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Rachel Maddow is proving just how myopic the Parlor Talking Purists really are

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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 09:54 PM
Original message
Rachel Maddow is proving just how myopic the Parlor Talking Purists really are
She's whining about how Obama "sold out" and absolutely excluding in her report conveniently the tax cuts for all the American people, extending unemployment benefits so that over two+ million people are not thrown out into the street,

She asked some British MIT economic professor what "an economic dictator for a day" would spend $900 million on and he kneejerked back with more parlor talk about spending money on job training and then absolutely CLUELESSLY said Obama has done nothing for the unemployed with benefits.

Just a smile and not a peep from our precious Rachel. Her "point" was made. She had to tirelessly find some British economist to prove that Obama is somehow in some mystical conspiracy to attack the poor little progressives who can't get their wishes because a funny thing called governance is in the way.

The video playing in the two-shot of Obama was the part where he was talking ABOUT helping the unemployed by extending benefits. I kid you not.

Why Maddow would ask a parlor talking hyperbolic "question" about what an "economic dictator" would do should provide just how inane her approach is.

She kept punching at the tax cuts for the wealthy while completely ignoring the FACT that the middle class will also benefit from the tax cuts. No mention at all of the payroll tax holiday of one year for employees.

Granted, in a parlor talking purist World, the Republicans would have walked in the Capitol building to vote for greed and an angry flock of meat-eating pigeons would have munched on their brains.

What does Maddow want to accomplish with what I see as a mirror-distortion of Sean Hannity with misinformation under the guise of "information"?

Keeping "the Left" lazily civics-challenged and uninformed about the full story is precisely what the Republicans could never do from the inside.

Usually Rachel Maddow gets it. But she's in some torpor cloud about this and forgets how Republicans had to actually comply and be a part of governing, which they haven't done since 2008.

As Obama said, this is not a short game... it's a long game. The time for political gamespersonship by using the unemployed and the Middle Class as pawns for fodder and leaving them to pay more taxes and be thrown in the street is not in the best interests of the American people.

The Democrats in the Senate and Congress can't get the Blue Dogs to act like Democrats. Without the votes, Obama has to work with the realistic vote numbers to get legislation passed. And he doesn't have a good enough team to work with.

We'll see what happens in the next weeks. Hopefully, Maddow comes to her senses that governing these days is like playing pool during an earthquake.





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Cant trust em Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 09:56 PM
Response to Original message
1. So I'm in public policy school right now.
We talk a lot about how policy approaches really aren't worth crap if there isn't the right political economy to get it enacted.
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 09:58 PM
Response to Original message
2. Keith's comment seemed kinda foolish following Ezra Klein's points.
But Rachel has to catch the fact that she isn't being true to the entire issue, she is usually good about that.
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sundancekid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:31 PM
Response to Reply #2
13. you got THAT right! KO drowned in his own spittle tonight - for shame
we should all go back and write down all the data Ezra gave and then evaluate KO's bloviations = really, really, really a disservice to any of us progressives who know civics ...
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 09:59 PM
Response to Original message
3. An advisory - if you have not watched the show please do so.
It will prove this OP is nonsense.
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Pale Blue Dot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. +1 I watched and completely agree. nt
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #3
14. I watched and disagree with you.
Maddow made the point she wanted to make, which ignored some basic facts.

Not good journalism.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #14
19. +100 n/t
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Hell Hath No Fury Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #3
49. I was scratching my head --
thinking, 'Did we watch the same show?' :freak:

Her show proved just about the opposite of what the OP is saying. Very wierd indeed.
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Clio the Leo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:02 PM
Response to Original message
5. I think her Gandhi quote could just as easily be applied to the Loud Left....
"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win."

The Loud Left has ignored him, ridiculed him and now they're full on trying to fight him.

Who will will? We shall see.
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Phx_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:04 PM
Response to Original message
6. I quit watching MSNBC when Olbermann was suspended, and I haven't gone back,
with the exception of ocassionally watching Chris Matthews and Lawrence O'Donnnell, and I haven't missed a minute of it.

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eleny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
7. "And he doesn't have a good enough team to work with."
Oh, I see - it's always someone elses fault.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. So Obama as President can overrule what Congress and Senate do?
Edited on Tue Dec-07-10 10:30 PM by zulchzulu
Are Blue Dogs in the Senate and Congress who go along with Republicans and derail progressive legislation Obama's job and not the Senate and Congress leadership?

After all, Obama is spending too much time twiddling his thumbs and feeding the goldfish while sharpening his No. 2 pencil to care about Blue Dogs sitting on Repigs' laps.

:crazy:


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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #12
44. Yeah, it's called a veto.
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RandomThoughts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
8. Great quote.
Playing Pool during an earthquake. Love that.

I figure they took my ability to play pool and have a beer, so all that stuff was brought to me by being put into current events, it is awesome how many pool references are in tv shows, music and movies.

But that is just my view of it. Or was a story idea.

Lots of pool words fit current events.

pool
cue
stick
bank
jump
shot
English
spin
draw
chalk
tip
butt
table
pocket
rail
bridge


and

Rack!!!!

LOL
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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:07 PM
Response to Original message
9. I'm sorry I forgot to unrec this BS. I went back and did so!!
You're welcome.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. Thanks for making some points to prove where you stand on the issues
Oh wait... you just clicked the Unrec button.

Such skill. Such prowess. How can anyone respond to that?

:crazy:

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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #17
31. Leave me out of your will.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:07 PM
Response to Original message
10. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #10
23. I am one of the Progressive Left that also knows this funny thing called Civics
It's frankly amazing how many who declare they are the "Progressive Left" haven't a fucking clue how governance works. That's like someone saying they are a singer-songwriter but don't own a musical instrument or know what they are singing.

For me, to be a REAL member of the Progressive Left is not to be the low-hanging fruit that are too goddamn lazy to learn the basics of civics and matters of legislation.
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catgirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 07:13 AM
Response to Reply #10
35. Not enough votes excuse is pathetic?

Um, we didn't get the votes to pass middle class tax cuts. We didn't get enough votes to pass unemployment benefits.
What was that you said? Not enough votes excuse is pathetic? LOL.
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #35
52. If they don't get enough votes for the compromise, where are we then?
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okieinpain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #10
45. you just said "i don't care how you do it, get it done". I think he
did that. hahahahahahaha
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:12 PM
Response to Original message
11. I think rachel got it right, and I think you got it wrong. That's my opinion.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. So throw the unemployed out in the street for political purity
Oh, I see.

:crazy:


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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:41 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. No, trade Obama for the 13 months. He resigns, and the Repos vote for
unemployment, just like they did the last 5 times in a row, but this time they get Obama.

i'd go for that. It would be a good deal instead of a stupid give away deal.


Let's do the right thing here. Giving the uber rich a tax break while families live on the street is just obscenely wrong.


Giving Obama to retirement wouldn't be so bad, certainly not immoral like giving the uber rich billions while families sleep in door ways.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 11:53 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. More evidence of a serious lack of understanding reality
Obama should resign... wtf?

So that would accomplish what?

Seriously...

Having Obama resign would absolutely play right into Republican hands. Talk about myopic parlor talk... sheesh...

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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #25
47. It would accomplish 13 months of unemployment. I thought that was your primary objective?
And we wouldn't be doling out billions to billionaires and Joe Biden would be president.

why would that be so bad? Joe seems capable.

That seems like a much better deal to me than the current ridicules, insane and obscene Republican demands that Obama is insisting we capitulate to.


If Obama wants to capitulate, fine. Let him do it. Just don't drag the rest of us down with his insane political calculations.


Is this about Obama or about the country?





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catgirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 07:15 AM
Response to Reply #20
36. Are you kidding?

Excuse me while I go and puke. Trade Obama. What, are you the negotiator for the repigs?
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #36
48. hey, Joe Biden is capable. I'm talking for the good of the country and the economy.
That way we don't have to spend hundreds of billions more on tax breaks for the uber rich while families sleep in door ways.


