Liberal Bloggers to Obama and Dems: We Told You So

[FourScore]

Liberal Bloggers to Obama and Dems: We Told You So
Peter Daou
Political consultant, former adviser to Hillary Clinton
Posted: January 19, 2010 09:08 PM


It took more than half a decade, countless American and Iraqi deaths in a war based on lies, a sinking economy and the drowning of an American city to finally kill Bush-Cheney-Rove's dream of a conservative realignment.

Democrats, controlling the White House and both houses of Congress, have managed to kill their own dream of dominance in 12 months.

How did it happen?

Theories abound, but two diametrically opposed narratives have taken hold:

The first, promulgated by conservatives, is that the new administration has moved too far to the left and alienated a large swath of independent and moderate voters.

The second, pushed by progressive activists and bloggers, is that the administration hasn't been true enough to fundamental Democratic principles, has embraced some of Bush's worst excesses on civil liberties, and has ditched popular ideas (like the public option) in favor of watered down centrist policies, thus looking weak and ineffectual.

The conservative argument is unpersuasive. After years of a systematic effort by the right to use Overton-style tactics to radicalize our national discourse, the center has moved so far right that the left is barely recognizable. With a military surge in Afghanistan, a denuded health insurance bill limping through Congress, Bush-era detainee policies reinforced, a deflated climate summit, and a windfall year for bankers, among other things, it's almost ludicrous to claim that the new administration is run by a gang of lefties.





The case by progressives that Democrats are undermining themselves with faux-bipartisanship and tepid policies gets much closer to the heart of the problem. I've written a number of posts arguing that it's all a matter of values and ethics. In essence: when you fail to govern based on a morally sound, well-articulated, solidly-grounded set of ideals, you look weak...

SNIP

...Nothing should have been a bigger red flag to the new administration than the growing complaints by established progressive bloggers that Democrats were veering off track on the stimulus, the health care bill, civil liberties, gay rights, and more. But scoffing at the netroots is second nature in many quarters of the political establishment, even though they laid the groundwork for Obama's victory. The single biggest reason Obama's hope bubble burst is because of the unintended convergence of left and right opinion-making...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/peter-daou/liberal-bloggers-to-obama_b_429031.html

[anonymous171]

1. K&R. nt

[CaliforniaPeggy]

2. Sounds reasonable to me.

And someone already unrecced this?

Unbelievable.

We not only look weak.....we are.

K&R

[Lorien]

5. Recced to neutralize their unrec

the author speaks the truth!

[grahamhgreen]

3. It is critical to reiterate: Obama is failing because he's way to far to the right.

[joeunderdog]

33. Senators and Congress Critters just got that memo last night.

Too bad they weren't paying attention earlier. Lucky for us, it was a special election and not mid-terms.

TIme to wake up.

[harun]

68. That's the memo they should get but I can't say I have much hope they

will actually "get it".

I might write my Congress Critters and highlight this point.

It seems like all B*sh did for eight years was pay attention to his base, now we get a Dem majority and it seems like all Obama is doing is paying attention to B*sh's base, not the base that got him there.

[ima_sinnic]

73. yes, it seems the haves and have-mores are both parties' base now

-- and everything must be weakened and watered down by "bipartisanship"--a prescription for epic fail and NOT what the 2008 voters wanted.

[MessiahRp]

149. You're most likely right on the message they will take away from last night...

What they probably will take away is, "Oh no, people were upset by the health care bill and even MA has swung to the Right. We better swing further to the Right if we want to court these voters."

I have no faith in these people. When things go in our favor they shift to the Right. When we lose they say it was because we weren't Right Wing enough and shift further to the Right. It's sickening.

Rp

[tblue]

108. They didn't get it in November? How many wakeup calls do they need?

We did tell them so. Despite so many people telling us to shut up and give it a few more years.

We didn't expect everything to be fixed in 14 months. We just wanted our elected Dems to show us they're really on the right path and committed to the principles they ran on. Is that too freaking much to ask? If it is, we end up with Scott Idiot Brown in Ted Kennedy's seat. Do they freaking hear us now???!

[lsewpershad]

130. Wake up

and work even harder during the mid-term to get more progressives elected.

[dotymed]

45. Absolutely

So far to the right, that most Americans are convinced that there is little to no difference between D&R. I am convinced...

[Robb]

51. Obama is failing because he's not listening to DU.

That will be clear when he spends the next week doing everything we suggest. Right down to Kucinich replacing Biden.

[nutshell2002]

126. Obama is not "failing"

He is exactly the president he planned to be. He is exactly the president I expected he would be.

[Robb]

140. Sorry

...didn't think that one needed a sarcasm tag. :hi:

[Toasterlad]

143. Indeed! This Country Is Well On It's Way To Being a Paradise!

Oh, wait. He hasn't actually started CHANGING anything yet. So, in that case, I suppose you're right. One can't be a failure if one doesn't try.

[KonaKane]

161. You want Bush back?

Personally, I don't. So maybe you should wake the hell up and realize a hard path away from the Bush nightmare is still better than being in the Bush nightmare.

Or have you forgotten so soon?

[grahamhgreen]

168. I hadn't noticed he left!

[mnhtnbb]

172. He hasn't! The guy who told Brownie what a heck'uva job he was doing on Katrina got hired

to help with relief to Haiti! No wonder the a$$hole was smirking all through the announcement!

Who the f*ck hires a f*ck-up for a repeat job?! Huh?

[Peregrine Took]

174. Good one! n/t

[bitchkitty]

183. LMAO! Good one. nt

[bvar22]

176. So Obama needs to be MORE Conservative...like Bush?

THAT doesn't make ANY sense. :shrug:

I can't believe there is a group of people on DU arguing that Obama needs to "stay the course" which isn't working except for Wall Street Bankers, and CEOs of Health Insurance Corporations, or the MIC,

OR

Move ever further to the RIGHT....towards BUSH.

Doesn't make ANY sense at all.



"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[rhett o rick]

203. That has to be the lowest. Do you want bush* back. So what you are saying is

forget HCR, we dont need it, after all what we have is better than bush*. All I can say to you is, you must have a job and health insurance and dont give a shit about those that dont.

[KonaKane]

214. Try again

I asked a pointed question of someone who obviously equates Bushhole with Obama. So here it is again.

Do you want Bush back? Because I sure as fuck don't.

It doesn't mean I'm satisfied with all of Obama's moves, but on his worst day, he's still not as bad what we had before him. Attempts to say otherwise is the most cementheaded false equivalency I've ever heard, just because you're frustrated.

Try perspective.

[rhett o rick]

222. Yes perspective. Stop comparing Pres Obama with bush*. nt

[ldf]

223. perspective???

fulfilling campaing promises would be a novel concept. remember when a man or woman was worth no more than their word?

returning to the basic tenets of the democratic party would be a novel concept. instead we now use them for nothing but window dressing. its REALLY all about the corporate bottom line.

support for labor and jobs at home with living wages, would be a novel concept. outsourcing jobs, off shoring corporations, avoiding corporate taxes should be treated as treason, because it is destroying this country.

support for women with control over their own bodies, would be a novel concept. giving up any hard earned rights in that area is unacceptable.

support for gays and equality for all, with the declaration that NO ONE'S civil rights are subject to popular vote, would be a novel concept. it's in the constitution.

support for our government spending our hard earned tax money on ways to help keep us alive and well, without causing a family's financial ruin, all for the sake of huge corporate profits, would be novel concept. the health care industry in this country is a disgrace. unless you are rich.

support for switching our economy from one dependent on the selling of death, to one selling the improvement of life, would be a novel concept. weren't warned about the military industrial complex?

realizing that when the people voted for "change", the ad campaign concept obama himself chose, they actually MEANT change, would be a novel concept. again, you are only as good as your word.

being a president of visionary concepts, hopes and ideals that were put into practice, rather than a president that used them as nothing more than bait to get people to the polls, would be a novel concept.

a president that furthers the realities that have been created, reinforced, and codified into legislation by the very people who caused this mess, then surrounding himself by those very same people who are the CAUSE of this mess, is NOT the change we voted for.

so,...

in the dlc mind, did he not move far enough to the right? or, more likley, is the rabid leftwing fringe now purposely setting out to destroy him?

what else could it be? :sarcasm:

he's better than bush? big fucking deal.

[motorcityliberal]

205. Running home isn't a option

If anything progressive should look at it's the right wing take over of the GOP model from the last 40 years, they started low i.e. school boards or city councils then move up to state reps and governors then United States reps and senators and finally electing a drunken frat boy who went AWOL to the office of president of the United States. It's going to be longer because we have to deal with a shitty Republican enabling media and a nasty ever present right wing media to deal with but isn't a Democratic party that holds true to progressive values more important?

Running home with your ball is no longer an option for the 2010 and the 2012 elections, because the other side has been taken over by nuts these are not if support gay marriage you're going to hell nuts, it's the let's start another civil war and kill liberals kind of nuts if you don't believe me go to a tea party website or read one post on Free Republic.

I rather stick things out and fight for a better Democratic party than place this country at the mercy of the misinform and the ultra right wing stupid and pray the misinform make the right choice by guessing.

[nutshell2002]

238. "You want Bush back?"

Why is that always the response around here? No, I don't want Bush back. I, like most folks I know, want the candidate we thought we voted for, campaigned for, and contributed our hard-earned money to. Geez.

[grahamhgreen]

167. One can't be a failure if one doesn't try. - nice -

[rhett o rick]

202. So you are ok with the Brown win? nt

[Common Sense Party]

224. We are ALWAYS correct.

WE are the mainstream. Politicians ignore us at their peril.

[FourScore]

93. You and I know that. I am just worried that they will read it as being too far to the left.

With Rahm advising him...I have my worries.

:shrug:

They need to know: People voted for change, they need to provide it.

[liberation]

118. There are less than a dozen of reps/senators which could be considered center-left

There is not a single elected official in both houses which is actual left or extreme left.

Most of the members of either house are either center (however, the political compass in this country has been so biased to the right, that these centrist would be considered center-right almost everywhere else in the democratic world) and the rest are right/extreme right.

So the problem it is not just that Obama is too much to the right (he is center-right by any unbiased assessment), the issue is that less than 2% of our elected officials in both houses could be considered as being anywhere near the left.

The left traditionally caters and represents the interests and policies of the middle and lower classes (the working class really is a composite of both of those two socio-economic classes). In other words: the majority of the population. While the right, at basic socio-economic level caters and defends the interests of the upper classes. Sure they throw a bone to the religious morons in the middle and lower classes, but that is just because they need their votes. So we could make an argument, that the most represented class in our government are the millionaires. Which make less than 5% of the population.


The interesting thing is that the rest of the 80+% of the population which make the middle and lower classes, the socio-economic interests of that 80% chunk of the population is represented by less than 2% of our elected officials in the legislative branch.


Until we realize that, we... all of us in the middle and lower classes, we are useless. And we can bitch and moan all we want, but I know that I am correct because the 4 decade track record of utter contempt for the middle and lower classes by both houses (never mind the executive and judicial branches) is pretty much self apparent. I mean, when was the last time any of you saw congress pass any legislation which was unabashedly defending and furthering the interest of 80% of the US citizens? Heck, let's take a quick look at the health care reform debacle: the vast majority of the population not only demanded but wanted an actual reform which benefits the average citizen (either universal coverage or at least a form of single payer). Instead the proposed bill gives the insurance companies (the culprits of this mess) everything they demanded and in some issues... congress gave them even more. Why? It is very simple, millionaires representing millionaires... will no doubt work to defend and further the interests of millionaires. In fact, to add insult to injury... citizens who just wanted to attend the negotiations, they were arrested simply for being in favor of single-payer. In any other country in the industrialized world, the jailing of those citizens alone would have lead to massive riots and general strikes.
But not here, no siree bob. We're so stupid, that most people thought the best approach was to not rock the boat, lest the massas in congress not throw us a couple of crumbs if we are too "uppity." What a bunch of morons we are...


So if the Dems decide to push further to the right, so be it (it is their prerogative after all). But I submit to you, that then it is up to us in the middle and lower classes to find/create our own party which will unabashedly stand for and defend our interests. Else we will continue doing monumentally stupid things like putting our hopes in a San Francisco socialite for example, while we will continue wondering why she is helping her cocktail buddies. How much stupid can we get?

[grahamhgreen]

166. The only option I see is the Greens. But we really need to make our party act for the people.

[HillbillyBob]

211. I feel the same.

Now to do the work. I am at a loss myself and failing health does not help.

[bvar22]

178. The American People are WELL to the Left of the Democratic Party:

Here is what the MAJORITY of Americans (Democrats AND Republicans) want from OUR government!

In recent polls (2005) by the Pew Research Group, the Opinion Research Corporation, the Wall Street Journal, and CBS News, the American majority has made clear how it feels. Look at how the majority feels about some of the issues that you'd think would be gospel to a real Democratic Party:

1. 65 percent (of ALL Americans, Democrats AND Republicans) say the government should guarantee health insurance for everyone -- even if it means raising taxes.

2. 86 percent favor raising the minimum wage (including 79 percent of selfdescribed "social conservatives").

3. 60 percent favor repealing either all of Bush's tax cuts or at least those cuts that went to the rich.

4. 66 percent would reduce the deficit not by cutting domestic spending but by reducing Pentagon spending or raising taxes.

5. 77 percent believe the country should do "whatever it takes" to protect the environment.

6. 87 percent think big oil corporations are gouging consumers, and 80 percent (including 76 percent of Republicans) would support a windfall profits tax on the oil giants if the revenues went for more research on alternative fuels.

7. 69 percent agree that corporate offshoring of jobs is bad for the U.S. economy (78 percent of "disaffected" voters think this), and only 22% believe offshoring is good because "it keeps costs down."

http://alternet.org/story/29788/

9. 92% of ALL Americans support TRANSPARENT, VERIFIABLE elections!
(Why isn't THIS a MAJOR, Front Burner Issue with the Democratic Party?)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x446445

"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[winninghand]

199. Obama, the right wing extremist...

Interesting.
:shrug:

[ecstatic]

232. If true, then why did voters turn to a teabagger?

Who is extreme right???

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lorien]

6. We HAVE worked for Change. We got Obama elected, we fought for health care reform

Obama ran on a platform that he abandoned once in office. Right or Left, that never plays well to those who put a candidate into office.

Enough with the idol worship. Waving pompoms no matter what policies he supports doesn't help a damn thing. What is YOUR position on the ISSUES, and what do YOU do to fight for them??

[democracy1st]

12. +1

[Dogmudgeon]

22. You fought. Then you stopped.

When you stop, you lose.

We began with the "Obama has forsaken us!" cry ONE MONTH into his term.

I wrote more, but it's all down to mass progressive rage and blame now.

Later today, I'll check in with the local Democratic Party HQ and see where we go from here. I hope that you will do the same, or similar.

--d!

[Lorien]

196. You have no fucking clue what ANY of us have done

so just get over yourself.

[Robb]

49. ...And then started complaining.

Weeks after the inauguration. Call yourself a fighter, but you stopped fighting right when Obama told you to start. Exactly then, in fact.

Why did no one "hold his feet to the fire" until it meant losing a Democratic seat in the Senate??

[whathehell]

56. I believe he was supposed to do a little "fighting" himself !

[jeff47]

132. What, exactly, do you think we should have done?

We called our congresscriters. We called the WH. We basically used every venue available to say "Hey! Morons! You got elected by a large amount of liberals to do liberal stuff! Get back to work!".

And we were told to shut up.

So what, exactly, should we have done to "Hold Obama's feet to the fire" before now?

[dionysus]

234. dupe.

[dionysus]

235. they "hold his feet to the fire" every day. by whining on a message board, silly rabbit.

:D

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JVS]

18. Boo hoo! Poor Obama, having to face expectations.

[Hello_Kitty]

19. Blah blah boring cliches

Tell me, what were YOU doing to organize support for the watered down corporatist compromised positions of this administration? What, you thought we'd do it for you?

[Dogmudgeon]

24. I see the hipsters have been busy

No substantive crit OR dialog; just the usual "I'm right, you're wrong" tap dance.

Howard Dean -- "Doctor Dean" -- said the same damn thing, about the futility of blame and complaint, to Rachel Maddow this evening. It fell on deaf ears.

(Well, not completely.)

--d!

[Hello_Kitty]

94. We get it. The DLC is never wrong.

When in doubt, blame the dirty fucking hippies.

[ima_sinnic]

28. fuck your "pony" argument and shove it

when I saw doctors and nurses being arrested for having the audacity to want that "seat at the table" to speak on behalf of single-payer, as they were "promised," with not one word from Obama--well, that was when I really started losing it.

Obama and the Dems in Congress seem to forget that We The People gave them a mandate for Change, not some moronic "bipartisan" bullshit. Sheesh--with Obama's gift of eloquent persuasiveness and the backing of 3/4 of the country, he could get bold initiatives passed--but no, we always must kiss republican butt in the name of "bipartisanship"--fuck it, just merge the two parties and get it over with. Obama ran falsely on some ad agency gimmick of "change"--and voters have drifted away, apathetic and cynical.

