Some thoughts about where we shop.

[kiva]

The Walmart wars here were good in that they made some of us consider how and where we spend our money, and was a good reminder that DU members are truly a diverse group--politically, urban/smaller towns/rural, economically, and regarding family structure. I thought about it and realized I probably spend 99% of my "purchasing power" in chain stores, and suspects that's true for most Americans.

What are the alternatives? Well, several people suggested shopping at other big box stores like Target or K Mart, but what exactly does that do? I've never heard that either is discernibly different in how they treat their employees in terms of pay or benefits; they all have pretty much the same stuff, and treat their customers in the same (usually discourteous) fashion. So if we all go to Target to shop, in a couple of years it will be the behemoth and we'll all be saying that we should boycott the evil Target.

Others eschewed chains and urged DUers to patronize only local businesses. I live in a city, and within a five mile radius there are two Super Walmarts, ten or twelve other chain markets, a couple of dozen chain convenience stores; most locally owned shops are service stores (alterations, restaurants, specialty stores) that don't sell food or other day to day necessities. The locally owned food markets are specifically ethnic--Asian, Hispanic, Eastern and Southern European--and carry few 'American' foods.

Thrift stores are great, but rely on the fact that someone purchased these items new, probably from one of those chain stores. Shop online? How exactly does that benefit your own community, a point made by many who were critical of chains? Farmers markets are also great, but not a reality in many parts of the country.

I guess my point is that there is no one "best way" to shop, it's really based on individual needs and situations.

[valerief]

1. It'll be a moot point for all of us pretty soon. We'll all be out of work and

will have no money to shop anyway. That'll be the end of Wal-Mart (well, in the U.S.; it'll boom in China).

[rurallib]

3. Sadly, Wally world will be the only one standing

ergo that will be where we MUST shop.

[valerief]

4. No, Idiocracy tells us it'll be Costco. nt

[ColbertWatcher]

12. How much do you want to bet they were originally going to use Wal-Mart, but ...

... Wal-Mart paid to get out of it.

I'm thinking that's what happened with the "Target" SNL skit too.

[valerief]

15. Well, I don't do SNL because it traditionally favors rethuglicans,

but I don't know about Idiocracy and Wal-Mart. In my pretend world, I like to imagine that Idiocracy creators chose CostCo, because it *wasn't* Wal-Mart, that Wal-Mart would ultimately fail and CostCo would remain standing.

CostCo would win. Wal-Mart would lose.

Of course, the world would be full of morons, which means, I guess, Wyoming and Oklahoma would win, too. Ugh!

[ColbertWatcher]

20. I was thinking that too.

But, at the rate Wal-Mart is growing and swallowing other businesses, it may come down to a battle royale between the forces of CostCo and the Army of Wal-Martians.

And you know those Wal-Martians are crazy fuckers.

[Texasgal]

2. "it's really based on individual needs and situations."

EXACTLY! These holier than thou types neeed to get off their high horse!

[kiva]

8. Yep, it makes me crazy when posters here assume that

everyone lives exactly the way they do--need vegetables? Grow a garden. Live in an apartment or non-agriculturally friendly area? Go to a farmer's market. No farmers' markets--then move, dammit, what are you doing living in such a place?

[TomInTib]

5. I stay away from Department stores, which is easy in my Town.

Here in Tiburon, every business (except banks) is independently owned. No Starbucks, no fast food, no gas stations. There is not a single WalMart in Marin County.

What I cannot find here (shoes, jeans, etc.) I can get at Nordstrom, just a few miles away in Corte Madera.

[valerief]

6. That's works for people with bucks. Most of us are poor. nt

[TomInTib]

9. Hey, I'm poor, too.

I have cut way back.

And I forgot to mention that, for the past six months, I have taken to shopping at the Town School Store in San Francisco. Every eight weeks, they have a half-price sale. The store is a thrift shop, and I have found some unbelievable deals there. Really fine stuff, too.

I recently purchased the first dress shoes I have ever owned. Three-lace Ferragamos, 10 1/2B (just perfect), never worn. $50 for a pair of $500 shoes. I feel like Condoleeza.

[valerief]

10. Poor people spend $20 on shoes and can't afford Marin County.

But enjoy your shoes anyway!
:hi:

[Fireweed247]

22. $20!

I'm looking for $3.50 at the thrift shop!

It is funny how these things are all relative...one man's bargain is a fortune for someone else.

[SoCalDem]

32. Ha..you reminded me of something.. I once paid $45 for a pair of shoes..in 1967..

They were made in Spain.. I still have them:)..3 kids & 41 years have made them too small, but I can;t bring myself to throw them away :rofl:

I made 75 cents an hour back then :)

[Texasgal]

13. Nordstrom?

wow... must be nice.

[TomInTib]

14. That's about it, Texasgal.

There aren't really any other Department stores within a reasonable drive. And the displays (or lack of) in places such as Ross make me very uncomfortable.

[Texasgal]

16. If Nordstroms was the only place I could shop

I guess I'd go pantless.

:shrug:

[PeaceNikki]

18. No shit! I had a $100 gift card from there

and there are not any in my area. I was visiting Seattle and walked into the place and quickly realized I'd be lucky to find socks that I could buy with it! :o

[SoCalDem]

34. My aunt took me to Neiman-Marcus in Miami Beach

and since we could not afford to buy much there, we went to the candy counter and each bought a piece of candy..& asked for a BAG :rofl:

[SoCalDem]

33. Ross makes me CRAZY!! plus, whenever I go, it seems to be "screaming baby day"..

The place always reminds me of a flea market..only not as well "tended":)

[TomInTib]

36. Thanks

I am really into visual merchandising (have you seen our Galleries website?) and my GF is into good deals.

She is constantly dragging me into the Ross store in Corte Madera (as if I would wear ANYTHING one of those stores carry) and I last a couple of minutes. All of those sternum-high circular racks and jumbled bins and classless peo;e are just too mind-numbing for me.

She thinks I am being a snob, but those stores make me very uncomfortable.

[BlooInBloo]

7. I certainly don't have time to do hella research on every store that I consider going to....

Unless they're waving a confederate flag or something obvious, I'll buy from them, if they have what I want at a price I'm willing to pay.

To hell with the leftier-than-thous.

[Quantess]

11. Yes, I know all my second hand clothes were made by brown little overworked hands.

It's a real stretch to say that my second hand clothing purchases are part of the problem, though.

[kiva]

17. I'm not saying that they are part of the problem--I love thrift stores.

Just making the point that someone has to buy the stuff new or it wouldn't be in a thrift store. So maybe we shouldn't be so critical about the person that bought the stuff in the first place.

[Quantess]

21. Not necessarily.

Here in Oregon and Washington, at least, major retailers donate their unsold merchandise to charity thrift stores such as Goodwill. There is always tons of "new" crap that nobody bought.

[kiva]

27. There is that, I'd forgotten.

You didn't say it, but I just flinch a bit when people complain about the people who buy unnecessary stuff--after all, if they didn't, many thrift stores would be emptier. I've never bought a new car, but am grateful to those who do so that I eventually get it. :hi:

[Fireweed247]

19. Support DUers on Ebay!

Let's support each other!

Add your shop...
Want to help other Americans this Xmas- Shop Ebay
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4557260

[roody]

23. How much of what we are buying do we really need?

[Texasgal]

24. who's business is it what I buy?

[Midlodemocrat]

25. Or where I buy it?

[Texasgal]

26. Or why I buy it!

:P

[uppityperson]

28. Target treats their employees better. Costco treats theirs WAY better.

Of course though, at Costco you get bulk food and drinks, though they have most everything else there also, but with fewer overall choices.

[kiva]

29. That's interesting, I was wondering about that.

Some years ago I had friends that worked at a variety of stores, and at the time there didn't seem to be much difference between corporate policies, just the way in which different managers applied the policies. I know that Costco is given much higher marks, but the whole bulk purchase idea doesn't work for everyone.

Is Target better in terms of pay/benefits, or just general attitude toward employees?

[superduperfarleft]

35. Target, in my experience, does not treat their employees any better.

And Costco has membership fees, which don't help those people who are struggling, those people whom Wal-Mart is an attractive place to shop.

So many of the "acceptable" and "liberal" places to shop are not much better, but just show a strong prejudice of "liberals" against the poor.

And anyway, since when did "activism" consist of shopping at one bloated corporation that makes cheap, sweatshop-produced crap place over another bloated corporation that makes cheap, sweatshop-produced crap? That seems like the problem right there.

edit: http://www.coopamerica.org/programs/responsibleshopper/company.cfm?id=295

[SoCalDem]

30. The problem is not so much WHERE we shop, as it is WHY we "shop"..

I think people are uneasy with themselves and their families.. and shopping, as a "hobby", fills time..

When was the last time you, as a family, worked a puzzle, played Monopoly, played cards, did household chores, etc.. together?


"Shopping", appears to be a "joint activity"..a reason to hang out..a way to get sullen teens to participate..

An overburdened Mom may shop to "woo" her children..

A distant Dad may shop to get gadgets for "home" products..for tasks he may have little or no time to complete..

Bored teens may shop because it's better than sitting around an empty house waiting for "people" to show up.

Families may shop, because if they all pile into the same car to get to the mall, they can consider it a family-outing..even if they all split up once there..

Lonely, older people may shop for exercise, and to buy things for grandkids they may not see often..

[kiva]

31. I agree that for some people shopping is a social or family event,

which could be replaced by other activities. What I really wonder about are the solitary shoppers who use QVC or another shopping channel, or shop online extensively. I've seen and read stories about these compulsive shoppers who have boxes and boxes of stuff they've ordered and never opened, much less used.