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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:46 PM
Original message
Has the White House Lost Their Minds? - FDL
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 08:47 PM by proud patriot
(edited for copyright purposes-proud patriot Democratic Underground)

Has the White House Lost Their Minds?
By: David Dayen
Tuesday September 28, 2010 8:42 am

<snip>

Have you ever seen an athlete stay in the game for too long (no intentional resemblance to any quarterback of the Minnesota Vikings) because they cannot imagine a world without the adulation and cheering? Thats about the only analogy I can make to the persistent carping inside the White House, now a definitive strategy and part of the Presidents stump speech, telling the liberal base to stop whining, get over it, wake up and get in gear. Blue Texan has an more complete list, ( http://firedoglake.com/2010/09/27/late-night-stop-whini... / ) and contrasts it with messages that would work on him.

Before revealing the latest in this genre, I would just add that Ive never seen a politician run an election with the message Dont be stupid, quit your bitching and vote for me. This goes orders of magnitude beyond Here are the stakes, my opponent would vote against everything you care about. That at least has a certain time-tested quality. That would make the election a choice and not a referendum. But vote for me, you simpletons? Theres a reason that strategy has never been employed: because its so insane to think that open berating would inspire a voter to action.

Heres President Obama talking to Rolling Stone: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/17390/209395?... Let me set the scene here: the President just completed a long interview with Jann Wenner. He left the room. Then a minute later, concerned that the hippie may be left standing, he comes back in the room to deliver the knockout punch.

One closing remark that I want to make: It is inexcusable for any Democrat or progressive right now to stand on the sidelines in this midterm election. There may be complaints about us not having gotten certain things done, not fast enough, making certain legislative compromises. But right now, weve got a choice between a Republican Party that has moved to the right of George Bush and is looking to lock in the same policies that got us into these disasters in the first place, versus an administration that, with some admitted warts, has been the most successful administration in a generation in moving progressive agendas forward.

The idea that weve got a lack of enthusiasm in the Democratic base, that people are sitting on their hands complaining, is just irresponsible.

Everybody out there has to be thinking about whats at stake in this election and if they want to move forward over the next two years or six years or 10 years on key issues like climate change, key issues like how we restore a sense of equity and optimism to middle-class families who have seen their incomes decline by five percent over the last decade. If we want the kind of country that respects civil rights and civil liberties, wed better fight in this election. And right now, we are getting outspent eight to one by these 527s that the Roberts court says can spend with impunity without disclosing where their moneys coming from. In every single one of these congressional districts, you are seeing these independent organizations outspend political parties and the candidates by, as I said, factors of four to one, five to one, eight to one, 10 to one.

We have to get folks off the sidelines. People need to shake off this lethargy, people need to buck up. Bringing about change is hard thats what I said during the campaign. It has been hard, and weve got some lumps to show for it. But if people now want to take their ball and go home, that tells me folks werent serious in the first place.

If youre serious, nows exactly the time that people have to step up.


(snip)

<snip>

More: http://news.firedoglake.com/2010/09/28/has-the-white-ho... /

:shrug:
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FiveGoodMen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. K&R
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live love laugh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:13 AM
Response to Reply #1
112. Whine at your own risk. nt
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ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:51 PM
Response to Original message
2. The entire Democratic Platform seems to be: STFU and vote for us
and it's going to bite them in the ass, in my opinion.
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Luciferous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #2
83. Yep
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #2
89. yeah, so do they really want a democratic majority in congress?
I mean if they start talking about privatizing SS, privatizing schools, privatizing the commons--if they hold the same views, wouldn't a repug congress help them along? I mean some of these teabaggers are something else-Eisenhower is looking pretty progressive about now.
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bc3000 Donating Member (766 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #89
145. Exactly! They'd rather hand it over to republicans so they have an excuse.
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 10:42 AM by bc3000
Our spineless democrats are more comfortable in the minority.
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lark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #89
178. Don't think they give a shit about progressives
they appease Repugs, rip their base, then complain because the base isn't motivated. Not very effective and certainly not what I'd have ever expected from our definitely smart POTUS. They could have done so much more if they'd have shown some spine and played hardball, but no, they only play hardball with their own supporters, thereby turning a lot of them off.
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tomp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #178
199. they would rather lose than be progressive.
take it to the bank. it is not in the dna of the current leadership.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
110. As it ought to. nt
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #110
168. Poetic justice, to say the least.
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 11:48 AM by bobbolink
:hi:
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #168
210. To say the least.
:hi:
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Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #2
122. I agree.
People don't like to be hectored and lectured. They are not employees of the party. Quite the contrary, public officials work for us, not the other way around.
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #2
133. Why would I NOT
vote for the Democrats in my state? The Governor, Atty General, Sec'y of State, Auditor, etc. have more of an influence over my life than this administration. Hell I don't want to put with Kasich as Governor...a former Lehman VIP. He'll massacre the working poor and the unemployed.

If Dems don't get out and vote for Dem Congressional and Senators, we are cutting off our noses to spite our faces.

I'm voting a straight Dem Ticket. I have a great Congressional candidate to vote for...the Senate, not so much but he sure the hell is better than Rod Portman who was W's Trade Rep and sent zillion of jobs to China.

I don't know why Obama doesn't say what I've said above instead of 'Wake Up.' Who is advising him anyway??? I think I'll send the dude an email...shit, I should be paid for the damn advice.
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #2
158. I think they are throwing the election...
the way the republicans did in 2008. Nothing else explains the behavior. I mean, what the hell? Any dem that is ousted will just get a cushy lobbyist job, so what do they have to lose? And Wall Street will get what they have wanted for a long time- our Social Security money.
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TBF Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #158
159. Yup. Makes it much easier for them to pass their
corporatist legislation.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
3. Seriously.
:shrug:
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:53 PM
Response to Original message
4. The WH thinks the 'professional left' is really nothing but DFH.
Why they would be total idiots before a pivotal election is light-years over my head. Maybe The Stupid is still in the air from Commander Failure Pants and Uncle Lucifer.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. "Uncle Lucifer"
:rofl:
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:55 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. LOL !!!
:rofl:
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #4
38. LOL
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txlibdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
169. If only I'd heard the term Commander Failure Pants before I selected my pseudonym for DU
No matter how inane or ludicrous my comments might seem, I, Commander Failure Pants stand by them!

:rofl: :rofl:
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:56 PM
Response to Original message
7. C'mon, buck up and quit your whining, unreccers!
:rofl:

NGU.

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RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
8. It certainly seems a bizarre way to get the vote out. I would accentuate the positive
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 04:57 PM by RKP5637
accomplishments and move forward, and save the negative stuff for the republicans we have appeased. Using divide and conquer techniques against your own base is really really strange.


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Whisp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:58 PM
Response to Original message
9. carping? FDL is whining about Carping?


they should talk

Jane, you ignorant ----
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Pssst... Take Another Look...
Jane didn't write it.

:shrug:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. OOps.
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Individualist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #9
45. The whining about FDL never ends.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #45
47. I've Always Believed The Right Was In Denial, But Apparently, The Center Is Too...
:shrug:

:evilgrin:

:hi:
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 04:59 PM
Response to Original message
10. Buck up. Really?
:puke:
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
11. You simpletons! I'll explain this 12-level Vulcan chess one more time
See, what's going on here is that the administration is playing a subtle game. If you're alienated by their work or their policies or you're such a delicate little flower that you can't vote because your fee-fees are hurt, well then the Democrats could lose their majority of dubious utility in the Senate or the House or both. This then means that the administration can really unload on all you unrealistic dreamers and blame you for their total failure to do anything until the 2012 elections.

But, supposing you wily hippies are craftier than the administration suspects, and you get out and vote, and Democrats retain their majorities, the administration has a plan for that, too. They'll take any electoral non-defeat as a ringing endorsement of everything they've done, and continue to box up every program and hand deliver it to the Republicans to treat like the gorilla treated that piece of Samsonite luggage in the commercial many years ago. Since you stupidly returned the Democrats to office, it must mean that you are totally behind everything they've done so far. And any of the heavy lifting will have to wait until after . . . {spoiler alert} . . . the 2012 elections. Oh, and they'll take credit for their ingenious verbal jiu-jitsu in making you all go to the polls and vote Democratic.

