Big pharma's latest scam. "Exhaling depletes the Ozone layer."

[Cyrano]

Hundreds of thousands of people with breathing disorders use inhalers.

The most common one was called Albuteral. It was a small pocket-sized spray that could be used two or three times a day to help people with lung problems breath easier.

However, this product is no longer on the market as of January 1st of this year. Big Pharma declared that inhaling it helped, but exhaling after using it was a "threat to the ozone layer." (On edit: How about if people just inhaled and didn't exhale? Would that solve the problem?)

The majority of people who use inhalers are seniors, and the generic inhalers were covered by their insurance companies.

The replacement product has no generic equivalent and costs $30 a month.

Just to put this in context, one medium sized herd of cattle cutting farts for a day, does more harm to the ozone layer than a million seniors exhaling after breathing in Albuteral.

The health insurers of course went along with this as it was one more thing they didn't have to pay for.

Anyhow, here's my opinion of what this country needs. We have to ask the French to dig out the guillotine they haven't used for decades, and borrow it from them.

[infidel dog]

1. Ah, our wonderful pharmaceutical fatcats. We must borrow that guillotine.

It could be put to constructive work in a hurry.

[Cyrano]

4. In truth, I really fear what would happen if they dug it out and loaned it to us.

Given the past eight years, a trip down this particular road would be ugly and endless.

The French Revolution almost immediately turned into a reign of terror and no sane person really wants to see that.

But most of us would like to see some semblance of justice visited upon the criminals who stole, raped, and destroyed the reputation, decency, and economy of our country. And we really need to start at the top.

[infidel dog]

43. My goodness! I wasn't speaking literally about guillotines! St. Thomas Paine forbid!

I wouldn't approve of executing even the vilest criminals of the Rethuglican party in Jacobin fashion, although I certainly wouldn't shed any tears over the bastards. I'll admit, I wouldn't mind seeing Jabba Slimebaugh tossed bound and gagged into a pen full of famished swine, however.
But only at my worst moments.

[damntexdem]

8. But what is the carbon footprint of using the guillotine?

We need an environmental impact assessment before using it.

[Bake]

37. Gravity powered ... probably not much environmental impact.

Except for the blood, of course. But no fossil fuels!!

Bake

[sharp_stick]

2. Do you have any links

that show big pharma pulling the product for this reason?

[Cyrano]

9. No, I don't have one fucking, stinking goddamn link of any kind

However, I would beg you not to use up too much brain power trying to figure out this particular pharma/insurance co. scam.

Damn, I'm sorry for answering you that harshly. To make it up to you, however, I have a bridge you may be interested in buying.

On a more serious note, do you really need a link to tell you the uncountable number of ways you've been screwed over the past eight years?

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sharp_stick]

32. Ahh thank you

deleted reply for the moment.

[Cyrano]

31. Hey, sharp_stick, sorry for the anger in my reply.

A friend of mine who uses an inhaler showed me a letter she received from her insurance company last November. I wish I'd saved it, but it did specify that as of January 1st they would stop using Albuteral,(they used a generic name for it), and would replace it with whatever it is they're using now.

The letter did state that the reason had something to do with polluting the atmosphere.

I wish I'd posted this back then and I wish I'd saved that letter so I could better reply.

The letter was from her medical insurance company, Humana, which is huge here in Florida. It's impossible to tell how much they are pocketing since they no longer have to pay for (generic) Albuteral prescriptions.

I guess that what too many people really don't realize is that the Bush Administration, and it's intentional lack of oversight of anything big business did, horribly screwed most Americans.

It's going to take Obama years to reverse just a portion of the damage that's been done to us all.

[jbfam4]

44. some info here

http://www.devicelink.com/pmpn/archive/05/05/023.html

www.fda.gov/cder/mdi/default.htm.

http://www.theangrypharmacist.com/archives/2007/02/albuterol_hfa_w.html

[Blue_Tires]

3. so what are we supposed to use, then?

[formercia]

6. Some patented propellant.

Big Pharma smiles.

[Cyrano]

11. As I mentioned in the OP, big pharma has put our a

non-ozone polluting inhaler that costs $30/month and there is no generic for it.

[hedgehog]

13. Does that inhaler actually have a propellant in it or is the medication

in a device that allows you to inhale a metered dose?

[Cyrano]

27. It has a propellant and it is a metered dose

However, it's about 1/3 smaller than the Albuteral dispenser. I really don't know if many people can make this thing last a month before they can get a refill.

I guess some philosopher on Big Pharma's payroll told them "less is more."

[hedgehog]

29. If it's a metered dose, then the canister should contain however

many doses it's labeled for. In fact, it probably has a few more just to ensure the last guaranteed dose is full strength. To coin a phrase, size doesn't matter.

[formercia]

5. I found out the hard way.

My co-pay for albuterol went from $10.US to $32.50 US last month.

Like the gram or so of Fluorocarbon propellant that I exhale every month is going to kill the planet.

This doesn't include the $14K in emergency room visits last Year.

[JJ]

7. "guillotine"

That word has been coming to my mind more and more frequently lately, and it appears I'm not the only one.

[Occam Bandage]

18. This is why mobs are a very bad thing.

They don't know very much, but they're happy to kill people for doing things they haven't actually done.

[hedgehog]

12. I don't think you can blame Big Pharma for this one. While their

pricing structure may be subject to criticism, I knew five or six years ago that this was on the way. The propellant that is in the inhalers is off the market. The propellant had to be very chemically stable so it wouldn't break down the medication and it had to be harmless to humans when inhaled. I can't remember the details, but it seems to me that it is a fluoride compound that doesn't interact with other chemicals in the atmosphere until it hits the ozone layer where the energy from UV rays allows it to combine with ozone.

This propellant was low cost because food manufacturers, paint manufacturers, cosmetics people etc all used it. My guess is that even if Pharma got a waiver to use the stuff, the cost of making it in small batches would make that a rather pointless exercise.

[Cyrano]

16. It's not a pointless exercise to people on fixed incomes

I live in Florida where there are probably more retired seniors, on fixed incomes, than anywhere else in the country.

And although $30/month may not sound like much to a lot of people, keep in mind that this is not the only prescription they have to pay for. Given today's economic disaster, people really are once again counting every penny.

[Occam Bandage]

21. Then you should probably start lobbying to allow CFCs again.

After all, they make all sorts of propellant-based products cheaper, and in this economy, people can't afford to pay more for their inhalers or their refrigerators. I mean, sure, we managed to end the threat to the Ozone layer by banning CFCs, but enviro-whackos are just going to destroy the economy if they keep it up.

[Xithras]

42. Down economies are always a challenge for environmentalists.

Just yesterday I was listening to a local talking head on the radio chatting about the unemployment rate in my area (now up to 16%). He's usually a tolerable moderate, but yesterday he started advocating for the ressurection of the CALIFORNIA LOGGING INDUSTRY as a way to create jobs. He then continued by listing off about a half-dozen situations where environmental laws have reduced or eliminated jobs in this state (mostly in manufacturing and resource extraction). His examples were ALL perfectly valid, but the thought of returning URANIUM MINING to the Sierra's was frightening.

The problem with down economies is that people get desperate as they drag on. Altruistic ideals like protecting the environment can be easily set aside by some when they're facing destitution and starvation.

It just means that some of us have to be willing to fight HARDER to hold the line, and it means we'll be facing off against people we'd normally be supporting. Whether you're talking about seniors with CFC propellants or unemployed workers looking at a pristine forest, the answer has to be firm and consistent, "I'm sorry, but we'll find other ways to help. Destroying the environment isn't an option."

[hedgehog]

28. What I meant by "pointless exercise" is that even if the EPA issued

a waiver to allow the use of the old propellant, the fact that so little would be needed would mean that manufacturing it would be expensive so that the cost of the generic inhalers would be as much or more as the new inhalers.

[Xithras]

41. Minor point, but the EPA couldn't have issued a "waiver".

The cutoff was specified by international treaty, specifically the Montreal Protocol, in 1994. If Obama were to order the EPA to issue a waiver today, he'd be violating international law.

[Occam Bandage]

14. The FDA banned it. It wasn't "big pharma"'s doing.

[NoPasaran]

15. What are facts compared to a good two minute hate? n/t

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

17. I like the confusion between greenhouse emissions and ozone depletion.

As if conspiracy theories weren't enough, Limbaugh style scientific illiteracy was required.

[XemaSab]

24. That is exactly the point I was going to make

They're two totally different things.

Cows have NOTHING to do with ozone depletion.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

25. Maybe ashmatic cows with really big hairdos.

:shrug:

[Cyrano]

22. George Bush's FDA was owned by Big Pharma and who knows how many others.

For eight long, miserable years, big pharma, banks, Wall Street, and every other powerful entity you can name has gotten their way due to lack of oversight and their K Street lobbyists.

What we're really talking about here is how large American corporations did whatever they wanted to do because they owned and paid for the government we had in power.

[Occam Bandage]

23. Ironically, CFCs were banned because of liberal environmentalists.

Sometimes, good policies can have unforeseen effects.

[Xithras]

40. The order was issued in 1994 n/t

[uppityperson]

30. Thank you and all who answered with facts vs emotions.

There are other products, though I have heard they may not work as well. I have seen some that have a spritzer type thing (similar to what happened to hair spray and other aerosol things) and have seen one that doesn't noticeably make a big cloud of medicine. The people I have talked with are ambivalent so far.

My doc and pharmacist advised me last yr to stock up on inhalers, getting the 1/month my insurance would pay for.

NOT a big pharm issue but FDA. I would like to see this rule overturned for inhalers though.

[hedgehog]

33. As long as we're exchanging anecdotes, memebers of my family and

myself were very happy to turn in our albuterol for Advair. We find it more effective with fewer side effects. But that's just us. It might be different for other people.

[uppityperson]

36. Advair, that is what it is called.

Advair is a steroid and bronchodilator, where albuterol was just bronchodilator. I wonder if having them together, rather than having to do the types separately are better.

[Xithras]

39. Yes, and even the FDA had no choice.

The Montreal Protocol, an international treaty signed by the U.S. in 1994, required a phaseout of ALL ozone depleting CFC's. They were eliminated from refrigerators, manufacturing, and the millions of other things they were used for. Pharma was granted a one-time 15 year exemption to find something better to use, and that exemption has run out (and nothing better was found).

The United States was obligated by international law to block manufacturers from using these propellants as of January 1.

If you want to blame pharma for something, ask this: Why, with 15 years of lead time and countless billions in profits, couldn't they find something better before the clock ran out?

[Dappleganger]

19. The new version is not as effective

as the with with cfc's. We are a family of asthmatics and unfortunately have to resort to using a nebulizers more often as a result of this.

[Silent3]

20. Cow farts vs. ozone?

Cow farts, and more specifically the methane they contain, are contributors to global warming. Methane is a much more powerful warming agent than carbon dioxide, and the total methane contribution from cattle definitely is an environmental concern.

This has nothing to do with the ozone layer, however. Two different issues. At a guess I'd say you're probably correct that the total effect of medicinal inhalers, emissions from which have got to be very tiny compared to ozone-depleting culprits like CFC-laden spray cans, refrigerators, and air conditioners, is likely a specious concern. I just wanted to clarify which environmental risks are being compared.

[Cyrano]

26. Thanks for the info, Silent3. I really didn't know that.

[tabatha]

34. I don't think it is the amount of CFCs.

I think it is a lack of production (caused by concern for the ozone layer).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorofluorocarbon#Chloro_fluoro_carbon_compounds_.28CFC.2C_HCFC.29

[Earth Bound Misfit]

35. Let's put a plug in all cows butts and DEMAND Albuterol be put back on the market!

Better still, if "Big Pharma" can develop a "cattle fart filter" they can use the profits to subsidize the costlier inhalers. THEY'LL MAKE A KILLING!!!

[petronius]

38. Albuterol is the medication, which is still available - it's the propellant that changed

My albuterol inhalers still contain the same number of doses, for the same price. The only difference I'm noting is that the new propellant tastes a bit funny...

[Cyrano]

45. I guess it's a state by state thing. It's not available in Florida.