Birth Certificates for stillbirths?

[smokey nj]

The Politics of Stillbirth

This article is reprinted from The American Prospect website.

Thirteen years ago, Joanne Cacciatore delivered a stillborn fetus, a trauma that was compounded by the fact that she received a death certificate in the mail but no birth certificate -- a tangible memento she said would have helped her grieve.

Motivated by her loss, she mounted a grassroots campaign in her home state of Arizona to get the government to give parents who deliver stillborn fetuses the option of receiving a "certificate for stillborn birth" -- and in so doing unintentionally waded into the turbulent waters of abortion politics.

Although reproductive rights advocates say they sympathize with Cacciatore, they also fear her effort -- which has since ballooned into a nationwide campaign -- could aid anti-choice groups as they attempt to chip away at or eliminate abortion rights. "There's no question in my mind that the anti-abortion crowd will look for some way to use this," Kim Gandy, president of the National Organization for Women, has said. At issue is the question of "personhood," or when human life begins; the answer lies at the heart of the debate over abortion.

Opponents of abortion rights contend that life begins at the moment of conception, and they have sought to define embryos and fetuses as human beings with a right to life. Under their logic, abortion is murder and should be illegal. Supporters of abortion rights do not equate embryos and fetuses with full human beings. Granting "personhood" to embryos and fetuses before they are born raises their legal status and jeopardizes women's right to abortion, they say.
<snip>
http://www.alternet.org/rights/58198/

[Katherine Brengle]

1. I have mixed feelings about this. I think that if the mother/parents WANT

a birth certificate, they should be able to have it. For whatever reason - to validate their experience I guess.

I do NOT think it should be required. I think that lends legitimacy to a movement hell bent on diminishing what liberation women have won so far and ensuring that their oppression increases.

[smokey nj]

2. My concern is that once optional, the forced birth crowd would then push

to make it mandatory. If families want to do something unofficial with a private group, I have no problem with it. I just don't want anything like this to be a part of offical policy.

Slighty off topic: My sister, who was still a practicing Catholic, had a fetus who died in utero when I guess she was maybe 5 or six months along in her pregnancy. She wanted to a brief graveside service - not a full blown-out funeral, just a few prayers - so she called her parish (the same parish we'd been raised in) to arrange it. She was basically told by the monsignor that the church doesn't do medical waste and the hospital would take care of the disposal of the body. Everytime I hear Pope Ratzo go off on abortion (and Pope John Paul before him) I always think of my sister.

[Katherine Brengle]

4. That made me cry.

I'm so sad that she was treated that way. For HER, that was her baby, not a blob of tissue.

And for the church to deny that closure, for something they so vehemently consider a human life...

But I do understand what you mean - once they get a foot in the door legally, it can be a swift trip down that slope.

[smokey nj]

9. Thank you Katherine.

She was able to have a small graveside service, the funeral director was extremely sensitive to her situation and took care of the arrangements free of charge. But, this experience really opened my sister's eyes to how hypocritical the church is.

[bliss_eternal]

6. I'm very sorry smokey nj,

that your sister (and your family) experienced this. :hug:

I do appreciate your sharing this, though as it merely confirms what I've always believed about the Catholic church (sadly). Again, so sorry to hear of your sister's pain. Hoping she is well.

[smokey nj]

10. Thank you bliss_eternal.

This happened about 12 years ago and my sister's doing ok now.

[Bjornsdotter]

8. That was cold

...how dare the church say every fertilized egg is a precious life and then turn around and say that to your sister. Can we spell hypocrite?

I am so sorry for the pain this caused your sister, both by the loss of her fetus and the callousness that is the church.

:hug:

[smokey nj]

11. Thank you, Bjornsdotter.

It was a huge slap in the face for her because she was a lecter and read at mass every Sunday as did our mother, who died about two years before this happened. They KNEW her. I don't know if this is the church's standard response in situations like this or just the act of one callous priest, but I think it highlights just how hypocritical the church is when it comes to the right to choose.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WildClarySage]

3. I think it's revolting

that the right-wing forced birth contingent would use this (and I've no doubt they would) woman's grief to further their political agenda and we on the pro-choice side have to consider their machinations rather than the feelings of women who've been through the tragedy of miscarriage/stillbirth.

[bliss_eternal]

5. Agreed....

...at the same time, reading these stories and experiences makes me think. They bring up an important point(for me at least). That it isn't up to a group of people outside of the person that conceived to decide if this is a life, when it begins and to use it for political purposes.

It also points out the hypocrisy (and obvious agenda)of such groups--given their unwillingness to support a grieving mother's desire to say a few words. :(

[WildClarySage]

7. A couple of years ago, I saw a bumper sticker

that said "Having an abortion doesn't mean you're not a mother, it means you're the mother of a dead baby."

I saw that and thought with sadness of the pregnancy I had lost several years earlier to a miscarriage. Some people are absolute shits to ignore the pain they cause others in pursuit of their do-as-I-say politics. That driver of that car didn't give a crap about my feelings as a woman/mother, he or she wanted to score some crummy political points.

[bliss_eternal]

12. Exactly.

What a shitty bumper sticker. :puke:

I've read a lot about this, women that have miscarried and/or had stillbirths only to be treated dismissively by those closest to them. I'm glad to see that there's more interest in actually honoring women's rights around this issue but feel it still has a long way to go. In some cases I've read women go to their anti-choice friends/colleagues expecting understanding and they aren't getting it. These are the same people that want to ascribe "rights" to a fetus for political purposes--and so they can dictate how someone else SHOULD live.

I'm so sorry to hear that you lost your baby to miscarriage. :hug: I hope that you had some that were more supportive of you than some I've heard of.