By the way, that sour taste in the back of your throat means you just threw up a little.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #11
31. Keep what we can and REALLY up the effort on Progressive primary challengers to Congress
next run. Give them something to whine about.

Why? Because I would rather march against Democrats than Republicans. The way I see it it's a shorter march. And furthermore I resent Obama gaming this midterm Congressional election against the left of the Dem base from his safety of 2012.

If I were Pelosi I would be livid.
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chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #31
55. So true. "Gaming the midterm. Poor Nancy. She just did everything she was asked to.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #55
66. Not saying she's perfect, but the House has presented better legislation that the Senate and Admin
have chucked. As in chuckers.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #11
35. Lose-Lose. Great choice they've given us.
Nature compensates for just about anything other than stupidity and failure to recognize deception. Not sure which it is they expect of us, and I don't like the choices. I ran out of Nexium a long time ago, but no longer taste the bile.

I'm beginning to taste blood from biting my tongue, but that too won't be a problem for much longer, I think. These guys have already put us in a sure trajectory back to being the minority party - we will again be able to say what we really think. Not much of a consolation prize.

G-d, I almost hate them.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:12 AM
Response to Reply #11
111. +1
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:04 AM
Response to Reply #11
120. Rinse and repeat.
:thumbsup:
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truebrit71 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #11
124. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the ballgame in a nutshell...
...
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Arkansas Granny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #11
129. +1
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liberation Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #11
140. Ha! Ha! It is funny... because it is true
and that is ever so sad :-(
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #11
143. This, unfortunately, is the answer.
*sigh*
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sonomak Donating Member (147 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #11
165. Yes, please be sensible
quit taking drugs, quit being so retarded, and quit yer whining
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lapislzi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #11
174. this deserves its own post
Pass the Listerine.
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bkozumplik Donating Member (391 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #11
182. its momentum or stalemate, not "this" or republican doom
If we lose the house and senate, Obama vetoes things. We arent in any danger whatsoever of veto overrides, so what we are risking is any forward momentum. If/When the election goes badly in 2010, we are NOT going to be plunged into the pit of republican despair where they do whatever they please. Not going to happen.

The choice is: the possibility of forward momentum or stalemate.

If we throw the board up in the air scattering pieces everywhere, that doesnt equal letting the repubs rule, it means Obama does nothing but veto things all day, and get harangued by congress.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #11
194. This should be turned into a manifesto for progressives
who decide, once again, to hold their noses and give Democrats one more chance. It should be sent to every Democrat, to let them know WE know what WE are doing, AND we know how they operate.

Really, this should be an OP, because it is precisely how things are and how they will be, whether Dems win or lose. Bottom line is that because of them, the people lose either way.



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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #194
198. The interesting thing is...
That the congressmen most at risk are those that are allied with the Blue Dogs and DLC. Even if a few of them are replaced by repukes it won't change reality much. The narrative battle will be far more involved.

The Republicans are going to be suffering from lost expectation battle fallout, while the media will probably crow something about a 'republican revolution' despite the fact that they aren't taking over anything, if we are lucky and push hard and strong maybe we might be able to push the message of rejection of the Blue Dogs. Blanche Lincoln should be the poster child for everything that is stupid and wrong with insider political handicapping by the pros trumping the process.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #198
207. Excellent points. It IS the Blue Dogs/DLCers who are most at risk
of losing any progressive support. You're right too, that for the people, losing a few DLCers to Republicans wouldn't make much of a difference. We should focus on helping progressives, like Russ Feingold win, eg.

I know I could not vote for someone like Blanche Lincoln. Those days are gone when people were convinced to hold their noses and vote for people like her just to get a majority. Well, we've seen now what has done for the people. So you are correct, no loss if we lose a few of those right-wing of the party Dems, in name only.

I hope in fact that this is what happens. However, Dems will then use it as an excuse for 'not having enough votes' to get anything done.

I DO agree that we should be pushing the fact that the Blue Dogs cost them the majority.
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-30-10 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #207
216. Hmm
With regards to Blanche Lincoln, her opposition in the primary was far, far more progressive and far more electable. (Funny how that argument only works when the DINO's use it) Yet still the party establishment came out in force for her, pushing her over a candidate that actually stood a chance at capturing her seat and keepint it from a repuke.
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Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #11
197. I agree with your analysis, gratuitous.
:thumbsup:
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tomp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #11
200. EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!
that is exactly the two party duoopoly strategy. there is no way to effectively convey our sincere and serious criticisms. we take what the dems are handing out or we get the repubs.

nice game for the rich.
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Agony Donating Member (865 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #11
203. So sad but true... and I'm immune to that sour taste by now, no worries
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-30-10 05:04 AM
Response to Reply #11
214. +1 n/t
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
13. They lost their minds when they decided "bi-partisanship" was more important than helping people
We needed real help and real change after the 8 years of the Bush/Cheney crime spree but all we got was more of the same with a SLIGHT change. All while being told by Gibbs, Emanuel, etc that us liberals are worthless, whiners, etc. The Dems show us no respect and just tell us to fall in line even though they hate us and don't do shit for us? NOT A GOOD STRATEGY AT ALL! :mad:
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Tesha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #13
54. They lost their minds when they decided that being supported by Republicans was...
...more important than being supported by their own partisans.

They *DOUBLY* lost their minds when they fantasized that
Republicans might, *IN ANY UNIVERSE*, actually support them!

Tesha
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #13
97. hear, hear
eight years of greed, corruption, blank check to corporations as we watched our soldiers die and our jobs go bye-bye. We needed real change-a one-eighty from the Bush junta years.
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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:04 AM
Response to Reply #97
119. needed, perhaps, but if you haven't noticed, we don't get complete one-eighties in this country
It's designed that way. I know, I know, everypne wants it so that one person can make any decision he wants and have it implemented immediately, so long as its Our Guy. For better or worse, though, a bunch of 18th-century dead dudes wrote out a couple of documents explaining why htey didn't think this was a hot idea. And I'd tend to agree with them.

Change is slow in the United States. For better or worse, that's pretty much the founding principle of our nation.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #119
195. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #195
211. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-30-10 04:58 AM
Response to Reply #211
212. I sure hope you are not doing any campaigning for this
this election. This may be a game to you, but to most Americans, me included, it is no game.

And hate to tell you honeycakes, but no, you fucking can't get what you want "immediately." You can't even get what you don't want "immediately."

I think I said that. But we sure can get what we DON'T want pretty quickly after electing a Democratic majority. Funny that, isn't it? Offshore drilling! Just one example of how easy it is to get some rightwing ideas turned into law pretty fast, by a Democrat!

You sound frazzled, so I'll leave you to rant and whine all you want.

'Honeycakes'? :rofl:


Oh, and speak for yourself regarding what YOU may do with your time 'pissing in a corner of the internet'. Too bad that's all you do, and 'pissing' is a good word for it I have to say. But most of us don't spend our time doing what . You seem angry at yourself. Maybe you should join the rest of us and get out of that corner of the internet and start doing some actual work.

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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-01-10 02:55 AM
Response to Reply #212
220. You're not serious, are you?
Offshore drilling... is Obama's fault.

Nnnngh.

I'm sorry. But if that's what's running through your mind, I don't want you voting. You'd probably just write-in "Mighty Mouse" and consider yourself clever, anyway.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #13
132. and as Obama said in the Rolling Stone interview ..he realized Seven days into his Admin.
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 09:49 AM by flyarm
that there was no working with Republicans and that all they were going to do was to try to obstruct everything.

I have to believe Wat Obama himself has said.

So if Obama knew the first week the Republicans would Obstruct everything..just who has he been kissing ass up to?

It surely has not been progressives or liberals..so just who??????????
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #132
184. Great question ....!!
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Broderick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:04 PM
Response to Original message
15. Shrug
I get the feeling they want to distance themselves for a centrist image, and mitigate damage in the upcoming elections. The patient competitor always wins, and the rhetoric will probably slow down afterwards. Maybe patience is the prescription, and we ought be more thick skinned. Isn't it always like this?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. I guess it depends upon whether being patient while the country goes right again
is something you think is a good strategery.

It never seems to have gained us anything yet, has it?
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Broderick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Not my intention
Just saying, from my personal experience, that politicians tend to distance themselves from the base to attract the centrists during elections. Patience comes from the job they have to do to get votes by making it appear they are not driven by the base. So, patience means understanding. It goes both ways I think. The middle voters are the key to every election it seems in my view. I try not to take it personally. Seems the media wants to rile people up, and I refuse to take offense mere days before an election.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. That's what Democrats have done since about 1994 and their results
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 05:18 PM by EFerrari
have been terrible. I've yet to hear any Republican administration go after their base in this way.
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Broderick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. It may seem that way
But if you listen to the base on the other side, they are always mad at their leaders for "not doing enough". Because I might agree with their pundits that voters are complacent or uniformed doesn't make it so, they just have a different perspective. Frankly, I don't think it is being uniformed, I think it is misguided. Nevertheless, and unfortunately, I find people's perspectives on issues akin to being supportive of a football team. My side, your side. Over the years, the media has asserted itself financially into the picture by taking advantage of that. A good "rivalry" always implores better ratings so to speak. I just follow my subset issues and look at a bigger picture and try not to let the "game" interfere with what I think is right. Politicians, in my humble opinion, are surrogates to a game of sorts and play it. Come election time, the base seems to take a brunt beating from those we support but behind closed doors things are not always what it appears to be. Just my humble opinions.
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #22
98. I want to know what is a centrist?
Does a centrist believe in social security and medicare, does a centrist believe in public education, does a centrist believe in holding wall street accountable, does a centrist believe in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights? I mean what exactly is a centrist's position?
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Broderick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:40 AM
Response to Reply #98
102. My opinion
A centrist is selfish, meaning that they only look to themselves. I am certain that is the minority position of centrists.
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The Green Manalishi Donating Member (426 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #102
148. In some ways I consider myself a centrist.
People, of left or right, who demonize other Americans are crap. there are no 'bad guys', there are other citizens doing what they think right.
as soon as you start calling the opposition stupid names, insinuating that they are motivated by anything other than honest self interest or belief in the issues, as soon as those childish games start, you've become part of the problem. Even Churchill called him Mr. Hitler.
The above notwithstanding that I think all the members of the PNAC should be tried at the Hauge.
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txlibdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #22
177. By that logic, since 70% of Americans want single payer...
The middle voters are probably middle class folks so why would it appeal to them to give bailouts to big business and a cold shoulder to the middle class, so many of whom are losing their savings, their jobs, their homes?

Voters gave a resounding THUMBS DOWN to Trickle Down so why would it appeal to the middle for the administration to be its newest champion?

How can it appeal to the middle to toss out single payer before you even start debate when 70% of Americans want it?

How can it appeal to the middle to keep unpopular wiretapping, to keep Bush appointees in your administration and in regulatory positions?

How can it appeal to the middle to insist on compromise with the right wing ideals that these same middle voters rejected?

I will vigorously fight to keep Democratic control of the House and the Senate in the 2010 election but NOT for any concern over Obama. I am hopeful that the 2012 primaries will bring us a Democratic candidate and we can dump our current center-right Republican President. Bye-bye former President, Obama.

PS, if the Republicons take control of the House they will work night and day to IMPEACH. The administration and their staff will be spending all their time in court. Grid lock will be the word of the day. Every day. If the President thinks he has grey hairs now, he aint seen nothing yet!
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #15
163. Suffering patiently is a good quality...

for a slave.

If you're a slave owner.
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:04 PM
Response to Original message
16. K & R nt
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old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:04 PM
Response to Original message
17. Rec. Thanks for posting this despite the asshole morons who unred'd it.
Obama is so disconnected from the left of his own party, it is just amazing. I have no fucking idea who he thinks voted him into office, but it was not the right...he had US pushing for him and making his presidency possible after he was attacked repeadedly as the most radical leftist in Congress. I could only rejoice after Clinton wasted years of opportunities to think that at last we had REAL LEFTIST PRESIDENT!!! The joke was on me.

Mr Obama, as I emailed the White House this morning, I have voted for Democrats in every election for over 40 years, and I plan to do so again, but I have NO "ENTHUSIASM" for an administration that continues the Bush regime's assault on our constitutional freedons via the Patriot Act and the HSA, and that has caved in the every GOP pressure to water down much needed legislation for the good of OUR COUNTRY! I will vote for Democratic candidates, but give no support to the Party itself, because I don't know who the hell you folks are, but you don't strike me as Democrats.

Fired Up? Hell, no.

mark
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #17
93. "the left", "those far left liberals"
Now, I always thought I was just a middle of the road democrat--one who believed in regulating businesses-wall street, believed in investing in our children's education, believed in helping those in need, believed in keeping our drinking water, food, products safe, believed in making sure our senior citizens would not starve or go without healthcare, believed that all workers should have a decent wage and safe environment. I thought, at one time, that was the democratic platform, but now it seems that's a far left liberal. My, my how times change.
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old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:54 AM
Response to Reply #93
107. Exactly. I was a Union Steward, I believe in the working people and middle class.
I believe we should not police the world, and should not police our own citizens without legal cause. I believe we should help our poor, sick, veterans and those seeking more education. We must have clean, safe living conditions and freedom of expression.

I don't feel that I'm way out in the left, although it seems that I am...


mark
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #17
186. Well, I'm looking at it not as voting FOR Democrats ... but AGAINST Repugs .... !!!
The more Repugs we get rid of the better -- and then maybe we can begin

to find out who these people calling themselves "Democrats" really are --

and begin to deal with THEM!!???



:) Nice post!

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Radical Activist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
18. FDL is taking the "whiners" comment personally.
And they should.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #18
206. and they respond by whining extra, extra hard.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
20. Gates and reasons for a couple of illegal, immoral and unnecessary wars still get me.
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 05:11 PM by Octafish
Then there's Don Siegelman and the rest of the Just-Us for Wall Street Congreff and Courts...

The bottom line is, President Obama is who we got, warts and all, on our side.

Retiring Rahm Emanuel and Timmy Geithner are a nice start to getting what he needs to do as president -- good information in order to make good decisions.

Integrity to use it is another thing -- from 1600 Pennsylvania to the basement health spa of Boehner's concubine.

For the future's sake, I keep the hope we'll see change delivered.
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #20
205. I'm with you on that one!
Hope burns eternal.
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Xipe Totec Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
21. Is you is, or is you ain't, my constituency? nt
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #21
43. Exactly
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dennis4868 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
23. 
Obama's message is clear...."we have done alot, we need to do more, and Repubs obstruct!
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Except for that whole other part.where he, his vice, his press secretary and his CofS
say "don't be stupid, quit your bitching and vote for me", you nailed it.



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dennis4868 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #24
29. I agree with Obama and Biden
alot of shit is on the line here, including the repeal of the health care bill (which I have a selfish stake in since it gives my daughter health insurance when she could not get it before the law went into effect) and we progressives should put aside our differences with Obama FOR NOW and get out the vote! What does bitching do at this point in time other than split the party and help the repubs/tea party.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. A lot of shit is on the line here and I hope Obama and Biden
and their staff stop bitching at voters ASAP.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. Their whining doesn't appear very "powerful" to me, I think it's a bad PR move. nt
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walldude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #29
36. Well if so much is on the line why aren't they attacking Republicans
for things like voting against health care for 9/11 responders? For voting down pay raises for soldiers? For their general obstructionism? Why are they not taking this message to the public? Republicans in their quest for greater stupidity have voted down some things that even the tea baggers would find disgusting. They tossed this election down the sewer and all the Democrats needed to do was keep hammering home the message "Republicans would rather give tax loopholes to foreign corporations than help 9/11 first responders. Where the fuck is that message?