If Obama would cut that deal, I'd say that he's putting his money where his mouth is. He would be demonstrating leadership, and showing that the pain needs to be shared.

i worked very hard to elect Obama, and i'm very glad he beat McCain, but i've never been part of the true believers who thought it likely Obama would be any better than his rather corporate Senate voting record fore-shadowed he'd be. I thought there was a slim possibility that we might be pleasantly surprised, but realistically, I knew we probably wouldn't be. And I'm not.

My biggest disappointment was that he promised a national debate on health care and instead we got a stage managed back room deal bill, and only that. Obama had a waiting and eager army of seniors, students and families who wanted to fight for single payer and were willing to accept an actual strong vigorous public option as a negotiated compromise, but who really were tepid on Romney Care. I always expected that in the end the back room deal would be what came out, but I thought that if we also had a debate, then at least the people would have had more say in what we ended up with, and with considerably more momentum to keep working and fighting for what we really want; Government run health insurance.

Of course, with so many mis-steps and the erosion of trust between Obama voters and the President, it just contributes to the Repo mime that 'government can't run any.thing, It's ineffective.'

Obama may have served his purpose and perhaps it would be better for him, our party, and the country if he gets his compromise on his own tab.

i think he should compromise his office away to get the deal. I don't think he should compromise away his party or his voters.


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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #20
43. !
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

civics challenged indeed...
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flamingdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:34 PM
Response to Original message
16. Lawrence O'Donnell is a voice of reason tonight
countering Jane Hamster and a few more. Ezra is also adding some real info to the discussion.

It helps if they know what they're talking about, Lawrence was a part of it all so he does.
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apocalypsehow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:35 PM
Response to Original message
18. Kick, Rec. n/t.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 10:46 PM
Response to Original message
21. You're right.
Edited on Tue Dec-07-10 10:48 PM by cornermouse
We couldn't possibly begin to comprehend the magnificence and perfection of the creation of a policy where the people in D.C. cut taxes for the wealthy for the next two years and allow people without jobs to be given unemployment for two years also... Oh wait. He only got 13 months of unemployment extension. Well, there's still his support for the public school system, guarantees not to touch social security, and pull out from Afghanistan and Iraq... Oh wait. You're right. We have no appreciation for 254th level chess.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. Just never enough, eh?
"He only got 13 months of unemployment extension"... as opposed to just throwing the unemployed out in the street but willing to show your Purity Card for them while they lick your boots.

As for Afghanistan and Iraq, both quagmires now have timelines to leave.

Of course, never enough. After all, we hated it when Bush thought he was a monarch but we want Obama to behave like a monarch.

Let me crash my head into a wall to get your level of a thought process.

:crazy:


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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 06:41 AM
Response to Reply #22
34. The fact that you can see nothing wrong with what he said and did
today speaks for itself.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-07-10 11:50 PM
Response to Original message
24. I was very disapointed in her tonight
He cherry pick her facts and misrepresented what the President said.
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Turk 182 Donating Member (81 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 12:38 AM
Response to Original message
26. what a bunch of horse pucky-unrec (nt)
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CakeGrrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 12:42 AM
Response to Original message
27. k/r - pandering to a specific demo with selective information is not journalism. n/t
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:06 AM
Response to Original message
28. K&R for the title alone. n/t
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Union Scribe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:07 AM
Response to Reply #28
29. Did you like the use of myopic or the name-calling?
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VMI Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:08 AM
Response to Original message
30. Rachel is awesome.
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 04:31 AM
Response to Original message
32. Great description of where her head was at tonight.
Edited on Wed Dec-08-10 04:33 AM by Major Hogwash
"But she's in some torpor cloud . . . "

That's funnier than hell.

I don't think Rachel "gets it" at all.
Obama is not white. The GOP has fought him for 22 months because they have thrived on hate for the last 2 years. There is no easy way out for him, so trying to deal with them has been frustrating for him.

But the Democrats in the Senate couldn't even get a tax cut measure passed.
Not even one for the top 2%.

