune in to your fav corporate media information dispenser.

I can't believe I'm actually watching this!

[ClarkUSA]

1. She's right. There are areas where it makes more sense to rent rather than buy.

[bettyellen]

14. exactly, owning is not for everyone,and many in this country cnnot and should not attempt it

but if they ever could, now owuld be the time...BUY LOW!

[sendero]

64. Housing is going lower..

... there's plenty of time.

[bettyellen]

73. I was kind of joking because for most people it;s a once in a lifetime thing or opportunity and if t

the timining isn;t right, then it wasn;t the smartest way to go and they are underwater and it;s a nightmare.
And the thing id mnany Amerocans can nowhere near afford it these days- especially when the market is bad, because they do not have the stable income. In NYC, it is not necesarily the norm. Plenty of happy renters for life.

[KamaAina]

136. Of course, tenants in NYC have actual rights

unlike those in 95% of the country.

[county worker]

149. But the cost of money is going to go up.

What matters is what you pay per month and if you can get a loan. There will be higher down payments required and higher interest costs now that Fanny and Freddy are gone.

No matter if the price of a house goes down, the cost of a loan and the assets needed to purchase are going higher.

[sendero]

172. You are correct...

... but the timing of that rise is uncertain. Meanwhile, housing will keep getting cheaper and when the cost of money rises, it will get cheaper faster.

[Horse with no Name]

120. Except that NOW that prices are low

the government has made it difficult if not impossible for people to buy. It will be gobbled up by speculators and another bubble will form and then we will be allowed to buy at inflated rates and reduced credit requirements. But let us common folks buy it now? Pshaw...do you really think that the masses would be allowed to get a good deal?

[WingDinger]

95. Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and anothe

Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?

[okieinpain]

130. no kidding, I was in california around 1990 and one of the guys

we were in class with took us to see the house he had just purchased for 180,000 dollars. house could not have been a foot over 900 square feet, that is crazy.

[superduperfarleft]

2. I'm not seeing the problem here.... n/t

[Bozita]

6. She's stressing lower expectations. Like in lower salaries.

The program started with a story of a wonderful mother who had saved enough money during her son's school years to be able to afford college for him.

All nice and good. I approve.

Suze never mentioned what happens to the kids of those of us who don't make enough to save enough for a college education.

The all new and improved America?

[superduperfarleft]

9. How? I make a pretty good salary, and I choose to rent.

"There's nothing wrong if you're a renter for the rest of your life." I completely agree.

[wtmusic]

12. It depends on who you are.

Blanket statements like that grab attention, but are not helpful to people who should be putting their money into equity.

[superduperfarleft]

19. Of course it depends on who you are. And there's nothing wrong if you're a renter for the rest of

your life.

I'm still not seeing what the outrage over this statement is about.

[wtmusic]

32. Cookie cutter advice.

Say a great opportunity comes along, I have a down payment and a job, but I don't bite because Suze Orman has allowed me to stay in my comfort zone. Twenty years later I've paid hundreds of thousands of dollars with nothing to show for it.

That's lousy financial advice, and it is wrong.

[Gormy Cuss]

119. How about "Home ownership is the American dream?" Is there anything wrong with that statement?

Or "Renting is wasting money?" Aren't those blanket statements that aren't helpful too?
The message that all should be home owners is the message that's been repeated by politicians, pundits, etc. for decades without balancing statements on when and why renting is a better choice.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

24. She is stressing realism and that is a good thing

Too many are sold on champagne lifestyles as the norm, funded by credit. We all know how well that works out in the long run.

I do not always agree with her, but minimizing debt is for the vast majority of us a good thing.

[Maru Kitteh]

53. Who's talking about champagne? Ever heard of "little pink houses?"

The American dream doesn't have to mean a mansion on the hill - just a little piece to call your own.

"Realism" shouldn't necessitate the downgrade of such modest aspirations to permanent tenancy. Don't the have's have enough already? Do they need my house and my daughter's dream of a house too?

[HughBeaumont]

80. I'm a homeowner and it's hardly a "champagne lifestyle" here.

It's enough where my salary affords my cost of living. Is the art of merely making a living all of a sudden "Too Much to Ask For"? Not everyone who owns a home = "living-beyond-their-means McMansion slave".

[ProgressiveProfessor]

98. Are you in financial trouble? If not then you are fine

Hollywood as a generic for image marketing pushes unrealistic lifestyles and attempts to make them the norm in peoples minds.

In other threads it has been pointed out that no name NFL rookies make $320K a year and some are living from paycheck to paycheck. They are not the only ones who over buy in terms of houses and consumer goods.

Counseling people to set their expectations in line with their income is good advice at all income levels

[demodonkey]

173. The problem is that even the most frugal can face financial trouble @ the drop of a hat

Get a major illness? Need hospital care? You could very easily end up losing everything, even if you have insurance. Insurance may not pay, or the hospital may make an error (or outright lie) so that your insurance can't or won't pay. Then the hospital sues you, the patient, or your family for everything you have.

The so called healthcare system in this country is nothing more than a sham and a shame that leaves no one in the middle class -- no one -- safe from financial ruin.

We need single payer healthcare, and free (or much more affordable) higher education in this country... because medical bills and paying off student loans can drag down the most frugal person or family to the point that they can't afford the basic necessities of life -- including rent.

Suze Orman has always disgusted me. IMO she's a self-righteous pig; out for her own ego and financial gain.

[tavalon]

63. Or the many unemployed college graduates.

[Township75]

137. What show did you watch?

I watched her 2 hour PBS show last night, and she stressed lower expectations of what you can buy. And that happens to be good advice. She said the old American dream is no more, and has to be updated. You may not be able to afford a house. You may have to take a lower salary.

Don't like the message? Tought shit, princess. This is reality. Plenty of people are dealing with lower paying jobs and not being able to buy a home, nor being in a position that they should. All she is doing is spreading hte important message that you shouldn't feel like a failure if you can't buy a home, and Christmas is smaller each year.

[some guy]

143. Or,

it may be the reality the owners would like the masses to accept.

There's an idea, use mass media to lower the expectations of the masses, rather than using mass media to encourage the masses to rise up and demand sacrifices of the ownership class.

It's okay for billionaires to own multiple homes, but not "realistic" for average people to even own one.

How about, let's make it realistic for no one to be a billionaire at all, for any reason, under any circumstance.

