Heard On Tom Hartman's Show - Galveston Is A No-Fly Zone Because Bodies Are Floating At Sea.....

[global1]

and this administration doesn't want us to know how bad it really is down there. Is there any truth to this story? Are there any links to verify this?

[Ian David]

1. Someone on DU posted it as a "friend-of-a-friend" story but nobody has verified.

Report from an friend in Galveston (insurance adjuster)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4006778

[Barack_America]

2. Kind of hard to verify or disprove when the media is shut out.

I'd just like to know what happened. I'm actually praying that everyone made it out.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

38. Except that they're not shut out.

Chron.com and the local TV stations have plenty of reports from people on the ground in Galveston. Shit, people were allowed back in for a look at their houses yesterday. More bullshit from the rumor mill.

[Barack_America]

45. Reporters have free access to the Bolivar Peninsula?

That's news to me, but great to hear.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

62. Yup.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6008237.html

There is no media blackout.

[sop]

60. You might want to look at this link

http://blessingsblessings.newsvine.com/_news/2008/09/17/1875291-galveston-coverup-you-decide

[Ian David]

66. There's some scary shit there, but that site does not provide documentation of some key claims.

I'm inclined to believe it, but so far it's still just "rumors on the internets."

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

3. I heard it was because of heavy chemtrail activity.

At least that's what Jim Morrison told me.

[Dr. Strange]

44. My astrologer told me it had to do with Virgo's subconjugation with Halley's Comet.

And I think my astrologer is a far more legitimate source than some loud rock-n-roller.

[napi21]

4. I heard the same thing on KPOJ news earlier today. I found this story

through a google search, but I don't know anything about the site or it's reliability.

GALVESTON, TX - President Bush "toured" the Galveston beach front earlier today, although all media outlets I checked did NOT show anything from the Bolivar peninsula down to Crystal Beach, and on towards the West End. And no mention was made in any report of the "no fly" order given by this same President, an order that has effectively rendered a media blackout after a major hurricane for the first time in American history. That's another in a long string of "first's" for President Bush, starting with the December, 2007 suspension of Habeus Corpus (the very foundation of civilized law for the last 800 years) through the most Executive Orders of any sitting President (more actually, than were signed from ALL of the previous U.S. Presidents COMBINED.....) that all but whittled away what was left of the Constitution as envisioned by the American Founding Fathers.

http://blessingsblessings.newsvine.com/_news/2008/09/17/1875291-galveston-coverup-you-decide

[ananda]

5. Yes, it was posted here by an eye witness a few days ago

He said FEMA and Homeland Security weren't
allowing news organizations or reporters
to come into that area.

He said they saw 900 bodies floating off
Bolivar and that the morgues were overflowing.

I believe it because that area was completely
wiped out and thousands refused to evacuate.

[bsdetector]

18. That was not from an eyewitness, it was by someone who heard it from a friend of a friend.

In other words, it was a THIRD hand rumor.

[malaise]

65. Do I believe you or Jeff Masters?

According to media reports, about 34 survivors from Gilchrist and the neighboring communities of Crystal Beach and Port Bolivar have been fished out of Galveston Bay in the past few days. Rescuers who have reached Gilchrist have not been able to find any victims in the debris because there is no debris. Ike's storm surge knocked 99.5% of the 1,000 buildings in Gilchrist off their foundations and either demolished them or washed them miles inland into the swamplands behind Gilchrist. Until search teams can locate the debris of what was once was Gilchrist, we will not know the fate of those who may have stayed behind to ride out the storm.

It's rare to see a town so completely destroyed by a hurricane, to the point where you can't even see the wreckage. The neighboring towns of Crystal Beach, to the south, and High Island, to the north, were also mostly destroyed, but weren't swept clean of nearly all structures and wreckage. This is because Gilchrist was built in an unusually vulnerable place. It's bad enough to situate your town on a low-lying peninsula, as was the case for Crystal Beach. But in Gilchrist's case, the town was located at the narrowest point of the Bolivar Peninsula, at a point where it was only a few hundred meters wide (Figure 2). Not only did Gilchrist suffer a head-on assault by Ike's direct storm surge of 14+ feet, topped by 20' high battering waves, the town also suffered a reverse surge once the hurricane had passed. As Ike moved to the north, the counter-clockwise flow of wind around the storm pushed Galveston Bay's waters back across the town of Gilchrist from northwest to southeast. This second surge of water likely finished off anything the main storm surge had left.

http://www.wunderground.com/blog/JeffMasters/comment.html?entrynum=1088&tstamp=200809

There is nothing there. Anyone who was there and was not rescued can be presumed dead. What about that is so hard to understand?

[maddezmom]

6. I thought KTRK had a chopper in the air yesterday

I was in Austin at the time so I could only get the news on the radio. Maybe they were only showing the devestation over land, but they were in the air.

[EFerrari]

7. Who said that? Was it a guest or a caller? Thom? n/t

[100AcreWood]

8. bet it's a "long time listener, first time caller" ...

... puhleeze. Bodies floating at sea? No Fly Zone. Yup. It's alien abduction, alright!

[EFerrari]

12. The problem is, the FEDs did close down the air space on Sat morning.

They're trying to control the images, the message. But, they're just breeding rumors like the true idiots they are. And I say that without commenting on the number of casualties because I have no reliable way of knowing.

[bsdetector]

21. You can see the exact TFR details here

http://www.runwayfinder.com/

this information is available to anyone, even non-pilots. Click the orange-around-white icon down on the gulf coast, you can see the information and zoom in to observe it's only a few miles wide...just enough to keep curiosity-seeking morons out of rescue effort's way.
(The thing is, that would not even be a problem without the TFR...)

Hundreds of flights have taken place just outside this restricted area but are plenty close enough to get pictures of the destruction.
Floating bodies would have been noticed.

[onenote]

24. no fly limited to 2000 feet or lower

I assume you can take a helicopter up to 2500 feet, fly over with a big ol' zoom lens and get whatever pictures you want.

[EFerrari]

28. Do you know when that went into effect? n/t

[onenote]

31. here is the link

http://tfr.faa.gov/save_pages/detail_8_8191.html

On its face, it says it was issued Sept 15, effective immediately until further notice.

If you scroll down to the affected areas section, the last line gives the altitude restriction.

[EFerrari]

35. Thanks. n/t

[Usrename]

52. Ten miles wide and fifty miles long.

It's a good stretch of real estate.

[100AcreWood]

23. lots of reasons why ...

Curiosity seekers

Amature photographers looking to sell footage to the networks

Insurance adjusters looking for a first peek

AND ... they've got drones, those Predator things, operating in the area.

...you know, when there's been a bad accident, they close down the road for a time.

Still, none dare call it conspiracy.

[EFerrari]

26. It's not a conspiracy if it's publicly acknowledged.

And, have our air traffic control facilities been washed away, too?

It's one thing to be safe. It's another to tell the press what they can cover and to restrict their access for days using safety as an excuse. Sort of like "national security".

[tammywammy]

30. Also, those other helicopters would interfer with rescue operations

And stuff being flown in by the Red Cross, National Guard, Coast Guard etc.

I believe I read that there were a few close encounters after Katrina, news helicopters filming people on their roof while the Coast Guard was trying to get in there and rescue them.

[TheWatcher]

47. Pssst. The No Fly Zone was real.

Keep sleeping though.

[TexasObserver]

57. You don't want to wake up Little Snoozy.

She's sleeping thru this bad old manipulation of media by the Bush administration.

Golly, Gee, they'd never do anything like try to shape the news by keeping bodies out of it. That's almost as silly as saying they won't allow any photos or images of dead US soldiers in or from Iraq.

If you don't believe the government, you're just not rational.

Right?

[Psyop Samurai]

58. "Little Snoozy"...

:rofl:

[TexasObserver]

63. I have to give props to Jim Carrey, who originated the line.

[TexasObserver]

64. dupe

[stranger81]

11. It was Thom who said it, not a caller. [eom]

[EFerrari]

13. Thank you. I'm streaming something else and can't listen. n/t

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

9. That's a lie.

The airspace is closed because the gubmit was testing its new HAARP weapon on Galveston!!!!111!1

[jobycom]

25. One eyewitness on Galveston Island had a different explanation

He claimed they had discovered Lafitte's treasure and were trying to figure out how to launder it through South America. :)

[jobycom]

10. Same story starts after every hurricane. There's a ton of footage of the area

and a lot of interviews with people on Galveston, Crystal Beach, and the whole area. No one has said anything like that.

After Katrina, there were very convincing rumors that a thousand bodies were floating in the lake by Slidell, that a thousand bodies were hanging from trees in Bay St. Louis, that sonar had discovered a thousand bodies in the Mississippi Sound... After Rite there were rumors of a thousand bodies off Port Arthur....

Same old stuff.

Planes and copters have videotaped and shot every inch of the coastline, and boatloads of reporters have visited Galveston and the Bolivar Peninsula. I'm sure there are bodies under the debris here and there, but there have been no photos, videos, or eyewitness testimony of hundreds of bodies. It's just not true.

I did read an interview with a survivor from Crystal Beach today, who rode out the storm in the remains of his attack as the storm washed away the house beneath him. All that survived were the piers holding his house up, and the attack. He said he a couple of close friends that he was pretty sure were dead. After the storm he walked up and down the beach and roads looking for help and scavenging supplies. He didn't mention bodies anywhere, and given the rest of what he said, he would have.

Check out khou.com for actual coverage, mostly free from the rumors. They also have several blogs you can read to get a good idea of what people there are discussing. That's where stories of bodies would pop up.

[EFerrari]

14. The way BushCo is manipulating this coverage is just making things worse.

They're trying to control what we see and it's not working. People are just more worried in the absence of information.

It looks like they've loosened up their restrictions today but, the damage with respect to public trust has been done. Idiots.

[jobycom]

32. Yeah, they are screwing up by creating the impression of controlled coverage.

It isn't just BushCo. The local and state authorities are doing it, and even the media is covering it. I haven't seen any good discussions of possible fatalities or reports of fatalities or the lack of those reports yet. The local media will sometimes say something like "We don't know if there are bodies under the debris," but they won't really talk about what people are saying. Anyone in the area now will be able to sniff out bodies, and there's no discussion of that.

They are trying to sanitize what we here, and they are trying to control access for a lot of reasons, including safety and their own attempts to do recovery and rescue, but the overall impression is of a heavy-handed government trying to keep secrets from the people who are supposed to be their employers.

But there still aren't 900 bodies floating off Bolivar Peninsula, and there isn't much restriction on fly-overs, considering how much footage we've seen.

[EFerrari]

39. I don't know if you caught this but over the weekend, Skeletor

and Perry just about bound and gagged the Galveston mayor during their big press conference. She was asked outright by a reporter if she had any complaints. She paused and said, "I'm not in any position to have complaints, am I?"

I don't have an opinion about the numbers. The thuggery, though, has been out there and in our faces. They are trying to wipe this disaster clean of a human face. Not like Katrina where they looped interviews from individuals that we still remember -- like that agitated sweaty blond mom trying to holding her crying baby outside of the stadium who was losing it and begging for help and for people to get along. There is no face to this event and I think that's purposeful. :shrug:

[Mika]

49. Kinda like Green Zone reporting.

Same shit. Different location.

[MadrasT]

42. That's the crux of the problem right there:

They're trying to control what we see and it's not working. People are just more worried in the absence of information.

[tammywammy]

16. Thank you Jobycom for helping dispel this horrible rumor

This hurricane is bad enough without all this stupid crap adding to it.

[jobycom]

36. It took three days after Katrina for me to hear from my parents and siblings.

Even longer and some of my best friends. Until then, all I had to go on were rumors of thousands of bodies everywhere. I fell for some of the rumors at first, even, out of fear and horror at what was happening, and not happening. But I was skeptical mostly, and even so, I was scared to death, and my parents are ten miles inland.

People don't need to suffer through this crap, just because some geek thinks its cool to spread rumors, either for fun or to advance some political agenda. Sickens me.

[tammywammy]

40. Most of my family lost their homes due to flooding from Ike

I'm glad they aren't on DU to read this stuff.

[jobycom]

41. Deepest sympathies.

Mine were fine, just lost some shingles and had a mess to clean up. Two of friends lost childhood homes, but none lost everything.

[Usrename]

50. There WERE over a thousand bodies in Katrina.

It may have been a rumor, but it was also true.

"In Louisiana, the direct dead count now stands at 902, according to state epidemiologist Raoult C. Ratard. In Mississippi, the number is 223, according to Sam L. Howell, director of the Mississippi Crime Laboratory."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stacy-parker-aab/still-counting-katrinas-d_b_109056.html

[bsdetector]

15. The TFR (temporary flight restriction) was issued last Saturday

and covers Galveston island and most of the Bolivar peninsula. It's only a couple miles wide. It doesn't prevent people from flying over the gulf just offshore. Nobody with any credibility has reported floating bodies.

[EFerrari]

17. Who would they report it to? The media announced they would not cover

"certain things" on request from the Feds and they did that as matter of factly as taking out the trash last Saturday morning.

I don't believe anyone could cover up something of that magnitude. And, I wouldn't put it beyond BushCo to try, either. They're stupid as a soup can.

[bsdetector]

19. Well, I'm as cynical as the next person but I don't think any credible news media would pass up the

chance to report "hundreds of floating bodies"...no matter what the "feds" told them.

[EFerrari]

20. It's a toss up, as far as I can tell. Sadam did 9/11, right?

But, I'm pretty sure it would be too hard to keep a secret that big for very long.

It's no wonder people are anxious, though, because these mfers are control freaks. Mayors White and Thomas are looking like someone is twisting their arms. There will be stories coming out of this mess.

The really creepy part is that here we are, trying to figure out what is going on because we have no functioning independent media any more.

[onenote]

27. the TFR that was posted on DU is dated 9/15 - Monday

Is there a link to an earlier one?

[bsdetector]

33. Sorry I wasn't sure about it, they update it every day or 2. I can probably dig it out of DUATS

but not sure if it can be linked. I'll give it a shot.

[onenote]

34. so was there an earlier one? How did it differ from the one issued Monday?

[bsdetector]

37. Yes, one from 9/12. I took special notice of it because I was asked to f ly a charter to Mobile

on Sunday but they decided not to go at the last minute. I probably saved a copy of it on the computer at the airport but don't have it on this one, sorry.
oh I think I meant 9/13, that was Saturday? This last week has been crazy!

[EFerrari]

59. It started on Saturday. Friday night, no one would be flying anyway.

It was announced in the media Saturday morning.

[Ian David]

68. Temporary Flight Restricions: TFR.FAA.gov

Only ONE TFR is listed for Texas: http://tfr.faa.gov/tfr2/list.jsp

09/17/2008 8/8829 ZAB TX HAZARDS PINE SPRINGS, TX, Thursday, September 18, 2008 UTC New

Issue Date : September 17, 2008 at 2054 UTC
Location : PINE SPRINGS, Texas near SALT FLAT VORTAC (SFL)
Beginning Date and Time : September 18, 2008 at 1300 UTC
Ending Date and Time : September 18, 2008 at 1900 UTC
Reason for NOTAM : Temporary flight restrictions
Type : Hazards
Replaced NOTAM(s) : N/A
Pilots May Contact : ALBUQUERQUE (ZAB) Center, 505-856-4580
Jump To: Affected Areas
Operating Restrictions and Requirements
Other Information
Affected Area(s) Top
Airspace Definition:
Center: On the SALT FLAT VORTAC (SFL) 054 degree radial at 15.6 nautical miles. (Latitude: 31º51'17"N, Longitude: 104º48'26"W)
Radius: 2 nautical miles
Altitude: From the surface up to and including 3000 feet AGL
Effective Date(s):
From September 18, 2008 at 1300 UTC
To September 18, 2008 at 1900 UTC

Operating Restrictions and Requirements Top
No pilots may operate an aircraft in the areas covered by this NOTAM (except as described).


Other Information: Top
ARTCC: ZAB - Albuquerque Center
Point of Contact: .
Telephone [phone]
Authority: Title 14 CFR section 91.137(a)(1)



More:
http://tfr.faa.gov/save_pages/detail_8_8829.html

[elifino]

22. Use this link for local Live TV news Houston area

http://www.maroonspoon.com/wx/ike.html

Good coverage

[yardwork]

29. Certainly not at this point.

Even if there were bodies floating in the sea right after the hurricane, they're not there anymore.

[southernleftylady]

43. But all I kept hearing was Texas republicans can handle this... ugh nt

[MiniMe]

46. I believe that many were swept away, I doubt they are floating yet

And I don't want to be gruesome. But there are a lot of sharks in the gulf. So I imagine some were lost to that, and sometimes it takes a few days for a drowned body to float to the top. At least they are finally admitting that the numbers don't add up, they just don't know what happened to them.

[bdamomma]

48. someone mentioned who is a resident in the affected

area, that if it was a Democratic Governor of Texas they (the repigs) would be all over them for their negligence and total incompetence.

[Richardo]

51. ...then Thom Hartmann is an ignorant slut...

That is so much horseshit. There have been thousands of feet of film shot over Galveston and Boliver in the last 72 hours and we haven't seen one floating body.

People should either STFU and help, or just STFU.

[cobalt1999]

53. That isn't as much fun as wailing and gnashing of teeth though.

Some people are justifiably worried because of the lack of coverage. However, that doesn't mean panic and automatically assume the worst possible scenario.

Logic doesn't stand a chance in the face of pure emotion.

[Richardo]

54. I know, but it's lack of NATIONAL coverage

If people had just the slightest bit of initiative, they'd find that LOCAL coverage is saturation-level.

It's very frustrating.

[cui bono]

55. then you've never listened to Thom Hartmann, you ignorant slut.

Could've been a caller who said it.

[Richardo]

56. I don't care - if he didn't tell the caller he was an ignorant slut, then Thom is an ignorant slut

I've had it with ignorant sluts who don't know shit about this situation spreading these stupid-ass rumors.

Again, my message to the country is: either STFU and help, or just STFU.

[Ian David]

67. If Thom Hartman is an ignorant slut, then you must be a nymphomaniac amoeba. n/t

[Richardo]

69. Um OK

Whatever that means.

[Ian David]

70. Told you so.

:P

[global1]

61. I Listen To Thom Regularly - And It Was Thom Who Said This....nt