Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Libyan Revolution Day 85

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU
 
joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 08:13 PM
Original message
Libyan Revolution Day 85
Links to sites with updates: AJE Live Blog AJE Twitter Dashboard The Guardian Reuters Telegraph feb17.info Libya Alhurra (live video webcast from Benghazi) Libya Alhurra archives and updates Benghazi Free Radio, in Arabic (may have translators present at times) Tribute FM (English broadcast from Benghazi) libyafeb17.com

Twitter links: Ayman Mohyeldin, with AJE Ben Wedeman, with CNN tripolitanian, a Libyan from Tripoli Brian Conley, reporter in Libya FreeLibyanYouth, Libyan advocate LibyaFeb17.com twitter account ChangeInLibya, Libyan advocate Sofyan Amry (arrived in Benghazi recently) KiloFoot (general Arab Spring news aggregation)

Useful links: feb17voices Current time in Libya Prayer times in Libya

Day 84 here.

Marching On in Libya, for the revolutionaries!


Children at a volunteer school. The was school set-up by volunteers in the eastern rebel stronghold city of Benghazi.

Photograph: Saeed Khan / AFP



Libya rebels in Misrata cautious despite gains
NATO air strikes helped Libyan rebels seize the airport in Misrata this week but they know the victory is unlikely to break the deadlock in their war to topple Muammar Gaddafi.

Both rebels and forces loyal to Gaddafi have struggled to hold military gains during eight weeks of fighting in the port city. So even though rebels captured government weapons at the airport they remain vulnerable to counter attack, rebels said.

"This is a big victory but not the end of the battle. NATO needs to do more because Gaddafi's threat is still there, mainly on the outskirts of the city. Many families are still encircled in some areas," rebel spokesman, Mohamed, said by telephone.

...

"Did our efforts have an impact on the taking of the airport? More than likely. Was that our intent? No," he said.


Heheh @ that last line. :)

Geography thwarts Gaddafi on Libya's western front
Colonel Tarek Zanbou stood high above the desert plains where Libya meets Tunisia, and explained how his rebels happen to hold the Western Mountains. He was brief.

"The geography is with us," he said, in English honed at Durham University in the northeast of England.

...

Ill-equipped and poorly-trained, the rebels hold a single mountain-top road that runs about 200 km (125 miles) from the Tunisian border to just beyond the town of Zintan, some 150 km short of the capital, Tripoli.

...

"Now, we are just defending," said 43-year-old Zanbou, who said he served as an intelligence officer in Gaddafi's army based in Tripoli. "If we get weapons, we can push them (pro-Gaddafi forces) to Tripoli. But now we are in a defensive situation."



Libyan military attache joins rebel ranks - TV
A Libyan military attache to the Emirates on Thursday told Al Arabiya channel he was quitting his post to join the rebel ranks.

"I announce my split from the regime and my joining and wholehearted support for the February 17 revolution," said airforce brigadier Ammar Bilqasem, who was wearing a badge of the rebel flag on the lapel of his jacket.

"Victory is near," he said.


Misrata airport would be tricky lifeline - agencies
Reports that Libyan rebels have captured the airport in the western city of Misrata could herald a new lifeline for the beleaguered population, but using the airfield could prove hazardous, aid agencies said Thursday.

Ships have delivered emergency food and medical supplies and evacuated some 13,000 migrants and wounded from the besieged city. But the vessels take up to 24 hours to reach Misrata from Benghazi in the east and face shelling and mines near the port.

Rebels trying to overthrow Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi said Wednesday they had captured Misrata airport in heavy fighting. They said they had also seized large quantities of weapons and munitions.

"It is too early to even think about trying to use the airport. If all is okay, it could potentially be an additional lifeline, but it is very dangerous, even in Benghazi the airport is not being used," Jemini Pandya, spokeswoman of the International Organisation for Migration (IOM), told Reuters.


'Gaddafi is the terrorist man': Derna denies being al-Qaida hotbed
It's not the caricatures of Muammar Gaddafi that mark the crumbling Mediterranean town of Derna as unusual.

Nor is it the messy graffiti cursing his 42-year-rule, which can be seen in cities across the east of the country in the so-called Free Libya that has existed since the revolution in February.

Instead it is the neatly stencilled messages, appearing in English on walls and placards, that hint at how Derna is fighting two battles: one to rid the country of Gaddafi and the other to shed the town's reputation as an outpost of Islamist extremism.

"Yes to pluralism," reads the slogan outside the port. "No to Qaeda."


Difference between now and the Spanish Civil War: when the anarchists were slandered by the fascists and communists, there was no way to defend ones self from them. As Orwell said in Homage to Catalonia: "Just imagine how odious it must be to see a young 15-year old Spaniard brought back from the front lines on a stretcher, to see, poking out from under the blanket an anemic, bewildered face and to think that in London and Paris there are gentlemen dressed to the nines, blithely engaged in writing pamphlets to show this little lad is a covert fascist." :cry:

A roadmap for Libya
At the beginning of this month, the Turkish prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, called upon Muammar Gaddafi to step down immediately in order to allow a new political process to begin in Libya. Erdogan's call complemented the roadmap for Libya he announced in April.

The roadmap has three main components: introducing an immediate ceasefire, establishing a humanitarian aid corridor, and starting a process for a new political order in Libya, which means Gaddafi leaving office. All three are essential for moving beyond the current situation and establishing a free and democratic Libya. The roadmap has garnered considerable international support last week its three components were adopted at the Libya contact group meeting in Rome, with US, Italian and Arab ministers showing public support.



Click here for updated map



A topic on the women of the revolution, dispels myths about the treatment of women in Benghazi.

Videos to bring the Libyan Revolution into context
The Battle of Benghazi. BBC Panorama on Libya Part 1, and Part 2. Video of the convoy sent to take Benghazi, taken from a dead soliders cell phone (shows how massive the operation was). Arab Awakening: Libya: Through the Fire. Tea of Freedom Song. Libya: Part 2 - The Uprising


March 10 7:28pm Saif al Islam Gaddafi says "the time has come for full-scale military action" against Libyan rebels. He goes on to say that Libyan forces loyal to his family "will never surrender, even if western powers intervene".


Text of UN resolution 1973. How will a no fly zone work? AJE reports.

Belgium: Six F-16 Falcon fighter jets of the Belgian Air Component. Bulgaria: The Bulgarian Navy Wielingen class frigate Drazki will participate in the naval blockade. Canada: Canadian Forces Air Command has deployed a total 440 military personnel as well as the Halifax-class frigate HMCS Charlottetown are participating in operations. Denmark: The Royal Danish Air Force is participating with six F-16AM fighters. France: French Air Force which realizes 25% of NATO's strikes is participating in the mission with 51 Mirage and Rafale Aircraft. Greece: The Elli-class frigate Limnos of the Hellenic Navy is currently in the waters off Libya as part of the naval blockade. Italy: Four Tornado ECRs of the Italian Air Force participated in SEAD operations. Jordan: Six Royal Jordanian Air Force fighter jets landed at a coalition airbase in Europe on 4 April to provide "logistical support." NATO: E-3 airborne early warning and control (AWACS) aircraft operated by NATO. Netherlands: The Royal Netherlands Air Force provides six F-16AM fighters and a KDC-10 refuelling plane. Norway: The Royal Norwegian Air Force has deployed six F-16AM fighters to Souda Bay Air Base. Qatar: The Qatar Armed Forces are contributing six Mirage 2000-5EDA fighter jets and two C-17 strategic transport aircraft. Romania: The Romanian Naval Forces will participate in the naval blockade with the frigate Regele Ferdinand. Spain: The Spanish Armed Forces are participating with four F-18 fighters. Sweden: The Royal Swedish Air Force will commit eight JAS 39 Gripen jets for the international air campaign. Turkey: The Turkish Navy will participate with five ships and one submarine in the NATO-led naval blockade to enforce the arms embargo. United Arab Emirates: The United Arab Emirates Air Force sent six F-16 Falcon and six Mirage 2000 fighter jets to join the mission. United Kingdom: The Royal Air Force has deployed 12 Tornado and 10 Typhoon fighters, surveillance aircraft, and air refuelling tankers. United States: The United States has deployed a naval force of 11 ships and are using MQ-1 Predator UAVs to strike targets in Libya on 23 April.

"One month ago (Western countries) were sooo nice, so nice like pussycats," Saif says in a contemptuous sing-song tone."Now they want to be really aggressive like tigers. (But) soon they will come back, and cut oil deals, contracts. We know this game." - Saif Gaddafi


(Yeah, Saif, as if you weren't "cutting oil deals, contracts" with western states. Who are the 'tigers' now? Bombing your own people.)

