NY Times Reporter Confirms Obama Made Deal to Kill Public Option

[Bluebear]

by Miles Mogalescu

For months I've been reporting in The Huffington Post that President Obama made a backroom deal last summer with the for-profit hospital lobby that he would make sure there would be no national public option in the final health reform legislation. (See here, here and here). I've been increasingly frustrated that except for an initial story last August in the New York Times, no major media outlet has picked up this important story and investigated further.

Hopefully, that's changing. On Monday, Ed Shultz interviewed New York Times Washington reporter David Kirkpatrick on his MSNBC TV show, and Kirkpatrick confirmed the existence of the deal. Shultz quoted Chip Kahn, chief lobbyist for the for-profit hospital industry on Kahn's confidence that the White House would honor the no public option deal, and Kirkpatrick responded:

"That's a lobbyist for the hospital industry and he's talking about the hospital industry's specific deal with the White House and the Senate Finance Committee and, yeah, I think the hospital industry's got a deal here. There really were only two deals, meaning quid pro quo handshake deals on both sides, one with the hospitals and the other with the drug industry. And I think what you're interested in is that in the background of these deals was the presumption, shared on behalf of the lobbyists on the one side and the White House on the other, that the public option was not going to be in the final product."

Kirkpatrick also acknowledged that White House Deputy Chief of Staff Jim Messina had confirmed the existence of the deal to him.

This should be big news. Even while President Obama was saying that he thought a public option was a good idea and encouraging supporters to believe his healthcare plan would include one, he had promised for-profit hospital lobbyists that there would be no public option in the final bill.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/miles-mogulescu/ny-times-reporter-confirm_b_500999.html

[mdmc]

1. Time to celebrate our SUNSHINE government

If they made a back door deal to kill the PO, shouldn't they be game to admit it?

[Bluebear]

2. Let the SUNSHINE in. nt

[bjobotts]

109. I've been saying this for months also but keep in mind this does not mean we will not get a PO

[bjobotts]

110. If a Rahm-Obama deal was made to exclude it now, the door has been opened for later.

[bjobotts]

111. Whether intentional or not our foot is in the door with passage of this bill

[bjobotts]

112. I'm still leary of judging Obama's works yet unfinished.But still this goes beyond him to stop it .

[aquart]

253. Ever have your foot slammed in a door?

It hurts.

[Dr.Phool]

168. In who's lifetime?

[Name removed]

221. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[truedelphi]

114. And pigs might fly someday, but

it is still advisable to not hold your breath.

[obxhead]

198. Don't forget the unicorns and rainbows. nt

[Name removed]

223. Deleted message

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[marshall]

11. That does sound consistent with my idea of transparency

Then again, the definition of transparency may have changed while I wasn't looking.

[Statistical]

32. Wasn't the promise that everying would be public (on CSPAN) hence no backroom deals to deny?

[Kalun D]

196. Cspan Cameras

Cspan Cameras would have to be following Obama into the backrooms where he's met with big Pharma and big Health Care if they were going to film these crooked deals that the corporatist Obama has made to sell out the working people to the greed pig corporations.

[Jim Sagle]

125. Yes, they shined us on.

[bjobotts]

134. The PO is the ONLY thing that creates any real competition against Private ins

[bjobotts]

135. Priv. Ins fear it cold lead to single payer or Medicare for all.That's why Obama dealt it out while

saying he was for it.

[bjobotts]

136. "If only we had 60 votes" they claimed when everyone knew it could pass via reconciliation with 50

[bjobotts]

137. Now that dems are being forced to use reconciliation they claim the PO will kill reform

[bjobotts]

138. Dems don't want an up or down vote 'cause then they'd have to go on record opposing what we all want

[bjobotts]

140. Soo senate dems will try anyway they can to exclude voting on a PO

by not including it in the reconciliation process.Their lying has become so transparent claiming all along how they wanted a PO but now trying to make sure they won't have to vote for one they have Dick Durbin out there whipping against it. I just hope Bernie Sanders can force a vote via reconciliation on the PO where senate dems will be forced to vote for it or prove their own hypocrisy. Priv. ins. hates it because it opens the door to single payer and competition to their profiteering.

This is where we will know if Obama can ever be trusted in the future or most of the senate dems for that matter cause now they only need 50 votes to p[ass what they claimed they all wanted to begin with.

[dionysus]

185. do you always talk to yourself?

[JTFrog]

249. You are supposed to log in and out between posts.....

:eyes:

[glinda]

141. Shoots self in foot while ADs against it also come out? Looser X 2

[Sherman A1]

158. +1, Agreed & Well Said!

[Hell Hath No Fury]

3. Would someone look to see --

if there is a knife sticking out of my back? It sure feels like it... :mad:

I already faxed O to tell him 2012 was out for me exactly because of moves like this.

Nothing left for me to do but start the hunt for a new candidate.

[NJmaverick]

9. Just a fake knife to go with the fake story

[Toasterlad]

Is It a Fake Story That Candidate Obama Was For the Public Option?

Is it a fake story that Obama said he would not sign a bill that DIDN'T contain a public option?

It is not. You fail.

[Bluebear]

41. Thank you for addressing "ignored"

Whoever it is you must have a stronger stomach than I :)

[Toasterlad]

43. My Pleasure.

I don't do ignore, but I'll concede that THIS poster is, in fact, well worth ignoring.

[louis-t]

213. While you people are all arguing, has anyone asked..

Why would hospitals benefit from NOT having PO? I can't think of a reason.

[ourbluenation]

216. Me neither. They barely get reimbursed from private insurance. n/t

[NJmaverick]

61. nonsense

[Toasterlad]

62. I'm Glad We Agree That Your Position Is Nonsense.

[NJmaverick]

63. nonsense

[Toasterlad]

67. Exactly.

[Name removed]

103. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

106. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

121. Deleted message

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[ChiciB1]

189. I KNOW Exactly How You Feel!! Living Where I Live, I Got Out And Worked My

butt off, even AFTER I had said I wasn't going to do it! Said I would vote "other" but got caught up with the SAME stuff so many others did. And that we STILL have so many "Rah-Rah's" here has me scratching my head!

I come here for MY NEWS, but can hardly deal with it ALL! I rarely watch MSM anymore, but do enjoy Dylan Ratigan and the OTHER MSNBC people who are TRYING to get the word out. For me, Ratigan has taught me a LOT about the financial workings of this country! I realize many here think he's a CAD, but even if he's not what other's like... at least I've learned SOMETHING I didn't really know about the INSIDERS!!

I don't know WHERE my allegiance lies anymore, I say I'm a Democrat, but I KNOW I'm NOT the kind of DEMOCRAT of TODAY! The NEW Democrats have brought a LOT of shame to the name!!

