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KansasVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:02 PM
Original message
Olbermann's Special Comment was AMAZING!
"You have just agreed to purchase a product. If you do not, you will be breaking the law and subject to a fine. You have no control over how much you will pay for that product. The government will have virtually no control over how much the company will charge for that product!"

"And sadly, the President of the United States has not provided the leadership his office demands. He has badly misjudged the country's mood at all ends of the spectrum."



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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
1. "First, do no harm." k&r
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Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #1
39. VIDEO HERE:
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Nite Owl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
2. One of his best and
I think he really found this difficult to do.
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Parker CA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. I got that sense too. Really an amazing comment. Really much more than a comment.
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #4
27. It's like a friend trying to encourage a friend...
...to be careful, when he sees him heading down the wrong path.
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Why?
He knew his audience would lap it up.

KO is cool but he's an teevee personality just like the others.
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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:12 PM
Response to Reply #5
19. He said Obama could be primaried if this health care thing doesn't go correctly IIRC
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Berry Cool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #5
33. And your point?
Whatever it was, you failed to make it.

KO doesn't just say stuff he knows will be popular. Don't assume everyone else acts for the same motivations you must use or you wouldn't assume everyone else uses them.
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O is 44 Donating Member (740 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #5
46. I agree Jeff_dem..
I have been really disheartened by the liberal voices in TV and radio that have been so quick to shriek in mass hysteria. I would think they would know how entrenched Washington is and that no major change can happen immediately. Obama is up against decades of entrenched interest. LBJ had a long history in senate before he was President that means something as far as who he could strong arm. I wish more had a more long view instead of always wanting instant gratification.

Keep up the positive vibes!
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #46
93. Everyone knows how entrenched DC is. That is why we supported
Obama. To change that. Instead, he chooses for his cabinet, people like Rahm Emmanuel. This isn't about giving him time. It's asking him to DO SOMETHING to let people know he is even engaged in this health care debate, rather than handing it over to Blue Dogs and allowing the Private insurance Industry to actually write the bill.

We don't expect a lot, even some lip-service would be an improvement. But from the beginning the only people Obama and Rahm have been 'tough on' have been the very people who elected him. Now, people have finally come to the conclusion that he never was on their side.

When you believe in something, you are passionate about it. I have never heard him speak out passionately on the reasons why a universal healthcare system ought to be considered a right in any civilized country. I think, as he said about his change of mind on mandated insurance, that his 'thinking has evolved'. But not in the right direction. He now views health care as first, a vast profit-making industry which is 'too big to fail'.

We need someone who believes that the lives of the American people are not just a commodity for a profit-driven industry. I do not believe now, that Obama is that person.
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #46
96. You would be shrieking too, if you were
the poor and middle class hemorrhaging from being strong-armed for money you cannot afford to give to fat cat corporate CEOs so they can buy more yachts while you starve and/or go homeless.

The shrieking your hear is the base getting pummeled ruthlessly.
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chukchi1 Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:24 PM
Response to Reply #46
113. Obama is Entrenched Interests
Yep, Obama certainly demonstrated his defiance of entrenched
interests and penchant for change when he appointed the people
who raped the economy to cabinet posts. For starters. 

It isn't about anyone wanting instant gratification. It is
about Obama being another unethical, self intoxicated
politician for sale to corporate interests.
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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #5
91. The thing is: can you fault the logic of his metaphor? Is there a flaw in it?
Edited on Thu Dec-17-09 04:08 PM by Joe Chi Minh
'If you do not, you will be breaking the law and subject to a fine.'

Is this an accurate statement of the case in relation to the purchase of medical insurance or is it not? Actually, I thought you would be subject to imprisonment, but maybe they've just 'tempered the wind to the shorn lamb' by slugging you with a monetary penalty, when your breach of non-undertaking will in many cases arise from lack of funds in the first place. 'Tempering the wind to the shorn lamb' like that, is a Republican and DINO speciality. Think credit-card usury.

'You have no control over how much you will pay for that product.'

Is this really the case? I find it hard to believe. But right now, I'm more inclined to believe Olberman than you.

