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Arne Duncan applauds vote to fire entire Central Falls, R.I. high school faculty

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brentspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 01:41 PM
Original message
Arne Duncan applauds vote to fire entire Central Falls, R.I. high school faculty
Edited on Wed Feb-24-10 01:42 PM by brentspeak
Obama and Duncan's efforts on part of the school-privatization "we want your tax dollars" hucksters continues:



http://www.boston.com/news/local/rhode_island/articles/2010/02/24/duncan_applauds_move_to_fire_entire_ri_school/

Duncan applauds vote to fire entire RI school
February 24, 2010

CENTRAL FALLS, R.I.The U.S. Secretary of Education is applauding the vote to fire all the teachers at the high school in Central Falls because it is one of the worst performing schools in the state.

"This is hard work and these are tough decisions, but students only have one chance for an education," Duncan said in Wednesday's edition of The Providence Journal, "and when schools continue to struggle we have a collective obligation to take action."

The Central Falls School Committee on Tuesday evening voted 5-2 to fire every educator at the school, from teachers to guidance counselors to the principal, at the end of the school year. The vote came the same day that State Education Commissioner Deborah Gist approved the firing plan, which was recommended by Superintendent Frances Gallo, and gave the district 120 days to come up with a detailed plan.

Central Falls Teachers Union President Jane Sessums says she is reviewing several legal options

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joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
1. This guy is proving himself to be more worthless than Bernake...
...which is quite an accomplishment.
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spiritual_gunfighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
2. Quite possibly
the worst of all Obama's cabinet pics, and that is really saying something.
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GodlessBiker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
3. The teachers should just leave now.
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Reader Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
4. It's union-busting, plain and simple.
This teacher will definitely be sitting out the next presidential election if Obama doesn't can Duncan and his destructive, corporatist agenda.
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #4
57. They'll Do More Than Sit Out My Friend
And there will definitely be more than one person doing this. I think there are probably teachers like this one that will vote for someone else, or do what they can to get someone to run against Obama in a primary. Think this is an idle threat? See what happens. The President, and other Dems, will need the vote of REAL public school teachers, and if they think we'll take this lying down, think again!
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #4
80. Not if the replacement teachers all automatically become union members
or is it voluntary...I do not know enough about that district's policies.
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tnlefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
5. K&R
Jeeze, why not bring back Bill Bennett?:mad:

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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #5
31. They did. nt
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 06:29 PM
Original message
Or rod "Teachers are terrorists" paige? (nt)
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #5
78. Or rod "Teachers are terrorists" paige? (nt)
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 01:58 PM
Response to Original message
6. How sad for the students
It's the only school in the tiny, impoverished city north of Providence. Only about half its students graduate, and only 7 percent of 11th-graders were proficient in math in 2009.

link



Rhode Island's Commissioner of Education Deborah Gist already signed off on this earlier today.

Some of these teachers might get their jobs back.

Part of the stipulation is that not more than 50 percent can get rehired, but all are able to apply.

The teachers who lose their jobs can also apply to other openings in the district.

link


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Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #6
24. Ouch. But sometimes it has to do with the parents.
Central Falls is very poor. I doubt the parents are spending much time helping the kids study.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #24
61. And they don't speak English either
The little factoids being left out make this a very tragic story.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #6
79. Another little fact that seems to escape the media's attention.
Schools need money in order to educate students. If you refuse to pay taxes; if you vote all increases to school budgets down, you are being unrealistic and you are contributing to these kids inability to get an education. Schools need upkeep and repairs, neither of which is free and both of which are subject to inflation. An increase in population means added teachers and additional school supplies, like computers, desks, and library books.
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-25-10 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #79
85. that's also part of the blame game, isn't it -- teachers fault, budgets fault
At some point, students also have to step up -- encouraging students who have no interest in excelling is becoming a more difficult task all the time (students have a lot more distractions to deal with), and the difficulty with the retention of experienced teachers only exacerbates, or at least complicates, the problem of student performance.

Arne's getting paid, so I suppose it is easy to applaud the firing of an entire school of teachers from a distance (plus the money is good-good, the money is real good).

The aggragate is the only thing that matters to a number-crunching, bean-counting administrator. The best teaching takes place in small groups (or even in a one-to-one settings)--far from aggragated numbers. Yet, these Administrators are blindly focused on the aggregate (how are your very, very large groups doing). With class sizes getting larger and larger, and curriculums approaching narrower and narrower thresholds in order to prepare for a "standardized" result that Administrators deem a proper measure of 'aptitude,' it is no wonder Administrators and politicians applaud the wholesale firing of teachers who don't perform in the aggragate.

