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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:11 PM
Original message
“Sometimes, the best thing to do in an oil spill is nothing,
Despite the agony of watching oil-sodden waters lap at pristine shores, our ham-fisted cleanups can do more harm than good, experts say.

Irving Mendelssohn, a Louisiana wetland ecologist, knows what won’t work if and when the oil slick in the Gulf reaches his marshy coastline.

Unfortunately, he’s not sure what will.

“The most important thing is that you don’t send hundreds of people walking into the wetlands, pushing that oil into the soil,” he said. “You can’t have people stomping around in their boots. And you don’t want machines like tractors pushing the oil into the soil. That would definitely kill the vegetation.”

snip

. . . Bioremediation, or breaking down the oil with bacteria, wouldn’t work well in Louisiana because the coastal wetlands are flooded with water, Mendelssohn said. Setting the marshes on fire or flushing them with low-pressure hoses could be effective in plots of 20 or 30 acres, he said, but those methods aren’t feasible in larger areas.

“Would you want to burn hundreds of thousands of acres?” Mendelssohn asked. “That’s a tremendously hard call.”

snip

. . . Robert Bea, a University of California, Berkeley, professor of civil environmental engineering who spent nearly 60 years in the oil business, was sent as a troubleshooter to all of those and several dozen more onshore and offshore spills.

In the sensitive marshes of the California’s Bay-Delta 35 years later, Bea said, workers used buckets to scoop up the mess from a 60,000-gallon pipeline oil spill.

“We killed the marsh,” he said.

snip

. . Along the coast of Brittany, some of the salt marshes there are still recovering from being trampled after the Amoco Cadiz accident, in which the supertanker split in two, spilling 68 million gallons of oil. Other marshes were bulldozed and the topsoil was carted away, leaving areas below water unable to regenerate. Effectively, studies show, the excavated marshes will never come back, while untreated areas are doing fine.

snip

. . . John Robinson, a Santa Barbara resident who was NOAA’s scientific adviser on the Exxon Valdez spill, recalled this week how he advised the U.S. Coast Guard to use high-pressure hoses to blast steaming hot water on the rocky shores of Alaska. It enabled the cleanup workers — 11,000 in all — to push the oil back into the ocean where it was corralled and skimmed off behind booms. But it “cooked” everything in sight.

Robinson said he feared that if the oil was not removed, it would swirl around and cause damage elsewhere.

“In the end, it was proven pretty clearly that we did the wrong thing,” he said. “We were approaching sterilization of the coast with that kind of equipment. It turned out to be a mistake. This kind of aggressive cleanup does nothing but delay the eventual recovery that nature is going to do anyway.”

It turns out that driving oily sand below the tide line, where many plants and animals had escaped the spill, the blasts of hot water only made matters worse, according to a report by NOAA in 1991.

“Sometimes, the best thing to do in an oil spill is nothing,” the report concluded.

snip

. . . And in a 10-year study on the effects of the spill, Bowdoin College researchers concluded that 90 percent of the plants and animals in the Exxon Valdez spill zone had recovered by mid-1990, in part because of the cleanup and in part because of natural forces.

snip

... Robinson said his own experience has made him a skeptic. When the Exxon Valdez cleanup was in full swing, he fought for nine areas — totaling less than a mile of coast — to be set aside and not cleaned. Within a few years, he said, “It was clear that the areas that had not been cleaned were faring a lot better in terms of their recovery. The areas that were cleaned were in much worse shape.”

As the head of NOAA’s Hazardous Materials Response Team, which he founded in 1976, Robinson oversaw about 100 oil spill cleanups. “I can’t think of any good example where a cleanup has been anything other than useless. It causes more damage than not doing anything at all. Once the genie gets out of the bottle, there’s no getting it back in. That seems to be proving itself once more in New Orleans.”


-MORE- http://www.miller-mccune.com/science-environment/oil-cleanup-cure-may-be-worse-than-disease-15722/
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
1. This should be taken into account with current cleanup efforts.
We don't want a bunch of people storming down there, making things worse.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Unfortunatly that will look like no action to
people, just read this site.

And I agree, the past is prologue.
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Codeine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 02:45 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. Ugh. We'll make it worse just to look like we're doing something
for the hysterical crowd. :(
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boston bean Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 05:55 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. How about stopping it before it gets in the wetlands???
That would most certainly stop people from trampling around the wetlands!

This is a slow moving train wreck, and there are things that can be done to stop it from hitting land.
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joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #2
20. Ridiculous...i am fed up with this justifying the unjustifiable..if this is true...
and if the guy knows what he's talking about, why the phuck do we have to read it here, why isn't Obama or whoever the phuck out there ALL THE TIME explaining the situation, getting in front of the issue? Fucking ridiculous.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #20
26. You do know for a fact that
people responsible for this are not readying any of this, and at the very least taking them under advisement.

Now here is a free clue, believe it or not the POTUS is not taking personal leadership for this. That is why HE DELEGATED to an INCIDENT COMMANDER.

I know, shocking... that a chief executive would actually NOT spend all his waking time on something he actually has zero expertise on... and actually DELEGATED. By the way, he has BEEN TRYING TO SPLAIN THINGS TO PEOPLE... and some have actually POSTED the links... but that is ok.

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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:19 PM
Response to Original message
3. Fascinating
Humans fuck the shores up through stupidity and greed, then make things worse in the desire to do the right thing. Why does this remind me of a life's lesson?
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BlancheSplanchnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:21 PM
Response to Original message
4. wow. This is worth being seen n/t
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. see how popular it is . . .
The "DO SOMETHING ANYTHING RIGHT F"ING NOW!!" crowd doesn't like to hear FACTS.

I understand their pain and frustration, but doing the wrong thing is worse than doing nothing, imo.
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BlancheSplanchnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. I agree 1000%
on all points
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joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. How about having the phucking administration telling people this, getting out in
front of the issue, or would you like to continue justifying the unjustifiable? Fer chrissakes, if this were Bush you'd be asking for the death epnalty.
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. um - what do you want Obama to do?
Fly onto an aircraft carrier?

Do you want real leadership or the appearance of leadership?

there is absolutely NO comparison between the dimson and Obama. these are the kind of comments that really torque me.

THERE is a lot more BEING DONE than the screamers on here are willing to talk about. They want Obama to swoop in with some kind of damn magic wand and poof the damn oil away.

Ain't gonna happen. Some things do take TIME and no amount of wishing and screaming and ranting and raving and throwing shit up against a wall and hoping it sticks is going to change that one iota.

People need to stop thinking that they know what the hell they're talking about and believing that doing ANY thing is a good idea, even if it's a BAD idea.
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Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:46 PM
Response to Original message
5. K & R
:thumbsup:
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-24-10 11:57 PM
Response to Original message
6. K&R...nt

Sid
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Cirque du So-What Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:00 AM
Response to Original message
7. K & R
Read and heed, all you 'ex-spurts' who demand that BP or the Obama administration - or both - get as many boots on the ground as possible. I doubt it will have any effect on your imaginary omniscience, but there's always an outside chance that you'll come to realize you're not as fucking smart as you imagine yourselves. Fashioning yourselves as fucking-know-it-alls with brighter ideas than people with long years of practical experience is willfully ignorant and the sort of attitude I'd expect among the conservatives you vilify when you're not busily condemning every action on the part of the Obama administration.
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #7
13. exactly.
Oh - let's get a bunch of boats and just put pumps on them. Problem solved. ta-da.....

BP/OBAMA - LIKE the oil spew. they're just hiding all those boats and refusing to use technology to help!!!

:banghead:
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. Oh for god's sake, you are talking about two different arguments.
Your article is about onshore cleanup, and you and some keep trying to apply that argument to the criticisms of the gusher. At any rate, if "doing nothing is the best option on shore", all of you need to take it up right with BP, who are clearly in charge here. Of all of it:




I've corralled Irvin Lipp, who drives me and a few wire photographers out to Elmer's. (He tells me ruefully that he has history with Mother Jones, having once been a flack for Dupont.) The shoreline is packed with men in hats and gumboots and bright blue or white shirts. Nearly all are African-American, all hired from around New Orleans. They tell me they've been standing in these exact same spots for three days. It's breathtakingly hot. They rake the oil and sand into big piles; other workers collect the piles into big plastic bags, and still other workers take them to a plant where the sand is separated out and sent to a hazardous-waste dump and the oil goes on for processing. Then the tide comes in with more oil and everybody starts all over again. Ten dollars an hour. Twelve hours a day.

When I joke with one worker that he should pocket the solid gobs of oil he's digging up to show me how far beneath the sand they go, he stops dead and asks me if BP's still trying to use the oil they all collect. "Aw, I knew it!" he says. Another leans on his rake to ask me, "Have they at least shut the oil off yet?" He randomly picks three spots in a three-foot-wide expanse of sand that he's already raked clean and drops his rake in an inch deeper to show me how the oil bubbles up from underneath. He can't count how many times he's raked this same spot in the 33 hours he's worked it since Thursday, but one thing he's sure of, he says, is that he'll be standing right here tomorrow and the next day, too.



"It's BP's Oil" (Mother Jones)
http://motherjones.com/environment/2010/05/oil-spill-bp-grand-isle-beach

Why Is BP Controlling Louisiana’s Cops?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x538116

DU is not the fucking problem.

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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 02:42 AM
Response to Original message
8. "If and when the oil slick in the Gulf reaches his marshy coastline."
Edited on Tue May-25-10 02:46 AM by chill_wind
It apparently hasn't quite yet. And when it does, that aspect will no doubt be a whole new debate, debate no doubt among many in his own same scientific peer group. Maybe his POV will win out. Maybe it won't.


The bulk of the DU discussion has not yet turned to onshore clean-up. It is still more focused on the at-sea clusterfuck - the gusher and the failed efforts to contain it, the uncertainty of when/if/how it ever will be, the corporate cronyism, the lax regulatory policies and absent contingency planning over the decades and administrations that have allowed it to happen. There are valid criticisms to be had about this offshore nightmare still unfolding, and this doesn't vindicate those. I say this, because once again I see some STFU political types seizing on this article to somehow try to say it does.


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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 05:49 AM
Response to Original message
10. . .
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 12:19 PM
Response to Original message
14. Interesting. (nt)
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amborin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
17. thanks for posting this ;)
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:10 PM
Response to Original message
18. Interesting--yup, I prefer to hear from people who knopw what they are talking about,
like Mssrs. Mendelsson and Robinson.
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. god forbid we should listen
to people who know what they're talking about.

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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
23. Well, we got that part down pat. nt
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Anybody get the feeling that BP is way past ready to move on?
Disaster 24/7 is so bo-ring. Got more to do-oo.
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. did you even bother to read it?
:sigh:

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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Yep. Long before it was posted here. nt
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