Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

"Why has the Obama Admin built its ed agenda on the failed strategies of No Child Left Behind?"

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:29 AM
Original message
"Why has the Obama Admin built its ed agenda on the failed strategies of No Child Left Behind?"

NEA Friend of Education Diane Ravitch's Speech, Delivered at the 2010 Representative Assembly of the National Education Association, New Orleans, July 3, 2010.



Well, it’s kind of amazing that this convention is being held in New Orleans. I was, just a few minutes ago, interviewed by documentary filmmakers who said to me, “Well, don’t you know that New Orleans is proving a new model?” The new model consists of wiping out public education and firing the unions, and it’s spreading across the country. And I said, “God forbid.” I pointed out to them what we all used to know, which is that public education is the backbone of this democracy, and we cannot turn it over to privateers.

Since my book appeared in early March, I have started out on what I thought would be a conventional book tour, but it really has turned into a whistle-stop campaign. I have been to 40 different cities and districts. I have another 40 planned starting in September. I talked to union members, to school board members, to administrators, to left-wing think tanks, to right-wing think tanks. I have met with high-level White House staff. I have met with about 40 members of Congress. I would say that I have met so far about 20,000 teachers, and after today I think I am going to increase it to 30,000.

And in all of this time, aside from the right-wing think tanks, I haven’t seen met a single teacher who likes what’s happening? I haven’t met a single teacher who thinks that No Child Left Behind has been a success. I haven’t met a single teacher who thinks that Race to the Top is a good idea.

Wherever I went, I met teachers who understood that there is a rising tide of hostility to teachers, to the teaching profession, and to teachers’ unions. You see it almost daily in the national media, in Newsweek magazine with its dreadful cover story about firing teachers, and Time magazine with awful columns, and in the New York Times and the Washington Post and all of the major media.

And as I talk to teachers, by the end of my talk, I hear the same questions again and again: What can we do? How can we stop the attacks on teachers and on the teaching profession? Why is the media demonizing unions? Why does the media constantly criticize public schools? And why does it lionize charter schools? Why is Arne Duncan campaigning with Newt Gingrich? Why has the Obama Administration built its education agenda on the punitive failed strategies of No Child Left Behind?

And teachers want to know, as you want to know, who will stand up for public schools and their teachers? At every appearance that I’ve made, teachers would come up to me afterward and they would say to me, “Stand up for us. Speak for us. Be our voice wherever you go.” And I promised that I would, and I have.

I promised to speak out against No Child Left Behind. It’s a disaster. It has turned our schools into testing factories. Its requirement that 100 percent of students will be proficient by the year 2014 is totally unrealistic. Any teacher could have told them that. Thousands and thousands of schools have been stigmatized as failing schools because they could not reach a goal that no state, no nation, and no district has ever reached. By setting an impossible goal, No Child Left Behind has delegitimized public education and created a rhetoric of failure and paved the way for privatization.

I will continue to speak out against high-stakes testing. It undermines education. High-stakes testing promotes cheating, gaming the system, teaching to bad tests, narrowing the curriculum. High-stakes testing means less time for the arts, less time for history or geography or civics or foreign languages or science.

We see schools across America dropping physical education. We see them dropping music. We see them dropping their arts programs, their science programs, all in pursuit of higher test scores. This is not good education.

I have been told by some people in the Obama Administration that the way to stop the narrowing of the curriculum is to test everything. In fact, the chancellor in Washington, D.C., the other day announced she plans to do exactly that. That means less time for instruction, more time for testing, and a worse education for everyone.

In speaking out, I have consistently warned about the riskiness of school choice. Its benefits are vastly overstated. It undercuts public education by enabling charter schools to skim the best students in poor communities. As our society pursues these policies, we will develop a bifurcated system, one for the haves, another for the have-nots, and politicians have the nerve to boast about such an outcome.

Public schools, as I said before, are a cornerstone of our democratic society. If we chip away at support for them, we erode communal responsibility for a vital public institution.

Teachers are rightly worried about the Race to the Top. I pledged to keep asking again and again why a Race to the Top replaced equal educational opportunity. Equal educational opportunity is the American way. The race will have a few winners and a lot of losers. That’s what a race means.

Race to the Top encourages states to increase the number of privately managed charters, to pass laws to evaluate teachers by test scores, to promote merit pay, and to agree to close or privatize schools with low scores or to fire all or part of their staff. All of this is wrong.

And thank you for passing a resolution expressing no confidence in Race to the Top. Why expand the number of charters when research shows that on average they don’t get better results than regular public schools? Last year, a major evaluation showed that one out of every six charters will get better results, five out of six charters will get no different results or worse results than the regular public schools. A report released just a couple of weeks ago by Mathematica Policy Research once again shows charter middle schools do not get better results than regular public middle schools.