I would have much less of a problem being told to STFU if the people telling me weren't fucking idiots.
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-30-10 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #36
217. Exactly.
Their communications and media strategy has been a failure as of late. The obstructionism should have been story one and the deaths of people with out healthcare should have been laid at their feet, as well as increasing the pay for soldiers, and blocking proper job creation.

Instead timidity has been the rule of the day. Tough language and arm twisting? Save it for the left wing of your own party. And when we stand up and try to primary out one of the very blue dogs that has been breaking her own arm stabbing the party and the president in the back what do they do? They campaign for her against a viable progressive alternative that was a hell of a lot closer in the polls to the repuke running.

But I'm still showing up and voting and encouraging my liberal friends to do likewise. If the blue dogs lose then I want it clear that the progressive candidates won.
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zipplewrath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #29
161. Why can't I do both?
Why can't I keep being critical of the administrations mistakes and short comings, AND get out and vote? More importantly, since it isn't a presidential election year, why can't I make it clear to those I am voting for, exactly what my vote means?
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #29
187. Agree with the "for now" part ... cause we're going to have to deal with this Obama crap soon after
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 02:14 PM by defendandprotect
the election -- another two years of this pro-corporate agenda and US will be finished!!

We need a new Democrat -- a liberal/progressive -- to step up in 2012!!

Obama is begging only for more time to fulfill his corporate agenda as far as I can see!!

And if you doubt what that pro-corporate agenda is -- check this out . . .



Ramh .... crowing about preserving "private health care industry" ... business s/b grateful!*


Here is the quote: In a Thursday interview, White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel argued that rather than recoiling against Obama, business leaders should be grateful for his support on at least a half-dozen counts: his advocacy of greater international trade and education reform open markets despite union skepticism; his rejection of calls from some quarters to nationalize banks during the financial meltdown; the rescue of the automobile industry; the fact that the

overhaul of health care preserved the private delivery system

; the fact that billions in the stimulus package benefited business with lucrative new contracts, and that financial regulation reform will take away the uncertainty that existed with a broken, pre-crash regulatory apparatus.

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=B2F85DDF-18 ...




*Posted on DU 8/12/10 by another poster --


Notice Rahm is also "crowing" about "opening markets" in edication -- i.e., PRIVATIZING

public education!

Is this what you want more of ???


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tomp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #29
201. oh, you mean you got your pony. where's mine? nt
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #23
82. "Let me just say, we've done a lot. I've got a list here in my pocket and maybe I'll show you...
but in the meantime, trust me. We've done a lot. How do I know? Because I said so."

Oh, and combat operation are over in Iraq. I am a fierce advocate for gay rights. And, except for the time that I made a secret deal with big pharma and the other time I made a secret deal with big insurance and the other time I let BP run the show and hide evidence... oh and the times I've invoked states secrets... I'm running the most transparent admin in history!
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #82
134. yep..lots of empty words..and rose colored glasses they keep trying to pass out..
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 09:55 AM by flyarm
they are just pissed Liberals and Progressives refuse to take those free rose colored glasses or wear them!

We Liberals and progressives know when the knife is in our backs..no glasses can fool us.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #82
188. "Preserving PRIVATIZED health care industry" -- a fiasco creating more suffering Americans ....!!!
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 02:20 PM by defendandprotect
And -- not even owning up to corporate $$$ that financed Obama and Baucus and

the DLC -- !! No one even embarrased by it all ... !!



Ramh .... crowing about preserving "private health care industry" ... business s/b grateful!Thursday, August 12, 2010

Here is the quote: In a Thursday interview, White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel argued that rather than recoiling against Obama, business leaders should be grateful for his support on at least a half-dozen counts: his advocacy of greater international trade and education reform open markets despite union skepticism; his rejection of calls from some quarters to nationalize banks during the financial meltdown; the rescue of the automobile industry; the fact that the

overhaul of health care preserved the private delivery system;

the fact that billions in the stimulus package benefited business with lucrative new contracts, and that financial regulation reform will take away the uncertainty that existed with a broken, pre-crash regulatory apparatus.

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=B2F85DDF-18 ...





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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
26. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
Broderick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Why does it seem (to me)
That politicians get brainwashed as soon as they get to DC? Is it the water?
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:52 PM
Response to Reply #28
37. It's the GREED.
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Recursion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #28
39. Because they have to actually pass and implement legislation in the real world
rather than just imagining what a great bill might look like.
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #28
164. Ya don't make it to the Big Leagues

if ya don't play ball with the Owners.
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harun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #28
183. Franken is about the only one I know who didn't drink the water.
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 02:03 PM by harun
I think he actually got better after going to Washington.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. Hear, here Lorien ^ My sentiments exactly. nt
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Junkdrawer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #26
41. Yep. I've seen sitcoms with more complex scripts....
From January:


I Think Obama will be ReElected in 2012

I also think the Republican Right will take over the House if not both the House and the Senate in 2010. And that will have two effects:

1.) It will allow Obama to play the role of Opposition Leader. Hell be able to veto some truly dreadful bills and seem heroic obtaining the kind of compromise bills that currently gets him in such trouble with the base.

2.) Memories of the 2010 losses will energize Get-Out-the-Vote drives in 2012. Besides, it looks like Republicans may take a dive again by nominating a Palin-like candidate.

Old Timers who lived through the 1994 Contract-with-America can be forgiven if all this produces a sense of dj vu.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

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suffragette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #41
76. 
And spot on analysis.
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newspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #26
101. and, that's what I've been saying
I'm voting because I want a democratic majority so that any legislation that even sniffs like repuke--they will be responsible for it and can't blame the repugs. Because I think we have some "new" democrats that are corporatizing, privatizing, reagonomic stooges--and, if the repugs gain majorities in congress, unless the plebes protest too much, they will continue a pro-corporate, privatizing de-regulating agenda.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #26
125. what a load of garbage
:rofl:
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tomp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #26
202. see gratuitous' post upthread.
if they increase the majority they will consider it a referendum on their first two years and pull more of same sell out shit we got already. and if they lose they will argue they should have gone more right.

count on it. it will happen. it's lose-lose for progressives.

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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:43 PM
Response to Original message
34. "They" (the ones that own us) have been working on this since at least Nixon . . .
their goal has been to establish a right wing plutocratic semi-dictatorship.

especially since the end of vietnam. this country might have been on the verge of revolution after the civil rights movement and during the vietnam war.

they made damn sure the people internalized apathy (through use of advertising and broadcast media) so that they would never collectively protest the government or revolt against it. only certain messages are valid and the left has been discredited through constant repetition of lies and historical revisionism; i.e., the myth of the "they spit on us and called us babykillers" airport scene between returning servicemen and protestors.
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Cherchez la Femme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #34
190. That's just DFH talk
fait accompli
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 05:59 PM
Response to Original message
40. Dayden is suggesting the President and VP have lost their minds?
They're likely in full control of their faculties and this hypersensitive outrage by FDL is part of the problem.



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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. DLC hogwash!
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #44
50. While FDL is whining
the President is in Wisconsin firing up tens of thousands of voters. Russ Feingold left Washington to go join the rally.

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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 07:23 PM
Response to Reply #50
60. So what did he tell them? Vote for us because if you don't, you suck?
Yeah, that'll work.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #60
65. No, he said
you are the base.



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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #65
78. Yes. You are the base, so vote for me. The problem is, the base is asking why...
and Obama and most of the rest of the Democrats can't or won't answer that question.
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Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #65
123. I see people are so pissed at him, they're reaching out get him!