The government will have virtually no control over how much the company will charge for that product!"

Say it ain't so. But not with forked tongue.


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ima_sinnic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #5
112. so you believe nothing he said is true?
or you just like to add fluff to a thread?
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OneGrassRoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
3. I agree. But I also feel he was respectful...

and was pushing our elected officials to DO THE RIGHT THING. He wasn't bashing, he was criticizing and pushing, with good intentions.



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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
6. He also made a good point about the "fine", How much is that fine? anyone know?
TIA
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CTLawGuy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
7. except you haven't
Edited on Wed Dec-16-09 09:22 PM by CTLawGuy
because this bill has not been signed. It hasn't even gone through the conference committee. Who knows what the bill that comes out of conference committee will look like.

More bluster from Fox Left.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. Senator Lieberman is that you? n/t
Edited on Wed Dec-16-09 09:09 PM by Cleita
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CTLawGuy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:20 PM
Original message
nope
in fact I was a big Lamont supporter in 2006.
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. Is that you Senator Baucus?
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Berry Cool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #7
34. If anything, it will be stripped of even MORE!
It won't get better, it will get WORSE.

This isn't "bluster." It's reality.

And if you think MSNBC is "Fox Left," you must never watch Morning Joe or Pat Buchanan. Sheesh.
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roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #7
45. actually, it will probably be worse. as for the idea that there is some
Edited on Wed Dec-16-09 11:43 PM by roguevalley
unseen chess hand working the universe to turn things around, delusional. so many people have this idea that he has some secret trap or he's playing chess. It could be just what it is.
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Bette Noir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #45
78. If Obama's playing chess, he lost the game in the first move.
He presented the Right with a pre-compromised plan, and has lost no opportunity to say that he's willing to "compromise" everything, that he won't "draw any lines in the sand." That's not compromising; that's giving away the store.
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #78
92. Somewhere on DU a couple days ago I saw a post that said Obama never was playing chess
he was playing Three Card Monte with us. I'm inclined to agree.
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
84. That's a good plan. Let's wait until it's too late to act! That will maximize our leverage ...
... in backwards land.
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AlbertCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #7
102. Who knows what the bill that comes out of conference committee will look like.
Edited on Thu Dec-17-09 05:48 PM by AlbertCat
Oh please.... I think we all have a pretty good idea. :eyes:


Whatever it will be....what it won't be is the will of the majority of the people of the USA.
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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #7
105. everyone keeps saying that..
as this bill gets shittier by the day. please explain why we should believe that anything that does come out of committee is going to be better than the turd we're seeing now?
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:07 PM
Response to Original message
8. He not only hit it out of the ball park but the east coast to west coast.
I love that he says he will refuse to be forced to buy into this bondage and protection money for health care. He said he will go to jail first.

Keith :yourock:

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chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Keith threw down the gauntlet. Called EVERYBODY out.
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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #8
94. I thought it might be the first ever extra-legal, legal requirement in history.
Edited on Thu Dec-17-09 04:48 PM by Joe Chi Minh
Like those villages in Vietnam burned down to save them. It's the new Monty Python paradigm.

But it occurred to me then that it's more like conscription into the armed forces - only you'd be fighting for the insurance companies, as a kind of penal battalion, like the Germans and the Russians used in WWII.

From Wikipedia:

'Penal battalions, penal companies, etc., are military formations consisting of convicted persons* for which military service in such units was either the assigned punishment or an alternative to imprisonment or the death penalty.'

So, you serve in the battalion, instead of - in your case - paying a fine. I don't know any more about the imprisonment, but I really don't think they would execute you for defaulting on your health-insurance payments.

