Religious right demands government stay out of health care, demands it intrude into our bedrooms.

[madfloridian]

and into the doctors' office when women need reproductive care. And into the pharmacies when women need contraception and emergency treatment to prevent pregnancy.

Just think about those stances. They are out yelling to keep the government out of Medicare (a government program)...they are yelling that government play no role, saying it is socialist.

Yet they want government right in the middle of the sex life of women, looking out for their reproductive rights, forbidding them to have abortions.

They are right in the middle of sexual preference, instead of staying out of peoples' private business.

It does not occur to them how foolish it all sounds.

There's an interesting post at RH Reality Check called When Church becomes State

She makes some interesting points, but there is one that stands out. It again shows the utter hypocrisy of many on the religious right.

When you’re in the Peace Corps, you expect culture shock. But it’s generally not supposed to come from your countrymen. Among many foreign experiences I had in Honduras a decade ago, interpreting for a brigade of fundamentalist Christian doctors was perhaps the most disturbing.

They set up their operations in our dance hall, triage at the entrance and stations of doctors inside. They brought enough free medicine to put Pfizer on notice and dispensed it generously to the hordes who had walked up to four hours seeking a few moments of attention to make up for a lifetime without medical care. This, of course, seemed a right and noble thing.

But then I noticed that, in addition to the expected diagnostic questions, the Spanish-speakers manning triage kept asking “Es Ud. evangelico o catolico?” Tragically, only the first answer got you into the queue. While I quickly rushed out to let my neighbors know that they were all evangelicals for the day, I was horrified that these good samaritans deemed this an acceptable way to ration their aid. Here was public assistance with strings attached; a foreshadowing of when church becomes state. This may have happened far away in a “banana republic”, but our Banana Republicans seem determined to bring this home to stay.

Weeks ago, readers of this site were rightly fuming when Congress threw another $50 million down the abstinence-only wishing well. Right-wing intentions to police sexuality by restricting abortion, blocking access to birth control and opposing marriage equality are well known. Equally clear are their desires to eviscerate social assistance, visible through efforts to block a public option for health care, privatize education by making public schools undesirable and cut assistance to people in need.

Much ink has been spilled and many explanations offered for why the right seems determined to demand government interference in matters of sexuality and so eager to block government involvement in matters of welfare. They care a lot about who we’re sleeping with but it’s on us to afford buying a bed.

The word catolico translate "catholic"...I had to look it up. The other is self-explanatory.

There is a strong group of anti-choice Democrats now. The Democratic committees chose them to run even though they did not support the rights of women to choose. The more we give in to them and to the religious right the more they demand.

Democrats took abortion coverage out of health care reform, now the right is demanding that birth control not be covered.

Our party has made it clear to the religious right that there will be NO payments for abortion in ANY plan for health care reform. Gee, you would think that would satisfy them.

No, it doesn't. The more we give in on any issue, the more they demand on other issues.
Groups are pushing hard in at least 24 states to make sure that insurance does not cover birth control prescriptions.

They continue to push for laws that will restrict rights of women based on their religious views, they continue to scream that we must not cave on DOMA and DADT which seriously harm the rights of gays.

And we let them do it. Our party has often adopted the rhetoric of the religious right, making it sound like the only good American is a Christian American.

The hypocrisy is overwhelming. The right wing wants government to be hands off on health care, but they are demanding that government peek into our bedrooms, control our sex lives, and control the rights of women to make their own medical decisions.

[BrklynLiberal]

1. No hypocrisy there....

:mad: :crazy: :silly: :wtf:

[madfloridian]

5. Right you are...none at all.

:shrug:

[Maraya1969]

2. PLEASE provide translation. Cotolico mean Catholic. I know this because

I just had to look it up!

[madfloridian]

3. Me, too...I had to look it up. I should have translated. Time to fix it.

:hi:

[mwb970]

9. You couldn't guess from the context that "catolico" means "catholic"?

That seems extremely obvious to me. Only a few letters are different. I see worse misspellings on DU every day.

Perhaps you are not a "word person", but still, come on.

:shrug:

[Maraya1969]

53. Because in my mind I thought it was going to have to do with birth control!

The idea of not letting someone in because they are not an evangelical is completely foreign to me.

Give me a break OK?

[mwb970]

55. "Catolico" just looks so much like "Catholic" and was right next to "evangelico".

However, perhaps the fact that I already knew the Spanish word made it seem more "obvious" to me than it would be to a normal person.

[madfloridian]

4. Interesting ending comment from the RH Reality blogger.

"When free clinics and non-profit health services can no longer pay their rent or their staff -- will churches become the provider of last resort? We may find ourselves in triage struggling to assert religious beliefs we don’t hold or at least aren’t interested in offering up as a pre-condition for assistance. Some day soon it may not only become even harder to get an abortion, you may need to declare your opposition to it just to get bread."

Think about it.

[Adsos Letter]

6. I've been thinking about this...

ever since the establishment of "faith-based" initiatives.

[madfloridian]

22. I think about it whenever a hurricane threatens...

Because I remember the day when Bush came after one of the 3 major hurricanes we had in 2004. He stood there in an orange grove and said the goal was for neighbor to help neighbor.

Neighbor help neighbor? How does that work when your neighborhood is destroyed. I thought that was why we had FEMA.

I think faith-based is not enough after such tragedies and events.

[Adsos Letter]

40. I think the portion you quoted in post #4 speaks directly to the point...

Government needs to do its job in providing for the common good (like disaster relief), not turn such things over to "faith-based" organizations who might be tempted to discriminate.

[Anakin Skywalker]

7. Aaah. The Irony!

This is why I always tell the RW to FUCK OFF! I will not debate them on anything. They are hypocritical, double-standard pieces of shit!

[Ineeda]

8. Outrageous. And additionally hypocritical that there is no corresponding

demands for exceptions regarding male sexuality - no ban on vasectomies, no withholding coverage for Levitra, Cialis, Viagra or any other erectile dysfunction treatment. Of course those drugs are only used by heterosexual men, right? Maybe if they got wind that teh gays might also use them, it would be a different story. I'm surprised that STDs will be covered. Oh, that's right. Men get those too, right along with women.

[Christa]

10. Hypocrisy and bigotry

Thy name is religion.


K & R

[RagAss]

11. Fuck the "religious right"..... !!!!!

[felinetta]

15. I'll top that. FUCK religions. They all think they are the real deal while they

cause countless wars and unrest. SCREW them all.  Good
riddance to these fairy tales and the leaders who dispense
fear and divisiveness.

[Vinca]

12. I guess this means they regret the Terry Schiavo intervention.

[RainDog]

13. 50 million to abstinence programs was repulsive.

honestly. money to Goldman Sachs and abstinence only programs so that corrupt assholes can enrich themselves on American tax dollars?

but no public health option for American citizens?

the only good deficit is one that enriches assholes, apparently. the only good deficit is one that spends money on useless bullshit. how many Americans could benefit from that 50 million by providing health care for children rather than theocratic bulllshit?

democrats had better get their shit together and stop funding the religious right. that is a slap in the face to democratic principles, in case they forgot.

we voters will not forget.

[Odin2005]

14. Fuck religion!

:grr:

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

16. Those people are batshit

What do you expect?

[PeaceNikki]

17. Genesis 3:16 says:

"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain will you give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."

You see how when one considers shit like this "Truth" how their misogyny can run so deep.

[madfloridian]

21. I had forgotten that verse.....very hateful toward women.

Sounds like they take perverse satisfaction in the pain of women.

[PeaceNikki]

23. Yeah, it's right there at the beginning of the Bible.

Embedded into that story about how women are responsible for "original sin".

Ya know, there's a very large thread going on in GD now about how unsafe abortions kill 70k women per year. There's a DUer in it who fancies himself "pro-life". Apparently, he's a 95-10er. I've been doing a great deal of research on the "DFLA" movement and it's lead me back to a lot of your posts here on DU. I very much respect your posts on this topic. Thanks.

[madfloridian]

24. Maybe he is one of the ones who unrecced this post. lol

BTW look up Kristen Day. She is the face of the DFLA, and she has little tolerance for women who don't follow her point of view.

Actually I am beginning to believe that pro-choice Dems are in the minority now.

[PeaceNikki]

25. I actually linked to that post.

To me, the DFLA is the religious right's attempt to infiltrate the Democratic party. On the surface, it SEEMS like a righteous cause, but when one digs deeper, you see that it's no more than Republicans in Democratic clothing. A http://www.talk2action.org/story/2006/9/26/3754/33226">Trojan Donkey. Something that even http://michellemalkin.com/2004/07/28/democrats-for-life/#comments">Michelle Malkin supports. An organization that http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/8792">fights against a health care bill by using Republican smear tactics.

[madfloridian]

26. Every woman needs to read your link from Fire Dog Lake..not good.

http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/8792

Just a little bit of it:

"I am, or was until today, a member of Democrats for Life of America. To date, they’ve done a good job encouraging Democratic politicians to support programs which help poor mothers keep their child, and care for it after they’re born. But this morning, I received a Facebook message from an employee of Democrats for Life of America. It was a message that opposed health care reform through the use of Republican smear tactics, and it was a message–which if heeded–would deny millions of women access to pre-natal care because previous pregnancies are a pre-existing condition under the current American health care system."

Thanks for posting that.

[PeaceNikki]

28. Wrong spot

oops

[madfloridian]

27. Wow I linked to that at FDL and now it is gone?? Why in the world.

It was a blog post criticizing DFLA

Very puzzled. Very curious.

[PeaceNikki]

29. II

It was JUST there! :o

[PeaceNikki]

30. Cached here

http://74.125.113.132/search?q=cache:KnZ1iu2bTDUJ:seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/8792+%22%22I+am,+or+was+until+today,+a+member+of+Democrats+for+Life+of+America.+To+date,+they%E2%80%99ve+done+a+good+job+encouraging+Democratic+politicians%22&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

Author's blog here: http://thebagofhealthandpolitics.wordpress.com/2009/10/07/pro-life-democrats-take-anti-life-stand/

[madfloridian]

31. Thanks, I was just going to post it.

I see no reason to archive a post so quickly. The blogger is not entirely pro-choice, but did catch on to what DFLA was doing.

[madfloridian]

36. That FDL post is back now? What is going on?

Weird stuff.

[truthrocks]

32. What does "GD" stand for? Thanks!

:eyes:

[PeaceNikki]

33. "General Discussion"

The forum here on DU (Democratic Underground) in which you are posting.

[GirlinContempt]

34. Oh no

It's only a matter of time before he's HERE, isn't it? Eek.

All of this is so inconceivable to me. I can not understand denying people health care, I can not understand denying women, or anyone, the right to make their own choices, and I can't even understand this whole birth control fracas.

Thank you for your great responses on the threads I've been seeing lately on this subject :)

[PeaceNikki]

41. No, no. Thank YOU for your great responses.

[madfloridian]

The blogger responds in the comments...powerful statement.

Someone was disagreeing, and she handled it quite well.

"Sadly, what I describe at the beginning of this piece is a literal, first-person account. I relate it not to paint the entire profession with broad strokes, but rather to demonstrate what can happen when religious beliefs entangle too closely with professional service.

As far as the rest of the issues you raise, I'm afraid I would need several separate articles to do them justice. For the sake of brevity, I will limit myself to acknowledging there is a vast spectrum of beliefs and tactics in the conservative movement. However, for some time an incredibly right-leaning, non-representative, faction of this movement has held disproportionate ideological sway. It is this phenomenon, and the corollary cultural shifts it makes seem logical that scares me.

And, for the record, I do not believe there are any valid reasons to deny loving couples a right that is theirs inherently -- to pledge publicly a lifelong commitment to each other sanctioned by their community, however they elect to define it. Anything short of this harms not just them but that same community."

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
She got it exactly right. Their power these groups hold over both parties is most definitely "disproportionate."

And it scares me also. 19 of the 25 members of the newly appointed Obama faith-based council are anti-choice. Why is that happening?

[Blue State Blues]

18. It isn't hypocrisy, it is entirely consistent

The ultimate goal (of the relatively small but well-organized and increasingly well-funded group) is theocracy.

They want full control over people's lives, public and private. They work to eliminate any social safety net or public program that prevents them from being the only recourse. They oppose public education because they want to control what children learn and adults learn to think.

They oppose social services and medical services because they want to be able to restrict them, to use them as a tool of coercion. So you can not be fed or you cannot be healed unless you agree with them, or pretend to.

They do not go to the bargaining table in good faith. They do not believe in compromise. To them, compromise, is a dirty word -- to compromise one's morals or beliefs. And they cannot be appeased.

[madfloridian]

19. Good point. When you look at it as theocratic...it IS consistent.

Very good post. They do not go to the bargaining table in good faith, yet too many keep pretending they do.

[bertman]

45. That is A PERFECT DESCRIPTION OF THEIR GOALS, Blue State Blues. These folks think

they are commanded by god to bring this theocratic government to pass on earth. In that, they are no different from the jihadists who are willing to blow themselves up to destroy the infidels.

[Independent_Liberal]

54. Yes, they're much like the jihadists.

Religious extremists, fascists, theocrats, etc. is what they are. They believe they are doing "God's work."

They're sort of in the same category as KKK, Nazis, Neo-Nazis, etc. Driven by hate and feeling a need to carry out the duty of whatever higher power they believe they are beholden to.

[tooeyeten]

20. one possible reason

"brain damage."

[JerseygirlCT]

35. The more we give in, the more they demand

you've got that right.

[madfloridian]

37. And we keep giving in hoping things will change.

And things do not change.

[JerseygirlCT]

42. Yeah

I'm sort of tired of hearing the paens to bipartisanship, and about our "big tent". (I don't think we need a tent big enough to encompass those who think they have a right to my body and my medical decisions, thanks).

We liberals are by nature conciliatory and accommodating. We tolerate an awful lot, and probably more than we ought.

[truthrocks]

38. All I can say to the these right wing rapists is

stay the heck out of my uterus!

:mad:

[UrbScotty]

39. And yet when it comes to the TEACHINGS of Christ...

they seem to ignore them.

[mac56]

43. Old saying:: The more you talk about Jesus,

the less you actually have to act like him.

[JerseygirlCT]

44. Those might involve THEIR actions and

that would be too hard. Much easier to sound pious while trampling on someone else's rights.

[bertman]

46. Too late to recommend, but thank you, Madflo, for this post.

I have many fundamentalist family members, friends, and business associates. They are good people in the sense that they try to live their lives without cheating others, they work hard, they devote themselves to their families, and they also try to do good deeds through their churches. But what's interesting about their good works through their churches is that they target other christians who believe as they believe. Example from Katrina: there were busloads of folks going to Mississippi to help rebuild the Gulf coast but they were mostly involved in rebuilding their denomination's churches and church facilities. When I brought this up, they said they were rebuilding the churches because the churches would be the central coordinating organizations for helping people rebuild their homes. As it turns out, they were helping the church members rebuild first. So, the non-believers were last in line for help.

This is a consistent pattern with their benevolence abroad as well. They go to another country and build churches or church facilities.

This is fine, of course, but it is the same closed approach they seem to use for all of their "good works".

Which means that those of us who are not of their religious persuasion, or any religious persuasion, must rely upon our neighbors (problematic--as Madflo has pointed out, if your neighbors have been wiped out too) or the government, for our help in times of need. Isn't that why we pay taxes?

[and-justice-for-all]

47. What a crock of shit...

Health care does not intrude into my bedroom; however the religious nutters do want to intrude and try very hard to do so.

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

48. Religious right needs to stay out of our government, and stay out of our bedrooms too.

[Overseas]

49. Kicking-- another painful part of US politics I wish didn't exist.

That amazing hypocrisy of supporting government intrusion into our private behavior but not to help with our struggle to stay alive.

No wonder they are having to rewrite their bible. Can't have that stuff with Jesus saying they'll be judged by how they treat the least among us, and how they helped the poor and needy.

[madfloridian]

50. I saw an article about a NC preacher burning some versions of the bible.

I wish I had kept the article. They burned all but one version, I think King James.

Unbelievable.

[Overseas]

51. Wow, I found the article on that preacher's plans for Halloween bible burning

Marc Grizzard, of Amazing Grace Baptist Church in Canton, North Carolina, says that the first King James translation of the Bible is the only true declaration of God’s word, and that all others are “satanic”.

Pastor Grizzard and 14 other members of the church plan to burn copies of the other “perversions” of Scripture on Halloween, 31 October.

The New Revised Version Bible, the American Standard Version Bible, and even the New King James Version are all pronounced to be works of the Devil by Pastor Grizzard and his followers.

Pastor Grizzard said: “I believe the King James version is God’s preserved, inspired, inerrant, infallible word of God… for English-speaking people.

With video, at
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/religion/6346662/North-Carolina-church-plans-Halloween-Bible-burning.html

[madfloridian]

52. Wow that article is far more complete than the one I saw.

What a arrogant little man standing there in his overalls, saying he will burn books by people like Billy Graham whom he considers a heretic.

Good Lord, that makes our country look so bad. Look at some of the comments after the Telegraph article.

Thanks for finding that.