Thousands of them!
Maybe they're trying to wring his neck?
:spray:
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #50
67. and while you sit here and whine about FDL this is the email they sent out today!
YES..while you whine and bellyache about FDL they were sending this out this morning to all he dems on their web site to fund raise for Russ.....what did you do today other than whine at fellow DU'ers and FDL??????????



act@firedoglake.com
Hi xxxxx,

All too often, those who proclaim to have strong principles regarding free speech or domestic spying or torture when "the other guy" is in power abandon those concerns when it's their own party's turn at the helm.

Not Wisconsin Senator Russ Feingold. He's the rare person of conviction who stood alone and heroically voted against the Patriot Act when every other member of the Senate voted "aye." And his principles don't change just because there's a new resident at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

But Russ is in a tough battle. He's trailing his well-funded opponent by a wide margin. If Russ loses, while party bosses on both sides of the aisle can conspire to keep Joe Lieberman in the Senate, it sends a message to every member of Congress that there is no popular support for those who put themselves on the line in defense of our first amendment rights.

Our country can't afford for Russ Feingold to lose this election.

Please donate $5 or more to Russ Feingold and fight for our civil liberties. It's critical we keep his voice in the Senate. Click here to donate:

http://action.firedoglake.com/feingold

Feingold voted against TARP under Bush, and he voted against it again under Obama. He can't call on the fat cat bankers to fund his race like so many others can.

There's only one yardstick, and Russ applies it to everyone.

Feingold's opponent, Ron Johnson, has more "flexible" principles. He's a millionaire installed by the party chieftans over the objections of local activists. When Wisconsin activists asked Johnson whether he supported the Patriot Act, he said "I wasn't overly concerned with George Bush in power. I'm a little more concerned about the Patriot Act when you have Barack Obama."

Johnson, like Joe Lieberman, is no fan of free speech either. Lieberman famously said that "in matters of war, we undermine presidential credibility at our nation's peril." Likewise, Johnson said that Feingold was "undermining our troops" by speaking out against the war in Afghanistan, and that it was "extremely harmful to our nation."

Russ needs your help. Can you please donate $5 or more to help Feingold fight back against his Lieberman-lite opponent?

http://action.firedoglake.com/feingold

Russ Feingold is the best defense of civil liberties in the Senate. His defeat would be an enormous blow to the tenuous wall holding back things like biometric ID programs that Joe Lieberman's Department of Homeland Security is simply salivating over.

The time is coming when Americans will have to decide: do we stand and fight for our right to privacy and individual freedom, or do we capitulate to the continued erosion of our civil liberties?

If you choose "fight," then join me in fighting for Russ Feingold. Click here to donate $5 or more to Russ Feingold now.

http://action.firedoglake.com/feingold

Thank you for standing up for our civil liberties, and for all you do.

Best,

Jane Hamsher
FDL Action PAC
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #67
80. FDL & Feingold. Fighting the good fight!
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #67
84. She sent an e-mail at noon on the day the President was in Wisconsin? What's the favorite saying
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 09:42 PM by ProSense
TLTL

:rofl:


Oh, and what's with referring to a teabagger as "Lieberman-lite"?



While Hamsher was whining, guess where Feingold was today?

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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #84
136. I awoke on the east coast to that email in my inbox..not at noon ..
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 10:04 AM by flyarm
and it had nothing to do with Obama's stop in Wisconsin..it was a campaign fund raising email.,,one of numerous ones I get from FDL for candidates....but you know that..

How many have you sent out???? and to how many Dems???????
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Me. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
42. Cenk Had A Great Rant On This Subject Today
His point: Progressives are the Messengers, whether the WH likes the message or not. His example was healthcare. The PO was left out and certainly not fought for. The WH intimated it was a bridge too far for the country while making deals with insurance companies and pharma. Recent polls now suggest that the country doesn't think they went far enough. As Cenk says, "we tried to tell them". Perhaps they never will listen but they surely know, when they make their bipartisan deals and give half the loaf away, that as with everyone else, there are consequences. If they're suffering buyers remorse over the deals they've made they should be bitching at the people who sold them the lemons.
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #42
51. "we tried to tell them"
The problem wasn't that they didn't hear. The problem was that they thought the message was full of shit. The message that it was worth killing the whole bill over the issue of the PO. That message was heard loud and clear, and emphatically rejected. They would make the same decision today or any other day (regardless of who tried to tell whom what), and that is a good thing.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #51
61. Good for them, and their insurance company owners. Not so good for us.
And I reject their message, and yours, just as emphatically.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #51
63. And Yet...
Voters who say the new health reform law was too conservative outnumber by 2 to 1 those supporting repeal, according to a poll released Saturday.

About 40 percent of respondents said the law was too timid in overhauling the nation's healthcare system, while 20 percent said they'd like to see it scrapped, according to the survey, commissioned by The Associated Press (AP).

Republicans, who voted unanimously against the health reforms, have molded their campaign message around the idea that opposition to the law comes overwhelmingly from voters who consider it an intrusion on time-honored liberties.


When you said you didnt want a government takeover of health care, we heard you," Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) said Saturday during the Republican's weekly radio address.

But the poll suggests dissatisfaction with the new law is much more nuanced than that, with more voters indicating frustration that the Democrats didn't go further.

"I was disappointed that it didn't provide universal coverage," Bronwyn Bleakley, 35, an Easton, Mass.-based biology professor, told the AP.


Link: http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/120915...

:shrug:
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #63
70. That doesn't even attempt to refute what I said.
HCR would have died if they insisted on a PO. Support for a PO, etc etc etc does not change any of that.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #70
73. Well... At Least You Got THAT Right...
Neither party apparently gives a shit what the citizens of America want.

:shrug:
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #73
87. Perhaps. Or perhaps 56/60ths of our party did care what the citizens of America wanted, and 1 didn't
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 09:50 PM by BzaDem
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:01 AM
Response to Reply #70
118. We don't know what would have happened since there was no vote ...
We don't know what would have happened if they came out strong for single payer and then accepted PO as a compromise. We don't know what would have happened if they twisted arms like removing Lieberman's chairmanships. We don't know what would have happened if they actually fought.

But they didn't and now rather than making the republicans look obstructionist they've made the dems look weak.

And it's going to hurt us all over the next two years.
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Me. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #51
64. Ignorance Is Never Bliss
They were as wrong as your post and the fact that neither of you know it is a good part of the problem
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #42
68. it was a spot on Rant! and very passionate! eom
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leeroysphitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:33 PM
Response to Original message
46. Why do I suddenly feel like the "Christ Figure" in a George Lucas film? n/t
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:38 PM
Response to Original message
48. Posts from FDL like these are not part of the solution. They are part of the problem.
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 06:40 PM by BzaDem
Obama is simply identifying the problem. Kudos to Obama for saying what needs to be said.

It is amazing how much you can tell about a person based on how they react to this. Most have in most places have been saying, well, duh. Not voting IS irresponsible in ALL cases. Especially when the alternative is as bad as it currently is.

But some people are like "if you keep hurting my feelings like this, I might just say "hrmph" and not vote! I need to be coddled and convinced to vote! waaaaah!" It shows a real difference between voters who were serious about change and non-voters who simply pay lip service to change, and care more about their personal feelings than their countrymen.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #48
53. You Are WRONG !!!
It's just that some of us thought that at long last we'd finally be able to vote FOR something!

Now after two years of molly-codling the Republicans in an attempt to gain "bi-partisanship", we are about to have our asses handed to us.

So NOW, we have to go out and save the Country's and the Democrat's bacon by voting AGAINST something... namely the right-wing, racist, sexist, classist, crazy fucks, lest they gain some actual power in Congress.

I'm voting Dem again this go round, it's just that I didn't think I'd have to do so out of desperation!

So once AGAIN... we have to hold our noses and cast our ballots...



:shrug:
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #53
71. After what Obama has accomplished, the fact that you would think you had to "hold your nose"
is a perfect example of a total disconnect between reality and a small subset of the progressive base.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #71
77. Um... You Are Aware, Are You Not, That Barack Obama Is NOT On The Ballot This Year ???
Just wondering.

:shrug:
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #77
88. Yes, though what Obama has done is clearly linked to what members of Congress have done. n/t
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Me. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #77
95. Very Little Awareness Going On There, If Any
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #71
86. Supporting the repressive coup in Honduras was real enough.
The black site the Red Cross found at Bagram, also real. Insurance act written by the industry and progressives shut out, ditto. Expansion of Bush police powers, real enough. Renewing the embargo on Cuba for no reason, that happened. Embarrassing foot dragging on DADT and gratuitous slams at marriage equality, check. FBI continuing to harass peaceful activists. oh yeah. Promoting fake reform in our schools at the expense of the teaching profession and the community relationships that makes schools work, yep. Leaving Don Siegelman twisting in the wind but getting Stevens off the hook for real and massive corruption, yuppers.

You know, all those things happened, in reality and everything. I don't have one reason to hold my nose in 2012, I'll be at a buffet and so will a whole lot of people. And, btw, it's not us "whiners" here that you need to worry about. It's the posters that just go away and don't bother to tell you they're gone -- those are the people that should worry you.

Obama wasn't my first or even second choice, but when he got the nom, I backed him fully. And I'll be damned if this season, while I'm out in this barrio gotv for Barbara, I'll listen to him or anyone tell me I wasn't "serious" or that I'm out of touch with reality. As it is, I can't listen to anything out of Washington en vivo and do what I'm doing.

Small subset of the progressive base, my sainted granny. Save it.
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #86
91. "It's the posters that just go away and don't bother to tell you they're gone"
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 09:56 PM by BzaDem
Actually, both you AND those posters will be back. It's just a matter of time, how much political pain you can inflict on yourself before the survival instinct kicks in, how much of the remainder of the New Deal will be destroyed before you are forced to ACTUALLY grapple with reality (as opposed to posting falsehood after falsehood about how you are wronged and aggrieved), etc. Generally, people like you are hurt by Republican policies far more than people who support Democrats, so your window of delusion will likely be short.

Though I do wonder why you are still here (until your point of capitulation). See website title. There are plenty of irrelevant Naderite websites that would likely be happy for a new member.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #91
99. Another great gotv bumpersticker: "Your window of delusion will be shorter".
LOL

Good luck with that.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #99
138. Some people are their own worst enemies.
Watched the same mentality at work in the 90's. Back then it was an eye opener. This time it was expected. The Democratic Party is nothing if not predictable. :)
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #138
193. Well, I've never heard "naderite" used as code for "you stupid social justice voters"
before. Maybe I just wasn't listening.

lol

And it's funny because at this point, I'm not collapsing the people here who use Obama to justify their anti-social behavior with the party. The party has problems but being awash with bullies isn't one of them, afaik.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #91
144. My question to you would be : why are you here? If you so dislike discussion on truth?
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 10:40 AM by flyarm
The VAST majority of the people on this web site are asking questions , many angry or disturbed at being attacked by this administration. The VAST majority who post at this web site are liberals and progressives. It is Liberals and Progressives who are being verbally attacked by this administration.

If you do not agree with the discussions going on here at Du and you seems to have disdain for those discussing being thrown under the bus by the Obama Administration..just why are you here??

To bully us??????

To demoralize people for the demoralization we already feel??

Just what is YOUR purpose here?????????? to agitate?? GOTV??? ( yeah you are doing a SWELL job at that! :sarcasm: )

To slow the flow of Information or to spew Propaganda..or to continue the attacks on we Liberals and Progressives?

Just what is your reason for being here??..I would sincerely like to know..since you brought that subject up to another Great DU'er..you should have no problem answering that question.

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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #48
59. Scream in the primaries ... line up for the general.
What is so hard to understand about this point?

If your preferred candidate lost in the D primary ... you have a choice ... vote R, vote D, stay home.

Only one of these helps to hold the ground on any progress to date.

The GOP, given the chance, would kill Social Security, medicare, and the DOE ... and gut almost all regulations.

Sulking in the General Election is not an option.

Fight for your candidate in the primary. If they lose to another Dem, suck it up. Figure out WHY your candidate did not win, and try again.

If you let the GOP win by default, you set the country back.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #48
69. You are wrong and parroting some kind of BS that has been fed you!
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 09:23 PM by flyarm
this is what FDL did today ..I got it in my email this morning!




act@firedoglake.com
Hi xxxxx,

All too often, those who proclaim to have strong principles regarding free speech or domestic spying or torture when "the other guy" is in power abandon those concerns when it's their own party's turn at the helm.

Not Wisconsin Senator Russ Feingold. He's the rare person of conviction who stood alone and heroically voted against the Patriot Act when every other member of the Senate voted "aye." And his principles don't change just because there's a new resident at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

But Russ is in a tough battle. He's trailing his well-funded opponent by a wide margin. If Russ loses, while party bosses on both sides of the aisle can conspire to keep Joe Lieberman in the Senate, it sends a message to every member of Congress that there is no popular support for those who put themselves on the line in defense of our first amendment rights.

Our country can't afford for Russ Feingold to lose this election.

Please donate $5 or more to Russ Feingold and fight for our civil liberties. It's critical we keep his voice in the Senate. Click here to donate:

http://action.firedoglake.com/feingold

Feingold voted against TARP under Bush, and he voted against it again under Obama. He can't call on the fat cat bankers to fund his race like so many others can.

There's only one yardstick, and Russ applies it to everyone.

Feingold's opponent, Ron Johnson, has more "flexible" principles. He's a millionaire installed by the party chieftans over the objections of local activists. When Wisconsin activists asked Johnson whether he supported the Patriot Act, he said "I wasn't overly concerned with George Bush in power. I'm a little more concerned about the Patriot Act when you have Barack Obama."

Johnson, like Joe Lieberman, is no fan of free speech either. Lieberman famously said that "in matters of war, we undermine presidential credibility at our nation's peril." Likewise, Johnson said that Feingold was "undermining our troops" by speaking out against the war in Afghanistan, and that it was "extremely harmful to our nation."

Russ needs your help. Can you please donate $5 or more to help Feingold fight back against his Lieberman-lite opponent?

http://action.firedoglake.com/feingold

Russ Feingold is the best defense of civil liberties in the Senate. His defeat would be an enormous blow to the tenuous wall holding back things like biometric ID programs that Joe Lieberman's Department of Homeland Security is simply salivating over.

The time is coming when Americans will have to decide: do we stand and fight for our right to privacy and individual freedom, or do we capitulate to the continued erosion of our civil liberties?

If you choose "fight," then join me in fighting for Russ Feingold. Click here to donate $5 or more to Russ Feingold now.

http://action.firedoglake.com/feingold

Thank you for standing up for our civil liberties, and for all you do.

Best,

Jane Hamsher
FDL Action PAC


edit to add: What did you do today to get a DEM elected ??????????
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
49. One could justifiably ask the same of FDL and the answer would be "yes, obviously." nt
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ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:44 PM
Response to Original message
52. Carter: Malaise . . . Obama: Whiners
Same old shit, recycled badly.
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Ruby the Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 06:57 PM
Response to Original message
56. Rahm: "Fucking Retarded". Gibbs: "(get) drug tested"
Edited on Tue Sep-28-10 06:57 PM by Ruby the Liberal
Yeah, I'll vote, but as long as y'all keep insulting me, I will not make the first call or knock on the first door and don't even think of asking me for a donation.

Don't piss on the base. It induces motivationless nausea.
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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:05 AM
Response to Reply #56
109. this is the 1st election cycle I'm sitting out. I'm voting, just not for DINOs anymore
They can call us all the names they like and see how it works out for them. The party, both at the national & state level, worked hard to undermine the candidacy of a well qualified progressive candidate in my state, even resorting to rovian dirty smears. It might have won them the primary, but it cost them support from this household and many of my friends.
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Ruby the Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #109
209. I hear you - loud and clear.
Arrgle!
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MannyGoldstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #56
114. Is my drug test covered by health insurance "reform"?
Or was that bargained away?
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #114
147. and what about Drug rehab?? whats the point of the test if there is no rehab! eom
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Edweird Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 07:01 PM
Response to Original message
57. I'm fairly certain that none of this is an accident. They know what they are doing.
It's intentional.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #57
72. ++++ exactly! eom
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PFunk Donating Member (687 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 07:13 PM
Response to Original message
58. Oh Crap, even Bush didn't do this.
And you wonder why the democratic base is getting more, and more disenchanted. I think it's now apparent to many that it's clear that we now have a deeply divided party. While I do think the dems will rally (in many cases hold their nose doing so) and vote in 2010. I also believe that unless the Obama dems work to get the base on their side afterward you'll also start to see a creation of a democratic third party afterward as a counter to Obama's and/or DLC democratic party.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #58
74. wait till you see the numbers on women tommorrow! Dem women..ugly! eom
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riverdale Donating Member (881 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:50 AM
Response to Reply #58
153. an idea
I don't even think it is the party that is divided. The elected Dem politicians are the ones who are divided- divided against the will of those who elected them. Pretty much any Democratic or lib voter that you talk to is in agreement on the major issues ... it is our politicians who vote against these wishes.
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mix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 07:28 PM
Response to Original message
62. I'll vote Democrat and for Obama again.
But I strongly dislike the center-right focus of his policies, particularly in education, LGBT rights, health reform, the economy, and foreign policy.

Yet the Republicans would be undoubtedly worse, as bad as this administration has been from for progressives.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
75. FDL makes baby Jesus cry!
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #75
79. ROFLMAO !!!
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

:toast:

:hi:
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #79
100. Looks like somebody doesn't like Rod and Todd! n/t
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #75
85. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
ncteechur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
81. FDL is whiner central.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #81
90. After about ten more repetitions, that word will be completely empty
of meaning and ready to go on a tee shirt, "don't blame me, I whined about the Obama WH".



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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 04:02 AM
Response to Reply #81
106. "Whiner", how original. Is that your new toy this week?
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scheming daemons Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 09:56 PM
Response to Original message
92. How is this guy able to type while nailed to a cross?
...
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #92
94. Voice Activated Droid
Very cool.

Don't ask me how Jesus bites his own nails.

:evilgrin:
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-28-10 10:03 PM
Response to Original message
96. I really think they want to lose Congress.
The Democratic Party's leadership has had to do some really laughable contortions to maneuver themselves into losing positions since 2006. A Republican majority in at least one house of Congress would sure make it easier to sell their "compromise" bullshit.
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democracy1st Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 03:51 AM
Response to Reply #96
104. agree
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #96
131. I agree.
That "We don't have the votes..its ALL Joe Lieberman's fault" bullshit didn't work on anyone who can count.
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harun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #96
185. So so sad that you are correct.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 03:01 AM
Response to Original message
103. K&R&LOL.
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 04:01 AM
Response to Original message
105. The "hippie punching" will stop when they stop carrying water for Rethuglicans.
I don't expect it to stop.

They're our Tea Party, our extremists, our boundary pushers, and we need 'em.

The Rethuglicans are just now realizing what it's like to have a circular firing squad, as we've had it for close to (or over) 100 years, which is how we survived.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:46 AM
Response to Reply #105
115. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 06:22 AM
Response to Original message
108. 
Indeed, that is a strategy that isn't going to work. You don't win the enthusiasm of your troops by telling them they're being unreasonable. You tell them "we have to get things out of congress, and if you help us maintain solid majorities we have a better chance at doing that."

I want Democrats to win in November, but the president and his staff need to get their heads on right. This penchant for trashing the left will go nowhere. They're not getting more support from the middle because of it. They're just pissing off the voters they have to have. It's a combination of hubris and naivete.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:46 AM
Response to Reply #108
149. or better yet..HEY STUPID..QUIT YOUR WHINING AND VOTE FOR ME!
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:22 AM
Response to Original message
113. .
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eShirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
116. apparently we prefer when our politicians bother to use a little lube
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:00 AM
Response to Original message
117. Here's Rahm "Crowing" about preserving PRIVATIZED health care system ... !!!
Here's Rahm "Crowing" about preserving PRIVATIZED health care system ....

Here is the quote: In a Thursday interview, White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel argued that rather than recoiling against Obama, business leaders should be grateful for his support on at least a half-dozen counts: his advocacy of greater international trade and education reform open markets despite union skepticism; his rejection of calls from some quarters to nationalize banks during the financial meltdown; the rescue of the automobile industry; the fact that the

overhaul of health care preserved the private delivery system

; the fact that billions in the stimulus package benefited business with lucrative new contracts, and that financial regulation reform will take away the uncertainty that existed with a broken, pre-crash regulatory apparatus.


http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=B2F85DDF-18 ...


Let's point to the true culprit --

and the truth of just who is "irresponsible" with citizens' lives --

and that's our elected officials who have sold themselves to corporations -- !!



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Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:27 AM
Response to Original message
121. I don't owe the current Democratic party a blessed thing
and I'll vote, or not vote, as I please.

Biden and Obama can lecture all they want.......

:shrug:
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #121
128. you darn well better vote young lady, or you're never getting another one of these!
:hi:
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Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:06 AM
Response to Reply #128
137. Banky!!!
Hi sweetie, how are you?

I'm back in the country and back at work (yuck!!).

Hugs for you....

:hug:
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #137
204. getting steroid injections into my spine. it's great fun.
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 05:47 PM by dionysus
i spent 2 of the last 3 weeks in watertown, ny, on business. hell of a town. really.

how was the trip?
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Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-30-10 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #204
215. Ohhh, that sounds painful!!!
I hope that you are alright!!!

The trip was great, even though I need a vacation from the vacation. I'm sooo tired. LOL!!!

Double hugs for you for all your suffering.

Feel better!!

:hug: :hug:
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Wednesdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:46 AM
Response to Original message
126. IMHO, they're toying with us
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 08:48 AM by Wednesdays
WH people say shit like that once in a while, just to get the base riled up.

Boy, did it ever work! :rofl:



(edited for clarity)
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on point Donating Member (613 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
127. We will fight for you, when you fight for us!! Stop capitulating before the discussion even starts!
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RandomThoughts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 08:50 AM
Response to Original message
130. Concerned the Hippy might be left standing.
That is a funny line, side note, it is a really bad context, it assumes people, any person, woul kneel to any other person.

Side note, I am still standing. Although I think the Democrats do better in legislation, with a ways to go.
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2critical Donating Member (51 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 09:58 AM
Response to Original message
135. The beatings will continue until morale improves. EOM
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
139. How Dems react to Obama right now is pretty much meaningless.
He has their support by a wide margin, and they know it. It's Independents that should be the Party's concern, and that's looking rather spotty right now. Winning on just Dem votes alone is going to be difficult, and Independents seem to be turning their backs on Dems in droves after having come to our side in 2008.
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Hamlette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
141. for ppl who whine as much as Jane et al, they sure can't take a little push back
and as for the WH being crazy, takes one to know one.

Some of you here might not think so but to the vast majority of us, Jane seems seriously unhinged.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #141
152. Exactly. They sure can dish it out. But ask them to take just a little bit?
And they whine even harder.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #141
155. and since you are in a very small minority here..most don't care who you think is unhinged.
and since your shit lists change daily, and with every dose of truth..and those you deem anything , only pushes more of the Majority around here.. further away from you and what you think!

Oh and the majority under the bus, don't give a rats ass what you think!

Ok..Now..parrrrr-ty at the back of the bus!!!!!!!!! :party: :party: :toast: :toast: :party: :party:

B Y O P..bring your own pony!! :party: :party: :toast: :toast: :party: :party:

:woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Hamlette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #155
179. what are you talking about?
I'm not sure I'm a minority here but I bet any amount of money I'm in the majority of the party.

And my shit list doesn't change daily. I've thought Jane was off her rocker since pretty early on in the health care debate. Teaming up with Mr. Bathtub was just part of it.

Not exactly sure why you made this about me personally. I'm sort of shocked you even know who I am or that you think you know who might or might not be on my shit list.

You do know that "the other side" would do away with social security, medicaid and medicare, public education, unemployment benefits, "everything not specifically in the constitution" if they got their way don't you? I'd rather not see that happen.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #141
156. You're making the Op's point, the president in a shoving match
with his own voters.

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Hamlette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #156
176. not all of his voters
I'd hazzard a guess that the President's approval rating on DU is different from democrats in general.

I've been disa ppointed in some thing Obama has done but the constant criticism from some quarters wears me down.

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #176
191. DU is a very interesting place. The last survey showed
there is a majority of middle class white middle aged suburban women here, a demographic that the parties fight over constantly. The other really interesting thing about DU is that it leads. If an issue crops up here, it will crop up out there in a week, a month, sometimes later. DU doesn't seem to be vastly to the left of most Democrats but just a little big ahead in addressing any particular issue, on the whole.

And yeah, constant criticism is exhausting. I agree.
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Deadgnome Donating Member (87 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:30 AM
Response to Original message
142. So....
They just gave me a choice, piss cake or shit pie. I think I'd rather starve at this point and maybe eat some Greens.
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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
146. It's like hes not taking any of this seriously
I understand "stop whining, get over it, wake up and get in gear" perfectly. If he had addressed our concerns and tried to explain I wouldn't be as pissed. Instead he just stump speaks all over the place telling us off at every opportunity. Screw that, he's not motivating me. At this point I have him on ignore and only listen or read anything he says when someone else recommends it.

I can help my local candidates without his nasty input, thank you very much.
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
150. More trolling from Fuck Democrats Liberally
:eyes:

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Techn0Girl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #150
170. Grow up - educate yourself.
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #170
172. You first
:eyes:
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
151. He knows you are not going to vote for him
If you don't give him a shred of credit for what he's done, he knows that. He's trying to appeal to the reasonable people in the middle, showing them that the blogosphere is not in charge of his campaign.

There was nothing he could say to get the left blogosphere vote. They are determined to let the Republicans win just to punish him for not doing enough, under conditions which make that unreasonable.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #151
154. So basically, you are saying the article is right,
that Obama is beating up on the left for political purposes.
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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #151
157. I doubt that. He knows we'll vote for him in spite of it. He's been mislead
and so apparently have you. Stop with the insults, you and Obama should know better, the fact that neither of you do speaks volumes about your people skills. He doesn't belong in that office if he can't comprehend that much.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #151
208. And Once Again... OBAMA IS NOT ON THE BALLOT !!!
And if he is in your area, please report that to your local voting officials.

:rofl:
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WatchWhatISay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
160. I would really like to see us have another option for 2012
I can't believe I am saying that, but it is the truth.
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bkozumplik Donating Member (391 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #160
181. because that would make our leaders really carry the torch
instead of just pretending to.
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Evasporque Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
162. Oh dear I guess I am voting Republican now....
NOT

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greiner3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
166. I see that the nay sayers to the OP;
Are being careful not to say that they would endorse another political party or any sort of post against the DU rules.

Just saying.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
167. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
democrank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
171. K & R
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DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
173. K&R n/t
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
175. I don't mind that Obama said that to progressives, but I do mind
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 12:45 PM by JDPriestly
that he does not say it to the Blue Dogs. They are the problem. Progressives support Obama's most idealistic proposals. It's the Blue Dogs that hold him back. Our beef is not with Obama's program but with the fact that he is not getting his program done because he is too soft on the Blue Dogs.

That's what Obama does not seem to understand. We back him on what he says he will do. We want him to push the Blue Dogs a bit harder.

What's with Landrieu putting a hold on an Obama appointee? That's the kind of thing that progressives do not do to Obama. The Blue Dogs do.

Progressives have been trying to support and work with Obama. It's the Blue Dogs that need to be chastised.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

That link is to an item regarding Landrieu's hold. Obama needs to speak to the nation about why he has the hold on oil drilling of the Gulf.

He needs to respond immediately to actions like that on the part of Republicans and Blue Dogs -- to the specific actions -- and not just say in general that the Republicans are blocking his agenda with "No" votes.

It's part of his job to sell Americans on his agenda. He needs to do that a lot better.
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bkozumplik Donating Member (391 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
180. what would get me back into the fight:
Is an apology. A real one.
I want Obama to say, I should have fought for the public option. The financial reform bill sucks and my policy makers are too corporate focused. I fucked up in reaching out to the Right for so long and so much. I should have had more of a focus on reducing the military footprint. I should pay some attention to civil liberties and privacy, because they are important. I should not let my people badmouth progressives and I shouldnt either. I should tell you whats going on. Ledbetter should have had some teeth, or should have had *something*.
I fucked up and I'm sorry, but I still want to do this.

I want him to acknowledge that his goals are my goals, and that we are on the same page as to what needs to get done.
If thats a pony, then fine. I want a pony. Its not too much to ask.
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BlueJac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
189. I don't like voting for sellout Dems all the time.............
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 02:27 PM by BlueJac
I am fucking tired of it. They sell out on every issue because they have no nut sacks, and are really Republican lite. The Democrats of old are all gone and the world is in a tail spin and will not stop. Milton Friedman will not let it........Free trade baby. I voted for change and all I got was attitude and lip service from another worthless free trading, war mongering, phony Democratic president. The truth hurts Obama, stick that in your "whine" glass!
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mistertrickster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 03:14 PM
Response to Original message
192. Actually, seeing the entire passage, the "buck up" sentiment makes more sense.
Edited on Wed Sep-29-10 03:18 PM by mistertrickster
"Change is hard" is absolutely right.

Now is no time to quit . . .

On edit--I think that Obama's biggest mistake was not using the OFA to mobilize the base that elected him. When we got the word to organize house parties to discuss health care, we did. We had meetings with 75 people there. Then . . . nothing . . .

He stood by and watched the astro-turf Tea-baggers steal the headlines and take the initiative.

But that was a mistake and that does not mean we should take our ball and go home.
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Drunken Irishman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-29-10 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
196. It's funny how FDL has spent the last two years dogging Pres. Obama...
And yet Jane Hampsher gets her panties in a bunch over Obama saying 'buck up'. Maybe it's time she looks into a thong.

What I love is that nowhere in that article did Pres. Obama come close to the same type of contempt you see toward him from the Huffington Post, FDL and a great deal of people here on DU. Yet he's now lost his mind because he's telling the Democrats they can't sit this one out.

Am I living in a bizarro universe?

Did any of you actually read the article? Or are you going to do what the Republicans have done and nitpick a few phrases from it to make it a point in attacking the President?

Whatever floats your boat, I guess. But why prove Obama's point? Once again, out of an entire article that was more in depth than anything we've ever seen from a sitting president, and the left chooses to focus in on this one little aspect to whine about.

Way to show the White House they're wrong! :rofl:

Continue whining, folks. We'll continue carrying YOUR water while you sit on the ground and mope.
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RandomThoughts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-30-10 05:03 AM
Response to Reply #196
213. Mope?? Not doing that.
Edited on Thu Sep-30-10 05:59 AM by RandomThoughts
To much to do.

Spartans!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RQm37K-clg


you have to ignore the race filter, the class filter, and the cultural filter LOL Also ignore the eugenics filter. Happens when fighting in the shade sometimes.

I posted a couple days ago about how some use the tentacle mouth symbolism in many films, it is in that film also, with the chain mail face shield over the bad guys in that film

Side note, boy girl, has nothing to do with gender, many of the 'Spartans' include many women singers, in the telling of the story, and personally I am glad their music was around during difficult times in my life. :loveya: In my view, the real few against.

And fighting is sharing better thoughts of kindness, without giving into despair. Which is not always easy.
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librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-30-10 01:34 PM
Response to Original message
218. can anyone here spell "malaise?"
I thought you could.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-30-10 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
219. Public option. Openness. End tax-cuts. Lots of words were spoken.
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