* Convicted as known paupers.
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BunkerHill24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:08 PM
Response to Original message
9. Keith is the best, and he speaks for me.
Keith, a hearty thank you for all you do.
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KansasVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #9
40. Me too!
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Popular Front Donating Member (188 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:08 PM
Response to Original message
10. Olbermann's job is to get TV ratings. President Obama's job is to lead us
Don't take Olbermann's rants too seriously. I'm going to go with the populist over the TV personality.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:11 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. If it weren't for Keith Olbermann and those like him who championed
President Obama, he probably wouldn't be President. Do keep your ear to the ground.
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Popular Front Donating Member (188 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. Yeah because Obama owes his historic election to Olbermann
Pass that kool-aid. Or is it tea?
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. No. To activists, of which KO...
...is one. ;)
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Change has come Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #22
77. Nope. It was pizza!
:rofl:
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madmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #77
86. I see pizza was finally delivered, what finally got him, I missed it.
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OneGrassRoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #77
90. Yay!!!! I missed it too! :) n/t
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quark219 Donating Member (311 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 03:56 PM
Response to Reply #22
88. In case you don't have eyes to see...
Edited on Thu Dec-17-09 03:58 PM by quark219
Obama has taken his "historic" and "populist"-themed election mandate and flushed it down the toilet, using his presidency (thus far) to do the bidding of the banks, Goldman Sachs, the credit card industry, Big Pharma, the health insurance gangsters, and the military-industrial complex.

In case you haven't noticed.

I have absolutely no doubt about five things:

1. Obama will not be in office for a second term.
2. Far from being improved in any significant way by an Obama presidency, this country will have slid further down the path to a coporatocracy and the middle class will be no better off after Obama than it was after the last administration.
3. Ten years from now (or less), Obama will be a VERY rich man.
4. Fifty years from now, historians will find it remarkable that a man who was elected president by millions who believed in his messages of hope, change, and "yes, we can!" could so blithely turn his back on them to do the bidding of billionaire CEOs.
5. There is NO WAY IN HELL I will vote for Obama in 2012.
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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 07:59 PM
Response to Reply #22
107. you may want to check your own glass
:slurp:
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:48 PM
Response to Reply #22
117. Probably owes it to 8 years of Bush/Cheney . . . if you think about it !!
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BunkerHill24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #17
48. So, so very true. Thank you.
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #10
23. Welcome to DU. n/t
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #10
28. You joined DU yesterday and have posted 180 centrist posts since then
So I very much question your motives and your sincerity.
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LBJDemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. He could be an adolescent or a child
He sounds like a 12-year old. I say Let him go. He'll learn.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #32
71. This may be true more often than we think.
Which is why I often have to edit my posts and try to be kinder.

(I don't always succeed)
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #28
36. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Scruffy1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #28
83. Sad state of affairs when a centrist lie KO
Is described as a left winger. Just goes to show the power of 40 years of corporate propaganda. He's never even advocated anything remotely radical just the old "good government" type of populist reform and limited government involvement for the good of the people. I think some are so poorly educated they have no clue how we got to where we are. I don't have television because its 99.9 percent corporate crap, and they all speak from the same page. I was in the break room at 5:00 AM and heard three local talking heads of the news use the the word controversial to describe the public option. May be a coincidence but I think its just an example of the corporate media being directed from the board room. Call something controversial that the vast majority want and the low information public will fal for the calling fascists "moderates". It took me several years to get to 188 posts. Someone needs to get a life. Were not changing anything by posting on the internet. Time to hit the streets.
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Guy Whitey Corngood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #10
30. OK so you learned a new word recently we get it, really we do. I would recommend
Edited on Wed Dec-16-09 09:29 PM by Guy Whitey Corngood
mixing it up a bit so it doesn't look like you've been reading the "P" section and that's the only word that stuck.
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crazylikafox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #10
31. Unfortunately, Keith is the one leading & Obama seems to be going for the TV ratings
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KansasVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #10
41. LOL.....I agree. Where is the leadership???
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:51 PM
Response to Reply #10
50. Lead us over the precipice!
What's the next fiasco for our Leader, bomb Iran?
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tomp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #10
60. populist in words, corporatist in action. nt
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Moochy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #10
65. You are tombstoned, troll so STFU
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quark219 Donating Member (311 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #10
85. POPULIST?!
You just referred to Obama as a POPULIST?! Seriously?

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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #10
87. Who's the populist?
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Ignis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #10
101. Byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
:hi:
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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #10
106. the next time obama leads anything..
will be the first time.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #10
109. How has Obama "lead" recently on this issue?
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #10
116. Who's the "populist" . . . ????
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EVDebs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:08 PM
Response to Original message
11. Can state insurance commissioners cap the insurance co's price increases ?
"We are about to force at least 30 million people into an insurance market where the sharks are circling," said California Lt. Gov. John Garamendi, a Democrat who served as the state's insurance commissioner for eight years. "Without effective protections, they will be eaten alive."

http://articles.latimes.com/2009/sep/24/nation/na-healt...
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unc70 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #11
64. My worry is pre-empting state laws to allow national competition
Much like how credit card reform removed most of the state-level protections. The insurance companies had tried several times previously to gain multi-state insurance plans which would be exempt from state regulation and state benefits requirements. I expect they will get some version of this in any bill that passes congress.
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
14. It was his best in a long time, and I know it hurt to have to say it.
Maybe we can stop this ghastly mandate yet.
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #14
26. I know. He has worked hard to support...
...President Obama.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
15. A swing and a miss, Keith
I watched it and all I can say is that he would rather prefer Obama overstep his role as President, would prefer to give the insurance industry exactly what it wants by killing the bill, would prefer those who can't afford healthcare now to not be able to have healthcare coverage, would prefer we not have a chance to get healthcare reform for many years, would prefer to follow the Republicans and Joe Lieberman and vote against what many have fought for...

Keith is wrong on this. He's wrong on Obama. He's on the wrong side for healthcare reform, which can be amended as opposed to killed to be buried. He can go off in his life of privilege and wink at those who can't get any coverage and think he's a folksy Murrowesque hero. He won't see them spit blood as he walks by to get into his limo.



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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. My understanding was Keith was sayin no to this bill without price controls somewhere and mentioned.
...reconciliation
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. Reconciliation is a trap with the Byrd Rule
I've looked into it.

Reconciliation that has to comply with the Byrd Rule makes healthcare reform impossible. Any increases in the deficit, any tampering with Social Security and any additional payments that cause the budget to increase make it not possible.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/2/644.html
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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #29
61. BUYING into medicare would make it deficit nuetral wont it? TIA
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Berry Cool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #15
35. "Life of privilege"? "He won't see them spit blood as he walks by to get into his limo"?
Did you even WATCH his Special Comment? He said he isn't going to continue buying his own private insurance HIMSELF if this passes. He's not going to have coverage EITHER.

You're not even paying attention to what he said.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. Not only that he sponsored and contributed large amounts of money
to the free clinics that are pointing out just how outrageous our health care crisis is. It's too bad the media can't bring themselves to show the footage of those clinics and how needy Americans are, working Americans. It's like we are a third world country.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:56 PM
Response to Reply #37
119. GOPs "third world America" ... they've been working on that for decades !!!
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quiet.american Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #15
38. Hot damn! Amen. nt
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #15
49. And you will pay through your nose because of pre-existing condition
and the insurance companies will charge you four times as much in premiums as they do everyone else.

Enjoy the financial grave you dug yourself by supporting the Lieberman/Obama health insurance bailout.
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Justitia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #15
54. More heated hyperbole from the poster who equated Howard Dean to Dick Armey. Still smells.
Less Than Zero credibility from you.
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niyad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #15
62. KO takes the subway, for one thing. tiny little fact, that kind of throws out your "life of
privilege" bs.

he is obviously making many people very nervous speaking truth to power.
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Bette Noir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #15
79. You're 100% wrong.
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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #15
89. Should have paid attention to
what Olbermann has been covering for months now. Those Free Clinics, he started that ball rolling.

Oh, yea, if he uses a driver it is because he cannot drive. He has no depth perception as a result of an accident on the subway.
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AlbertCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #15
103. Keith is wrong on this
Edited on Thu Dec-17-09 06:01 PM by AlbertCat
I supposed you missed the whole section of the show about passing the good stuff in the bill via reconciliation and killing the rest, since, as Dean points out, it has no teeth, and the Insurance companies are counting it a victory. They discussed the changing of tactics besides just pass anything.

Watch the SHOW next time...not excerpts.
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TheKentuckian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #15
115. At this stage, what health care reform
What else would have to be stripped out for you to say this isn't reform?

What amendments do you think will be allowed to go forward that will improve the bill when the parameters have been set by threat? If the conservatives don't write the bill then it doesn't proceed.

What indicates affordability to you here? What price controls do you see? What options will most folks have in their mandated insurance? How do you justify propping up an employer based system where the employers have lower fines than the citizens?

Like the President, you'll apparently support anything labeled health care reform. There isn't enough reform to fill a thimble other than forcing everyone to suck up whatever your employer doles out, if they are so willing. Meanwhile, some of the uninsured will get policies they cannot afford to actually use since every cent just about will be gone in their share of premiums, taxes, housing, bills, and food.

What on Earth makes you think that most people are going to be better off?

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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:11 PM
Response to Original message
18. We won't have to subsidize those who can't afford coverage if it doesn't pass
after all those who get subsidies will likely be better off - but if we can't afford our own insurance why should be help someone else out by offering tax payer subsidies :sarcasm:
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Bette Noir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #18
80. Except that the subsidies won't go to health care, they'll go to insurance companies.
Subsidies would go at least 30% further if the gummint set up its own plan, as I wrote to both my Senators last night. I proposed that low-income families be able to buy in on a sliding scale, while the rest of us be allowed to buy in at cost.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #80
118. Seems they're also talking about creating SUBSIDIES for Cobra . . .!!!
Edited on Thu Dec-17-09 08:53 PM by defendandprotect
All of this legislation is simply intended to aid corporate theft -- !!

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victoryparty Donating Member (416 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
20. Well said
Thank you, Keith.
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AndyA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 09:20 PM
Response to Original message
24. "...the President of the United States has not provided the leadership his office demands."
That pretty much says it all.
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ind_thinker2 Donating Member (259 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
42. Kill this bill and Pres Obama is a one termer
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KansasVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. Pass the Bill and the shit hits the fan. Either choice is bad!
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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #43
47. VERY TRUE!! But True Leaders Should Have "THUNK ABOUT IT FIRST!"
Instead of selling out, they should have at least put their finger to wind to get a feel for what "we the people" wanted!!

Screwed either way, and it wasn't HIS BASE that did it to the WH! THEY will take the blame, and ALL THAT OBAMA-Nation stuff has been slowing leaking air out of the BIG BALLOON!!
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 04:10 AM
Response to Reply #42
57. You have that exactly ass-backwards
It is passing the bill that will make him a one-termer.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #57
110. Exactly. nt
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Bette Noir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #42
81. Pass the bill in its current form and Democrats lose their majority for at least 30 years.
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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-16-09 11:31 PM
Response to Original message
44. I Don't Think He Wanted To Do It... But IT NEEDED TO BE SAID!!
I'm so very happy that we are seeing some REAL, REALLY hard core PUSH BACK NOW!!

There are some Senators who we should be targeting to VOTE NO NOW! Feingold and Sanders for starters!!

Thank you Keith, it was hard to listen to, but you're a better man than oh so many others in Congress!!!

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marlakay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 12:38 AM
Response to Reply #44
51. I could tell while he was talking at times he could have
been tougher on Obama and he wasn't, he held back. He seemed almost sad and reluctant to say what he knew he had to say.
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 12:41 AM
Response to Reply #44
52. Someone brought up Roland Burris
in another thread and how he has nothing to lose since he will not run again. I think our best chance though is to get Sanders to vote against it - and to even not vote for cloture if necessary. Still, I'm gonna call Burris's office tomorrow, ask if they saw Countdown and heard what Howard Dean and Bernie Sander have to say about the bill and at least see if they'll consider it.
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Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 12:42 AM
Response to Original message
53. That's so sad, KO turning on his hero..............
Poor KO, he couldn't trash Hillary enough during the primaries and now he realizes, as many others have done, that he was sold a bill of goods. It couldn't have happened to a more deserving windbag.

Suckers..........

:7
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:51 AM
Response to Reply #53
56. Wow that was just mean
and for you to smile at someone else's pain? Not nice, not cool. Hillary and Obama both sucked - he just talked a better game. now many of us know it was just that - talk. you do know your hero hillary is part of that creepy C street group "the family" right?

You can find all about it in a widely under-read article in the September 2007 issue of Mother Jones, in which Kathryn Joyce and Jeff Sharlet reported that "through all of her years in Washington, Clinton has been an active participant in conservative Bible study and prayer circles that are part of a secretive Capitol Hill group known as "The "Fellowship," also known as The Family. But it won't be a secret much longer. Jeff Sharlet's shocking expos The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power will be published in May.

link: http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080331/ehrenreich
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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #53
59. So Sorry You Don't Seem To "Get It!" If You Care About Our Party...
we need to LET OUR LEADERS KNOW! We aren't happy and we can't just be sitting here typing on blogs!
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rvablue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #53
63. One day, you really must get over the primaries. Your obsession is ridiculous. n/t
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mariawr Donating Member (171 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #53
66. Jeez, get over it already. nt
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Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #53
69. As bad as this is, HRC wouldn't have been any better.
She was a corporatist then and she still is.

Your incessant worshiping is noted though.
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Bette Noir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #53
82. Does anyone else smell puma scat?
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:08 PM
Response to Reply #53
111. You need serious help.
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slinkerwink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:41 AM
Response to Original message
55. That was one of his best Special Comments.
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Raine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 06:45 AM
Response to Original message
58. It was TERRIFIC
Thank God for KO :patriot: ... at least someone is fighting on our side. :applause:
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:17 PM
Response to Original message
67. I asked my SO to come in to the office to listen to it this morning....
We both sat there with our jaws on the floor. I don't think I've ever heard such a powerful editorial on television before. Granted, I rarely watch television, but it shocked me nonetheless.
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quiller4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
68. Keith no longer speaks for me.
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KansasVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #68
72. And you no longer matter to Obama!
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LittleBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:51 PM
Response to Original message
70. He nailed it. Spanked the pitiful Obama administration like a petulant child
It was nice to see. Take them to task, sir!
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quantass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
73. Great show overall
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AngryAmish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:07 PM
Response to Original message
74. Was he yelling again?
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #74
76. Not at all. He was quiet, anguished.
He clearly feels terribly torn, disappointed, angry, and conflicted about the situation, all at once.

As do all thinking progressives, whether they end up siding with voting for or against the ex-HCR bill.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
75. that's pretty much what this is all about
Edited on Thu Dec-17-09 02:22 PM by fascisthunter
corporate control over "We the People's Control"... why one would side with corporations is telling.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
95. AND...
The "product" is invisible, and being sold by For Profit Corporations that manufacture NOTHING and create NO wealth, AND Americans MUST BUY it EVERY FUCKING YEAR!

That is some SCAM.
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
97. I have to say I wholeheartedly agree with him on this.
I'm glad he said it.
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fadedrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #97
98. me too...
R
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
99. Sure was. nt
Edited on Thu Dec-17-09 05:23 PM by valerief
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GreenTea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
100. You've got to check out Olberman's video - GREAT!
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Mulehead Donating Member (93 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 06:33 PM
Response to Original message
104. Mr. Olbermann
Well said, sir. Thank you.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:05 PM
Response to Original message
108. AND, we don't know if that product will perform any service at all
outside of making insurance co. and investors richer. I buy my own insurance. The best I can afford has a 12k deductible; I have no credit or savings, so there's little chance I will ever benefit from having it unless I get cancer or end up in a nasty auto accident.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
114. If this right wing steals this one ... with the help of the Democrats . . .
I doubt Olberman will be around much longer . . . !!
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Sheltiemama Donating Member (892 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-17-09 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
120. I hate to agree, but I do.
The health care industry has taken control of this bill. We desperately need reform, but I don't think this is it. Howard Dean's appearance the night before really made me think. The idea of fining people really bothers me.
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