The National Assessment of Educational Progress, on whose board I served for seven years, has tested charter schools since 2003. In 2003, 2005, 2007 and 2009, charter schools were compared to regular public schools and have never shown an advantage over regular public schools. Charter schools, contrary to Bill Gates, are not more innovative than regular public schools. The business model and methods of charter schools is this — longer school days, longer hours, longer weeks, and about 95 percent of charter schools are non-union.

Teachers are hired and fired at will. Teachers work 50, 60, 70 hours a week. They are expected to burn out after two or three years when they can be replaced. No pension worries, no high salaries. This is not a template for American education.

If we pursue the path of privatization and deregulation, we better keep in mind what happened with the stock market in 2008. And to those who tout the benefits of vouchers and charters, I want you to point out this example to them, of Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Milwaukee has had charters and vouchers now for almost 20 years. Twenty years with vouchers, almost 20 years with charters.

They have seen a steadily declining enrollment in the public schools, and meanwhile research now shows that African-American students in Milwaukee, the supposed beneficiary of all of this choice, have test scores on the National Assessment of Educational Progress, test scores that are below those of their African-American peers in Mississippi and Louisiana.

There was no rising tide. Choice promoted no rising tide, and no boats were lifted. While all of this money was invested in choice, there were no benefits to the students.

The Race to the Top plan to use test scores to evaluate teachers is a very bad idea, badly implemented. Legislatures should not decide how to evaluate teachers.

SB6 was wrong in Florida. Thank you to the Florida Education Association and to all the parents and friends who stood with you who defeated that pernicious piece of legislation. And thanks to you for persuading Governor Charlie Crist to do the right thing by vetoing it. Now you have got to make sure that whoever is the next governor will veto it again if it dares to come back again.

191 is wrong in Colorado. Sorry to say that it was passed. It was signed into law, and the teachers may stand to be fired because the test scores didn’t go up consistently. And these are matters that are, in many cases, beyond their control. Teachers should be judged by professional standards and not by a political process. Research does not support evaluating teachers by test scores.

Students are not randomly assigned to classes. Teachers’ so-called effectiveness fluctuates depending on which students happen to be in a teacher’s class. The single most reliable predictor of test scores is poverty, and poverty, in turn, is correlated to student attendance, to family support, and to the school’s resources.

And perhaps we should begin demanding that school districts be held accountable for providing the resources that schools need. Just like No Child Left Behind, Race to the Top requires and pressures districts to close low-performing schools. The overwhelming majority of low-performing schools enroll students in poverty and students who don’t speak English and students who are homeless and transient. Very often, these schools have heroic staffs who are working with society’s neediest children. These teachers deserve praise, not pink slips. Closing schools weakens communities. It’s not a good idea to weaken communities. No school was ever improved by closing it.

You know, a lot of teachers don’t pay attention to the national scene. They are busy teaching kids. They don’t pay attention to what’s happening in Washington. But when the Central Falls staff, the entire staff, was fired without a single teacher having an evaluation, the message went out that there is a new game of punishing teachers. And the message also went out when this was endorsed by Secretary Duncan and then reaffirmed by President Obama. This is not a good message.

We should thank our teachers, not fire them, not threaten them, and not close their schools.

Merit pay is another of the useless fads of our time. Merit pay has nothing to do with education. It destroys teamwork. It incentivizes teachers to compete with each other for money instead of collaborating for each other for the benefit of children.

Teachers need to share what they know and work towards one common goal — helping children and young people grow and develop. Merit pay will promote teaching to not very good tests. It may or may not improve scores, but it definitely will not improve education.

I have spoken out repeatedly to defend the right of teachers to join unions for their protection and the protection of the teaching profession. Teachers have a right to a collective voice in the political process. It’s the American way. I don’t see the Wall Street Journal or the Washington Post or the pundits complaining about the charter school lobby. I don’t see them complaining about the investment bankers lobby, or any other group that speaks on behalf of its members. Only teachers’ unions are demonized these days.

Currently, there is a campaign underway to eliminate tenure and seniority. To remove job protections from senior teachers would destroy the profession. Supervisors will save money by firing the most expensive teachers. Imagine a hospital staffed by residents and interns with no doctors. Bad idea.

Instead of the current wave of so-called reforms, we should ask ourselves how to deliver on our belief that every student in this nation should learn not only basic skills, but should have a curriculum that includes the arts, history, geography, civics, foreign languages, mathematics, science, physical education, and health. But instead of this kind of rich curriculum, all they are getting is a heavy dose of high-stakes testing and endless test preparation. And as the stakes increase for teachers and schools, there will be more emphasis on test prep and not what children need.

Policymakers have been far too silent about the role of the family. Teachers know that education begins at home, and that when families take responsibility, students are likely to arrive in school ready to learn. We need, not a Race to the Top, but a commitment to provide greater resources for those children who are in the greatest need. Schools and school districts continue to vary dramatically in their access to resources. The role of the federal government in education is to level the playing field, not to set off a competition for money. Nor do we expect the federal government to tell states and districts how to reform themselves based on the Chicago experience.