This is the real world, we can shape it in any fashion we choose, as long as we get enough agreement on what that shape should be.

[EstimatedProphet]

77. The problem, in a nutshell:

When you own the property, you own the wealth. When you rent the property, you don't. You have no ultimate control over the property.

[Karmadillo]

3. It turns out eating two meals a day is actually a status symbol.

nt

[Delphinus]

71. You got that right.

Sad state of affairs we have here in this world.

[davidinalameda]

4. if you've ever listened to her show

she doesn't believe in bullshitting people

she believes what she tells people

[Hannah Bell]

56. bullshit. she's a media shill, & a well-paid one who undoubtably owns more than one house.

[Freddie Stubbs]

83. Why would her owning more than one house make her advice that home ownership isn't for everyone BS?

:shrug:

[SOS]

107. Suze

owns a $2.4 million townhouse in San Francisco and a million dollar beach condo in Ft. Lauderdale.

Her SF home has appreciated by nearly two million dollars since she bought it in 1996.
Nothing wrong with that, but it seems that the "American Dream" of home ownership, building equity and
maybe even seeing your asset appreciate is now a thing of the past.
Except, of course, for those with capital who will scoop up all the foreclosures and rent them back to us at a profit.

[Township75]

138. And she is doing that?

"Except, of course, for those with capital who will scoop up all the foreclosures and rent them back to us at a profit."

She is doing that? If not, what relevence is it to her? If so, please provide a link, because this is big news!

[closeupready]

133. Didn't she file for bankruptcy before, so I'm not sure what kind of a financial expert

we should see her as?

[Zoeisright]

141. She has filed for bankruptcy at least twice.

[wtmusic]

150. And she's proud of it, to boot.

"On the Suze Orman show, Suze advised a highly indebted guest to declare bankruptcy on approximately $70K of credit-card debt. Telling him about the legal benefits of declaring bankruptcy, she went a step further and asked him to tell at least 10 of his friend’s that he was declaring bankruptcy, and to be proud of it. Unbelievable."

http://blog.mises.org/2639/suze-orman-councils-clients-on-the-perfect-time-to-steal-70k/

[quiller4]

162. What is wrong with that? It is good advice. n/t

[dixiegrrrrl]

101. Except some of her advice has not turned out so well.

She advised people to take early Soc. Sec. at age 62, saying the COLAs would increase the value of the checks over time.
That is not working out so great.

she advised people on how to fully fund 401 k and other retirement plans, not a word about the dangers of the market being manipulated to crash the earnings.

She advised people to buy houses to build equity, not too long ago. No mention that in a crash the equity is lost.

I read all that and more in her books and columns.

[JuniperLea]

157. She flip flops a lot

She used to say to buy a home and pay it off before you retire... now we are all supposed to be renters.

No thanks... I think she's raving loon.

[otohara]

102. Bullshit or Not

she gave wrong advice in the past. Just like the CNBC goons - buy, buy, spend, spend....opps!

No sweat off her back, she's still considered an expert and made a lot of money, giving wrong advice.

[Teaser]

5. Wish I had taken this advice

buying a home was a huge mistake.

[wtmusic]

7. How long ago did you buy? nt

[Teaser]

8. 2002

.

[wtmusic]

10. About half a real estate cycle

I've never met anyone who's owned a home for a long time and regretted it. I've owned mine since '94 and I've been "paper broke" several times since.

If you get in over your head it's one thing, but if you can tough it out and they don't discover a toxic landfill under you, it's not a bad investment.

[Teaser]

18. not in over my head but

we cut it uncomfortably close sometimes.

I'm just remembering back to when the mortgage didn't eat my paycheck.

[wtmusic]

25. I hear you.

Have you re-fied lately? It's a good time.

[Teaser]

28. been thinking of it actually.

probably will. maybe i'll feel better then.

[wtmusic]

33. You may be surprised

at how much you can knock off your payment. Good luck. :thumbsup:

[MGB67deux]

43. Definately agree...

Wife and I rented for the last years. Two years ago we bought a larger home about six blocks away. Good neighbors and a dog park very near. We did a refinance and reduced the 5.75 to 4.75. That saved our lives as B of A was raping us. The refi brought the payment to within 10 bucks of what we paid in rent. The cost of repairs and improvements was a matter of love and the worst of that is over (green pool with bad pump and dangerous wiring). We also did the upkeep at the rental house because we had the "landlord from hell". That place had no insulation, bad wiring and only a single gas heater in one room. PG and E got us for between $300 and $500 a month.

Much happier now. I was 64 when we made that leap and I don't regret it. My next move will be on a gurney with a sheet over my head..... unless we must become refugees. And, after listening to Rachel tonight, I am not counting that out.

[PassingFair]

75. Where I live, renting is more expensive than "owning".

The payment on my house is $500/month.
Of course, I pay taxes and escrow on
top of that, but I get some of that back.


Renting a comparable home (or apartment) would cost me
$1,000.00 a month and build NO equity.

Welcome to Detroit and it's environs.

[Wind Dancer]

109. It's that way in many places.

The rent has increased considerably. Landlords are taking full advantage of those who can't afford the down payment to buy.

[Luminous Animal]

11. I have no problem with being a renter for the rest of my life. I'm 52 and both

my husband and I have never had a desire to be a property owner.

[raccoon]

87. I may be too. I've owned a house before, and what a lot of people don't seem to think of

or don't mention when they talk about home ownership, is maintenance.

If you can do a lot of stuff yourself, good for you. Otherwise, you've got to constantly spend money on the plumbing...the electricity....etc.

[pipi_k]

94. So true!

Mr P and I are both over 55 and finding it increasingly more difficult as time goes on to take care of maintenance things.

Luckily, one family down the road has two teenagers who are more than willing to help out with whatever they can. We do have children who can help also, but they have jobs and families, and it's hard for them to find spare time, plus if there's anything to be done in the winter, it can be next to impossible for anyone from the outside (i.e. without 4 wheel drive) to get in here.

That also goes for anyone we would hire. I haven't seen my bathroom cleaning lady since before Christmas because our road has been a hellhole all winter.

