What's wrong with this picture?

[mmonk]

As Americans take to the streets in greater and greater numbers, the politicians keep coming up with more "bipartisan" plans such as the "go big" coalition (as in cuts to the safety net and social programs) and deferring tax hikes on the rich and powerful effectively giving the people the finger. Are you ok with that? Are you going to keep criticizing OWS as confused and without direction?

Interesting dynamics as we move ahead. When will it reach critical mass?

[Scuba]

1. When will we start vetting "Democratic" candidates? ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2261601

[OnyxCollie]

10. "Vetting" has become a dirty word on this board.

It means you want Republicon teabagger candidates to win.

All must bow down and become subservient before the mighty Circle D, accepting whatever shitty Third Way/DLC/Blue dogs candidates are offered.

[Tejas]

2. Yes.

"Are you going to keep criticizing OWS as confused and without direction?"

When the MSM picks out some doofus in a dollar-store hoodie and starts asking basic questions and all they get is "Like man, I uh think the movement is uh cool and felt that it'd be cool to uh come hang out...man"...it does not reflect well. It only gives the detractors ammo to paint the movement as ragtag.

[rgbecker]

4. Register and certificate only smart OWSers.

It's awful the image that is portrayed. A short simple IQ test with questions about our political system and economic model could weed out those that aren't serious. Maybe a button for each who passed the text could be worn and only those would speak with the MSM. In fact, we could dress them up, call them representatives and send them to Washington to serve in congress. That's worked well in the past, right?

:sarcasm:

[dixiegrrrrl]

5. Hey, how about same test for voters,. too!!!

Only half kidding.

[MichaelMcGuire]

7. Very good point...

Is it really required that you need to become an 'expert' to protest, as if the economic forces would exclude you if you aren't able to articulate it. Its troubling that many others think you need to justify the hows, methods or whys to others when simply exercising their right to protest is enough justification. Surely.... even standing with and supporting in solidarity can be justified.

[bigtree]

11. well, that would be the advantage of some prominent spokespeople

Who would better articulate concerns and initiatives. Without that prominent representation, the focus is invariably on the actions of the group, rather than on any defining message. That lack of an overriding message will also, invariably lead to others making that definition for the groups.

[Zorra]

13. Does a bunch of Senate douchebags in Armani suits saying "let's privatize social

security, cut taxes on the wealthy, and engage in senseless wars" reflect well?

Not for me.

Just because somebody is rich and has pretty, expensive clothes it makes them wise?

I'll answer that. It does not. I'll take the kids in the dollar store hoodies without reservation. They're much, much, less dangerous to the world than the killers for profit.

Seems we we may need to reassess our values.

[lunatica]

3. Critical mass has been reached

We're roiling in it right now.

The way you worded your question is proof that the gig is up. We get it. We, the OWS, get it. You, the OWS get it. Me, the OWS gets it.

Do you think that something that's caught this Nation on fire and has the attention of the entire world is just a fluke?

[mmonk]

9. Yep. There are reasons for things. There is no vacuum.

[bigtree]

12. there is certainly a disconnect

between the aim of the OWS movement and what's actually occurring in the legislative arena right now. You mentioned the debt ceiling, and other economic initiatives, but the ones deciding these policies, (mostly republicans in their obstinacy) are mostly insulated from the protests.

I don't see their demands being presented directly to the politicians and legislators in position to influence policy and law. How does the movement intend to translate their agitation into legislative action?

[SammyWinstonJack]

6. Their (1%) "bipartisan" plans = IN YOUR FACE!

AND THERE'S NOTHING YOU 99%ers CAN DO TO STOP US!.  :grr:

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Zorra]

14. Ever since the DLC/Third Way insidiously neutralized our Democratic party, we're naturally a bit

suspicious when outsiders that don't support our movement are repeating RW MSM memes over and over, seemingly in order to chip away at the egalitarian democratic processes and ideals that are the core of OWS.

It's only natural. The 1% was very successful at turning our Democratic party into the GOP junior varsity by using the DLC/Third Way, and we are not going to let this happen to OWS.

So, while your concerns and subtle personal attacks are noted, we don't give a shit.

Sorry, but its real.

[bigtree]

15. all I've EVER criticized the movement for is a lack of a legislative focus

. . . and a unified, prominent messaging scheme that directly confronts the current political establishment and actually influences the legislative process to effect the demands into action or law. I don't see that happening.

That should interest you.

[Zorra]

17. Trust me on this: The PTB are well aware of the message

A hundred thousand people camped in parks and marching in the streets across the country has conveyed the message very clearly. It's in their face.

The PTB, meaning the 1% and their many employees in government (see link below) ignore the message because acknowledgment implies credibility and subsequently gives the message more publicity.

The primary message of OWS, the immutable glaring fact that wealthy private interests are in almost complete control of the government and that this control is totally undemocratic and is having a very serious negative impact on the majority of the lives of the 99%...

...then has to be addressed publicly by the employees of the PTB that hold many of the highest positions in the federal government. Subsequently, this logically dictates future legislative action if the pretense of democracy in America is to be maintained.

They are hoping that they can kill off the movement, primarily, at this time, through violent, coordinated, massive police attacks on the non-violent persons expressing the aforementioned message through peaceable assemblage, words and other non-violent actions, as well as a widespread media disinformation campaign, so that they will not be forced to acknowledge this OWS message that is crystal clear to them.

Those that don't get the message are by and large the people who are not politically aware of much that is real to begin with, and many of these folks are those who consistently parrot the idiot slogans delivered to them by Fox News and Rush Limbaugh. These slogans generally form the foundation of their political awareness and opinions.

And then there are those few that obviously have some type of personal/political/financial agenda that pretend to not get the message.

Who Owns Congress? A Campaign Cash Seating Chart
What if members of Congress were seated not by party but according to their major business sponsors?

http://m.motherjones.com/politics/2010/09/congress-corporate-sponsors

If you want to know why many of us are so deeply concerned about having the OWS movement misrepresented, and are concerned about silly RW MSM memes being spread, it is because of the above, and this:

We need you, and everyone else possible, to join our movement so that we can attain the numbers of concerned people necessary to continue and guarantee the success of our admittedly somewhat flawed but overall very effective process of eliminating any and all control that wealthy private interests have over our government and our lives.

[bigtree]

18. I have no problem 'joining' and supporting the movement.

That doesn't include my personally occupying any of the sites nearby, but I do want to find more avenues to influencing legislation as directly as possible. One avenue might be to solicit and field progressive candidates in this current primary season behind some of the planks of the protest movement. There could also be opportunities to identify and support candidates who are making the legislative efforts protestors advocate. I don't think the movement should cede any political ground, even as participants forswear making eternal commitments to party politics.

[Zorra]

20. Please, go for it!

I am of the opinion that the OWS played a significant collateral part in the widespread gains for labor and the Democratic party in the recent elections.

Because many of us have little or no confidence in the current wealth controlled campaign/legislative/political status quo, we feel that OWS, right now, is the most effective process for eventually establishing necessary constructive progressive change, and this is how we choose to go about it.

Most of us can't divert our time, energy and resources from moving OWS forward. OWS is the main gig that will bring about change. Dividing our attention by focusing on a political process that we have already found to be ineffective because it has been compromised will be counterproductive.

Any collateral assistance from folks that have more confidence in status quo processes and the inclination to improve democratic effectiveness is surely welcome.

I used to pound the streets for Democrats, but they have really let me down. Now I pound the streets with my sisters and brothers of OWS. I donate to Elizabeh Warren, Dennis Kucinich, Alan Grayson, etc, concerned, intelligent, capable people that share my beliefs and goals. I no longer donate to the DNC or DCCC because they give my money to Third Way candidates that support and help maintain the dictatorship of the 1%.

OWS has something of the spirit that the Democratic party lost when the DLC/Third Way took it over. That spirit is why I have been a Democrat all of my life. The heart and soul of the Dem party have been stolen. No...bought is the better word. I'll still vote for Democrats unless a more viable, effective, and productive alternative arises.

But OWS is where I will be devoting the bulk of my free time, energy, and resources.

[Poll_Blind]

16. It's what a systemic failure looks like. It's a systemic failure of representative government.

I'm a big supporter of functional representative government but what we have currently is a failed execution of that concept.

BTW, I live in Oregon. I'm, for the most part, very pleased with my representatives.

But not everyone gets the same breaks and the problem is, once it reaches the House and Senate and Federal government- I feel that collectively the works are shitted-up (possibly) beyond repair.

PB

[Capitalocracy]

19. What is critical mass?

What happens when it's reached?

[Zorra]

22. Here ya go:

Critical mass is a sociodynamic term to describe the existence of sufficient momentum in a social system such that the momentum becomes self-sustaining and creates further growth.

Social factors influencing critical mass may involve the size, interrelatedness and level of communication in a society or one of its subcultures. Another is social stigma, or the possibility of public advocacy due to such a factor. Critical mass may be closer to majority consensus in political circles, where the most effective position is more often that held by the majority of people in society. In this sense, small changes in public consensus can bring about swift changes in political consensus, due to the majority-dependent effectiveness of certain ideas as tools of political debate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_mass_%28sociodynamics%29

[Capitalocracy]

24. That's actually quite useful, but...

I meant more like what does it look like, how do we know, that sort of thing.

[Warren DeMontague]

21. Anything except cut defense or end the drug war.

Other than that, ya know, it's "all on the table". :eyes:

[Zorra]

23. _^_