Say what you will, but it's the TRUTH I see, but maybe not what some might LIKE to see!! Repukes getting their way WITHOUT having to VOTE for anything is an abomination!! Obamanation???

[Name removed]

195. Deleted message

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[Toasterlad]

39. Enjoy That.

[Lorien]

129. Your DLC propaganda doesn't work anymore

because the facts have proven your assertions false time and time again.

[reggie the dog]

51. Kucinich and Grayson

[backtomn]

186. You mean the guy on Airforce One??

What the hell was Kucinich thinking?? There is no way that I trust this guy to do the right thing anymore. Either he is selling us out or he is just playing for the cameras and hyping his popularity. That is pathetic.....he used us for another 15 minutes. Never again.

[h9socialist]

236. Cool it my friend . . .

Lawmaking and sausage-making are a lot alike. Both are nasty and do not make good spectator sports. Obama is playing the hand he was dealt.

[truedelphi]

113. As for our household, we do not care if they clone Hitler,

And have him run as the Repug in 2012, We are no longer voting for these Corporate Sell Outs. Let them rig the voting machines to get in.

[Caretha]

117. I feel exact;u the way you do

fucck'em

[Name removed]

128. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[truedelphi]

157. Do you know what I just found out yesterday? - There is a

Proposition that will be on the California ballot that is titled something like the "Extension of Voting Rights to Everyone" and what is is actually about is making it ILLEGAL for any third party that has not gotten at least 1 % of the votes in the most recent election to have a candidate on the ballot!!

They are trying to make it illegal to have a third or fourth party. Only the sold out DemoRepublicrats can be on the ballot if the proposition passes.

[peacetalksforall]

212. There is more honesty to believe in with Kucinich and Sanders than nearly all the other

legistlative 'so-called leaders'. Only a dozen deserve our loyalty. I stay with Kucinich and I'm proud of his positions. I support him through everything he does - he has a tougher job than the others. He's not a hypocrite - doesn't have to dance and perform for corporations and the bankers/money firms.

[Lorien]

127. I just unsubscibed from his mailing list and told him why

I've never felt so deeply betrayed by anyone that I worked and voted for.

[tpsbmam]

172. I did the same thing about a month ago....

it felt great to do and it's lovely not getting anymore of the bullshit correspondence from a smarmy liar. But I'm with you, I feel betrayed.

[WeekendWarrior]

247. Let's See...

You have disavowed a guy based on hearsay. That's what the OP and the story linked to pretty much is.

My cousin's girlfriend told my sister-in-law that my wife has been unfaithful. I think I'll divorce her.

[bluestateguy]

4. I'm sorry your sources are not convincing

The NY Times, the same Establishmentarian rag that brought us Jayson Blair, Judith Miller and covered up the NSA warantless wiretapping.

[NJmaverick]

6. Remember when reporters used real sources and not other reporters?

[glinda]

142. or checked their information instead of just repeating everything

[creeksneakers2]

206. The White House should be contacted

and a response demanded.

[Name removed]

199. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bluebear]

7. Nothing would convince you of anything, so this isn't even aimed at you. Please hide the thread.

[ProSense]

12. And nothing convinces you of everything.

Where's the evidence?

[ProSense]

13. Here's a question

Why does the bill stipulate that the exchange must include a non-profit plan run by the OPM?

[daleanime]

108. Wasn't that 'supervised' by the OPM?

Now who did we say was going to run it?:hi:

[bvar22]

83. That same crowd said the same thing about early reports...

...of the deal cut with BIG Parma to toss out Drug Re-importation behind closed doors at the White House.
.
.
Wonder is any of them would like to admit their mistake on THAT one.

[Mimosa]

132. ^ I remember that. BVar ^

I was following this far more closely the first 8 months. Then I became too disappointed and depressed. :(

[flyarm]

145. damn right they did and those of us that posted those facts were called liars by some of the same

people that are right on this thread calling the NYTimes liars..they have also called Helen Thomas a liar, and Glen Greenwald..and David Swanson, and FDL and Huffington Post when they post truths..and are not censoring people..they call DK names..the list is long that they have tried so hard to discredit..

Well they can stick it ..everyone knows who they are, and what their game is..it is a tired and sick and pathetic game they play..but they are responsible for selling this country out..and her people.

[rudy23]

167. Making their "list" should be a badge of honor at this point.

Kucinich, FDL, Huffington, Greenwald, Dean, Michael Moore--making the Obama/DLC list should be a point of pride. Based on history, it means you're doing something right.

[unapatriciated]

178. That is just how I feel.

Nothing I say or post will convince them of the huge flaws in this bill, so why bother.
You can give links, valid points, and personal experience, the responses are much the same they will fix it and I'm too idiotic to understand.
I Understand that this is a big give away to the Insurance Companies giving them 30 more million insured to abuse the same way they did in California.

http://articles.latimes.com/2009/feb/11/business/fi-bluecross11 (second page)

{"Under the terms of the settlement, Anthem Blue Cross Life will invite these consumers to purchase coverage on a go-forward basis, regardless of past or present medical conditions," she said. "Additionally, these consumers will be eligible to receive reimbursement of prior out-of-pocket medical expenses."

Under the deals with regulators, rescinded patients can accept new coverage without forfeiting any legal rights. But they must waive their right to sue insurers in order to make claims for out-of-pocket medical expenses.

Critics say medical expenses often are only the beginning of the losses. In some cases, they say, patients were unable to get care because they couldn't pay for it, causing health conditions to worsen. In others, mounting medical bills damaged their credit and led to financial calamity.

Then there are the less tangible consequences. Bates, for instance, was awarded about $700,000 for pain and suffering.

"You have to give everything else up just to get your medical bills paid," said William Shernoff, Bates' lawyer. "I'm all for getting medical bills paid, but this is coercive. That's the real bad part of this settlement and the other ones too."

Jerry Flanagan, a patient advocate with Consumer Watchdog in Santa Monica, said Anthem's $1-million fine was "an insult to the people of California, especially those who have lived under the financial destruction caused by rescission."

The fine, he said, pales in comparison to what Anthem must have saved by rescinding policies for years. Anthem has never said what costs it avoided through rescission. But Health Net, in documents produced for the Bates trial, said it avoided $35.5 million by canceling 1,600 policies.}


This settlement didn't include the multitude of insureds who were denied, reviewed or flat out cut from the insurance roles illegally from 1994-2006. Strong regulations were in place regarding pre-existing conditions and wrongful denial of claims during this time.
They got away with millions in illegal profits for twelve years and families like myself were devastated. I spent from 1991 until 2005 fighting Athem Blue Cross for wrongful denials and constant reviews of my sons medical claims. I filed numerous complaints with the state that they ignored, wrote to my congress critters and three different administrations. This cause critical interruptions of care, forced me to sell my home and left my son unnecessarily crippled.