Around the world, those nations that are successful recognize that the best way to improve school is to improve the education profession. We need expert teachers, not a steady influx of novices.

We need experienced principals who are themselves master teachers. We do not need a wave of newcomers who took a course called “How to be a principal.” We need superintendents who are wise and experienced educators, not lawyers and businessmen.

The current so-called reform movement is pushing bad ideas. No high-performing nation in the world is privatizing its schools, closing its schools, and inflicting high-stakes testing on every subject on its children. The current reform movement wants to end tenure and seniority, to weaken the teaching profession, to silence teachers’ unions, to privatize large sectors of public education. Don’t let it happen!

So here’s a thought for NEA. Print up four million bumper stickers that say, “I am a public schoolteacher, and I vote — and so does my family.”

Do not support any political figure who opposes public education. Stand up to the attacks on public education. Don’t give them half a loaf, because they will be back the next day for another slice, and the day after that for another slice.

Don’t compromise. Stand up for teachers. Stand up public education, and say “No mas, no mas." Thank you.

http://www.substancenews.net/articles.php?page=1527#comments
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:46 AM
Response to Original message
1. Excellent speech on the failure known as NCLB and
the war on Teachers and the Public School System being waged by this administration.

Good question about why Arne Duncan is campaigning with Newt Gingrich also.

I rec'd this OP but incredibly someone had unrec'd it! It is astonishing that anyone would unrec this post after reading it.

:kick: and rec'd for the record. This OP is well worth reading.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:50 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. duncan is campaigning with gingrich? wow.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:13 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Yes, Gingrich joined Duncan and Sharpton to promote
this 'education reform' (privatization). That should tell people something. The Right has always favored destroying the Public School System. Gingrich must be in 7th heaven with this administration's cooperation to privatize the Education system. Republicans couldn't get it done, but here we are. This is not what I supported nor is it what Obama promised when he told teachers he would support them as they were the backbone of this country! Well, I guess his thinking 'evolved' on this issue also.

Arne Duncan, Al Sharpton and Newt Gingrich join forces

In an effort to push cities to fix failing schools and highlight the Obama administration's programs to reform public education, former House Speaker Newt Gingrich and civil rights leader Al Sharpton will join Education Secretary Arne Duncan on a tour of cities later this year.


Sharpton is just an idiot if he thinks this is the way to even the playing field on education. That, or he's hoping to get his hands on some of that 'Faith Based' money.

Who ever thought we would see many Republicans involved in this administration? And so few Progressives.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:34 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. omg. GINGRICH & SHARPTON are promoting the Democrats' ed reform package?
Well, that tells you something.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
44. And Jeb Bush. Yes, what it does to see this kind of rightwing
support is to confirm the worst of what we were thinking about the war on teachers and the public schools by this administration. What a tragedy. It's as if we were taken for fools and fell for it. Education is one of the most important issues for me and millions of others. I believed Obama's warm speeches and promises of support to teachers. I see now how people become cynical about politics and politicians. He is just another ordinary politician after all.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #44
66. jeb too? wow, just wow. jeb = major player in florida's school deform.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HowHasItComeToThis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 01:41 AM
Response to Reply #66
98. WANT GOOD STUDENTS???? EDUCATE THEIR PARENTS
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jeanpalmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 02:06 AM
Response to Reply #3
99. Gingrich is ok
But if Duncan ever aligns himself with Jane Hamsher, he's in trouble.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:44 AM
Response to Original message
5. The answer is simplicity tself: M-O-N-E-Y, BABY. What it don't get, I can't use.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Smarmie Doofus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 07:06 AM
Response to Original message
6. K and R...... and bookmarked. Folks who don't get what the fuss is all about...
... should start here.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
peekaloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
7. Kick
for the teachers.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Danger Mouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 07:45 AM
Response to Original message
8. President Obama's record on education is VERY disappointing, to say the least.
He isn't showing those of us who teach that he cares in the least about us. In fact, it feels like we're being treated like enemies.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seafan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:13 AM
Response to Original message
9. One of the ringleaders of the assault on public education? Jeb Bush.
And there's nothing on the immediate horizon to shut him down. Only us.



October 8, 2008, with more from this thread and this thread.


Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush (R) lavished praise on President Barack Obama’s education policies on Thursday, telling ABC News that the Democrat who succeeded his brother in the White House has broken from the teachers’ unions and should be applauded by conservatives.

“The fact of the matter is, the guy is on the right track, and his (Education) Secretary is as well,” said Bush.

.....

Shortly after Obama took office, Bush told the Wall Street Journal that the new president should break with an interest group allied with the Democratic Party.

“I hope it’s the teachers’ union,” said Bush.

Since Bush made those comments, union officials have alternately criticized and praised the new president’s education policies.

"It looks like the only strategies they have are charter schools and measurement," Randi Weingarten, president of the American Federation of Teachers, told the Washington Post last month. "That's Bush III."



Tampa Tribune: Jeb Bush leads move to reduce teachers union's influence, April 14, 2010





The following remarks from a speaker at the NEA last week perfectly illustrate for those who don't *get* why this overt assault on public education is so corrosive to our country.

(Hat tip to Hannah Bell for the link to this speech.}



NEA Friend of Education Diane Ravitch's Speech, Delivered at the 2010 Representative Assembly of the National Education Association, New Orleans, July 3, 2010



excerpt:

.....

SB6 was wrong in Florida. Thank you to the Florida Education Association and to all the parents and friends who stood with you who defeated that pernicious piece of legislation. And thanks to you for persuading Governor Charlie Crist to do the right thing by vetoing it. Now you have got to make sure that whoever is the next governor will veto it again if it dares to come back again.

.....

The current so-called reform movement is pushing bad ideas. No high-performing nation in the world is privatizing its schools, closing its schools, and inflicting high-stakes testing on every subject on its children. The current reform movement wants to end tenure and seniority, to weaken the teaching profession, to silence teachers’ unions, to privatize large sectors of public education. Don’t let it happen!

So here’s a thought for NEA. Print up four million bumper stickers that say, “I am a public schoolteacher, and I vote — and so does my family.”

Do not support any political figure who opposes public education. Stand up to the attacks on public education. Don’t give them half a loaf, because they will be back the next day for another slice, and the day after that for another slice.

.....





Teachers are the backbone of our country's future. They are under furious, untethered assault by privatization-driven jackals who want to destroy them.


It is yet another ramification of thirty years of right wing attacks on the middle class.



This is a massive wake-up call.







Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nashville_brook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 09:46 AM
Response to Reply #9
18. this is so true...these curriculum manufacturers in FL work 2 angles, education and prisons.
they're both captive audiences, and once their foot is in the door, they're set for life.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #18
36. yes and remeber the Bushes privatized the Prisons too...easy money..then they don't have to risk
the family fortunes in the stock market or our treasury or the euro..or any other foreign currency..

they get our tax dollars ..from the public schools and take trips to the Carib and hide those fortunes..

and your kids don't get an education..they get prepped to be cannon fodder in our endless bogus wars!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
suffragette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #9
21. That Jeb Bush is entirely in favor of Duncan's direction
speaks volumes.

http://www.substancenews.net/articles.php?page=931§ion=Article
Jeb Bush (whom some are calling 'Bush III') begins campaign to become the next 'education president' while praising Obama and Duncan's corporate approach to 'school reform'


A massive wake-up call. indeed.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #21
35. newt gingrich as well. the architect of contract on america.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #21
37. Of course he is..it was his plan! eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #9
43. Obama should be ashamed to have the support of anti-public-
education warriors like Jeb Bush and Newt Gingrich. But apparently this is what he wants more than anything, approval from the Right. If it is not, he is doing nothing to convince people otherwise, from Health Care to Education and now to Social Security. The major privatizers of public funds appear to be very happy with this administration. And more and more of us, who believed that a Democratic majority would 'change' things, are becoming more and more disillusioned.

Ralph Nader is looking more and more prescient with each betrayal of democratic principles.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #43
56. because he too is against public anything
if he weren't he'd do something about our current crisis rather than sell us all out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #9
93. Excellent post, thank you!
In my wildest nightmares, I never thought that with a Democratic majority, we would see Jeb Bush of all people, support the policies of a democratic administration.

When I have time, I will try to recreate the reasons why this should scare people to death. Jeb Bush used NCLB to go after the money and the corruption that was uncovered, but now seems to be forgotten, was appalling.

It is an indictment of this administration's policies to have the stamp of approval of one of the most infamous beneficiaries of his brother's disastrous 'educational' program.

I am heartsick that we have been so betrayed.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seafan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #93
100. The Bushes have long benefited wildly from skimming money from education.
That they go to such laughable machinations, posing as people who care about our children's education, is a travesty. What they care about is funneling as much money away from public school education as they absolutely, positively, can, into their pockets.



Jeb Bush: 'For the record, Neil Bush is not involved in the FCAT business. Stop spreading rumors.' , April 15, 2010




Oh, yes, Jeb Bush benefited from Reading First......big time., September 12, 2007


More here, from March 9, 2007:

Federal officials who ran Reading First maintain that only curriculums including regular, systematic phonics lessons had the backing of “scientifically based reading research” required by the program.

