It is thing's like this that will insure that our time in power

[nels25]

will be short>

I swear I feel like the parakeet in a coal mine warning of our (progressive Democrats) coming across as arrogant and condescending (we to some degree have earned that stereo type whether or not we have the courage to admit it).

And now the NYT goes a long way to validate the viewpoint of conservatives (yes I know we could give a rip what they think, but others do. Dare I say the word independent thinkers or voters who may not see the world in quite the way us progressives would like.) by rejecting Sen McCain's essay on Iraq. And if that is not bad enough the editor (A Clinton staffer 95 - 97) can be rightly portrayed as biased, both by his background and prior political actions, and with his comment that if McCain's essay would have been run if it mirror Obama's.


Now I agree with Obama's approach, how ever I wore a uniform for entirely to long to take comfort in the actions of the NYT. Can any DU reader honestly say that if the shoe was on the other foot we would not be screaming first amendment from the top of our lungs.

If we fail to do so now than that says something about us, and that something is not pretty IMHO.

If this how we desire to act once we win in November, than we should not be shocked if we wear the word censor, and if this is the way we desire to act we had better wear that word with pride.

Oh and one other word we had better want to wear with pride is "hypocrite".

No one with a common believe in the legitimacy of the first amendment should be proud of what the NYT has done.

If this make me less than a stealer progressive than so be it.

I know garbage when I see it.

And this is garbage!:mad: :puke: :grr:

[barbtries]

1. do you have a link?

i wish i knew what you were talking about.

[spin]

4. Link from Drudge Report...

http://www.drudgereport.com/flashnym.htm

[Hydra]

2. Link?

I'd like to know how we shot ourselves in the foot again.

You know it's bad when I accept out of hand that we did so yet again.

[nels25]

7. Note it is my understanding that AP

has run with this and they asked the NYT editor, hence his quote about mirroring Obama's piece.

[Hydra]

16. McCain's Editorial is pure BS

But they should have allowed it to be printed so that we could shred it in a public forum.

I have to think McCain asked them to do this for the exact reason that he could scream about the "Liberal Media." NYT has been an unofficial propaganda arm of the WH, so why they would do this puzzles me unless the reason above applies.

[zanne]

3. I'm sick and tired of trying to "understand" the Right Wing.

They don't care if they're "understood". They just want things their way, and they've been arrogant about us for decades. Fu*k em'.

[nels25]

8. It still does not give us the right to support censorship

I mean just how far are we as progressives prepared to go down this road??

One of the ideas I thought I was wearing a uniform to protect was the idea that I may not like what you write or get published but I would lay my butt on the line for your right to do so.


Since when do we get the right to decide what does and does not get published (especially in the so called newspaper of record) and expect that people like Hanni ty and Rush will not have a field day with it.

Also most of Joe/Jane six pack are not going to understand why one candidate for the POTUS is published while the other side is censored.

[zanne]

14. They'll have a field day no matter what we say.

They want it all. We've come to a point in history that we have to undo so much of their disastrous policies, put in place because of their disastrous ideas, that we can't worry too much about offending them. They haven't worried about offending us for the past seven and a half years, have they? All the time we've been trying to be "above that", we've been losing out and they've been gaining. I think they're the ones responsible for blurring that First Amendment line. They count on us trying to be "fair". Screw em'.

[hogwyld]

17. Thank You! it's high time we went on the attack

The GOP has been ramming it's conservative poison down our throats for 28 years, dating back to reagan. I'm sick of their crap, and am not going to take any more. They shut down all of the progressive shows, only to have more rush, hannity, o'lielly etc. It's time we do things our way for a while.

[hogwyld]

5. The conservatives, AKA Reich Wing

have been controlling the media for far too long. They've censored us progressives at every opportunity. Now that they are getting a taste of their own medicine, they whine the loudest. It is high time we exercise such thought and opinion from political discussion and dissemination.

[nels25]

9. Oh My God

DOES IT MAKE IT RIGHT???

IS THIS WHAT YOU WANT?? RIGID CONTROL OF THE MEDIA IS ALLRIGHT AS LONG AS WE ARE THE ONES CONTROLLING IT??

JUST HOW FAR DO YOU WANT TO CENSOR??

DO YOU HAVE ANY CONCEPT AT ALL OF THE FREE FLOW OF IDEAS??

DO YOU UNDER STAND THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE FIRST AMENDMENT AND CENSORSHIP?


GOOD LORD!! BEAM UP SCOTTY NOW!!

[griffi94]

11. i have to agree with you

many democrats seem to want a reversal of the sorry assed roles of the last 8 years.

if this were reversed and the nyt was declining to publish obamas iraq position until it mirrored dubyas people here would scream bloody murder. but this is entirely different, this time it's our boot on their throat so it's okay.

i think you have a point about how long we'll be in power, but i think we may never get in power in the first place with
glaring hypocrisies like this.

[nels25]

13. It sure will not help

you know what might help (since a dime will get you a dollar that this is just the begining of this hoo hah) is if Obama comes out agianst this himself and askes the NYT to publish Sen McCains piece.

Obama wins on a lot of levels on that approach.

[Greyhound]

20. DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT OF THE CAPS-LOCK KEY?

Do you also understand that as long as we allow a single company, of whatever political persuasion or agenda, to control multiple outlets in a single market, there will be censorship?

It is useless to try to blame one group or party for the travesty that our media is, there are no 'good guys' in this conflict, only bad faith players. The only solution to this problem is to break up the media conglomerates and force them to decide which media they will retain in every given market.

[wvbygod]

10. You bet...all those right wing NYT editorials must stop!

I can't believe the NYT got away with it for so long.

[elocs]

6. I think that progressive and Liberal Democrats can come off as being condescending.

Most people detest those who are condescending to them. I know I do.

Progressives and Liberals seem to have the attitude for many Americans of "we know what is best for you and you are going to get it whether you want it or not". We are the all knowing champions of democracy, so just trust us. We do tend to come across as only we are the true defenders of truth, justice, and the Americans way. Especially after 8 years of Bush there seems to be a desire to impose our point of view on others when we take power and if that is the case the reign will be short just like this last one of the Republicans. In spite of the First Amendment I sometimes wonder if Democrats had the power to shut up the Republicans and neocons if we would. We need to learn how to lead rather than drag.

[nels25]

12. THANK YOU!! You buttress my point exactly

you see to me this is not an insignificant issue, it is bedrock, and it is an issue that most other americans can get their arms around and understand and not to our benefit.

In addition looked who this is being done to you do not have like McCain but you do have to acknowledge his service, and this is just like slapping him in the face with his service.

I can only just imagine what a field day is going have with this one.

On so many levels this plays to our detriment.

And still to many independents who do not take politics as passionately as I and others at DU do this will confirm what they already believe about democrats to some degree (Obama makes a mistake in wording and is wrongly branded as an elitist, the NYT editor is a died in the wool Clintonite, which is okay, but then do not try to pass of you editorial pages as unbiased, because it is not).

Universities have earned a reputation as elitist and politically correct, now it seems to becoming to the press.

This is not going to go over well for the most part, and we might as a party think about it.

[elocs]

18. I too often see Progressives and Liberals having attitudes like we are talking down to people,

like we are the only ones who really love the Constitution. The world gets painted in black and white where if you agree with us then all is goodness and light, but if you do not agree you are thugs and neocons and why do you hate the Constitution. I am willing to concede that we (Democrats: Progressives, Liberals) may not always be right or always have the right answers and that others of differing positions may have valid points of view. I don't want to come across as the wise and all knowing Liberal who has all the answers and must lead the little children along the right path for their own good since they know no better themselves.

[zanne]

15. TOUGH.

People in power have the luxury of deciding whether or not to be fair. Let's reach that point first, shall we?

[defendandprotect]

19. McCain isn't responding to Obama's article ....and they don't want to print it. Do I misunderstand?