We don't need to discard teachers. We need more of them. We need more class rooms and smaller class sizes and teachers need a little 'flexibility' (dare I say it out loud) to mold the curriculum to the needs of particular, individual students. That's where substantive improvement and the cultivation of a desire to excel lives -- in the relationships built between individual students and dedicated teachers (when teachers are 'allowed' to cultivate to particular needs of individuals) -- not to gross numbers in the aggragated student body.

But, usually individual needs hardly match the demands of a political/cultural/authoritative agenda which dominates and operates by, for, and within the aggragate.

It's a damned shame and the shame expands exponientially in two directions: first, experienced teachers become more difficult to retain because of stories like this one; and second, good people interested in entering the teaching profession are easily discouraged by stories like this one.

So, again, I'll say that it's a damned shame to hear about Arne's applause.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
7. I hate to recommend this, but it needs to be seen. Arne's against public education.
He is angering me.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
8. Of course he did.
He's salivating at the thought of moving in charters and replacing experienced professionals with cheap TFA teachers. Welcome to McSchools!
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lamp_shade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:10 PM
Response to Original message
9. I applaud the decision as well. Something had to be done.
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atreides1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. And this was the best that management could come up with?
Fire all of the teachers, counselors, and even the principal? This was the only choice that they had?

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lamp_shade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. I can't think of a better one.
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montanto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. No doubt.
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atreides1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. I can
Let's find out how many parents were involved in their kids education. If mom and dad don't care, most kids won't care either.
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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. And then there's....
It appears that the majority of these kids were speaking English as a second language. Shouldn't the test scores be adjusted for the difficulty factor? I speak broken Spanish, but I sure as hell wouldn't want to take a geometry exam in a language I don't fully understand.

And maybe before the Secretary of Education applauds the move, perhaps the federal government should be providing extra funding to provide tutors in low-income, heavily immigrant neighborhoods. That would improve test scores AND create new jobs all at once.

Firing the entire faculty -- including those teachers who were doubtless EXCELLENT at their thankless jobs -- is an idiotic decision that reeks of politics.
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #20
26. Thank you,Jeff. I think I...
...love you. :7
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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #26
52. Woo Hoo!
:blush:
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #52
74. I didn't mean to ...
...make you blush! ;)
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #20
63. No Child Left Behind
It's mind boggling that a DEMOCRATIC president not only didn't toss it out but gave it steroids.
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #18
58. Touch (nt)
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #12
35. Neither could Arne.
Not being able to know what to do about education is his thing. Privatize and shrug off the responsibility is his operating procedure.

He has never been able to articulate what makes for a good education except for doing better on poorly designed and poorly delivered tests. Any moron off the street would suggest that.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. Dupe
Edited on Wed Feb-24-10 02:57 PM by Jakes Progress


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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #12
62. I'm sure you can't
And when no one wants to work in this school next year, the kids are just screwed, right? May as well just close the school.
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Oregone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #62
77. Of course they should. They are just spanish speaking children of immigrants and lousy teachers
They don't really matter now, do they. Some test proves it:sarcasm:
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #11
25. no - they HAD a better decision,
but the union officials who were "bargaining" didn't do a very good job of negotiating in good faith. They refused the offer that the school board made. That left the board with no other option.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ChimpersMcSmirkers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:15 PM
Response to Original message
10. I'm not a fan of Duncan, but with a 50% graduation rate and 6% math proficiency
those teachers aren't doing their job.
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atreides1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. It's always the teachers isn't it?
Why not fire the parents, or don't you believe that parents can play a part in the education of their children? Why not suspend some of the kids, who probably had no interest in being in school in the first place?

It isn't always the fault of the teachers, but somehow they always get the blame.

Sometimes they deserve it, but not all of the time.
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #13
59. Quit Making Sense
Some people don't like that.
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trayfoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. MAYBE.........
The PARENTS aren't doing THEIR jobs!!!! I do NOT support this action.
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Nuclear Unicorn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #10
19. Oh yeah, definitely the teachers' faults.
They should have known better than to crash the economy, prop-up the corporations and fund ridiculous wars all over the globe.