I don't think white people like Rachel understand that Obama is carrying the weight of 300 years of US history of black slavery, servitude, racism and bigotry towards blacks in this country on his shoulders.
Every single day of the year.

He is the Martin Luther King to the young generation of kids who weren't around in the early 60s. MLK to them is some guy from history, some black civil rights guy they have seen films of in history class or on tv.

But, Obama is real to them today.
He is there, standing tall in real time, the President of the United States of America.

And for those young kids, no one will ever be able to tell them again "Who do you think you are? You're no big shot. What, do you think you can be the President some day?"

Because now they can say "Yes, I can be, someday."
The hope lives on.
The dream is still as true today as it was in 1963 when MLK went to Washington D.C. and gave that momentous speech.
To millions and millions of black Americans who have been disenfranchised since the day they were born, and the millions and millions of black Americans who wondered if it would ever come true, it has come true.

So, the criticism that is leveled at Obama is not much, not really.
Not when weighed against the standard that he has set for himself.
Carrying the weight of all those who came before him, and to make the way easier for those who will come after him, he has done what he could, he did the right thing.

So, the criticism that has been made of him, even from the left, will fade out . . eventually.
And President Obama will be standing tall, head held high, making history every single day.

I'm going to vote for him again in 2012.
I like making history, too.

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Whisp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 05:00 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. what a wonderful post. thank you so much.
I believe as you do.

Bless him and thank goodness he has the strength that he does to carry the burden.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 09:23 AM
Response to Reply #32
39. +100 n/t
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kjackson227 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #32
50. +1
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
37. because rationality and principle are soooo myopic--come on, drink a little of this
millionaire koolaid, Obama likes it, you like it too and soon you will be raging against leftist principles just like the rest of the koolaid drinkers.

Have some and feel the hate of liberal principles.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #37
40. Wow, you write that...
....bullshit?

Good for you.

I had to laugh when reading the part about "against leftist principles just like the rest of the koolaid drinkers."

It seems the real koolaid drinkers are the clueless, civics-challenged purists who are ganging up on Obama without any ideas on just how Obama can get legislation passed without having to deal with the Blue Dogs and Republicans, who are doing all they can to maintain the status quo.

Additionally, is it too difficult to understand that not getting at least 13 more months of unemployment benefits means a lot of people would be out on the street? Are the "leftist principles" so pure that reality doesn't come into play?

Let them eat dog food, right?


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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #40
41. Or maybe....the status quo simply continues...with one difference...instead
of Dubyah attacking liberals from the bully-pulpit of the Whitehouse with all of his minions trying to drown out any kind of civil engagement originating from a principaled difference...

now we have Obama attacking liberals from the bully-pulpit of the Whitehouse with all of his minions trying to drown out any kind of civil engagement originating from a principaled difference...

One set of cheerleaders traded for another set of cheerleaders, AND the status quo simply continues.

Change we can believe in? Or bullshit...you called that right, brother.
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budkin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
38. I understand the reality of the situation... but he didn't even throw a single punch... not one
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MichaelS2012 Donating Member (12 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 09:57 AM
Response to Original message
42. K&R nt
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
46. It started with McClurkin and the personal attacks never stopped
Of course, the target is usually teh gay. Which is of course, pure coincidence out of the anti-equality faction that claims Newt Gingrich is 'sanctified by God' and Rachel is inferior to him and not worthy of the same rights.
Rachel Maddow is a Fulbright Scholar. The OP thinks she is unable to understand simple politics. Thinks that a politician can slander and preach against minorities and still keep their support and benefit of the doubt when they do utterly harmful things.
I know Obama sees gay people as less 'sanctified' than say, Sarah Palin, but this sort of thing just gets old and tired. Most of us do not think you are 'sanctified' and would love to see one of you explain how you got 'sanctified' and prove that you are, and tell me what the fuck 'sanctified' means in a secular legal context...
Sick of the blather from the anti-equality Kaine types.
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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
51. Starve the Poor, Tax Breaks for the Rich
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