For now we can still do most of the stuff ourselves, but I dread the day when most of it is just too hard... :(

[CrownPrinceBandar]

99. I disagree on the maintenance.........

The past three places I have rented, I have had to literally wait MONTHS for the landlord to fix stuff. And what's worse is that I had very little legal recourse: no renters association, lease gives no time-stipulation on repairs and I couldn't do the repairs myself and charge the owner. If I owned the place, I could have had these things fixed. Yes, it would have been on my dime, but at least it would have gotten done in a timely manner.

Given the choice of being saddled w/ a mortgage from my local bank and having some power, or having to deal with another dead-beat landlord, there is no question: I'd take the mortgage any day (now if I only had a down-payment).

[raccoon]

100. You had a crummy landlord. IME, it's MUCH easier to deal with property managers

than an individual who owns a house/apartment, etc. IME the individual doesn't want to fix a cotton pickin' thing, even if whatever is broken was hundreds of years old.

I am dealing with good property managers now, but I've been where you have.

[CrownPrinceBandar]

113. I have had crummy LANDLORDS..........

Wish I could say its been only one. They seem to be legion around here.

But I agree that folks in some complexes have a better go of it. They usually tend to be more standardized and have tighter regulations.

[WinkyDink]

118. It's as nothing (24 yrs, one new roof, a couple plumbing things) compared to $$ down a rat-hole.

With nothing to show for it at the end.

[begin_within]

13. In other words, "Be content with your lot in life."

[msongs]

15. Suzie O has done plenty to help people improve their finances nt

[lolly]

34. Or maybe

Stay flexible?

One thing about being a homeowner--having been one for 22 years now--it's really hard to pick up and go.

Not to say there aren't benefits, but there's a good chance we would have left the area and perhaps tried something new if it weren't for the problem of getting rid of the house.

[Raine]

54. No, not really. Suze is more into telling it like it is

and this is the new reality. Suze gives good commonsense on how to deal with it in the best way possible.

[Hannah Bell]

58. she's a media shill. pushing approved talking points.

[Township75]

135. "Live above your needs, but below your wants". Who is she shilling for?

I am really curious who is pushing that line...you seem to know.

[Raine]

159. I'm curious WHO is she shilling for?

[GoCubsGo]

82. No.

In other words, "Don't live beyond your means." It has nothing to do with being "content".

[Dappleganger]

84. How about owning a home doesn't mean you've "made it" any longer?

It's not just about how much homes cost (their value), but the fact that no longer are people staying in the same company for more than five years at a time, so it really doesn't make much sense if you've got to remain fluid (easy to move) and own a home. Quite honestly, our family probably should stop owning and just rent due to the fact that my husband has been laid off several times and the odds are pretty good that it will happen again. We do own and have for years because we felt it was important to live in a good school district for the kids, and at the time we purchased our home there were almost never, ever any rentals period (much less any which would be large enough for our family).

[Selatius]

161. Given the financial realities of our economy, many of us find what she said reasonable.

We no longer live in an economy where there are plenty of high-paying, union jobs. Those days evaporated when trade policy was switched into favoring out-sourcing those kinds of jobs to countries like China.

[AC_Mem]

16. I may be in the minority here

But frankly, I don't care if I ever own a house again. I live in a very nice apartment with indoor and outdoor pools, fitness center, covered parking. If my appliances (all supplied by the apartment) break, I call maintenance. My yard is always mowed, my gutters are always cleaned, pretty flowers all around, lovely stocked lake.

Home owning may be the way to go for most, but honestly - I don't care. I inherited my father's home when he passed and it was such a money pit that it scared me from ever wanting the stress of home ownership on my own again. I was lucky to sell it before everything started to crash and burn and haven't looked back at home ownership since.

Annette

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

17. Why pay your mortgage...

when you can pay somebody elses? The "investor class" thanks you.

[Mimosa]

106. ^Right^ Orman IS 'the investor class'

I can't stand that woman.

[BreweryYardRat]

108. Exactly. I refuse to willingly pay the mortgage for some piece of human slime.

As soon as I have enough to make a down payment, I'll be into a home of my own -- somewhere -- like a shot.

[JuniperLea]

156. That's the bottom line...

And clearly people are falling for it.

The old school rule of thumb was to pay off your mortgage by the time you retire so you aren't suffering ever increasing rents when your income is fixed. I guess many of these folks will worry about catfood brands instead.

[BillyJack]

20. Nobody 'owns' anything......and that IS the simple truth

Our 'human claim' to such things is only foolishness.

Peace (as a general principle ~ the world is FILLED with friends we haven't met yet! Go out and introduce yourself! :-) )

[Keith Bee]

21. Suze Orman, 100% Phony

Some guy gave her $50,000 when she was a waitress. She blew it. Then, someone (might've been the same guy) gave her another $50,000 which she managed not to blow.

Hey, you wanna gift me with a hundred large, I can be a financial guru too!

[Bluebear]

52. Man you sound bitter.

[Raine]

57. Maybe you could, maybe you couldn't.

Orman learned from blowing the first $50,000 (if the gifting is even true) and made sure she did different with the second (if that gifting is even true) but some people never learn.

[xmas74]

22. Depends on where you live,

what your situation is, etc.

I love having a large yard and the freedom to do what I want. I also live in an area where it is still cheaper to buy than rent. For me buying is a better option, since I do not plan on moving from this area.

Someone with a more mobile lifestyle, someone who does not like to put in time and money for maintenance, etc., would be better off renting.

I have no problems with her statement. It really is a personal preference for some.

[PSPS]

23. She's right.

There's nothing wrong with renting. I have very wealthy clients who are perfectly happy renting. Income has nothing to do with it at all. Perhaps some people have been fooled (by NAR ads mostly) into thinking there's some stigma attached to renting but there is none. In fact, if you're renting now, you'd be a fool to buy a house. From a financial standpoint, renting will be the smart thing to do for a very long time to come.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

27. Residential real estate is not a good investment at this point

There are exceptions that will be made, but by and large its growth in the future will be limited

[wtmusic]

35. That's one hell of a crystall ball you have there.

You must shorting REITs like a madman.

If it's not a crystal ball, on what are you basing your opinion?

[ProgressiveProfessor]

38. Just about every realistic economic forecast

Most of the gains in real estate, especially in CA, were fueled by inflation or speculation. The assumption was that prices would continue to rise. That bubble popped big time, as well all know. No one is predicting another boom any time soon. However localized exceptions are possible.

Some claim that houses are sort of an enforced savings plan, a kind of Christmas Club that puts a roof over your family heads. A similar argument is that everyone has to pay some sort of rent anywhere you live, so getting some of it back at a later date is a better thing than getting back nothing at all. Those are reasonable approaches, since they are not based on making a profit and moving up.

Disclaimer: I don't have any REIT involvement, and own my own place outright. I do have kids looking at these issues. One is opted for employer housing, the other did some bottom feeding and might actually break even if she has to sell in the next 5 years.

[wtmusic]

39. Having lived through about three bubbles

with every pop being followed by cries of, "Prices will never, ever, ever go up again!" I'm a skeptic.

That said, the ransacking of the public sector is a new twist. If we can't restore some measure of fiscal soundness to government, all bets are off.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

41. As have I and this one seems different

The attack on jobs, working peoples wages, unions, and other protections makes me think we have not yet hit bottom.

[WinkyDink]

121. Who is speaking of "investment"? Renting isn't exactly an investment, either.

It's what you have AT THE END.

RENTING = NOTHING. If I have to sell my house for a dollar, it's a dollar more than a renter will get.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

153. But it may also cost you more when you figure it maitenenace, HOA fees etc.

It is clearly situational these days and should be looked at vice automatically assuming that ownership is better. The assumption of significant appreciation over time is not longer valid.

Running the math is cheap, but do it independently of some one with a vested interest in you either buying or renting.

[JuniperLea]

155. When you retire, owning a home is a very good thing

People should plan to pay off their mortgage by retirement. Otherwise, you will be paying ever increasing rents on an income that doesn't increase at all.

[PassingFair]

76. Where do they put the swingset?

I wouldn't raise a family in an apartment unless
I had too.

And in my neck of the woods, house payments are
usually cheaper than rent.

[PSPS]

92. Houses can be rented too.

If one wants a house in today's market, it's foolish not to rent.

[PassingFair]

97. Not in Michigan.

Many people who think buying is "foolish"
are seeing things through the lens of a
California or big city market.

It is MUCH cheaper to buy here than it is
to rent.

[TorchTheWitch]

26. there never was anything wrong with it

I've always resented people thinking you're a loser for not owning your home. I don't need the hassle and responsibility of home ownership, and I certainly don't want to be stuck in a place that's too difficult and too time consuming to get out of.

Home ownership isn't for everyone and never has been.

[blondeatlast]

131. +1. In my parent's time (WW2 vet dad who profited from the GI Bill)

it was a great idea.

Now, for this single mom--I'm much happier with a good apartment, good landlords, and good neighbors (almost all of whom, like me, are former homeowners). Divorce for me, don't know what it was with the naybs, don't care if the drowned in a money pit--they're just nice people.

[niyad]

29. many years ago, I remember reading a piece that said exactly the same thing-LONG before the current

catastrophe, this guy was saying that a mortgage is basically a millstone around most people's necks, and that situations were going to arise where people would not want to be tied down like that. made sense to me then, and now.

[Hannah Bell]

59. and rent isn't? oh, with rent, if you lose your job you can become homeless

& not lose your credit rating.

the new reality is we should all be "free" to immigrate on a moment's notice if we get laid off due to the whims of global financiers, like okies.

[katnapped]

67. You do understand

That if you don't pay your TAXES you'll find out quick that you don't actually own the house either...right?

[Tsiyu]

89. You have more than 60 days as with a lease

I know because I sold a 40 acre farm nearby yet they still kept sending me the new owner's tax bills.

I forwarded them, let the deed clerk know it wasn't me. Three years later, my name was in the paper on a list of delinquent property owners because they were auctioning off the property.

I called the clerk and reamed them out and then said "So if i pay these taxes, can I have the property back?"

"Uh, no. We just sent you a bill to cover our bases." They knew who really owned the house and farm but he is "prominent" so they didn't want to put his name in the paper, I suppose. At any rate, it took three years for them to auction the property. I STILL got all the paperwork on that, and the guy who owned it STILL had a year to make good on the taxes before the highest bidder could take possession of the property.

It varies from state to state, but you have more than 30 or sixty days to pay late taxes....you have years in many cases.

[Dappleganger]

86. +10000

[madamesilverspurs]

30. I don't mind renting.

Especially since I'm in no shape to do yardwork, shovel the walks, etc. That said, I do think it would be reasonable to provide some kind of credit record for our monthly investment in someone else's mortgage; I pay the mortgage, they get the entire tax credit when they pay the bank? Not cool. Ah, well. Gotta have something to dream about, yes?

-

[RandySF]

31. She's actually right

It may make more sense economically for some people to just rent.

[some guy]

36. Well, as long as you don't run out

of money to pay rent with, I suppose that's true.

The general plan for people who buy, is that they will have the mortgage paid off and thus be able to retire because they don't have the single largest monthly expense recurring monthly throughout their entire life.

[TorchTheWitch]

65. and that general plan usually goes awry

Major repairs, replacement of appliances, job loss, needing to relocate for new job, illness or injury, neighborhood deterioration, etc., etc.

Most people will never be so lucky that that they have an entire life of smooth sailing only having to make minimal repairs/replacements and having nothing occur that they lose income or need to pull up stakes and move.

And people are a LOT more transient these days. I don't think I'd want to live in the same house in the same neighborhood in the same town for the entire life of a mortgage and still live there retired for the remainder of my life. Frankly, with our shitty healthcare system most people will never be able to afford that retirement in that house for the rest of their life.

[some guy]

110. Okay.

I think that most people who buy a home/try to buy a home do so with the idea that at some point they won't be paying a mortgage and their general cost of living will decrease, making it easier to afford to retire.

You've offered reasons why that may not work out.

What is the long term plan for renters? If you're a renter, what is your plan for paying the rent when you're 70?
I don't mean to be hostile, I'm just curious.

[TorchTheWitch]

114. I will likely not make it to 70

I will likely not make it to 60.

I'm one of those people that has spent my entire life clinging on by their fingernails and dare not even think beyond getting through the next day.

[some guy]

116. Okay.

:hug:

I wish better for you, however you may choose to define that.

[katnapped]

68. Well until the property taxes come along...

And those start getting near mortgage payments.

WHOOPS--guess you don't REALLY own the house, now do you?

[dixiegrrrrl]

105. Except in states where seniors do not pay property taxes.

In our state, people 65 or older, or people blind or disabled, qualify for "homestead exemptions" for property tax.
As in ZERO property taxes.

