Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Question from a 10 year old

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:28 PM
Original message
Question from a 10 year old
My 10 year old daughter is a big Clinton supporter (and quite peeved at her parents for their Obama support). We live in Alabama which means that the vast majority of her friends come from Republican families. She told me today that her best friend said,

"Hillary Clinton only wants to be president because she just wants to be the first woman president."

Upon asking me if that was true, I told her that while I'm sure that Senator Clinton would like to be the first female president it is certainly not why she is running. She is running because she cares about US citizens and wants to make sure that children are well educated, that families will have health care, that we all can find good paying jobs, and that America's reputation in the world is repaired after 7 years of a disastrous presidency of George Bush. She agreed and wondered why her friend's family hates Clinton so much. Evidently when she was over at their house the other day her friends father was watching a news story about Bill Clinton speaking in Birmingham. My daughter excitedly said, "I was there and on the front row!" to which the father said, "Hrrumph..". I told her that many in the South are not fond of Democrats so don't be surprised if she hears that more and more during the run up to the General Election.

My daughter then asked a question that I have had a hard time answering. She asked:

"Why do people in the South support the Republicans more than the Democrats?"

How would you answer that question from a 10 year old?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:29 PM
Response to Original message
1. Because the majority of Southerners were raised with an Authoritarian mindset
Authoritarians tend to vote fascist.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. What do you mean by Authoritarian? How about Fascist?
You see my dilemma? Each answer gets more and more complicated.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TrogL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #3
34. The Authoritarian Personality
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
12. I may be wrong but they are intensely tied to their state and region
especially since reconstruction. when the civil rights legislation was signed in with LBJ he knew the south would rebel against the dems for generations. They did. They went Republican. Also, the republicans are experts at playing to their cultural and intellectual mindsets with religious declarations and pious displays about family and country. Until they become more diverse in their mindsets and until the poverty Republicans hit them with is so intense, they won't change. Loyalty
counts in the south.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
El Pinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-07-08 07:53 AM
Response to Reply #12
42. I would have called it a misguided tribalism, but yes, basically what you said NT
NT
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
YOY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
2. Religious values voters
Edited on Wed Feb-06-08 04:32 PM by YOY
The easy answer. The "pious attitude" that Pubs like to play wins them over. Of course it's all a show of the worst proportions...

That and rednecks tend towards the "tough guy attitude" that the Pubs like to play wins them as once again a show set by a bunch of chickenhawks.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. I did mention religion
But I don't want to use the word "redneck" because that belittles her friends and their families.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
YOY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. Then say those with a severe provincial mindset (Villagers) with severe nationalistic tendencies.
Edited on Wed Feb-06-08 04:36 PM by YOY
Fits them to a tee.

Explaining ignorant nationalism doesn't take a college degree.

You know: "Some people are proud of something that takes no personal accomplishment: Nationality and Religion in this case." Republican's tend to aim for those
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #10
21. yeah...that's good
I like that. Thanks.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
melm00se Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #5
38. you might surprised at one theory about the origin of the term: redneck
and, if true, should not be used as a pejorative:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3732/is_200601/...

...according to linguist David W. Maurer, the former definition of the word probably dates at least to the second decade of the twentieth century, if not earlier (1936:19). The use of redneck to designate "a union member" was especially popular during the 1920s and 1930s in the coal-producing regions of southern West Virginia, eastern Kentucky, and western Pennsylvania, where the word came to be specifically applied to a miner who belonged to a labor union.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
4. I'd say that part of it has to do with their ideas about what it means to be Christian
and the other part has to do with their ideas about what being a country means, such as states' rights, self-determination, and war with other countries.

But those are just my guesses.

Good question though. :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Good points
It is a good question. She's a bright child...too bright for her parents sometimes ;)

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mattfromnossa Donating Member (125 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #4
40. I agree.
It does have alot to do with their ideas about what it means to be a Christian. If you go to any Baptist church in the south you will hear alot of talk about conservative politics.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BOSSHOG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:32 PM
Response to Original message
6. Pride. Ignorance. They are easily manipulated
by nonsense like "patriotism" and "values." They think voting for republicans is manly. And my number one reason, they buy the gop line: "Government does not work, put us in charge and we will prove it."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
16. And every time they are put in charge they prove THEY can't make government work.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sweetpotato Donating Member (678 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
8. In my opinion
Way back when, the Republicans decided how to take the South. They figured out that most southern people were against the Civil Rights Movement. Voila - instant issue. The Republicans came out against Civil Rights and promised that it would not pass. The people of the south voted against Civil Rights by voting FOR Republicans. Then they taught their children to vote for Republicans and to identify themselves as Republicans. Its hard to change an identity that has been ingrained this way.

How do I know? I'm a child of a bigoted southern family who was raised to be a Republican.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Arugula Latte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
9. It all goes back to LBJ and the '64 Civil Rights Act, doesn't it?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mountainman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
11. They use to be democrats. The fight for civil rights was the issue that became the turning point.
They began to favor State's rights thinking that the States could make laws keeping the South segregated.
see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dixiecrat

The States' Rights Democratic Party (Dixiecrat Party for short) was a segregationist, populist, socially conservative splinter party of the Democratic Party in the mid-20th century who were determined to protect what they saw as the Southern way of life against what they perceived as an oppressive federal government.<1>

Historically, the solidly Democratic South had emerged in the wake of Reconstruction, the period following the Civil War when the Republican Party used the Union Army to occupy the South and forcibly reengineer Southern society along norms directed by northern interests. As a result of the perceived unconstitutionality, tyranny and corruption of Republican Reconstruction, when conservative white Southerners ended military occupation and restored the Southern politico-economic position, the region gave its political allegiance almost entirely to the Democratic Party.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RufusEarl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:44 PM
Response to Original message
13. Tell her she should ask her american history teacher, oh yea i bet she doesn't have one.
I can't think of an easy answer to a very complicated question, it deals with many things republicans in the south are uncomfortable talking about.

Peace!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DadOf2LittleAngels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
14. God, Guns, and Gays
The three G's
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #14
24. And with Hillary, add an "M"
Misogyny.

And with Obama add a "R"

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DadOf2LittleAngels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. Naa they would be
quick to vote for a Minority or Woman who matched their views on God, Guns, and Gays..

Liddy Dole won a senate seat, JC Watts was from OK I think? and they Love Alan Keys..
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. Well true
Hillary and Obama do scare them though
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DadOf2LittleAngels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. And why not
They are going to squash the GOP this year an without any of the untraditional GOP states.. They will run away with PA, OH, FL, NY, Cali, Il, Wi, MN, WA, MD, DC, (all of New England). and wil lprobally take NM, CO, VA, and MO. ANd I would not rule out GA, NV, and IA

After that the deep south will be seen as no longer politically relevant...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elehhhhna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
15. A: They don't. It's ignorant, LOUD people who support Republicans.
This explaination worked fine on our tween daughters.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
17. B/c the South never got over not winning the Civil War and I believe
would always prefer to be separate politically from the rest of the country. In the 1860s, they started to believe that the southern states were a country separate and apart from the northern states with secession from "the Union" and that mentality exists to this very day. This of course is an overgeneralization.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #17
25. "States Rights" do have a lot to do with it
But this does mean "the right to do what we damn well want!"

I think the conversation about the segregated south and conservativism is a good starting point.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
18. I could give you the correct answer.
But it'd probably be deleted.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #18
29. Heh
:hi:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DCKit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:15 PM
Response to Original message
19. Too bad you can't tell her that all the men want to be pResident...
'cause they all think it makes their penis larger.

Hmmm, I wonder how many of the failed candidates, over the years, have bought convertibles or muscle cars after dropping out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
20. sheeeit, i answered years ago to a lot younger than ten.
Edited on Wed Feb-06-08 05:20 PM by seabeyond
my children are politically aware and they are 10 and almost 13. they have a lot of family members republican so they can hear their views. my kids also read times and other sources and talk a lot of politics so they have a feel on both party

we live in religious belt texas panhandle and htey were going to a christian private school 2004 election. they learned a lot first hand

you do not have to make a bad guy. there are differences. give them to the girl. teach her. bet she sucks it all up and what hse isnt able to handle today, she will tomorrow
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:35 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. She's very politically aware
and she's very aware that she is "different" than her friends. The politics is one thing, but the agnosticism and vegetarianism round out a perfect trifecta of difference. She has a good head on her shoulders and I want to give her the tools to critically analyze her world but I don't want her to become outwardly disgusted with her friends because of their parents' beliefs. It's a tough rope to walk.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #23
35. my youngest inately finds good in all people. at about 8 even argued the good in hitler
Edited on Wed Feb-06-08 06:58 PM by seabeyond
just who he is. just really who we are as people. seeing this christian school they had been going to for years shift to a hate in spring of 2004 with election and the movie passion and all the anger that was around allowed my boys to walk in a christ like attitude. saying turn the other cheek. take the hate, anger, fear, pain (i think this was the huge answer to their understanding and acceptance, to know it was pain and fear really) and give love. even though i eventually pulled kids out of that school it is a blessing for our whole family. taught us so much. i will always be appreciative even though at times painful for my oldest.

we find the beauty, even in the ugly.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DadOf2LittleAngels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #20
33. "you do not have to make a bad guy."
This cant be said enough, the think that I really Like about Obama is his positive message about uniting people...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #33
36. then it is just another battle, another war on and never will there be progress
so many people dont get it. not being submissive either. a thing my kids experience time and again with me is even though i will argue at every point with the religious and republicans in my area, always it is with love and always we walk away in love. much more productive.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Vinca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:33 PM
Response to Original message
22. Time to tell her about the civil rights movement. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. She knows
and has been to the Civil Rights Museum in downtown Birmingham. Powerful place.

But I want to be careful and not call her friends' parents racists when I don't think they are. I think their beliefs have a genesis in racism however.

It's tricky.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Vinca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #26
31. That's a toughy. Time to change the subject to the birds and bees.
:rofl:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
digitalbuddha Donating Member (32 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 05:39 PM
Response to Original message
28. Because they are confused
and are unable to tell the difference between what is good for the majority and what is good for the minority. That should be simple enough for a ten year old.

If more detail is needed, just explain that the right does not want to share their wealth and seeks to accumulate more wealth through evil means. (wars, prisons, poverty)

I understand the desire to not disparage your daughters friends, but you can only sugar coat descriptions of the right wing so much.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CRK7376 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 07:10 PM
Response to Original message
37. Not all we Southerners
support the Repugs. I definitely do not. We've changed over the years unfortunately. At least my district has. We used to be a solid Democratic city with a good Representative. But then my state has also produced Jesse Helms, Liddy Dole and Richard Burr....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cloudythescribbler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-06-08 08:44 PM
Response to Original message
39. I would answer citing the history of the Democrats and Civil Rights ...
I don't know how much your daughter knows about what Jim Crow was, but her question affords a good opportunity for introducing the history of the struggle between Jim Crow and the Civil Rights movement. No doubt she will have heard something about Dr King in school, but I can't gauge even where the 'average' 10 year old would be on this let alone the specific instance of your daughter.

OK, let's say you explain that there was a system of segregation and oppression set up after the abolition of slavery, and that this system was designed by certain classes and interest groups among whites to keep blacks from having power or social recognition. And of course, much of the stigmatizing dynamic of Jim Crow was important to make this system of discrimination and segregation not only acceptable, but indeed embraced by the OVERWHELMING majority of whites.

I would insist both for a 10 year old or a snarky DU poster or a PhD that it be recognized how universally vulnerable people are to this kind of process (described, though one might just use it as background rather than confusing a child with it, by Goldhagen in HITLER'S WILLING EXECUTIONERS -- though I disagree with his thesis) whereby people become committed to excluding a group and to the "right" to oppress that group as a "mitigating" factor in society as a whole, from their point of view (the support of Jim Crow by poor whites in the South).

So then there is the rise of the Civil Rights movement, with the support of the Supreme Court decision and the change in attitudes throughout the world in the FDR and post WWII era. This meant that many many more people, both within and outside the South, who were NOT black came to see Jim Crow as a scourge. And so the Civil Rights movement was built, rose in popularity the way movements whose time has come can do, and was victorious in winning the Civil Rights reforms.

Here is where the issue of the Democrats and Civil Rights comes in, and it is pretty confusing, for scholars as well as no doubt for children. While historically, the DEMOCRATS were the party with the support of white southerners, and the Party that enacted Jim Crow, by the time of the Civil Rights movement it was largely though not wholly the Democratic Party, and in particular Presidents Kennedy and Johnson, who passed the Civil Rights Laws and forced those in the South and elsewhere who bitterly opposed them to conform to them.

As Johnson himself famously said as he was signing into law the Civil Rights Act of 1964, "We are handing the South over to the Republicans for a long time to come". This opportunity/tendency was actively pursued by Republicans like Presidents Nixon and Reagan
and after the 60s not only did the South (as in 1964) back right wing Republicans for president, but increasingly backed Republicans for other positions, including locally as well.

I would throw in my own 2 cents here, in passing, that though the climax of this Republican consolidation of a 'solid South' in the 90s (94) especially actually happened quite recently, we see in many spheres, not only in the voting power of blacks but in the wide support in Georgia for Obama, and in the situation posed by the Republican response to Katrina in New Orleans, and in the need to steal Florida for the Republicans in 2000, that the 'solid Republican South' "for a long time to come" may be drawing to an end; there is however opportunity rather than inevitability.


I suppose that you would be able to translate this verbosity into terms that your 10 year old daughter can relate to better than this...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GaYellowDawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-07-08 06:42 AM
Response to Original message
41. Because, to paraphrase Jimmy Carter...
Edited on Thu Feb-07-08 06:42 AM by GaYellowDawg
Republicans make them feel comfortable with their prejudices.

On edit: And I say that as a 40-year-old man who's spent his whole life living in Georgia and Tennessee.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Feb 18th 2020, 01:18 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC