How do we respond to this?

[FLyellowdog]

Are millionaires actually paying taxes at a higher rate than the middle class? This makes it seem so.

I don't understand all I know about it.:shrug:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/09/20/irs-data-show-most-millionaires-pay-taxes-at-higher-rate-than-middle-class/?cmpid=cmty_fb_Gigya_IRS_Data_Show_Most_Millionaires_Pay_Taxes_at_Higher_Rate_Than_Middle_Class

[Zax2me]

1. Well, not clicking on your link because it is a fox link.

But the top .2 percent earners do pay 20% of all income taxes.
Whether that is a fair share or not.....

[EstimatedProphet]

3. But they earn 40% of income.

[FLyellowdog]

7. I know, I know. Sorry.

[FarLeftFist]

2. Should rich people complain that they're not richer?!

Especially during these times? Maybe they need a reality check.

[EstimatedProphet]

4. Here's the response: it's bullshit.

[daleanime]

5. Uh....

20% of the taxes when they have 50% of the wealth is unfair. That's not hard to figure out.:shrug:

[HappyMe]

6. It's Fox! Don't believe a word. nt

[Enrique]

8. by not falling into the trap

the trap being considering progressive taxation "unfair". Rich people SHOULD pay taxes at a higher rate.

[Viking12]

14. Yes. Even the Saint of Capitalism, Adam Smith, said so.

[EOTE]

9. Ummm, they sure as hell should.

Just look at the title of this freaking thing "IRS Data Show Most Millionaires Pay Taxes at Higher Rate Than Middle Class". Is that even a question?!? The point is that ALL of them should be paying more taxes. What that's saying is that there are some millionaires who pay taxes at a lower rate than someone making 30k per year. That's OBSCENE. ALL millionaires should be paying taxes at a higher rate than those in the middle classes and they should be paying significantly more. This just shows how incredibly skewed the debate has become.

[FLyellowdog]

12. Duh! I should have pondered that longer.

It was a Facebook post by a teabagger "friend". Guess I should just unfriend him 'cause he confuses me. Thanks. :hi:

[EOTE]

17. I've found myself with fewer and fewer friends due to the political climate.

Anyone who'd show me an article like that in order to try and convince me that the rich are already paying their fair share would quickly find themselves unfriended.

[Old Codger]

10. Tax rates

Based on taxable income


http://www.moneychimp.com/features/tax_brackets.htm

[KharmaTrain]

11. Broad Brushes Rarely Paint Accurate Pictures...

A lot depends on how the money is earned...through income or capital gains and then what deductions are included. The tax game isn't a level playing field...just note the difference if you're married or not or if you own a home.

Those with larger incomes do pay more...but also the pinch they feel is a lot less. Let say someone who earns $1,000,000 is taxed at 35% (no deductions)...they, in theory, would pay 350,000 in taxes. If they actually did they're fools. Still, they would have 750gs left...compared to someone who earns 100gs and pays 28%...that 28,000 is gonna be felt a lot further. So, yes they can pay more, but the bite is far less.

Also, this talking point forgets to take into account payroll taxes, property taxes, sales taxes and the like that everyone pays. While a person earning $30k a year may not pay much in income taxes, they still pay full freight on their property, SSI and other taxes that aren't counted.

[FLyellowdog]

13. Thanks for reminding me.

"Also, this talking point forgets to take into account payroll taxes, property taxes, sales taxes and the like that everyone pays. While a person earning $30k a year may not pay much in income taxes, they still pay full freight on their property, SSI and other taxes that aren't counted."

[sinkingfeeling]

15. No it does not 'make it seem so'.

"... according to Senate Democratic Leader Harry Reid's office, 22,000 people who make over $1 million a year pay taxes at a rate of less than 15 percent. According to the IRS, nearly 1,500 households reporting more than $1 million in income paid no federal income taxes in 2009.


For those wealthy Americans paying taxes at a seemingly low rate, it could be because they earn income overseas or because a large part of annual income is from investments. Though corporate profits are taxed at 35 percent, in the form of capital gains and dividends they are taxed at 15 percent. Senate testimony in May from the Tax Foundation also showed that for taxpayers making more than $200,000 a year, their salary income made up just 20 percent of national salary income. Much more came from business income.



Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/09/20/irs-data-show-most-millionaires-pay-taxes-at-higher-rate-than-middle-class/#ixzz1YWDJxRJI

[FLyellowdog]

20. You're right.

I've been rereading and studying the article plus doing some fact checking. It's so easy to miscontrue data and I just wish someone could put all this in layman's terms for the intellectually challenged of us. All this crap is making me so mad. :mad:

Thanks for helping...

[Riftaxe]

16. Here is an AP article confirming that

President Obama's speech writer was playing a bit loose with the facts.

http://mynorthwest.com/178/549000/FACT-CHECK-Are-rich-taxed-less-than-secretaries">FACT CHECK: Are rich taxed less than secretaries

[HughBeaumont]

19. As does this article.

Leaves out that many of the wealthy get their incomes from dividends - taxed at a flat 15% rate. 10% of the population also own over 70% of this country's wealth and take a little under HALF of this country's income.

It also doesn't state the reason behind their long-debunked RW talking point of "46% of the people pay no federal income tax" . . . that America's poor not only don't MAKE enough to be taxed, but also have to pay a great deal more taxes in terms of gross income percentage compared to the oh-so-hurting rich.

I give it credit that it does mention the poor pay other taxes (which many articles don't . . . they just go with their "poor people are lazy" agenda without question), but doesn't state that the Oh-So-Hurting wealthy also have miles more money left over after all bills and taxes are paid. The poor person? Not s'much!!

Why do you think many oh-so-hurting CEOs have a salary of $1? It's a breeze paying taxes on THAT, ya think?

Before the AP can spread boilerplate crap from Forbes or The Tax Foundation, maybe they'd want to tell the whole story so they'll have what's called a "FAIR" article and not one that suits a right-wing "leftist sour grapes" frame. They should stop acting like they've poured water on something that's very much true just because it dumps on their fantasy of the Bewsh Tax Cuts being fair somehow.

[FLyellowdog]

21. Thanks for adding this to the conversation.

I'm thinking I need to just ignore this "friend" so I don't have to rant and rave about things I don't fully comprehend. :hi:

[Honeycombe8]

18. The % taxes paid figures are incorrect. I think the W.H. with its staff of

people who have definite numbers from the IRS probably knows the facts and the percentages.

I know for a fact that some of those percentages are wrong. Because they are MY percentages, supposedly.

Never, but never, have I paid as little as 15% in federal taxes. And I had a substantial mortgage interest deduction and a few charitable donations, as well as high property tax deduction. Even after all that, I paid well over 15% in federal taxes. I currently pay about 25% in fed income taxes AFTER deductions.

So I know if those % figures are wrong, then the others are probably wrong, as well.

Do you know what rate of taxes you pay, after deductions?

It is POSSIBLE that someone earning $1 Million pays 29% after taxes. It's possible, but not likely. Someone with that type of income has all sorts of deductions. And they also have dividend interest being taxed at the lower rate of 15% tax rate; that's a big thing for wealthy people. Especially OLDER wealthy people, who tend to invest their retirement assets in mutual funds that pay big dividends, and bonds.

If the wealthy person is a small business owner or self-employed, besides all the regular deductions, they also have work-related deductions (deducting cost of home computers used for business, space used in home for conducting business, maintenance and repair of automobiles, clothing, food, and on and on).

[guitar man]

22. Here's my answer

This group at the top rungs of our societal ladder holds a huge and ever increasing chunk of everything in this country while the bottom 80%, that's 8 out of 10 Americans, get to split up a measly 7% of the wealth, no matter how hard we work.

The upper rung segment has gotten this way by co-opting and outright purchasing the democratic process right out from under the vast majority of everyday working class citizens. They have then used the government they purport to hate to turn every situation to their advantage and have been increasingly locking the rest of us out in the cold for the past 3 decades.

They have managed to pull off this great coup by repeatedly promising that as the "job creators" if we would lower their taxes and keep them low, their cherished "free market" and it's magic invisible and would make things better for all of us because they could grow their businesses, hire more people , pay better wages and blah blah blah...we've all heard it a million times.

Bottom line is, as a group they have FAILED at every turn to pony up what they promised every time they got their tax cuts. As a group, they are currently taxed at the lowest rates since before the great depression. If it worked as advertised, we should be swimming in prosperity. We aren't.

So now it's way past time to pull the plug on their tax cut priveleges, and it's probably time to pull the plug on their capitalism priveleges too. I am the father of a 5 year old, I know how things get out of hand when bad behavior contiunues and priveleges are not taken away in response. It just gets worse and worse...

So, FWIW, there is my answer to that noise.

[FLyellowdog]

23. Thanks.