Which was a basic consideration in planning where to retire.

In our state, there are many places with very affordable houses.
We pay about 1/3 less for our mortgage than this house would rent for.

As with most everything else, one size does not fit all.

[demodonkey]

174. What state is that?

Seriously I am curious. I know some states that offer reduced property taxes but where are there NO property taxes for seniors?

[dixiegrrrrl]

177. As my profile says, Alabama.

May also be true in Texas and Fla, which have homestead laws.
If other states have homestead laws, might be worth checking out too.

Here, we just have to sign a piece of paper once a year, in the fall, and mail it back in to the county.
( I do call the county every year before tax deadline, just to make sure they have filed the paper correctly)

[demodonkey]

178. Oh sorry, I didn't see yr profile. nt

[Biker13]

179. Idaho too.

The "Circuit Breaker" program lowers taxes for the poor, and widows pay a straight $100.00.

We own, but the place is paid off. Biker13 made sure he bought a place he could always afford, it's small, but with a ton of land.

Biker's Old Lady

[some guy]

111. I'll grant that could happen.

Before I bought my home, I didn't have any idea what I was going to do to pay the rent when I was 70. I didn't think about that every day, and I didn't obsess over it, but I did think of it from time to time, and never had a good answer.

That's part of the reason I bought. It may work out, it may not.

What is your plan for paying the rent when you're 70?

[shanti]

129. i'll be about 80

before my mortgage is paid off (bought in '96, re-fied in '04)...if i live that long. however, the mortgage is about the same as rent here, so i'd have to pay it anyway. :shrug:

what i like about home ownership (besides the obvious financial/tax reasons) is that i can do whatever i want, have animals, plant a garden, etc. - love the privacy, it's worth its weight in gold to me.

[some guy]

139. another ownership vote.

Nice perspective that even without the long-term considerations, owning "now" allows some freedoms that may not be available to renters.

Trade offs - how do you want to live. Renters can generally pack up and leave more easily than owners; owners generally have more choice over how they live without having to move.



Good point, thanks!

[MilesColtrane]

37. New definition of the Ownership Society:

The Man owns your ass...along with the house you live in, the car you drive, your access to health care, etc...

[MadHound]

40. It depends on your personal situation,

In some areas it makes sense to rent, for some people's lifestyle it makes sense to rent.

Personally, my mortgage costs less than renting. Not to mention that I now have the freedom to do whatever I want to the property.

However this certainly does have the tone of encouraging people to settle for less, heralding that the American dream is becoming a vanishing fantasy for many.

[W_HAMILTON]

42. I wouldn't want to rent for the rest of my life.

If you can't afford to buy, or are planning to relocate often in the future, sure, go ahead and rent.

But if you can afford mortgage payments, and you plan on living in your current city for the foreseeable future, why would you not buy? Why put money towards never-ending rent when you can put money towards owning a house?

[K8-EEE]

44. The problem is nothing affordable to rent OR buy! At least in L.A.

When I was a renter, if you didn't mind living in a not-that-fashionable neighborhood and having a bit of a rundown, small-ish place then rent did not eat ALL your money.

My first apt. was a studio (in 1982) and it was in a nice neighborhood so it cost $400. At the time I made $400 a week at my first "real" job. Gas was 99 cents a gallon. Utilities were not a big deal.

Nowadays even a HORRIBLE TINY LITTLE PLACE will cost you $1000/month in L.A. AND ENTRY LEVEL SALARIES ARE THE SAME.

IMO -- I think that's part of the "trickle up" plan is to make the necesities of life, housing, energy, healthcare beyond the means of most working people. Then they have to fund everything by debt and pay their credit card and bank masters just to live!

[Bozita]

45. NOW on my local PBS: Suze says it's time to reset a whole lot of stuff - link

http://www.pbs.org/programs/suze-ormans-money-class/
Suze Orman's Money Class premieres Tuesday, March 8, 2011.
Check Local Listings to see when it's airing on your local PBS station.


In Suze Orman's Money Class financial powerhouse Suze Orman delivers her expert take on what actions everyone needs to consider in light of the new economic reality in order to secure a hopeful and sustainable financial future. After the upheavals of the economic downturn that began in 2008, Orman believes it’s critical to rethink many of the traditional strategies we’ve been using to achieve our financial goals.

In this special, Orman offers hard-hitting advice in her trademark no-nonsense style on how to navigate today's unsettling economic waters. The core of her message is an inspirational re-imagining of the American Dream – based on integrity and standing in your truth.

Throughout this financial master class, Orman equips viewers with timely, powerful, and often surprising advice for getting a grip on the most important financial fundamentals: understanding the opportunities and pitfalls of the real estate market, raising financially aware children, borrowing for college and paying off student loans, building a career, saving and investing, planning for retirement, and more.

As Orman puts it, "I am calling on you to re-educate yourself, to discover—perhaps for the very first time—what truly constitutes your new American Dream. You will learn what it means to stand tall in your truth today, so that you can realize your vision for tomorrow."

more...

---------------------------------------------------------------

This looks a lot to me like one of those small doses of corporate media-inspired news/info designed to slowly educate the masses to the expectations in the new America.

Naomi Klein's "The Shock Doctrine" gives it to me in one shot.

[HughBeaumont]

88. Fluffspeak for "Everyone in their station, have the good sense to STAY there . . ."

" . . . and you might want to consider downgrading expectations. A LOT. Why? Because at the end of the day, WE RUN THIS BITCH. You'll be giving it all to us one way or another, and there isn't a damned thing you're going to do about it. We'll make you too complacent to revolt and too scared of arrest to rise up. We'll string some of you along thinking you'll be able to be in our club someday (snicker), and make you believe voting works and Reaganomics is the most sensible thing in your economic worlds."

"The reality is, you're going to die at your desks, or under a bridge. This retirement thing? You can take that romance novel and BURN it. You ain't gettin' what we got, because we took it all and you ain't invited. You never were. We sold you filet mignon and you're eatin' bullshit. Work your fingers to the bone. Doesn't matter. Keep chasin' that rabbit. Doesn't matter. Vote. DOESN'T MATTER. Reaganomics, bitches. GET USED TO IT. You ain't in this club yet, you ain't-a GONNA be. How do we get away with it? Talk to your several Fox News-watching neighbors. Go to a tea party rally. That's our swinging watch, assholes. Only a few of you 'smarty-pants' schmucks have figured it out, but the reason it doesn't matter is that a vast majority still under it's spell HAVEN'T."

"They'll never get out of the bewitching because here's the big secret: Deep down inside, everyone fears becoming someone they think they're better than. Yes. It's true. Fear and Hatred are basic human conditions and we play them like a cheap Atari at a nerd shop. HA!"

"So you'd best get used to your lot in life and find a nice bridge. Or get a few million people on your side, run us up a flagpole and put an end to it once and for all. Yeah. Good luck with that . . . . in addition to all the wealth, we own the military and they will shoot your asses DEAD."

[misanthrope]

132. That was on my PBS station last night...

...I was able to sit though about 45 seconds of it before turning the channel because it felt like an infomercial. The style of it got on my nerves. Had it been done more like a Frontline episode or something, maybe I could have stomached more.

[BlueCheese]

46. I didn't see it, so I don't know the context.

Having said that, I've seen convincing analysis that it can make financial sense to rent a house rather than own one, even if you can afford the latter. This is especially true in places where real estate remains overpriced. Of course, this is a purely financial calculation, and it doesn't factor in intangibles such as pride of ownership, etc. But if you're fairly dispassionate about these things, then you might come out ahead by renting.

[David__77]

47. She's right.

One should make the smartest moves with their finite resources that they can. For many, that does not involve committing to a mortgage.

[JCMach1]

48. It is pablum, but she is right... you should only buy a house for living-in and if you plan to stay

there long-term.

Otherwise, renting is the much better option.

[CommonSensePLZ]

49. Draw backs on both sides

Owning there's property taxes you have to pay forever even after you've paid off the property. And renting obviously the property isn't yours and you must again pay constantly. Owning I think is even more dangerous because they'll tax you until you have no money left THEN take that land from you and kick you to the street.

Our real estate system seems to be designed so that banks will get possession of our land and money and so that no one has control of anything too long.

[JDPriestly]

51. If you are renting, you are paying property taxes. It's just included in your rent.

You also pay for the upkeep on your housing. It's included in the rent.

And, you pay the mortgage and insurance payments. They also are included in your rent.

If you rent, the rent can be raised any time, but you are not tied down to the same housing for the long term.

If you buy and get a fixed mortgage, you don't have to worry about higher payments (except for the same small increases in taxes and insurance that you will have to pay if you are renting), but you can't move quite as easily as you can when you rent.

So, it is smart to rent when you are young and then buy when you get older (but still have time to pay off your house).

[GoCubsGo]

79. Actually, if you sign a lease..

...they can't raise your rent "any time". They have to wait until the lease is over. It's up to you whether you want to renew at the higher rate or go somewhere else. Moving is expensive, as well as being a huge pain-in-the-ass, so you are damned if you do, damned if you don't.

As far as insurance goes, anyone who doesn't have renters insurance is stupid. Just ask the folks who live in the apartment unit across from my sister. One of their neighbors decided to grill on his balcony, which is against the rules. And, he proved why. None of the people in that building had renters insurance. They lost everything, and are on their own to replace it.

And, regarding all of those ragging on Suze Orman here, that's called "shooting the messenger". She didn't create the current reality. She's just giving people advice on how to deal with it. It's all common sense, something a lot of people in this country don't seem to have. I hope people listen to her.

[laundry_queen]

140. I agree about the renter's insurance

I have it and it was the very first thing I did when I moved into my place. I don't get why anyone wouldn't have it. It's very inexpensive. I also know someone who didn't have it and lost everything in a fire, which is why I'd never be without insurance.

[Hannah Bell]

60. i'm doing a study of the foreclosures in my neighborhood. so far, every one

is owned by bank of america.

maybe boa is going to be the new landlord for all those new renters.

[HughBeaumont]

91. So glad I got out of that trap.

Had a BoA mortage for about 2 years. I couldn't refinance through my place of employment fast enough. My monthly payment soared every year with BoA until I was paying 15% more than what I started. My refinancing at 5.375 was the best thing I've ever done financially.

[katnapped]

69. +1

At least you got the point that many are missing (when those property taxes go through the roof, as is expected, you'll STILL end up out on the street when they're not paid)

[Mosby]

145. why will property taxes go up?

Property tax is tied to home valuations, if the value of the home goes up the tax goes up. IMO it is unlikely that home values will significantly increase in the next 10 years given the amount of inventory on the market.

Considering how badly conservatives hate progressive taxation they will fight to the death to keep valuation multipiers from changing. Right now in most states the property tax is very reasonable, eg I pay 1600/year in arizona.

What suze is not giving proper consideration to is the fact that home ownership is more than an investment, when I'm 65 my mortgage payment will be zero dollars, if I was renting I'd still be paying who knows how much.

[JDPriestly]

50. The problem with never owning your house is that you will always have to pay rent.

It is difficult to retire on Social Security and maybe a small amount of savings if you don't own your house.

Suze Orman is wrong on this.

I know a very elderly woman who had little retirement income but owned her house. She has lived well. Her friends who have to pay rent or still own on their mortgages have a much tougher time than she does.

[Hannah Bell]

61. yep.

[CTyankee]

85. But that isn't the entire reality when you become elderly.

I'm still in the "young senior" decade. My health is good. Hubby is recovering from spinal surgery. All the lifting is now my responsibility and frankly, neither of us can do stuff around the house that we used to. We have a service for our grass cutting in the summer (also any replacement plantings and trimmings) and snow removal in the winter. Having to haul full laundry baskets up and down 2 flights of stairs is getting pretty burdensome.

Frankly, we want to sell and move to a rental apt. where we don't have those costs. A smaller place will be less costly to heat, air condition, and hire somebody to do repairs.

There is more to the equation here...

[WinkyDink]

123. Yes, but that is post-home-ownership!

[JDPriestly]

152. Sell your house and buy a house on one level in a better climate.

I used to envy people who live in houses up on a hill with lots of winding steps going up. No more. I'm so happy to be on flat land.

[CTyankee]

164. No. I want to live near a city in a high rise with apartments, a covered garage and an elevator.

I see the handwriting on the wall, folks. I know what is coming, having seen it with my mother. WE need special aids, no steps, even in a snowy climate. New Haven is still a cultural center, no matter what. If I can get into it to the theatre, the restaurants, the health care, I will go. It will simplify my life enormously from what I have now.

[JDPriestly]

170. A high-rise is another good solution because you usually have an elevator.

I really enjoy a garden so I prefer a house. When the time comes that I can no longer tend my garden, my husband and I will sell this house and move closer to our children.

[Hannah Bell]

55. Interesting how the propaganda talking points change. During the real estate

boom, the talking point was "How great is the US & the Bush Admin, with the highest percent of people owning their own homes in the world/ever!!!!"

Now it's "It's great to be a renter!!!!"

I've been making a study of the foreclosures in my neighborhood.

So far, every one i've researched is owned by some arm of Bank of America.

Our new landlord?

How great is America!!!!

[Historic NY]

62. For some its the only way..........

I see people who buy houses and are just plain clueless on just how much it costs to keep up the property. I have a neighbor bought the house fresh from the streets of NY. They saw the pool the green grass and then the cost factor kicked in. The 15k pool is now just a hole in the ground that he better fill in soon, the idea of mowing the lawn well was just too much for him, he is 10yrs younger than me. People get sp caught up in what is the American dream, its sure comes with expenses. You can ride around town and see this same senerio over and over. I know of people who rented all their lives, pretty much the landlord takes care of all those issues. They just hand over a check monthly and poof its done. My grandmother had tenants for years, most stayed on 10yrs or more it was almost like they became part of the family.

[Anakin Skywalker]

66. "Homeowners" Delude Themselves.

You don't own anything until you've paid it off. The shysters and the banksters do, in the mean time. So why are you helping them?

[Sienna86]

70. I'm not sure that she's the voice for corporate media here

It is something that should be considered. If I could, I would sell my house and get into a rental home.

[Sky Masterson]

72. I am 44 years old and I've never owned a house

At this age I would be in my 70's before I paid it off.
I don't see any advantage in owning a house.

[Nye Bevan]

74. She is absolutely correct. The delusion that homeownership is always a good thing needs to end.

People should not feel compelled to tie up most of their net worth in a single, illiquid, asset class. Renting is just fine and in a lot of situations makes more sense than buying a house.

[datasuspect]

167. yes, we should leave property ownership for our feudal lords

yeah, that's the ticket!

[Vinca]

78. Sometimes - depending on the area - it's cheaper to own a home than pay rent.

You don't have to buy the Taj Mahal to be happy with where you live. It depends on what your needs are, how long you plan to live in an area, etc., etc. Personally, I have a need to be in control of my abode - to have pets, paint the walls purple if I want, etc. Maybe it's a generational thing. I remember from the time I hit 25 in 1974 I was obsessed with buying a house (and the long, long road of restoring 5 houses began).

[AngryOldDem]

81. I think her message is valid.

Simplify your life. Live a little bit under your means now to hopefully ensure that your future will be a little more secure later.

[TBF]

90. Her message is crap. I'd agree that personal property ownership is overrated,

but her view is that a few very wealthy people DO and SHOULD own everything, and the rest of us rent and live on next to nothing. Fuck that.

[truebrit71]

93. Home ownership is not all that it's been cracked up to be...

..I rent and every time my lease is up the property manager asks me what new perks I want, new paint, new carpets, new appliances. Whenever something breaks it gets fixed at no cost to me. I get access to a free health club, spa, swimming pool and racquetball court.

The downside is I don't "own" my home, so I don't get the tax breaks, but I do have the freedom to move my home without the hassle of trying to sell a house and all that entails.

Would I like to own a house? Someday maybe, but right now it just doesn't make sense.

[BlueIris]

96. I love and hate Suze Orman. On the one had, a lot of what she says

to consumers regarding debt management (or, you know, getting rid of high interest debt specifically) is good advice. On the other hand: "I don't want to pay for national health care." And yes, she pushes CorpPropaganda like the rest of them. So for me it's a mixed bag.

[Yavin4]

103. Suze Is 100% Correct. Housing Valuations Are Tied To Incomes, and Incomes Are Stagnant

What we're seeing in housing today is that the value of homes are falling into line with incomes. What Suze is saying is that housing valuations may not appreciate for a long, long time to come. So, renting is the better answer for most people.

Many "homeowners" are going to be in for a huge shock when they go to sell their homes to finance their retirement. There won't be any buyers.

Given that job growth has been negative now for 10+ years.

Given that incomes are stagnant for 10+ years.

Given the lack of jobs and debt levels for new college grads.

Given the layoffs of so many US workers.

Given that government employees have to pay more for their pensions and healthcare.

Given outsourcing and the wage race to the bottom.

Given all of that, owning a home IS NOT the best financial investment one could make. For our parents' generation, it was. But not for us.

[WinkyDink]

124. Housing is valued by property assessments, not income.

[Yavin4]

126. Bunk. Property Assessments Are for Tax Purposes

It's the market that determines the price for your home. It's what people can and are willing to pay for it.

Just because an assessment says that your house is worth X, that does not mean that you will get X when you go to sell it.

[taught_me_patience]

144. Completely and totally bunk

It is tied to income and interest rates 100%. If interest rates are lower, prices are higher (all else equal). If income is higher, prices are higher(all else equal). The problem right now is that incomes are not increasing and interest rates are super low and can't go much lower. Not much in the way of drivers for future price appreciation.

[lumberjack_jeff]

104. No one knows. I read the same thing in 1984.

Glad I didn't take that advice then.

YMMV. It might be sound advice now.

[snot]

112. Home ownership was oversold to us when it benefitted t.p.t.b. for us to buy homes;

now, I've been hearing enough about why we should rent that I'm wondering if it's now expected to benefit t.p.t.b. more if we rent.

This would make sense in a high-inflation environment, which is where we are/are headed.

[TroglodyteScholar]

115. I don't mind renting at all.

Would it be nice to have a house some day in the distant future? Perhaps, but renting a house is a perfectly fine option as well. In a lot of areas and circumstances, home ownership can no longer be considered the sure-thing investment it once was, and I really have no problem with that.

[shanti]

117. absolutely

not everyone is cut out to be a home owner, nor wants to be one. sometimes it just make financial sense not to. i have a couple of friends (we're all boomers) who have never been homeowners and don't care to be, although they could afford it. :shrug:

[WinkyDink]

122. Does Ms. Orman rent? Case closed.

[Ikonoklast]

171. Do as I say, peasent, not as I do.

I see her as just another con artist making a fortune off stupid people.


She is getting people ready for the Long Decline, as her wealthy pals buy up housing for a dime on the dollar.

[Shagbark Hickory]

125. Amazing how one quote without any context can set off a shit storm. UNrec.

[Hosnon]

127. I agree with her. nt.

[Beaverhausen]

128. How about not making those of us who will never have the down payment not feel like failures?

Those of you on this thread who are so high and mighty about how bad it is to rent can kiss my ass.

Some of us will never be able to save up the down payment, nor will we inherit the money to be used as such.

many people in this country will have to rent their whole lives. Stop making them (us) feel bad.

[Yavin4]

134. Excellent Article on Renting vs. Buying and It Supports Suze's Claim

Renting doesn’t seem like a bad idea when the number one asset in the country has fallen by 30 percent from the peak. And keep in mind this is leveraged. So say you bought into the delusion and bought in 2007 in California with a nothing down Alt-A loan and paid $600,000 for your shack. As it turns out, the home is now worth $400,000 and you are underwater by $200,000. You are now in worse shape than a renter that simply lived in a home and socked money away in an emergency fund. Leverage cuts both ways and that is why having a significant down payment, upwards of 10 percent is so important. This is why we have a housing market flooded with problem loans:

http://www.doctorhousingbubble.com/financial-allure-of-renting-real-estate-industry-silences-the-voice-of-renters-marketing-finance-mortgages/

[Thunderstruck]

142. This sort of prepping the population for an expectation of a lower standard of living

is pervasive right now. Also, CNN has recently began pushing the idea that if you're unemployed for a long time that you should start your own business.

[Cairycat]

146. People used to rent all their lives

My grandparents rented for 65 some years til they went to a nursing home. They had a nice, spacious apartment.

The difference between then and now is the unfettered greed of the monied class. I wouldn't trust anybody owning apartments not to raise rent way beyond costs or market value.

[PlanetBev]

147. I just purchased my first condo at age 60

I had to wait until my father died to afford it. If he had not left me money, I could have never done it.

That said, I rented for for 37 years. People who were well off would always asked why I didn't buy something. I find that so insulting. I had to fight down the impulse to say, "Why don't you pay for the downpayment, asshole?"

There's nothing wrong with renting. Sometimes you just have no other choice.

[county worker]

148. I read this kind of stuff a few months ago in some news magazine.

Basically it said that we should get used to the idea that we can't afford a home or to get a loan because most of us will be making less money in the future.

[Uzybone]

151. She is right, only fools think homeownership is some magical status

[JuniperLea]

154. Home ownership means a lot more when you retire...

If you have a home that is paid off, you only need worry about taxes, which is a small fraction of rent. If you don't own a home and you are renting, you are roadkill financially. Rents go up, but not your fixed income.

Those who can own a home, should. It's the fiscally responsible thing to do.

[CTyankee]

168. we bought a home later in life and we now still pay on the mortgage.

We are 70 and 71. We don't quite have enough to pay off our entire loan. The mortgage still gives us a healthy tax deduction but we are going to see in a year's time. I'm just hoping we can clear
$20,000 above our mortgage...

[JuniperLea]

169. The tax deduction is very beneficial...

Good luck to you! Can you imagine the worry over rent increases and no mortgage interest deduction? A lot of folks will be facing just that. Especially if they listen to this woman who is wrong a lot of the time.

[CTyankee]

175. We have other deductions. And our income has been lowered.

For instance, we are in a more expensive health care plan now for our Medicare supplemental so we are saving our receipts on every single medical/dental expenditure. We have no debt, except for the mortgage. We live pretty frugally, which is not a hardship, just what we do to remain in good shape. We are both volunteers and are adding up our expenses there. Every bit helps.

[TNLib]

158. I think it depends in the area you live

Some housing in some areas are really really cheap and will most likely rise. Some Cities the real estate is still way to high and will most likely drop. I think the rule of thumb I've been reading (for what it is worth) is a if the average annual cost for renting is 15 times more than the average cost of the house in the city you live then wait because prices will most likely fall. If it is lower than 15 time then buying in your area might be a good idea.

And I wouldn't recommend anyone to purchase a home if they do not have the income to support owning a home.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

160. I have chosen to remain a renter

I could never afford to buy the apartment that I currently live in, and I can leave in 30 days if I want.

I am SO glad that I didn't bow to the INTENSE pressure I was under to buy ca. 2000-2008. Everyone, including friends, relatives, my bank, and the media, were telling me that I was an idiot for not buying a house or condo.

However, I did the math and realized that I would not only reduce my disposable income, receive a maximum of 35 cents in reduced taxes for each dollar I spent on mortgage interest, and tie myself down for the rest of my life, I would also be owned by the bank.

No thanks.

[Curmudgeoness]

163. I keep thinking that if I can ever sell my house, I will remain a renter

for the rest of my life. The one thing that you mention that I wish I had right now is mobility. Until the housing market improves, if it ever does where I have my house, I am trapped here. You are right that the bank owns the house, you don't, but it doesn't end when you have it paid off. Try not paying your property taxes and you will find that you still do not "own" the house. My property taxes are now more than the house payment on this house was when it was purchased. And unless you live in California with restrictions on how much taxes can go up, you are at the mercy of the city/county that you live.

My only suggestion to you is to make sure to save that additional money you have from renting for when you are not working anymore.

[Johonny]

180. me too

[Spider Jerusalem]

165. Well, you know...she's right

Home ownership in Germany is only at 43% of the population, for instance. And the idea that home ownership in and of itself is a desireable thing led to a lot of trouble for people who took out mortgages they couldn't afford to keep up the payments on; that's something that didn't really work out so well.

[datasuspect]

166. hey it worked during feudal times!

[Township75]

176. For anyone interested in what Suze Orman really said, PBS is playing it again tonight.

At least on my channel at 7PM EST. Then you can hear everything she said and decide for yourself if it is good advice or just corporate crap. ENJOY!

[devils chaplain]

181. I love renting.

I love knowing that I can move whenever I want, I love not having to worry about ever having to fix an appliance, and I love not having a lawn to maintain. I don't care if I never own a house. Us renters just have to make sure we save more money for retirement than homeowners do because we aren't building equity in a home. And real estate isn't a particularly good investment anyway; equities outperform them substantially over the long run.