I'm told by the supporters of this bill that it will be different on a federal level, that the "DOJ" will prosecute them.:rofl:

[EFerrari]

16. Establishment rag? Who do you think Obama is, Che?

lol

[Bluebear]

18. That evil, liberal New York Times is a "rag", doncha know.

[Name removed]

93. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[glitch]

59. !

:spray:

[Ignis]

107. !

:spray:

[avaistheone1]

192. lmao

Great quip.




:rofl:

[donco6]

42. So, what news source WOULD be acceptable?

Any? Anywhere?

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

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[BlueJac]

105. If it was night you would say it is day.

[Name removed]

144. Deleted message

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[Kalun D]

194. Denial is Not a River In Egypt

the things you mention are at the opposite end of the spectrum, they support the corporations

this story exposes them

Obama is a corporatist, it's been pretty obvious for a while, he talks the workers talk and walks the corporate walk all the way

He said early on he was for the public option, but he never really pushed for it in congress like he did the $700 Billion banker bailout or defense appropriations

so this NYT story makes perfect sense and fits right in line with the back door Pharma deal which is proven

the things you mention are easily refutable like no WMD's, this is not easily refutable and it makes perfect sense, it connects to what is really happening.

[izzybeans]

215. Oh come on? An entertainment lawyer must be right about this, right?

:)

I'm mean he's quoting somebody who quoted somebody else on the TEEVEE. Meanwhile the very next thread on the greatest page says "public option is in the house reconciliation bill"

One chump says jump and a bunch em' comply. The NYTimes did not recently publish this, a reporter of theirs said something on the TEEVEE. When they publish an article with documentation I'll believe this. Instead a second hand quote from a lobbyist is used to push something out virally.

[NJmaverick]

5. I remember when reporters used REAL sources and not OTHER REPORTERS for their sources

:eyes:

[Name removed]

200. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[damyank913]

8. I sure would like to see more proof.

[NJmaverick]

14. You are not alone

[madmom]

179. ditto

[ProSense]

10. What utter bullshit.

"last August"

People still trying to milk the hysteria around the PharMa deal when even the Pharma deal hasn't prevented more reductions in drug cost.

[NJmaverick]

15. +1

[Nikki Stone1]

19. Thank you for kicking this post.

Everyone needs to read this.

[Bluebear]

20. I see LOTS of "ignoreds" kicked this post!

;)

[Nikki Stone1]

26. Why, yes!

:D

[pecwae]

56. Thought it was just me.

I see 5 myself:)

[Ignis]

65. I made the mistake of flushing my Ignore list after...

...reading Skinner's great "don't be an asshole" post regarding civility.

Big mistake. The signal-to-noise ratio is horrible now.

[JTFrog]

171. *But insults, name-calling, or other expressions of contempt toward Barack Obama or his supporters

are not welcome.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=5524913#5530848

Yea, it was a great post. Feel free to use the alert button often.

:shrug:

[uponit7771]

143. +1

[WillyT]

17. Big K & R !!!

:kick:

:mad:

[ProSense]

21. Here's the NY Times story from August

It was about the PharMa deal:

Drug industry lobbyists said they negotiated a deal to contribute $80 billion over 10 years toward the cost of an overhaul with Mr. Baucus, under White House supervision, before taking it to the president for final approval. House lawmakers have said they were caught by surprise when it was announced.

Hospital industry lobbyists, speaking on condition of anonymity for fear of alienating the White House, say they negotiated their $155 billion in concessions with Mr. Baucus and the administration in tandem. House staff members were present, including for at least one White House meeting, but their role was peripheral, the lobbyists said.

Several hospital lobbyists involved in the White House deals said it was understood as a condition of their support that the final legislation would not include a government-run health plan paying Medicare rates — generally 80 percent of private sector rates — or controlled by the secretary of health and human services.

“We have an agreement with the White House that I’m very confident will be seen all the way through conference,” one of the industry lobbyists, Chip Kahn, director of the Federation of American Hospitals, told a Capitol Hill newsletter.

link

Typically, it's only the RW that tries to drum up old news and repurpose it as "breaking."

[soleft]

22. What did Obama get from the for profit hospitals?

[harun]

29. Exactly a deal means they gave something. I don't see the for-profit

hospitals giving a crap about the PO. Probably wouldn't affect them for a decade if ever.

[Kalun D]

201. Buy a Vowel

With private insurance the health care industry can charge whatever they want. With the government paying for health care it becomes regulated.

the health care industry is definitely against the public option, they don't make as much money that way.

[JDPriestly]

31. Is this Obama's idea of transparency?

He had better have a really good explanation for this.

This just destroys his credibility. Who can trust him if he makes backroom deals like that or feels bound by the deals when his staff and Baucus make them?

I really want to hear what the White House has to say about this.

The Obama administration becomes more disgusting with each day. Where is the promised transparency?

This is not a matter of national security.

[sabrina 1]

71. 'What did Obama get from the for profit hospitals?'

It looks like he got about $3.3 million dollars in campaign financing:

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2010/01/12-9

The new figure, obtained by Raw Story through an independent custom research request performed by the Center for Responsive Politics -- a nonprofit, nonpartisan group that tracks money in politics -- is the most comprehensive breakdown yet available of healthcare industry contributions to Obama during the 2008 election cycle.

Currently, the Center's website shows that Obama received $19,462,986 from the health sector, which includes health professionals ($11.7m), health services/HMOs ($1.4m), hospitals/nursing homes ($3.3m) and pharmaceuticals/health products ($2.1m). Miscellaneous health donations (from which Obama received $860,411) are also factored into the current total health sector numbers but are not accessible on the site.

Whether anyone believes these huge amounts of money influence policy or not, is up to them.

From the same article:

Obama delegate now takes umbrage with healthcare position

Historian and media critic Norman Solomon, who was also an Obama delegate to the Democratic National Convention, called the president's transformation on healthcare since taking office "shameful."

"Overall it's been a very corporate friendly healthcare approach from Obama as president," Solomon said in an interview with Raw Story. "Corporate friendly in a way that I believe is injurious to public health."

He underscored the subtle but substantive change in healthcare language used by Obama and the White House.

"We don't hear so much now about ‘healthcare reform,'" Solomon said. "We're hearing a lot more about ‘health insurance reform.' And that is absolutely in large measure driven by the White House."

Apparently the WH was given an opportunity to respond to the Raw Story article, but declined to comment.

[alcibiades_mystery]

78. Obama raised $150 million in September 2008 alone

You think he gives a fuck about $3 million in campaign cash?

:rofl:

[sabrina 1]

81. Apparently he does. Or did he refuse to take it?

Funny how we didn't know about the huge contributions of the Health Care Industry to his campaign until fairly recently. Why do you think they didn't want us to know?

I thought his campaign took no money from lobbyists for big corporations, that most of his funding came from grass roots organizations. Since it was such a pittance in your estimation, it should have easy to refuse.

Nice try though, attempting to diminish the significance of politicians taking pay-offs from big business. He got three times what McCain got from the Health Insurance Industry. Obviously the Ins. Ind. had more faith in him delivering for them.

Funny too how while he was taking these contributions, he was railing AGAINST others taking them.

I've learned a lot about him in the past year. Not much 'change' going on since he got to DC. Just another average politician after all.

[snagglepuss]

197. So did he refuse it? nt

[Nite Owl]

23. K&R

[Karmadillo]

24. When Obama campaigned, he never specifically said he wouldn't try to kill the public option while

pretending he was for it, so like, like, like this is OK and even admirable because it is OK. OK?

[Bluebear]

35. You're channeling quite a few people with that one lol

[tekisui]

55. lol!

:rofl:

It always admirable, isn't it?

[salguine]

86. Sshhh! Sssshhhh! He's going to speak! He's going to speak!

[L0oniX]

188. ¿

[Zen Democrat]

25. I don't understand why hospitals would be making that deal?

[Smashcut]

27. Party liners are here to spread the FUD

But the existence of such a deal is obvious to anyone with eyes and the capacity for deductive reasoning.

[xultar]

44. +1

[CreekDog]

28. The headline is damning but when you actually read the article, the meat isn't there

it all seems to be based on 3rd level hearsay of an industry lobbyist about some deal that has no definition.

not enough for me to make any conclusions.

[Bluebear]

33. LOL. Like Messina confirming the deal, you mean?

[ProSense]

34. He confirmed the deal last year.

Breaking: Last year's story.

[donco6]

54. No, he confirmed Monday that a deal was made last summer.

Different thing. But you know that, you silly!

[Bluebear]

58. :)

Whoever "ignored" was, thank you for addressing it. :)

[donco6]

60. No prob. n/t

[ProSense]

80. No, he confirmed the deal last year

Not to worry, Jim Messina, the deputy White House chief of staff, told the hospital lobbyists, according to White House officials and lobbyists briefed on the call. The White House was standing behind the deal, Mr. Messina told them, capping the industry’s costs at a maximum of $155 billion over 10 years in exchange for its political support.

[frylock]

98. this is Gneral Discussion, not LBN..

what's your point?

[Kalun D]

202. but not covered

But not covered by the mainstream, that's one of the OP's points.

Just think if all Americans knew about this, Obama's (fake) "credibility" would be in the dumper.

this is real news that shows Obama is a liar and a fake

the fact it's not covered by the MSM shows you it's owned by the same POS corps that are doing the crooked deal with the ObamaRahma flim flam.

[CreekDog]

38. My message said the "deal" if there was one, was undefined

by anything but hearsay on top of hearsay.

i'd like one money quote from somebody who is not a lobbyist (and hopelessly compromised) saying, there was a deal to drop the public option.

and from that lobbyist, it's not enough that he says there was a "presumption" that there would be no public option. i need something to demonstrate that the presumption was there to begin with among ALL parties involved in any negotiation (if there even was one).

see?

[Kalun D]

205. End Results

After Obama said he was for the public option he did not support. Like he pushed for the crooked $700 BILLION banker bailout or defense appropriations. He was arm twisting for those and they got passed immediately. Health care reform has been here for over a year and he's NEVER pushed for anything meaningful.

I'm sure you could also look at donations. Just like Goldman Sachs who donated $996,000, Obama's 2nd largest contributor. I'm sure there's similar donations from insurance and health care. Que Bono?

Obama is a corporate sell-out and those that support him on this are either severely mis-informed or DLC shills.

[CreekDog]

238. Obama was the one passing the $700B TARP?

when did he do that?

[JTFrog]

250. Like he pushed for the crooked $700 BILLION banker bailout? W...T...F?

WTF?? This whole thread is about just making shit up isn't it?

Bush Pushes to Pas Bailout Package

President Bush Pushes $ 700 Billion Bailout

Bush seeks $700 billion for bailout

President Bush Signs Complex And Highly Criticized $700B Package

The right wingers are also trying to rewrite this bit of history. :eyes:

Talk about severely misinformed shills....

[aquart]

254. I thought Obama was the man who wasn't the DLC shill?

Has the spin been changed so that he IS a DLC shill now? I just can't keep up.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

30. The New Boss has met the real bosses and used the famous chess maneuver of "caving".

As usual.

[Ignis]

36. Ohhhhhhh yes. And that reminds me of this Hicks quote:

"It's just a handful of people that run everything, and that's provable.... I have this feeling that whoever's elected president, like Clinton was, no matter what promises you make on the campaign trail - blah, blah, blah - when you win, you go into this smoky room with the twelve industrialist, capitalist scumfucks that got you in there, and this little screen comes down... and it's a shot of the Kennedy assassination from an angle you've never seen before, which looks suspiciously off the grassy knoll.... And then the screen comes up, the lights come on, and they say to the new president, 'Any questions?'

"Just what my agenda is."

[Moochy]

89. !

:thumbsup:

[Ignis]

99. Not sure whether to laugh or cry?

I know the feeling. :hug:

[Moochy]

104. Necessary Illusions

We must maintain the Necessary Illusions about our Allowable Options.

[Ignis]

230. Sometimes, the illusion of control is all we have.

But that doesn't stop us from clinging to it. :shrug:

It's a dark, scary jungle out there, and we're little more than literate primates when it comes to things that challenge our notion of reality. We'll cling to just about anything that helps us feel powerful, rather than powerless. This is compounded by the independence training that most Americans go through as children, and the "rugged individualism" and "American Dream" memes with which we are inundated from an early age.

:hi:

[Moochy]

240. Very True

When Chomsky used the term he was speaking on behalf of the oligarchy and it's necessity for Illusions to hide the mechanisms for control.... But yes, I wholly see the need to pretend that its not as dire as it really is. Go Healthcare, Go Obama! :hi:

[Ignis]

242. Oh jeez, my linguistics professors would kill me.

I completely missed the Chomsky reference. :blush:

[Ignis]

244. Aw jeez...

My linguistics professors would kill me: I completely missed the Chomsky reference. :blush: Now that you've spelled it out for me, it all comes flooding back. :D

[Myrina]

100. +100

Exactly.

[G_j]

40. +100

[Echo In Light]

37. k/r

[Prism]

45. Don't you hate being right?

I remember, way back in August, when the White House was sending signal after signal that the public option was on its way out.

We were called Doom and Gloomers, Chicken Littles, and everything else under the sun because we had the audacity to listen to what the politicians were saying and go "Wait, we actually heard that."

Then the ignoreds in this thread called us liars, disruptors, concern trolls, and assured us that there would be a strong public option and that they themselves could never support any bill that didn't have one.

Well!

Who could have expected we'd be where we are today?

I mean, aside from those of us who paid even a smidgen of attention.

[Bluebear]

47. In this case, yes I do.

Because who wouldn't want to believe the crock of hope that was being served up?

The bus tire tracks flattened me long ago. Thank goodness for ignore.

[bvar22]

84. I'm with you.

I would much rather be celebrating a good "Democratic" Health Care Reform Bill instead of dreading this "Bait & Switch" National RomneyCare Bill.

[donco6]

53. I think we're still called that.

To this very day.

[flyarm]

148. +1000!!! eom

[Marr]

139. There's actually a lot of money that goes into disrupting boards and blogs.

When I was a kid, I saw a lake drained to get rid of some type of frog. The fish were fine-- they just swam lower and lower as the water level dropped. But the frogs couldn't leave their reeds and they just dried out as the water receeded. I often think of those frogs hopping around in the sun these days when I visit DU. When the consensus opinion dips below a certain point, the ones still cheering kind of stand out.

[truedelphi]

246. My question is:

how do I get a hold of some of that money? (To heck with the fish or the frogs.)

[flyarm]

147. ahhh yes i remember..and I also remember that " incredible chess game" that was being played..

and the truth tellers were called all sorts of ugly names!

If one had the time and inclination..it would be fun to pull up some of those posts from the archives..

[Unvanguard]

46. Mere rumor, and probably bullshit. The timing isn't right.

It wasn't clear until late fall that there would be no public option, and Obama had no means of controlling that outcome, any more than he had means to make a public option happen.

[Bluebear]

48. 'Obama had no means of controlling that outcome' - no of course not.

Do remember though: (see sigline)

[Unvanguard]

49. At minimum, you need an ellipsis in there. n/t

[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tranche]

69. You're this out of shape over a story that came out almost year ago?

I don't even see what the "deal" is. Some "handshake" agreement in "support" of the package? I don't see a lot of support and I see no will in congress to write a public option into a final bill.

[sabrina 1]

74. You left out the great big check Obama received from

the Insurance Industry. But as we all know, Big Corps give away $20 million dollars every day and expect nothing in return!

They were betting on Democrats for the 'right' kind of Health Insurance Reform. They gave Dems three times what they gave McCain. Republicans would never have been able to pass this Corporate Friendly bill. They had already used up their political capital with the two wars, the torture business etc. So, all bets for the next assault on the American People were on the rightwing of the democratic party, as the money shows. And it looks like they are about to get what they paid for.

No PO = No Competition for Private Insurance. Mission Accomplished.

[truedelphi]

248. Apparently Obama is believed by enough Americans that they will not be

Out in the streets protesting this.

He keeps claiming that he is-proud of getting to "fix" the health care matters. What fix? unless he means, the "fix" was on.

And the "fix" will be operative every time some one of the few Senators or Progressives in the House attempt to make a fix. The lobbyists will again storm the Congress with the checks for the campaign coffers.

[slipslidingaway]

57. What Candidate Obama said of politicians who make deals with insurance and drug...

lobbyists once they are sent to DC.


From a speech just before the election - "Enough is Enough..."

"And we are tired of watching as year after year, candidates offer up detailed health care plans with great fanfare and promise only to see them crushed under the weight of Washington politics and drug and insurance lobbying once the campaign is over.

That is not who we are, that is not who we have to be, enough is enough, it time for us to change."

Newport News - October 2008

[truedelphi]

116. And Yada Yada Yada. Boy was I ever snookered by that guy. n/t

[emald]

190. the outright duplicitous nature of presi-didn't's statement is stunning.

Really, how can anyone read what Candidate o said and rectify it with what exists now?
Had he wanted medicare for all we would have had it, but we, the people, have been sold out by o the little man.

[NNN0LHI]

64. The NYT blows

I won't even use that rag as a source since the WMD debacle.

Don

[Bluebear]

66. What isn't a "rag" to you, just curious?

[NNN0LHI]

68. Any source that hasn't been caught red-handed lying out their asses like the NYT

Hows that?

Don

[Bluebear]

70. Fine. I just hear more people yelling about the NYT because it is "liberal" and "elite"

The Judith what's-her-name debacle notwithstanding.

[NNN0LHI]

75. Thats because a lot of people have short memories

Have a good day Bluebear, it was really nice chatting with you.

:hi:

Don

[Bluebear]

76. Good evening to you!

:hi:

[Major Hogwash]

165. It's time for "The Judy Miller Show"

From Saturday Night Live.
Gildna Radner.

Funniest skit she ever did, as the girl scout who jumped up and down on her bed.

I won't ever forget Gildna.

Never thought the NYT would go to bat for BushCo the way they did in 2003, either.

[tranche]

72. I don't get it? Would Obama veto a bill with a PO?

The more I read this the more I ask, "where's the beef?". It's some "handshake" deal for insurance and pharma "support" but I sure don't see much support and I don't see a congress willing to write a PO into a final bill. How exactly was Obama going to enforce this "deal"? Veto a bill with a PO in it?

[depakid]

82. Probably not- but he won't lift a finger to get anything like it

There's a pattern emerging here: pander to the corporate right and scold the constituencies that make up the Democratic base.

[VMI Dem]

73. Don't know how this will shake out, but I can say this:

This story is more believable than not.

[Greyhound]

77. I wouldn't mind crooked politicians nearly so much if they would just stop selling me so cheaply. nt

[EFerrari]

85. Seriously. I don't need a corsage but a postcard every now and then

would be nice!

lol

[bvar22]

79. That Obama...

such a Fighter for the People......NOT.

He would rather take cheap shots at the Democratic Wing of the Party.

[Moochy]

87. Yeah we are supposed to pretend that didn't happen.

Move along

[gateley]

88. What did Obama get in return for this deal? nt

[ProSense]

91. Good

question.

[gateley]

95. You know, I'm not naive enough to think that such deals don't take place, or to

discount that Obama might make such a deal if there was something in return he felt was worth it. I just don't see evidence of anything that would have been 'worth it'. :shrug:

[ProSense]

102. The deal

is old news. It's the same PharMa deal people were trying to portray as a secret deal last year.

[NorthCarolina]

92. Isn't the usual exchange $$$? eom

[gateley]

96. I don't see it in this instance. Just my gut feeling. nt

[NorthCarolina]

90. Well DUH. eom

[JohnnyHardhat]

94. The bell tolls for thy Obama

As someone who has worked in politically high offices with great elected officials, I learned early it is a cardinal rule not to lie to your constituents. Promising too much is one thing... but saying you support a policy to get elected, then deal it away once you are, and then lie about it to your base is tantamount to asking your constituents to find someone to primary you. Its a no win political tactic that is as slimy as it is clumsy. It also says a lot about what this administration really thinks about its supporters. I'm done.. don't call me for donations.

[icee]

182. It is also says something about the offender as a man. There will

be no winners here no matter what. And Dennic K with his announcement of yesterday may be among the biggest losers.

[Name removed]

97. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[David Zephyr]

101. Sad.

K&R.

[truedelphi]

115. Miles, Baby, the thing is, the media receives billions of dollars annually from

The Big Medical Interests. That is why you never hear a decent discussion of the "Single Payer Universal HC" possibility on any TV network. (Unless they are denouncing it as a Socialist plot, or ridiculing something that Michael Moore said.)

It has been that way for a long time. The Powers that Be - the Big Oil, Big Pharma and Big Medical People control our news. As an indie reporter, way back in 1997, I tried to get my tale about MTBE out to major San Francisco Bay Area newspapers. When I presented it, I said I had research on the Number One public policy and public health related issue. Presenting the issue like that, all the papers were interested. But when they found it it related to Big Oil, no one was.

Right now, Obama is doing everything that the Puppet Masters are asking him to. When the Puppet Masters tire of him, then maybe the truth will come out. But for now, he is proving to themhe can do as told:

1) He continues the Bush -style, Bernanke/Geithner poison pill on America.

2) He continues the war on Afghanistan (Which will be paid for by our penalties for not handling the HCR insurance mandates correctly

3) and now he has delivered on HC

And perhaps worst of all, the Monsanto GMO food "revolution" which will bring about world wide famine, that is proceeding nicely too, what with all the Monsanto appointees in important posts.

So my guess is he will be in for a few more months at least.

[defendandprotect]

118. So corporate leverage over Obama . . . while public has no leverage . . .!!!

Think we need a new plan, folks?

[Name removed]

131. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[marshall]

151. It would be nice to have three, or even four, parties

But our system seems so committed to a two party system. A new party will occasionally rise up, but doesn't it take the place of an old party? Like the Whigs or the Democratic-Republican or whatever those old parties were called. Then there are the ones that have false starts like the Bull Moose party or whatever Ross Perot called his party.

[defendandprotect]

231. The two parties are colluding together to keep third parties from rising . . .IRV voting ...

is what we need!!! And, basically, we're asking the two parties with the LOCK on

things to help us break thru the barriers they've put in place to prevent just that!!

PLUS corporations profit as well from having to BRIBE only two parties --

and MSM gets 80% of the campaign fund money -- i.e., the BRIBERY $$$.

Let's call it what it is -- despite the fascist Supremes!!

[defendandprotect]

229. I agree . . . nothing left of the Democratic Party to REFORM it --

[SlingBlade]

119. Proof that we've been sold out .... AGAIN

This guy is starting to lie as bad as the last one did

[demwing]

120. There's a difference between assert and confirm

this isn't the latter.

[ProgressIn2008]

122. Shocked. Shocked, I tell ya. nt

[Mimosa]

123. Eeeeuwww... did somebody fool me...again?

Backroom deals. *No wonder many people have stopped voting.* No wonder we tend to think 'meet the new boss...same as the old boss...'

[Name removed]

130. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Mimosa]

133. Lorien, you're right.

But I'm still sad. I hoped, I trusted.

[Lorien]

150. I do understand. Completely.

:hug:

[Ticonderoga]

191. They have

no use for voters anymore. It's all done stolen electronically now days.

[Better Believe It]

124. President Obama keeps his promises made to corporate America

[TacticalPeek]

126. I sense a pattern emerging.

It's kinda like a bull's-eye
and it's on the little guy.

[midnight]

146. K&R

[New Dawn]

149. Kick for truth.

[bbgrunt]

152. the only thing worse than a dumb fratboy liar and corporate hack--is a smart one.

[Mike K]

208. Well said.

[saracat]

153. I am astounded that even the most dedicated of Obama supporters could "defend" this.

Some are actually arguing that this doesn't matter because this only reaffirms what was already known last summer? Others argue about the source of the NY TIMES indicting the NYT isn't "credible"! What has to be done to prove that this is a bad thing that was done? Nothing could prove more to me that some folks have no critical thinking ability whatsoever. It is very sad and a bit scary.

[Skittles]

156. it's scarier when we see it in so-called progressives

we've always taken for granted that freepers have no critical thinking skills

[Loudmxr]

154. I am not buying it. Yet.

I am not a trusting person and I have said time after time do not trust President Obama. OK his South Carolina speech made me switch from Hillary because he said all the things I believe in. But still....

I trust the people who say bad things about him less. They will have to produce a video or audio recording of the backroom deal plus THEIR birth certificates. :smoke:

[boppers]

155. Hm.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7931053

I smell FUD.

[Son Of Wendigo]

159. I Have Believed This For Months - k/r

Ever since August when the Teabaggers were acting like the Storm Troopers they were, and still are, and the White House was amazingly silent about the whole thing, I wondered why. I seem to recall that Obama spent about 10 days in Hawaii on vacation. Now I don't criticize his vacation, but with his alleged main legislative priority for the year being attacked and slimed and lied about in a way I have never seen before, I felt that someone from the White House should have pushed back hard. What we got was virtual silence.

As the months have progressed since then, and all Obama and Gibbs would say was nothing but mealymouthed crap, it became clearer and clearer to me - Obama was nothing better than a shill for the health care industry. He had been bought off. We have known a little about the deal with the pharmaceutical industry for a long time, but what we didn't know that the deal included bargaining away the public option. This is the first I have heard that detail, and the first I have heard about the corresponding deal with the for profit hospitals. Where was the outrage about this sellout from the MSM? Oh, right, they're all owned by big corporations which would agree in principle with a deal that, while it wouldn't benefit them directly, would benefit other big corporations. Their turn will come.

