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Be prepared, progressives! Here comes Gennifer Flowers and Paula Jones all

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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:10 PM
Original message
Be prepared, progressives! Here comes Gennifer Flowers and Paula Jones all
over again, followed by monica-on-the-rope-line footage over and over again...

I'm just sayin...better have your talking points shined up because you KNOW this stuff is gonna come at us from Fox and Friends...
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. They Impeached Clinton For It, Didn't They
And Clinton never said God asked him to run for president.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. well, they'll say Dems have a double standard.
It's kind of like a reverse IOKIYAR...
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Well
"A foolish consistently is the hoggoblin of a small mind."
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. that might come across as weak, tho...
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. It Is Weak
I encourage the Republicans to nominate Cain and let the people decide.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. yep. just call their effin bluff...good idea...I'm using it!
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Lint Head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
4. Will Cain be Able to keep his marriage alive?
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Zen Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
7. These stories aren't coming from Democrats. They are coming from Republicans.
And the woman who has come forward is a conservative Republican. Hardly comparable.

Besides, in Clinton's case, the woman came on to HIM and he stupidly didn't walk away. And Genifer Flowers had a 12-year affair with him. That's not sexual harassment or assault.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Yeah, I know. But they'll use it anyway just for shits and giggles...ya know...
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:27 PM
Response to Original message
10. Oddly enough, I don't think the existence of these claims will be what takes Herman out.
I think for the older, whiter voting bloc who are the GOP's strongest primary voters, who haven't quite caught up to this century and the whole black male/white female thing, this may be Herman's biggest problem, despite what they tell the pollsters.

It's definitely going to be interesting to watch as these ladies' identities are leaked, which they most certainly will be, and how they react. Like I said, we may not see it in public, but behind the scenes, I can imagine the other campaigns (Rick Perry) trying to make hay out of the fact that Herman's unwitting victims are white women. Remember, they can't be overt about it, but a nice whisper campaign wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility. ;)
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aint_no_life_nowhere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:33 PM
Response to Original message
11. I've heard people like Thom Hartmann say that Rick Perry will have an even more explosive scandal
go public, if Cain drops out and Perry gets more popular. What that story might involve, I don't know. Hartmann refused to elaborate on his show.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:42 PM
Response to Original message
12. Already here
I was driving back from an errand and put on RW talk radio - and Sean Hannity was listing the whole Pantheon of women that ever accused Bill Clinton of being inappropriate - Flowers, Jones, Janita Broderick, Katherine Wiley etc Then speaking of how the women's organizations and the media didn't care about them.

In fact, the media DID cover Flowers, the only one out there in 1992 - extensively. It was likely ONLY because it was in the past and Hillary on 60 minutes stood with him and there was the strong implication that all this was in the past - they worked on it and it was no longer a problem.

Not to mention, that was a consensual affair - still wrong - but NOTHING like these accounts of uninvited attention - and in this case assault. The Jones allegation was on the same level, but it came up only after he was President and there were reasons to doubt it - especially as it was one isolated incident.

But all except Broderick, which was spoken of only by RW trolls, ALL of these allegations got huge coverage. It likely is true that you can say that the lies on Flowers (and on whether he was drafted) should have made Democrats more leery in nominating him. He was, for the most part, a media favorite. )
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Even At It's Worst The Jones Allegation Was Sexual Harassment Not SexualAssault
There was no touching and pushing of heads into laps.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:46 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. well, there's the woman that Clinton supposedly bit on the lip...
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. Who Waited Fifteen Years To Tell Her Story
Sharon Bialek told her story immediately to two people who have signed affidavits attesting to that fact under the threat of perjury.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. good point!
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former9thward Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #12
22. Jones was more than an allegation.
He paid her 850k. You don't pay someone that type of money because of an "allegation".
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stevenleser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. Sure you do. Happens all the time. People are paid money to go away for all kinds of suits...
doesnt mean it wasnt true in her case, but payoffs even for things that didnt happen occur all the time.
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former9thward Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. If you were familar with this type of suit you would know
Edited on Mon Nov-07-11 07:24 PM by former9thward
that you pay five figures to make these type of suits "go away". When you get into six figures it means that a jury may well rule against you.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. I should have written that better - I was referring to the time period before 1996
when it could have been a bigger issue than it was had there been any corroboration. I do know at least one person, who voted for Clinton in 1992, voted against him because he believed - given his lying on Flowers that there was a real likelihood that he was guilty.

If I remember correctly, Clinton paid after the impeachment proceedings before the end of his term. At that point, he still raised an Arkansas trial - he paid and he had his law license suspended. Some might argue that he didn't want more humiliation like he faced during the impeachment proceedings. I don't think Clinton ever admitted there was truth to it.

I think the Democratic party would likely be in a better place now had the primary voters chosen one of the other 1992 nominees.

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former9thward Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 07:26 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. I agree with you about 1992.
I think the best candidate would have been Mario Cuomo who decided not to run because he thought Bush I was unbeatable.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. True - I was really hoping he would run, but then liked Tsongus
One thing in 2004 that always irked me is that Begala and Carville kept referring to Kerry as ABB, where that had always been primary language. (Ie right now the Republican conservatives want ABR) It was galling as Clinton was nearly my last preference - but when he got the nomination, I supported him. For the 2 biggest tv Democrats to have dragged their feet publicly in 2004 was extremely hurtful as I didn't see anyone do that to their candidate.
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Liberal_Stalwart71 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:42 PM
Response to Original message
13. Genifer Flowers and Monica Lewinsky? NO!! But Paula Jones? YES.
Paula was the alleged victim of sexual harassment. It was consensual with Genifer and Monica.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Yes, you are right and I realize that. But they'll do the whole monty for us anyway...
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. Even At It's Worst Clinton Made A Ham Handed Pass At Paula Jones
He didn't sexually assault her.
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Liberal_Stalwart71 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. You and I both know that it doesn't matter. It's the same in the eyes of the Repukes/wingnuts
in the pursuit to achieve equivalency.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #17
26. I don't see a huge difference - if the Jones allegation was true
from the accounts, Clinton exposed himself to Paula Jones. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paula_Jones ) In addition, he is said to have sexually assaulted Kathleen Wiley.

I think the best thing is to be consistent and say that BOTH Cain and Clinton if the worse allegations are true are not people of good character - even if people on each of their sides, see them as charming, charismatic people. (This not mean that Clinton was not capable and smart - he was, but these actions are pretty bad.)
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Maccagirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
21. Was Hannity in a coma for the entire year of 1998?
You literally couldn't pick up a paper, watch TV or listen to the radio without the subject of l'affaire Lewinsky being discussed 24/7. I remember the "left" (especially women) wanting Hillary to leave Bill-as if ait was anyone's business but their own. As for Flowers-what about all the tabloid stories and interviews?
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tledford Donating Member (633 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 07:26 PM
Response to Reply #21
28. Hannity has been in a coma all his life. eom
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 06:34 PM
Response to Original message
24. What will they be accusing Obama of?
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-07-11 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #24
30. Nothing. They just will be picking on Dems cuz of Clinton...they can't let that go!
It's their "thing."
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Zoeisright Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-11 12:37 AM
Response to Original message
32. So? If repukes bring it up, to be consistent, tell them that Cain
should be brought up on charges immediately.

Otherwise, they're fucking hypocrites.

But we already knew that.
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mojowork_n Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-11 01:02 AM
Response to Original message
33. That doesn't tell us much about Herman Cain, does it?
He and Bill Clinton are so completely dissimilar in so many other ways.

This is the more apt comparison:

http://www.counterpunch.org/2011/11/07/herman-cain-and-... /

Worth the time to read. It's good that some people remember history,
and resurrect that experience occasionally, for those of us in
the present.
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BlueMTexpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-11 02:48 AM
Response to Reply #33
34. Excellent piece! Thanks for posting. nt
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