Is it really necessary?

[BooScout]

I am a left wing liberal. I consider myself a Democrat and a feminist.

After reading thru some of these threads on here right now concerning the latest rumors du jour about Palin and her marriage.......I must say that some responses shocked even me......and that's afer surviving the primaries here on a couple of Presidential Elections.....and yes, I was also disgusted and sickened during the hottest primaries and the nature of the conversation here concerning Hillary Clinton.

I realize that the internet provides a great degree of anonymity.....but the Democrats I used to know do not generally spout off misogynist and sexist remarks. Calling a woman a bitch or a slut and dancing on the supposed grave of someone's marriage does not exactly speak volumes for one's levil of maturity.

Yes, I know Palin preached/preaches family values. Yes, I know that hypocrisy runs rampant. But I ask you......can it not be done in a more civilised manner?

Flame away. Let me go hunt in my closet and drag my flame reistant suit out of mothballs.

:nuke:

[Skittles]

1. there's lots of misogyny on DU

truly pathetic people who would deny it, too

[grantcart]

2. Its not necessary but it is rather embarassing and counter productive

The Palin family isn't going to have any secrets from here on out.


Its all going to be reported and documented in detail.


If the rumors are true we will know in excruciating detail far too soon for any of us.


If the rumors are not true the blogosphere BS will be used to discredit other criticisms and used to demonstrate a bias against the Palinss'


It would not surprise me if the rumors were planted so that they could come back, keep their name in the news and show how dispicable their detractors are.

[lunatica]

3. I didn't read any name calling but then

I don't read every single thread about things I'm not all that interested in. One thread to know what it's about and that's about all I want to read when it comes to Sarah Palin.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. Oh lord, more from the perpetually Concerned Women of America.

Were you all upset over David Letterman too?

[undeterred]

8. Eat some cow pies.

[BooScout]

9. Oh pardon me....

I guess you don't like it much when women speak out huh?:eyes:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

20. Women are fine, Sarah Palin defenders can eat shit and die.

[emilyg]

36. You first - show us how.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

38. Oh, I'm sorry.

I didn't mean to offend your delicate Sarah Palin defending sensibilities.

Oh my odds and bodkins.

[emilyg]

49. Don't wish bad things for anyone - Karma kicks.

[gleaner]

17. Hey.....

I am concerned too. I don't like to see women denigrated simply because they are women. Would the people slinging all these names around be as quick to use racial epithets or insult someone's ethnicity?

I don't like Sarah Palin, but there are lots of things I could say about her without specificity to her gender. She is not very bright, she has only a passing relationship with reality, she is dishonest and unethical. She lies as easily as she breathes. There are many male politicians I could say this about as well. There is plenty to criticize and enough criticism to go around without making an attack simply because of gender.

David Letterman was funny, but he is a talented comedian who makes a living being outrageous about everyone. He is an equal opportunity offender.;) Don't forget, though, that he apologized for some of his remarks about Palin He has had to do it before about things he has said to and about men. I don't think he considers himself an anti feminist icon.

[TankLV]

23. yes, theyrrrrrrre baaaaaack...

annoying, too...

[Odin2005]

31. That's very rich coming from the resident DATE RAPE apologist.

:eyes:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

33. Well speak of the devil.

Have you already forgotten sticking up for your buddy in that prison rape thread?

[Odin2005]

34. What?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

35. Not all there, eh?

Yeah right.

[WeDidIt]

5. No flame from me

The whole rumor mongering about it is ridiculous.

And the other bit is, if they do get divorced, it's their business.

[varelse]

6. You're a better woman than I am

I've just employed the "hide thread" tool to these threads, which is the internet equivalent to sticking my fingers in my ears.

No, it's not necessary and yes, it *is* counterproductive. Sadly, most of these threads violate good taste and common sense, but not DU's rules, so they're going to continue to proliferate until another celebrity dies, or another policitian goes off for a "hike" somewhere. It's the internet... what can you do?

[anonymous171]

7. Who cares? This is war. She needs to be discredited and/or destroyed

[BooScout]

11. Um no......

This is the internet....where people get to act like idiots and talk with potty mouths that their mama would slap them silly for.

[newinnm]

13. No

You need to be ostrasized for your sexist attitude

[Warren Stupidity]

16. it is now sexist to think that politics is a form of war?

do tell

[anonymous171]

26. What? How is it sexist to want Palin's career destroyed? nt

[EFerrari]

15. Yes, that homophobic, anti-Semitic, racist Nazi c*w needs to be sent home.

I oouldn't agree more.

[timeforpeace]

19. No it's not. You take this stuff way too seriously.

[anonymous171]

22. What is more serious than our Government? nt

[Odin2005]

32. That's no excuse for misogyny.

:puke:

[paulsby]

42. and the first casualt in war is the truth

which is so evident from people who use their hate of a political opponent as an excuse.

[anonymous171]

45. Truth is already dead. In American politics, you have to make something true.

You make it true by winning and implementing your policies and ideology once you have the power to do so.

[Odin2005]

58. If Truth is dead than Democracy and Freedom are dead, so than what's the point?

The ends never justify the means, especially when the means only aid the reactionary enemies of a free and open society in their age-old war against freedom started by Plato (the patron saint of the Neoconservatives).

[Mrs. Overall]

10. I think there is a way to ridicule Palin and other republicans for their hypocrisy,

hate-mongering, and general stupidity without resorting to the type of name calling that verges on misogyny and simply poor taste.

When the Christian, family values, holier-than-thou politicians mess up their own lives by doing something they judge and condemn others for doing, than I am all for exposing their hypocrisy and bringing them up short.

[BooScout]

12. Exactly! n/t

[paulsby]

43. a pro "family values" repub getting divorced does not equate to hypocrisy

that's absurd. or did she do something else, i missed. that's even assuming the divorce rumours are true.

[Warren Stupidity]

14. I don't consider marriage sacred, but palin does

and so it goes. She put herself out in the public arena, put her fambly values front and center, claims she is being persecuted, wraps herself in 'da troops' as a shield, claims that she represents the real 'murka and that we are not to be considered americans at all, and you are all concerned we are 'dancing on the grave of someone's marriage'. Pheh.

[TreasonousBastard]

18. Since you suckered me into this thread after I...

managed to ignore almost all of the rest of the Palin threads...

Politics has been, and is now dirty business, and will continue to be so for the foreseeable future. It is nasty enough out there in the open, but gets worse here on anonymous discussion boards.

So, why, after women are finally approaching the pinnacles of power, are they to still be considered such frail flowers that they can't be attacked as ferociously as the men in the business are? This is not to say that allusions may be made to a woman's inability to do the job because of her gender, but attacks on her lifestyle, beliefs, actions, and everything else a man would be attacked on should still be fair game, nu?

Otherwise, will equality have really been attained?

[nini]

29. that's kind of how I look at this..

I hate the frail image that goes with all this. I want us to be tougher than that and prove we are not weaker simply because we are women.

[blogslut]

39. I agree

I may not care for her politics but Margaret Spellings spoke wise when she said: “Put on your big girl panties and deal with it!”

[paulsby]

44. it would be no less justifiable if palin were a man and he was getting divorced

so frigging what? seriously. omg she's getting divorced! and???

[BooScout]

51. Trust me.....

I'm far from a frail flower.

Sexist and misogynistic remarks offend me and generally when something offends me I speak out rather than sit in my kitchen brewing a nice cuppa. Since we women are supposedly approaching the pinnacles of power, why should I shut up and take it when someone insults women because we have breasts? I have no problem with people attack a politician because of their hypocrisy, their beliefs, their lifestyle. I do object to any woman being called a slut.

In case you haven't noticed, the powerful sometimes speak out when they object to something.........not sit there meekly and take the shit flung at them. So people are welcome to have a go at the issues, the hypocrisy, etc.........just lay the hell off the terms that insult all women.

[TreasonousBastard]

56. But you get to define what's sexist? In all of...

this "-ist" correctness, the fun part is still walking on eggshells wondering what today's offensive term will be. And who will be offended.

[BooScout]

57. Yes I do.....

And I think any reasonable person who sees a woman referred to as a slut, refer to wanting her crotch, saying she must be a lesbian, talking about her as a hot woman and men not taking her crap, and other blatent and not so blatent comments.......you bet ya I get to define and complain about such comments supposedly coming from enlightened individuals. I'm damned sick and tired that this crap is constantly spouted off here and if you object to me objecting then tough caca.

[TreasonousBastard]

59. Reasonable poeple can see thorugh the crude insults...

and get to the heart of the matter. However, one of the cheapest ways to stop an argument is to throw up your hands and scream "I'm offended!"

In this particular case, calling Palin names means little when the real point is her political ineptitude and inability to do the job properly. Or even least completely. The "I'm offended at what you called comeone else" gambit simply stops discussion in its tracks and points to mysogeny when the idea should be to point away from it.

Palin is not inept because she is a woman, but is an inept person who happens to be a woman. Both sexual slurs and complaints about the sexual slurs blur this distinction and say more about the speakers than about her.

[spin]

21. I prefer to disagree with her on the issues...

and leave her family and personal life out.

She's vulnerable to attack on her political views and opinions. Why bother throwing mud. It's just not necessary, and may even be counterproductive as she uses the attacks to gain support from the right wing.

One example is her views on hunting wolves from aircraft.

Watch this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQobIUE1zTU

[lukasahero]

24. It's just the way it is here

I've given up.

[Fearless]

25. Too many people...

Equate looking for the truth and asking questions with Palin-supporting. Likewise, too many people would go to any extent to continue that bashing.

[nini]

27. I admit I am not offended by those remarks

because they are not targeted as Palin the woman, but Palin the nasty, evil POS she is. I do realize there is a fine line there and not everyone agrees with me.


I do not condone women being treated poorly simply because they are women - such as Sotomayor was. There are plenty of nasty evil women that will be called less than flattering names - as long as they're called that for their lack of character then so be it.


On the same vein, we call asshole men bastards, pricks etc.. because those insults geared toward their gender.

I guess it's the content in which the insults are used. I don't automatically assume it's because the person is a woman - even women can be slimeballs and not deserving of respect.

[WillowTree]

28. Agree. Emulating things they claim to hate seems to be the norm for some around here.

[Odin2005]

30. What did you expect? There are posters that think DATE RAPE is OK for Christ's sake.

This board positively OOZES misogyny. I know because I was one of posters spouting the BS, then my friend was raped, THEN I got it.

[emilyg]

37. Thank you. k/r

[earth mom]

40. Sorry you don't like it, but that evil creature needs to be exposed for what she is. nt

[Generic Brad]

41. Until and unless divorce papers are filed....

... there is nothing to comment on. No flames from me.

[seabeyond]

46. spout off misogynist and sexist remarks... welcome to du. some men would tell you it is respect

talking about women in this fashion, really it is. and it is empowering to women....

regardless what women may say

[CakeGrrl]

47. My $.02 on the word "bitch"

I'm female, I don't consider myself self-loathing or a hater of women.

But if I encounter a female who is nasty, mean, or whom I feel causes collateral damage to others in her wake for no real reason, sometimes "bitch" is le mot juste.

I don't throw the word out lightly or use it frequently, but I don't take affront to its use if my instinct tells me the context is not one of general misogyny. Sometimes the word "bastard" or "prick" fits the bill for some men. I decide by context whether something offends.

As for Palin, my only wish is for her to drop off into obscurity. I don't care one whit about her marriage, her looks, her kids, her commentary, or her ambitions. I just want her out of the public eye and away from a position of influence.

[seabeyond]

48. i went in one thread

out of all the palin threads i was in one. that is it... and just on glance saw the suggestion she would be doing playboy, next poster asked how much a spread.... then a comment from alaska to russia...

so there is a little more that goes on besides the word bitch.

[CakeGrrl]

50. Crude sexual innuendo isn't necessary or cool, agreed. n/t

[BooScout]

52. Exactly my point.....n/t

[hfojvt]

53. wahrscheinlichkeit. Unbedingt notwendig

There must, after all, be a final solution for exterminating the vermin who spew so much hate. :crazy:

I just had to trot out the latter phrase for nostalgic reasons. When I was a junior in high school, taking the 3rd year of German in one class the teacher went over the vocabulary list. It so happened that I had been going over that list the night before, and one phrase in particular must have stuck with me. He said 'absolutely necessary' amd before he had finished saying 'necessary' I was already starting to say 'unbedingt'. One girl in class, who was also in my freshman German class (where I finished one quarter with an average of something like 102%) pointed to the door and said to me 'Get OUT!!' I still laugh at that. I was pretty good at Deutsch, but I put a fair amount of work into it too.

Anyway, isn't it logical that the best way to fight hate is with more (and bigger) hate? How else are you gonna win?

"A strange game. The only way to win is not to play."

[Tangerine LaBamba]

54. To me, Sarah Palin

has no gender. I'd be just as repulsed by her if she were male.

The language can be lazy and sloppy at times, but I would like to think that it's not misogyny when people deride her - it's just dislike of her and what she represents, nothing to do with her gender.

I could, of course, also be dwelling on the dark side of the moon on this one, but, to me, Sarah Palin isn't worthy of any gender. She's just something taking up space and being disagreeable.

I do, though, believe she has the potential to be a very dangerous figure.......................

[SleeplessInAlabama]

55. Politics is war. War is hell.

It is not a place to go when you want a hug.
It is not a place to go when you want the media to leave your children alone.
It is not a friendly place to be.
It is based in rhetoric and vitriol and to some degree, hatred. It has been ever since Preston Brooks beat Charles Sumner over the head with a cane on the Senate floor in 1856 and it was before that and it will continue to be.

You get racial slurs toward President Obama on freerepublic, and you get "eat shit and die you stupid broad" about Sarah Palin from DU. I won't personally condone any particular comment, especially ad hominem attacks without merit but mudslinging is a part of politics.

"Is it really necessary?" REALLY? No, it's not. But, as the old saying goes, there are two things you don't talk about in polite company: politics and religion. It only follows that those who discuss politics aren't always polite about it. 'Tis the nature of the game.

[MilesColtrane]

60. You see somebody breaking the rules, alert the mods.

I think you will find that internet bulletin boards are not known for civility.

[DevonRex]

61. I haven't found anything to respect about her. She's anti-choice and

she is the worst example of womanhood that our girls and young women could see and, god forbid, emulate.