[Grinchie]

226. I lost it whem Michael Taylor got reappointed to the USDA

How can you have real health care reform when you have a corporate lobbyist for Monsanto "regulating" food safety. Add to it that the news was purposefully squelched for several days, and the paid, Monsanto fan boy club was out in force prosletyzing the benefits of having a Monsanto insider heading the USDA Food Safety Program.. "Who better to know that tricks of Monsanto?" they bellowed. All the usual subjects, now using alternate aliases to hide their tracks for the current crop of fuck ups.

Yep, that's Obama alright. Owned and operated by the Military Industrial/Bankster complex. Supported by the DLC Blog Squad, and supported by the DU Moderator Moles planted to make sure that dissenting voices are censored and silenced.

Come on mole, I dare you to delete this post.

Sorry Obama, game over.

It's not that I blame Obama, but he is the fall guy for this Corporate fuck up, and even though I feel sorry for him, I don't think for one minute that he will be held accountable for the continuing fraud he helps to nurse along until the ultimate collapse.

[dotymed]

47. I totally disagree.

If President Obama actually wanted to fulfill his campaign promises and he asked Americans to take to the streets or whatever, to help him change the status quo...we would be there. It is kind if like; he turned his back on us first, then we also turned away. It would take a show of real progressive action(s), but if he did this, we would be there en masse.

[Robb]

52. So you didn't listen to his victory speech, then.

I would humbly suggest reading it.

[bvar22]

179. You are absolutely right.

Who could have figured that letting Joe Lieberman and Olympia Snow write the Health Care Reform Bill would piss off so many Democrats? :shrug:

Sheesh, People.
Get with the program and CHEER whenever they tell you to cheer.
Don't get all caught up in that "Issues" and "Policy" Bullshit.
You don't want to "waste your beautiful mind" on that stuff.

"Centrism"...because it is so EASY!
You don't have to STAND for ANYTHING,
and get to insult those who do!
:party:

[Robb]

186. Interesting post.

...Which has nothing to do with what I posted. But when all you have is a hammer, I guess you see nails everywhere. :D

[Name removed]

227. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Robb]

229. Wow.

Even for you it wasn't that complicated: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7516452&mesg_id=7518004

[totodeinhere]

92. Your attitude is just the thing that is bringing the party down.

Not the opposite. I'll repeat what I asked in an another thread. Does anyone honesty believe that Coakley would have lost if we had passed single payer? We have let the American people down and we had better get off our asses or there will be a bloodbath in November.

[Grinchie]

228. You nailed it. The DLC Toadies have jumped the Shark, and fell short

They actually beilieve that people cannott tell the difference between right and wrong, and now they've had the wake up call, are STILL in panic and confusion.

I don't think they will be able to pull any more rabbits out of their a__ Hats.

[Selatius]

142. So, it's not possible to march in an anti-war protest AND maintain a fucking blog? nt

[bkozumplik]

keep telling yourself that

mumbling it to yourself alone in your corner. Heres a stapler for you to hold.

[Lorien]

198. Lol!

:thumbsup:

[Name removed]

207. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. DLC crowd is out en force

when people say he is a socialist, I kindly point out he is a centrist.

[Lorien]

10. They certainly are. Like a troop of babboons flinging RW poo. nt

[Individualist]

107. +1

[Echo In Light]

43. Astonishing, isn't it (not that they're out, but that so many buy into their poison jive)

[whathehell]

57. Most of those idiots couldn't define "socialist" anyway

Many seem to think it's interchangeable with "fascist".

[abelenkpe]

95. +1 nt

[katty]

124. right-Obama is a centrist, always has been

[BP2]

8. Have you seen the HCR Bill? It's full of compromise and stalled. Told you so.

[JVS]

11. oh boy

:popcorn:

[BunkerHill24]

13. No need to get upset one single loss

Maybe we need to focus on other important upcoming elections...instead of blame game?

[nadinbrzezinski]

15. I imagined Virginia and New Jersey

No they were not to the US Senate, but still.

[RedCloud]

139. In Va. the repugs needed to get out almost their entire registry to win.

The dems were very unconcerned about inheriting a faulty government.

[no limit]

67. Right, lets not figure out how we lost one of the most liberal states in the country

lets just move on to lose some more seats in November without asking any stinkin questions that might make the democrats look bad.

[BunkerHill24]

138. It was very upsetting night for all us

it's hard to fathom indeed, and I'm still pinching myself thinking it was a bad dream.

[bvar22]

180. Not hard to fathom at all.

"When given the choice between a Republican, and a Democrat who acts like a Republican, the voters will choose the Republican every time." ---Harry Truman

QED

[TheEuclideanOne]

104. Rahm, is that you?

You can't be serious, right? Are you missing a sarcasm tag? With people like your mindset, we will be killed in November. Congrats, I think you may have made the stupidest comment I have read all day.

[BunkerHill24]

136. No one was more pissed off than I was at that moment

But where do we go from here was what I was trying to say.

Cheers!

[jeff47]

133. Because if we don't focus on this one single loss

Then we're gonna be slaughtered during those other important upcoming elections. Putting the blinders on and continuing over the cliff is not a good idea.

[PADemD]

219. The same thing happened in PA with our local elections.

The Republicans won.

[democracy1st]

14. K & R

[Smashcut]

16. The funny thing is that the public option WAS the "watered down centrist policy"

And then we didn't even get that!

[lapfog_1]

17. K & R.

and might I add "Yup-per Ding Dong"!!!

[Abq_Sarah]

20. Most people aren't hard core

About their politics. They vote for what sounds good to them and they reward politicians who don't lie, by reelecting them. Those are the people both sides try to reach.

[Blue-Jay]

21. Being correct is awesome!

[hfojvt]

23. the bloggers argument is unpersuasive

In case you didn't notice, the goddam voters elected a Bush Republican. Because they wanted to help move the country to the left? Because they are angry about not enough leftward movement, they elected a rightwinger?

I think the voters are pretty stupid right now, but I don't think they are THAT focking stupid.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

26. Their argument completely falls apart when you look at the turnout.

The turnout was impressive for a special election, on both sides of the aisle. It also falls apart if you look at the poll numbers and understand that Coakley squandered a massive advantage in the past two weeks. There are two possibilities here. According to blogger logic, everyone on the left suddenly, and within the past two weeks completely and radically altered their feelings towards the national Democratic party. I find that extremely difficult to believe given the relative lack of interesting developments in the national political scene during that timeframe. The other alternative is that she squandered it through massive incompetence - a suggestion backed up by pretty much everyone with direct experience in MA politics.

[leveymg]

27. The polling wasn't picking up the growing levels of disaffection among two key groups

1)progressive party activists who, themselves, voted for Coakley, but didn't sweat blood to turn out Group 2), the alienated Democratic-leaning voters -- young Dems and minorities -- who turned out in droves for Obama, in large part because of the Herculean organizing and GOTV of now disaffected Group 1 Dems.

The level of (dis)affection and (de)mobilization of the base isn't picked up by traditional polling.

[LiberalLovinLug]

103. Third possibility - election fraud

http://www.blackboxvoting.org/

Funny how Coakely won the hand counted precincts, and Brown won the Diebold counted precincts.

[skyounkin]

154. Easily could ahve been fraud

cause the rethugs know the dems are too scared to call them on it.

[Yurovsky]

220. After 2000, I always question a rethug "win"

and in Mass., no less. Doesn't add up to me. Could it have happened as the corporate media is reporting? Possibly, but you can't trust those bastards. They'll stop at nothing to subvert the will of the People.

[jeff47]

135. Perhaps it would be good if you actually did look at the turnout

http://thinkprogress.org/2010/01/20/exit-poll-of-mass/

Obama voters stayed home.

[ima_sinnic]

31. no, voters who put Obama in office just didn't bother to come out

when all you hear is No We Can't after a big campaign on Yes We Can, it makes people apathetic.
"bipartisanship" will be the death of the Democratic Party, as will taking people's votes for granted. When all people see is deal making with billionaires and "hearings" behind closed doors that end up with a mandated giveaway to the corps, they're not going to continue supporting Democrats.

[Tesha]

60. It's okay -- we'll just keep repeating that lesson until the DNC either a) learns it ir

b) dissolves as a national political party.

The DLC bloviators can deny it all they want, but
a few disasterous election cycles will convince
everyone else.

And right now, 2010 and 2012 are looking to be
unmitigated DLC-inspired disasters.

C'est la guerre.

Tesha

[Name removed]

129. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Raineyb]

146. If it blames Nader like a DLCer and makes excuses like a DLCer

you'll have to excuse people for thinking it IS a DLCer. You wouldn't expect people who hear a quack and see a waddling bird to expect a turkey would you?

[hfojvt]

147. nice of you to dust off the old gay-bashing metaphor

I am not gonna apologize for not hating the Democratic Party. Blaming Nader is simply fact-based. Either you can argue the facts or you can call somebody a DLCer.

[Raineyb]

159. Excuse you? Where the fuck do you get off claiming that the duck metaphor

is gay bashing? THAT is straight up bullshit. And you can fuck off for making that accusation.

And to address your bullshit assertion, and that's all it is, Nader had every right to run and the Democratic party is not entitled to anyone's vote. They have to EARN it. If they don't that's not the fault of the people who decide that the Democratic party wasn't doing a good job of representing what it is they want.

[hfojvt]

165. it seems to have wider and differing applications

but it is often used to question either somebody's gender or sexuality

http://eurout.org/2009/08/25/lesbian-visibility-if-it-walks-duck-and-quacks-duck

[Raster]

163. "Blaming Nader is simply fact-based"

What a diaper load!

[hfojvt]

164. well that sure answers the facts

not that I really want to go around and around with Nader winning deniers again. See the strawmen above.

Hint: saying that "Nader helped to elect GWB" is not the same thing as saying "Nader had no right to run". Not even tangentially related.

[bvar22]

182. NO!

The Democratic Party left a big sucking vacuum on The Left.
Vacuums are filled.
If not Nader, it would have been someone else.

Your refusal to hold the Democratic Party Leadership accountable is EXACTLY what produces historical repetition.
Nader was NOT a Superman who knocked the wheels off of the entire Democratic Party.
He WAS/IS a wimpy little policy wonk who recognized that the Corporatized "Centrist" Democratic Party Leadership had abandoned its base.

If YOU continue to perpetuate the Nader was Superman myth and blame the voters, NOTHING will be done to fix the REAL Problems, and history WILL repeat, like last night.

QED

[hfojvt]

187. right. I am sure Nader had not more impact

than the socialist candidate, whose name still escapes me, despite the fact that I knew him from an email discussion list for about half a year. McReynolds. Sure, McReynolds would have had the same impact as Nader. edit: Do YOU remember McReynolds? I am sure he tried to have the same impact as Nader. Everybody runs in order to get votes.

Nope, don't buy it. Ralph Nader was a leftwing hero until 2000, and still is to many Nader winning deniers. He definitely had an impact, and it was all bad.

[mdmc]

193. If only Nader didn't participate in democracy

We could have Joementum in the white house right now!

[LibDemAlways]

101. When voters see that their vote for change meant more of the same -

war, bailouts for bankers, continuing job losses, foreclosures, a corporate giveaway "health care" bill - it's no wonder they stayed home or voted for the repuke this time around. The Dems have no one to blame but themselves.

[hfojvt]

128. sure it does

at least you hope so, eh?

Sorry, I don't believe most people are that pathetic either. That because they don't get what they want after twelve months that they will give up and let the other side win. The leftists of DU might be that pathetic, but not most people. Although, curiously enough, the leftists of DU have still not given up on bashing the Democratic Party, which they still seem to hate more than they hate Republicans.

Gives a whole new meaning to the phrase "Never Give Up"

[pattmarty]

34. Well, they are that "focking stupid". When 2/3rds of the workers..............

...............in this country make LESS than 50K per year AND they then vote for Bush or Scott Brown, then they are either "focking stupid" OR grossly uninformed and uneducated. Take your motherfucking pick. Where in the fuck did the FDR/LBJ Dems go? We basically have a one party system in this country now. The "choice" is either BAD OR WORSE. Last election we voted for BAD after we had WORSE for 8 yrs. I know, I know, I voted for the "change we can believe in" too.

[hfojvt]

125. there's another choice

If you are a liberal, then it is stupid to vote for a Bush-type or allow one to win by either not voting or voting for a Nader. Admittedly, I myself did the same thing in 1992 because I saw both Bush Sr and Clinton as moderate Republicans. Crazy maybe, but after Reagan, Bush Sr. seemed like a moderate, and I still think he was about a billion times better than his son.

However, it is not stupid to vote for a Bush-type if you are conservative. I don't think it's stupid to be a conservative just because you have low income. But I do think it is extremely stupid to want to move the country to the left, but then help to elect Republicans. Yet that is what so many DUers seem to encourage or cheer (see, for example, jgraz's re-run on the front page).

[NorthCarolina]

53. You send a message with the tools at your disposal. Brown was the only tool they had

and they sent their message. Perhaps this message is too nuanced for some to grasp, and of course these are the folks that the MSM and DLC talking heads will pounce on in an attempt to make this flawed and deceptive message fact. For many of us however, the real truth behind this vote is abundantly clear, and it is absofuckinglutely not about moving the Democratic Party further rightward under the banner of the DLC.

[Autonomy]

153. agreed

The left wing is a lot like the right: they will twist any abject loss into some sort of affirmation of their worldview/strategy/feelings/etc.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

25. Sorry, at which point since the invention of the blog...

...have liberal bloggers not been predicting horrible doom and gloom? Cause I'm pretty sure I remember a lot of that from like, every recent election.

[girl gone mad]

30. I seem to recall widespread predictions of hope and change..

in 2008.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

160. Ya, that lasted about 72 hours, while everybody was still drunk. n/t

[NuttyFluffers]

63. well, blogging really took off after 2000, so that tends to explain it.

btw, i end up replying to a lot of your posts tonight. how odd, for i have no intentions of following you, but somehow your posts draw forth my commentary. i will chalk it up to being entertained... perhaps i like the visual of liberal bloggers throughout the blogosphere applying lipstick to their pouty lips with back teased hair like The Cure.

[Joanne98]

29. Exactly but will they listen? The Republicans are telling them to move to the right.

It's a set up!

[Chulanowa]

32. In other words: "Liberals" cheer for Brown; smug in own fecal matter

"We told you so"? Well, I'm happy that you're happy.

Why, with Brown in there, we'll be getting liberal legislation night and day!

...Oh wait! No we won't

[RainDog]

36. way to miss the point

it's amazing to me that you can read this and STILL REMAIN IGNORANT about the problem of trying to govern from the right as a democrat. THIS IS OBAMA'S PROBLEM, not the problem of people on this forum.

no one that I see is happy that Obama chose Rahm and Geithner, etc. those were HIS CHOICES. HIS MOVES. HIS MISTAKE.

Choosing to dump the public option up front was Obama's move. Choosing to support the insurance co give-away was HIS CHOICE.

He is living with the fall out from those choices.

If democrats want to win, they have to govern for the people, not the insurance cos.

Blue dogs may make a lot of noise, but they cannot bring people to the polls outside of their own small states. The larger population blocks in the U.S. that vote for democrats are populated by union members, feminists, gays, minorities and, yeah, even atheists.

so, when the democrats shit on all those groups, the dems can expect to be turned out of office.

THAT'S the lesson the democrats should have learned over this last year. Whether they will or not remains to be seen.

[PVnRT]

50. Horseshit

No one credible is "glad" Brown won. You DLCers can take that talking point and shove it up your ass.

[Puglover]

54. Bullcrap.

No progressive is happy that Brown won. Epic fail. :thumbsdown:

Nice try though. Keep repeating this crap loud enough and often enough you and your DLC buddies might even believe it.

[dotymed]

58. Hey...reality check here.

At this point we may not have a "super majority" in Congress. We do have a majority (at this point) and the republicans governed and passed all of their corporate legislation with a simple majority. This is a "shot over the bow." If the Democrats do not immediately change course and start being Democrats (Progressive, for the majority of Americans not the elite), then they are through. We need a viable third party, which I have posted til I am sick of saying so, every Progressive,I think, realizes this by now. We have, in Congress, a few members who actually govern for the (95% majority) of the people. They need to form a political party of their own. It is the only alternative to the "right of center" "Democrats" who currently are in power. A "right of center" Democrat is a republican. I hope the current administration will now open it's eyes and see and smell the shit that they are in. Obama the candidate railed against corporate rule. Obama the president is just the opposite. If he makes an immediate return to Obama the candidates ideas, he can retain Democratic control. If not, it's back to republicans, one party, two faces...

[ima_sinnic]

72. +1 million

one engaging progressive who really understands the frustration and anger of voters, even of teabaggers, could capture the votes of everybody who's feeling screwed over. THIS is the moment when a third party really could change the course of the status quo--but it would require extreme hard work and dedication, because every "mainstream" outlet will be against it, esp. the media, which will always focus on the "2 major parties" (as though they're not really 1 big one). The voters need to overwhelm that machine.

Thank goodness for the Internet, because critical mass could be reached now. A real leader is needed who can galvanize people and give them a central focus of their energy and commitment.

[mdmc]

194. +1

[Individualist]

109. Damn the DLC

[dionysus]

236. !

:spray:

[malaise]

35. Excellent read

I posted this last year.
http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2009/03/political_ideology.html

The 2008 presidential election not only solidified demographic and partisan shifts toward the Democratic Party but also marked a significant turn in the ideological landscape of the electorate. After nearly three decades of public acceptance of the Reagan-Bush model of
conservatism—limited government, tax cuts, traditional values, and military strength— a broad and deep cross-section of the American public now holds markedly progressive attitudes about government and society.

-------------
Apparently Obama, Rahm et al have not read this Study.
The progressives are right - the party has forgotten it's principles and its mandate. I hope lessons are learned but I suspect they will scurry further to the right. The more Dems move to the right, the more they will lose - the lunatic right prefer their own lunatics.

[LWolf]

37. Yes.

As my sigline attests, I did so, and have been doing so, for a long time now.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

66. "Missing Topic"

:shrug:

[LWolf]

209. I haven't checked it in awhile.

It's been there for at least 6 months. It was a link to a post I made back in the primaries, pointing out Obama's center-right positions and the fact that, if he was the best the party could do for a nominee, the party was in big trouble.

There was nothing in that post to break the rules, but I guess a loyalist it could have alerted. It wouldn't be the first legitimate, in-compliance post ever deleted, lol.

I'll have to ask admins what happened to it.

[RBInMaine]

38. All bullshit. It is the economy, economy, economy. Bad economy = pissed off at majority party.

[zeemike]

39. Then why the fuck don't the blogger lead?

Instead of just following.
Why don't they organize themselves into a tea party too?
And why are they not taking to the streets like the tea baggers, or organizing a counter protest to confront them?
Is it that they are just too scared?

[clear eye]

46. That's the first reasonable complaint I've seen on this thread.

Your post is the only negative one that doesn't falsely accuse the bloggers of being happy about the situation and wanting Republican victory just because they analyzed public opinion correctly and tried to warn DC Dems. BTW, wouldn't a group that wanted a Dem defeat and saw a serious problem emerging KEEP IT QUIET AND TRY TO LET IT HAPPEN RATHER THAN SHOUT "DANGER!" FROM THE ROOFTOPS AND TRY TO GET THE GOV'T TO CORRECT THE ERROR?

It is riskier for progressives to organize street demonstrations than it is for rw teabaggers to do the same. For one thing, if they get out 25 people at a shot like most of the teabagger demos do, instead of the MSM saying how upset the American people are (like they do after every tiny teabagger demo), they will either disparage the small turnout and say it shows a lack of support, or not report it at all. Being blacked out of the media discourages the participants. For another, the corporatist-oriented gov't tends to refuse progressive groups permits, threatens to arrest progressive planners of unpermitted demos as "terrorists", and brings out scary maiming "non-lethal" weaponry if the demo is even moderately large.

All of the above doesn't mean progressives shouldn't "lead" as you put it, by daring to organize, set clear proposals, and mobilize. It just means it's harder for them than for teabaggers.

edited to add: Single payer activists have been regularly demonstrating in many places around the country in greater numbers than the teabaggers w/o getting a single line in the MSM.

[zeemike]

48. All of that is true.

But if every tea bag protest was countered by a large counter protest the media could not ignore it so easily.
But I guess the left is a bunch of scared cats...afraid of losing their jobs or afraid that the tea baggers will bring out the guns....I don't know but not willing to risk anything.

[clear eye]

55. How would progressives know where & when those jerks are going to pop up? n/t

[zeemike]

61. The same way they know

They advertise it.
But we don't and we let them get there air time with no dissenting commentary from the press.
If the shoe was on the other foot they would surly act.

[clear eye]

62. I think they notify members at their mtgs.

I've never seen an ad for a teabagger demo, have you?

[zeemike]

65. All the time, but I don't shy away from sites with dingbats on them

Know thy enemy is always good advice
and any one really wanting that information can get it in the world of the web.

[proud2BlibKansan]

119. Sign up to get on their email list

That's what I did.

Google 'tea party' and you should find some national groups where you can look up what's going on in your area.

[GinaMaria]

112. The teabaggers were organized by right wing leaders

Their websites were purchased months before Obama was even elected. This is an organized arm of the repukes that is meant to look like a common person uprising. It's very similar to the Brooks Bros. revolt during the 2000 election. It's all staged. Some of the participants might not realize that, but this is a right wing stunt meant to look like a populist movement to further the right wing agenda by claiming to have a mandate. Don't buy the bs that a group of people organized themselves into a tea party. This was planned and the structure put in place long ago. Everything was ready for when people sounded the alarm to join a 'spontaneous' tea party movement.

What we need is a little street theater of our own.

[zeemike]

148. Yes I do know that

And I agree we need some street theater of our own....but no one on our side seem interested in organizing that same kind of thing to counter them. too me it is a deliberate show of weakness.

[krabigirl]

177. I completely agree!

I was thinking of doing it myself, but no way would I call it a tea party. I think more people should LOUDLY protest things Obama does that they dislike, especially when he goes back on promises. You don't have to be a racist teabagger to make your point.

[zeemike]

230. Our problem is not with Obama or politicians.

Our problem is that the media is working against us and thus the politicians are disposed to playing the game with them.
The purpose of any counter demonstration is to show the viewer that there are significant numbers that oppose them. and it would be difficult for them to ignore a noisy and significant number of people making that protest.
And if we don't do it they will swamp us.

[scentopine]

40. "centrists"

Centrist
–noun
1. (esp. in Obama Admin) a member of a political party who empathizes with the need for corporations to make profits without the encumbrance of principals, morals, ethics, civil law or criminal law;

2. a politician who holds a smug composition of academic purity; takes path of least political resistance; deferential to wealth and power; conservative; moderate; realist.

[GinaMaria]

115. nothing center about it except

it is right smack dab in the middle of the right wing spectrum. I guess it's the core for the status quo. But it is not the center position between right and left. That actual center would be a remarkable move to the left.

These folks are right of center and need to be labeled as such. To continue calling them centrists is misleading as misleading as labeling butter fat-free and just as toxic to our well being.

[scentopine]

170. Another deceitful euphemism for right winger just like "fair and balanced" -nt

[droidamus2]

41. Run to the center, win, then pick a side

The political truism is that you have to run to the middle to get the independent voters but I think once you have won you need to pick a side. Voters like candidates that they perceive to stand for something (right or wrong as the perception may be). When you try to govern from the 'middle', and yes I agree that the current middle is actually well to the right of center, people think you don't really stand for anything or have strong beliefs about the direction of the country. Having a 'bipartisan' atmosphere in Washington is a laudable ideal but the job is to run the country and in the case of a Democrat to progressively move the country forward.

Another point is that if you try to govern from the center and the opposing party is staunchly to one side and you insist on the idea of 'bipartisanship' then any legislation coming our of Congress is going to be skewed to the opposing side. The real bipartisanship in this country, if we are stuck with a two party system, is to have one party be solidly progressive and try to move the country forward through progressive change and to have the opposing party be solidly conservative to help control the excesses of unrestrained progressive change. Notice the use of the work 'solidly' think of the use as indicating that the political spectrum is spread across far-left, solidly-left, centrist, solidly-right, far-right.

[lonestarnot]

44. What bullshit. Stopped reading at first sentence.

[droidamus2]

190. Oh Gee!

I am sooooo upset that some dweeb on the internet doesn't agree with my opinion. Grow up I don't give a damn if you agree with me I just put out my thoughts so others can see them. If you agree and want to read them or don't agree and still want to see the other sides ideas great. Otherwise don't read them and go your own way. Besides if you don't agree how about reading my whole post and then stating why you disagree and what you point of view is. I don't even really know why you disagreed because you statement was pointless.

[Octafish]

42. PeteNYC hit it outta da park.

It's no green monster. Dems don't win acting like repukes.

[Soylent Brice]

70. "Dems don't win acting like repukes." - SPOT ON.

[Toots]

59. You must not have heard, Liberals have no where else to go

It doesn't matter how far right Obama and Congressional Democrats push the agenda, they feel safe because progressives are in a box, they have no where else to go.. Strategy put forth by Rahm and the Obama Administration. I personally feel insulted by it but I am sure they could care less. After all I have no where else to go...Granted I will never vote Republican but I really no longer see any reason to vote at all. After this past year it has become obvious to me they have a right wing agenda and I will not give it my vote.. PERIOD I remember all of the great speeches, saying raise taxes on those earning more than $250,000. a year. Any move in that direction, nope. I remember well "Main Street Not Wall Street" Well the banker's bonuses are sure a lot bigger than mine, especially since I had to take a pay cut...Soaring rhetoric is just that, rhetoric, when it comes to actions the exact opposite seem to be the case. I am pretty much done..They have nine months to try and redeem themselves, but I would not bet even a wooden nickel on them doing so..

[harun]

69. Unfortunately I echo those sentiments.

[alberg]

64. Called both my Senators and Congressman this morning

and told them that the message from Massachusetts is that Americans want real HealthCare reform, not mandated giveaways to the Insurance Companies, jobs, and a regulated Wall Street that prevents bankers from holding our economy hostage. That means moving to the "left", not the "right".

[newtothegame]

71. I don't think you can "told you so" when they weren't listening to you in the first place.

Sorry folks, but the President of the United States doesn't come to an anonymous online-blog for his political information, especially one with hundreds of tombstones, locked, and deleted posts a day.

[ima_sinnic]

75. the Democratic Party has strategists that most assuredly keep their finger on the pulse

and Rahm's "message discipline" rests on reacting to and disrupting blogosphere postings.
The horde of DLC shills here on DU reports the arguments they encounter and are given new talking points to counter those--they're so easy to spot, all parroting the same bullshit, calling anything that doesn't fit the "discipline," "irrelevant."

They ignore the postings of the ignored and disenfranchised at their own peril.
They can keep pretending that We The People are "irrelevant" and continue to lose elections, or they can respond to the real needs and concerns of voters who aren't in the base of haves and have-mores.

[DisgustedInMN]

74. That's right, DLCers...

WE TOLD YOU SO

You insulted us in return. You demoralized us in return. You spoke to us in condescending crapola in return.

THEN expected us to pick up the ball YOU fumbled and score for you.

But you were WRONG.

Tragically, sadly, utterly WRONG.

:nopity:

[closeupready]

80. Many progressives will not work to advance a DLC agenda, nor GOTV for DLC Dems.

If DLC dems continue to court conservative DLC-leaning voters, Republicans will continue picking up seats, due to apathy from progressive, Democratic voters and also to the fact that legitimizing GOP talking points only serves to popularize Republicans and the Republican Party.

Way to go, Rahm! :eyes: :mad:

[DisgustedInMN]

82. Thom Hartmann has oft...

.. repeated a quote (from whom fails me just now} ..

"Given the choice between a Democrat that acts like a Republican and a real Republican, the real Republican will win every time."

Or words to that effect.

[closeupready]

89. I believe that's a Truman quote, and it's correct.

n/t

[scentopine]

215. "legitimizing GOP talking points only serves to popularize Republicans" - Yes! Perfect!

I posted this back in Sept. 09, and I've tried to say the same things back in May 09. It is like watching the Hindenburg...
----------------
The right wing is brilliant at transformational politics. We can post all day how they are assholes and turn a blind, disingenuous eye to our own party bullshit.

Republicans believe in shock and awe. It works. They put their best blow-hards out front. Carpet bombing us 24 hours a day with extremist rhetoric. This softens us up. It desensitizes us to the point where we start accepting these extreme views as uniquely American and legitimate. They can do this because they own so many media outlets. They did a similar thing when they purchased Christian, Inc. in 1980 or so. When they bought the jesus trademark, they bought an outlet for a weekly address to millions of voters. We've all watched right-wing christian nut jobs lecturing about the greatness of Bush and Cheney and the evils of democrats. Palin still got a scary number of votes.

Now how about the democrats? Well, Rahm and Obama know that a majority of people don't like extremes at either end of the political spectrum. So they see an opportunity to ride in the slipstream created by the right wing blow hards. They let the right wing do all the heavily lifting, and they move just the slightest bit to the left and suddenly they are seen as "moderate centrists". This is called political relativism. It looks like we are moving left, but it is just a few clicks left of fascism. (you are in a car, passing another car, the other car looks like it is going in opposite direction, but both cars are still speeding to the cliff).

And this is how things like torture, wiretapping, wall street fraud, corporations running their own candidates and financing them, and the idea that insurance companies are exclusively allowed to set public health policy are legit. These are ideas that run afoul of every intent of the constitution. And democrats are willing to compromise ethitcs, morality and constitutional protections for the "preservation" of their party. Believe it or not Democrats are a corporation like GM. They are re-inventing themselves, having lost the battle to keep corporations out of policy making. Democrat, Inc and Republican, Inc need to take care of themselves (and corporate benefactors) first. The public is near the bottom of current priorities.

What this means is that as long as the right wing is pushing the envelope, democrats don't have to work very hard. We'll pick up republican voters who don't like the extremist nonsense. But in turn, these new democrats will demand republican policy priorities. No problem. Its all about "winning" and some people are just so happy to see a democrat elected (yeah for team Obama!) they don't care if that democrat is actually promoting policies against public benefit nor do they care that the policies are exactly more of the same stuff from the previous republican.

With the right-wing doing all the hard work for our corporate designed government, the dems can "coast" on the perception of good will. The brilliant part is that its win-win for republicans. Even when they don't have a majority in congress or exec, they still indirectly control and have final word on policy decisions.

And while republicans are making so much noise about evil Obama, privately they think Obama is their chump and they are very glad to have him on board. It is a diabolical brilliance.

[closeupready]

233. I agree with every single point in your post.

Wish I could K&R it alone. :hi:

[Lydia Leftcoast]

76. This isn't a matter of Right or Left--This is a matter of Up or Down

Working class Americans are angry and frightened, and with good reason. Their standard of living peaked in 1979 and has fallen since then. However, thanks to America's anti-intellectualism and locally controlled schools, they don't understand WHY they're in such desperate circumstances.

Along come the right wing media to tell them that it's all the fault of the liberals, the feminists, the people of color, the immigrants, and the gays.

The left-wing media has been AWOL for thirty years. There is no left-wing Fox News, no left-wing Reader's Digest, no left-wing Rush Limbaugh, nothing that explains the facts about society in terms that working class people will accept.

The left wing is sitting around talking to themselves, often including slams at "stupid" working class people. They use big words and sophisticated analyses, but like the position papers on Candidate Kerry's website in 2004, these carefully wrought analyses never seem to get translated into simple language for public consumption. Instead of coming up with simple, easily understood sound bites that offer specifics and relate to where people are (struggling), they mumble generalities or latch onto unimportant issues. (My own senator Amy Klobuchar is a prime example of this approach, with her propensity to advocate earnestly for all trivial issues and write non-committal gobbledygook about important issues.)

Now the right-wing media are tools of the elite, but they always talk as if they're on the side of the family that has two full-time workers and is still falling behind. They talk as if they understand the working class person's struggles. They subtly play on people's prejudices.

Well, the right wing had gone too far by 2008, and all but the dumbest or most nakedly greedy of the Republican voters could see that Bush was a disaster. So they voted for something DIFFERENT. They voted for a candidate who pretended to be a Huey Long populist.

What did they get?

Someone who not only continued almost all of Bush's policies but appears to lack the courage of his own convictions. Someone who has changed masks overnight and no longer seems to know or care about ordinary Americans. (At the time of the bank bailouts, I was astonished at how unanimous opinions on my local paper's website were. The usual leftist suspects like me and the usual wingnut suspects were ALL opposed to bailing out the banks without requiring them to clean up their act. They hated it when Bush did it, and they hated it when Obama did it.) Someone who talks about health care for all Americans and then silently allows all the good parts of the bill to be bargained away. Someone who seems unconcerned and unable to do anything about the worst job market since the Great Depression. Someone who lacks the leadership skills to tell the Blue Dogs to go to hell and make them look forward to the trip. Someone who seems to be waiting for his next cue from the DLC. Someone who doesn't have a clue.

If you're a working class American, you have seen NO DIFFERENCE between the Bush and Obama administrations.

We may rant about how "stupid" the working class is (Way to win friends and influence people there!) and wonder why they're voting against their own interests, but the way they see it, NEITHER party has their economic interests at heart.
Oh sure, the yuppie Dems wonder why voters choose candidates who are against abortion and gay rights and feminism, but the fact is that working class people ARE socially conservative and are rewarding the party that pretends to share at least their social principles.

The Dems could get away with violating these social principles if the voters could see a tangible economic benefit to voting Democratic.

They haven't even see any moves in directions that will help the working class, and they are no longer confident that the Democrats have either the will or the skill to get anything done.

The Democrats appear to be serving the same moneyed elites that the Republicans serve.

If the Dems were not corrupted by the same moneyed interests as the Republicans, they could win over working class voters by

1. Making it extremely difficult for companies to export jobs or import low-wage workers
2. Either instituting single payer or expanding the public health clinics so well that everyone was in easy reach of one
3. Putting blue collar Americans to work building new infrastructure (experts were complaining about our deteriorating infrastructure in the 1970s) and affordable housing.

These measures would make a real difference in the lives of working class Americans and ensure a Democratic majority for the next generation or two, just as FDR did.

But no, both the Republicanites and the Dems are addicted to corporate bribes. They're both on the side of the Ups, not the Downs.

[clear eye]

79. Please. Check into reality. When Air America tried to create a counter to Limbaugh et. al.

they were hit with an advertiser boycott. The same financial situation pertains to other media.

If you are truly in sympathy w/ a traditional Democratic agenda STOP BLAMING THE PROPONENTS OF IT. There are things we can do, but they begin by accepting that there are formidable forces arrayed against this agenda and working from there. Your effort to form a circular firing squad is a humongous fail in my book.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

83. Air America was too little, too late

and the leftist press that exists is very good, but it is not appealing to the masses.

My point about the politicians still stands.

[clear eye]

86. YOU... ARE... NOT... BEING... CONSTRUCTIVE. eom

[Lydia Leftcoast]

100. What do you want me to do, finance my own radio network?

We HAD a powerful radio voice in Jim Hightowner on ABC in the early 1990s. He was fantastic at taking confused right-wing voters and making them see the flaws in their thinking without being insulting. So when ABC dumped him, it would have been an opportunity for the DNC to find sponsors and a new venue for him, even if they had to tap into Hollywood types to do so.

You can be sure that the RNC was backing the right wing media guys all the way.

Furthermore, there are some very good talkers in left-wing community radio around the country who deserve wider audiences.

But even beyond radio, if you've ever looked at supermarket tabloids, you know that their political stance is relentlessly right wing. It's always "heartless bureaucrats" and "crazy government red tape" and "persecution by the IRS" and "shameless welfare cheats" in their non-celebrity articles.

Where are the left-wing tabloids, the ones with articles about "heartless company owners" and "crazy workplace regulations" and "persecution by bigoted workplace colleagues" and "shameless corporate welfare freeloaders"?

And paging Al Gore, what on earth possessed you to buy one of the few worthwhile news sources on cable (Newsworld International) and turn it into a vanity station where viewers submit videos? Why couldn't he have kept it as it was and promoted the hell out of it? (It was not advertised anywhere, and I found it only by accident.)

The PR efforts of the Democrats have been so tone deaf, so inept, so misplaced, that you have to wonder what they really want.

[clear eye]

114. You make my point for me.

ABC dumped Jim Hightower. Advertisers boycotted Air America, and you think the right response is to belittle their effort.

Most mainstream newspapers are close to bankruptcy now, yet you berate progressives for not establishing their own.

Unless you can afford to finance the radio network, quit blaming the people supporting the progressive agenda for not having one.

Come up w/ something we actually can do in your posts instead of dumping on us, or STFU. YOU ARE NOT BEING CONSTRUCTIVE.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

120. I'm not talking about mainstream newspapers, but about

TABLOIDS for reaching the vast portion of the population that doesn't read mainstream newspapers but eats up celebrity gossip.

And now? The Dems aren't broke. They would get more and better media coverage by first cleaning up their own act so that they have something to brag about and then putting their best, most populist speakers out on the news programs (and making all the Blue Dogs ambassadors to remote Third World countries with poor communications networks).

They could borrow a page from Peter DeFazio and rely on low-budget fundraisers that ordinary people can attend with no special "access" for large contributors.

If they MUST have those $25,000 a person fundraisers, use the money for media saturation.

But above all, they should DO something that benefits ordinary working people SOON.

Because if they don't, all their media efforts will be wasted.

[jonestonesusa]

84. Amen!

Your post deserves its own thread. Spot on!

[RedstDem]

105. That's Dead On

I'll second that

[TBF]

150. Excellent post.

Should be an OP on it's own.

[fitonkpo]

77. Actually, I DON'T hate to tell you "I told you so."

I told you so.

I was raised in a union hall. Delegate for Paul Simon at 17 and on the central committee's platform committee. The Democratic Party is supposed to be the party of the middle and working classes. Obama and Co. sold us out. Now take your punishment. I would never vote Republican, but that is no guarantee that I will vote Democrat.

I hope you learn before the corporations loot America and toss it over their shoulders like an empty beer can.

[closeupready]

78. Another major K&R this morning.

We have some smart people here on DU. :hi:

[icee]

81. From a noted Progressive full of rage today...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stephen-gyllenhaal/and-so-it-better-begin_b_429122.html

[DisgustedInMN]

85. I'll second that.

Listen up or be prepared for the shitstorm that arrives in November.

[icee]

88. Democratic Underground needs to come up with a list of things

for Obama to do, and then campaign on that list.

[Ken Burch]

152. We did that in THIS thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x134935

[RedstDem]

99. Hammer Meet Nail

That's dead on.
Too bad Obama chose to corrupt the meaning of "change", just makes it that much harder for real change to happen. The dems and repukes should just merge into one party, then there will be room for a progressive party.

Gridlock on the hill looks better everyday, don't it.

[icee]

122. Yes, it does. Glad you said that.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

102. "Another poor fellow who fell on his sword for douche bags"

Wonderful phrase.

[MissDeeds]

87. K&R n/t

[Stumbler]

90. Yep, I think some of us have been saying that for a while now.

[avaistheone1]

91. We knew this was going to happen.

Obama and Rahm have ignored and disenfranchised the left at every opportunity.

Pay back is a bitch.

[SlingBlade]

96. K & R FourScore: We Progressives Didnt leave the Party

The Party left us.

Time to get back to business and fight for the soul of this Party
cause we are NOT Re-Puke Lite's or anything close to it.

[ProSense]

97. We told you a teabagger would be elected in Mass.

Ludicrous. This is opportunistic drivel.

People who voted for Brown or decided not to vote for Coakley decided it was better to cut off their nose to spite their face. Mass will reap the benefits of an idiot.

[Toasterlad]

141. "Mass will reap the benefits of an idiot."

And the rest of the country will follow suit in November.

Keep blaming the left for Democratic failures instead of fixing what's wrong with the Democratic party. A BRILLIANT strategy. I'm pretty sure even Scott Brown can come up with something better. After all: he WON.

[spin]

98. k&R (n/t)

[igfoth]

106. Bipartisanship has always been Obama’s Achilles Heal

That has always been my biggest beef with him. One cannot work with people who would rather see him dead then see America move forward.

With the election of the lunatic Brown Obama is now a lame duck for the rest of his term.

Perhaps the DLC will finally figure out that bipartisanship does not work and that when Dems run as a Pub Light they LOSE everytime.

Obama is no longer of any use to the party, we would be better off backing Dean or Kucinich to run against Obama in 12 and backing real liberal and progressive candidates to run against all of the Blue Dogs.

We will never be able to pass a progressive agenda as long as the Blue Dogs and Corporatists are in the party.

[Don Draper]

110. Regardless if one is "right" or "left", it is obvious people in power

tend to be out of touch and delusional.

If I were to bet, I would say the Democrats will try to "move to the center" (not like they weren't there to begin with). It is unlikely they will ever see that they are nothing without the base.

[GinaMaria]

117. They are right of center

To move to the center would require them to move left.

[Don Draper]

158. You are right, I agree 100% which makes this even more scary

[highplainsdem]

111. K&R

[JDPriestly]

113. Obama just wanted to use us old-time Democrats.

(The right-wing press has labeled us as "left," but really, we are old-time Democrats.)

Well, these days we communicate with each other and get information that has not been dyed some strange color by the media and we know when we are being jerked around. Old style politics where politicians say one thing and then go to D.C. and vote for the opposite are not possible today. If you promise not mandate for health care without a public option, if you promise Medicare and Social Security benefits, if you promise to raise taxes on those receiving high salaries in order to pay for the Baby Boomers' retirement, then you had better keep those promises. We voters are watching to see whether what you say you will do and what you do match up.

So, politicians need to take heed. Time has changed. The voters have changed. You can't fool us so easily any more.

[whatchamacallit]

116. Shout it from the mountaintops

Finally some fucking reality... :applause:

[Deep13]

121. It's just a flesh wound! nt

[Goldstein1984]

123. I don't know about other Progressives, but...

I definitely fall under the second theory: "...the administration hasn't been true enough to fundamental Democratic principles, has embraced some of Bush's worst excesses on civil liberties, and has ditched popular ideas (like the public option) in favor of watered down centrist policies, thus looking weak and ineffectual.

The short-term future of the Democratic Party seems to be a function of whether they believe and act on the correct theory. I have no problem pursuing "fundamental democratic principles" without the party is they take up permanent residence in the center. They are, after all, fundamental.

[katty]

127. I say go fundie-progressive, start actin' up 'progressive' & get right

back at RW hacks & crazies in their faces. Dems have been carrying knives to a RW gun fight!

[Goldstein1984]

137. Democrats have not been doing what Democrats should do.

Today's Democratic Party is a party of surrender and compromise. No leaders are willing to speak out the FDR did. No leaders are willing to lead in the streets, the way MLK did.

The only question that should matter for democrats is: Will this contribute the the general welfare of the people? Instead, they worry about the impact on the price of stocks, and whether their decisions will cost them political contributions. As if the health of Main Street was a one-to-one function of the health of Wall Street. The jobless recovery, with unemployment indicating the welfare of Main Street, while the DOW recovers and executive receive huge bonuses, should be a clear message that the welfare of the many isn't a function of the welfare of the few.

We need a Democratic Orthodox Party.

[jwirr]

131. K & R

[AlbertCat]

134. Democrats, controlling the White House and both houses of Congress, have managed to kill their own..

dream of dominance in 12 months.


**********

Having 59 votes in the Senate is a killed dream of dominance? We still have the White House and the House too. This is a KILLED DREAM?


Shut up!

Thanks for continuing to act as if the GOP is in charge.

[Toasterlad]

144. "Thanks for continuing to act as if the GOP is in charge."

I believe it's the DEMOCRATS who are acting as if the GOP is in charge.

[katty]

169. that is certainly what it looks like re: their behavior to date

[David Zephyr]

171. Thank you, Tosterlad. You have it exactly right.

!

[AlbertCat]

181. I believe it's the DEMOCRATS who are acting as if the GOP is in charge.

That's what I meant! Sorry for being vague.

But the hyperbole about the end of some dream of being in charge of everything....

I thought it was the Repugs who dreamed of being in charge of everything. And although we don't have the newly-important super-majority, we still have a huge majority.

[Hamlette]

145. Yippie. Jane won! She sure showed Obama who is boss. Now 30million go without health care

but that doesn't matter to the "I told you so" crowd.

(and if I never hear Overton window again I'll be happy)

[jgraz]

173. Really? You're blaming this on FireDogLake?

Are you sure you don't want to save some recrimination for ACORN? :crazy:

[Hamlette]

189. didn't the op say the liberal blogs were to be given credit?

isn't Jane the loudest "on our side" screeching about how horrible Obama and HCR is?

How the hell is Acorn in on any of this (I'd do a cute little icon here but I don't like to imply that other dems are crazy.)

[jgraz]

191. Given credit for predicting exactly this result.

How do you conflate that with actually rooting for (or causing) Brown to win?

And yes, FireDogLake is to the Angry Center what ACORN is to the Teabaggers: a convenient scapegoat.

[bvar22]

201. "screeching about how horrible Obama and HCR is"

Exposing the HCR Bill for the Corporate Welfare it is, and pointing out Obama's lack of leadership would be a more honest way of putting it.

Gee, who could have guessed that letting Joe Lieberman and Olympia Snow dictate the HCR Bill would make so many Democrats unhappy? :shrug:

LESS than 35% of ALL American support Mandates without a Public Option, and most of those aren't Democrats anyway....
So who are Obama and The Democratic Party Leadership working for?
America can easily figure that out.

"When given the choice between a Republican, and a Democrat who acts like a Republican, the voters will choose the Republican every time." ---Harry Truman

QED


"I didn't campaign on a Public Option."

[Autonomy]

151. Funny

I see a message to the Left Wing: abandon mainstream Democrats, and you get Republicans. When a Dem is in office, you guys claim both sides are the same. So you abandon Dems, get a Republican, and suddenly realize, AGAIN, that they are not the same. It's fuckin' comical.

[gorfle]

155. Here it is in a nutshell:

"The second, pushed by progressive activists and bloggers, is that the administration hasn't been true enough to fundamental Democratic principles, has embraced some of Bush's worst excesses on civil liberties, and has ditched popular ideas (like the public option) in favor of watered down centrist policies, thus looking weak and ineffectual."

There you go.

The right is never going to love Obama. They are a lost cause. Trying to court them did not get you into the Oval Office, and it will not keep you in there.

What energized your electorate was the HOPE OF CHANGE. Change from the last 8 years of fuck-ups. Hope for health insurance that takes the profit motive out of paying for health care. Hoping for a turn-around in our economy.

As the article notes, we still have the worst excesses of Bush's erosion of civil liberties. The Public Option is dead in favor of catering to insurance companies. I am relatively pleased with his maneuvers on the economy but I am still annoyed that the bulk of the help has gone to big businesses and not to the average American in trouble. I personally would have rather seen the banks not get a penny and instead have that money spent to re-finance every mortgage in America, thus pushing Americans' cost of living lower and not only keeping us in our homes but helping make us more competitive on the global work market.

[wowimthere]

156. Dems should have stayed progressive. Republicans fought the stimulus...

And the Dems started blinking.

[defendandprotect]

157. America is a LIBERAL nation being abused for decades by right wing political violence...

More than 72% of the public wants a government run health care system like

MEDICARE FOR ALL --

The Obama administration knows this -- Rahm knows this -- Democrats in Congress

know this . .. we all know this --

So what's going on --

Those who control the party - the DLC corporatists aren't here to resurrect the

Democratic Party -- they are here to destroy it --

FIRE RAHM EMMANUEL N O W !!

He's run another election into the ground --

[Hardrada]

162. And another health care plan too. He screwed up the Clinton one also.

[defendandprotect]

204. Really? Didn't know he was around then . . . and hear he has two brothers ...!!

Zeke and Ira!!????

But I was trying to think of the terrific guy who began the health care movement

at that time ... he became a Senator -- name began with "W" . . .

wondering if you might remember?

:)

[Hardrada]

210. I think it was a senator from Wisconsin. I'm not sure.

Might have to do some google searching!

Rahm's brothers are Zeke and Ari.

[defendandprotect]

212. Can't do searches right now . . . computer problem . .. but he was a terrific guy!!

What do Zeke and Ari do???

I know there is dual citizenship with Israel -- and big support for AIPAC!!

Don't like it --

[Hardrada]

225. I think Zeke is helping to wreck public education

and the other one is some kind of film exec or agent in Hollywood. He has a bad attitude also. I can't see these people are any kind of great asset to Western Civilization and in fact seem quite the opposite.

[bvar22]

175. This is nothing new..

"When given the choice between a Republican, and a Democrat who acts like a Republican, the voters will choose the Republican every time." ---Harry Truman

"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone



No wonder "they" had to kill Wellstone.

[amborin]

185. the bulk of the working and middle classes haven't benefitted, either!

[Douglas Carpenter]

184. kick and recommend

[Uncle Joe]

188. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, FourScore.:thumbsup:

[katty]

192. in the words of Frederick Douglas...

Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will.

[tblue37]

195. People on our side NEED TO STOP SUPPORTING THIS

BASTARDIZATION OF LABGUAGE: "watered down centrist policies."

There is nothing "centrist" or "moderate" about the rightwing and corporatist policies and politicians that have been labeled "centrist" and "moderate" by the MSM! Lieberman and McCain are NOT centrist or moderate, and neither are the Blue Dog Dems like Nelson. The Senate health care bill is not centrist or moderate, either.

[AllTooEasy]

197. ...and everyone else in America told you so!

[motorcityliberal]

200. Don't get it

The Republicans showed the Democrats and President Obama their playbook and yet they're still trying to reach out and play nice with them.. If this was hockey the Democrats would stand around and watch the Republicans slam President Obama around the boards.

[midnight]

206. The White House has squandered the greatest opportunity to change both the country

and the political landscape since Ronald Reagan. It should have started with a non-watered-down stimulus package big enough to stop the bleeding in the job market -- and a smack-down of any Republican who dared to utter the word "deficit" after 8 years of reckless, unpaid Republican spending. It should have followed with stringent regulations on Wall Street and protection of homeowners and small businesses instead of with a jobs creation program inside the administration for failed bankers and failed regulators. A stimulus -- including a jobs program -- strong enough to prevent the hemorrhaging of 700,000 jobs a month and a muscular approach to the bad actors who had crashed the economy would have gotten the public firmly behind the President and the Democrats, demonstrating to the average voter that they have a choice between one party that's on their side and another that's not. Instead, the White House just blurred the lines between the parties so the average American couldn't tell the difference.http://www.huffingtonpost.com/drew-westen/obama-finally-gets-his-vi_b_429232.html

[wordpix]

208. damn straight, now Obama, get the train back on track. We didn't vote you in to get

BushCo Lite and "let's get along with the repukes."

[TexasObserver]

213. Recommend

[bertman]

216. Recommend.

[Zhade]

217. KandR

NT!

[bkohatlanta]

218. They just don't get and they're going to blow it again.

They passed a bill which sold us out, now foreign drug imports, triple insurance rates for people in their 50's, etc... Now they think doing less will be better.
They did nothing.

The lesson is they should have fought 100% against the rich and powerful.

Obama is turning out to be a total failure. He doesn't believe or fight for anything. He compromises everything away.

I am so proud of Helen Thomas, she calls them right.

[johnaries]

221. The result is that Congress will have to move to the right.

It's already begun.

I cry for America, because it seems most Americans would rather believe lies than try to understand Truth.

[ecstatic]

231. they sure showed him! Keep up the GREAT work!!! Maybe we'll get a Cheney next time

:sarcasm: :eyes:

[dionysus]

237. b-b--but, it's patriotic to undermine the president out of spite because your preferred candidate

couldn't poll over 1% !!

:patriot: