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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 11:02 AM
Original message
Ignorance, hatred, and meanness of spirit
Right now, America sucks a lot. The last time we were this divided was probably during the Civil War. But todays divided America is a battle between a very few haves, and the other 99% of us have nots.

However, this time around, the haves have learned to use the ignorance of many have nots, and turn their frustrations into hatred for the other. And you know who the other is. Black people, brown people, Muslims, and everyone else who is different.

Theres a meanness of spirit across the land in todays America. It is dangerous, destructive, ugly and disgusting. And its being bought into by far too many fools. These fools are people who dont have a clue that they are being manipulated by a mere handful of the greedy. And they have no idea that everything they are being told to hate and destroy will result in them destroying themselves in the end.

It doesnt get more discouraging than this. The ignorant acting against their own self interests, and helping to bring about the end of whatever democracy we once had.

Ignorance, hatred, meanness of spirit, -- these are difficult things to battle. Yet, those of us who still think for ourselves must fight them. The world that would exist if we lose would be an unthinkable nightmare.
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Snoutport Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
1. And so we must prove they are wrong...
by being kinder, more generous and supportive of each other if for no other reason than to show by action rather than word, that we are good people.

Oh, and we should debate the hell out of anyone who says different!
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Are you suggesting that we follow in the footsteps of Gandhi and MLK?
Edited on Wed May-18-11 11:41 AM by Cyrano
I always wondered what happened to that tremendously courageous man in Tienanmen Square who stood in front of a tank holding nothing but a shopping bag.

As much as I admired Gandhi and MLK, I really don't know if passive resistance will work this time around. But I'd like to hear the thoughts of others on this subject.
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lapislzi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Correction:
MLK and Gandhi were anything but passive. Read Gandhi's writings. His resistance movement was active and energetic--and difficult. He never advocated passivity. Do not confuse passivity with nonviolence. They're not the same thing.
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The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. That would be great... if they understood how things like 'proof' work.
But they don't.

They will hold their force-fed beliefs in the face of any evidence, reason, proof, or act as if their lives depended on it. The brainwashing is so thorough I have a hard time imagining more than a handful could ever break free. They have the reinforcement of their echo-chambers and wingnut pundits to keep them assured that their beliefs are valid. This is scary fucking stuff, and I wouldn't be so pessimistic if I hadn't been face-to-face with it too many times to count.

We're in deep shit here. They're being programmed for war.
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xfundy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. "They're being programmed for war."--TRUE.
But don't give up hope. They decided to pick on the educated, the creative, those who make things work through using logic as well as trial and error, rather than standing firm on a system even when it fails.

Truth and justice will prevail, ultimately. I have to believe that, and I DO believe that. The question, though, is WHEN.
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The Doctor. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Oh my yes... that IS the question.
If the corporate forces get their way, the US will go hard-fascist, the wingnuts will sign up to be storm-troopers, and all signs of democracy will disappear under the fog of fear and hatred these idiots live in.

They'll hardly even notice.

Here's how these things will play out;

- People will continue to evolve. We've already seen how brain anatomy has improved over the last several thousand years. Those traits aren't going to go away any time soon, and certainly not soon enough for a feudal empire to flourish for very long. People will still be able to see and understand what is going on, and there will be enough information to put everything together with relative ease. That genie is out of the bottle.
In the pursuit of establishing control, more sharply defined echelons of power will be created. The insecurity that drives the quest for power is also not going away anytime soon. There will be constant power struggles 'under the waves', making opportunities to disrupt the structure plentiful.
At some point, the structure must fail. In order to not fail, it must have global dominance. With global dominance, the enemies of the structure will be many orders of magnitude greater in number, will, and resources. Small countries like Iraq could make totalitarian structure work. Try it with the whole planet and see how that works.

But try they will, and, one day, they will be destroyed simultaneously from both without and within. Hopefully, that will herald the new age of human evolution and we will become responsible for our habitats and perhaps even get off this world.

That, of course, is the worst case scenario.

I'm still hoping for the best though.
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OneGrassRoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 11:16 AM
Response to Original message
2. K&R n/t
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
4. K&R n/t
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TriMera Donating Member (885 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
9. k&r. n/t
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 12:26 PM
Response to Original message
10. Nonsense
Where is this 'ignorance, hatred and meanness of spirit?'

In working class neighborhoods where people pull together after floods, help families in hospice, volunteer at homeless shelters, fill bags for food banks, help a stranger change a flat tire?


The only hatred and meanness is on the part of the ruling class

unRec
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Yes, local disasters pull people together.
That was not my point. And hatred and meanness is not limited to "the ruling class."

Hatred, meanness and ignorance are just some of the weapons the ruling class uses to hold onto their power and to keep the suckers trying to win that big bear at the carnival. Obama did not choose the phrase "Carnival Barker" lightly. He knows what he, and all the rest of us, are up against.

But here's the difference. Carnival Barkers are out to make a few bucks from us. The ruling class is out to take everything we have. And then to turn us into their servants. Or perhaps more accurately, their slaves.
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Bake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
11. You see it on our side of the aisle as well, and you see it every day in DU/GD
Hatred and meanness of spirit, absolutely. Ignorance, not so much. I admit I'm guilty of it too.

We all have to try to avoid it.

Bake
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
13. I'm beginning to think that divided is the natural state of the country.
It wasn't united during the revolutionary war, the war of 1812 or during and after the Civil War. The Gilded Age wasn't a time of unity. And then we had the 60s, followed shortly by the culture wars. Did I leave anything out?
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. You seem to have covered it, EFarrari
My only quibble may be that the War of 1812 was fought against the British. All the rest, we fought against each other. And these wars are best named, "Robber Barons Against All The Rest Of Us."

The Robber Barons never go away. Today, they are called the "haves." They can never get enough. And we can never stop fighting them. But, damn it, they really have our backs against the wall this time around. So do we fight, grovel, hope, pray, try a non-violent approach, or do everything possible to bury the bastards?

Beats me. What do you think we should do?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. I recently found out that there was a large population here in the states
Edited on Wed May-18-11 02:25 PM by EFerrari
that sided with the British during the war of 1812. After the war, many of them went up to Canada.

As far as your question, you got me. Big money seems to have all the levers in its hands again. But even so, I've been looking at the revolutionaries in Egypt a lot lately. Their movement didn't spring up over night. They've been working at this for decades and it's not unusual for a young activist leader of today to come from a family where the parents and even the grandparents were also activists. That's why they're so disciplined and why even the extreme provocation that Mubarak tried to use on them didn't work.

When you think about it, political order (or, the State) came about as a way for people to balance the power of families (that would be feudalism). The only thing that really seems worthwhile to me at the moment is to withdraw some of the investment we've made in the State and return it to our localities as a first step and then, to network those as a second one. That's not the work of one election cycle or even of one lifetime but I don't see how we're going to get anywhere until that happens.

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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. I think some folks worked hard to make people ignorant..
I don't think it is a natural state.
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Natural or unnatural. It's where we are. So what do we do now?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. I think you're probably right and that adds to our division.
But I don't think it's the main cause. This is a huge country. Expecting everyone to be on the same page is unrealistic; that expectation is mostly a product of stories we were told that were largely folklore.

The first 13 colonies weren't even all that "united", when you think about it.

I guess my point is, if we stop trying to fix some mythical, temporary "division" and are a little more realistic about what this playing field really looks like, we won't waste time trying to fix the wrong problem.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
19. extraordinarily sad isn't it? nt
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Raksha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
20. K & R - Agree with you, get demoralized and disgusted
and don't know what to do about it either.
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Cyrano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-18-11 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. I occasionally think that life is just a bad dream.
But what really scares me is that it isn't.
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