Violence is coming

[Mortos]

Whipped up by the right wing talking heads. One of these crazy fearful fuckers is gonna snap and do something very violent and hurt people. Timothy Mcveigh, the Murrah Building bomber in my hometown of Oklahoma City, carried the same message on the t-shirt he wore the day he detonated a bomb hidden in a Ryder moving van killing 168 of my neighbors including children in a daycare center; as a man is carrying today near where the President is speaking.

Here is the picture of the shirt he was wearing when he did it.



Here he is still wearing it in the mugshot taken the day he was arrested:



Here is a picture of a man openly armed and carrying a sign with the same sentiment in New Hampshire near were the President is about to speak:




Mcveigh also had a gun with him when he was arrested. He listened to Rush Limbaugh and G. Gordon Liddy talk on the radio everyday about the danger of Bill Clinton presented to this country and the new world order that was coming to take away his rights.

The only difference between then and now is the right wing rhetoric then was mild in comparison. There was no 24 hour fox news channel repeating the same message over and over, that the President is dangerous and is ushering in the end of America as we know it. There was no Glen Beck talking about poisoning members of congress and calling the President a racist who hates white people. There was no Sean Hannity accusing the President of being a socialist and wanting to take away rights. There was no freerepublic.com whose hundreds of readers constantly goad and confirm each others paranoid conspiracies.

Rush Limbaugh was less bat-shit crazy then. He didn't compare the President to Adolph Hitler and congress to Nazis. He couldn't stoke racial fears by referring to the President as "halfrican" as he does now.

There was no Lou Dobbs giving air time and echoing the message of an obviously deranged woman shouting that the President is not an American at all but a Kenyan born socialist squatter in the oval office.

The right wing is an active and willing participant in fomenting violence against the President, Democratic senators, congressman and the American people who support them.

It is not a matter of IF the embers of violence they fan every day will burst forth into an explosion
of hateful flame, it is a matter of WHEN. Several smaller but no less horrible acts have already occurred. The man who killed 3 women and injured ten others before killing himself in a Pennsylvania gym echoed foxnews talking points online against the President prior shooting innocent women. The neonazi who shot up the Jewish museum in New York was a frequent poster on freerepublic. The anti-abortion nut who killed Dr. George Tiller in his church, was surely goaded along by Bill O'Reilly's frothing hateful talking points against "Tiller the baby killer".

When these rich parasitic talking heads of the right do succeed in pushing an unbalanced individual or group over the thin line of sanity and one or more of them blows up a building, shoots innocents or assassinates the President or a member of Congress will we sit by shake our heads and mourn the loss of civility, or will we finally hold these people accountable?

The right wing hate mongers have been paid and paid well for their actions in the past. When their gutless words become someone else's vile deeds they should pay for the whirlwind they sow. They should but they probably won't.

Will they?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

1. Well, duh.

We've known for years that the Republicans will resort to terrorism when the Dems take over.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. Absolutely, and I have said this for months now

and been called all kinds of names round these parts.

I am expecting a low level civil war. and when I say this... people go, what armies? No you fools, cells, a la McVeigh, a la Shin Fein. Modern civil wars are not fought by standing armies, they are guerrilla movements.

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Fire1]

12. Fine with me! I'm ready to rid the world a few idiot racists.

SAY WHEN!:nuke:

[nadinbrzezinski]

14. Problem wiht cells is that they will strike before you

can do a thing.

This is where good police work (done legally and with warrants kiddies) is needed.

The FBI needs to start considering penetration of RW cells, like they did the peace movement over the last eight years. The difference we were going to attack with chocolate chip cookies, these guys are willing to use lead coated bullets.

I suspect that is already ongoing though, as the FBI does penetrate the RIGHT WING supremacist movement regularly. And they are doing it VERY LEGALLY, which is the way intelligence needs to be done. But until these idiots do something more dramatic like blow up something or gun down somebody in government, until that moment, some folks will not take these guys seriously... I suspect some will not even then.

[nankerphelge]

80. I hope you're right...

they were much more worried about targeting environmental groups and infiltrating vegan potlucks under the last administration.

[meowomon]

87. Vegan Potlucks? LMFAO!

You are so right.

[nankerphelge]

112. Sad but apparently true...

http://www.citypages.com/2008-05-21/news/moles-wanted/

[timtom]

26. Not to put too fine a point on it, but

that's Sinn Féin.

[nadinbrzezinski]

28. Of course, it is

no problem.

[villager]

3. back then, Clinton immediately started to back off his "hate speech" pronouncements

after the Murrah Building atrocity, since Limbaugh and others got pouty, etc.

Clinton didn't want to "offend" anyone, y'see...

Will the Democrats finally, at last, be willing to stand up and push back, in the face of more rightwing craziness?

[jasi2006]

78. It was a mistae to back off. I hope Obama doesn't.

If anything happens, I hope the full force of laws, common sense and decency grip this nation like never before and that good people will rise up in force and defeat the dragons of hate and evil. Doesn't "GOOD" ever win against "EVIL?"

[Lex]

4. Just as John Wilkes Booth thought he was a hero when he put a bullet

in Abraham Lincoln's head. He thought the country would hail him as a hero.

Ignorance and violence go hand in hand.

[Bonhomme Richard]

5. Not a doubt in my mind. n/t

[Lerkfish]

6. now, imagine if that protestor were Arab, holding the same sign and openly armed

would the police still claim there was nothing they could do?

[havocmom]

8. guessing that church wouldn't let an armed Arab stand on their property

[Mortos]

11. and someone please find out what fucked up church

let this turd stand on their property with a sidearm. And Jesus wept.

[Stuart G]

47. We have discussed this before, and it is indeed scary..Please don't

ever underestimate the power of hate, fear, and anger, stupidity, and arrogance.

Ask the relatives of 20 million Russians who died because of them .

[Mortos]

10. Now imagine this was a Bush speech

and someone outside was carrying a sharp stick. They would be bundled off so quickly, their head would snap. Remember the people who were arrested or detained for wearing a shirt criticizing Bush.

This is a direct threat to whoever this person thinks is a tyrant. And who do you think that is?

[butterfly77]

36. or black...

[Life Long Dem]

43. That would be profiling now wouldn't it?

And I don't believe the cops want another Cambridge incident?

I think the President should take precautions more in line to what the Bush administration did with zones for protesters.

[MadMaddie]

44. Arab...hell if the protester were black he would be dead.

Even if he was legally carrying the weapon.

This is utter bullshit...they are pushing the limits to see what they can get away with. I guarantee the next time there will be 20 of these nuts.

Remember Dems weren't even allowed near any of the venues the repugs were at.....

[Enthusiast]

89. Yup.

"Arab...hell if the protester were black he would be dead."

No doubt.

[Subdivisions]

9. I've been saying this. There's no possibility of reconciliation. n/t

[omega minimo]

13. The civil rights of all Americans have been obliterated ever since OK City - hope all those privacy

violations and police state world we live in can actually prevent what they're supposedly there for. :evilfrown:

[flvegan]

15. Is open-carry legal in NH?

If so, can the secret service suspend that allowance in the presence of the president, etc? Not looking to start a gun rights debate, I'm really just curious.

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. It is I THINK, and no, the SS cannot suspend it

that is where you get into state rights vs federal. So their choice is to keep their package safe by keeping distance from threat.

That said, it was funny in Hawaii, bush and the SS tried to enforce free speech zones, but local cops refused to play along. Yes I can say I have something to do with that one. I had a nice talk with a local rep about the Patriot Act. He said could not be that bad. So I met him at a starbucks, bought his coffee and gave him PDF of it, and let him read it. We discussed it for three hours. He introduced legislation where Hawaii did not recognize the USPA.

:-)

And they say getting involved never pays.

[Liberation Angel]

32. There were "Free Speech" CAGES in Denver - I was in them

and Obama did nothing to stop them

nothing

not a peep

I marched there with IVAW
and slept in the cage

with the vets

putrid water

klieg lights powered by gassy obnoxious generators

outhouses more than three blocks away (putrid water too)

ringed by tiers of armed men in Kevlar and high powered weapons

out of sight of the media and the convention center


and this ASSHOLE is protected?

Obama was silent then.

But maybe there are people who WANT these brownshirts to be able to get close...

[truedelphi]

54. Wow. Thank you for doing that.

And good to hear of a Congressman who was willing to sit down and learn from a constituent.

[nadinbrzezinski]

58. Hawaii is a small state, so yes they do

here in California, don't even try. OK I do, regularly.

But the Hawaii State Legislature is literally a very different ballgame than most I know off. It is also extremely progressive, in spite of Linda Lingle.

[Fire1]

22. YES, it is legal.

[florida08]

84. am wondering the same thing

Yesterday the guy who had a loaded holster said it was but today in one of the posts here there was this article..

Man Charged With Trying To Enter School Before Obama Event

PORTSMOUTH, N.H. -- A Hampton, N.H., man was charged with trespassing after he allegedly tried to get into Portsmouth High School before President Barack Obama spoke at a health care town hall meeting Tuesday, police said...

Police said he was also in possession of a folding pocketknife, and officers found a loaded handgun in his car, which was parked in on school property. Young was then charged misdemeanor carrying a loaded pistol without a license.

Police said he could face more serious federal charges.
http://www.wmur.com/news/20356764/detail.html

[florida08]

86. ok..it's legal

New Hampshire does not require a license for Open Carry, but carry in a motor vehicle or otherwise concealed does require a license. Note that the NH license is issued for carry of a "pistol or revolver," and is not a license to carry "weapons" as exists in some other states.

[X_Digger]

93. Different guy. n/t

[florida08]

95. yeah

I know but was wondering what the difference was between open carry without a permit to vehicle carry. Here in Florida our laws are the opposite. Open carry is only permitted if your the law, even with a permit, unless your Wells Fargo. However vehicle carry is allowed as long as it's not on your hip or in your lap. NH has open carry without permit but you need one for your car. We issue a CWL to carry on your person. It must be concealed.

[X_Digger]

100. *nod* Texas has no open carry, either

(And ya, that'll come as a shock to some.)

[florida08]

107. what?

it sure did..lol

[droidamus2]

104. From what I have heard

Yes, you are allowed to carry a weapon in NH as long as it is in plain site. Personally I don't care what the law says in this case it is the Secret Services job to protect the President allowing people to carry loaded guns in his presence is just stupid. As Cenk on The Young Turks pointed out what happens next time when it is 5 people legally carrying guns, and then 10 or 20 at what point does the Secret Service stand up and say no way.

[csziggy]

16. Guy with a gun is William Kostric of Manchester, N.H. - info on him

He signed up to move to New Hampshire as part of the Pledge “First1000”:

"I will move to New Hampshire by 12/31/2008 where I will work to bring about a society in which government’s maximum role is protecting life, liberty, and property but only if 999 other liberty minded individuals will do the same." — Ian Bernard, Free State Project participant (contact)

Deadline to sign up by: 31st December 2006
1,030 people signed up

<SNIP>

More details
I am a participant in the Free State Project, www.freestateproject.org, which has the goal of getting 20,000 people to agree to move to New Hampshire where they will work to bring about a society in which government’s maximum role is protecting life, liberty, and property. However, I don’t want to wait for 20,000 to agree to move before relocating. I want to move now. I am calling on liberty lovers everywhere to move with me, to be a pioneer for freedom, to be a beacon of liberty in the Free State. Together we can bring about a state with increased liberties and reduced government. Join me!

More: http://www.pledgebank.com/First1000?showall=1

Organizer and Volunteer of the 2009 Porcupine
Freedom Festival

You made it! Welcome to the 2009 Porcupine
Freedom Festival. It's going to be four days of
freedom-filled fun!

The goal of PorcFest is to showcase the Free State
Project, New Hampshire, and the activists who are
making significant changes to the political and social
landscape of the Live Free or Die state. Over the next few days, you will have a
choice of a wide range of activities, including informative speeches by in-state and
visiting activists, bus tours, shooting trips, and more. You will have the opportunity to
learn more about New Hampshire-based organizations, go on hikes, play board and
card games, watch movies, grab a bite, judge the cook-off, and participate in many
other fun, social events.

<SNIP>

The love of liberty brings together a diverse group of people. At PorcFest, we have
people who have already made the move, folks who are still on the fence (hop off and
move, already!), those planning to move soon, and New Hampshire natives. We have
people originally from the left and the right, those who like guns, those who don't,
religious people, atheists, children, parents, grandparents, the list goes on. The
beauty of PorcFest is that our belief in freedom allows us all to come together in
peace. Remember, everyone here is eager to meet new people and have a good
time! Don't be shy, introduce yourself, ask questions, find things to do together, and
build new friendships.

When I attended my first PorcFest in 2006, I did not know a soul. Guns scared me.
After spending time with the Free Staters, my husband and I decided to make the
move. We arrived during a blizzard in February 2008. Ten Free Staters showed up on
that dreary Saturday morning to help us unload the truck. That's the sense of
community that is waiting for you.

Speaking of community, PorcFest is made possible by the dedication and hard work
of a small village of volunteers. I would like to express my deepest gratitude to
everyone who has helped make PorcFest 2009 possible, in particular, Mark Warden.
Thanks also, to all our donors, especially Jason Osborne of ThinkTwiceNews.com,
Manchester Brewing, and Sakal CAI, who always gives generously and is sponsoring
this year’s welcome reception. Please consult the Acknowledgment section for a
listing of donors and volunteers. For more information about how you can contribute
to the Free State Project, see the form in your festival bag.

More: http://www.freestateproject.org/files/PorcFestWeb.pdf

I wonder why the writer had to mention that "Guns scared me" for a Freedom Festival?

[Bluerthanblue]

38. and the natives take the flack for assholes like him.

:shrug:

[grantcart]

41. that is true for other places like northern Idaho too.

[cui bono]

61. So then I'm sure he doesn't use public roads, wouldn't allow the fire dept.

to put out fire if one should start in his home, etc...

[BREMPRO]

97. PorcFest lol! - not so smart choice of name for their festival. n/t

[inna]

17. KR. i caught some tidbits on the cable news this morning and was absolutely stunned

by the extreme stupidity, ignorance and pure hatred emanating from the mobs at these town hall meetings.

truly sad and almost terrifying.

[AnotherDreamWeaver]

19. Here is part of the note my Mom sent me last night:

I heard yesterday that one of the
sheep herders were killed. I don't think they would have much money on them,
so makes you wonder why. been several bodies found on the road that goes
between California City and Phillips road. they don't give an address, so
don't know if it is North or South of Phillips road. Its a long stretch of
nothing there. So they may be killed other places and dump them there.
On the news lock down at all California Prisons
today.

___________________________
(She moved out of Palmdale because they no longer spoke or wrote in english at the local supermarket. It was all spanish)

[John Q. Citizen]

30. Y su mama tiene una problema con eso? Por que?

[AnotherDreamWeaver]

34. She is convinced California is being taken over by Mexico

And the "letting Mexican trucks come across the border into the States" is the latest take over.

[John Q. Citizen]

37. That's too bad. She sounds unhappy.

[nadinbrzezinski]

46. Hmm the activation orders for us under cover fight columnists

are now going out?

Just kidding, some folks have had those fears for decades... oh since 1848

[JDPriestly]

105. Actually, California is being taken over by everyone from everywhere.

That is what makes it so magically cosmopolitan. I love being taken over by people who speak mysterious languages, wear national clothing and jewelry, listen to melodic music (as opposed to our horrible pop stuff), practice strange religions and cook and eat yummy food. Your mom should move to the midwest where people can eat mashed potatoes and white bread and get almost too fat to move to their hearts' content. I'll take the diversity in L.A. any day. The only thing I miss here is rain. I do wish we had more rain because I like to garden.

Illegal immigration is a serious problem, but tourism and legal immigration are great!

[Heidi]

20. My dad had an office in the Murrah building and wasn't there that day.

We need to be aware and prepared, but not panicked, not giving them an inch of fear to exploit. Some of us closely touched by the events of April 19, 1995 believe that being aware and prepared, not hateful or panicked, is the way to go. Show them for the willfully ignorant and largely bigoted sub-set that they are, but do NOT let them dictate how we live our lives moment to moment, day to day.

[Critters2]

23. Wow, Heidi. Can't imagine how your father felt. How many co-workers he lost,

how difficult that was for your family.

Thanks for your words of wisdom and calm. They're important to hear, and mean even more coming out of your family's experience. Thank you!

[Heidi]

25. My dad's a good, good guy, and a very good progressive.

Not a diehard liberal or as left as my husband and I are, but a very good progressive. He'd be the guy tryin' to figure out what went wrong with McVeigh, why he felt desperate enough to kill for his beliefs, go to his death for beliefs that he probably didn't even question. Since I was adopted by Dad and Mom when I was six years old, every time I'd say, "I believe..." or "I think...," one of them was always right there to say, "Why do you believe that? Think through it and be honest." I'm 46 now, and what I know for a fact is that among the few things we can truly control, our reactions are ours alone to control and fully own. That was true of McVeigh, too. :hi:

[shadowknows69]

81. Sounds like you found some great parents Heidi

As an adoptee myself, I know how important that is. Glad your dad wasn't there for that tragedy.

[Heidi]

82. Mornin', shadowknows.

I think a couple of folks didn't a pretty good job with you, too. We're both lucky, you and me. :)

[bemildred]

21. It's sort of like going back to the 60s again.

Unfinished business, you might say.

[anonymous171]

24. I just hope that after we get rid of these pawns, we go after their leaders as well.

I want to see mansions burned to the ground and the parasites thrown out into the street.

[ecstatic]

27. Do you think any of the crazies are watching Pres. Obama's townhall today

and that some of the anger is being diffused?

[Mortos]

31. There anger is not based in reality

so No, I don't think it can be diffused

[FatDave]

42. Not the crazies, no.

But I'll bet a bunch of rational people were reassured.

[lunatica]

66. That moment of sanity, if it happens

will disappear as soon as they get their next Limbaugh fix. They're addicted to the boiling rage. Without it they have no reason to live.

[nashville_brook]

29. kick and rec and saving for later.

[glinda]

33. kick

[Mrs. Overall]

35. OMFG

Can we finally start calling these radical, nut right-wingers "terrorists?"

[BR_Parkway]

74. Seems like the BushCo Justice Dept did just that - and oh the howls

from Republican congressmen and senators couldn't have come any faster.

[Xenotime]

106. We have. Where have you been?

[Mrs. Overall]

110. I've been here for almost seven years reading everything I can--

what I'm talking about is society/media/law enforcement labeling the extreme right wing radicals as domestic terrorists. They are not doing that yet, but yes, here on DU we label them as such.

[onestepforward]

39. K&R

[Odin2005]

40. K&R These Brownshirts need to be stopped!

[deaniac21]

45. I would never trust anyone with a Thomas Jefferson quote on a

t shirt or a bumper sticker.

[Swamp Rat]

48. How about a sigline?

:D

[deaniac21]

49. That too. The guy was a radical.

[guardian]

50. The right wing nuts are crazy BUT

your argument would be stronger if you didn't have obvious mistakes in the OP. The t-shirt with the Jefferson quote is NOT the same shirt in the mug photo. A little of attention to detail will give less ammunition to the other side.

[Mortos]

59. It is exactly the same shirt

The quote is written on the back. The mugshot is taken from the front. The pictures I included are take of the shirt he was wearing when he blew up the building 5 miles from my home. I make enough mistakes without being accused of them when I didn't. One picture is of the back which is different from picture of the front. A t-shirt has 2 sides, a front and a back.

Here ya go, just to strengthen my argument a little more:

21] He (Mcveigh) wore a printed T-shirt with the motto of the Commonwealth of Virginia, Sic semper tyrannis ("Thus always to tyrants", which was shouted by John Wilkes Booth immediately after the assassination of Abraham Lincoln) and "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants" (from Thomas Jefferson)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City_bombing

Why don't you make sure you know what you are talking about before criticizing my info as wrong. Feel free to point out any other "mistakes" I made in the OP so I can prove you wrong or admit my mistake.

[defendandprotect]

51. k i c k

[mullard12ax7]

52. The brainwashed masses are now a very serious problem

100 years of greedy propaganda has come to fruition, we have an entire segment of our population so malleable they will act on the constant hate-speech they hear. I realized this years ago as people just passed off racist repugs as "good ole boys" and useless wars as acts of liberty. Now, we've got torture camps, war criminals roaming free, institutionalized crime and a culture that thinks it's OK because hey, they were smart enough to get away with it and the most important thing is me and my money!

[Hugabear]

53. I said this last week, and had some DUers tell me I was being paranoid

Not so much anymore, eh?

[mullard12ax7]

55. People will call other people anything at anytime

It has nothing to do with DU, or what political party a brainwashed person is a party of. Most people see what they want to see, not what is really there. The problem with seeing things as they are is that a lot of it is horrible and people choose to avoid bad things rather than accept them as inevitable. Of course, once the horrid display is there for everyone to see it's impossible to continue to ignore it. Following that is the next delusional behavior of "no one could have predicted it". Our corporate and government media/propaganda has played us all for 100 years, playing the same happy tune so we'll buy whatever it is they're selling and demonize the other side, even if that side is doing the exact same thing we are, like torture. Remember how evil Saddam was for torturing people?

[nonsequitur]

56. i don't think you're paranoid, I think you're right. They need to get a handle....

on these people at these town halls. They're out of control and it's getting worse.

[DFW]

57. Yeah, so did I

I said that there would be some blood spilled, and that it would be ours.

That post didn't go far either, although I'd rather be proven wrong, if I had my druthers.
The alternative is not a very appealing scenario..........

[Chulanowa]

77. It surely wasn't me

I've known these fucks would spiral into violence since I was twelve, immediately after the WTC bombings. I found a stack of flyers outside the local grocery store, calling for armed insurrection against the "communist regime in Washington", demanding an end to liberalism and immigration, and with a photocopied picture of a lynching. That being Alabama at the time, I suppose the strangest damn thing was that I was not surprised.

It's fitting that this is about the time I started attempting to deconvert my mother from her Bible-Belt Conservativism, and am happy to report that she is now an even stauncher and more involved Progressive Democrat than I am!

Then came McVeigh. And the Unabomber.

Oh yes. These motherfuckers want us dead. Anyone who doubts that is delusional. No, not all Republicans are Conservatives want to "water the tree". But it takes one. Just one motherfucker with some nitrates and a grudge. So when the conservatives start bleating and hand-wringing about being "lumped", point that shit out to them.

As far as I am concerned, so long as they vouch for men and women who would cut my throat, I owe them no consideration.

[Stand and Fight]

60. An approaching storm. n/t

[Maru Kitteh]

62. It's painful, but I must K and R your post. You are correct.

[CitizenPatriot]

63. some of these crazies

are also of the dominionists brand of batshit nuts, and they think Muslim countries house the devil, and they think O is a muslim. They are being bred to believe it's their duty to protect their portal to End Times or some such bs, which is located in....

Alaska.

Who are also taught to infiltrate the government through Secessionist/constitution parties, going under cover as Republicans. Or, now, just your average Republican.

Kind of puts another face on racism and the war between certain crazy hating christians (led by the one who wear red shoes) and the rest of us.

[shellgame26]

64. honestly

I don't understand why these people are not called terrorists. Actually I do know why. THEY'RE WHITE AND THEY'RE NOT MUSLIM!

[LittleGirl]

70. Home Grown Terrorists

I was visiting my rabid right wing Faux Spews watching sister when Dr. Tiller was killed and in passing she asked how I felt about North Korea. Was I afraid of those gooks?

I knew she was baiting me so I said, North Korea...Bwaaahaaa....No. I'm more afraid of that guy that walked up to that Abortion doctor, at church yet, and shot him execution style in front of his family. Those guys scare me more than some old and feeble communist in the far east. They are American Home Grown Terrorists fed hatred from Fox News and they have guns.

She was horrified. She said, I think we should just nuke those Koreans. I had to walk away at that. That's her answer. Just nuke 'em. She's completely batshit crazy from watching Hannity, O'Really, and listening to Limdick everyday. Totally ruins our family holidays now.

[tomm2thumbs]

65. so the guy that brings the gun gets national air time on Hardball - rewarding the nutjobs MSNBC ??

this is why we are seeing the nutjobs up the ante - it gets them attention. What will the person who brings a machete get, his/her own talkshow on MSNBC ?

The 'news' stations are nothing more than National Enquirer with a resume. They need to stop.

[Mortos]

67. I actually think it is good to shine a light on these people

Chris Matthews could barely contain his anger. I would have liked to have seen him push a little harder on what this man wanted and what he meant with his sign. It is obvious he was advocating violence and wants literal blood to flow.

[tomm2thumbs]

111. I thought he actually handled it well - and gave them a platform

that is, he didn't back down or shy back from his views - and no doubt encouraged others along the way - but I'd just assume not see the ones who have a bigger agenda get on the air and telegraph their ideas to a national audience of misfits out there. it's russian roulette but point taken regarding shining the light as well

[Turborama]

68. Should we be taking these militia videos seriously or just laugh them off as cranks?

While looking around YouTube for vids I occaisionally come across videos like the ones below. There's been a large spike in gun sales since Obama was elected and these nutjobs seem to be being taken a lot more seriously by the racist teabagging birther wingnuts now they're out of power. Should we continue passing them off as cranks or are these the people we should be worried about when we talk about the violence that's possibly around the corner?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LiuqeujSLg">Strength In Numbers
1,862 views

One quote that stuck out:

FuckObamasMama (2 weeks ago)
How about we spend as much time organizing as we do on the tube.Let's
get it together.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUx_ynBiFjs">WARNING TO ALL MILITIAS
69,627 views

A quote that stuck out on this one:

CenturyGamer (4 days ago)

Your right, the only way we can fight is guerrilla, paki insurgent style. If we fought openly too many militant soldiers would die. If anyone wants to properly fight the USA government we have to be damn straight about it, not like these wannabes who think that training and showing your unhappiness openly is a good idea. America needs some real men to fight not like these camo clowns, it ain't going to work like that

There are a lot more all over YouTube, check out the related video next to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsG4WckqOqU&NR=1V">this one for example.

[and-justice-for-all]

69. and when that one person crosses that line...

it will be the end of the repuke party for good. Faux Noise, Beck, Limbaugh and the rest of the shit stirring lying assholes will also have to answer for their bullshit that got all this nonsense started.

[Mortos]

71. I don't recall Limbaugh losing anything substantial

after McVeigh blew up the Murrah Building and he was definitely egging on these types. Oh wait, he did get punished. He was put into a higher tax bracket as he raked in tens of millions more dollars. My bad.

[and-justice-for-all]

73. As whipped up as the shit is, I can see this not working out in their favor

at all.

[Chulanowa]

79. because that could be brushed off.

You know. A lone crazy. Just one event. Certainly not some fat talk-jock's fault, right?

And then it happens again. And again. And again. A pattern emerges, and each time, the Limbaughs and Coulters and Becks of the nation have less and less cover for themselves.

And-Justice is right. If anything happens to the president, or any sort of targeted violence occurs.. .the Republicans are done for. Their sane members will ditch, not wanting to be associated with filth like that. They probably won't come to our side, but it'll definately tear their party apart.

As much as I would love to see a Republican party with hte crazies excised, I do not want it to happen like that.

[zeemike]

72. When are we going to fight back?

Cause we are not doing what we must...shut down the right wing noise machine that is poring gas on this fire...and do it through the pocket book not with violence...someting that they understand.
We should be watching Fox news closely to see who is funding the Becks and Hanitys, and let them know in no uncertain terms that we will not buy their crap as long as they run adds that support the right wing nut jobs.
And I would go further by organizing protest outside the head quarters of the companies that do advertise.
If we continue to tolerate it it will only get worse.

[democracy1st]

75. We need this pres to show some backbone and fighting spirit

[zeemike]

85. Well if you expect him to do your fighting for you

you will be disappointed with the results no matter how much balls he shows.
Because the truth is he can do little or noting by himself, and if we leave him standing alone they will destroy him as easily as stepping on an ant.
Obama only power is the number of his suporters...and that is why they try to peel off slivers of support one issue at a time.
They want us to be angry with Obama for what ever reason...even if it is something that they themselves do not suport....Divide and conquer has been the acting principle for the right wing for years now and we are still falling for it.

[RedCloud]

76. "It is its natural manure"

Tom didn't think too highly of those who call themselves patriots.

[MissDeeds]

83. I'm afraid you are correct

I've heard that Wal Mart stores routinely run out of bullets by mid morning. Day after day. It's chilling to think who is buying them, and why. :scared:

[Enthusiast]

88. If some RW loon

sets off a bomb that kills hundreds, or, God forbid, thousands, the RW talking heads will say "See, Obama is not keeping us safe."

[Doctor_J]

90. It's already happened, but yes, it will happen again

Many of the mass murderers over the last year or so are Limbeciles and such.

Unfortunately, our side doesn't seem to have the stomach to do anything but whine. At some point I suppose it will chance, but I don't know what will get us out from in front of our keyboards and into the streets.

[lonestarnot]

91. You can bet on a patsy break'n loose at some point.

[Blue For You]

92. And McVeigh was watered with a lethal injection while strapped

to a table. That should be a reminder to other GOP asshats who want to "water" the tree of liberty with the blood of innocents.

[gopiscrap]

94. oops I meant to recommend

but hit the unrecommend button by accident...so there should be two more recommends...I am sorry!!

[colsohlibgal]

96. Yep

Ample supply of guns/bombs and so many people unstable and some combination of misinformed/uninformed/not the brightest bulb on the tree. Or just plain fruit loops. So it would be a good bet that one or more of these loonies will want to see their name(s) in the news.

[Nothing Without Hope]

98. Yes, and this is what all the hate TV, radio, and "spontaneous" demos are aiming at

They WANT assassination and violence. They couldn't steal the election from Obama, they can't count on completely controlling Congress, so this is their most visible way of "encouraging" things to go as they want. I have no doubt less visible things are going on - blackmail, coercion, bribery, the works. They've proven over and over that there is NOTHING they will stop at in their greed.

[moondust]

99. The public suggestions of violence certainly keep coming.

From Huckabee's "joke" at the NRA convention during the campaign that:

"That was Barack Obama, he just tripped off a chair, he's getting ready to speak," Huckabee said. "Somebody aimed a gun at him and he dove for the floor."

to yesterday's gun guy in NH that knew how to get on TV by carrying a loaded gun and a sign that suggests violence--

and any number of clear suggestions of violence during and since the campaign,

the idea of violence is being kept alive in the minds of whack jobs all across the U.S.


(Incidentally, I don't think the T-shirt in the mug shot is the same as the one above it.)

[keepCAblue]

101. Violence is not "coming"...it is already here.

For me it began back in in the days leading up to Prop 8 here in California -- seeing the frenzied rightwingers waving their anti-gay signs, many of which incited violence against LGBT, hearing about the surge in hate crimes committed against LGBT during this time -- a direct result of the Prop 8 propaganda spewed by religious zealots, slimy Republican pols and fascist talk radio. Since then, George Tiller is viciously murdered by an anti-choice/anti-womens rights extremist, fueled by the hate speech of Bill O'Reilly. Next was the Marine recruiter murder, by another religious extremist--this time a Muslim convert. And on the heels of that, the murder of an African American security guard inside the Holocaust Memorial Museum, committed by an elderly extremist who says his hatred for blacks and Jews ate at him "like a cancer."

So what the hell do you mean, "Violence is coming"?

It is already here.

[Torn_Scorned_Ignored]

102. It is scary

everybody feels it.


I am wondering if our Constitution prevents criminalization of Hate Speech.

I am also wondering if the ANGER felt by those on the Right is anger never expressed about Bush. We express and vent that rage, still. Bush is the one who took their rights away, who destroyed their Constitution. Bush is the one who robbed them of their savings. Bush is the one who took over the country, became Dictator and violated the sanctity of their homes.

It is very scary.

[WeDidIt]

103. As of today, I am in favor of repealing the second amendment. n/t

[Gman2]

109. Are you friggin nuts? I need my 9 to ward off the blathering, liberal lynching mob!

[LanternWaste]

108. So I've been told since 2001.

So I've been told since 2001. I imagine one day it will come to pass...

[HughBeaumont]

113. OMG, not Exidor!

That guy was pretty much the only reason I watched Mork and Mindy.

[mnhtnbb]

114. Violence has been in this country since its inception.

see the separate thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6295210&mesg_id=6295210


http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article17195.htm

[Supersedeas]

115. watering the tree with the blood of patriots