Here's what I don't get about people beating up Obama on the debt ceiling

[The Hitman]

Okay, so you think he's caving in too much. I get it.

But remember that the rest of the Democratic party appears to be following in tow. If a majority of people within our party are backing him, then what does that say about how the party as a whole is treating the base?

Are you by extension going against the party as well?

We look up to Bernie Sanders for his progressive line. But remember, he's not an elected member of the Democratic Party.

I just don't see the solution here.

[Change Happens]

1. I just asked this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1535276

[Bluenorthwest]

2. The part you are lacking on is the 'appears to be following in tow'

I do not agree. I do not think they even know what they are being asked to vote on. Cuts will cost them their jobs.
And that majority has been really, really wrong. Many times, So that is no way to find one's footing, looking to see what the crowd is doing.

[patrice]

3. I don't get it either. I hold ALL of them responsible, especially the Dems the ones who

are just along for the ride.

People don't seem to understand what a President can't do, especially in a situation in which some bad actors, i.e. those responsible for the Derivative Crash of '08, NEED to be corrected, but what the President needs to do that most effectively is information that is PRIVATE property. So the best he can do is game the situation in order to learn some things that might help him decide what to do, and if he gets it wrong, he many not deal the right consequences to those who deserve to pay for their financial treason and he could also hurt those who aren't that guilty and who are in a weakened condition now too because of the bad actors.

Lot of yelling on this board about the President being too chummy with Wall Street, but I think he has a very special problem that goes something like what I sketched above.

[Angry Dragon]

4. First I think there are question that need to be answered

What do the Democrats stand for??

What is a progressive??

I am getting real tired of people (mostly politicians and the so called media)
using terms that they have no definition.

Small business
Middle-class

Perhaps the leader of the party is lost and leading the base astray

[McCamy Taylor]

5. I will assume that this is a serious question and I will provide a serious answer...

Obama's position is much stronger than that of the rank and file members of Congress. Except for those who are independently wealthy or who come from safe liberal districts, Congressmen and women must whore themselves for SuperPac money if they are going to get re-elected in 2012. If any big special interest decides to target a specific Democrat, he or she is toast. Thanks to the Roberts Supreme Court, millions can be poured into ANY election by ANYONE. Individual members of Congress will not be able to raise enough money to fight back. And so, few members of Congress can afford to attract the wrong kind of corporate attention. In addition, they MUST bring home some pork,. Often, that means cutting deals so that other members of Congress can also bring home some pork. "Pork" usually means jobs or occasionally public works that bring jobs. So, Dems will try to broker deals that will get their districts jobs. That is why you will not see defense cuts, for example. It isn't ideology. It is economics.

Obama, on the other hand, is the incumbent. That means he has an enormous ability to raise cash for his own re-election. No matter how much money the Koch Brothers or the Saud Family of Saudi Arabia funnel into the GOP's coffers, Obama will be able to match that. I am sure that some of his more right wing, pro-business advisers are trying to convince him that if he doesn't kiss Koch Brother ass, he will be penniless in 2012, but this just is not true. People who wants favors NOW, as opposed to in 2013, will offer him suitcases full of money. Also, there are plenty of special interests whose interests are not those of Big Oil or the health insurance industry. Manufacturing, retail, travel---all of these will look to Obama to save them from the specter of higher oil prices and lower profit margins. If they think Obama can get re-elected, these folks will give to him.

Obama is different from Congress in a second way. If an individual Congressman stumbles, none of the rest get hurt. However, in a presidential election years, the party in power counts upon the President having coattails. His job is to get out the rank and file loyal party members, who will punch that straight party ticket. This is better than money, better than a visit from the president, because it is all free. It can mean the difference between seats lost and seats gained for a party.

Right now, Obama is getting some very bad advice from someone. He is being told that America will forgive him if he seems cold, intellectual and indifferent to the suffering of middle class America, as long as the statistics look better in 2012. This is utter bs. America is not going to care about some numbers. They will remember how they felt in the bad times and how Obama made them feel when they were already feeling bad. If he seemed to be on their side---if he had their backs, seemed to be speaking for the common man, if he showed that he CARED---they will vote for him. If they remember him the way they remembered Bush Sr.---a smart enough guy but out of touch with the problems of main street--he will be swept aside. If Obama gets swept aside, Democrats in Congress get swept aside and everything in DC goes Republican. This is what the RNC is aiming for. The key to their plans is a clueless Obama who does not know how to act like a Democratic president.

You have to wonder what Bill Clinton is doing during all this. Is he being ignored? Is he choosing to sit this one out in a sense of pique over what was done to his wife? I know that Clinton knows Democratic presidential politics. I suspect that Obama--who was raised an international child, rather than an American one---still does not quite understand how the game is played here. For instance, Michelle is supposed to be Eleanor, as in Mrs. Roosevelt. Where are the photo-ops at soup kitchens? Why isn't she CRYING in public over the plight of the poor? Is she doing her job and the press is ignoring her? Then she needs to work twice as hard to be the American equivalent of the Virgin of Guadalupe, the mother who loves us all.

The couple were skilled on the campaign trail. They were praised for running "the perfect campaign." Was that all Axelrod? If so, they better find a replacement for Axelrod immediately. This is not just about Obama. This is about the Democratic Party. It is Congress's job to write a budget---and it's the presidents job to reassure American Democratic voters that they have a voice in the budget negotiations. Remember, Americans will accept a lot of hardship, but they will never accept being told that they are not masters of their own fate. If they think Obama does not speak for him, they will dump him for someone who does.