I bet they'll think twice before wasting all those tax dollars again.

:sarcasm:
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4_TN_TITANS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #10
41. How 'bout you giving it a shot?
Edited on Wed Feb-24-10 03:01 PM by 4_TN_TITANS
I can't imagine how hard it would be to try and teach English second language students, most of whose parents probably don't have a high school education. There were surely some bad teachers in the bunch (math), but everyone???

edit: and Duncan can kiss my ass
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tnlefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 08:02 PM
Response to Reply #41
81. That, and the majority of students living in the poverty level...
bad combination. And their parents may not speak English and may be working to try to make ends meet.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #10
65. And the parents
I guess they get to just sit at home and play tiddly winks while their kids are failing. Cause it's all about what the teachers do, never the parents or the community.
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #10
72. I'd like to see how YOU'd do in a situation like that
It's the people who've never stood in front of a classroom who always assume that it's the teacher's fault.

Are there such things as bad teachers? Of course. But the likelihood of an entire school staff being incompetent is so small as to be impossible.

Firing the whole staff is a facile solution that makes right-wingers feel good but doesn't do a thing for the students.
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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
15. What a Dumbass....
Edited on Wed Feb-24-10 02:25 PM by Jeff In Milwaukee
So you just fired the entire faculty for not wanting to spend extra (read: unpaid) time on the job.

So just who, pray tell, do you thing you're going to hire to replace these teachers? Who would be stupid or desperate enough to take a job where they know that the martinet running the district is going to make utterly unreasonable demands AND might fire you on a moment's notice -- even if you were willing to go along.

Anybody that fucking stupid, I don't want teaching my kid.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. "So just who, pray tell, do you thing you're going to hire to replace these teachers?"
Edited on Wed Feb-24-10 02:31 PM by ProSense
Some of them will no doubt reapply.

Rhode Island's Commissioner of Education Deborah Gist already signed off on this earlier today.

Some of these teachers might get their jobs back.

Part of the stipulation is that not more than 50 percent can get rehired, but all are able to apply.

The teachers who lose their jobs can also apply to other openings in the district.

link


If it weeds out the ineffective teachers, so be it.

It's the only school in the tiny, impoverished city north of Providence. Only about half its students graduate, and only 7 percent of 11th-graders were proficient in math in 2009.

link


Schools aren't only about teachers, it about educating students. If students aren't learning, then it isn't education. Maybe some of the blame lies with parents, but it seems a little ridiculous to blame the students. If the students absolute can't or refuse to learn, then this situation isn't working anyway.






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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. It will weed out the effective teachers....
The best ones will look for jobs in a district not run by an asswipe.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #23
29. Possibly, but
if they really care about the students, they will reapply.


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Reader Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #29
33. Sorry, emotional blackmail only goes so far.
The whole "you'd do it if you cared" argument to browbeat teachers into doing all kinds of things for free is getting old. If America cared about education, all the people so quick to bash and blame teachers would get their superior asses down to their nearest school district and fill out an application.

Don't piss on my head and tell me it's raining.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #33
38. Sorry, that has nothing to do with the point.
Teachers enjoy teaching and they care deeply about their students. Suggesting that they will abandon them because of "assholes" isn't credible.

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Reader Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #38
47. Think again.
Teachers love teaching, but eventually we get tired of being abused by administration, put down by people who couldn't do our job if their lives depended on it, and worrying that dedicating ourselves to a school in a low income area will mean sudden unemployment when Arne Duncan comes to town.

Those of us who stick with the profession learn over the long run that you have to look out for yourself, because no one else is going to do it. In fact, they may just applaud when we get fired by an administrator trying to earn a rep, some air time, and a promotion.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #47
51. "Those of us who stick with the profession learn...that you have to look out for yourself"
I was raised by parents who stuck with it for decades, one for more than four, and it was always about the students.



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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #38
70. You're talking to teachers
Yes it is credible. This is not the only high school in the country. These teachers won't be abandoning these kids, the district is the one doing the abandoning. These teachers will move on to other teaching jobs where there are other kids to care about.
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #29
34. Or maybe they would have stayed...
...for 20+ years due to that same level of caring and commitment. ;)
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progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #29
43. Wrong.
Firing everyone is a slap in the face of good ones; the ones who really tried.

And there comes a time in almost everyone's career where you have to make a choice. Is fighting a dysfunctional system worth the physical and mental anguish?

I know more than a few quality educators that moved on rather than fight a bad administration, or an angry & foolish school board, or a fickle (or worse yet) uncaring public. Sometime the good ones just have to move on.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #43
48. "Firing everyone is a slap in the face of good ones; the ones who really tried."
Maybe there needs to be a better solution, but do you think a school where only seven percent of 11th graders can do math, and half the students are failing every class is face saving?



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tnlefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #48
83. If we're going to stay with this thought, then if only 7% of 11th graders
can do math, shouldn't the firing have been done at the elementary and middle school level?

Forget that large numbers of the students were at the poverty level and English as a second language students...if we're gonna be so damned punitive shouldn't everyone at lower grade levels be the first fired?
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FBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #43
69. If so, then it was the union (and Arne) who "slapped" them.

Firing everyone is a slap in the face of good ones; the ones who really tried.

There are two distinct conversations to be had.

1) Whether the law makes any sense at all - that's for Arne & Co.

2) Given the constraints of the law - they did everything they could to avoid a "slap." The law requires one of four options. Three of the four involve firing every single teacher. They selected the ONLY option that COULD have kept the teachers employed. They even agreed to job protections that I'm not sure the law permits. The union turned it down... thus endangering at least 50% of the teachers who didn't need to lose their jobs.

For that "slap in the face" they have only to look in the mirror.

I know more than a few quality educators that moved on rather than fight a bad administration, or an angry & foolish school board, or a fickle (or worse yet) uncaring public. Sometime the good ones just have to move on.

Absolutely true. Unfortunately, students rarely have such a luxury of choice.
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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #29
49. .
You have no right (NONE) to put the responsibility for this back on the teachers. You're basically saying, if they don't come back, then they never really cared about their students. You ever taught in an inner city classroom? I can gaurantee you that the vast majority of these teachers care passionately about what they're doing or they'd be somewhere else. There are easier places to earn a living.

They've been working their butts off and just got collectively fired by a Superintendent who tells the whole world that they're incompetent. So the teachers are supposed to say "Thank You and May I Please Have My Job Back?" There are kids in other school districts who need help from these teachers just as much. And these teachers will care just as much about those new kids. They're under no obligation put up with conditions like this.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #49
53. Not at all,
Edited on Wed Feb-24-10 03:19 PM by ProSense
"You're basically saying, if they don't come back, then they never really cared about their students."

Everyone has a right to decide what is best for them. I'm responding to your assertion that anyone who remains is "fucking stupid."

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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #53
56. Point Taken
But speaking only for myself, I would quit the profession before I work at that school district again. I do think that - regardless of your level of devotion - that you'd have to be fucking stupid to go back to work in a district that shows such abysmally poor leadership. You can be just as devoted in a district that appreciates all your hard work.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #29
68. Bullshit
The ones who can retire will retire. The ones who are good will be looking to work elsewhere. There are kids to care about in every school in the country. Why stick around after being slapped in the face by this district? I know I wouldn't. I would have gone home and stayed there the day they told me I was losing my job at the end of the year. Sylan is hiring if I am really desperate to work in the meantime.
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #21
30. Prosense...
Edited on Wed Feb-24-10 02:48 PM by YvonneCa
...I love you, too :7 ...but it will be the less expensive (newer) teachers that will be re-hired and the older (more expensivbe) teachers will be cut. It's already happening that way in other districts. States can't afford us anymore. It's age discrimination and it's SAD.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #30
36. I see your point.
It's really a sad situation. They really need to focus the solution on students.

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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #36
40. Senator Kerry said once, speaking at a school in...
...South Carolina, that he understood how hard teachers were working and that NCLB was like a sledge-hammer solution...whereas we needed a scalpel. I think he is right. Some of President Obama's changes are very good. But when it comes to the low performing schools targetted for turnaround, there are stll flaws.

EVERY teacher in a low performing school should not be punished for their dedication to stay and work in such a school. To assume that they are all BAD teachers is wrong. JMHO. :hi:
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. Completely agree:
"To assume that they are all BAD teachers is wrong."

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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #44
75. Thanks...
...:hi:
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Reader Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #30
64. The firing/rehiring is also a way to get rid of teachers who challenge Admin
The nodding-heads who go along with every administration decision, no matter how ridiculous or counterintuitive, would be re-hired in a minute. And then they'd never be in their classrooms teaching, because they'd always be out at some in-service or training or conference.
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FBaggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #64
71. Except that the principal is fired too.
So it would have to be someone who was known as a troublemaker outside of the school.
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Reader Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #71
73. Admin doesn't just mean the principal, it means district office personnel.
The woman who made the decision to fire all the teachers is Admin.

As in most districts, the nodding-heads make sure they get in good with the right folks. They'll be taken care of during the rehiring process.
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PVnRT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #21
42. If students refuse to learn, please explain how firing teachers corrects that problem
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #42
46. "If students refuse to learn, please explain how firing teachers corrects that problem"
Maybe they can replace the students?

The rest of that statement is that the situation isn't working, there needs to be a solution.

Maybe they can hold parents accountable, but if the students aren't learning, what's the point?


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tnlefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #46
84. Exactly how do you propose replacing students?
I'm not sure how it works for everyone else, but here students attend the school(s) they're zoned for. In elementary school mine were lotteried into a magnet school (exception to zoning rules) where they are the minority race in the magnet schools. The school system did this to get around charges of segregated schools and I wanted my kids in a more diverse school environment.

If we don't complete our volunteer hours, or if they don't perform in school, their option is the school they're zoned for, which is predominantly white, has a reputation for drug running and is overcrowded.

I'd like to see your plan for replacing students as it's not a reality for me.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #21
66. Only half can be rehired
No doubt the better ones will choose not to come back.
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rasputin1952 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:34 PM
Response to Original message
22. It is almost impossible to have a situation where...
all of the teachers are "bad". Failure of that magnitude begins, (and often is the sole reason), at the top of the pyramid. The School Board, the principle, and others in the top tier are at fault, and should all be replaced. The teachers, if given the proper guidelines would have done a far better job. This situation needs to be looked at and reversed.

Get rid of the scum at the top of the soup, and it will come out fine.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. Agree, the principle and assistant principles were also fired. n/t
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handmade34 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:42 PM
Response to Original message
28. I agree
I lived in Pawtucket (right next to Central Falls) for a year. From what I have seen, heard and read, I think this is a good idea.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
32. Democrats destroying education one school at a time
Now that's change we can believe in:puke:
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
39. That's some team Obama has assembled.
Edited on Wed Feb-24-10 02:58 PM by Jakes Progress
Arne thinks test scores equal learning.

Geithner thinks rich bankers equals a strong economy.

Rahm thinks appeasing republicans is political victory.
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #39
55. You're Right On All Three Jake
2010? Yeah right, whatever? 2012? We'll see what happens.
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progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
45. Time to put your underwear on your head, Arnie.
We don't want to see asshole anymore.
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WI_DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
50. So what happens when a new bunch of educators are hired and the students still don't give a shit?
and their parents don't give a shit? are they going to fire them, too? Parents and students need to take some of the responsibility, too.
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
54. Obama Will Lose Many Teachers' Votes If He Keeps This asshole
Other "Dems" who support this bullshit can forget another term as well.
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
60. Duncan should be fired
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
67. Shades of Reagan. Outrageous.
More badness from the most disappointing Dem administration of my lifetime.
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hay rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
76. Federal mandates?
My apologies in advance, as I have not been following education issues- but the Central Falls firings caught my eye, so I started googling and came across this article: http://www.projo.com/news/content/central_falls_high_school_chafee_02-23-10_1QH_v37.38adaa0.html

From the article: "In January, Gist identified Central Falls High School as a persistently low-performing school and placed it in the bottom 5 percent of struggling schools. According to new federal mandates, such schools must adopt one of four methods to improve: school closure; takeover by a charter or school-management organization; transformation, which requires a longer school day and other significant changes; and turnaround, which requires the entire teaching staff be fired and no more than 50 percent hired back the following fall."

I'm not familiar with the current set of federal mandates, but these sure sound like something carried over from the Bush administration. Under these guidelines, I have to wonder why any teacher would accept a job in a poor district with a "persistent low-performing" history. The new teacher surely can't change the demographics which create the problems in the first place and all the probable remedies mentioned involve eliminating the teacher's job or making his day longer and harder with no promise of additional compensation.
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Orlandodem Donating Member (859 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-24-10 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
82. As a teacher, Obama has lost me. This is a result of his bone headed Sec of Ed.
This is also a result of Obama's own educational beliefs. I can't in good conscience vote for him again. I will sit out 2010 and 2012.
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