I do not see how anyone who values any part of the progressive agenda can sleep soundly knowing that Obama has probably already bargained away big chunks. And I do not see how anyone anywhere can continue to support Obama. He isn't a democrat. He is a fascist, in the sense of Mussolini's definition, "Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." Obama is certainly doing his part to merge corporate power and state power.

[Hubert Flottz]

160. K&R

[OneBlueSky]

161. seems that when you arrive in Washington as a "servant of the people" . . .

you first have to check your integrity at the gate . . . it may be available for you to reclaim if and when you leave DC -- but it damn sure ain't likely . . . not with all those lobbyist firms just itching to hire former government employees, particularly the "elected" kind . . .

"and goes round and round and round
in the Circle Game . . ." Joni

[vssmith]

166. Do you think Chris Dodd will become a lobbyist?

[aquart]

255. Isn't he?

[gleaner]

162. I knew it ...

It explains so many of Obama's actions. I knew something was wrong last August and I wracked my brain to figure out what it was, when it was so simple all the time. A public figure who takes an oath of office to protect and serve the United States and who then makes agreements with money attached to do the opposite is taking a bribe. If he were not the president he could be prosecuted. He deliberately lied to prey on the hopes and needs of the public. That is fraud. The saddest thing is that he spent his promise, his real chance to make a difference and tarnished his legacy. What is even sadder is that people who trusted him will die because of it.

This raises other questions for me that are so scary, I hate even to think about them but I can't help it. Why the sudden interest in a greatly widened war arena which is against the wishes of many if not most of the American people. Bush and Cheney made a tidy living out of Iraq. Is Obama doing the same thing in Afghanistan, Yemen, Pakistan and Iraq? There are real people on both sides dying there. It is bad enough that on the face of things they are dying for no reason. If they were dying for profit as they did under Bush it would be unbearable.

Obama has no more reputation to lose. He has squandered it for a pile of change. In exchange he has given his benefactors our lives, our health and our well being as well as our hopes for the future. He has no credibility left. Ask the Democrats he threatened to try to force them to vote for his bill. Now all of the people everywhere who supported him and maybe still do support him have to ask themselves how much credibility they will have if they continue to follow blindly and without question. I wonder if they will think that sacrificing their own ethics will continue to be worth it. Because it is going to get harder and harder for anyone to believe them or take them seriously in the future.

K&R:kick:

[DisgustedInMN]

163. I won't say what I would actually ...

.. prefer to, as it would likely get me banned. Let is suffice to say, that to many of us, that Barack Obama sold us out is hardly news. He and his fellow conspirators WILL reap all of the benefits afforded to those that show this kind of integrity.

[dkf]

164. Ok that is it. Obama needs to go because he is untrustworthy.

I can't believe I donated money to A person who lies straight to my face. He turned Nancy Pelosi into a liar too. I am beyond disgusted.

Maybe we should have been suspicious of Michelle's ties to the hospital. Maybe he was bought from the beginning.

[ShortnFiery]

169. Pelosi was corrupt before Obama. Remember her statement, "Impeachment is off of the table."

She should have lost her leadership for that horrific statement alone. In essence, she helped BushCo cover up war crimes.

[malaise]

170. New York TImes?

And I should trust them because...?

[icee]

176. Oh, come on. They are the most Democratic rag in the United States.

[sunnystarr]

173. Fair Weather Friends & Voters

I thought Dems were more intelligent than what I've been reading here. Did you honestly believe that ANYONE could get into the White House and give the powerful corps/lobbyists/power mongers the middle finger and twist the arms of the Dem Congress to do all that was envisioned in one swell swoop in his first year in office and still be alive to tell the tale????

Obama gave us his vision and we got on board to elect him. His vision hasn't changed but he has to deal with the reality of politics and the structure that constrains him. The measure of his genuine-ness is the Repugs tactics that are unprecedented historically. PLUS he took office at the worst economic time our country has faced.

So go in your corners and POUT and STOMP YOUR FEET!! Continue to live in your fairy tale world! Go vote for an INDEPENDENT or DON'T VOTE! Cause if you can't get EVERYTHING you want NOW then you want to remove your support for the best president to hit Washington in many lifetimes or ever. The Repugs are CHEERING as they read your comments! YOU are their best hope at regaining control in the executive and legislative branches. WTGGGGG!! Pat yourselves on the back! I never did have any use for fair weather friends! Oh ye of little faith ... you always did screw up a good thing.

[Name removed]

207. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sunnystarr]

237. I had to look twice to make sure I didn't land in Freeperland

Guess I have to apologize for supporting my DEMOCRATIC president on DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND! Oh that's right ... I'm just not too bright if I'm supporting Barack Obama!

[Ticonderoga]

239. Well again I find myself

in disagreement with your comment, but I do however want to apologize for the awful remark I made towards you. Really it was inappropriate and I'm truly sorry about that. Peace.

[icee]

174. I along with many others have been saying this for a long time. Now

we know. This destroys everything I believe as a Democrat. Those of you who stick with Obama now step on the face of FDR and Lyndon Johnson. Jesus, I hope Allentown Jake is okay.

[CanonRay]

175. I knew it, but I still feel betrayed.

[Javaman]

177. at the end of the day or end of the week, we still won't have a public option

so to those who wish not to believe this story, fine, it supports your position, how?

We still won't have a public option.

I have written time and time again here on DU that the fix has always been in. We have been lead around by the nose as the chorus for the Greek tragedy that this health care bill has become.

First they say the PO is in, then they say it is out and with each pronouncement, there will be the chorus if "it's back in!!!" followed by the chorus of "it's dropped!!!".

If it just wasn't so damn depressing watching us all knee jerk react to this orchestrated charade, it would be down right amusing.

So just remember, as much as we all have been cheerleaders for the public option we all have been played for the fools that we really hope we are not. To that extent, so have the ball licking tea baggers.

We are just the pawns folks, they don't give a flying fuck about us.

It's the corporations that stand to make a buck from all of this. We, in the end (where we always seem to get it), will get nothing but a nice wall paper job over bullshit.

So scream and yell back and forth over who is right and who is wrong, all it does is prove my point that we are being played like harps and are so willfully ignorant of it all.

[Beacool]

180. If this wasn't so serious, it would be ironic.

The man always struck me as a B.S. artist. His soaring speeches during the primaries were all about platitudes and overreaching statements that made me uncomfortable ("we are the ones we've been waiting for" and the one about the waters parting and the planets aligning, etc.). Did the man think he was some kind of prophet who was destined to save us? To me he was just another Chicago politician who rose through the Daley machine. The first big clue was the way he managed to get every other Democrat thrown off the ballot when he ran for the state senate. It may have been legal, but it sure showed the kind of person he really was.

This may seem like heresy on this board, but to me Obama's candidacy was more about Obama than about the larger good of the nation.

As I see the house of cards collapsing, it brings me no joy to want to scream: We told you so!!!!

:(

[JTFrog]

183. ...

[Beacool]

184. The little guy made me laugh.

:D


:hi:

[Clintonista2]

224. So far I've resisted saying "I told you so" but

Everything I said about the guy during the primaries has come true.

[Beacool]

243. It's the first time I said it.

I waited more than a year, but like you, I feel about him now the same way I felt during the primaries. Oh, well.......

:-(



:hi:

[4dsc]

181. And Obama wonders why we liberals are pissed??

One more reason President Obama is not getting my support in the coming elections.

[L0oniX]

187. I guess he won't be needing our money for re-election now.

[RoccoR5955]

193. I knew it, and I know when it happened.

It happened when it was changed from health care reform, to health insurance reform. I saw it happening, right before my eyes.

[craigmatic]

203. It was obvious from the start but at least people are talking about it now.

[SandWalker1984]

204. I found out too late that Obama's not working for us -- he's working for the Business Roundtable

There's an article by David DeGraw that explains that a group of economic elites are calling the shots for the White House:

The Most Powerful Destructive Corporate Business Club Most Americans Have Never Heard of

http://www.alternet.org/economy/145996/the_most_powerful_destructive_corporate_business_club_most_americans_have_never_heard_of?page=entire


In the article David commented:

The Business Roundtable is the most powerful activist organization in the United States. Their leaders regularly lobby members of Congress behind closed doors and often meet privately with the President and his administration. Any legislation that affects Roundtable members has almost zero possibility of passing without their support.

For three major examples, look at healthcare and financial reform, along with the military budget. The healthcare reform bill devolved into what amounts to an insurance industry bailout and was drastically altered by Roundtable lobbyists representing interests like WellPoint, Aetna, Cigna, Pfizer, Eli Lilly and Johnson & Johnson. Obama and Congress are trying to please the Roundtable with a bill that supports their interests. This led to the dropping of the public-option put forth in the House bill. However, when it came to finishing the bill, Roundtable members began to walk away from the process. That’s the real reason why the reform bill has stalled. Obama met with the Roundtable on February 24th, in hopes of getting healthcare reform back on track. After that meeting, he held a bipartisan healthcare meeting with members of Congress.




If you still believe the Senate HCR bill's main goal is to benefit Americans at the expense of industry, I have a lovely high and dry piece of swamp land in Florida that I will sell you for a really good price.


:crazy:

[ThisThreadIsSatire]

209. I wonder...

If the final bill has a public option, will he veto it??

[Laelth]

210. k&r for the truth, however depressing. n/t

:dem:

-Laelth

[alp227]

211. And...if Congress agrees on public option, President O'Pharma will veto

I felt like screaming at my computer once I saw the title of this post. I thought that Obama was gonna bring change, unlike Bush the Bank Bailout President. Instead, he'd still rather be a corporate suckup, whether for health care reform or education. For schools, Obama's secretary of ed plans on a private overhaul. Notice something?

[Whisp]

214. I'm going to wait and see...

I don't believe much of what the big media has to say because
1. they're big fat disgraceful liars and
2. they have just as much on the chopping block as anyone if their little bribed and bribees are ruffled up by this hcr.

[florida08]

217. I may be wrong

but wasn't it the NYTimes that wrote up the lie about Acorn and that spliced video and now refused to issue a retraction? Just saying.

According to Lynn Woosley "Woolsey, along with other members of key House committees, met with Obama on Thursday and pressed the issue with the president. "The president doesn’t believe there are 51 votes in the Senate, but if there , he’ll support it," she said http://motherjones.com/mojo/2010/03/obama-will-support-public-option-if-votes-are-there

Sebelius has said the same thing that if the senate leadership wants a P.O Obama will fight for it. I don't think they're all lying, but at any rate Congress should put it in and put him to the test. Let us see where he stands.

(edited for spelling)

[Clintonista2]

218. But...but...but... he's a chess master!

We just can't understand because he's so far ahead of us!!!!111!!!!!11!!!!!

[golddigger]

219. lol

[emulatorloo]

220. LOL - "quoted Chip Kahn, chief lobbyist for the for-profit hospital industry"

Sorry, I don't put much stock in the "word" of a Hospital Industry lobbyist.

[h9socialist]

222. This doesn't mesh well with other reports . . .

. . . that the public option is in the House reonciliation bill.

[Uncle Joe]

225. If you're referring to an exchange of for profit health insurance, that's not a true public option.

A public option must be preeminently geared toward the publics' best interest and that would be non-profit.

[h9socialist]

235. To be honest . . .

. . . my idea of a "public option" looks a lot like the National Health Service in Great Britain.

[earth mom]

226. Not surprised by this one damn bit. Pissed off, but not surprised.

:grr:

[nutshell2002]

228. Unfortunately,

I am neither surprised nor pissed off. I am done with it all. I used to wonder how some people could live their lives not giving a damn about anyone else as long as they were doing ok. I'm almost embarrassed to admit that I'm beginning to understand.

[fatbuckel]

227. NY Times Reporter Confirms Obama Made Deal to Kill Public Option brought to you in the Huffington Po

It`s such a good story the Times didn`t want it.

[Bluebear]

234. holy trolly!

[Deadgnome]

232. Since when?

Did reporters reporting what other reporters reported constitute reporting? I'm at a loss at how these people can't seem to do their jobs correctly. This needs to be reported on, investigated, and illuminated, not just passed along from one reporter's mouth to another. Sometimes I miss the expose.

[chromotone]

233. Well, this certainly explains things...

Health-care reform should have been sewn up a year ago, and we could have moved on to other issues.

This whole health-care reform "debate" should never have taken this long.

[amborin]

241. too late to recommend! just disgusting but not surprising with this administration

one ghastly revelation after another

[Ean Juan]

245. Not sure

President Obama has not said he made any deals to kill the public option. I find this a bit hard to believe.

[aquart]

251. Way back in the primaries...

I looked at his house deal and looked at his statements about it. I said this man can look you in the eyes and lie with the deepest sincerity.

The response was "Yes, we can!"

Maybe next time we won't give our country to a simplistic slogan.

My disappointment is in thinking he would have been more skilled and adroit. But this simple a sellout for which we got NOTHING...

[Incitatus]

252. What did he get in exchange?

[upi402]

256. What did Clinton get for NAFTA, GATT, Telecommunications Act, Welfare "Reform"?

These guys are Republicans but they are very smart. So it can't be blind ideology. Power is a drug that takes down the best. That's my theory. Because neither will be allowed to play with the big boys -ever.