The first free public opinion poll ever conducted in Libya reveals clues to Eastern Libyan sentiments
* 98 percent of the respondents do not support the division of Libya as a part of the political solution for the current conflict with the Gaddafi regime. Around 95 percent also dont see any role for Gaddafi or his sons in a transitional period, and think it is impossible to implement any political reform in Libya if Gaddafi or one of his sons stays in power

* Around 96 percent of those polled, believe that the 17th of February revolution can consolidate the national unity of Libya and support the model of a democratic Libya based on a constitution which respects human rights

* Al-Qaeda has not played any role in the 17th of February revolution, say 94 percent of the Eastern Libyans, and 91 percent thinks its impossible for Al-Qaeda to play any political role in the new Libya

* The National Transitional Council is seen by 92 percent of those surveyed as expressing the views and wishes of Libyans for change


This is equivalent to 17% the entire population of Libya, doing the numbers very conservatively.


A Legal War: The United Nations Participation Act and Libya
The above link is to an overview of why Obama's implementation of the NFZ and R2P is perfectly legal under the law. I will not post it entirely here, however, all objections come down to the misinformed position that Obama, by using forces in Libya, was invoking Article 43 of the United Nations. This is wrong. Obama invoked Article 42, which does not require congressional approval to implement. Proof of this is that Article 43 has never been used.

It goes like this: The US law (Title 22, Chap. 7, Subchap. XIV 287d) grants the President the right to invoke UN Article 42 without authorization, the War Powers Act (Title 50, Chap. 33 1541) grants the President permission to act without authorization under "specific statutory authorization" which, by definition, is what 287d does. 1543 of the War Powers Act requires the President to report to Congress, which he did. One can argue all day and night about the legality of the War Powers Act, doesn't change the fact that under the law as it is written, the President acted within the law.






Mohammed Nabbous, killed by Gaddafi's forces while trying to report on the massacre in Benghazi

"I'm not afraid to die, I'm afraid to lose the battle" -Mohammed Nabbous, a month ago when all this began


I'm struggling to come up with something to say about this man. I was not aware of the Libyan uprising until I saw Mo's first report, begging for help, posted here on DU. I was stricken. Here was a man giving everything he had to explain a situation that clearly terrified him, I would not call him a coward in that moment, but you could see the fear in his eyes, and desperation in his voice. For 30 days Nabbous would spend many hours covering the uprising in Benghazi. For many nights I would go to sleep with the webcast of Benghazi live on my computer screen, looking to it occasionally to be sure it was still 'there.' Mo treated the chat room as if we were his friends, and in some way, we were. I never signed up to LiveStream to thank him for all his work and it seems somewhat shallow to do so now, given that I was a lurker for so long. Ever since I took over posting these threads "Libya Alhurra" has been linked as a source of information. It wasn't until last night, when I posted, and twitter posted on Mo's adventures out into Benghazi to try to determine the truth of the situation, that Mo's webchannel became a hit, over 2000 people were watching him stream live. This was curious to him because he'd done many reports like this in the past but he appeared somewhat bemused that the view count exploded as it did. Last night Mo became a star. This is a man who first started out with a webcast replete with fear and desperation finally overcoming that aspect of himself and losing that fear, to become someone who was a fighter for the resistance just as much as those who held the guns. Reporting on the front lines of Benghazi became his final act, and for that he should never, ever be forgotten. I'm so sorry Mo that I never got to know you better.

Mo's first report, which many of you may remember, begging for help.

Mo leaves behind a wife who is with child, she had this to say about the No Fly Zone and R2P UN resolution:

We started this in a pure way, but he turned it bloody. Thousands of our men, women, and children have died. We just wanted our freedom, that's all we wanted, we didn't want power. Before, we could not do a single thing if it was not the way he wanted it. All we wanted was freedom. All we wanted was to be free. We have paid with our blood, with our families, with our men, and we're not going to give up. We are still going to do that no matter what it takes, but we need help. We want to do this ourselves, but we don't have the weapons, the technology, the things we need. I don't want anyone to say that Libya got liberated by anybody else. If NATO didn't start moving when they did, I assure you, I assure you, half of Benghazi if not more would have been killed. If they stop helping us, we are going to be all killed because he has no mercy anymore.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
1. Current time in Libya, 3:15am Friday, May 13
Friday the 13th!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
al bupp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
2. Al Jazeera Arabic: opposition advances towards Zliten
18:52 (GMT+2) Al Jazeera Arabic reports that opposition fighters from Misrata continue their advance towards Zliten.

From: http://www.libyafeb17.com /

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
3. Battle for Libya shifts in desert sands as Gaddafi loyalists target oilfields
Edited on Thu May-12-11 09:12 PM by tabatha
Daniel Howden sees the regime turn to guerrilla warfare in Jalo
Thursday, 12 May 2011

As the battle for Libya has reached a near stalemate along the Mediterranean coast, a guerrilla war has begun in the deep desert to the south where the country's strategic oil and water reserves lie.

The oasis of Jalo, 250km south of the front line between Ajdabiya and Brega, has witnessed repeated raids by a fast-moving enemy that attacks and then disappears back into the desert.

The assaults by regime forces come amid claims last night by the rebels that they had taken control of the airport in the western coastal city of Misrata, which has been under siege for nearly two months. But despite rebels claiming a major breakthrough against the forces of Muammar Gaddafi, the battle for control of the sparsely populated Jalo area could have greater long-term consequences.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/battle-f...

I don't know how credible this article is. The Independent does not have a good reputation. The comments seem to be from a different world.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yosarian71 Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. That sure is some stalemate
Basically nothing has happened this week. Right.

This bozo is writing about maybe a dozen 4x4's racing around the desert that have not been caught yet. Big deal.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #3
28. The facts are correct and the reporting is rare.
It's actually pretty good as these things go.

The problem comes with the characterizations of the events. I don't understand why editors would insist putting on that threadbare "stalemate" shirt topped by an old "guerrilla war" cap. It doesn't fit, however fashionable.

By the actions of this group I think "raiding party" would be a better tag.

That's not to say though that it doesn't matter. Sure, it won't determine the outcome, but it does show the schizophrenic thinking in decisions that are likely made by only two or three people at the top.

Reporting and attention to the area is rare, and about all you can do otherwise is piece together bits and tweets into something that seems consistent and coherent. The original plan seems to have been to assemble 1500 to 3000 Gaddafi soldiers and mercenaries from Sabha and possibly Chad, move east to Kufra then north through Jalo to outflank Ajdabiya; an alternate idea might have been to split the east by driving to Tobruk.

In fact though, what's happened is that this force moves into a town, rounds a few people up, calls for a pro-Gaddafi protest (under threat), then backs off (or gets driven off), shells the town, and moves on to the next one. Unlike the western mountains, these towns are not close enough to support each other. When the Gaddafi forces moved north of Jalo, they were stopped in their tracks by Nato. When they've moved into the towns the rebels have driven them off. The force can now only be a fraction of what it was, but it's thirsty and dangerous.

A reason for more serious concern comes from the timing of the raid -right after the NTC made their first oil sale and at the same time the fuel crunch really started to hit Tripoli. The oil facilities had been hit earlier, but ineffectively. It was one of the first things this group did after it left Kufra. Now they've been seriously damaged. Exactly how serious, we don't really know.

But what we do know is that after every loss, Gadaffi forces have made some sort of move of retribution. Most of them, but not all, have been aimed at social or economic infrastructure, whatever hurts the most, whether it's water wells in the west, water and the oil storage in Misrata (used for electricity), the oil storage at Benghazi (also for electricity, the one that Mo covered that night). Water, fuel, and the very large natural gas facility at Brega are the reasons to keep track of this bunch of raiders. Many of the electrical plants are gas fired, and the gas runs through Brega. It's hard to exaggerate how linked all of these are to the basic sustainability of Libya's coastal cities, and they are all vulnerable and concentrated.

I see now I could have saved some typing, because there's another article at the same site on the subject of the eastern raids:

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/shash...

"To ensure longevity, Muammar Gaddafi has had to switch his focus to securing the war's lifelines. And supplies are no less important to the rebel forces"
Thursday, 12 May 2011

"Supplies are no less important to the self-described Free Libya forces, which is why the government has struck at the rebels' own lifelines in the south-east of the country. The Sarir field is the country's largest, but it lies outside Nato's core patrolling zone and its pipelines have been subject to sporadic regime raids. The area hosts key portions of the water grid; Libya is mostly desert and desalination capacity is limited."

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
al bupp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 09:08 PM
Response to Original message
4. Twitter @ChangeInLibya: Temena area has been fully liberated
From: @ChangeInLibya

MISRATA BREAKING: Temena area has been fully liberated just now & a couple of tanks that escaped to air academy got destroyed by NATO

60 minutes ago

Twitpic Graphic of Temena
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yosarian71 Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
6. Major crackdown in Fashloom area of Tripoli
Where are these defections that Heinz keeps promising? Now would be the time.

Tripolitanian: Tripoli BREAKING: NATO strikes up to 30 minutes ago CONFIRMED and Fashloom is FULL of Gaddafi forces after clashes earlier today. #libya

http://twitter.com/#!/Tripolitanian
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
7. Qatari military advisers on the ground, helping Libyan rebels get into shape
AJDABIYA, LIBYA The United States, European allies and other nations have dispatched representatives to the Libyan oppositions ruling council. But on the ground here, credit for helping to get the rebel army into shape goes to military advisers from the tiny Arabian Peninsula emirate of Qatar.

Qatar was the first Arab country to formally recognize the political legitimacy of the rebel council in Benghazi and the first to provide military assistance, sending six Mirage fighter jets to help NATO enforce the no-fly zone in March. Qatar also helped the rebel leadership sell oil to help finance the fledgling administration. Now, it is alone in providing military training to the rebels, officials say.

They are helping us to organize ourselves, Mahmoud Jibril, a leader of the Libyan opposition council, said Wednesday during a visit to Washington, adding that no other countries are providing military training to the oppositions fighters.

Qatar had stood by us from the very beginning, even before it was announced that they were here, said Col. Ahmed Bani, a spokesman for the rebel army. They have been more effective than any other nation. They just havent boasted about it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle-east/qatari-...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
8. CNN report on expats returning to fight for the revolution, giving up their western lives:
https://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=114833105269...

Incredible report. Those men are certainly brave.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 10:10 PM
Response to Original message
9. Most people in 23 nations back NATO action in Libya
NEW YORK May 12 (Reuters) - Sixty percent of people from 23 countries support NATO's military intervention in Libya, a poll showed on Thursday.

The Ipsos poll found more than 70 percent support in Belgium, South Africa, Australia, India, France, Sweden and Canada for the NATO strikes on Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi's military and command structures.

About two-thirds of people in Brazil, Japan, Spain, South Korea, Poland and the United States back the action, which began after the U.N. Security Council in March authorized a no-fly zone and "all necessary measures" to protect civilians.

And more than half the people in Germany, Britain, Hungary, Mexico and Italy support the NATO strikes, while Saudi Arabia was evenly split. Support was less than 50 percent in Russia, Turkey, Argentina and Indonesia.

...

More than 18,500 adults were interviewed online by Ipsos between April 6 and April 21 and the survey has a margin of error of plus or minus 3.1 percentage points. (Reporting by Michelle Nichols; Editing by Eric Beech)

http://af.reuters.com/article/energyOilNews/idAFN122993...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Amonester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. Thanks for finding and posting this.
Although I was not polled, that 70% in Canada sure does include meself.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 10:26 PM
Response to Original message
10. FACTBOX-Amnesty International's rights report
LIBYA*

"Amnesty International researchers on the ground have been investigating numerous reports that attacks by Libyan forces have hit or targeted civilians or were indiscriminate. They have also been looking into the enforced disappearance of hundreds of people since the protests began, and have confirmed that during the protests people were deliberately killed or died as a result of excessive or indiscriminate use of lethal force at the hands of security forces. Amnesty International also uncovered the use of cluster bombs and anti-personnel landmines by pro-Gaddafi forces."

"About half a million people fled the ongoing conflict in Libya, mostly into Egypt and Tunisia..."

SYRIA*

"By 19 April, some 220 people had died during a month of violence, the overwhelming majority apparently as a result of being shot with live ammunition fired by the security forces."

YEMEN*

"Vast demonstrations have rocked Yemen since the beginning of 2011 ... At least 120 people have lost their lives and hundreds have been injured as security forces have repeatedly used live ammunition and other, often excessive force to break up demonstrations."

http://af.reuters.com/article/libyaNews/idAFLDE74B1PP20...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Turborama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 10:29 PM
Response to Original message
11. K&R & Hi Josh
Can I make a suggestion about the "Arab Awakening: Libya: Through the Fire" Video? I reckon it should get added to the Mohammed Nabbous box, seeing as it's not just a history of the revolution, it's also largely a bio about him and the brave work he did.

Thanks again for all the hard work you and everyone else are doing. (I have to take somewhat of a back seat due to increasing personal commitments).

:hi:

PS, I've taken a screenshot of this if you'd like a copy... http://twitter.com/#!/DUTurborama/status/67097813548417...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Thanks Turborama, it's also one of the earliest doco's of the Feb 17 rev...
...and should get more exposure so I'll try to figure out how to do that. :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 11:23 PM
Response to Original message
14. For Libyan Rebels, a Light Moment in a Doleful War
May 12, 2011, 9:29 pm
By C.J. CHIVERS

MISURATA, Libya If the official statements by the government of Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi about the battle for this city were true, then much that was visible around the airport on Thursday did not actually happen or exist.

There were no clusters of rebels and machine-gun trucks at the traffic circle by the outdoor bazaar and huge mosque. The empty fighting holes, left in haste on Wednesday by fleeing Qaddafi soldiers, were not empty. The loyalist soldiers there were just especially well-camouflaged.

Those armed rebels on the runway, milling around by the score? They were not really there.

And certainly Rabi Mustaf Algnidi, 20, did not drive with his fellow rebels into one of the airports military hangars and climb atop a Soko G-2 Galeb military jet, pry open the cover of the fuel tank with a bayonet and siphon out jet fuel, mouth-to-hose, into an empty water jug.



http://atwar.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/05/12/for-libyan-re...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-12-11 11:47 PM
Response to Original message
15. Sea Shepherd Ships to Patrol Libyan War Zone for Poachers
Thursday, May 12, 2011

Photo: Gary StokesPhoto: Gary StokesEffective next month, two Sea Shepherd Conservation Society ships will enter the waters off the coast of Libya, an area declared to be in a state of war as NATO-backed rebel forces struggle to topple the despotic dictator Muammar Gaddafi, with the goal of intercepting Bluefin tuna poachers and freeing any illegally caught fish in attempt to save the species from nearing extinction.

The territorial waters off Libya are a declared a no-fly zone by NATO, which means there will be a distinct absence of poaching surveillance in the region. NATO is not interested in illegal fishing operations, and no European Union or International Commission for the Conservation of Atlantic Tunas (ICCAT) inspectors will be allowed into the Libyan zone.

The Greenpeace Foundation is not conducting a Bluefin tuna campaign, meaning that the only protection for the highly endangered Bluefin tuna will be at the presence of two Sea Shepherds vessels: the flagship Steve Irwin and the soon to be renamed fast interceptor vessel. The only non-military aircraft in this zone will be Sea Shepherds helicopter the Nancy Burnet onboard the Steve Irwin.

This will be a dangerous campaign but the Bluefin tuna are facing extinction within a few years unless they are effectively protected, and Sea Shepherd will not fail them. Last year, during the first Operation Blue Rage Campaign in 2010, Sea Shepherd crewmembers located and intervened against an illegal poaching operation freeing approximately 800 Bluefins.

http://www.seashepherd.org/news-and-media/news-110512-2...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 12:04 AM
Response to Original message
16. Schematic battlefield plan of the Misrata Siege as of May 12th
Edited on Fri May-13-11 12:06 AM by tabatha
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yosarian71 Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 06:02 AM
Response to Reply #16
24. That is what is confirmable
Edited on Fri May-13-11 06:04 AM by Yosarian71
Good map. I have wished that the media would use and update more maps.

Based on most tweets, the western front of Misurata is at Zlitan. It also appears, based on reports near the airport and Temena, that the rebels have extended the front out to the southeast. I believe they are going to turn to the east and encircle Gaddafi's troops along the shore south of Misurata.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
17. Heinz sounds really optimistic
Edited on Fri May-13-11 12:11 AM by tabatha
Libya Live Blog 6 minutes ago
goverment in libya know
Game over zero points

Libya Live Blog 23 minutes ago
it is 6.28 am in germany now
and a lot of new info coming in over night.
there are massive deflektions in daffis army now ,the only troops who are loyal to daffi are the brigades of his sons.
this brigades are mostly not libyens and fight for money not for libya.
ff seize a lot of weapons and amu this days and coming stronger every day.
libyen airforce change to ff side and a lot of other units from army.
there are only crazy people left on daffis side ,you see it yesterday ,to attack a destroyer with rockets is pure suizide .
daffi and his sons are on tilt now ,they loose every day more and their exit street is coming small.

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...


I hope so. May the killing (for 42 years) in Libya stop, soon.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yosarian71 Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 05:57 AM
Response to Reply #17
23. Next 24 hours look big
The other credible poster AFreedom seems to confirm Heinz's predictions.

Another poster was able to prove Gaddafi's video from 2 days ago was a fake because the time went backward in the background.

The mercs will start to disintegrate into the background as this fight continues to turn against Gadaffi and the defections pick up. I am sure many of them don't even know Gaddafi is losing. Cowardly actions like randomly firing into innocent civilians and raping women is one thing, but these mercs didn't join this fight to get killed. Most likely the Libyans will not be as generous with defecting mercs in the final days as they are with Libyans. I can't say that the mercs deserve much mercy. There is nothing more evil and low than killing and hurting others for money.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #23
47. I saw AFreedom's post.
Btw, do you know that if you click on the user's icon, and then choose "Activity" when the dialog box opens up, you can see all of that user's posts. Saves hunting through the thousands of posts.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 02:20 AM
Response to Original message
18. Italian foreign minister: arrest warrant for Gadhafi likely issued end of May


By Associated Press, Published: May 12


ROME Italys foreign minister says he expects the International Criminal Court to issue an arrest warrant for Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi at the end of the month.

Franco Frattini said Thursday that would be a key moment in the Libya crisis, suggesting that after the warrant is issued it would be impossible for Gadhafi to agree to an exile.

Frattini said from that moment on an exit from power or from the country will no longer be imaginable because after the arrest warrant is issued all the international community would have legal obligations.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/italian-foreign-min...








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 07:53 AM
Response to Reply #18
29. Warcrimes court to seek Libya arrest warrants on May 16
1 hr 6 mins ago


THE HAGUE (AFP) International Criminal Court prosecutor Luis Moreno-Ocampo said Friday he would seek arrest warrants on May 16 for three people considered most responsible for crimes against humanity in Libya.

...


"The Judges may decide to accept the application, to reject it or to ask the Office for additional information."



http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110513/wl_afp/libyaconfli...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cognitive_Resonance Donating Member (733 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 02:22 AM
Response to Original message
19. K&R nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 03:05 AM
Response to Original message
20. Mahmoud Gebril: What the Libyan Resistance Needs (Op-Ed in WaPo)



Op-Ed Contributor

What the Libyan Resistance Needs


By MAHMOUD GEBRIL ELWARFALLY
Published: May 12, 2011



IN late February, as the Libyan opposition gained strength, the regime of Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi predicted there would be rivers of blood and hundreds of thousands of dead because of the uprising. At the time, little stood between him and this chilling threat. But thanks to decisive action from the United States and the international community, the pulse of freedom still beats strong in opposition-controlled areas of Libya.


Even while fighting for our lives, we have begun to put the building blocks in place for a free society. The interim government, the Transitional National Council, has managed to fight a war, keep the lights on and reopen the schools. The people of Benghazi, the base of our struggle, are participating in traffic control and trash collection, and creating newspapers and radio stations that reflect the new spirit of tolerance and freedom. Policies are debated passionately in open forums. All of this would have been unthinkable three months ago.


The councils 31 members lawyers, human rights advocates, former military officers and business owners come from all regions of Libya. Many, like me, were educated in the United States. In our march to freedom, we are strengthened by a belief in peace, justice and equality. The dark days of Colonel Qaddafis rule have taught us that a free and democratic society based on a fair and transparent justice system is the only way forward. We will work to ensure that the peaceful transfer of power occurs through ballot boxes and legal institutions. The bedrock of our state will be a constitution written by the Libyan people and endorsed in a public referendum.


The lives of too many innocent Libyans have already been lost. The council unequivocally condemns the killing of noncombatant Qaddafi loyalists. When the fighting stops, we will be faced with the difficult task of healing a nation traumatized by decades of violence. The council will not only create institutions based on the rule of law, but also begin a reconciliation process to unify Libyans on both sides of this conflict.

...


Mahmoud Gebril ElWarfally, interim prime minister of the Transitional National Council of the Libyan Republic, is the author of Imagery and Ideology in U.S. Policy Toward Libya, 1969-1982.


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/13/opinion/13elwarfally....



Gebril also elaborates in the article on the four things he is asking the Obama Administration and Congress to do:


INTENSIFY NATO OPERATIONS


OFFICIALLY RECOGNIZE THE COUNCIL


ACCELERATE ACCESS TO FROZEN LIBYAN ASSETS


SUSTAIN HUMANITARIAN AID






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 04:15 AM
Response to Original message
21. Gibril's address at the Saban Center for Middle East Policy, Brookings Institution:


Washington, D.C.
Thursday, May 12, 2011


Featured Speaker:
MAHMOUD GIBRIL ELWARFALLY
Interim Prime Minister
Transitional National Council of the Libyan Republic



The Future of Libya: A View from the Opposition



.... Unfortunately we are facing a very acute financial problem because of the frozen assets that we have in different European countries and in the United States. So I would like to seize this opportunity and to call on the United States administration to help us as they helped us, President Obama particularly, in particular his call for the end of the legitimacy of the regime, that this regime lost its legitimacy and should leave. This was very inspiring to many Libyan people that they are not alone in their fight against dictatorship, so I want to thank him for that call. And I want to thank all the free world who stood by us in this fight against tyranny.


Now if we move a little bit further toward the military situation, I would like to clarify something. This revolution started as a peaceful revolution. It's not an armed struggle against a tyranny or against another army. Armed struggle was forced upon us because of this genocide which was taking place. This killing machine was slaughtering people day and night by the thousands. The expectation and the estimate was that over 11,000 people died during those 12 weeks of manslaughtering. We still have -- and gone, you know? Too many people are fleeing their country, you know. Going to Tunisia and to the Egyptian borders. The United Nations just yesterday -- before yesterday -- released its last report saying that over 750,000 Libyan country fled their country. This never happened in our history before.


We, despite all this agony and this painful human tragedy, we're very much optimistic about our future. Our people in Misurata, they managed with those light machine guns against this mighty military machine to liberate their city and they are marching west toward Tripoli. Those towns in the western mountain -- all western mountain towns are liberated now, and they are hoping to break the siege of that mountain to march toward Tripoli.


Active uprisings started to appear in the capital city of Tripoli itself during the last week and the week before. So we are very much optimistic that people started to gain confidence, taking things in their hands. Military are improving and gaining ground. This is against all allegations circulating that there is a stalemate case on the ground. That's not the case at all, you know.


(Uncorrected transcript)
http://www.brookings.edu/~/media/Files/events/2011/0512...







AUDIO available on this page (54:00):
http://www.brookings.edu/events/2011/0512_libya_opposit...




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 04:46 AM
Response to Original message
22. NPR: Libya TNC leader makes good impression on lawmakers and think-tank analysts


Jibril seems to be making a good impression on the lawmakers he met and on think-tank analysts, including Martin Indyk of Brookings.


"Prime Minister Jibril is quite impressive a Libyan leader who suddenly emerged on the stage in a way that is quite distinct from other Libyan officials that I've dealt with in the past," Indyk says. "Serious, smart and passionate about establishing a democracy in Libya."


Though Indyk has been skeptical about the U.S. involvement in Libya, he says the rebels deserve U.S. support.


"I don't think we have a strategic interest in what happens in Libya, but we definitely have a strong interest in, first of all, taking care of the humanitarian needs of the Libyan people and, secondly, helping them to overthrow this horrendous leader, Gadhafi," Indyk says. "And they're making progress."



http://www.npr.org/2011/05/13/136254231/rebel-leader-as...








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yosarian71 Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:07 AM
Response to Reply #22
32. Impressed with Gebril
The most important lesson from Vietnam is that finding a legitimate leader is absolutely essential for successfully intervening in another country militarily. Gebril is very impressive. Western educated, but credible to Libyans too. He has shown incredible bravery, not fleeing even as the Gaddafi tanks reached the outskirts of Benghazi in March.

It took the U.S. about 5 tries to find a credible alternative in Iraq, and al-Maliki is barely credible to Iraqis, as indicated by his recent hesitation about the continuing U.S. troop withdrawal. Karzai is a weak, drug dealing scumbag who has no legitimacy and never will. Obama should have cut our losses with this clown the day he took office. Now we are another 2.5 years into the conflict, Karzai is weaker than ever and the U.S. is no closer to getting out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 06:04 AM
Response to Original message
25. Tripoli witness: Tribalism and threat of conscription
Tripoli witness: Tribalism and threat of conscription
BBC News 13 May 2011 Last updated at 06:41 GMT

A Tripoli resident - who does not want his name to be used for security reasons - describes life in the Libyan capital. He says work, or the lack of it, is becoming a pressing concern for many - and so is the threat of conscription.

You know there is a problem in a country when you find that almost everyone you know is awake until the dawn call to prayer - and afterwards sleeps from sunrise until the early evening before sitting with their families again with nothing much to do.

The exception to the boredom is the still-worrying situation of fuel shortages, and a new phrase - "tribal allegiances" - being hammered out on state television.

The paradoxes of life here are on the rise and it is no longer only through official rhetoric.

more paradoxes...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-13380525

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 06:40 AM
Response to Original message
26. ICC will issue arrest warrants for individuals in the Libyan regime Monday
The satellite broadcaster al-Arabiya reports that the International Criminal Court will issue arrest warrants against individuals in the Libyan regime on Monday. Muammar Gaddafi is expected to be among them.


ICC chief prosectuor to request Libya arrest warrants on Monday: official #alarabiya


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/middle-east-live/2011/m...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 07:19 AM
Response to Original message
27. Supply line under strain in Libya's rebel-held west
Source: Reuters


Fri May 13, 2011 9:24am GMT


Rebels' only supply road under threat

Food supplies running out, fuel costs soaring

Doctors struggle to deal with wounded



By Matt Robinson

ZINTAN, Libya, May 13 (Reuters) - Concern is rising over shortages of food and fuel in Libya's Western Mountains, where fear of attack threatens the rebels single supply route and at least one remote town is blockaded by Muammar Gaddafi's forces.

Rebels control a chain of mountain-top towns on the western front of Libya's two-month-old conflict, linked by a single road running some 200 km (124 miles) from the Tunisian border to within 150 km (93 miles) of the capital, Tripoli.

But Gaddafi troops hold the desert plains below, and the road is exposed at several low sections -- a concern for aid agencies trying to enter rebel-held territory in defiance of the government.

...


The World Food Programme (WFP) said on Thursday it was increasingly concerned about access to food for people trapped by fighting in the region.

"We have not yet been able to reach the areas most affected by the fighting around Yefrin and Zintan in the Western Mountains," WFP executive director Josette Sheeran said. The supply route is now facing serious challenges due to insecurity in many of the areas, in addition to severe fuel shortages. More than 40,000 people have left the region for Tunisia, leaving a number of towns populated almost entirely by men. Refugees have reported male relatives disappearing from towns in the plains controlled by government troops.

...


http://af.reuters.com/article/libyaNews/idAFLDE74C0SI20...








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:00 AM
Response to Original message
30. 1,200 migrants feared dead during Libya sea exodus


9 mins ago


GENEVA (AFP) The UN refugee agency said Friday it feared that up to 1,200 people fleeing Libya have died in the Mediterranean Sea so far, as it found evidence that a military vessel refused to rescue one boat.

"There are about 12,000 people who have arrived in Italy or Malta and we believe that as many as 1,200 people are dead or have gone missing," said Melissa Fleming, a spokeswoman for the UN High Commissioner for Refugees.

A migrant told the UNHCR that unidentified military vessels off the Libyan coast refused or failed to pick up a boat carrying 72 people, most of whom subsequently died of exhaustion, thirst or starvation in late March or early April.

Fleming told AFP that the survivor's harrowing account obtained after a long interview on Thursday was "compelling and credible".

"At Shousha refugee camp run by UNHCR in Tunisia we met with three of the survivors. They were Ethiopian men, they said they were among only nine survivors from the boat that left Tripoli on 25 March carrying 72 people," she told journalists.

...


http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110513/wl_africa_afp/liby...









Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:03 AM
Response to Original message
31. AJE video report: pro-democracy fighters have taken up a new line of defence in the W. Mountains
1:29pm
Libya's pro-democracy fighters have taken up a new line of defence in the Western Mountains where from their high vantage point they can easily observe the movements of Muammar Gaddafi's troops on the plains far below.

It has been a successful last few moves for the NATO-aided rebels who have repelled attacks on land and sea in the last few days but things are far from over.

As the pawns make their move across the desert, the movements leaders are meeting with world leaders to make sure that when the dust settles a new regime will see light of day.

Al Jazeera's Erica Wood reports.

http://bcove.me/uhu4ok7n
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:12 AM
Response to Original message
33. Concern growing for Anton Hammerl, photographer held by Gaddafi regime
Edited on Fri May-13-11 08:21 AM by pinboy3niner
Concern is growing over a British-based photographer who has been missing for 39 days after being captured in Libya , writes Peter Beaumont.


Anton Hammerl, an award-winning photographer, was captured on 4 April and his family have had no concrete news about him since then.

The regime has, however, allowed access to three other journalists who were captured with him.

Hammerl, who has joint South African and Austrian nationality but lives with his wife, Penny Sukhraj, in Surrey, had been travelling with Manuel Varela de Seijas Brabo, Clare Gillis and James Foley when they were captured.

The Libyan regime has admitted it is holding all four journalists, and has allowed the two Americans and the Spaniard to receive a visitor where they are being held, but it has provided no information about Hammerl.



http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/middle-east-live/2011/m...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:32 AM
Response to Original message
34. Libyan capital buffeted by airstrikes, protests

DIAA HADID, Associated Press
Updated 05:42 a.m., Friday, May 13, 2011

TRIPOLI, Libya (AP) NATO launched more airstrikes Friday in Tripoli as Moammar Gadhafi's regime faced open defiance on the ground, with activists reporting gunfights between protesters and soldiers in several of the capital's neighborhoods.

...


An anti-government activist in Tripoli, interviewed Friday, said protests have occurred this week in at least three neighborhoods in the city, accompanied by exchanges of gunfire between opposition activists and Gadhafi forces.


In one neighborhood, Fashloum, the activist said he saw soldiers flooding the area and patrolling the streets in vehicles. He said he did not personally see a demonstration there but heard from other activists that there was a brief gunbattle.


The crackle of gunfire could be heard in a separate neighborhood close to a hotel where foreign reporters reside.


The activist's report echoed those made earlier to The Associated Press by a local journalist and resident on Thursday. All spoke on condition of anonymity out of fear of reprisals.

...


http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Libyan-capital-bu...









Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:59 AM
Response to Original message
35. NYT casts doubt on Gaddafi regime portrayal of NATO airstrike
I usually skip these stories about staged press visits to bombing sites and claims of civilian casualties by the Gaddafi regime, but happened to click on this one and found much more than I expected.

After an overnight airstrike, Gaddafi regime officials took reporters on a controlled tour of a Tripoli bombing site next to a children's playground and attempted to portray it as evidence of NATO's "barbarity" and immorality.

The NYT's John F. Burns was skeptical, and wrote a report that probably is not the one 'Tripoli Bob' expected:


But acting as a sort of truth squad in weighing the authenticity of the Qaddafi governments accounts of the bombings is an essential part of the job description for foreign journalists, and the notion of reporters lingering in a childrens playground in the pre-dawn hours was not the only element in the official story of the compound bombing that raised serious doubts.


There was, too, the fact that the three huge water-filled bomb craters shown to the reporters, and other features close by, appeared to point to the real target of the bombings as being a vast network of underground bunkers running for a half a mile or more beneath the compound a network that is believed to have been well known, for years, to Western intelligence agencies tracking the largely clandestine life of Colonel Qaddafi.


The other features that pointed to an attack on the compounds subterranean tunnels and bunkers included bomb fragments strewn around the craters that indicated that they came from bunker-busting, 2,000-pound bombs that were used by American aircraft in the attack on Baghdad in 2003, according to a Western security adviser accompanying one of the television crews who said he was familiar with the bombs.


Also, smaller craters at the bomb sites were tangled with what appeared to be the punctured wreckage of massive concrete and steel structures reaching deep underground, and at least one large aboveground ventilation shaft. Close to the childrens playground, there was a concrete stairway descending to a steel door, flanked by green-painted steel railings.


An official determination to disguise the stairways presence was betrayed by what appeared to have be a carefully marshaled gathering of a crowd of protesters around the stairway, and a frenzied push forward by the protesters whenever a reporter or a camera crew approached to get a closer view.


...


Libya Offers Controlled Tour of NATO Bombing Sites in Tripoli
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/13/world/africa/13tripol...




To avoid regwall, google story title (in bold above link) and get full, free access.






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #35
39. That is good -and much more than expected.
I found the line "three huge water-filled bomb craters" intriguing. All this time I had imagined it might end when the masses of Tripoli gather to pack sand in the ventilation shafts at Bab al-Aziziya. Nato's solution seems better thought through.

I look forward to the moment when those reporters at the Rixos realize the next shift of minders haven't shown up for work.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 09:19 AM
Response to Original message
36. Live tweeting of U.S. Congr. hearing on human rights in Bahrain:


BahrainRights: RT @VOAMiddleEast: BREAKING: US Congressional hearing on the #humanrights situation in #Bahrain. @VOAHilleary will live-tweet as will we
about 7 minutes ago







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
37. UN: Survivors of migrant sea odyssey from Libya found in Tunisian refugee camp


By Associated Press, Updated: Friday, May 13, 5:29 AM


GENEVA Three men who survived a harrowing odyssey at sea that saw dozens die of thirst and starvation on a boat fleeing Libya have been found in Tunisia, the U.N. refugee agency said Friday.


Melissa Fleming, a spokeswoman for the U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees, said the Ethiopian men were discovered in the Shousha refugee camp in Tunisia early Thursday.


The mens account to aid workers confirms Londons Guardian newspaper report that the boat carrying sub-Saharan migrants from Libya to Italy encountered military units who refused to help, Fleming told reporters in Geneva.


The refugee said that military vessels twice passed their boat without stopping, and that a military helicopter dropped food and water onto the boat at some point during the journey, said Fleming. The first boat refused their request to board. The second only took photos, she said, citing one of the witnesses.


...


http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/un-survivors-of-mig...








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
38. UN human rights agency orders fact-finding mission to Syria
The UN's human right organisation has ordered a fact finding mission to Syria and expressed "deep concerns" about the crackdown.

It highlighted reports that the Bab Amr residential district of Homs was shelled on Wednesday, and that up to 850 people have killed in the violence.

"We cannot verify these numbers for sure, but believe they are likely to be close to reality," said spokesperson Rupert Colville told journalists in Geneva.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/middle-east-live/2011/m...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
40. Libya boat migrants have 1/10 chance of dying: U.N.


By Barbara Lewis

GENEVA | Fri May 13, 2011 8:57am EDT

GENEVA (Reuters) - Migrants fleeing conflict in Libya by sea have a one in 10 chance of dying in a Mediterranean crossing in appalling conditions on massively overcrowded, unseaworthy boats, the U.N. refugee agency said on Friday.

Around 12,000 migrants have arrived at reception centers in Malta and Italy, while an estimated 1,200 are missing, presumed dead, adding a further human tragedy to the thousands killed in fighting.

"It is estimated they have got a one in 10 chance of perishing during that journey," Melissa Fleming, chief spokeswoman for the U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees, told a Geneva news briefing.


http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/05/13/us-libya-migr...








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
41. March 8, 2011 (AP) Gadhafi Loyalists Stop Migrants From Leaving Libya
Edited on Fri May-13-11 10:27 AM by Iterate
Gadhafi Loyalists Stop Migrants From Leaving Libya

By JOHN HEILPRIN Associated Press
GENEVA March 8, 2011 (AP)

Soldiers loyal to Libyan strongman Moammar Gadhafi have blocked some 30,000 migrant workers from fleeing into Tunisia and forced many to return to work in the Libyan capital, a Red Crescent official said Tuesday.

The migrant workers were rounded up and apparently held in Libyan immigration buildings near the Tunisian border last week, Ibrahim Osman of the International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies told The Associated Press.

Osman, who heads the agency's assessment teams in northern Africa, said Gadhafi soldiers were forcibly returning many of the 30,000 Bangladeshis, Egyptians and sub-Saharan Africans nearing the Ras Ajdir border crossing.

He said loyalists had held a pro-government demonstration at the crossing, and later that evening the "30,000 (migrant workers) accumulated at the Libyan border, waiting to cross."

much more...
http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=130866...


ETA: As I recall, many of them were forced back into labor at Zawia Refinery located just north of Az Zawiyah. On March 10, the city was retaken by pro-Gaddafi forces and the refinery area secured.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
42. Gaddafi likely has been wounded and has left Tripoli--Italian FM


The Reuters news agency, citing Italian foreign minister Franco Frattini, reports Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi has likely left the capital Tripoli and has most likely been wounded.


Frattini told reporters in Tuscany today that he believed what he had been told by Giovanni Innocenzo Martinelli, the Catholic bishop in Tripoli, that "Gaddafi was most probably outside Tripoli and probably even wounded" by NATO airstrikes.

5:30pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...









Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
al bupp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #42
44. Funny reply in AJE Live Blog comments to Libyan spokeman's denial the report
Edited on Fri May-13-11 11:13 AM by al bupp
SecondHarmonica 3 minutes ago

"It's nonsense," Mussa Ibrahim said. "The leader is in high morale. He's in good spirits. He is leading the country day by day. He hasn't been harmed at all."

So in accordance with inferential logic we could probaly safely say Given Ibrahims performance to date that:

1. I'm of course speaking nonsense again
2. The leader is depressed.
3. In very low spirits
4. He used to terrorise the country
5. He's injusred or dead.

From: http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #44
46. LOL--those comments are spot-on
Ibrahim also said that rebel victories at Misrata are hallucinations. :rofl:






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
al bupp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #46
56. When the truth becomes too difficult...
There's always that river in Egypt to fall back on!

BTW, allow me to take a moment to raise a toast to your efforts in these threads throught he last fews months, and say "atta boy!". You, Josh, Iterate, and Tabatha have all done a really outstanding job, which probably can't be said enough.

:toast:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #42
45. Yes, the "Gaddafi" at the meet and greet
a couple days ago did not look like the real Gaddafi. And the expressions of the people in the gathering were priceless.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #42
48. More on the Italian foreign minister's comments on Gaddafi
Frattini stressed that Italy has "no hard information on the current fate of Gaddafi".

But Frattini said "international pressure has likely provoked the decision by Gaddafi to seek refuge in a safe place.''

His comment came during a TV interview with Corriere della Sera that was posted on the newspaper's website.


I lean toward the solution of an escape from Tripoli, not an escape from Libya,'' Frattini said. "Libya is a big country, with desert areas."


5:37pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:03 AM
Response to Original message
43. Real Clear Politics interviews NATO SecGen Rasmussen on Libya, Syria

RealClearPolitics sat down with NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen during his visit to the University of Chicago on Wednesday, May 11, to discuss the ongoing NATO operation in Libya as well as the turmoil in Syria.

...


RCP: What is the end state for Libya?

Rasmussen: The end state is a transition to democracy in Libya.


RCP: Influenced by NATO?

Rasmussen: No, it's for the Libyan people to shape the future of Libya. We have two tracks: We have a military track and a political track. As far as the military track is concerned, NATO has taken full responsibility for the operation and we have defined three clear military objectives for our operations to be fulfilled. Firstly, a complete end to all attacks against civilians; secondly, a withdrawal of Gadhafi military and paramilitary forces to their bases and barracks; and thirdly, immediate and unhindered humanitarian access to people in need in Libya. Then, in the political track, the international community has put a lot of pressure on the Gadhafi regime through sanctions, and at the same time, the International Contact Group has decided to step up support -- even financial support -- for the opposition. I do believe this combination of high military pressure and enhanced political pressure will eventually lead to the breakdown of the Gadhafi regime.


RCP: Given that the stated purpose for intervening in Libya was to prevent a humanitarian crisis, should NATO intervene in Syria as well? Despite the lack of a U.N. mandate, stopping the violence in Syria would certainly be within the "principles in the U.N. charter," wouldn't it?

Rasmussen: It is indeed a very good and legitimate question, but I think I only have a pragmatic answer. We must evaluate each country on a case-by-case basis. We do not have the capacity to solve all crises in the world. In addition to that, the situation in one country is very often different from the situation in another country. You can't just outline one common approach. This is basically the reason why we responded positively to the request from the U.N. There is a mandate, a legal basis. There is strong support from the region. Neither of these conditions are fulfilled as far as Syria is concerned.

...


http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2011/05/13/rc...









Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
49. Gaddafi spokesman Ibrahim claims rebels are 'hallucinating' victory at Misrata :)
Edited on Fri May-13-11 11:32 AM by pinboy3niner

Officials also tried to deflect the blow to morale from the rebels seizure of the airport in Misurata. Mr. Ibrahim delivered a second denial of the news during the tour on Thursday. They are losing their mind, they are hallucinating, because they can see they are losing, he said, referring to Western nations that have hailed recent rebels successes at Misurata as a portent of the rebels eventual ability to prevail in the war.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/article?a=788673&f=20








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #49
51. Al Qaeda probably put pills in their Nescafe...



"Their ages are 17. They give them pills at night, they put hallucinatory pills in their drinks, their milk, their coffee, their Nescafe." -- Muammar Gaddafi




:rofl:







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 11:49 AM
Response to Original message
50. On the NYT: Libyan Rebels Advance.
Follow the link to the NYT report that Bryan Denton and I filed earlier, which went live a few minutes ago. (With help from Kareem Fahim.)

The rebels have moved forward. Time will tell what it means, but perhaps a stalemate is cracking. Certainly some of the Qaddafi units in the field are showing signs of strain.

Even as the fight moves down the roads again, some of the sights are head-spinning. Today a rebel commander proudly ok, maybe mischievously pulled me aside to show me a new weapon. Have a look.

These are sections of scored pipe, packed with explosives and closed with plumbers fittings to become home-made pineapple grenades. The commander, who does not want to have face shown, had a bag of them.

http://cjchivers.com/post/5345796698/on-the-nyt-libyan-...


With Help From NATO, Libyan Rebels Gain Ground
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/10/world/africa/10libya....





Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
52. Regime spokesman denies reports that Gaddafi has been wounded
But Reuters, citing Al Arabiya TV, now says a Libyan government spokesman has denied reports about Gaddafi being injured, calling them "nonsense".

Arabiya said that a Libyan government spokesman telephoned the Dubai-based satellite channel to deny that Gaddafi had been wounded, Reuters reported.

5:40pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yosarian71 Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. Lots of possibilities
Edited on Fri May-13-11 12:34 PM by Yosarian71
a) Possible that the Italian FM was talking out his butt and has no idea.

b) Possible that he knows something and slipped by accident.

c) Possible that they intercepted some sort of communication or have a theory, and are floating it to put pressure on the Libyan regime.

I vote C because NATO has been pretty disciplined in messaging so far so it probably isn't a mistake that he said this.

Edit: More I think about this, the more likely it is C. NATO is running this story right before night time, when the protests will start. NATO gives the story a few hours to spread, and then sees what happens tonight in Tripoli. If the rumors of mass defections are true, the military and the mercs have a decision to make too once they hear these rumors. No matter what, the regime is not rebutting the story as it spreads with the one person that could rebut the story, Moumar himself.

The only thing working against this theory is that the Misurata rebels are still days away from Tripoli. Or maybe they are not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #53
57. I'd vote C, too
Also after giving it some thought. I think the FM's comments were calculated, rather than accidental, and intended first to put pressure on Gaddafi's supporters (who have got to be very nervous right now), which, in turn, puts more pressure on Gaddafi. And I think Gaddafi is spending virtually all of his time underground, in reinforced bunkers.






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yosarian71 Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #57
58. He may be dead already
Heinz thinks he is dead or incapacitated. I think there is a 25% change he is dead already.

Intrade also seems to think so. I was tied up this morning, but I popped onto the site to see what "Gadhafi gone by 5/31" contracts were trading at. $1.35 (equivalent to 13.5% chance). I was too busy to buy them, and wanted to think about it.

Now they are trading at $3.00. That will teach me. Would have more than doubled my money from 9 am to 2 pm.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
54. Zintan, Jadu, Yefren update
First comes a missed update from yesterday, May 12.

Map: http://twitpic.com/4q8bc2/full

There was a battle on the road north into Nalut. G forces to the south had been blocked and pushed east of Yefren. G forces N. of Yefren moved back to attack the N. of Nalut, repeating a move that's never worked before. It didn't this time either.

@4Adam May11th2011 Clashes North #Nalut as Gaddafi's forces try to advance to the city. http://t.co/FRrwp8B #Nafusa #Libya #feb17
12 Mai
May11th2011 Clashes North #Nalut as Gaddafi's forces try to advance to the city. #Nafusa
http://youtu.be/qyDDxc5igkQ

What follows is a series of videos taken by Gaddafi soldiers and were found on their cellphones. I won't post them all, but you can find them here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/10libyan#p/u/4/jmHHGuLjC5c

Here's one, and I think it might be shown on AJE:
4Adam Adam
Video II of #Yefren Center shows looted shops by #Gaddafi soldiers youtube.com/watch?v=ZECpHE #libya #feb17 #nafusa
vor 2 Stunden

4Adam Adam
May12 Gadhafi's forces r shelling the archaeological Sifeet in #Qalaa and trying to destroy main water reservoir http://twitpic.com/4wowc0
12 Mai

http://twitpic.com/4wowc0

The shelling and intentional destruction of UNESCO and other heritage sites is a whole topic in itself. This is just one instance. It's another project I may never get to, so I'll just C&P this that I had ready for a UNESCO post. Twitter is useless right now anyway.

Live call from Nafusa Mountains, April 28
April 28, 2011, 11:20 local time: live call to Yefren Media center in Jadu, Nafusa Mountains, recorded live on Libya Alhurra.
Kalaa: historical area of Kalaa bombed: ancient monuments, cemetaries, mosques, going back to Libyan kingdom, all damaged by Gaddafi forces. Urgent call to Unesco and other NGOs to raise awareness of the destruction occuring in Nafusa mountains, as well as elsewhere in Libya.

Twitter is so overloaded right now I'll just have to leave this or edit later. We should have a call-in tonight anyway at Libya Alhurra.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #54
55. This is truly sad, and despicable.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
59. Another wrinkle
Ibn Omar

from #libya fbook group (i.e. unconfirmed): Urgent News: Sulieman Dougha in Aljazeera: defections yesterday led to shooting, possibly wounding or killing Gaddafi. The images which were aired yesterday are old because the people that were present are now abroad. Zliten has started to move today and people came out in Fashloum and Tajoura and Soug Al giuma and Gargaresh. Mosa Ibrahim's duty is to deny and the Colonel should come out live himself.

http://www.tweetdeck.com/twitter/IbnOmar2005/~coxs5

Need to follow this up.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
60. A youth adds an image of his brother on to the wall of martyrs in Benghazi
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 01:27 PM
Response to Original message
61. The Guardian's summary of events in the region so far:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
62. ICC prosecutor reportedly will seek warrants Mon. for Gaddafi, his son & intel chief
We mentioned the possible ICC arrest warrant for Gaddafi yesterday.

Now, the Spanish radio station Cadena Ser, citing ICC sources, is reporting that the International Criminal Court prosecutor will request arrest warrants for Muammar Gaddafi, his son and Libya's head of espionage on Monday.

8:45pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
63. Libyan state TV has aired an audio message from Gaddafi...
...in which he denies reports that he's been wounded, and condemns a recent NATO attack as cowardly.

He says he is in a place where NATO bombs cannot reach him.

8:52pm:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. Qaddafi: "I live in the hearts of millions"



May 13, 2011


Libyan leader speaks publicly for first time since strike that some thought killed him, says NATO will never get him


(CBS/AP) TRIPOLI, Libya - Libyan leader Muammar Qaddafi says in an audio recording he is alive after NATO attacks and "in a place where you can't get me."


Qaddafi appeared on state TV but has not previously been heard speaking since a NATO attack on a Tripoli residence two weeks ago, which officials said left his son and three grandchildren killed.


In the recording Friday, Qaddafi taunts opponents, saying he received many calls of concern following a NATO attack on Bab al-Aziziya, his compound in Tripoli. NATO says it hit on a command and control bunker complex.


"I tell the coward crusaders. I live in a place where you can't get to me. I live in the hearts of millions," he said.

...


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/05/13/501364/main20...









Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
65. UNESCO and other historical sites
Mark Colvin reported this story on Monday, April 18, 2011 18:34:00

MARK COLVIN: How much damage has been done to the towns, the villages, to old buildings, the cultural artefacts?

LIBYAN MAN: In Kalaa, this is approximately 15 kilometres from Yafran which is a Berber village, Kalaa also is a Berber village, 20 tanks rolled into that town, firing indiscriminately at anything that moved. There's ancient ruins next to the old granary in Yafran. And apparently Gaddafi forces were targeting ancient Roman ruins.

Anything that has history they will destroy. They will destroy the Berber history on the Western Mountains. He's vowed on many occasions to destroy the Berber people and break their spirit, so never again will they rise or speak up against him.

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2011/s3194828.htm


Since then fighting has moved through the mountains to the Tunisian border and back again. I've tried to correlate reports like this to photographs, but simply can't. We really don't know how much damage has been done, or even exactly which sites have been damaged and destroyed.

It's not that I would expect such a thing right now, but it does suggest that this is one group for whom the threat of genocide was not an exaggeration. We know that Gaddagi has tried to eliminate their language and their culture, because it was a crime to speak it, a crime to be Amazigh. Destruction of their history is only the next step removed from destruction of them as a people.

UNESCO asks Libya, allied forces to respect ancient cultural sites
http://www.monstersandcritics.com/news/africa/news/arti...

Live call from Nafusa Mountains, April 28
April 28, 2011, 11:20 local time: live call to Yefren Media center in Jadu, Nafusa Mountains, recorded live on Libya Alhurra.
Kalaa: historical area of Kalaa bombed: ancient monuments, cemetaries, mosques, going back to Libyan kingdom, all damaged by Gaddafi forces. Urgent call to Unesco and other NGOs to raise awareness of the destruction occuring in Nafusa mountains, as well as elsewhere in Libya.

Amazigh_Libya: The countless attacks by Gaddafi forces has destroyed historical building, mosques, and synagogues in #Nafusa #Libya #Feb17
2 days ago via web Reply View Tweet

4Adam Adam
May12 Gadhafi's forces r shelling the archaeological Sifeet in #Qalaa and trying to destroy main water reservoir http://twitpic.com/4wowc0
12 Mai

This photosharing page does seem to include the places mentioned in that particular tweet.
http://www.panoramio.com/photo/11780314

For the others, nothing. All I can offer is photo-sharing of the area, with the thought that some of these one thousand, two thousand, three thousand year old sites may be damaged beyond repair.

Yefren, Qalaa (Kalaa):
http://www.panoramio.com/map/#lt%3D32.048934%26ln%3D12....

Zintan to Yefren:
http://www.panoramio.com/map/#lt%3D32.021467%26ln%3D12....


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #65
66. Before, it would have been cultural suppression/intimidation
Coming now, it's just punitive. Gaddafi seems to be a particularly vengeful man.

Thanks for the info. This is one aspect of the conflict that has been under-reported.






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yosarian71 Donating Member (185 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 02:59 PM
Response to Original message
67. Zawiya rising again?


Mhalwes reporting:

Zawiya: Freedom fighters are now in complete control of a few neighbourhoods in Zawiya after a fierce battle this afternoon. #libya #feb17

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
68. !LPC #Jadu: [ENGLISH] Gaddafi forces continued shelling Qalaa this morning with Grad rockets
LPC #Jadu: Gaddafi forces continued shelling Qalaa this morning with Grad rockets #Libya #feb17
8 minutes ago
http://audioboo.fm/boos/356536-lpc-jadu-english-gaddafi...

!Troops withdrawn? I can't transcribe fast enough.
from peak of mountain to foot of mountain, withdrawn or camouflage, Jadu to Al-Aziziyah?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
69. Nefusa Media group live now
Edited on Fri May-13-11 03:25 PM by Iterate
http://www.livestream.com/libya17feb

Uh, next time I say "now", that actually means, "almost over" and you'll have to catch it on the replay.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
70. Libya: Col Gaddafi moving around Tripoli in secret tunnels

The Telegraph





Col Muammar Gaddafi is moving around Tripoli in a network of secret tunnels and bunkers as Nato dramatically ramps up its efforts to kill the Libyan dictator.


By Andrew Gilligan, Tripoli8:00PM BST 13 May 2011

...


The dictator did not use the hotel's entrance and was not seen in its corridors or lobbies, which were full of reporters at the time. Staff at the Rixos said there was a underground tunnel from the hotel to Bab al-Aziziya, which is about half a mile away on an adjacent plot of land. An unmarked door opposite the conference room Gaddafi used led to a staircase to the basement and in turn, through white-tiled corridors, to a sealed metal door from which the handle had been removed.


At the rear of the hotel, there is also a ramp capable of taking large vehicles which descends into the earth. Security guards on permanent duty nearby prevented The Daily Telegraph from walking down the ramp.


On a rare visit to Gaddafi's Bab al-Aziziya compound, which is sealed off from the city by four rings of 15-feet blast walls, journalists were shown a bomb crater in what was clearly the roof of a bunker. A black void was visible below, as well as the remains of a reinforced concrete structure. A government spokesman insisted it was a sewage facility, but even other officials later admitted this was untrue.


The layout of the underground tunnels is known to Nato since most were built by Western companies.


Similar tunnels were discovered last month beneath Gaddafi's summer palace in the rebel-controlled city of al-Bayda, with bedrooms, bathrooms, kitchens and even a sauna 30 feet beneath the ground.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindi...








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
71. K&R



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
72. Post on Al Jazeera blog about Zawiyah
Marlom 22 minutes ago
There is a post by Mhalwes (ChangeInLibya) on twitter that claims that Zawiyah (the same one that was slaughtered by Gaddafi after the uprising) is under fight now and some neighbourhoods are under complete control of the FFs. I really hope this is true and the city gets totally free, it will be a tribute to so many people who died in the beggining for the freedom of this city. Gaddafi commited a criime against humanity there. A mosque was completely removed, not even the foundation remained. Hundreds of people were disappeared. The Gad. government unearthed lots os bodies of civils and FF to erase evidences of war crimes.

I got so so sad when they lost this city. If only NATO had arrived earlier, this tragedy wouldn't have happened...
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...


I remember when Zawiyah was flattened by Gaddafi. Heartless and tragic.

Also, ICC to issue three warrants on Monday.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
73. Key US senator warns Obama on Libya role

(AFP) 5 hours ago

WASHINGTON President Barack Obama needs to get formal approval from lawmakers to continue US involvement in military strikes on Libya past a looming deadline set in US law, a top senator warned Friday.

"If the administration seeks to continue our military involvement in Libya, it is incumbent that they seek and secure congressional authorization," said Richard Lugar, the top Republican on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

Lugar, Obama's erstwhile foreign policy mentor, pressed the president to detail the course, scope and duration of the hostilities in Libya but stopped short of saying he would introduce legislation aimed at pulling out US forces.

US lawmakers generally agree that Obama has until May 20 to get congressional approval under a 1973 US law for the use of military assets in the UN-backed, NATO-led strikes on Libyan President Moamer Kadhafi's forces.

...


http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5j-VT...







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #73
75. Maybe it will be over this weekend.
I actually have respect for Lugar on some issues.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #75
76. I hope so
The regime is near collapse.

I like Lugar on a lot of things, too. And he's one Republican who still manages to work well with his Dem colleagues on the committee.







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 04:36 PM
Response to Original message
74. Zliten BREAKING:
@ChangeInLibya Mhalwes
Zliten BREAKING: NATO warships bombarding Gaddafi forces in Zliten's "Tuesday" market - & clashes between G forces & FFighters #libya #feb17

http://twitter.com/#!/malakadams1/status/69153665314861...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 05:01 PM
Response to Original message
77. CURRENT TIME IN LIBYA = 12:01 AM SATURDAY, MAY 14
Edited on Fri May-13-11 05:01 PM by pinboy3niner
Libya time = EDT +6 hours, PDT +9 hours, UTC +1 hour, GMT +2 hours







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
78. The Guardian's Libya/Middle East stories for the night:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tabatha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 05:41 PM
Response to Original message
79. Captured Tanks Of Muammar Gaddafi Forces Displayed By Rebel Fighters.
(NSI News Source Info) TORONTO, Canada - May 13, 2011: A rebel fighter checks a tank, captured from forces loyal to Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi in the rebel-held town of Zintan in the Western Mountains, some 150 km southwest of the capital, Tripoli, May 12, 2011. (Photo - Reuters)



Ghastly machines.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #79
80. Tanks are descended from chariots
I googled for a brief summary of historical development, and stumbled on this course offering at Loyola University New Orleans:


Chariots to Tanks: Western Military History
HIST-A294


No further info there, but you get the idea. The military, like everybody else, wants a better mousetrap.

Tanks are more ghastly than some weapons, less ghastly than others. Using them against a civilian population clearly is a crime against humanity.






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 06:15 PM
Response to Original message
81. U.S. stops short of full diplomatic recognition of TNC
The United States on Friday stopped short of full diplomatic recognition of Libya's rebel movement but the White House said it was a "legitimate and credible interlocutor."

Mahmoud Jibril, the number two in the rebels' National Transitional Council, met earlier at the White House with President Barack Obama's national security advisor, Tom Donilon.

The White House said:


During the meeting, Mr Donilon stated that the United States views the TNC (National Transitional Council) as a legitimate and credible interlocutor of the Libyan people.


12:20am:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 06:26 PM
Response to Original message
82. Libyan rebel commander: French military contractor killed in accidental shooting in Benghazi


By Michelle Faul, The Associated Press 1 hour ago


BENGHAZI, Libya The head and founder of a French military contracting company was killed in an accidental discharge of a weapon in the rebel stronghold of Benghazi as he was arguing about his team getting arrested, a rebel commander said Friday.

...


A statement from the rebels' transitional government late Friday said the Frenchmen were ordered arrested for alleged "illicit activities that jeopardized the security of free Libya." It said a committee headed by a judge was investigating the case.


Elshaheibi said the shooting incident occurred around 1 a.m. Thursday on the street of a residential Benghazi suburb where the men had been staying.


"When they went to arrest them, one of them (Marziali) started arguing and fighting, saying 'Nobody touch me. You can't arrest me.' The guy who was behind him pushed him with his gun, one of the bullets went off and he was killed," said Elshaheibi.


Elshaheibi alleged the Frenchmen had raised the rebels' suspicions from their arrival. He said they were staying at a private home although they had been advised to stay in a hotel. While the Frenchmen were offering their services to several rebel agencies, they also had been "asking many questions of private citizens that we found strange," Elshaheibi said, adding he had told Marziali the rebels did not need his company's expertise.


"We were suspicious from the start," Elshaheibi said.

...


http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/...









Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Iterate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 06:38 PM
Response to Original message
83. "This is Gaddafi. A mass grave. Look how far it extends."
acarvin: "This is Gaddafi. A mass grave. Look how far it extends." Watch this video if you haven't yet. Tough, though.

http://www.universalsubtitles.org/sv/videos/YSr4DQHQHDx... /

This is more graphic than we usually post here. It is what it says it is, and is just outside of Zawiya. With subtitles.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #83
84. "One of these people under the sand is my brother..."

"They didn't even dig."

"These are human beings...and they've dumped buckets of sand on them.... They didn't even dig holes for them."

"His hand."

"God bless you for throwing the sand on them. That you didn't throw them in the sea."

"Humans, thrown here with sand over them."

"Thank God they threw sand over them."

"As for Zawiya, it looks like there are no men left, or I don't know..."

"God forgive you, is all I can say."




:cry:







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:09 PM
Response to Original message
85. The US has stepped up its support of anti-Gaddafi rebels...
...with Obama authorising $25m in non-lethal assistance and $53m in humanitarian aid.

The White House said it was looking for ways to increase US financial support to the opposition, in part through congressional legislation that would free up a portion of the more than $30bn in frozen Gaddafi regime assets in US banks so it could be used to aid the rebels.

Jay Carney, the White House spokesman, said:


We believe that if we could access and use blocked government of Libya assets it could make a significant amount of money available to alleviate the suffering of the Libyan people.


1:30am:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:30 PM
Response to Original message
86. From AJE:
The following graffiti was posted by @SumayyahG:




3:20am:
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/live/africa/libya-live-blog-...






Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:50 PM
Response to Original message
87. Libya Rebels Meet White House Officials
Source: Voice of America



Dan Robinson | White House May 13, 2011


Representatives of the Libyan Transitional National Council met with President Barack Obama's national security advisor on Friday, as they continue to press for more aid in their fight against Libyan Leader Moammar Gadhafi. Libya also was a focus of talks that Obama had with NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen.


National Security Advisor Tom Donilon met with the rebel delegation headed by Dr. Mahmoud Jibril. The president did not drop in on the talks.

...


Ali Tarhouni, the council's Minister of Finance and Oil, spoke to reporters after (a meeting with Deputy Secretary of State James Steinberg) about rebel needs in ongoing battles with Gadhafi forces.


"My basic need now is food, medicine and fuel, but also if there is any country that is willing to arm us, we will be happy," said Tarhouni. "We are defending ourselves. This is the thug, the killer regime that took a peaceful movement and forced us to carry arms. So its legitimate that we have arms to defend ourselves."

...


http://www.voanews.com/english/news/africa/north/Libya-...








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pinboy3niner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
88. Should we make the threads mandatory and link to free kitteh .gifs? (*NOT A POLL*)
:evilgrin:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-13-11 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
89. Day 86 here:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sat Nov 18th 2017, 06:43 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » General Discussion Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC