Not sure wher to post this, however I am concerned about a very good freind of mine who has joined

[CraftyGal]

Scientology. She is young and dealing with a number of issues including a horrendous sexual assault from when she went home during the holidays in December. There is a family cycle of depression.

She was recently put on Prozac and Celexa to deal to help her deal with all the depression. She is also in recovery from alcoholism as well.

Any suggestions?

CraftyGal

[Autumn Colors]

1. This is a good reference site

This site fights the Scientologists and you can find a lot of good advice and info on here. (And by "fight" .... I mean helping family and friends extract their loved ones from Scientology's grip.)

http://www.clambake.org/

[TornadoTN]

2. Also: WhyWeProtest.net is a good source for information

It's run by the Anonymous group that is protesting Scientology and trying to bring their practices to the light. It looks like the site is down right now (server hiccup I believe) but if you go into the forums and post this, there will be a ton of people willing to help out and get you and your friend good, solid information.

I'm not affiliated with them, but I've been following it and I have to say, their manner is a little off-putting, but they are sharp and know how to get shit done. I'll look around and see if can find a contact for you in the mean time.

[qb]

3. I suggest you do all you can to get her away from Scientology.

I have no personal experience with the group, but I read a former member's memoir years ago. They manipulate members into donating their life savings and harass the hell out of anyone who tries to leave the group. See if you can find a mental health hotline to call for advice.

[CraftyGal]

4. Here is a copy of the IM that I had on Facebook with her.

The only thing that has been changed on this IM is the names of the people to hide their identities.

CraftyGal

Friend
hey 2:07pm

CraftyGal
hey
2:07pm

Friend edited Religious Views in her profile.

Friend
how are you

CraftyGal
I am in pain today. Wrenched my back lastnight.

Friend
that is not kool i hope you get better

CraftyGal
so do I

Friend
so what is new

CraftyGal
not much, may go and lay down. I didn't sleep well lastnight.

Friend
me neather

CraftyGal
How come?

Friend
i found something out about farmistuical drugs and i did not take me meds last night

CraftyGal
not good to not take them.

Friend
i now

2:17pm Friend is a scientologist and loves it and hse has her head out of her ass yaa i can see the light.

CraftyGal
interesting choice, is that why you are not on your meds?

Friend
yep

CraftyGal
I am really concerned about this...

Friend
why

CraftyGal
Scientology is well known for being against anything to do with psychiatric community. Can we get together tomorrow to about it? I want to make sure that you make an informed choice.

Friend
what time do you want together

CraftyGal
it would probably be lat afternoon as I have some commitments earlier in the day. TrogL would like to join us if that is okay.
Have you spoken with "your sponsor" about this decision?

Friend
nope not yet and she will be mad but it is my decision and my mum is letting me make my chocie about it

CraftyGal
Why would she be mad about it?

Friend
it really is my chocie and my life and i am doing jsut fine and i have not had any bad thoughts and i am working my program again and i am feeling much better thank you

CraftyGal
please don't be offended, i am just concerned just like I would be with any other person.

Friend
i know but i am liking my decsion and i am happy with it

CraftyGal
okay, however will you keep an open mind about? Please....

Friend
i guess so

CraftyGal
still want to meet?

Friend
let me think about it i guess so

CraftyGal
Let me know a good time for you...

Friend
i will have to check with my calender and i will call you

CraftyGal
great!

[bkkyosemite]

5. They use steps of indoctrination to complete brainwashing. They prey on the vunerable. Do everything

in your power to get her the needed information asap. The longer she is affliated the worse it gets for her to see the forest for the trees. Also the meds have serious side effects so you may be dealing with two issues here. One trying to steal her mind (sc) and the other affecting it. Best wishes for your concern and efforts for your friend. You are a good friend.

[CraftyGal]

6. I am working on it.

TrogL is getting the links together, however she is offended that I would say anything.

CraftyGal

[bkkyosemite]

9. My best to you and I edited my post further for you. They want her to remain secretive

about her problems and needing help. They will convince her that they are the help and no one else needs to know.

[FloridaJudy]

7. Someone who's depressed

Needs Scientology like a diabetic needs Christian Science.

Encourage her to find another spiritual path.

[originalpckelly]

8. Oh damn, CraftyGal.

:cry:

This is why we need to stop Scientology NOW! Those people will definitely get her off the meds she probably very desperately needs to be on to deal with her issues.

How into it is she? Clambake is a good site, someone else linked to it.

[CraftyGal]

10. I am not sure, however

I do know that she has gone off her meds before with dire consequences.

[originalpckelly]

12. I wish you the best of luck, check out Clambake.

They're a good site for this.

[bkkyosemite]

13. Can't cold turkey on those types of meds.

[bkkyosemite]

11. Also the meds if not the right dosage could affect her mentally. Doc needs to check to make sure she

is not having adverse side effects to her meds. Sometimes there are adjustments that need to be made to these types of meds because of reactions.

[SoCalDem]

14. Make sure her family knows, before the Scientology folks latch onto her money

A lot of cults don't want anything to do with a person who has no funds to contribute..

[CraftyGal]

15. From the IM that I had with her, it sounds as if mom is supporting her.

She doesn't have alot of money at the moment. However, having said that if she Victim's Assistant Money (not sure if the States has this or not) that could be a different story.

CraftGal

[rcrush]

16. ..waits for someone to come defend scientology likes its another 'religion'

I've actually seen people stick up for the space alien religion.

[Hollow Shells]

17. I have seen people stick up for Christianity. Which group has tortured more people?

[rcrush]

18. I wouldnt defend either

But in the short time scientology has been around they've tortured their fair share of people. Give them 2000 years and they could get a respectable record going.

[Hollow Shells]

19. In 2000 years, Scientology could be the major religion in the U.S.

Coin operated auditing machines in everyones home.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

44. You're asking the wrong question.

The question relevant at present is "is getting involved with this group likely to help or harm someone suffering from depression?", not "how many people has this group tortured?"

The answer to that question is far more clearly "it's likely to do harm" for Scientology than it is for most branches of Christianity.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

20. First, if she has good prescription drug insurance...

First, if she has good prescription drug insurance get Lexapro.

Prozac is generic now and thus cheap but is a very harsh and primitive drug. High side-effect profile.

Some shrinks prefer to dispense Prozac because it's the first SSRI and thus the best tested, but it really messes people up.

I don't know why someone would be given prozac and celexa... they're both SSRIs. (???)

Secondly, pray her scientology thing is a phase because they are very, very bad. (And will keep her away from head doctors that could save her life.)

She needs company (whether she thinks so or not), to get out and and minimal stress. (The three are not always compatible, of course.)

A sexual assault support group might not hurt, but that's very much her call.

[CraftyGal]

21. Thank you for the information...

on the meds. I am worried about her because TrogL and I have had to take her into the emergency due to a suicide attempt. I am very worried about her and when I saw her on Wednesday she looked fantastic! She was doing much better since she got back from New York.

I am wondering if this has something to do with her sexual assault, as the trial is at the end of February. She also found out that her attacker, (step-brother), has been charged with 4 other attacks. The police found out after 4 other came forward. after her mother did a write up in the paper, giving her attackers name, and other information. She had appeared to be handling things, then she dropped this in my lap this afternoon.

CraftyGal

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

22. My Suggestion? Support Her As A Friend And Allow Her To Make Her Own Decisions.

If she likes scientology than more power to her. It helps a lot of people.

If it gets to a point where she's sucked in to an obviously unhealthy degree, then you could always step in and offer advice/concern etc. But there's no reason to be concerned now whatsoever, and all you really need to do is be a non-judgmental friend who is their to offer support, comfort and a listening ear.

[CraftyGal]

23. I am trying to do that for her,

however, the concern is that she went off of her meds WITHOUT DOCTOR SUPERVISION OR PERMISSION.

That is the main reason for the concern.

Craftygal

[EvolveOrConvolve]

25. If she's gone off her meds

then she's sucked in to an unhealthy degree.

I couldn't disagree more with your post, OMC; religions like Scientology are like crack cocaine or heroin. They feel good to the user but are incredibly destructive in the long run.

"...there's no reason to be concerned now whatsoever..."

I suggest VEHEMENTLY that you are full of shit - this woman has been sexually assaulted, attempted suicide, and has stopped taking her meds. What the FUCK should it take for her friend to become concerned? Jesus H. Christ I'm glad that you're not a friend of mine IRL.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

28. Wrong.

Scientology can be beneficial for tons of people and has been. Not everybody turns into some huge scientology nut; and in fact the majority don't.

As far as stopping the meds, oftentimes the meds don't do shit anyway and actually puts the person in a worse spot. Fact is, if she feels good about this new path and is abe to cope without the meds, then more power to her. Simple truth is that most here are simply bigoted against scientology and knee jerk react simply to the fact that she's joining it. For someone like her, scientology might actually be a great thing. As a friend, the OP should simply support her and be there for her, and only step in if her friend's behavior really changes and sinks into a deeper depression, and it becomes apparent that returning to the meds are a necessity. Absent of that, to each their own and the friend deserves the OP's full support for her decisions without having to be judged as if she's making some horrible decision.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

29. Nope, YOU'RE wrong

Quitting these types of med cold-turkey is NEVER recommended, and a group that is encouraging her to do so is dangerous because they don't have her best interests at heart.

Would you support a good friend in their heroin habit because if made them feel good?

[CraftyGal]

30. Er did you even read my post in number 21?

She was looking good and was fine with being on the medication. Then she talks to these guys and she goes off without doctor supervision?

I am spiritual and I say anything goes, however I have a concern with a so called religion that states you can only get enlightment if you are not on these medications. I am concerned because she had tried to commit suicide in December. She slit her wrist for f##ks sakes! We were at the emergency with her for 2 hours, she walked out after the er dr said that she needed to talk to her doctor. Her doc was on vaction, so I took her to the U of A out patient psych walkin clinic. So she has been on these meds for a while.

I am afraid the next time she will succeed. How much plainer do I need to get? So I came here to get soem help and information so that she can make an informed choice.

CraftyGal

[tkmorris]

31. It's a cult. A dangerous and manipulative one at that

[bkkyosemite]

33. You're wrong about Scientology!

[uppityperson]

37. On the other hand, stopping her meds suddenly can be life threatening.

Often times the meds do a whole lot of good and suddenly stopping them can be dangerous. Unless you know what meds she is on, what you write is too simplistic feel-good and could be dangerous.

Unless you are her health care provider and know that it is safe to go cold turkey that is a really poor thing to say.

[crimsonblue]

27. are you crazy?

Scientology is not a religion, it is a dangerous cult.

[uppityperson]

39. Stopping her meds cold turkey could be dangerous.

Suddenly stopping taking he meds that she was doing well on to turn to a religion sounds like a thing to be concerned about.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

43. Friends don't support friends when the join cults

Friends help friends get out of cults.

[CraftyGal]

24. I am kicking this...nt

[crimsonblue]

26. Get her the FUCK AWAY from Scientology

it is nothing more than a dangerous, horrible cult. Get her out, get her out, get her out.

[Starry Messenger]

32. I have a close relative involved in an EST offshoot.

Here is a link that I found useful--

http://www.rickross.com/coping.html

These groups are scary and divisive. They work quickly to destroy trust in the victim for their loved ones. They isolate. It is important to not put the person on the defensive. Even if you have a mound of evidence to show how coercive Scientology is, this person will probably react negatively. Scientology has a lot of pre-emptive talking points to deal in advance with the most obvious criticisms from outsiders.

Also some good videos by Tory Christman, a 30 year Scientologist who got out:

http://www.youtube.com/user/ToryMagoo44

She has a lot of good tips on how to talk to someone who is "in". I hope this helps.

[tkmorris]

34. Something you ought to know about Scientology

One of the very FIRST things they will do is encourage, no let me rephrase, browbeat her into severing ties with her past. Meaning family... and you. They don't want anyone presenting a different point of view to her than the one they offer. If they really get their hooks into her, she's gone. You'll not see her anymore. You need to act fast, and act first.

Remember, Scientology is in it for themselves. Your friend matters to them only insofar as she has something to offer them. Oh they'll recruit her for sheer numbers sake, but if she has money, or access to it, they will focus a LOT harder on keeping her. Try to convince her to at least shield her assets from them, if they find out she has any they will stalk her until they get them.

Good luck CG. Please keep us updated on events.

[Digit]

35. Yep, I was entangled with them when I lived in CA

I continued when I moved back to the East Coast, but I finally got out.

They did indeed try to break up my marriage because my husband was not a believer....I cannot recall the term they had for those who did not support us in our beliefs.

Hopefully, she will see the light before she gets too deeply involved.

[CraftyGal]

36. Thanks....

hoping to get information soon that will help me with talking with her.

CraftyGal

[sohndrsmith]

38. First question needs to be: is she a minor? n/t

[uppityperson]

40. That is a really good question and one I was wondering. Is she a minor?

[sohndrsmith]

41. Well I don't know if it's a good question but it's essential... n/t

[CraftyGal]

42. She is 19 or 20 yrs old.

She is of age here in Canada.

Craftygal

[Canuckistanian]

45. Tell her to run, not walk away from those charlatans

Especially for someone who's already got a shitload of troubles.

The "Church" of Scientology has screwed up thousands of perfectly normal people, filling their heads with pseudo-scientific bullshit and false promises of spiritual fulfilment.

Also, if she falls under their spell, she'll be handing money over to them hand over fist for "courses", "tests" and "treatments", not to mention demanding more and more of her time.

If she needs help, get her to go to counselling by a reputable therapist.

If this happened to a friend of mine, I'd start a direct intervention.