But in a string of blistering reports, the Education Department’s inspector general has found that federal officials may have violated prohibitions in the law against mandating, or even endorsing, specific curriculums. The reports also found that federal officials overlooked conflicts of interest among the contractors that advised states applying for grants, and that in some instances, these contractors wrote reading programs competing for the money, and stood to collect royalties if their programs were chosen. /...../




Key Initiative Of 'No Child' Under Federal Investigation, WP, April 21, 2007


Jeb!'s Florida was a LARGE beneficiary of Reading First. Isn't that nice....., April 21, 2007



The Bush Family 'Reading First' Scam-- George, Jeb, Neil and Ma Bush, May 1, 2008


Once again, Jeb Bush's legacy of educational failure slaps Florida in the face., June 19, 2009





Florida's bruising fight over (Jeb Bush-designed) teacher merit pay bill, that Governor Crist ultimately vetoed, April 9, 2010




**Education** is a cash cow for the BFEE. Alongside oil.





Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:15 AM
Response to Original message
10. Because it was the law?
A new presidency does not cancel all previously existing laws. They still have to be enforced.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #10
20. He promised to reform it and has only made it worse
Obama put NCLB on steroids. I'm certain his daughters aren't attending a school that spends more time testing than teaching. He should be ashamed by what he is doing to our children in our once great public schools.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. Any President would have to enforce it as is
The daughters, that's a low blow - leave them out of it.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. No. Any president would reform it and make it better or lobby Congress to throw it out.
Any politician promoting any piece of legislation that impacts children should ask if it's good enough for their own children. And no thinking person (certainly no one as intelligent as our president) would want their own children educated in a school that focuses more on testing than teaching. That's just common sense and is nowhere near a low blow.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:42 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. The executive does not have the power to "make it better"
alone. Also, one thing at a time. Everyone has this thing about their pet issue, yet there is a problem economy and an oil spill. Lobbying on education is not up yet - so in the meantime, the existing laws have to be enforced.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #25
29. We just had 8 years of an administration that meddled in every piece of legislation they wanted to
You're naive if you don't believe Obama can change this horrific piece of legislation. One reason it's so bad is because of the changes to the original piece of legislation by the Bush administration.

Read Diane Ravitch's book. Or go to the Ed forum here and read our discussions.

You might call this a pet issue. I call it our children's future. And we have an obligation to do what's best for them in spite of what other issues are looming.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 02:48 PM
Response to Reply #25
38. Oh bullshit..and i have some oil drenched beaches for you! bullshit! eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fasttense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #25
45. "So in the meantime, the existing laws have to be enforced." Yeah like bush and Raygun
There are still laws against employers hiring illegal immigrants. Raygun and every President after has not enforced those laws.

There are laws against torture like water-boarding. There are laws against spying on the American people. There are antitrust laws against monopolies that have been ignored since Ann got her Rand on.

Seems to me every damn administration picks and chooses what laws they feel like following.

But suddenly, when President Obama gets into office, he can't pick and choose.

I never knew a President was so powerless.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AngryOldDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #25
60. What a patronizing, condescending piece of crap.
Edited on Sun Jul-11-10 05:36 PM by AngryOldDem
I normally just read these threads but this is just so over the top and begs for a reply.

So what you're saying is, educators need to be good little boys and girls and wait their turn, and STFU about what they see as a continuation and entrenchment of bad public policy.

In some circles, this Obamamantra of "hope and change" would be justly seen as "bait and switch." And people wonder why the frustration grows toward both Obama and the Democratic Party.

Never saw so many people so seemingly satisfied with the status quo after complaining eight years (or longer) about said status quo. Patience is running thin, and you have to be deaf, dumb, and blind not to recognize that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #60
68. +100.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #60
84. + another 100
:yourock: AngryOldDem :yourock:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #60
102. +1
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rpannier Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #25
65. That's really weird
Edited on Sun Jul-11-10 05:58 PM by rpannier
He's been out promoting his RTT at every opportunity

When Congress took out about 1/10 of the funding of RTT to save teacher's jobs, the White House has said they might veto it

He seems to find time in his schedule for that
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 06:35 PM
Response to Reply #25
67. no, even with control of both houses, democrats are powerless.
"lobbying on education is not up yet"

lol. this admin has been working on ed from day one. who are you kidding?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:33 PM
Response to Reply #25
83. So show me the guy is even trying. Any news stories of him meeting with teachers lately?
He kisses everybody else's ass, so get a clue. Obama hates teachers.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TBF Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #25
86. Admirable on your part, but
we know exactly how much attention will be paid to public education with Arne Duncan involved.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Angry Dragon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 12:08 AM
Response to Reply #22
91. It is not a low blow
That is a major problem in this country today.
Laws are passed that apply only to the ones on the bottom
and the top gets their own rules and laws.
If it is not good enough for them at the top,
then it is not good enough for the bottom.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 11:09 PM
Response to Reply #22
107. This is not a logical response.
If somebody tells you the president has changed it for the worse, claiming "any president would have to enforce it as is" doesn't make sense as a response.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #10
26. Oh really? So how do you explain "Race to the Top"?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
azul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #26
28. "Race to the Top" is a cruel hoax.
The Sea Pirates have come ashore in Texas in the quest for loot and are scaring people stupid.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #10
77. right on time
:puke:

RL
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:44 AM
Response to Original message
11. Raises the question as to why this administration as built so much of its agenda on the
failed/disastrous policies/agendas of the former administration? :shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #11
39. very good question and everyone with brains understands why!!
You know why..we just can't say why!

eom
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AngryOldDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #39
61. Exactly, n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:13 PM
Response to Reply #11
72. After running on "Change"?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:49 AM
Response to Original message
12. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:53 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. as opposed to the policies are "very curious indeed"...ok nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Divert! Deflect! Defend!
:rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Smarmie Doofus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. Take a look in the ed forum archives.
A lot of us have been yelling and screaming "fire"... since at least 2003.

The fact that other DUers are now catching on is something to be *happy * about and believe me I AM HAPPY.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #12
24. Teachers have been upset for years.
But our opinion is not respected. Even here on DU we are accused of defending the status quo. We've also been told here that we should be grateful we have jobs and should just shut up and quit complaining.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #12
27. People have been upset all along, there is no delayed reaction. Maybe you missed it.
Currently it's in the news again, so there are more threads at DU.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
14. Thank you
the k and the r
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nashville_brook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 09:43 AM
Response to Original message
17. b/c that's where the money is?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
19. Shame on AFT for not having Ravitch speak at our convention
I am hoping she will be coming here on her next book tour. I want to meet this wonderful woman and thank her.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #19
40. they were too busy seein how far they could shove Gates down your throats and how bad of a reaction
there would be...

seems most of you sucked it up and sat through his lies and bullshit..

and you will get what you are willing to take.

Now me ..I would have caused such a shit storm they would have had to use Broad's military boys to take me out!..and it would have been screaming the top of my lungs..I would never have sat and listened to that MTF'er!

And I won't have MSNBC on in my home because that fucker owns it! and I am not even a teacher..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #40
103. If I had stirred up a shitstorm there would have been consequences
I would have been escorted out while 3000 people booed me. I could handle that but I also would have brought negative attention to my local. I'm not willing to do that. Instead I chose to help pass out informational material about Gates and his foundation to the delegates and I took notes so I could share his comments. Since there was no media allowed on the convention floor that seemed like a responsible task. Creating a shitstorm is not always the best tactic.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 11:38 AM
Response to Original message
30. k & r
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nightrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
31. kick as high as I can, and rec heartily! Thank YOU!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
puzzlingpond Donating Member (86 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #31
32. done.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
33. Wonderful, Powerful Speech, One Which I Think Will Prove To Be Historic
Excellent is a complete understatement, WOW!!!!:patriot:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
34. Kick & Rec # 43 :)
:)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
41. Building on "FAILED" strategies ?
Failed?
In what sense?

These strategies, and ALL the other privatization scams have been 100% successful as designed....
directing the flow of public money into private pockets.

The people who design these programs couldn't care less about "Is our children learning"

The same is true about the "historic" Health Insurance Reform.
Never before has so much public money been redirected to "private" pockets.

NAFTA and "Free Trade"?....100% successful as designed.


The DLC New Team

(Screen Capped from the DLC Website)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #41
42. The bottom line trumps all! nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #41
46. "directing the flow of public money into private pockets" Exactly!
THIS is the lense through which all policies need to examined -- does policy x y or z funnel public money into private pockets or not.

If the result of particular policy IS the directing of public money (i.e. our tax dollars) into private pockets, then it ought rightly be opposed, period.

sw
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #41
49. +10
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 12:36 AM
Response to Reply #41
94. +1
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Spheric Donating Member (512 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
47. K&R and bookmarked. /nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
branders seine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
48. Same reason they've built every policy except their PR policy
on the existing neocon policy.

I think I'm prohibited for naming that reason here, but I think I am permitted to describe it as the "same."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:10 PM
Response to Original message
50. Because this man was not ready to be president.
He is certainly dreamy. And he can be very inspiring. But there are many things we need in a president right now that he is not.

I campaigned, voted, and supported him. Many hours of my life went to help get him elected. The fact that we only had him and a desiccated walking corpse to choose between is the symbol of what is wrong with our country. Our president was not ready, lacked the skills and knowledge for the job, and has fallen prey to the advice and direction of people who should not be in the position of serving our president. Were he not a Democrat, most of what this administration has done would be vigorously fought by almost all the people on this board. Had mccain won and tried this attack on education, the halls of congress would be filled with indignant Democrats.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KonaKane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #50
51. Would you have preferred McCain?
Honest question.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #51
57. you know the answer to that stupid question
it's not as if people had much of a choice now was there? That in itself is a sad reality...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #51
58. Did you even read my post?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #51
73. No, not honest-deliberately obtuse
One would not have preferred a Right Winger if they are disappointed that the person they voted for-who ran as a "change" from right wing politics-is, in fact ACTING like a Right Winger. Logic, please.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #51
79. Stupid, boring, overused response.
Edited on Sun Jul-11-10 08:22 PM by RetroLounge
Get some new material.

RL
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Smashcut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 01:17 AM
Response to Reply #51
97. Stuff your red herring - we would have preferred a more principled Democrat.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #51
104. That's the wrong question. The question is 'what would McCain
have done differently, on Health Care, on Education and now on Social Security, on Offshore drilling, on war?

We KNOW what he would have done on all of those issues because he told us in the campaign. Which is why people did not vote for him. They voted for the candidate who disagreed with him, on Mandated Insurance, on Privtizing Education and Social Securtiy on offshore drilling and on forever war.

Exactly how different would it have been? That's the real question people are beginning to ask.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. Because that is what he campaigned on.
It was something Ted Kennedy pushed. Stop pretending that the President's position is new.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #52
59. No, he didn't campaign on privatizing education and busting unions.
And defaming Ted Kennedy isn't your best angle here.

Say. Do you support more multiple choice tests for our children as a means of improving education? Do you favor using government programs to bust unions?

Are those two goals of yours? Did you support NCLB as it was implemented under bush?

Do you have an opinion about what should be done other than just whatever the white house says?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:24 PM
Response to Reply #59
81. Of course not
Edited on Sun Jul-11-10 08:24 PM by RetroLounge
all talking points in blue links, all the time.

cannot deviate from what the DLC tells him/her/them.

RL
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #52
62. Ted Kennedy wanted to improve education...
Edited on Sun Jul-11-10 06:15 PM by YvonneCa
...as does President Obama. From what I have read, Caroline Kennedy has also been quite involved in NYC schools. These people are my HEROES. I share their goal of finally getting education right. It is their method that is wrong.

Sadly, Mayor Bloomberg, Joel Klein, Tony Alvarado and others in the education reform movement have had the 'ear' of my heroes.There is more to be said about how to fix our school by educators who KNOW:

http://www.voiceofsandiego.org/people/q_and_a/article_cc1c3c76-809e-11df-aa3d-001cc4c002e0.html

http://www.booktv.org/Watch/11386/After+Words+Diane+Ravitch+The+Death+and+Life+of+the+Great+American+School+System+interviewed+by+Valerie+Strauss+Washington+Post.aspx


I would hope that all my Democratic party heroes are open-minded enough to hear ALL the voices...including educators. California is not NYC...or Chicago...or Washington DC. During Obama's campaign I listened intently for his view on education. He often talked about fixing our schools...my goal too...but expressed few details until after the election. His appointment of Duncan spoke VOLUMES.

The good news is, it is NOT too late for him to support teachers and get education reform right. I still have hope. ;)

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #62
90. Points for good intentions, demerits for execution.
I didn't say that the president hated children or made it his goal to ruin education. He may want to do wonderful things, but he lacks the knowledge or perception to see that the people he is entrusting this to are lying charlatans who, best scenario, don't know what they are doing or, more likely, have goals of their own that don't include making schools better for children. That was the point of my post. Our president - the one I worked my butt off for in his election - just doesn't have what is needed here.

Kennedy did want to improve education. He made the same fatal flaw that Obama is making now. He trusted the wrong people. Kennedy is a co-sponsor of the bill and shepherded it through the Senate. Kennedy wanted to reform education but he worked with the republicans to do so and the result was a bill that he supported with george bush and whose house sponsor was john boehner. We would have been better off with no bill than the bill that will go down as a part of Kennedy's legacy. Obama is following a similar course. The tragic error he is making will be linked to his name and administration forever. You can't make newt gingrich and bill bennet happy if you are doing the right thing.

I envy your hope. Mine has shriveled in disillusionment.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #90
105. I essentially agree with this. I have been called an idealist...
...often. That may be true. I understand the 'shriveling' and disillusionment. I hope you will try to hold on to your hope a little longer.;)



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #52
89.  Ted Kennedy never pushed the Arne Duncan plan and Teddy himself
knew what happened to NCLB was very bad. It was the worst compromise of his career.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #50
76. This should be an OP
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Reader Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
53. Awesome. Simply awesome.
I think I'm going to print it out and send it to various elected representatives!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Winston Wolf Donating Member (117 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
54. Kick and Recommended.
Thank you for the article. An under-educated public is far more malleable and subservient to authoritarian types, which is why I find it very alarming that the Obama Administration has not made an immediate and very sharp break with NCLB and other like policies.

After the Bush Administration's shredding of our basic civil rights, our future generations need to understand the dangers of not having basic civil rights like Habeas Corpus, freedom from cruel and unusual punishment, etc.

If we do not want to see our country dominated by a right wing fascist regime, we need a well educated public to combat all of the lies and distortions that bombard them on a daily basis.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
theaocp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
55. k & r
Excellent article and always remember to follow the money. Public education wants an educated public. Privatized education wants dinero. Think about this, too: if you knew you could make more money by having higher test scores, where would your price fall? Everybody's got a price.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
txlibdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:49 PM
Response to Original message
63. If not by students learning the material then how ARE teachers to be evaluated
Shall we just ask them if they're doing a good job? I'm sure even the worst teachers would give an honest answer even if that means demotion or getting fired. Having a "classroom observer" come in twice a year to evaluate a teacher is not working. When one out of three students drop out of school there is a problem with the education system in America.

Student test scores are a crude measure of a teacher's skill and knowledge but at least it's an objective measure. It is at least something.

Charter schools are an idiots answer to an Einstein level question. Thinking that just privatizing a failed system is going to fix it is ludicrous from the start. Privatized schools will still be run by the same Principals and school administrators that have failed to slow the decline in America's educational quality for several decades. It's just window dressing on a burning house.

The classroom paradigm is the problem. Individualized self-paced study is the only answer. Students must be made to understand that their education is their sole responsibility. Teachers should not be asked to pound learning into someone who neither wants it nor will work to obtain it. Teachers should be available for questions and to explain a particular point or concept but students must ultimately be in charge of their own learning.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. You're funny...
...:rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #63
69. no. student test scores, in aggregate, are a measure of class, pure & simple.
class/income/wealth is the factor which most closely correlates with student performance.

and there are obvious reasons for that.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #63
70. I can see by your post that you do not understand what
NCLB is all about. Teaching for testing is not learning. So how do you measure what a child is actually learning if all you do is test, test and test again. And all teachers can do in order to keep their students passing is to narrow the curriculum to correspond with the limited questions on these tests.

We are producing generations of ignorant people with this system. No time for actual learning, 'Race to the Top' of the test scores. It certainly has benefited Educational Test Publishers like Harcourt Brace, good friends of the Bushes, they've made millions. But as far as education goes, no teacher, no matter how good, can teach effectively when this road-block to learning is staring him/her in the face every day. Which is one reason why we are losing the best teachers and students are finishing school with hardly any knowledge at all.

And this, along with the for-profitizing of our educational system, was the goal, an ignorant population is much easier to control. Trained to take tests, NOT to think, they make excellent 'subjects' but not such good citizens.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fearless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:06 PM
Response to Original message
71. K&R! If things don't change soon, they'll feel it in their campaign's finances this fall
and into the foreseeable future. It's very hard to pull wool over the eyes of your nation's teachers.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
havocmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #71
75. I don't think they care anymore. We only give them chump change
compared to what their sugar daddy corporate bosses give them and their families. Money for campaigns. Money for cushy jobs. Our elected 'reps' and that includes the top tier, seem to be fully owned employees of other entities. Sure aren't working for the good of the American people.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fearless Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #75
85. K&R!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
EmeraldCityGrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:17 PM
Response to Original message
74. It sounds as if the administration is imposing the same principles and
methods to education that are utilized in Corporate American. There are no professions or
industries that will be exempt from this mindset. Privatization and Globalization are our greatest
threat. What's coming is truly frightening.

And to think there are those that fear Obama is a socialist...we should be so lucky.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Chisox08 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:22 PM
Response to Original message
78. Arnie Duncan loves NCLB
When he was CEO of the Chicago Public Schools he often talked about how great NCLB is. So when Obama pick Arnie I knew that there would be absolutely no change in the education system.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #78
87. Duncan DoNUT thinks he IS the President and Obama lets him believe it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:23 PM
Response to Original message
80. K&R
:hi:

RL
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 08:31 PM
Response to Original message
82. Beware of what you hoped for people, this goose of an administration is laying a
Edited on Sun Jul-11-10 08:32 PM by MichiganVote
big fat **** on students across this country.

Do I have a problem with greater curriculum choices for students? Heck no.

Do I have a problem with stringent standards? Nope.

Do I have a problem with testing?
Sometimes it helps. It can help identify students who are falling behind. But those are the curriculum tests---not the bogus state tests. Do I have a problem with accountability? Not as long as the same standards are applied to those worthless get rich quick bastards in Washington.

But when education, when learning, when our kids are forced to become a part of the equivalent of an American Idol game show Washington/Corporate carnival inspired travesty called Race To The Top, I have a problem.

I have never selected a president on the basis of one issue. Just goes to show you anything can and does change. The Obama game show has lost me when is comes to education.

Can't support this shit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-10 10:36 PM
Response to Original message
88. Thank you for posting this, Hannah Bell. Rec. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
senseandsensibility Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
92. It is awful to watch.
Thanks for continuing to post about this, and we need to wake up.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 12:37 AM
Response to Original message
95. K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 01:03 AM
Response to Original message
96. "A modern economic system demands . . .
Edited on Mon Jul-12-10 01:03 AM by snot
mass production of students who are not educated and have been rendered incapable of thinking."
– U.N.E.F. Strasbourg, On the Poverty of Student Life (1966), http://library.nothingness.org/articles/SI/en/display/4 .

K&R'd.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 09:33 AM
Response to Original message
101. kick
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-12-10 11:06 PM
Response to Original message
106. k
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mdmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-16-10 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
108. ..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed Apr 24th 2024, 07:12 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC