Why do people travel to different countries and openly complain? It drives me NUTS!

[Locut0s]

I'm posting from Xiamen China, was just in Shanghai. I used to live in China from when I was 2 to the time I was 5 years old, still remember some and still speak the language OK.

Anyway my attitude to traveling has always been to try to immerse myself in whatever culture I'm in and take as much as I can for granted as part of that culture and try to understand it. I've run into more than a few foreigners over the years though who only seem to travel to complain. People who talk about how "back home" this and that. People who refuse to eat much of the local food or take in much of the local culture because it's too foreign for them or the people seem to hostile towards them. More often than not these people are conservative right wingers. To me the whole point of traveling is to place yourself outside your comfort zone and experience a different culture. Sure there are going to be things that put you off, things that may even disgust you but this is all part and parcel of experiencing something new. Why travel if all you are going to do is look like Big Rude Whitey who only eats in McDonalds?

[Mythsaje]

1. Really makes you wonder why they bother to travel in the first place, doesn't it?

I only WISH I could travel like that because it would give me the ability to inject other places and cultures into my books. Maybe someday.

[Grey]

2. I agree.. nt

[Cant trust em]

3. It's like these people travel just so they can reaffirm their love for home. nt

[annabanana]

6. I gives them something to brag about. They don't have to do anything

but touch down in the airport and take off again to get "bragging rights" in their social circle.

[vadawg]

29. yup, nothing so narrows the mind like foreign travel, although theres nothing wrong

with deciding the grass is greener at home, i guess different people travel for different reasons, personally if i never have to leave virginia i am happy.

[tabasco]

94. That's not what Rush Limbaugh says!

He loves him some overseas travel.

He chooses a rather strange destination though - - the Dominican Republic - - an area plagued by child prostitution.

:shrug: :shrug: :shrug: :shrug: :shrug: :shrug: :shrug: :shrug:

Stocks up on the viagra when he goes there too!

[madeline_con]

100. If only someone had pics.

sigh...

[XOKCowboy]

117. I know a lot of people like you back home. I've always wanted to see what was over the hill...

I got my travelin' gene from both sides of my family. My Dad loved to travel and my Grandpa on my Mom's side was an over the road trucker back in the 50s and 60s. I was lucky enough to get into a profession that has allowed me to travel to places this ol' Ex Okie only used to dream of and still love every minute of it. I met some wonderful people in Europe, Asia and Central America and have seen some amazing things.

What's ironic is that I'll probably end up back in OK. It's always been home. I just had to go see what was over the hill. :)

[jeff30997]

4. It reminds me of a story I've read a couple of years ago.

A man decided to make a trip around the world but in each country he "visited" he stayed in the local Hilton only getting out to go to the Airport for his next expedition to an other country's Hilton.

That is totally ridiculous.

[JI7]

21. that's really stupid , is it a true story ?

[jeff30997]

25. Yes,believe it or not.

He went to a lot of exotic places like Japan,India and stayed in his room.That's nuts.

[dalaigh lllama]

53. Amazing, isn't it?

We were overseas for two weeks recently and stayed in a Hilton for two nights in Luxembourg. Everything was very Americanized, and we were surrounded by Americans for the only time during our trip. It felt like cheating. I told my husband I hated it -- what was the point of being in Europe if you're insulated from the culture you're there to immerse yourself in?

[Flying Dream Blues]

5. Monty Python had a great sketch on this.,,about traveling Brits who complained about

how you couldn't get a proper cup 'o tea, can't find Watney's Red Barrel Ale, etc. so I guess it's not just an American phenomenon, but when I travel it's usually the Americans I see doing this. Makes me cringe.

[redwitch]

33. Yes! The Travel Agency skit

Firs thing I thought of.
"And if you're not at the table spot on 7 you miss the bowl of Campbell's cream of mushroom soup..."

[pink-o]

99. Go to the South Coast of Spain! It's "Little Britain"!!!

And yes, they're just as boorish and annoying as their Yankee counterparts. Even worse, they can live there full time now, as EU citizens. Just watch one episode of HGTV's House Hunters International--see the working-class Brits looking to buy a place in Spain or Portugal. Their lack of sophistication is really surprising!

And it's not just the Brits either!! I've seen some pretty rude Germans when I was in Italy (and the Italians--especially Venetians--can't stand the Germans) and some obnoxious French people in Berlin.

But in all honesty, I gotta admit we're the worst.

USA! USA! USA! We're number 1!:headbang:

[davidpdx]

7. Actually I'm not right wing, but liberal and have lived abroad for five years

and complain often. It's not necessarily about the comfort zone but what drives me insane. People spitting on the sidewalks, driving like there's no tomorrow (ie get out of my way or I'm going to run you over) and the general attitude that you don't exist (if I can't see you in line then surely I must be in front of you). Granted I'm not overtly negative all the time, but a lot of the times things DO get to me. I have learned alot about the culture I live in and have great respect for the foundation of what it was based on. Being married into another culture has been an eye opening experience I could have never imagined. Still people do have their limits on what they can tolerate.

[Locut0s]

14. Where do/did you live those 5 years? I Also from a family that did the same.

I fully understand complaining on that level. I'm 1/2 Chinese my father married my mother then had me and 2 years latter the 3 of us moved to and lived in China and Malaysia for 4 years. My father had all the same reactions to China of the 80s. But he loved it as well. I'm more talking about a veiled racist attitude that I see in foreign travelers.

[davidpdx]

18. I live in South Korea have have been here 5 1/2 years

except for short trips home that can last 8 weeks to four month about ever two years. This one coming up is going to be shorter, only three weeks.

[malaise]

8. Good post

I heard one of the clueless GEMSNBC ladies saying that when she was in Geneva she ate at McDonald's three times a day. I shook my head and switched channels. Why would you not try the local food? I detest these morons.

[Johnny Noshoes]

9. "Why would you not try the local food?"

You know the same thing happens here at home. People come to New York City - my hometown - from other parts of the US and they never seem to go out of their way to find the many kinds of restaurants featuring all sorts of great ethnic foods. They end up in the same chain places they can find back home. Why bother to come here if you're not willing to really discover the place? I work in Times Square and I swear sometimes I feel like my city has been turned into a theme park.

[ChazII]

23. Agreed - live in Phoenix

and other Americans come here and totally say how much better everything is back home in the east. Mid-west folks don't seem to complain as much. Back to the topic, when I was in Europe I ate at the local restaurants and stayed away from the chains.

[MrsMatt]

35. Well, that would depend on who you are traveling with

Last time my husband and I were in New York City, we had our two children with us (aged 11 and 3). While we didn't eat exclusively at chain restaurants, we did end up eating at a Hard Rock Cafe, a McDonald's and an Appleby's.

Not by MY choice, mind you. But out of respect for my children's comfort level and since we were there a whole week, we figured that a couple of visits to familiar chain eateries wasn't too bad - especially since we never eat at Hard Rock or Appleby's here at home (we tend to eat at a locally owned Japanese, Mexican and BBQ joints!).

[reggie the dog]

59. I am going to try avoiding all chain restaurants with my daughter

that way she will not get hooked. I only go to local eateries here in France or in the USA. Even for fast food we go to the local Kebab sandwhich (like a gyros) place instead of McDonalds like I did in the USA. While visiting the UK recently my friend proposed Burger King or a local porc sandwhich place. We got the porc sandwhich just because it was not a chain. I know that kids can like their comfort so I understand your motivation, but as they get older hopefully you can get them to like the adventure of going to local restaurants.

[hfojvt]

57. not everybody has a strong stomach for one thing

if I try some strange local food, I could easily, all too easily, end up riding the porcelain express for the next six hours. So I'd rather not chance that just for the experience of eating something I am probably not gonna like the taste of anyway. As far as 'discovering the place' presumably a lot of local people are eating at those chain places too, and hopefully even more people are eating at home.

[grace0418]

88. I live in Chicago (an awesome food town itself) and whenever we go to NYC we

love to try as many new places as we can. Tourists who don't take advantage of a city like New York are nuts.

[proud2BlibKansan]

20. When we travel, we make it a rule to eat the local food

If it is something we can get at home that is good at home, we don't order it when traveling. And we refuse to eat 'foreign' food, like lobster, here at home. We live 2000 miles from an ocean. The most expensive lobster here sucks compared to the least expensive lobster we had in Maine.

[JI7]

22. some relatives visited from England and they went to Mcdonalds, Taco Bell, Burger King etc

and it's not about going to expensive places either.

in Los Angeles you can try something like Pinks hot dogs, in and out, king taco etc. all pretty cheap but better than those same stupid chains that exist all around the world.

[reggie the dog]

60. hell I would take them to a steak house

so they could see real American food, then out to an authentic Mexican restaurant for real Mexican food.

[grace0418]

89. It's not just food. We went on an Alaskan cruise last summer. I had reservations about

doing a cruise because I hate tourist traps and being surrounded by hordes of people like the morons you describe. So we did a ton of research before the trip to find interesting local activities, hiking trails and other things that would not be so overrun. So when we would get off the ship at the various ports, we would head straight for a quiet trail or meet up with a local guide to take us on a river raft or something. We took some great hikes (and hardly saw anyone else on the trails), saw tons of wildlife, visited places like a salmon hatchery, a sled dog camp, and a totem museum. We took a million gorgeous pictures, and worked off some of that food we ate on the ship. We even ziplined through the rainforest in Juneau–AWESOME!

Nearly everyone else on the boat would either get on a tour bus or shuffle over to all the tacky tourist shops. One time we even saw a bunch of people getting on a bus to go to WALMART. You pay all that money to go to Alaska and end up at Walmart? Why? Because the ship charged extra for soda with meals (there was plenty of cold water, iced tea and coffee available), and it was cheaper to go to Walmart and buy a case of Coke. I actually saw several people getting back on the boat with cases of soda. That was how they spent their time in Ketchikan. Mind-blowing.

The part that makes no sense to me is that cruises to Alaska are pretty expensive, moreso than cruises to the Caribbean. Why spend the extra money if you were just going spend the whole time on the ship gorging yourself or in a tourist shop buying cheap crap?

[moondust]

10. Tour bus zombies.

"Hey waiter, why is this damn menu in French?"

[HughBeaumont]

11. Especially when they do it and not realize that travelling abroad, for many of us, is a luxury.

I'd probably be able to do that if I were 26 and single and it was just me going. But what people don't get when they explain how they do their outlier discounts, methods of seasonal timing, etc, is that I have a wife and a teenaged son, so that automatically triples the cost. I also have a dog to board at the Animal Clinic, since none of my relatives can appear to be burdened with watching him, so that costs money.

I wanted to go to Germany, specifically Wacken, to see a metal festival two years ago. A German resident I worked with brought me back to earth right fast. Even with discounts, buying airfare and hotels at the right time, planning ahead, etc; we'd be talking $5,000, MINIMUM. Sorry, my money tree in the backyard didn't exactly bloom that year.

Last year we went to Niagara Falls, Toronto and Ottawa, which is like, the biggest thing I've done since I've been on my own. Living in northeast Ohio, this is somewhere we can drive to. We stayed in fleabags, ate on the cheap, etc. When all was said and debited, it came to around $1000, and we had to save for a whole year to meet that cost.

Even travelling in the cushy spots of South and West America isn't in my price range. I wanted to go to Disneyland in Florida, but even factoring in discounts, that will set me back $1750 at the very least.

So until I get a wage that matches the cost of living, get debts paid (because, again, we don't have wages that match the cost of living), or have a house that doesn't require triple-to-five digit maintenance like basement waterproofing, it looks like I'm pretty much staying within the driveable 500-mile realm of Northeast Ohio. I'm pretty sure the majority of America is in the same boat as I am, which is why these people that brag about their Punta Cana excursions, European jaunts and even Vegas trips should stop and consider how lucky they are to be able to do this.

[SmileyRose]

51. Trust me on this

it isn't where your body is, it's who you are with and what that relationship is like. Every vacation I have ever had has been within 500 miles of home. As a kid we spent a whole week tent camping at a state park about 150 miles from home, using it as a home base for both exploring the park itself, getting a science lesson on the plants, the rock formations, the animals, human history etc - and for driving short distances to see unique small towns with rich histories around it. That cheapo close to home vacation is still our absolute favorite.

We did once manage to save up to drive all the way to Florida to Disney world. We all remember having a good time but the details have gotten fuzzy over the years. Oddly enough, the strongest memory we all have is of our red socks - because the hotel we stayed at recently bought new red carpet. I think Disney was too overstimulating -- and we tended to split up and run all over the place rather than stay and communicate as a family.

Anyways - in my 50's now - and we still get together every 5 or so years for "the family vacation" where we all bring our own families. We are all on tight budgets getting tighter quick - and the tent thing is something all our spouses have learned to "enjoy" (or at least survive well enough to be willing to come) - those weeks, where all the cousins sit around burning more marshmellows and hot dogs than they actually eat - and the adults sit in the dark and talk to each other do more to recharge us for the next months or years of working our asses off than any "fancy" vacation ever could.

[reggie the dog]

64. 5 grand is about right

my wife comes from an Island in the indian ocean so we go to her island once every 3 or 4 years, at back to the states once every 3 or 4 years. We are trying to save some more money because we have 3 grand for air line tickes for the three of us for next summer, plus another 2 for our 7 weeks in the usa (thanks mom and dad for letting us squat at your house!) but we would love to go to quebec but that is easily another 3 grand......we could sell our stocks, wait they are worthless???hmmmm now there are money tress (cannabis) but that is just too damn risky......I found that I was able to save up a grand in a year by stopping eating cakes at the french bakeries to the tune of saving about 20 euros a week just in junk food. Do you smoke? I am thinking about stoping buying cannabis because it is less risky to grow 2 or 3 plants and smoke for free all year long (saves between 500 and a grand) than it is to grow 4 kilos to come up with 4 grand (low prices here). I am blessed with low health insurance (nationalized) so that is probably where my vacation money comes from. Single payer may well help folks like you to start having better vacations. Otherwise if you smoke ciggies you could save up 1500 a year if you quit a pack a day. I did a vacation like that at the end of high school when I quit and put 10 a week into a box and then had 500 to drive to Florida and squat at my aunt's for a week. Wacken is the top metal fest in the EU, save up slowly but surely and go in 5 years. Your family will think Europe is so cool. Perhaps the govt. will give you all single payer and you can save a pile that way. I am not bragging or trying to make you feel bad. I really think you will love Europe and think that if you can foregoe 2 smaller trips and go to Europe you will love it.

[XOKCowboy]

118. Save your money. Go to Europe and take your family

Keep your eye out for discount flights and hotels. Deals are out there. Once you stand in a place that's been there 4 times longer than white people have been in America it changes your perspective. Plus the food is INCREDIBLE!

[comtec]

127. Heh don't come to Holland for teh food

you will be horribly disappointed!

But I admit frikendel and patat (steak fries) in a paper bowl/cup/thingie is a very kewl experience.

Lumpia (spring rolls) from a street vendor as a street food is rather amusing.

Been here 5 years, visiting for 5 before that (wife), and I have LOADS to complain about LOL
but not when I was just a visitor.
observations, but no real complaints.

Having lived here for 5 years solid, I can say, got to germany for food LOL! Even the chinese is better imho.

But yeah, if you are going to another country EAT LOCAL!

aside from being good for the local economy, its an experience.

In Spain, for example, goto the local pubs/bars at lunch time, try the tortilia, it's GREAT!

In germany try the street schnitzel, a looong hot dog in a TINY bun :) try the mustard with it!

you may not care for it, but TRY IT!

why go to another country if you aren't going to explore?

BTW if anyone is coming to holland look for a proper Kaass winkel/kaas handel (cheese shop). Ask for oud bouren kaas (old farmer's cheese) mmmmm that is SHARP and GOOOOOOD!!

Don't be afraid to ask for samples, if you are foreign, they will give you some additional exposition, which is nice!

Holland is a great place for cheese :)

Spain has some great pork, and other random stuff !

Germany... well about everything LOL just you WILL need to be able to eek out at least basic german phrases unless you are in a major city. The younger german speak english, but older ones.... not so much.

anyway... enjoy your trip!

complain when you get home LOL

[knitter4democracy]

12. Tell me about it.

When I was in college, I did a fair bit of travel on mission trips. For a lot of the kids in the groups, it was their first time out of state, let alone out of the country and/or culture. I got the point that I ditched my group as quickly and as often as possible. The only decent group was the Russian Studies Program I did a semester with. All the other trips had people on them who shouldn't have signed up--complained every frackin' day about every tiny little thing.

[DURHAM D]

13. From my experience -

Americans are not the worst travelers. There are several other nationalities that rank far above us in general a**hole behavior.

Just ask the locals all over the world who work in the hospitality industry. They will tick off a list without hesitation.

[CBR]

15. When I was in Amsterdam last year, I asked the bartender at the

hotel about the worst tourists. He said Italians without hesitation. He said Americans were of average obnoxiousness. FWIW

[Locut0s]

16. Oh yes I agree. Canadian myself. Germany and France are famous!

It's the attitude in general that drives me up the wall. If you want to shit on someone else's culture do it at home. To have the nerve to go to another country and do so in front of them (even if they can't understand) just gets me furious.

[vadawg]

32. germans and the english are by far the worst.

[JI7]

17. i hate squat toilets

[AllieB]

19. There are still some in France-old Turkish toilets.

x(

They're usually in Tabacs or very old bars.

[reggie the dog]

61. or the pubic toilets in small towns in the countryside

Shitting in those toilets with an attack of the squirts is not fun, not fun at all ;(

[AzNick]

71. They are more popular in Japan

In France they were popular at a time because it is said they are better that the type you sit on.

Traditionally, people were squatting. People have only started to use seats in the lest few decades.

[old mark]

24. My sister in law spent several years in southern Africa in the old

Peace Corps and later as a scholar....she met someone from the US there who was fascinated by the idea of making the entire continent into a development , "just like Florida." He envisioned a big retirement community/corporate haven with huge buildings, hiways, cheap local labor.
He wanted to completely destron any vestige of African culture except for maybe a few fake tourist quality resorts and "safari" hunting lodges.

People always amaze me......
:patriot:
mark

[Lucky Luciano]

26. Ahhh traveling....I am dedicating my life to it...

There is definitely a lot of "sucking it up" when traveling and it can lead to some complaints. As others have alluded to above - the squat toilets, cultures where spitting a huge wad right in front of everyone is totally cool (I was speaking to a very attractive woman in Shanghai - and she paused while speaking to me to hock a big lugie and then continued to speak...I immediately moved on), or even a little thing - like the first thing I found annoying the first time I was in Europe after college - ALL supermarkets closed at like 6pm - maybe 7pm if you were lucky! That made it hard for a budget traveler to get a cheap dinner because you would have to stop what you were doing very early to go find cheap eats! I realized that my comfort zone in America definitely involved 24/7 conveniences.

It's all good though. I would not want to travel if it did not involve hardships - I think that is part of the deal and part what makes it more fun and adventurous. Or to make a more extreme example - anyone ever climb Mount Everest or K2 without experiencing hardship? No, of course not - it is part of the appeal and the experience - to look back and remember everything about it would be less meaningful if you took a helicopter (a magic one that can actually fly up there) to the top!

Ultimately, what makes travel wonderful whether it has a focus on culture or nature (my last two big trips were more nature - the Patagonian wilderness and some national parks/game reserves in South Africa, Lesotho, Swaziland, Namibia) is all of the unexpected things that happen. A day at home is more interesting whenever some random postive unexpected event occurs. When completely out of your element and traveling in some totally unknown place, these random occurrences, small and large, happen 20 times per day and it is fantastic! This is why it is not about the destination, but all about the journey!

ok, I am babbling...I could go on and on and on...I guess I did so, because the economy totally crushed me and I cannot go anyhwhere until I get back on my feet!

[JVS]

39. Even the Europeans got sick of groceries closing at 6 or 7.

Some of the small stores close at 7 now, but full size supermarkets are open until 10 or even 11.

[reggie the dog]

62. The biggest store in the town I live in closes

by 8:00 PM, the smaller 3 supermarkets all close between 7 and 7:30. Two even close for 2 hours for lunch. If I drive ten miles down to the road that leads to the coast there is one that is open untill 9 pm, that is really late for around here. Of course I live in France. Here most people do not even see the utility of stores being open around the clock. I like the mentality here. Hell after 8 pm during the week you are lucky to find a tobacco store open, after 10 forget it. I live in town, a middle sized town of 35 000 surrounded by the forests of the Alps to the north, and grapes, figs, olives, oak for making bottle corks, and pine trees with nuts you eat to the east west and south. Here you shop, then go home and eat, then RELAX!

[14thColony]

90. My town shuts down at 5pm.

Life in rural England...

[dysfunctional press]

27. different strokes for different folks.

as for not eating the local foods- some people are just more comfortable eating what they know.personally- i don't abide spicy food. ever since the dawn of refrigeration, there's no reason that eating has to be an unpleasant experience. the reason for spicy foods, has historically been to cover the taste of rotting meat, which is why, in general, the warmer the climate, the spicier the 'native dishes'.
if i had to choose between a kfc and some shithole local establishment outside phuket- the colonel would win every time.

[Catherine Vincent]

63. I never thought of that.

:-)

[XOKCowboy]

83. I agree with Anthony Bourdain.. They've been eating those foods for thousands of years..

We've only been a country for a little over 200 years and KFC has only been around for 40 years. "Mashed potatoes" made from a dry powder and gravy from a can, chicken that's pre-dipped in a chemical "16 herbs and spices" goop and "coleslaw" from a can. MMMMMMMMmmmm I'd rather eat from a street vendor in Nueva Laredo. It's at least more nutritious.

Edited to add: I have a friend who can't eat spicy food either. I feel sorry for him because he has to miss out on some incredible Thai, Indian and assorted Asian foods. Any ire I have is toward people that actively avoid eating ANY local food and actually believe that America's chemical ridden, pre-processed and factory farmed "cuisine" is superior to cultures who use fresh products in 1000 year old recipes. Some of the best food I've ever eaten was in out of the way "shitholes".

[knitter4democracy]

96. Chili peppers are from the Americas, though.

Granted, they took off in Asia when introduced by traders, but they're a relatively recent phenomenon there.

[dysfunctional press]

98. "I'd rather eat from a street vendor in Nueva Laredo."

'nuf said...:eyes:

enjoy.

[votingupstart]

107. the chicken tacos are actually really good

i find some of the street vendors in mexico very good - i will have to admit i have traveled a little, have a strong stomach and really like mexican/south american food. They were not as good as the guys in Thailand (Bankok and Phuket),Gremany (all over),Ireland (Belfast), about tied with china(bejing)

[XOKCowboy]

115. Oh I know...

Never NL but I have eaten at street vendors in Tijuana. I have a strong stomach also combined with a love for good food. We're just lucky I guess. There is a little lady in a town square somewhere in Belize (not giving away my paradise) who will cook you a spicy pork burrito on what looks like an upside down trash can lid that will bring you to your knees. We ate some great food in Beijing also plus were treated to a dim sum dinner in Hong Kong that was incredible though exotic (some of the dishes you ate on faith). Don't get me started on Europe.

My goodness in the majority of these places the ingredients are all grown either locally or by the chefs themselves. Very little if any of their food comes out of a can. As I said before I'll take a street vendor just about anywhere in the world over KFC, Mcdonalds (:puke:), BK, etc, etc...

[XOKCowboy]

116. Oh I will don't worry...

You sound like a guy who posted on a Caribbean island website I frequent. He wanted to know if Customs would charge him duty if he brought in a weeks worth of Stouffer's frozen dinners. This place is known for its fresh seafood, fruits and vegetables and great local cuisine. This guy though didn't trust the filthy natives to live up to his sanitary standards.

Most of the responses from the locals and frequent visitors was for him to just stay home.

[bikebloke]

28. I've found them even among backpackers.

And I don't hang out with them for long. They're always bitching and moaning about how this and that are better back home. The newness and differences are part of the adventure.

[AzNick]

69. I'm from Paris, France, I could tell you a lot...

Tourists are part of the landscape and an important source of revenue, and most tourists behave, but I've seen the traditional loud-mouthed American tourist who criticized everything, speaking loudly as if nobody could understand (because, you know, English is a cryptic language that very few people speak), but most know how to behave.

What really piss everybody off though is the long lines of such tourists at McDonald's on the Champs Elysees (really one of the best McD's in the world, by the way, they raised the bar two notches).

[Goblinmonger]

85. We are headed to Paris (and other spots)

in a couple weeks. What should we do and not do?

[AzNick]

87. Just enjoy yourself and try a few different things!

But if you want to know why in 2000 France was the only country where McD made a profit, try eating once at the McD on the Champs and you'll see why.

Due to the difference in culture and palate, McD had to raise their standards.

[Goblinmonger]

95. We are vegetarian, but with that recommendation

we'll give it a shot.

Pragmatic question for you, if you would. We are staying in a hotel by the Gare De L'Est and the Gare De L'Nord stops. We have a flight out of De Gaulle where check-in ends at 07:00. How long of a metro/train ride is that going to be. We could cancel our last night and find a hotel closer to the airport if it is going to be a bitch.

I found a RER B schedule online and go the answer to my question.

[noamnety]

30. I've experienced that as well.

I was in Moscow during Thanksgiving one year, and other Americans with us were angry that the restaurant we went to that day didn't prepare an American Thanksgiving feast for us. It was unbelievable. It doesn't take a lot of brain cells to figure out that traveling abroad during holidays isn't the best idea if you want to experience a traditional American holiday.

I'd be willing to bet the folks on that trip who were complaining that other countries' businesses didn't honor US holidays couldn't have named a single holiday/date from another culture.

[NNN0LHI]

31. Same reason some people take TV sets with them when they go camping

[cherokeeprogressive]

34. "Big Rude Whitey"

Um... yeah.

:puke:

[vadawg]

38. yeah i saw that but for some reason my brain just reminded me i was on DU and it seemed acceptable

wish i knew how to do the emoticons things

[cherokeeprogressive]

42. LOL Here, even Whitey hates Whitey.

On the subject of emoticons, look right above the subject line of your replies, and click "Smilies lookup table". All you have to do is click on one and it'll be in your post.

[kiva]

41. Yup, kind of ruined the whole post for me...

an interesting question about why some tourists are rude, ending with "Big Rude Whitey"--right. :eyes:

[Name removed]

36. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[seabeyond]

37. because their mother in laws make them go and they dont want to be there? n/t

[marmar]

40. I was in Brussels....and there were some Americans in a restaurant just BITCHING that....

.... the restaurant had run out of ketchup for the pomme frites (fries, which are more commonly served with Mayo in Europe).
We were sitting a few tables over and apologized to the waiter. "Really, we're not all like that."

[reggie the dog]

66. why not just eat the fries plain???

notice it is pomme frites, and not FRENCH fries!!! you were in Belgium after all.

Hell they could have dipped the fries in the sauce of their moules (mussles) or were they eating burgers insteat of the local moule frites specialty?

[bikebloke]

74. Pommes frites et mayonaise

YUM!!!
It's the only way I'll eat them
Keep your ketchup. You can pry my paptat frites en mayonaise from my dead cold hands.:)

[comrade snarky]

78. I will trample another human being

In my rush to get to the frites with curry sauce in Amsterdam.

mmmmmm curry sauce

[Goblinmonger]

108. Now that sounds good.

Will try find some in Amsterdam. Being vegetarian, the seafood is out but fries in curry sauce...be still my heart.

[jberryhill]

113. Hit the fry place....

...just off Dam Square, on the street immediately to the right of the NH Grand Hotel Krasnapolsky. About halfway down the block there is a Vlaamse Fries place that makes the fries on order, and they have about 20 different sauces to try out.

Conveniently located next to the Paradise Coffee Shop, too.

[Goblinmonger]

114. Copied and pasted into our

"things to do in Amsterdam" document.

[jberryhill]

119. Ahhh...

Add: "NEVER stand in a bike lane - NEVER" You are safer throwing yourself into auto traffic than standing in a bike lane.

Add: "Rent a bike. Your feet will thank you. At complicated intersections, just follow another person on a bike, and then correct your route at a less complicated intersection. See all of Vondelpark."

[comrade snarky]

124. For vegetatians in Amsterdam

I'd strongly recommend the Dutch pancakes. They're "pancakes" in the loosest sense, more like crepes covered in your choice of of topping. Sweet or savory it's hard to go wrong. I still dream of a walnut and Camembert concoction I had one morning.
There are great little restaurants all over the city, I don't think you'll have any trouble finding veggie food.

Oh and, really, beware the bike lanes. Treat it like an extension of car traffic because there that's what it is.



Crap... now I want to go back.

[comtec]

131. Hee hee In my town of Zwolle we have the Pannekoen schip!

The pancake ship - or is it pirate...


anyway yeah Pancake Pizza is... different, but gooood!
The stroop (very thick syrup) is very interesting to have on pizza like substances.

I was not aware of that place off the Dam, but there is a Japanese place about 5-8 alleys down that is the F'ing best japanese i've had in this country (ok that's a LOW bar, but it IS good, and I'm from SF).

In the shopping square (I'm sorry I don't know the name but the 5, 16, 24 trams go there, it's right before museum plein) are a few good places as well.

Pretty much ANY duram place is good (sorry I know, vegan) because of the large Turkish population.

The wok n go places that are scattered throughout A'dam have vegetarian options and are VERY good - wok'd fresh!)

Anyway enjoy! :)

[azmouse]

43. Americans don't have to travel to other countries to complain things aren't like 'home'

I was raised in PA but now live in AZ. The first few times family came here to visit I heard a lot of the "that's not the way things are back home" type comments.
My goodness... they were surrounded by beautiful saguaro cactus and breath-takingly rugged mountains and all they could do was compare it with the cornfields and hills 'back home'. :eyes:
They couldn't just enjoy the scenery and appreciate seeing something different.

[laststeamtrain]

44. I was in Switzerland & I couldn't get a cup of Swiss Miss Hot 'Chocolate'!

What's up with that!?!?

We're number one, we're number one, we're number one.

PS: the United States is a 'center-right' country. (But only if you watch too much TV & believe what you see & hear on TV.)

[TahitiNut]

45. Please don't say "nuts" like it's a Bad Thing. It's offensive to us Nuts.

Thanks. :hi:

* This is a public service posting on behalf of the International Association of Fruits & Nuts, Ad Hoc DU Chapter.

:silly:

** This message may or may not reflect the opinions of 10minutearticle, 1plain1peanut, AcadamiaNut, aquanut, B3Nut, blackwalnut, bobbonutrino, bozosleftnut, bulugnut, BUSHISNUTS, butternut, butternutty, buttnutt, Canadiangunnut, capsnut, Carnut, CarNutAtl, Cash U. Nutt, CA_liberal_nut, Chanute, coconut, Coconut Buddha Ape, coconut55, CoconutMonkey, coconutofdoom, Coconuts, coconut_oil, conspiracy-nut, cybernut, darlademnut, deeznuts, DemNutz, democratinutah, deznuts, deznutts, donut, donut33, donutrevolutionary, Donuts, donutwant, econut, elvisthenut, fleabitpeanutmonkey, fluffernutter, fordnut, FruityNuts, fuzzlenutz, gaygunnut, GnomesLeftNut, grapenut1998, graphixnut, gunnut12345, HangingSaddamByHisNutsack, hangonjustaminute, hazelnut, HealthNut, Historynut, Jacknut, jakenuts, JaneDoughnut, JustFiveMoreMinutes, just_anuther_gurl, Kazznut, KnuteThingrich, KNUTSY, kokonuts, konominut, lastminutevoter, leftnut22, leftrightwingnut, leftrightwingnuts, leftwingnut, LeftyWingNut, Lefty_WingNut, Lela McNutt, Letters From A Nut, liberalgunnut, LiberalInUtah, lilpnut, Lonenut23, lonenutcracker, loosenut, Lugnut, Luv nut, MACanuto, madminute, MarlinNut, MilsurpNut, Minuteman, Minutes, monkeynuts6969, monolithic_juggernut, Mr Peanut, Mr. Peanut, mrpeanut, my15minutes, NONnutcase, NorthwestNut, NoToCubanRepubnuts, nsaixphnutex, numinut, Nut Grinderswitch, Nutboy, nutcake, nutcase, nutcracker420, nutcrakcer, nutgrass, nuthatch, nuthead2ub, Nutkinnews, Nutmeg, NutMeg021576, nutmeg08, Nutmeg1576, Nutmeg61, Nutmegger, NutmegJenny, NutmegYankee, nutmeg_express, Nutniks, nuton2wheels, nutone, nutria, Nutrino, NutritionFacts, Nuts, nuts101, nutsco101, nutshell2002, nutsnberries, nutsnbolts, NutterFluffer, NuttinBut, nutty left, NuttyFluffers, nuttyjake, nuttymango, nuttywoody, nututhissite, oaknut, omgiamgoingnuts, Opera Nut, ornanut, paolonutuni, peanut, Peanut Gallery, peanut2010, peanut3729, peanut57, peanutbrittle, PeanutButter, Peanutcat, PeanutGallery, PeanutOne, peanuts, peanutz, Permanut, pnutchuck, pnutfarmer, PNutt, PoliSciNut, PolitiNut, PublicHealthNut, pucknut, Racenut20, reichwingnut, somenut, soulforpeanuts, soulforpeanutz, Soynut, spacenut, Spudnuts, superbeachnut, TahitiNut, the wingnuttiest, undamynutz, Unuttymuh, videonut, walnutpie, weenut1, Wingnut19, Wingnutblogger, Wingnutsawry, wwwalnut, or yoganut.

[BlooInBloo]

46. You can get DU on the internet in China? Amazing.

[votingupstart]

106. i am also a little shocked at this

introdue it to a few locals while you are there.

[Captain Hilts]

47. I lived in Moscow with USians who never rode the subway or hung out with Russians.

People try and recreate their life back home. That's not why you travel.

And it's why you should learn the language of where you are going. Without doing so, you might as well stay home.

[comrade snarky]

58. Honestly, I disagree about learning the language

It's good to pick up a few phrases and learn numbers but it wont make the trip worthless if you aren't fluent.

I was lucky enough to get to spend a month in Egypt and with my lack of language skills Arabic isn't something I could just pick up in a year. Could I have gotten even more immersed in the local scene if I did speak the language? Of course but when I think back on that trip I learned so much about Egypt, it's people and myself that it was far from worthless. I'd be a poorer person for letting the language barrier stop me.

I did eat a pizza in Alexandria though. :-)

[Captain Hilts]

86. Yes, some phrases to get you around. Most US folks didn't do even that. They lived in English-

speaking enclaves.

[comrade snarky]

91. Even without that you can do a lot

My wife and I were in Eastern Europe and ended up going to Budapest. Kind of spur of the moment because it was between us and our destination. Not a word of Hungarian between us. Had a great time, learned a bit at restaurants and the hotel but we started with nothing.

I'm totally with you on getting out of expat ghettos, I just wanted people to know that don't need to speak the language to go. We have some great memories because of the language barrier! We were trying to get to an airport at 3 am in Egypt but the only cabbie around spoke no English so we ended up pantomiming airplanes and running around in the street. We all laughed a most of the way there.

With a good attitude and basic pantomime you can go anywhere.

[knitter4democracy]

97. I met some in Nizhni Novgorod like that.

They kept eating at the crappy pizza place in town (just plain awful pizza) and didn't know Russian, didn't know any Russians outside of work, and were total jerks. They worked for the State Dept in various ways and really should've been sent home.

[RufusTFirefly]

48. The pizza and hamburgers in Paris are terrible!!

I was stuck at CDG in Paris after authorities found an unclaimed makeup case (this was 2002) and was forced to stand around with a bunch of other passengers just beyond a barricade.

There we were a captive audience to an obvious U.S. American (I'm American too) who was ranting so nobody could easily tune him out about how bad the food was in Paris. Apparently the hamburgers weren't up to snuff and the pizzas were too small. It was an international group of passengers and I was embarrassed to be from the same country as this lout.

[hayu_lol]

50. Actually, travel in China is probably safer than ...

walking the streets of NYC, Philly, or Chicago--even late at night. The people are quite friendly and the food generally superb...even from street vendors. Merchants are accomodating and helpful in directing you to the stores you want to go to.

If you haven't traveled China, don't criticize the place.

[TahitiNut]

55. Y'know? Three and a half months in Paris and I have no idea how the pizza and hamburgers were.

Go figure. :shrug:

It just NEVER occurred to me to eat either. Not living there for 3 1/2 months or on several trips thereafter. Funny ... I didn't have them in Tahiti, either.

:crazy:

[reggie the dog]

67. excellent!

[TahitiNut]

72. (grin) I will say, however, that a little Skippy peanut butter on a fresh baguette is to die for.

Almost as good as fromage. :dunce:

[reggie the dog]

125. peanut butter!

[spooky3]

81. had a similar experience at an airport - several other Americans and I apologized to the staff

for the idiot's behavior - he was being really rude to the staff, who were bending over backwards to help him politely.

[XOKCowboy]

122. I was in a hotel in Paris that wasn't on a main arterial street..

so you had to arrange for a cab with the concierge. It was obvious by the location and it was posted that you had to pre-arrange a cab. When I got to the cab stand the next day there was an American Businessman going nuts. He was giving the valet the whole "YOU DON'T KNOW WHO YOU'RE DEALING WITH" routine and raving about how much money his company spent at that hotel, yada yada yada. I was about 3rd in line and went up to the valet (we'd talked before during my week there. It's amazing what a smile and a "Howdy" will get ya) and said in a voice that the shithead could hear to give him my cab and that not all Americans were like that. The valet smiled, went to his little stand and made a phone call. A few minutes later the hotel limo pulled up, he motioned to me and said "Merci monsieur, thanks for staying with us" and I had a free ride to CDG.

It's all in how you treat people. No matter where you are.

[spooky3]

128. Great story! Thanks.

[barbtries]

49. i don't know why

when i travel i'm like you, i'm so happy to be somewhere else. what a drag it would be to just pick at why isn't it more like home.

[HamdenRice]

52. Because Chinese, French, Germans, are assholes who think in English then speak foreign to confuse us

Ya know what I mean? Everyone in the world "thinks" in English. But some fancy pants foriners speak some other goddam second language and make it hard for us travelers by insisting on "speaking" in that second tongue.

They're assholes for that and they deserve to be complained about.

[Iggo]

54. +1

Daaaaaaaaang furriners!

[WhiteTara]

56. most of those people go to

Cancun. Where they can leave home and have everything the same.

[LeftishBrit]

65. There is an old saying in my family...

'You don't educate a steer by shipping it.'

[Fire1]

68. I've found over the years that international travel is for the

open minded. It digusts me to hear people say, that there's no better place on earth than America and more often than not these are the same people that have never been any further than 'their own back yard.' My suggestion to folks like that is to keep your dumb ass at home.

[cherokeeprogressive]

112. I've been further than my "own back yard".

I've been to Caracas, Mombasa, Athens, Nice, Paris, Monte Carlo, Palma, Naples, Sigonella, Perth, London, Nassau, St. Thomas, St. Georges, Ponta Delgada, Portsmouth, and Diego Garcia. I may have left some out...

Wanna know something? I've also been to 37 of the 50 states and you can give me an RV with enough gas to see the things I've yet to see in my country, and the time to re-visit some of the things I HAVE seen. I'll be perfectly happy.

What struck me the most about traveling abroad was the fact that as long as you had Dead Presidents in your wallet, you were a high priority. Without the Dead Presidents, you were persona non grata. With Dead Presidents in your wallet, EVERYONE speaks English. Without? English might as well be an alien language from outerspace.

Been there, done that, and now I'll keep my dumb ass at home, thank you very much.

[Fire1]

130. Surely you realize even in the good ole U.S. of A, without

'dead presidents' you're 'persona non grata' or haven't you been listening these last thirty years.

[truedelphi]

70. I remember some 20 years ago asking a friend's mom

How she liked her month in Italy.

The woman said "I would have loved it if those Italians had not spoken so much Italian."

Sheesh! I thought at first she was joking, but she wasn't.

And both she and her husband were very RW.

[Brooklyns_Finest]

73. Business men

There are a lot of people who have to travel internationally for business. I have had to go overseas for business (Eastern Europe) and I will admit to being the first person to find a Mcdonalds.

Also, America IS the best place in the world to live. This is coming from an American. I would expect any patrotic person of ANY country to say the same for their own homeland.

[Fire1]

77. Like I stated. Disgusting.

:puke:

[14thColony]

92. Amen

[donco6]

101. Really?

Wow. How sad.

[pipi_k]

75. I would travel just to get AWAY from the local food n/t

.

[AnnieBW]

76. When we went to Australia, we avoided all American fast food

Our working motto was "if we can get it at home, we don't want it". We didn't even stop in a frickin' Starbucks. My attitude has always been that you are going to another country to absorb the culture and see how people live. Okay, there are some things in China that I wouldn't eat. (Rat on a stick, starfish on a stick, etc.) But there's some things I won't eat in America, either.

[bigtree]

79. I get you

. . . but, while in China, I think you'd be better off if you restricted your diet (outside of the major hotel food - and even then) to fruits and fresh vegetables. That's not a complaint, just a tip.

[spooky3]

80. I gained 10 lbs. in 6 weeks in France, and that was with walking everywhere.

You could say I immersed myself in the local culture. :-) The food everywhere is just as wonderful as it's reputed to be.

Fortunately I lost it when immersing myself back home.

And I agree with you. If you're lucky enough to travel, especially to a nice place, you should take in everything it has to offer to the extent that you can.

[eowyn_of_rohan]

82. I hear you !

but it is not just Americans who can be stunningly rude and ignorant travelers. I have seen PLENTY of this behavior from non-Americans traveling here.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

84. I can't eat spicy food.

I have problems with food when I travel in the U.S.

Like the Bob Evans I ate at with prefab beef stroganoff. The meat was fatty. I asked the waitress about it and she said it was prefab and they couldn't replace it with anything better. Bob Evans is a reheating station, NOT a restaurant.

I can't eat fatty or stringy meat. Weird spices make me belch. I'm allergic to tomatoes and bell peppers and all shellfish. I had a meal at a winery and all the food had wayyy too much salt in it, so that was a disaster. Both the winery and the Bob Evans were near St. Louis.

:shrug:

All my life people have urged me to try food that I would gag on...."Oh it's not spicy!!".

Famous last words.......blech....barf...

[pipi_k]

102. Me neither

It HURTS.

Hurts my mouth, hurts my tongue, hurts my lips...everything.

Spicy food is just no fun.

And to make it worse, I'm extremely sensitive to spices that other people say don't bother them.

Like when we buy turkey hotdogs or whatever, and the manufacturers are afraid it'll be too "bland" so they spice it up and ruin it (for me) because it hurts to eat it.

In a way I feel lucky to live in New England where we don't use a lot of really hot spices, usually. The spiciest I can stand is a bit of black pepper...

:7

[Manifestor_of_Light]

104. Yeah I use a little black pepper and sea salt on a burger.

Here in Texas they think everyone eats Tex-Mex.

I once tried a few small bites of some takeout from P.F. Chang's.........barf...belch...I burped all night.

[HughMoran]

93. It can be fun at first

I now hate traveling and if I'm suffering due to nonavailability of things I'm used to and/or I just want to be in the comfort of my own home, I may not be the rosiest person you ever met. This is business travel I'm talking about.

[Lucky Luciano]

103. Business travel is generally not so fun. One rarely gets to do much

of the fun stuff in business traveling. It is pretty much, "get in, get out, quit fucking about - and back home."

[MasonJar]

105. You mean the "ugly American"? He's so common (AND I DO MEAN "COMMON")

that he actually even became a novel.

[efhmc]

109. The only thing I complained about was the inability to get away

from smoking. That has changed drastically. On my first trip to Europe, all the Americans were crammed into the one nonsmoking car. A few years later there were more nonsmoking cars and less smoking cars. Sorry but whereever I am, I am going to complain about inhaling tobacco fumes. I do it here too.

[TexasObserver]

110. That's a pet peeve of mine, too.

If one cannot go without having a McDonalds, one shouldn't leave their hometown!!

I hate Americans who come back from foreign travel bitching about everything isn't like in the US of A. Be glad to be home, but don't hate other places because they have different stuff, different attitudes.

When you're a traveler, it should be about them and their culture, not you and yours.

[JVS]

111. If I didn't know better, I'd think foreign culture is defined by stuffing one's face and using the..

toilet. At least that's what it seems like reading this thread.

[jberryhill]

120. Food is a key to a lot of cultures, really /nt

[bumblebee1]

121. This thread reminds me of our cruise stop in Nassau.

I was hell bent on trying conch chowder. After disembarking, my hubby and I found a restaurant that served various foods made from conch. I had my conch chowder and enjoyed it along with conch fritters. I then remember seeing a Dominoes pizza and Subway restaurants. I said to my husband that if I wanted to eat either Dominoes pizza or Subway sandwiches, we would have stayed home. Hubby agreed with me that day. Unfortunately, that was the only thing that agreed with me that day. I liked the conch chowder, it didn't like me. DOes it mean I would never try conch chowder again? No. I also wanted to try either a Bahama Mama or Papa. Due to the disagreement between my stomach and the conch chowder, that was out of the question.

You see, my husband and I took a four day cruise to the Bahamas for our 20th wedding anniversary. I had been to Nassau before. My husband had never been to the Bahamas. I've never been to Freeport. Unfortunately, it also rained while we were in Nassau. I was disappointed that I wasn't up to taking hubby around Nassau. He had no problem with it.

The reason I made the comment about the Subway restaurants is there are three within a short driving distance from our home. I'm also looking into taking a cruise to either Canada or the Caribbean next year.

[amandabeech]

123. I lived in NYC and now live in the DC area. A**h**e tourists come from all over.

n/t

[Cleita]

126. They do it just to say they've been there, but they don't seem to

enjoy their vacations at all. I worked with a woman who took a vacation in France, and came home complaining that they didn't speak English.

[BoneDaddy]

129. Yet people from other cultures come here and refuse to

adapt to this culture. Why is there such cognitive dissonance on this issue? I happen to agree with you. If I traveled or relocated to another culture I would immediately learn the language and adapt to that culture while still retaining a sense of my own.